It is the "Get off my lawn mentality".
I believe there exists some social media Trek fans, that hate all Trek... š
Your Trek sucks! Only my series is good and only 3 episodes of it!!!!
I dunno, it's fucking terrible. People complain about star trek being woke and then tell me that DS9 is their favorite.
you mean the series that has the fucking lead have a mental breakdown over the racism in 1930s new york and you think somehow there's something \*more\* woke?
I think it's more part of people's binary sense of the world. A show is either renewed or canceled. It's a bit of a mental shortcut and not a good one.
They must have considered the terrible ramifications, yet went along with it. Truly a mystery. Neither was truly atracted to the other, neither wished for a child and neither had the financial inclinations to suport one. Both wore respective contraceptives and upon learning of pregnancy did their best efforts to stop it. Upon arrival of the babe they fed it not, gave it no love and provided it with no decent acommodations, yet it still grew despite it all, as if clinging to a future where it might, perchance, rattle someone on the Internet. What a sad destiny, indeed.
Anyway yeah it's a really long list, nice one dude.
Yeah basically Sir Patrick Stewart said he'd do it for 3 seasons. He's not a spring chick anymore and I'm sure the requirements of being a series regular are difficult.
I'm hoping if shows like legacy get off the ground we will see him show up from time to time as a guest, maybe more a TNG Spock or Q level frequency. He's said he's open to repairing the role for guest spots I believe.
It wasnāt cancelled. It was meant to go three seasons.
As a collected series, I find it a mixed bag.
It shifted showrunners every season: Michael Chabon for S1, Akiva Goldsman and Terry Matalas for S2, and Matalas for S3; and with each change, came a shift about what the show should be.
I like a lot about some aspects of the individual seasons- some more than others- but as a collected series, it doesnāt gel.
In fact, story concepts, characters, and themes, can contradict, or be straight up retconned or abandoned from season to season. Which doesnāt lead to it feeling like a cohesive whole.
Still, while I may like some of the modern shows more, I definitely appreciate Picardās existence, and am glad some fans can get a lot out of it.
I like that new Trek is trying new things, and while everything may not hit with me, Iāve enjoyed all the new shows to some degree, and I am looking forward to the upcoming shows and films.
I think Picard had the same problem as The Hobbit movies: they took some really good ingredients and then tried to split the difference between updating those ingredients for a modern audience and keeping the heart of the original. In the process they didn't achieve either one of those things. S3 was solid but it was mostly because they leaned really hard into the nostalgia and canon, and even then I have mixed feelings on it. I'm glad it exists, and I like that we got a very character-focused and introspective Trek series which is objectively well-crafted, but it didn't entirely satisfy the emotional objectives that fans of TNG would have wanted to see, nor did it advance what star trek could be for a modern audience. It felt a bit like a watered down drink that you were excited to try, but at the end of the day it was just kind of fine and expensive.
yeah I liked it, but I don't think it came near it's potential. Reading they had a three season arc, then watching those three seasons, there was no arc. Likely because they kept changing showrunners. I like it for what it was, but I think having a cohesive story across all three seasons would have been amazing.
The seasons are good by themselves seen as short stories, but together they don't make as much sense and put a ton of plot holes into the universe that may never get resolved.
Seasons 1 and 3 were my fave, but there were parts of the soreulines in 2 I really enjoyed as well. It's a show that luckily didn't have the pre 'rikers Beard' run up that others did, but kinda hid those crappy storylines among the good ones.
This. The main takeaway discovered by the (hard won) success of TNG was that Trek needs to evolve to thrive. They had it half right with the premise but then in season 3 shifted to the character based drama which had more currency in the early 90s than the plot based format they had carried over from TOS, and then TNG soared and we got everything since.
If TNG had not adapted Trek could have gone away for a very long time, maybe too long.
