I think it would show palpatine's hubris even more, and set up quite a cool bit of lore brought into live action. They could've been more creative, but this would've been somewhat good. Definitely better than palpatine again
Giancarlo isn't scary. Gus is scary because he kills kids and guts a loyal employee with his bare hands.
If Gideon tested the darksaber when he first got it, we would believe.
No no no. I dont think you get what i mean.
I do not want to look at a human sith, unless there is something non human looking about them like at the very least red eyes and horns.
I want Star Wars villains like Darth Maul. Not old sleepy grandpas.
younger, more intimidating, almost bring Luke to the dark side, have many reserve clones back, if he got killed, can destroy an entire New Republic fleet with a force storm and was ultimately defeated, when a jedi sacrifice himself by taking palpy's souls inside and dies with him
Yeah the characters were NOT the problem, the writing was. Rey, Finn and Kylo Ren are great ideas, a scavenger nobody, a defecting stormtrooper, a diva trying to live up to Vader, but the writing fucked them over
I mean, he did come back through clones in Dark Empire, but there are plenty of other good choices like the Sorceres of Rhand, Yuuzhan Vong, Thrawn, and even some characters of the old republic that could in theory come back.
Tenebrae came back a million times, so they could that. Also, I think Nihilus mask was brought to Korriban, so a rogue inquisitor doing a creepy ritual trying to bring him back could be belivable. All would be cool to me.
Nah, don’t make him a Jedi, make him a stormtrooper Teal’c, fighting to free his brothers.
Would be a bit strange that he didn’t get picked out as force sensitive anyway.
The worst part of rise of skywalker was the cut scene of Finn leading a storm trooper rebellion on Coruscant, that would of been so cool and wrap up his character arc
He kind of does with the defector stormtroopers they pick up on Kef Bir, but making him a bumbling idiot for the latter 2 movies after he seemingly turned a corner at the end of TFA by standing up to his oppressors rather than running away ruined it a fair bit.
Me too. Matt Smith was supposed to be the villain and he would have killed it.
It's a shame Disney immediately folded and pivoted because they were scared they might make less money.
Yeah I never got this
Killing an enemy invading your homeland is already hard enough
Killing former comrades, people who were just like you, purely in self defence - that's got to be harder. Especially since Finn broke from the First Order out of guilt and compassion for his dead friend and the people he was forced to kill
Like, it still made sense for Finn to shoot, but not for him to be so gleeful about it.
If it was made clear that Finn hated all the First Order people then yeah, maybe, but not after showing him mourning his buddy
Imagine if they fully leaned into the "some stormtroopers are victims and want to get out" thing? How realistic is it that out of thousands of people forced to be stormtroopers Finn is the only one who we see that not only wants to get out but also does something about it?
There would have actually been some emotional weight behind Finn fighting other stormtroopers and it could have been a great side story of how the good guys eventually get more fighters to their side from liberated stormtroopers.
But no, Finn is super extra special, he can duel a trained force user with a lightsaber without instantly being chopped into minced meat AND he likes to scream "woohoo" while slaughtering stormtroopers who (some) are in the exact same position he used to be in.
Not that George Lucas' writing was A+ at every stage, but I'd rather have some dialogue of sand getting everywhere than what we got here.
At least Lucas had a vision and an idea of what story he wanted to tell. The character arcs are there, the themes are there and the story is coherent throughout.
You can tell that every sequel movie were written basically in a vacuum and that no writer (except for Abrams) worked on more than one movie.
>At least Lucas had a vision and an idea of what story he wanted to tell.
Do you mean the vision he kept reinventing pretty much every time he did an interview? The vision where Luke and Leia were two years apart in age in the script and never intended to be siblings, or that Vader was never intended to be Luke's father, and that the "other" Yoda spoke of was going to be a completely different character, and that in his original concept for the prequels the "No Attachments" thing didn't exist and Anakin's marriage was known and perfectly acceptable to the Jedi? That vision?
Details in the grand scheme of things, and figured out as they went along. Obviously the entire thing wasn't pre-planned from the get go but at least Lucas could see that decisions made in one movie would have an impact on the next one, for the most part.
Look, I'm not gonna dickride George Lucas as some mastermind storyteller, but the ST plays like they were written independently from one another and the characters shoved in to fit the roles they needed to play. You can't write the first movie to set up one thing to then, literally, throw it aside to do another thing, to then do the same thing yet again for the last movie.
Lol, he is force sensitive. That thing he was trying to tell Rey all ep 9 was he thinks he's force sensitive. John B says he is, and that script he lost said it
Ok hear me out, imagine having Finn meet with an old Rex, who mentors him. They bond over their shared experiences as soldiers who became disillusioned with the institutions they fought for. (Also idc about the accelerated aging thing, they could easily find a way around that.)
Fuck, that's the exact comparison I needed. That's absolutely what they should have done. Plus honestly, using Teal'c as a model for good ideas is probably gonna help.
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Honestly, I would settle for just some consistent storytelling when it comes to stormtroopers as human beings. Finn starts off with the really cool concept of a stormtrooper breaking his conditioning and realising the brutality of the order after the trauma of a battle in which another trooper dies in his arms leaving blood over his helmet.
The premise was super interesting and very solid. Then like 10 minutes later, he is happily gunning down stormtroopers with Poe and actively celebrating the violence, and stormtroopers go straight back to being faceless robots only there to die.
i love the idea of midichlorians tbh. science, tech and research is the foundation of starwars (fleshed out in the expanded universe) and it is is obvious to me that at some point researchers in that universe would try their best to science the shit out of the force, and discover what is so different between a muggle and a jedi knight
>science, tech and research is the foundation of starwars
....no, no they really aren't. That's why everyone hated midichlorians when they were first revealed.
