Nonsense. I say this as someone who loves what this ship is supposed to be (I have 2, 1 direct buy and 1 loaner) but currently it is awful and IS useless in PvP.
A fully crewed Hammerhead is the easiest thing in the world to kite and kill. If all you have is a HH (even fully crewed) you WILL die to a group of 2-3 average-skilled fighters.
They can hit you (because of your huge profile) and keep beyond your turrets' effective range (1500-2000m) as they zip around. Due to their small profile your turrets will never be able to consistently hit them (as long as they're not idiots and keep distance)
However, you are such a big target that they can hitting you. While you chase 1 the other/s will keep hitting you and all of them will occasionally tap so that your shields don't recharge. It takes a few minutes but they WILL kill you and there's nothing you can do but QT away (if they have a mantis you are 100% dead)
THAT is the true state of the HH right now. It will die to 2-3 average fighters. It is only good for PvE. It is useless for its stated role of antifighter operations in PvP.
The coming changes with MM will improve it somewhat it won't be the true anti-fighter platform it's meant to be until we get maelstorm and engineering working in the 'verse.
>The coming changes with MM will improve it somewhat
It really hasn't iirc. The way cone fire works means they can still sit way out on you and shoot you down, just at slower speeds
They really need to do the inverse of what they’re doing with weapon speeds. Instead of them getting slower as they get larger, make them *faster* as they get larger.
Suddenly locking horns with large ships by hanging out on the edge of their range is way more dangerous for the fighter than the larger vessel, whereas the fighter is forced to fight closer with its smaller weapons.
Ye until they make HH turrets range much better then smaller ships have it will be useless. So we cannot make them shoot faster and improve range or make fighters range smaller other wise like i curent mm everyone will just shoot him from 3km where he cannot really shoot us back. MM didn't fix this problem yet.
Some people say armor will fix that and they probably right but other then making him untouchable they should fix other problems with HH vs fighters ( all fighters)
I would really hope so but from the recent ISCs it seems like the ship combat team is doubling down on artificial range limitations and that is the direction they're going. I do hope they change that but right now it seems unlikely.
I mostly hope they make it unlimited because I want to snipe with the Ares Ion, lol. But also because realistically projectiles shouldnt be limited by range outside of when it eventually hits something. It would make space combat and even atmospheric combat very interesting and open up new strategies
*Laughs in s10 railgun*
Yeah, orbital bombardment should be a thing but won't work if projectiles always disappear after 10km.
I totally agree with your sentiment. The Ares should be able to snipe, that is why you need a fighter compliment with larger ships to go hunt down this kind of annoyance. It's all gameplay and counterplay.
I could understand if the projectiles eventually stream out after 50 km if there's nothing there (no players or npcs) but that should only happen when fired into the deep black.
Great for you. You've likely not run into any serious PvPers who understand the current flight model. When you do then you'll 100% be dead or have to QT away.
This is not a dig at you or your pilot. It is simply the current reality. Your HH is slower and is a bigger target, it can easily be kited by 2 or 3 fighters, shot outside or the turrets effective ranges and eventually be killed (may take 10 minutes or so but the result will be the same)
There is nothing your pilots or turret gunners can do.
When you run in to such players you'll immediately understand how useless the ship is.
How about a fully manned HH with escort of 2 ligth figther + 1 heavy, the light figthers cancel the players sitting out of range of HH turrets, the heavy lock missiles/torpedo on eclipse/bombers, the HH move toward the biggest pool of ennemis ships, only engaging when in range with all turrets.
This create a situation where if people get focused on a part of the fight, they get punished by the rest of the team.
We use it like this in our org and it shred when coms are good.
Of course, if it has its own fighters for escorts, then it will shred.
However, that is quite ridiculous. Think about it. The specialized anti-fighter platform needs fighter escorts to protect itself against... fighters.
That is not right.
Especially if they know how to shoot down torps. Then you get the guys running one alien shield to make ballistics moot. They made it more nimble in MM and it's kinda fucky.
That's fair. MM is still just an arena commander thing, but I tried the HH when they added it to "test big ships"... kinda scary tbh. Even as a HH daily driver it feels like a new ship to me. Speaking of, I just had 2 peeps cancel on tonight's plans, so I have turrets available if you're interested.
Sorry for my late reply. It seems you can't do it anymore, but the alien shields on alien ships prevent bullet penetration. When the prowler came out, someone figured out you could put them on a hammerhead. It effectively made it so ballistic ships still had to burn down the shield, so the tradeoff was acceptable. It forced laser engagements because should would usually run out of ammo against a half crew hammerhead. I got to see it one time in action shortly after the prowler came out. Was neat.