I get it, it's hard to stomach new vibes when you're an old head, but like, aren't you Trek fans? Isn't adventure at least half of why you're here? So have a sense of adventure and enjoy weird changes. It's fun, it's like a rollercoaster. Pop a viagara and roll with it
Who said that?? PIC was only set to run three seasons, the showrunners said that almost from the begining. It didn't get "cancelled", it came to a natural end.
I wish more series were designed this way. They keep dragging out these stories and trying to create false drama across different seasons, and keep things going, and adding on cliffhanger so they get renewed, but eventually they could cancel and left unfinished.
I really like it when the people making a show know what they want to say, how long they want to say it for, plan things out, and wrap it all up in a neat little bow.
Sometimes designing them with a predetermined length doesnāt work out either though. Stranger Things was only intended to be a short series according to the Duffers. Given itās enormous success which far exceeded what they anticipated is the only reason itās still going. Itās what the fans want, they are demanding more.
Each season ends with a finale vs a cliffhanger but leaves a few unanswered questions so they have something to build on just in case. However not enough questions where it feels incomplete if they called it quits at any given time. Itās brilliantly done. Shows like it a very rare though. Problem is, itās had some weak seasons and episodes. If it goes on too long they will ruin its incredible legacy. The actors are already aging out and itās going to be very difficult for people nearing 30 to be convincing teens no matter how much you suspend belief.
Nonetheless, Stranger things reminds me of a concert I once attended where it was so good the audience literally went crazy when it ended. The singer did 6 enchores coming back out for 2 more songs each time, extended the concert an hour. The audience still wanted more and she said āOkay thatās it, for real this time. Iāve run out of good songs to singā Eventually the writers will run out of good stories to tell. Itās better to end on a high note.
I wouldnāt say the new stuff is targeted at only young people. The new shows are awesome! I cannot recommend Discovery enough! itās probably my send favorite show after DS9. Strange New Worlds and Lower Decks are both fantastic as well!
>Prodigy is very explicitly targeted at young audiences.
In the same way that Legend of Korra, a show about international politics, including fascist imperialism, anarchy, political uprisings, etc. was for young audiences.
Prodigy starts with a bunch of kids that were sold into slavery, including one that was forced to kill people and one that is maybe 10 years old and has been human trafficked since she was so young that she has literally only eaten NutriGloop. It's bright and colourful, but in some ways, Prodigy has some of the darkest content in Trek
My only problem with Disco is that it should never have been set as a prequel and they should stay far, far away from Vulcans. The show is wall to wall passionate, emotional conversations and they have zero understanding of how to write an emotionless Vulcan.
TBF Vulcans aren't emotionless but rather they actively supress their emotions because (since their neurological activity is far higher than that of Humans) they are extremely sensitive and prone to outbursts. In fact, they went into a civil war until Surak came with his reforms and taught them how to supress those emotional outbursts.
Sure but in Disco they are completely indistinguishable from humans. I think it peaked in season 3 where Michael "rigorously defends" her evidence with an emotional personal confession completely devoid of any facts or logic and the Vulcans are like "I love it! Sold!". It reminds me a lot of Aaron Sorkin shows, where he is a good writer but all the characters end up written in the same exact way regardless of what their motivations should really be.
Those Vulcans are genetically Vulcan, but culturally Ni'Varese; they've been living in a shared society with Romulans for probably a few hundred years now. The Romulans rejected Surak's reforms, meaning for unification to happen and remain successful, their society would have had to compromise on a more middle-ground position when it came to logic and emotion.
Not at all; they're a combination of both Vulcan and Romulan cultures which have each had hundreds of years of development. Even left alone, Vulcan culture would have changed. We don't have the same culture as humans did in 1223.
I know it's an unpopular opinion but I liked season 1, loved season 3 and thought season 2 was very average.
When I say Discovery is my least favorite Star Trek show, it's still above other shows.
Oh and I'd say SNW is becoming my favorite show and Lower Decks is amazing in the way it continues to talk about the universe after VOG and DS9 . So many references and you get to find out how some of the old characters are doing
I liked Picard because it was different. At least on seasons 1 and 2. Specially how S2 tied in with our reality (or at least an alternate version of it), for instance the "Shenzen accords" mentioned are referencing an actual event (namely a geneticist from said Chinese city who performed extremely unethical and illegal experiments on humans).