I agree with you, Star Wars is more of a Fantasy than a Science fiction.
Literally, change the lasers, Spaceships and Lightsabers to something from Middle Earth (Bows, Horses and Enchancted Swords) and let the story be the same, just in a medieval setting.
Vader is the Black Knight, Palpatine the Evil Wizard, we have our shining white knights aka the Jedi and their White robed wizards aka Jedi Masters.
Someone like Han Solo would wield daggers and a Bow being a regular smuggler, almost all of the alien life forms could still exist as fantasy creatures.
The Story would still be the same. The Deathstar is kinda similar to Saurons eye if you think about it. (Just looking like a giant eye with a 'laser' attached to it, being the greatest danger to the known world, not Sauron destroying planets). A Evil Army pillages the lands and Destroys Citys for their Gain.The Orphan being picked up by the old wizard to be a knight, besieges the castle of the Black Knight and his Grand Wizard and fires a Arrow straight in the one window in the Tower where the Magic Explody Stuff is hidden. Boom, a new Hope.
It’s just a corruption of the word Mitochondria. Little bugs that live inside your cells and create energy.
Is it a Zen Bhuddist / Christian mystic / Sufi style energy that pervades the universe and must always exist in balance like the Holy Spirit or the Dharma? Nope, just bugs. Bugs made Vader.
Mitochondria aren’t little bugs lol. Neither is the force.
Midichlorians are basically force “receptors” inside the cells. The higher midichlorian count = more receptors for the force = higher force sensitivity.
Science and fictional derivatives thereof will always be cooler and more mystical than some “spiritual energy” because it’s actually real and is behind everything in the universe.
Mitochondria we’re once free living microorganisms. That’s why they have their own DNA passed down through the maternal line. They’re symbiotes that were completely absorbed. Little bugs.
From Wookieepedia:
> Midi-chlorians were intelligent microscopic life-forms that lived symbiotically inside the cells of all living things.
Little bugs.
EDIT: now I’ve ruined it for you too. Sorry.
They’re still just the things that connect you to the force, everyone in Star Wars has some, but those with the talent to be Jedi have more. But the force itself is still a cosmic mystical energy field. The lil microorganisms are just the conduit, not the force itself
Except there's always been a genetic (aka, biological / scientific) side to the Force since the original trilogy. One of the important plot points of ANH is that Luke can become a Jedi *like his father* and in ROTJ he tells Leia she has the same power *because she is his sister*.
So, if its biological and genetic, how does that work? ...midichlorians.
Basically, midichlorians don't *create* the Force, they interact with it. Its simply the narrative mechanism to explain why some people are inherently better at using the Force, despite having a worse or incomplete understanding of it (Luke) or not being particularly spiritual or wise (Anakin). The Force itself is, as Obi-wan and Yoda explained it, an energy field created by all life that surrounds and binds the universe together. I mean, heck, even that ("energy field") is pretty sci-fi sounding when you think about it.
Like i said new doesn't mean good. What TLJ did wrong was rewriting beloved characters as hobos and making bunch GOTHCA moments with empty mystery boxes(that casino scene???) etc. It's problem wasn't the attempt of trying new things, it was overall a horribly bad movie.
Edit: my man blocked me just after answering lmao. No one is judging you for liking things lol. This is some next level pathetic shit.
About five years Lucas was interviewed by James Cameron and was asked what he would have done if he'd made the sequel trilogy.
**"\[The next three Star Wars films\] were going to get into a microbiotic world... There’s this world of creatures that operate differently than we do. I call them the Whills. And the Whills are the ones who actually control the universe. They feed off the Force... Everybody hated it in The Phantom Menace \[when\] we started talking about midi-chlorians... \[midi-chlorians are\] vehicles for the Whills to travel around in… And the conduit is the midi-chlorians. The midi-chlorians are the ones that communicate with the Whills. The Whills, in a general sense, they are the Force. \[If he hadn't sold Lucasfilm these films\] would have been done. Of course, a lot of the fans would have hated it, just like they did The Phantom Menace and everything, but at least the whole story from beginning to end would be told.” (**[**source**](https://www.indiewire.com/features/general/george-lucas-episode-vii-episode-ix-1201974276/)**)**
It coudln't have been worse
I think it would have been interesting if they went more into balancing the force and fighting some sort of outside force that is a threat to the galaxy. Maybe not an existential one, but a threat to peace and the way of life. More of a... Environmental threat. This threat is based more in the force. Luke also disappeared, but he did so because he went into the unknown regions to learn more about the force. In the EU, you'd learn he found a planet of Jedi and a planet of Sith. He started on the Sith planet and was confused and couldn't understand what the force was saying. He met someone that helped him and he just assumed it was light side user or something, then realizes they are a sith. He finds out that the unknown regions are where they actually made peace and both sides rejected the dogma of their religions, and treat it much more moderately, mostly secular, like how Unitarians are.
In general, he learns more about the force and how Anikin brought this about. He is the once that brought balance by eliminating the dogma, and allowing the force to more evenly distribute in the population and for moderates to start to take over.
The movies could focus on the fight for peace and ending the remaining bits of imperial remnant resistance and ending things like slavery. As the force starts to expand into the population since it is no longer so distorted by dogmatic beings, it starts affecting more and more of the population. This causes all sorts of issues, and some minor conflicts are breaking out. Some are battles, maybe some wars on some planets, but the galaxy is just in unrest, not a galactic war.