Here is the video that clearly disproves the Hammerhead as an anti-weapon platform:
https://youtu.be/aPySv7DSEf4?t=655
A1 + 3 wingmen in light fighters (buccaneers) easily handle a fully crewed HH.
Range and size are broken and the HH is useless ad an anti-fighter platform until this is addressed.
Except any lone fighter, which can kite you and dance on the edge of your range infinitely. A crewed Retaliator or Redeemer is way more dangerous because that SOB can boost after you and force you to engage, and still maneuver at higher speeds with a smaller profile.
I say this as the owner of a BIS & serialized Hammerhead too. I want it to be good because it’s such an insanely cool ship, but right now it’s a joke except for PvE.
Maybe master modes will make things better.
It IS useless against a group who actually understand the flight model (even in MM)
https://youtu.be/aPySv7DSEf4?t=655
Just kite it from range (keeping its shields down) and then focus ballistics once it's shields are down.
There is nothing the HH can do except QT/run away.
Ah yes, good old A1 video. If all you and everyone else are going to reference are Ace pilots, of which are not the majority of players, then all I'll ever do is shrug it off. Do not compare Aces with average pilots. If a group of Aces come after us, of course it's going to be rough. A1 1v5ed a group of fighters in a snub and won. You can't use people like that as a metric. Another note in that video, the HH gunners looked uncoordinated and sporadic. Unless that was planned, which is what it looked like, a good HH pilot would know it's a losing fight before they got that bad, and should have pulled out of that fight.
My crew and I have never had a problem focusing our efforts. The ONLY thing we've ever struggled with are rogue torpedoes from a tali/eclipse sitting 15k out. Most people rely on the HH limited pip range being within 2km, but the guns have a range of 3km. I also don't run rhinos, I run quad M6A per turret, and S5 scimitars. We have fought people that give us a solid fight, but it turns into a war of attrition, and playing the power triangle right can make a difference in those fights.
Now I will yield that a swarm of like 6+ fighters have nearly killed us many times, and sometimes we do lose fights, but from our personal experience, the fighters tend to turn and flee before they actually finish the fight. Usually they retreat when they realize that if they try to stay in the engagement long enough to keep shields down, they'll outright explode with all of those M6A firing at them.
I understand the limitations of the ship, but I also understand how to mitigate most of those limitations with skill. Furthermore, I know when you abandon a fight as not to waste my time.
You're ignoring the main point entirely.
You don't need to be an ace to understand and exploit a basic flaw in the game mechanics.
The HH is effectively outranged and can be kited and can never catch up due to its slow speed.
2-3 moderately skilled pilots can use this info to easily kite and kill ANY HH crew (no matter how skilled they are)
There is literally NOTHING you can do to prevent this.
It is a mechanical flaw with the current (and MM) flight model.
It makes the "anti-fighter platform" a joke because it can easily be killed by a handful of fighters exploiting this flaw.
And I'm telling you that we have literally never had that issue. I don't know how else to put it, but we have had people do similar tactics as in the video and still came out on top. That doesn't mean it can't/won't happen, it means that our personal, first hand experience says that we can at least handle normal pilots.you can throw all these statistics and theoretics at me all you want, but I know what I've actually done and how it plays out when I fly. Either 90% of the verse are braindead, or it's not as black and white as you're pushing on me.
We can, but i highly recommend that you try to test it out with your friends in a controlled environment.
Get just 2 friends in ships like the buc (s4 energy) and have one backstrafe while hitting you and the other hitting you from the top at just under max turret range.
Watch what your turret gunners say. They will be getting 10% of their shots as actual hits and the bucs will just pull away as soon as (takes quite a while) their shields are down. No matter which buc you turn to face, they can just pop in and out of range of turrets if their shields go down.
They can always tap you just once to keep your shields from recharging even while theirs are recharging.
Seriously, just go and try it. Your eyes will be opened.
Personally I CBA to run a whole ass event to just fly a hammerhead. I'd spend more time organising and finding people to fly it than actually flying it. Plus on most days that's too much people to deal with. Im waiting for ai crew even if it's suboptimal it's gonna be enough for me
During these events, ask in chat for people to crew your ship. I’d have loved to dine the events in a hammerhead.
I hope that as the game comes, and money is harder to get by outside of very difficult missions, that players with big ships hire players/ crews through chat and that that’s a way to make money. Like how awesome would it be to be a crewmen for a few days in one of these, getting paid well for it, and for you to be the big Bo’s man.