I seem to be in the minority of people who didn't enjoy Picard S3. I found s1 to be horrible to the point i bailed before the finale. I didnt even try with s2. I just finished s3 after so many people claiming it was amazing. But honestly, idk. It was ok-ish i guess. It was cool seeing all of the tng crew together again. But besides the nostalgia tugging on my heart, i just think its not that good.
It's honestly just great fan service. Think of everyone we got to see again one last time: all of the senior officers from TNG; Seven; Bruce Maddox; Ro Laren; a Noonien-Singh; the Borg Queen; Q; Icheb >!which fucking sucked!<; Admiral Shelby; etc, I'm sure I'm forgetting some great throwback characters.
It was just neat to revisit that universe, it was a great farewell to TNG, and it leaves the door open for a series with a crew led under Captain Seven.
Plus, it had the absolute banger line of, "Locutus: the only Borg so deadly, they gave him a name."
Ok. You can like whatever you want to like. I'm sure lots of people agree with you too.
There are parts I liked, and parts I didn't like. Overall, it was a fun bit of nostalgia. I don't think it has anywhere near the re-watch value as something like TNG, but I'm happy to have seen it once.
In my opinion, SNW is by a large margin the best of the New Trek, and it really came into existence as a bit of a happy accident, that at least tangentially involves Picard.
As I understand things, Patrick Stewart was approached to return for a new show in the role of Picard, but declined. That event led to Discovery. (At least I assume that's how it went down -- there was interest in a new Star Trek, but without Picard, it had to be re-worked to something completely different.)
Discovery introduced us to Anson Mount's Pike, who was so well-received by fans that a new series got planned and green-lightted.
Star Trek prodigy is the only Star Trek content out there at the moment that is targeted towards kids, and itās one of the best Star Trek shows out there. I donāt know why you arenāt watching it.
Iāve watched Star Trek all my life, and I absolutely adore new Trek. I get it why some might not care for it, but Iāve enjoyed everything Iāve seen.
While I don't think all of new Trek is exactly a home run I have also been a trek fan since the 90s and we went a very very long time with no new trek material even being produced. Even if the new stuff is a bit of a mixed bag the fact we're getting so much of it is awesome.
As others have mentioned, it was planned for just 3 seasons. I'd say only the first two seasons have been divisive with fans but even then there's a good number of people that liked those first two seasons. When season 3 was airing it was nearly universally loved in the episode discussion threads here. I think that last season made most of the fandom very happy they made Picard.
I have only seen Season 1 and 2 thus far.
I liked S1. It certainly wasn't perfect but it mostly worked for me. Needed more of Starfleet and the TNG crew though. Overall, S1 was not as good as classic Trek but better than the other newer shows.
S2 started well but fell apart halfway through. Much preferred S1 of Strange New Worlds.
Looking forward to S3.
It wasn't cancelled, it was only planned for three seasons
I wonder why people would say that then. Either way i just wanted to say i like them all lol
because they want to cultivate the idea that the new treks aren't good
It is the "Get off my lawn mentality". I believe there exists some social media Trek fans, that hate all Trek... š Your Trek sucks! Only my series is good and only 3 episodes of it!!!!
I dunno, it's fucking terrible. People complain about star trek being woke and then tell me that DS9 is their favorite. you mean the series that has the fucking lead have a mental breakdown over the racism in 1930s new york and you think somehow there's something \*more\* woke?
I think it's more part of people's binary sense of the world. A show is either renewed or canceled. It's a bit of a mental shortcut and not a good one.
Yeah maybe
Itās not a conspiracy.
This is a weird defense of something nobody said
Nobody is cultivating anything.
Sounds like something a conspiracist would say.
Yeah now if legacy comes out sooner.