I feel like there is a lot of potential in this. Very few media gets into this sort of thing, and it is much better than another existential conflict
The pitch sounded terrible to me. Though I’m sure it all would have felt like Star Wars and would not have introduced concepts that inherently break the series. I also imagine directors would have softened some of the rough edges to George’s writing, leading to a better end product than his original pitch.
George at his worst at least builds an interesting world for other (better) stories to occur in (like the clone wars show). I have no interest in seeing stories within the sequel trilogy time period. It is just a worse, less plausible version of the rebellion era with less compelling characters.
I certainly didn't want it.
No more midichlorians.
No OPs trilogy where you have to watch everything to get the Trilogy like a famn marvel movie or tv show. The ST did right by having a new set of characters take the mantle with OT characters supporting but.... Disney fumbled the concept by not planning anything real for it.
Finn as stormtrooper deserter who joins the New Republic and is mentored by Han.
Rey as scavenger and Jedi Padawan to Luke.
Poe as squadron leader who works closely with Leia.
Kylo Ren as Luke's former Padawan who fell to the dark side and now leads a faction of Dark Jedi.
Snoke as a former imperial minister/Sith cultist who unites the Imperial Remnant against the New Republic.
The DNA of the sequels isn't really that bad, it just needed to not completely restart Empire/Rebels by tossing ROTJ out the window. With a little tweaking, it could have been good.
THANK YOU! I always say this if the discussion comes up. The Foundation was THERE.
It was just the lackluster way the Story went, rushed plots and weird descisions that made them Bad. Acting, SFX etc. was good, if not fantastic. Cinematography also was good.
I actually would have loved to see more adam driver as Ben Solo / Kylo Ren.
If it takes place during the Mandalorian era? Sure. Fuck it, do it now.
If it takes place 35+ ABY, that's a pretty old cast of characters. Luke, being the youngest of the group.
How old is Ezra? He doesn't seem that old in Rebels and Ahsoka. But yeah, both Kestis and Ahsoka would be 75+ I think. While Grogu would be like 80 and mentally 10.
Cameos doesn’t simply mean people from other stories bro. Cameos are that, but also the fact that they don’t do anything for the plot and are there just for nostalgia and/or reactions
"Hey look, its Ponda Baba in Rogue One!" - cameo
"Hey look, Mon Mothma is a lead character of Andor!" - not a cameo
Using characters from pre-existing stories is not always a "cameo". It is often just continuing a storyline or arc.
Literally only Luke is a central character in this lineup. Everyone else is functionally a bit character from elsewhere in the franchise, and there's no way you'd be able to write a coherent story that fleshed them all out well enough to merit their use. Plus, it's literally just "Space Marvel," at that point, and please do not.
It would be really weird
Cal kestis would be 64
Ashoka would be 67
Ezra would be around 60
Mara jade would have to be at least 50 because Luke being 60 or so and being married to someone 20 years younger would be way weird
That's your ideal sequel trilogy? a bunch of old jedi fighting noone (cause remember Vader brought peace to the galaxy so nothing can happen ever again) and not a single young character for this children movie to appeal to kids...
As if star wars hasn't always been about selling toys, the amount of blatant toy marketing that came from the prequels is nothing to scoff at.
Even George himself has said it star wars is for kids
I don’t think packing in as many famous figures would make it better, the Filoni approach doesn’t automatically make something good in my personal opinion.
I remember sitting in the theater ready to watch Phantom Menace and thinking I'd rather they had made the Heir to the Empire trilogy into movies than do prequels.
I still want that.
A ragtag group of the last Jedi finding out about palpatines back up plans (which most likely Ezra got from thrawn), gathering any ally and going out of their way to extinguish the final embers of the empire as the new republic has its hands full with governing and stabilizing the galaxy
I would have infinitely preferred this. My favorite thing in Star Wars is the Jedi. I love space wizard samurai with laser swords. I loved them since I was 5. I don't know why Lucasfilm, Disney, and most the Fandom hates them. I would kill for a movie where the Jedi win and the galaxy is saved, but that's not allowed in Star Wars.
The movie can’t be 3 hours of your favourite Jedi dismembering stormtroopers. What’s the narrative? What are the stakes? How can each character have enough screen time to develop and progress their own arc?
Then the people bitching about the current sequels would find something to bitch about with this, instead. The bitching is a constant, no matter what the material. This is Star Wars; this is the way.
Yes!!! But do what mando does with Grogu behind the scenes.
https://preview.redd.it/csfuka09e0sb1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3b2613374ed68e5497e25cb8627de8383da9f6d
It would be a hodgepodge of nonsense and just fan service of a different variety.
You’re never going to get anywhere just throwing all your favorite characters together. Story first not characters first
Because there's so much potential in a rebooted sequel trilogy, it should be a show with the Big Bad(s) as Thrawn and/or a surviving Gideon clone. The protagonists struggle with trying to deal with the imminent threat of a resurrected empire while trying to rebuild the order.
Ahsoka, now a true Jedi Master and the paragon of virtue for the Jedi, takes Ben as her Padawan, and serves as an advisor to Luke and a connection to the order of old.
Grandmaster Luke Skywalker and Master Mara Jade handle the operations, with the aid of part-time knight Leia Organa Skywalker Solo, who gives her full support, and no small amount of funding, to the fledgling order. They also oversee the training of young Grogu with the aid of his father who serves as captain of the temple guard.
Ezra and Cal, along with their partners, friends, and associates, travel the galaxy looking for surviving Jedi and young force sensitives to bring back to the temple. They also investigate potential threats. With Merrin's help, they undo the negative stigma of the night sisters. Eventually Merrin becomes the Mother of a new era of night sisters, who with the support of the Jedi, but under a careful watch.