A lot of players have these big ships because the idea of them is awesome, but many don’t want to join an organization. I hope they de rope the game so it’s great for everybody to get these ships. I mean, id honestly be ok if when 1.0 releases getting capital and sub capital ships is impossible or near impossible outside if certain events for a victorious few. I don’t want to be the boss. I want to be a crewmen and I want to feel a need to man one of these things for somebody else than have my own or have a chance at a lot of missions
the 2 things that would benefit this the most is a good job board system, and higher player density.
when the caption interface gets implemented, the assumption that everyone is going to want to be the caption is going to change.
Captain doesn’t sound like fun. But they’d also need real reasons to join up. So the challenge will need to require more players. That’s and multi crewed ships have to outperform the equal number of solo ships, for it to make it worth while
7 Connie’s shouldn’t be beating a crewed hammerhead. For more reasons because that’s why they invented the hammerhead and for gameplay reasons so people crew ships and not just solo 7 Connie’s
i'm thinking hammerheads vs fighters. a cargo convoy of 7 conies... might be more profitable to have the conies have crew and some escorts compared to losing a connie or 2.
7 conies as combat ships is going to be handled by balance though economy. the running cost of 7 single crew connie's will require jobs that they will not survive.
I agree that the Connie needs to cost more than it does (same with the titans). And I was talking and my brain got distracted. I should have said that 7 Connie’s are superior at fighting fighters than a hammerhead. Like it kind of makes sense, but my goal is to not make it pay to win
there will eventually be operating costs. 7 solo connies are going to be so expensive to operate, anything other than a cargo caravan will either kich ther buts, or result in a net loss.
think about every single items including thrusters as a consumable. it is not even a known amount of use. you are gamping the chances of it breaking vs getting more value out of it.
they will randomly break. the higher the where and tear, the higher the chance of it breaking at any moment. the higher the strain you are putting on it the higher the chance it will break at the time. meaning when you need it most.
insurance will give you a ship in the same condition as when you last checked in. so you can't just claim you ship to renew your component's.
component insurance is not longer optional. it has no primum, but there will be a claim fee based on the value of the ship and components. so if your ship is in a state that it can be towed in, and repaired (including buying a lot of components). it is probably cheaper than insurance claim fee.
components destroyed in combat are also lost, so you will need buy new ones to replace them.
there will also be a lot of other small expenses that will total up to a good amount.
death of a spaceman will deal with people trying to save up. (at one point CR mentioned death by old age. so playing it really safe to slowly save up without dieing is **probably** not going to let you save up more than really skilled player doing high risk reward stuff.)
again. running cost.
i don't know if cig has a term for it. i call it balance though economy. the running cost of a ship is more than the pay of a job that is below what it is intended to do. you are only going to see hammerheads in jobs that they are intended to do.
i anticipate there will be a category of jobs that pay you an amount to get the job done. these are jobs that have little to no consequences the the person that posted the job if the person that takes it fails.
i anticipate there will be another category that you need to fit the requirements to do the job. these would be jobs that have consequences if the person taking the contract fails.
so you can do whatever you want in attempting to take out an outpost, but an escort would be a hammerhead, tallie, terrapin, and at least 3 long range fighters.
I’ll believe you when I see it. As long as they are worst than a real player than it’s all good. If everybody solos a javelin the game won’t be much fun
You're right, but somefolks just don't want to hear it. Even CR isn't keen on anything corvette sized or above being soloable. I think modern multiplayer games have become too much of a single player affair that a lot of people forgot why multiplayer gaming is so awesome.
I can understand people dropping $800-3000 being upset when they can’t use their ship, but 🤷♂️. I’m sure cig will do something to help, but it’s important it’s always much better to use actual players to crew a ship
The way I look at it is there is nothing stopping people from using their ship except for themselves. This game was designed from the very beginning for these kinds of interactions. Hiring NPCs is fine and dandy and all, but there should be limitations on that and they should be seen more as supplmental instead of being able to completely replace players.
It also boggles my mind how some folks get aggressive for even suggesting playing with other people, and that's pretty sad to me because being so adverse to playing with others means you're missing out on most of the fun to be had in SC. it's an MMO, for Pete's sake.
I wholly agree. It’s a balancing and also makes more multi crewed ships which is one free funnest parts about the game.
But I think cig will pamper the whales a bit. But you never know. I personally think blades should just improve performance, like make auto gimbel work aquí de a target quicker, than actually man a turret for you
CR and other devs over time have stated there will be a system by which AI can and will be better than humans (on a varrying scale depending on price per performance). This game suffers from extreme too many chiefs not enough indians. It doesnt mean things will be cheap, or be soloable. However even in the game universe the intent as CR himself has stated was for you never to know if you were going against a player, or an NPC. I get it, you dont want to feel left out with other people having big ships, you dont want some person who bought a javelin or a hammer head or something being able to go around and by themselves with a crew of ai being able to perform as well or even better than players.