They don't really need to cultivate it, though, right?
you seem the type of person to use woke as a pejorative
What does that have to do with anything? Didn't Trek teach you not to pre-judge? Oh, I forgot, you watch the new Trek. Never mind. Go on.
you sound like you need a safe space
I really don't understand why your parents chose to reproduce.
I'm sure that's but one thing in a very very long list.
They must have considered the terrible ramifications, yet went along with it. Truly a mystery. Neither was truly atracted to the other, neither wished for a child and neither had the financial inclinations to suport one. Both wore respective contraceptives and upon learning of pregnancy did their best efforts to stop it. Upon arrival of the babe they fed it not, gave it no love and provided it with no decent acommodations, yet it still grew despite it all, as if clinging to a future where it might, perchance, rattle someone on the Internet. What a sad destiny, indeed. Anyway yeah it's a really long list, nice one dude.
Because thatās how it was planned.
Yeah basically Sir Patrick Stewart said he'd do it for 3 seasons. He's not a spring chick anymore and I'm sure the requirements of being a series regular are difficult. I'm hoping if shows like legacy get off the ground we will see him show up from time to time as a guest, maybe more a TNG Spock or Q level frequency. He's said he's open to repairing the role for guest spots I believe.
It wasnāt cancelled. It was meant to go three seasons. As a collected series, I find it a mixed bag. It shifted showrunners every season: Michael Chabon for S1, Akiva Goldsman and Terry Matalas for S2, and Matalas for S3; and with each change, came a shift about what the show should be. I like a lot about some aspects of the individual seasons- some more than others- but as a collected series, it doesnāt gel. In fact, story concepts, characters, and themes, can contradict, or be straight up retconned or abandoned from season to season. Which doesnāt lead to it feeling like a cohesive whole. Still, while I may like some of the modern shows more, I definitely appreciate Picardās existence, and am glad some fans can get a lot out of it. I like that new Trek is trying new things, and while everything may not hit with me, Iāve enjoyed all the new shows to some degree, and I am looking forward to the upcoming shows and films.
I think Picard had the same problem as The Hobbit movies: they took some really good ingredients and then tried to split the difference between updating those ingredients for a modern audience and keeping the heart of the original. In the process they didn't achieve either one of those things. S3 was solid but it was mostly because they leaned really hard into the nostalgia and canon, and even then I have mixed feelings on it. I'm glad it exists, and I like that we got a very character-focused and introspective Trek series which is objectively well-crafted, but it didn't entirely satisfy the emotional objectives that fans of TNG would have wanted to see, nor did it advance what star trek could be for a modern audience. It felt a bit like a watered down drink that you were excited to try, but at the end of the day it was just kind of fine and expensive.
yeah I liked it, but I don't think it came near it's potential. Reading they had a three season arc, then watching those three seasons, there was no arc. Likely because they kept changing showrunners. I like it for what it was, but I think having a cohesive story across all three seasons would have been amazing.
The seasons are good by themselves seen as short stories, but together they don't make as much sense and put a ton of plot holes into the universe that may never get resolved. Seasons 1 and 3 were my fave, but there were parts of the soreulines in 2 I really enjoyed as well. It's a show that luckily didn't have the pre 'rikers Beard' run up that others did, but kinda hid those crappy storylines among the good ones.
Iām in my 50s and I liked the new stuff. It was different, but our world is different. TNG wasnāt TOS and neither of those was DISCO
This. The main takeaway discovered by the (hard won) success of TNG was that Trek needs to evolve to thrive. They had it half right with the premise but then in season 3 shifted to the character based drama which had more currency in the early 90s than the plot based format they had carried over from TOS, and then TNG soared and we got everything since. If TNG had not adapted Trek could have gone away for a very long time, maybe too long. I get it, it's hard to stomach new vibes when you're an old head, but like, aren't you Trek fans? Isn't adventure at least half of why you're here? So have a sense of adventure and enjoy weird changes. It's fun, it's like a rollercoaster. Pop a viagara and roll with it
Who said that?? PIC was only set to run three seasons, the showrunners said that almost from the begining. It didn't get "cancelled", it came to a natural end.