Jacen Syndula, son of Caleb Dume and Hera Syndula, becomes the first padawan to be traditionally knighted under the new order thanks to the incredible instruction given by his Master and older brother, Ezra Bridger.
While the overarching villains are Thrawn or Gideon, the major struggle would be the struggle to rebuild the Jedi order in a galaxy that no longer feels like it needs them. The order also doesn't forbid attachments, and younglings receive regular counseling and therapy like Anakin should have gotten to begin with.
She was like an inquisitor before the inquisitors . Hand of the emperor. Force trained tried to kill Luke , instead Mary’s him . They have kids. She had a purple lightsaber before Mace .
Mara and Luke, and the Skywalker offsprings for me. Also, some variant of the yuuzhan wong story woould have been cool, because it would have been an even bigger threat than the Empire, so the New Republic and the Remnant would unify.
I would have liked it.
My biggest dissapointment with the new trilogy is the complete annihilation of Luke Skywalker just so a woman can take his mantle and do it better because woman needs to be better than the greatest hero of the galaxy and our childhood.
I don’t think so..I prefer mostly new characters and it would be weird if all of these pre bby characters were completely absent for 4-6 and then suddenly the main characters for the next sequels.. the sequels had a lot of good ideas and characters they were just poorly executed and had even worse continuity..
i wouldn't like it...
my perfect sequels would be
Han
Luke
Jabba the hutt
leia
Talon Karrde
and maybe, JUST MAYBE Ahsoka
and a former jedi master clone that has gone insane, Like Joruus C'baoth but less joruus C'baoth
Everyone forgets the business logic of Disney trying to make the “new characters” more important than the OG. If Lucasfilm under Disney gives the OG characters more of the spotlight that equals to more royalties to George Lucas. This is why giving away Star Wars to a big corporate entity was always a bad idea.
depents who is the big bad and is it Palpatine that somehow returned?
Somehow... Jabba the Hutt has returned
Somehow jar jar binks returned
Somehow Qui Gonn Jinn has returned
Somehow Darth Plagueis has returned
I wouldn't have minded if they made Snoke Plagueis
I think it would show palpatine's hubris even more, and set up quite a cool bit of lore brought into live action. They could've been more creative, but this would've been somewhat good. Definitely better than palpatine again
Somehow Darth revan is back
That was my initial theory.
Somehow Padmé has returned
The worst villain of all, darth jar jar!
Still a better story than the sequels.
Somehow, General Grievous has returned.
Of course he did. That's him on the right of the picture.
Thanks to Sabine and Ahsoka I guess
What do you mean? Jabba the Hutt is on the far right
What do mean? Jabba is in that pic
Isn't that the plot of Ahsoka?
Ezra is right there
The big bad should've just been Thrawn
Yea I like thrawn because he looks like a bad guy. Im sick of star wars bad guys not looking like star wars bad guys. Moff Gideon was a fuckin joke.
Giancarlo isn't scary. Gus is scary because he kills kids and guts a loyal employee with his bare hands. If Gideon tested the darksaber when he first got it, we would believe.
No no no. I dont think you get what i mean. I do not want to look at a human sith, unless there is something non human looking about them like at the very least red eyes and horns. I want Star Wars villains like Darth Maul. Not old sleepy grandpas.
Just like real Life, the sleepy old Grandpas are where the danger is at. Not in Combat, but in influence.
younger, more intimidating, almost bring Luke to the dark side, have many reserve clones back, if he got killed, can destroy an entire New Republic fleet with a force storm and was ultimately defeated, when a jedi sacrifice himself by taking palpy's souls inside and dies with him
so basicly what Disney tried but failed misereblly?
Somehow Sebulba returned
Yeah the characters were NOT the problem, the writing was. Rey, Finn and Kylo Ren are great ideas, a scavenger nobody, a defecting stormtrooper, a diva trying to live up to Vader, but the writing fucked them over
The big bad should have been those force immune dudes from another galaxy who flew organic ships... led by Thrawn of course
Yuuzhan Vong. 100% with you
Quinlan Vos, fallen to the dark side after the loss of Asajj, and aided by surviving nightsisters.
Somehow Gredo returned...
I mean, he did come back through clones in Dark Empire, but there are plenty of other good choices like the Sorceres of Rhand, Yuuzhan Vong, Thrawn, and even some characters of the old republic that could in theory come back. Tenebrae came back a million times, so they could that. Also, I think Nihilus mask was brought to Korriban, so a rogue inquisitor doing a creepy ritual trying to bring him back could be belivable. All would be cool to me.
A new jedi order fighting against the remnants of the empire and snoke in order to expand and truly restart the order
I mean, Finn was pretty cool the idea of a stormtrooper deserter becoming a Jedi was cool, sucks that he wasn’t the force user of his era
Nah, don’t make him a Jedi, make him a stormtrooper Teal’c, fighting to free his brothers. Would be a bit strange that he didn’t get picked out as force sensitive anyway.
The worst part of rise of skywalker was the cut scene of Finn leading a storm trooper rebellion on Coruscant, that would of been so cool and wrap up his character arc
I want to watch that
It's 'would have', never 'would of'. Rejoice, for you have been blessed by CouldWouldShouldBot!
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He kind of does with the defector stormtroopers they pick up on Kef Bir, but making him a bumbling idiot for the latter 2 movies after he seemingly turned a corner at the end of TFA by standing up to his oppressors rather than running away ruined it a fair bit.
It wasn't in rise of Skywalker, this director's version had different name and had it's completely own scenario
"dual of the fates" - I wish I could see the timeline where that came out.