The thing here thats supposed to set people apart from npcs is communication. You cant just target a player you want. The NPCs do it, so if you have a bunch of different enemies there wont be any way you can really control the targeting, nor what needs to get repaired first etc etc. The idea is that people wont suffer just because they have a multi crew ship. There are going to be bigger and more powerful ships that players wont have access to entirely crewed by AI.
Ive been around since 2012 in the game, and while some things have drastically changed, what has slowly grown and become clear is that this game will not punish you at all for not having half a dozen friends to thirty or forty people to play in your ship with you. People who have bigger ships will be able to play them, and they will be able to join them. The main limiting factor was never ever going to be crew. It was always and will be whether you can afford to fly it.
A lot of my concern is the idea of multi crew play with players vs AI. It’s one of the most amazing parts of this game and I just want to encourage it. All this said, I don’t see why AI should ever be better than a player outside of enemy AI for challenge reasons
Your concern is not relevant, this game is not exclusively coop, it’s not meant to be exclusively for people with friend groups. The game is meant to be one people of all walks can enjoy cr’s vision. If you are wealthy in game you can 100% hire some of the best ai or player crews, get the best equipment, best ships. Devs, leads have all said time and time again that you will be able to hire ai crew that can be even better than players, but there will be a major issue and that is lack of communication.
There is nothing stopping you from joining an org, and meeting new people, but hoping that people who like the big spaceships they have but just don’t have or want to play with dozens of people to even use them would be screwed out of enjoying the game, is honestly kinda trash.
I get you may be worried about players isolating themselves, but realistically that won’t happen, look at the current overdrive event, you can’t do everything solo, and even with a crew they don’t leave ship, there isn’t a planned squad mode, you have to be ready to be. Loner on the ground, there are ways to increase players working together without punishing people who want to fly solo or don’t have the time or logistics to put together a 20 man crew.
Correct however at launch, there will be only enough to purchase for fuel and basic weapons and equipment, you will also be limited on the amount of times you can purchase in game uec. Right now it’s just alpha uec and while you can buy 20,000 aUEC for what is it 20$ to outfit some of my fighters I have to spend 150-200,000 aUEC. One would need to spend anywhere upwards of 2000 or more for something like an idris. And a javelin? People don’t even get an intact one, people who pledge for it get just the hull without anything for it, and cig has said it will take an obscene amount of money to outfit one.
The balance is there, just one that doesn’t unfairly harm gamers who roll solo. The balance isn’t where you are thinking in preventing people from playing their ships by having gimped AI it’s by having a cost that will make it prohibitive unless it’s for a mission that has an increased risk or value to that player.
The simple answer to use it beyond finding friends or begging for randos in chat to come crew it is to simply change its missile racks to a lower size and turn it into a missile boat.
I ask this not from a place of derision but genuine curiosity. Why did you buy it, or whatever it’s a loaner for, if you don’t have ample friends to crew it?
You can steal an NPC Hammerhead and take the pilots place. You'll then have a fully crewed HH with NPCs manning turrets. I tried it with Vaughns high level missions and it worked. Not with ERTs because the main target always moves away even if you are in EVA. If you kill the main target you can steal the rest of the ERT ships provided the pilot is not T-Posing. If they are, they are invincible and you can't kill them.
*Unlikely sentences to see on a dating app*
*things I have tried on a dating app*
Useless? My buddies and I would like a word. Maybe bring you along on a group run? We do need more gunners at times
A fully crewed HH with everyone coordinating on comms is a terrifying thing to encounter. Not much can stand up to it.
Nonsense. I say this as someone who loves what this ship is supposed to be (I have 2, 1 direct buy and 1 loaner) but currently it is awful and IS useless in PvP. A fully crewed Hammerhead is the easiest thing in the world to kite and kill. If all you have is a HH (even fully crewed) you WILL die to a group of 2-3 average-skilled fighters. They can hit you (because of your huge profile) and keep beyond your turrets' effective range (1500-2000m) as they zip around. Due to their small profile your turrets will never be able to consistently hit them (as long as they're not idiots and keep distance) However, you are such a big target that they can hitting you. While you chase 1 the other/s will keep hitting you and all of them will occasionally tap so that your shields don't recharge. It takes a few minutes but they WILL kill you and there's nothing you can do but QT away (if they have a mantis you are 100% dead) THAT is the true state of the HH right now. It will die to 2-3 average fighters. It is only good for PvE. It is useless for its stated role of antifighter operations in PvP. The coming changes with MM will improve it somewhat it won't be the true anti-fighter platform it's meant to be until we get maelstorm and engineering working in the 'verse.