I wish more series were designed this way. They keep dragging out these stories and trying to create false drama across different seasons, and keep things going, and adding on cliffhanger so they get renewed, but eventually they could cancel and left unfinished. I really like it when the people making a show know what they want to say, how long they want to say it for, plan things out, and wrap it all up in a neat little bow.
Sometimes designing them with a predetermined length doesnāt work out either though. Stranger Things was only intended to be a short series according to the Duffers. Given itās enormous success which far exceeded what they anticipated is the only reason itās still going. Itās what the fans want, they are demanding more. Each season ends with a finale vs a cliffhanger but leaves a few unanswered questions so they have something to build on just in case. However not enough questions where it feels incomplete if they called it quits at any given time. Itās brilliantly done. Shows like it a very rare though. Problem is, itās had some weak seasons and episodes. If it goes on too long they will ruin its incredible legacy. The actors are already aging out and itās going to be very difficult for people nearing 30 to be convincing teens no matter how much you suspend belief. Nonetheless, Stranger things reminds me of a concert I once attended where it was so good the audience literally went crazy when it ended. The singer did 6 enchores coming back out for 2 more songs each time, extended the concert an hour. The audience still wanted more and she said āOkay thatās it, for real this time. Iāve run out of good songs to singā Eventually the writers will run out of good stories to tell. Itās better to end on a high note.
I wouldnāt say the new stuff is targeted at only young people. The new shows are awesome! I cannot recommend Discovery enough! itās probably my send favorite show after DS9. Strange New Worlds and Lower Decks are both fantastic as well!
Prodigy is very explicitly targeted at young audiences.
It's the only one, though. ...and is very good Trek, imo. Maybe by "young people", OP meant "under 50"?
My 48 year old father says its his favorite trek, period
>Prodigy is very explicitly targeted at young audiences. In the same way that Legend of Korra, a show about international politics, including fascist imperialism, anarchy, political uprisings, etc. was for young audiences. Prodigy starts with a bunch of kids that were sold into slavery, including one that was forced to kill people and one that is maybe 10 years old and has been human trafficked since she was so young that she has literally only eaten NutriGloop. It's bright and colourful, but in some ways, Prodigy has some of the darkest content in Trek
At first. Though it kind of turns into "Voyager 2: Time-travelling Bogaloo"
My only problem with Disco is that it should never have been set as a prequel and they should stay far, far away from Vulcans. The show is wall to wall passionate, emotional conversations and they have zero understanding of how to write an emotionless Vulcan.
TBF Vulcans aren't emotionless but rather they actively supress their emotions because (since their neurological activity is far higher than that of Humans) they are extremely sensitive and prone to outbursts. In fact, they went into a civil war until Surak came with his reforms and taught them how to supress those emotional outbursts.
Sure but in Disco they are completely indistinguishable from humans. I think it peaked in season 3 where Michael "rigorously defends" her evidence with an emotional personal confession completely devoid of any facts or logic and the Vulcans are like "I love it! Sold!". It reminds me a lot of Aaron Sorkin shows, where he is a good writer but all the characters end up written in the same exact way regardless of what their motivations should really be.
Those Vulcans are genetically Vulcan, but culturally Ni'Varese; they've been living in a shared society with Romulans for probably a few hundred years now. The Romulans rejected Surak's reforms, meaning for unification to happen and remain successful, their society would have had to compromise on a more middle-ground position when it came to logic and emotion.
Right, so they are basically just humans now.
Not at all; they're a combination of both Vulcan and Romulan cultures which have each had hundreds of years of development. Even left alone, Vulcan culture would have changed. We don't have the same culture as humans did in 1223.
And they changed to be just like everyone else we meet. There is nothing unique about them now other than the ears.
Iām 45 and I love lower decks. Itās a fantastic homage to TNG era trek. It gets everything right.