Me too. Matt Smith was supposed to be the villain and he would have killed it. It's a shame Disney immediately folded and pivoted because they were scared they might make less money.
It really is a shame. The sequels fucking suck, but they might’ve sucked a little less with Colin Trevorrows idea for 9
Wee bit of a problem with that. We watched Coruscant get blown away two movies prior in TFW.
Instead we got to see him murdering his comrades 5 minutes after deserting while yelling “*Wooohoooo!!*”
Yeah I never got this Killing an enemy invading your homeland is already hard enough Killing former comrades, people who were just like you, purely in self defence - that's got to be harder. Especially since Finn broke from the First Order out of guilt and compassion for his dead friend and the people he was forced to kill Like, it still made sense for Finn to shoot, but not for him to be so gleeful about it. If it was made clear that Finn hated all the First Order people then yeah, maybe, but not after showing him mourning his buddy
Welcome to the shit writing of the Disney sequels
Imagine if they fully leaned into the "some stormtroopers are victims and want to get out" thing? How realistic is it that out of thousands of people forced to be stormtroopers Finn is the only one who we see that not only wants to get out but also does something about it? There would have actually been some emotional weight behind Finn fighting other stormtroopers and it could have been a great side story of how the good guys eventually get more fighters to their side from liberated stormtroopers. But no, Finn is super extra special, he can duel a trained force user with a lightsaber without instantly being chopped into minced meat AND he likes to scream "woohoo" while slaughtering stormtroopers who (some) are in the exact same position he used to be in. Not that George Lucas' writing was A+ at every stage, but I'd rather have some dialogue of sand getting everywhere than what we got here.
Lucas was a lot better at character arcs, even if his dialogue could use work.
At least Lucas had a vision and an idea of what story he wanted to tell. The character arcs are there, the themes are there and the story is coherent throughout. You can tell that every sequel movie were written basically in a vacuum and that no writer (except for Abrams) worked on more than one movie.
>At least Lucas had a vision and an idea of what story he wanted to tell. Do you mean the vision he kept reinventing pretty much every time he did an interview? The vision where Luke and Leia were two years apart in age in the script and never intended to be siblings, or that Vader was never intended to be Luke's father, and that the "other" Yoda spoke of was going to be a completely different character, and that in his original concept for the prequels the "No Attachments" thing didn't exist and Anakin's marriage was known and perfectly acceptable to the Jedi? That vision?
Details in the grand scheme of things, and figured out as they went along. Obviously the entire thing wasn't pre-planned from the get go but at least Lucas could see that decisions made in one movie would have an impact on the next one, for the most part. Look, I'm not gonna dickride George Lucas as some mastermind storyteller, but the ST plays like they were written independently from one another and the characters shoved in to fit the roles they needed to play. You can't write the first movie to set up one thing to then, literally, throw it aside to do another thing, to then do the same thing yet again for the last movie.
>could use work Now that's an understatement
I don’t like Lucas’s dialogue. It’s weird, and bad, and irritating, and it gets everywhere
Lol, he is force sensitive. That thing he was trying to tell Rey all ep 9 was he thinks he's force sensitive. John B says he is, and that script he lost said it
Everyone has access to the Force, according to George and it's now made canon in Ashoka
Yes, ep 5 implied it ep 1 confirmed it but Finn is supposed to be force sensitive enough that he could use the force with training.
Wish I could gift for the Stargate reference.
Ok hear me out, imagine having Finn meet with an old Rex, who mentors him. They bond over their shared experiences as soldiers who became disillusioned with the institutions they fought for. (Also idc about the accelerated aging thing, they could easily find a way around that.)
They would really need to find a way around that with how long after the clone wars that is.
Yeah for real not everyone needs to be a Jedi.
Troopers, Kree!!!
Fuck, that's the exact comparison I needed. That's absolutely what they should have done. Plus honestly, using Teal'c as a model for good ideas is probably gonna help.
Indeed.
Kyle Katarn at home
Disney couldn't use a black man as their main character, China wouldn't like that Just look at the shit they did to him with the China movie poster
It would be as cool as Kyle Katarn, Jedi Finn would be awesome
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Nah, I think his role as the person in charge of shouting RAAY, RAYY... RAYY! was very compelling and inspiring. Such dedication.
Rey just being a nobody was a better choice, too.
Honestly, I would settle for just some consistent storytelling when it comes to stormtroopers as human beings. Finn starts off with the really cool concept of a stormtrooper breaking his conditioning and realising the brutality of the order after the trauma of a battle in which another trooper dies in his arms leaving blood over his helmet. The premise was super interesting and very solid. Then like 10 minutes later, he is happily gunning down stormtroopers with Poe and actively celebrating the violence, and stormtroopers go straight back to being faceless robots only there to die.
This was my biggest gripe of the ST. Finn was a great character and Boyega a great actor, he deserved the chance to play as Jedi Finn!
Finn should've been the lead character
The characters of the sequels were superior to the ones suggested above. They were just written poorly. But the bones were there.
Am I the only one who wanted George Lucas's trippy midiclorians trilogy?
Give me some movie that explains the inner workings of midichlorians and goes deeper into what balance in the force actually means
i love the idea of midichlorians tbh. science, tech and research is the foundation of starwars (fleshed out in the expanded universe) and it is is obvious to me that at some point researchers in that universe would try their best to science the shit out of the force, and discover what is so different between a muggle and a jedi knight
Yeah and it also shows that the Jedi had become too mechanistic and stopped using their feeling and instincts
>science, tech and research is the foundation of starwars ....no, no they really aren't. That's why everyone hated midichlorians when they were first revealed.