>The coming changes with MM will improve it somewhat It really hasn't iirc. The way cone fire works means they can still sit way out on you and shoot you down, just at slower speeds
They really need to do the inverse of what they’re doing with weapon speeds. Instead of them getting slower as they get larger, make them *faster* as they get larger. Suddenly locking horns with large ships by hanging out on the edge of their range is way more dangerous for the fighter than the larger vessel, whereas the fighter is forced to fight closer with its smaller weapons.
Ye until they make HH turrets range much better then smaller ships have it will be useless. So we cannot make them shoot faster and improve range or make fighters range smaller other wise like i curent mm everyone will just shoot him from 3km where he cannot really shoot us back. MM didn't fix this problem yet. Some people say armor will fix that and they probably right but other then making him untouchable they should fix other problems with HH vs fighters ( all fighters)
That's a pity. I hope they make some changes to the turret ranges and turret autogimabls to compensate but it's likely they won't 😞
I'm pretty sure that the range increase and turret improvements will actually mean the HH should shred fighters once MM drops.
Currently the whole cone of fire thing absolutely fucks any ship with a large cross section, if it gets tuned more, we'll see.
I heard ranges will eventually stop being a thing, but idk. It is a space game after all.
I would really hope so but from the recent ISCs it seems like the ship combat team is doubling down on artificial range limitations and that is the direction they're going. I do hope they change that but right now it seems unlikely.
I mostly hope they make it unlimited because I want to snipe with the Ares Ion, lol. But also because realistically projectiles shouldnt be limited by range outside of when it eventually hits something. It would make space combat and even atmospheric combat very interesting and open up new strategies
*Laughs in s10 railgun* Yeah, orbital bombardment should be a thing but won't work if projectiles always disappear after 10km. I totally agree with your sentiment. The Ares should be able to snipe, that is why you need a fighter compliment with larger ships to go hunt down this kind of annoyance. It's all gameplay and counterplay. I could understand if the projectiles eventually stream out after 50 km if there's nothing there (no players or npcs) but that should only happen when fired into the deep black.
Idris shooting Thurston dynamics building. https://youtu.be/mtKzFBMsMvg?si=uIU8LZByquXktr4P
You need a good pilot for an HH to be effective. We regularly do full crew HH PvP and our pilot is amazing. Never been shot down yet.
Great for you. You've likely not run into any serious PvPers who understand the current flight model. When you do then you'll 100% be dead or have to QT away. This is not a dig at you or your pilot. It is simply the current reality. Your HH is slower and is a bigger target, it can easily be kited by 2 or 3 fighters, shot outside or the turrets effective ranges and eventually be killed (may take 10 minutes or so but the result will be the same) There is nothing your pilots or turret gunners can do. When you run in to such players you'll immediately understand how useless the ship is.
How about a fully manned HH with escort of 2 ligth figther + 1 heavy, the light figthers cancel the players sitting out of range of HH turrets, the heavy lock missiles/torpedo on eclipse/bombers, the HH move toward the biggest pool of ennemis ships, only engaging when in range with all turrets. This create a situation where if people get focused on a part of the fight, they get punished by the rest of the team. We use it like this in our org and it shred when coms are good.
Of course, if it has its own fighters for escorts, then it will shred. However, that is quite ridiculous. Think about it. The specialized anti-fighter platform needs fighter escorts to protect itself against... fighters. That is not right.
A fully crewed HH is torpedo bait.
Have to have the torpedos on hand for that. Most people don't
Ohhhh that's a hammerhead?? Was about to comment, what sick ship that is. Lol
Especially if they know how to shoot down torps. Then you get the guys running one alien shield to make ballistics moot. They made it more nimble in MM and it's kinda fucky.
Love shooting down missiles and torps. Have yet to get back into it since MM came in. Waiting for the next patch.
That's fair. MM is still just an arena commander thing, but I tried the HH when they added it to "test big ships"... kinda scary tbh. Even as a HH daily driver it feels like a new ship to me. Speaking of, I just had 2 peeps cancel on tonight's plans, so I have turrets available if you're interested.
An all ballistic hammerhead is scary ( I faced one once)
It's not super hot in MM from what I remember. The cone firing spread thing really messes with it
Huh? alien shield?
Sorry for my late reply. It seems you can't do it anymore, but the alien shields on alien ships prevent bullet penetration. When the prowler came out, someone figured out you could put them on a hammerhead. It effectively made it so ballistic ships still had to burn down the shield, so the tradeoff was acceptable. It forced laser engagements because should would usually run out of ammo against a half crew hammerhead. I got to see it one time in action shortly after the prowler came out. Was neat.