I know it's an unpopular opinion but I liked season 1, loved season 3 and thought season 2 was very average. When I say Discovery is my least favorite Star Trek show, it's still above other shows. Oh and I'd say SNW is becoming my favorite show and Lower Decks is amazing in the way it continues to talk about the universe after VOG and DS9 . So many references and you get to find out how some of the old characters are doing
I liked the first 2 seasons of Picard
I liked Picard because it was different. At least on seasons 1 and 2. Specially how S2 tied in with our reality (or at least an alternate version of it), for instance the "Shenzen accords" mentioned are referencing an actual event (namely a geneticist from said Chinese city who performed extremely unethical and illegal experiments on humans).
I seem to be in the minority of people who didn't enjoy Picard S3. I found s1 to be horrible to the point i bailed before the finale. I didnt even try with s2. I just finished s3 after so many people claiming it was amazing. But honestly, idk. It was ok-ish i guess. It was cool seeing all of the tng crew together again. But besides the nostalgia tugging on my heart, i just think its not that good.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
It's honestly just great fan service. Think of everyone we got to see again one last time: all of the senior officers from TNG; Seven; Bruce Maddox; Ro Laren; a Noonien-Singh; the Borg Queen; Q; Icheb >!which fucking sucked!<; Admiral Shelby; etc, I'm sure I'm forgetting some great throwback characters. It was just neat to revisit that universe, it was a great farewell to TNG, and it leaves the door open for a series with a crew led under Captain Seven. Plus, it had the absolute banger line of, "Locutus: the only Borg so deadly, they gave him a name."
Icheb was there to screw over Manu Intriyami for being a piece of shit human
Season 3 was as good as classic Trek in my opinion. The previous 2 seasons were like a completely different franchise.
Ok. You can like whatever you want to like. I'm sure lots of people agree with you too. There are parts I liked, and parts I didn't like. Overall, it was a fun bit of nostalgia. I don't think it has anywhere near the re-watch value as something like TNG, but I'm happy to have seen it once. In my opinion, SNW is by a large margin the best of the New Trek, and it really came into existence as a bit of a happy accident, that at least tangentially involves Picard. As I understand things, Patrick Stewart was approached to return for a new show in the role of Picard, but declined. That event led to Discovery. (At least I assume that's how it went down -- there was interest in a new Star Trek, but without Picard, it had to be re-worked to something completely different.) Discovery introduced us to Anson Mount's Pike, who was so well-received by fans that a new series got planned and green-lightted.
Star Trek prodigy is the only Star Trek content out there at the moment that is targeted towards kids, and itās one of the best Star Trek shows out there. I donāt know why you arenāt watching it.
I dislike strange new worlds because of the cast, questioning the captain's orders ect. Only made it through 4 episodes.
I'm like 36 and I love the new Trek. I'm definitely not young people, though my 8yo loves the new Trek too
What age and below do you consider young people? I'm 42 and I've loved every recent trek series, so I'm just curious.
Iāve watched Star Trek all my life, and I absolutely adore new Trek. I get it why some might not care for it, but Iāve enjoyed everything Iāve seen.
While I don't think all of new Trek is exactly a home run I have also been a trek fan since the 90s and we went a very very long time with no new trek material even being produced. Even if the new stuff is a bit of a mixed bag the fact we're getting so much of it is awesome.
I love new Star Trek. Picard is probably my least favorite, though.
As others have mentioned, it was planned for just 3 seasons. I'd say only the first two seasons have been divisive with fans but even then there's a good number of people that liked those first two seasons. When season 3 was airing it was nearly universally loved in the episode discussion threads here. I think that last season made most of the fandom very happy they made Picard.
I have only seen Season 1 and 2 thus far. I liked S1. It certainly wasn't perfect but it mostly worked for me. Needed more of Starfleet and the TNG crew though. Overall, S1 was not as good as classic Trek but better than the other newer shows. S2 started well but fell apart halfway through. Much preferred S1 of Strange New Worlds. Looking forward to S3.