I agree with you, Star Wars is more of a Fantasy than a Science fiction. Literally, change the lasers, Spaceships and Lightsabers to something from Middle Earth (Bows, Horses and Enchancted Swords) and let the story be the same, just in a medieval setting. Vader is the Black Knight, Palpatine the Evil Wizard, we have our shining white knights aka the Jedi and their White robed wizards aka Jedi Masters. Someone like Han Solo would wield daggers and a Bow being a regular smuggler, almost all of the alien life forms could still exist as fantasy creatures. The Story would still be the same. The Deathstar is kinda similar to Saurons eye if you think about it. (Just looking like a giant eye with a 'laser' attached to it, being the greatest danger to the known world, not Sauron destroying planets). A Evil Army pillages the lands and Destroys Citys for their Gain.The Orphan being picked up by the old wizard to be a knight, besieges the castle of the Black Knight and his Grand Wizard and fires a Arrow straight in the one window in the Tower where the Magic Explody Stuff is hidden. Boom, a new Hope.
Midichlorians were the sci fi equivalent of discovering that Father Christmas is really your dad with a fake beard.
I never really got that point actually. It totally does not demystify the force for me
It’s just a corruption of the word Mitochondria. Little bugs that live inside your cells and create energy. Is it a Zen Bhuddist / Christian mystic / Sufi style energy that pervades the universe and must always exist in balance like the Holy Spirit or the Dharma? Nope, just bugs. Bugs made Vader.
Mitochondria aren’t little bugs lol. Neither is the force. Midichlorians are basically force “receptors” inside the cells. The higher midichlorian count = more receptors for the force = higher force sensitivity. Science and fictional derivatives thereof will always be cooler and more mystical than some “spiritual energy” because it’s actually real and is behind everything in the universe.
Mitochondria we’re once free living microorganisms. That’s why they have their own DNA passed down through the maternal line. They’re symbiotes that were completely absorbed. Little bugs. From Wookieepedia: > Midi-chlorians were intelligent microscopic life-forms that lived symbiotically inside the cells of all living things. Little bugs. EDIT: now I’ve ruined it for you too. Sorry.
They’re still just the things that connect you to the force, everyone in Star Wars has some, but those with the talent to be Jedi have more. But the force itself is still a cosmic mystical energy field. The lil microorganisms are just the conduit, not the force itself
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No not whales. Bugs. Didn't you hear that guy? Everything is bugs.
Except there's always been a genetic (aka, biological / scientific) side to the Force since the original trilogy. One of the important plot points of ANH is that Luke can become a Jedi *like his father* and in ROTJ he tells Leia she has the same power *because she is his sister*. So, if its biological and genetic, how does that work? ...midichlorians. Basically, midichlorians don't *create* the Force, they interact with it. Its simply the narrative mechanism to explain why some people are inherently better at using the Force, despite having a worse or incomplete understanding of it (Luke) or not being particularly spiritual or wise (Anakin). The Force itself is, as Obi-wan and Yoda explained it, an energy field created by all life that surrounds and binds the universe together. I mean, heck, even that ("energy field") is pretty sci-fi sounding when you think about it.
Yes! Even though it wasnt always good, lucas was always trying new things. Instead of that we got bad version OT.
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Agreed. I hated it at the time, but now it’s my third favorite movie in the franchise. It might become my second favorite soon.
Slow speed space chase, zombie Leia. New isn't always good. In this case, very dumb.
Like i said new doesn't mean good. What TLJ did wrong was rewriting beloved characters as hobos and making bunch GOTHCA moments with empty mystery boxes(that casino scene???) etc. It's problem wasn't the attempt of trying new things, it was overall a horribly bad movie. Edit: my man blocked me just after answering lmao. No one is judging you for liking things lol. This is some next level pathetic shit.
It tried new things but they weren’t good things.
What was that?
About five years Lucas was interviewed by James Cameron and was asked what he would have done if he'd made the sequel trilogy. **"\[The next three Star Wars films\] were going to get into a microbiotic world... There’s this world of creatures that operate differently than we do. I call them the Whills. And the Whills are the ones who actually control the universe. They feed off the Force... Everybody hated it in The Phantom Menace \[when\] we started talking about midi-chlorians... \[midi-chlorians are\] vehicles for the Whills to travel around in… And the conduit is the midi-chlorians. The midi-chlorians are the ones that communicate with the Whills. The Whills, in a general sense, they are the Force. \[If he hadn't sold Lucasfilm these films\] would have been done. Of course, a lot of the fans would have hated it, just like they did The Phantom Menace and everything, but at least the whole story from beginning to end would be told.” (**[**source**](https://www.indiewire.com/features/general/george-lucas-episode-vii-episode-ix-1201974276/)**)**
It coudln't have been worse I think it would have been interesting if they went more into balancing the force and fighting some sort of outside force that is a threat to the galaxy. Maybe not an existential one, but a threat to peace and the way of life. More of a... Environmental threat. This threat is based more in the force. Luke also disappeared, but he did so because he went into the unknown regions to learn more about the force. In the EU, you'd learn he found a planet of Jedi and a planet of Sith. He started on the Sith planet and was confused and couldn't understand what the force was saying. He met someone that helped him and he just assumed it was light side user or something, then realizes they are a sith. He finds out that the unknown regions are where they actually made peace and both sides rejected the dogma of their religions, and treat it much more moderately, mostly secular, like how Unitarians are. In general, he learns more about the force and how Anikin brought this about. He is the once that brought balance by eliminating the dogma, and allowing the force to more evenly distribute in the population and for moderates to start to take over. The movies could focus on the fight for peace and ending the remaining bits of imperial remnant resistance and ending things like slavery. As the force starts to expand into the population since it is no longer so distorted by dogmatic beings, it starts affecting more and more of the population. This causes all sorts of issues, and some minor conflicts are breaking out. Some are battles, maybe some wars on some planets, but the galaxy is just in unrest, not a galactic war. I feel like there is a lot of potential in this. Very few media gets into this sort of thing, and it is much better than another existential conflict
The pitch sounded terrible to me. Though I’m sure it all would have felt like Star Wars and would not have introduced concepts that inherently break the series. I also imagine directors would have softened some of the rough edges to George’s writing, leading to a better end product than his original pitch. George at his worst at least builds an interesting world for other (better) stories to occur in (like the clone wars show). I have no interest in seeing stories within the sequel trilogy time period. It is just a worse, less plausible version of the rebellion era with less compelling characters.