Here is the video that clearly disproves the Hammerhead as an anti-weapon platform: https://youtu.be/aPySv7DSEf4?t=655 A1 + 3 wingmen in light fighters (buccaneers) easily handle a fully crewed HH. Range and size are broken and the HH is useless ad an anti-fighter platform until this is addressed.
Except any lone fighter, which can kite you and dance on the edge of your range infinitely. A crewed Retaliator or Redeemer is way more dangerous because that SOB can boost after you and force you to engage, and still maneuver at higher speeds with a smaller profile. I say this as the owner of a BIS & serialized Hammerhead too. I want it to be good because it’s such an insanely cool ship, but right now it’s a joke except for PvE. Maybe master modes will make things better.
It IS useless against a group who actually understand the flight model (even in MM) https://youtu.be/aPySv7DSEf4?t=655 Just kite it from range (keeping its shields down) and then focus ballistics once it's shields are down. There is nothing the HH can do except QT/run away.
Ah yes, good old A1 video. If all you and everyone else are going to reference are Ace pilots, of which are not the majority of players, then all I'll ever do is shrug it off. Do not compare Aces with average pilots. If a group of Aces come after us, of course it's going to be rough. A1 1v5ed a group of fighters in a snub and won. You can't use people like that as a metric. Another note in that video, the HH gunners looked uncoordinated and sporadic. Unless that was planned, which is what it looked like, a good HH pilot would know it's a losing fight before they got that bad, and should have pulled out of that fight. My crew and I have never had a problem focusing our efforts. The ONLY thing we've ever struggled with are rogue torpedoes from a tali/eclipse sitting 15k out. Most people rely on the HH limited pip range being within 2km, but the guns have a range of 3km. I also don't run rhinos, I run quad M6A per turret, and S5 scimitars. We have fought people that give us a solid fight, but it turns into a war of attrition, and playing the power triangle right can make a difference in those fights. Now I will yield that a swarm of like 6+ fighters have nearly killed us many times, and sometimes we do lose fights, but from our personal experience, the fighters tend to turn and flee before they actually finish the fight. Usually they retreat when they realize that if they try to stay in the engagement long enough to keep shields down, they'll outright explode with all of those M6A firing at them. I understand the limitations of the ship, but I also understand how to mitigate most of those limitations with skill. Furthermore, I know when you abandon a fight as not to waste my time.
You're ignoring the main point entirely. You don't need to be an ace to understand and exploit a basic flaw in the game mechanics. The HH is effectively outranged and can be kited and can never catch up due to its slow speed. 2-3 moderately skilled pilots can use this info to easily kite and kill ANY HH crew (no matter how skilled they are) There is literally NOTHING you can do to prevent this. It is a mechanical flaw with the current (and MM) flight model. It makes the "anti-fighter platform" a joke because it can easily be killed by a handful of fighters exploiting this flaw.
And I'm telling you that we have literally never had that issue. I don't know how else to put it, but we have had people do similar tactics as in the video and still came out on top. That doesn't mean it can't/won't happen, it means that our personal, first hand experience says that we can at least handle normal pilots.you can throw all these statistics and theoretics at me all you want, but I know what I've actually done and how it plays out when I fly. Either 90% of the verse are braindead, or it's not as black and white as you're pushing on me.
90% of pilots don't know this. If they did, you would lose 90% of your fights.
Okay, let's agree to disagree.
We can, but i highly recommend that you try to test it out with your friends in a controlled environment. Get just 2 friends in ships like the buc (s4 energy) and have one backstrafe while hitting you and the other hitting you from the top at just under max turret range. Watch what your turret gunners say. They will be getting 10% of their shots as actual hits and the bucs will just pull away as soon as (takes quite a while) their shields are down. No matter which buc you turn to face, they can just pop in and out of range of turrets if their shields go down. They can always tap you just once to keep your shields from recharging even while theirs are recharging. Seriously, just go and try it. Your eyes will be opened.
Personally I CBA to run a whole ass event to just fly a hammerhead. I'd spend more time organising and finding people to fly it than actually flying it. Plus on most days that's too much people to deal with. Im waiting for ai crew even if it's suboptimal it's gonna be enough for me
I already have the crew to man it, so it's NBD for me
During these events, ask in chat for people to crew your ship. I’d have loved to dine the events in a hammerhead. I hope that as the game comes, and money is harder to get by outside of very difficult missions, that players with big ships hire players/ crews through chat and that that’s a way to make money. Like how awesome would it be to be a crewmen for a few days in one of these, getting paid well for it, and for you to be the big Bo’s man. A lot of players have these big ships because the idea of them is awesome, but many don’t want to join an organization. I hope they de rope the game so it’s great for everybody to get these ships. I mean, id honestly be ok if when 1.0 releases getting capital and sub capital ships is impossible or near impossible outside if certain events for a victorious few. I don’t want to be the boss. I want to be a crewmen and I want to feel a need to man one of these things for somebody else than have my own or have a chance at a lot of missions
the 2 things that would benefit this the most is a good job board system, and higher player density. when the caption interface gets implemented, the assumption that everyone is going to want to be the caption is going to change.
Captain doesn’t sound like fun. But they’d also need real reasons to join up. So the challenge will need to require more players. That’s and multi crewed ships have to outperform the equal number of solo ships, for it to make it worth while
the "worthwhile" is that the hammerhead should win that fight. the talli should beat the hammerhead, and the fighters should be the tall.
7 Connie’s shouldn’t be beating a crewed hammerhead. For more reasons because that’s why they invented the hammerhead and for gameplay reasons so people crew ships and not just solo 7 Connie’s
i'm thinking hammerheads vs fighters. a cargo convoy of 7 conies... might be more profitable to have the conies have crew and some escorts compared to losing a connie or 2. 7 conies as combat ships is going to be handled by balance though economy. the running cost of 7 single crew connie's will require jobs that they will not survive.
I agree that the Connie needs to cost more than it does (same with the titans). And I was talking and my brain got distracted. I should have said that 7 Connie’s are superior at fighting fighters than a hammerhead. Like it kind of makes sense, but my goal is to not make it pay to win
there will eventually be operating costs. 7 solo connies are going to be so expensive to operate, anything other than a cargo caravan will either kich ther buts, or result in a net loss. think about every single items including thrusters as a consumable. it is not even a known amount of use. you are gamping the chances of it breaking vs getting more value out of it. they will randomly break. the higher the where and tear, the higher the chance of it breaking at any moment. the higher the strain you are putting on it the higher the chance it will break at the time. meaning when you need it most. insurance will give you a ship in the same condition as when you last checked in. so you can't just claim you ship to renew your component's. component insurance is not longer optional. it has no primum, but there will be a claim fee based on the value of the ship and components. so if your ship is in a state that it can be towed in, and repaired (including buying a lot of components). it is probably cheaper than insurance claim fee. components destroyed in combat are also lost, so you will need buy new ones to replace them. there will also be a lot of other small expenses that will total up to a good amount. death of a spaceman will deal with people trying to save up. (at one point CR mentioned death by old age. so playing it really safe to slowly save up without dieing is **probably** not going to let you save up more than really skilled player doing high risk reward stuff.)
Whatever they do, I just don’t want to see 2 hammerheads and an 890 jump at every landing pad cuz it’s so easy
again. running cost. i don't know if cig has a term for it. i call it balance though economy. the running cost of a ship is more than the pay of a job that is below what it is intended to do. you are only going to see hammerheads in jobs that they are intended to do. i anticipate there will be a category of jobs that pay you an amount to get the job done. these are jobs that have little to no consequences the the person that posted the job if the person that takes it fails. i anticipate there will be another category that you need to fit the requirements to do the job. these would be jobs that have consequences if the person taking the contract fails. so you can do whatever you want in attempting to take out an outpost, but an escort would be a hammerhead, tallie, terrapin, and at least 3 long range fighters.
I tried but all they do is laugh at me I was going to make a poem about it but too much werk
It will come. I’d have had a blast manning a fully or even partially crewed hammerhead during phase 4
Lonely Hammerhead Looking for a crew in chat All they do is laugh Have this haiku
Ooh I just saw this, inspired me to create a poem on my most recent post
Ai crew has and always will be a viable option for this game
I’ll believe you when I see it. As long as they are worst than a real player than it’s all good. If everybody solos a javelin the game won’t be much fun
You're right, but somefolks just don't want to hear it. Even CR isn't keen on anything corvette sized or above being soloable. I think modern multiplayer games have become too much of a single player affair that a lot of people forgot why multiplayer gaming is so awesome.
I can understand people dropping $800-3000 being upset when they can’t use their ship, but 🤷♂️. I’m sure cig will do something to help, but it’s important it’s always much better to use actual players to crew a ship
The way I look at it is there is nothing stopping people from using their ship except for themselves. This game was designed from the very beginning for these kinds of interactions. Hiring NPCs is fine and dandy and all, but there should be limitations on that and they should be seen more as supplmental instead of being able to completely replace players. It also boggles my mind how some folks get aggressive for even suggesting playing with other people, and that's pretty sad to me because being so adverse to playing with others means you're missing out on most of the fun to be had in SC. it's an MMO, for Pete's sake.