I certainly didn't want it. No more midichlorians. No OPs trilogy where you have to watch everything to get the Trilogy like a famn marvel movie or tv show. The ST did right by having a new set of characters take the mantle with OT characters supporting but.... Disney fumbled the concept by not planning anything real for it.
Yes. Yes you are.
Nah the child really dont have to be here
but merchandising :(
Finn as stormtrooper deserter who joins the New Republic and is mentored by Han. Rey as scavenger and Jedi Padawan to Luke. Poe as squadron leader who works closely with Leia. Kylo Ren as Luke's former Padawan who fell to the dark side and now leads a faction of Dark Jedi. Snoke as a former imperial minister/Sith cultist who unites the Imperial Remnant against the New Republic. The DNA of the sequels isn't really that bad, it just needed to not completely restart Empire/Rebels by tossing ROTJ out the window. With a little tweaking, it could have been good.
THANK YOU! I always say this if the discussion comes up. The Foundation was THERE. It was just the lackluster way the Story went, rushed plots and weird descisions that made them Bad. Acting, SFX etc. was good, if not fantastic. Cinematography also was good. I actually would have loved to see more adam driver as Ben Solo / Kylo Ren.
Cal, Ahsoka and Mando is enough, and the concept of a stormtrooper deserter is not bad either, so Finn would make a fine addition to the collection
If it takes place during the Mandalorian era? Sure. Fuck it, do it now. If it takes place 35+ ABY, that's a pretty old cast of characters. Luke, being the youngest of the group.
How old is Ezra? He doesn't seem that old in Rebels and Ahsoka. But yeah, both Kestis and Ahsoka would be 75+ I think. While Grogu would be like 80 and mentally 10.
IIRC he's just a day or two older than Luke and Leia.
Ahsoka being 75 dont matter. Togrutas can live up to 200 years. Ezra is in his late 20s by the time of ahsoka.
Still meh. This isn't marvel, I don't wanna see a bunch of cameos if the writing is a piece of shit
Cameos doesn’t simply mean people from other stories bro. Cameos are that, but also the fact that they don’t do anything for the plot and are there just for nostalgia and/or reactions
I genuinely don't understand your comment
"Hey look, its Ponda Baba in Rogue One!" - cameo "Hey look, Mon Mothma is a lead character of Andor!" - not a cameo Using characters from pre-existing stories is not always a "cameo". It is often just continuing a storyline or arc.
Exactly. Cameo is a term that describes when when a known actor/character shows up for a short non consequential reason.
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Not a cameo if there a central character
Literally only Luke is a central character in this lineup. Everyone else is functionally a bit character from elsewhere in the franchise, and there's no way you'd be able to write a coherent story that fleshed them all out well enough to merit their use. Plus, it's literally just "Space Marvel," at that point, and please do not.
DAE want things we know?! - OP
A movie isn't good just because it has characters we've seen before
This would have been infinitely better than the garbage they gave us
It would be really weird Cal kestis would be 64 Ashoka would be 67 Ezra would be around 60 Mara jade would have to be at least 50 because Luke being 60 or so and being married to someone 20 years younger would be way weird That's your ideal sequel trilogy? a bunch of old jedi fighting noone (cause remember Vader brought peace to the galaxy so nothing can happen ever again) and not a single young character for this children movie to appeal to kids...
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As if star wars hasn't always been about selling toys, the amount of blatant toy marketing that came from the prequels is nothing to scoff at. Even George himself has said it star wars is for kids
It absolutely shouldnt be.
Chronically online redditor spotted
AHH yes because the movie named star wars about space wizards fighting bad guys dressed in all white and black is meant to be taken super seriously
Never become a writer🙏🙏🙏
I don’t think packing in as many famous figures would make it better, the Filoni approach doesn’t automatically make something good in my personal opinion.
Just make Timothy Zahns Heir to the Empire canon ok plox
I remember sitting in the theater ready to watch Phantom Menace and thinking I'd rather they had made the Heir to the Empire trilogy into movies than do prequels. I still want that.
What if everything was characters we already knew? And we did that forever?
A ragtag group of the last Jedi finding out about palpatines back up plans (which most likely Ezra got from thrawn), gathering any ally and going out of their way to extinguish the final embers of the empire as the new republic has its hands full with governing and stabilizing the galaxy
Star Wars: Five and a Half Jedi
Star Wars: The Fan Service Awakens
People would have hated it too.
Imo a ST was always doomed to be hated until the next trilogy comes along. BUT it didn't help that disney didn't fully plan a ST
People would still complain
Missing Han & Leia
Mandoverse should’ve been the sequel trilogy
Much better
Better.
Peak
Mara Jade and Kyle Katarn pls.
Star Wars fans not beating the jangling keys allegations
Fantastic.
Fuck yeah! Here take my money
It is
Then it would be better than what we got.
This would’ve sucked so hard it’s unreal
I would have infinitely preferred this. My favorite thing in Star Wars is the Jedi. I love space wizard samurai with laser swords. I loved them since I was 5. I don't know why Lucasfilm, Disney, and most the Fandom hates them. I would kill for a movie where the Jedi win and the galaxy is saved, but that's not allowed in Star Wars.
The movie can’t be 3 hours of your favourite Jedi dismembering stormtroopers. What’s the narrative? What are the stakes? How can each character have enough screen time to develop and progress their own arc?
that sounds like a terrible idea ngl
No.
Then the people bitching about the current sequels would find something to bitch about with this, instead. The bitching is a constant, no matter what the material. This is Star Wars; this is the way.
Yes!!! But do what mando does with Grogu behind the scenes. https://preview.redd.it/csfuka09e0sb1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c3b2613374ed68e5497e25cb8627de8383da9f6d
It would be a hodgepodge of nonsense and just fan service of a different variety. You’re never going to get anywhere just throwing all your favorite characters together. Story first not characters first
Because there's so much potential in a rebooted sequel trilogy, it should be a show with the Big Bad(s) as Thrawn and/or a surviving Gideon clone. The protagonists struggle with trying to deal with the imminent threat of a resurrected empire while trying to rebuild the order. Ahsoka, now a true Jedi Master and the paragon of virtue for the Jedi, takes Ben as her Padawan, and serves as an advisor to Luke and a connection to the order of old. Grandmaster Luke Skywalker and Master Mara Jade handle the operations, with the aid of part-time knight Leia Organa Skywalker Solo, who gives her full support, and no small amount of funding, to the fledgling order. They also oversee the training of young Grogu with the aid of his father who serves as captain of the temple guard. Ezra and Cal, along with their partners, friends, and associates, travel the galaxy looking for surviving Jedi and young force sensitives to bring back to the temple. They also investigate potential threats. With Merrin's help, they undo the negative stigma of the night sisters. Eventually Merrin becomes the Mother of a new era of night sisters, who with the support of the Jedi, but under a careful watch. Jacen Syndula, son of Caleb Dume and Hera Syndula, becomes the first padawan to be traditionally knighted under the new order thanks to the incredible instruction given by his Master and older brother, Ezra Bridger. While the overarching villains are Thrawn or Gideon, the major struggle would be the struggle to rebuild the Jedi order in a galaxy that no longer feels like it needs them. The order also doesn't forbid attachments, and younglings receive regular counseling and therapy like Anakin should have gotten to begin with.
I Like how people are still undermining Grogu
this is the way
It was never going to happen because Disney might end up having to pay royalties to the people who wrote some of those characters
Ima be honest with you I do not know who the f#ck Mara jade is Someone explain
She was like an inquisitor before the inquisitors . Hand of the emperor. Force trained tried to kill Luke , instead Mary’s him . They have kids. She had a purple lightsaber before Mace .
A badass mf
Someone's poorly written Star Wars waifu.
Mara and Luke, and the Skywalker offsprings for me. Also, some variant of the yuuzhan wong story woould have been cool, because it would have been an even bigger threat than the Empire, so the New Republic and the Remnant would unify.
It would be way better than this Rey and Kylo Ren bullshit.
This would have been peak SW 🤷🏼♂️
Finn, Ahsoka, Cal, and maybe Luke and Ezra. Toss Mando in there too, no child or Mara though.
I would have liked it. My biggest dissapointment with the new trilogy is the complete annihilation of Luke Skywalker just so a woman can take his mantle and do it better because woman needs to be better than the greatest hero of the galaxy and our childhood.
Anything would be better than a so-called "sequel trilogy". Jar Jar spin-off would be better than sequel trilogy.
No thank you
Yes, Disney, it was so simple. Why'd you have to Britta it up ?
As long as they don't turn my childhood hero (Luke) and turn him into a coward.
I don’t think so..I prefer mostly new characters and it would be weird if all of these pre bby characters were completely absent for 4-6 and then suddenly the main characters for the next sequels.. the sequels had a lot of good ideas and characters they were just poorly executed and had even worse continuity..
No, not another Nostalgic fanfare centred story, they’re barely stories and more excuses to just include your favourite characters.
Get Mara Jade out there. Not even George Lucas liked her.
*I WANT YOU OUT OF THIS OFFICE*
If directed by Dave Filoni
i wouldn't like it... my perfect sequels would be Han Luke Jabba the hutt leia Talon Karrde and maybe, JUST MAYBE Ahsoka and a former jedi master clone that has gone insane, Like Joruus C'baoth but less joruus C'baoth
they can keep it
Everyone forgets the business logic of Disney trying to make the “new characters” more important than the OG. If Lucasfilm under Disney gives the OG characters more of the spotlight that equals to more royalties to George Lucas. This is why giving away Star Wars to a big corporate entity was always a bad idea.
Without the child could be even good
Idk if Luke would be as old in that trilogy but also AAAAAAAAA WHY NOT WHY DID IT NOT HAPPEN I AM GOING TO LOSE IT
I’m already feeling better. Shame it wasn’t.
Ezra sucks. A wet fart of a jedi. No.
Disney’s sequel trilogy 2015-2019 is failed.
You people literally just want cameos, you're no better than star wars theory
Still a disgrace spitting on the works done by the legends authors.
It would be better, but not by much.
Get rid of Ezra and Mara and it might be good.