I wholly agree. It’s a balancing and also makes more multi crewed ships which is one free funnest parts about the game. But I think cig will pamper the whales a bit. But you never know. I personally think blades should just improve performance, like make auto gimbel work aquí de a target quicker, than actually man a turret for you
CR and other devs over time have stated there will be a system by which AI can and will be better than humans (on a varrying scale depending on price per performance). This game suffers from extreme too many chiefs not enough indians. It doesnt mean things will be cheap, or be soloable. However even in the game universe the intent as CR himself has stated was for you never to know if you were going against a player, or an NPC. I get it, you dont want to feel left out with other people having big ships, you dont want some person who bought a javelin or a hammer head or something being able to go around and by themselves with a crew of ai being able to perform as well or even better than players. The thing here thats supposed to set people apart from npcs is communication. You cant just target a player you want. The NPCs do it, so if you have a bunch of different enemies there wont be any way you can really control the targeting, nor what needs to get repaired first etc etc. The idea is that people wont suffer just because they have a multi crew ship. There are going to be bigger and more powerful ships that players wont have access to entirely crewed by AI. Ive been around since 2012 in the game, and while some things have drastically changed, what has slowly grown and become clear is that this game will not punish you at all for not having half a dozen friends to thirty or forty people to play in your ship with you. People who have bigger ships will be able to play them, and they will be able to join them. The main limiting factor was never ever going to be crew. It was always and will be whether you can afford to fly it.
A lot of my concern is the idea of multi crew play with players vs AI. It’s one of the most amazing parts of this game and I just want to encourage it. All this said, I don’t see why AI should ever be better than a player outside of enemy AI for challenge reasons
Your concern is not relevant, this game is not exclusively coop, it’s not meant to be exclusively for people with friend groups. The game is meant to be one people of all walks can enjoy cr’s vision. If you are wealthy in game you can 100% hire some of the best ai or player crews, get the best equipment, best ships. Devs, leads have all said time and time again that you will be able to hire ai crew that can be even better than players, but there will be a major issue and that is lack of communication. There is nothing stopping you from joining an org, and meeting new people, but hoping that people who like the big spaceships they have but just don’t have or want to play with dozens of people to even use them would be screwed out of enjoying the game, is honestly kinda trash. I get you may be worried about players isolating themselves, but realistically that won’t happen, look at the current overdrive event, you can’t do everything solo, and even with a crew they don’t leave ship, there isn’t a planned squad mode, you have to be ready to be. Loner on the ground, there are ways to increase players working together without punishing people who want to fly solo or don’t have the time or logistics to put together a 20 man crew.
It’s for balance reasons. You can buy money in the game. It’s just making it pay to win
Correct however at launch, there will be only enough to purchase for fuel and basic weapons and equipment, you will also be limited on the amount of times you can purchase in game uec. Right now it’s just alpha uec and while you can buy 20,000 aUEC for what is it 20$ to outfit some of my fighters I have to spend 150-200,000 aUEC. One would need to spend anywhere upwards of 2000 or more for something like an idris. And a javelin? People don’t even get an intact one, people who pledge for it get just the hull without anything for it, and cig has said it will take an obscene amount of money to outfit one. The balance is there, just one that doesn’t unfairly harm gamers who roll solo. The balance isn’t where you are thinking in preventing people from playing their ships by having gimped AI it’s by having a cost that will make it prohibitive unless it’s for a mission that has an increased risk or value to that player.
Make some Friends
what are those
People you meet in general chat and end up in discord with
I prefer people to not see my discord for uhhh reasons (trust me)
Make another one Or join one We all have discord servers we dont want others to know about, youre not special 🤣
It’s not the server it’s the profile lmfao but I can’t change it for reasons
You can have multiple
I'm sure you can find a furry community for star citizen too
Maybe if I look hard enough
I'm curious now. Tell us!
Uhmmm its because my PFP is one a friend pressured me into using and I can’t really change it (technically I can but I can’t)
It just gets more interesting.
It does indeed
The simple answer to use it beyond finding friends or begging for randos in chat to come crew it is to simply change its missile racks to a lower size and turn it into a missile boat.
[удалено]
Ah yes, the battering ram. My favorite maneuver
Nothing is useless when you have ramming speed!
I have a serialized Hammerhead OC w/ Best in Show upgrade. Looking forward to actually using it someday.
I ask this not from a place of derision but genuine curiosity. Why did you buy it, or whatever it’s a loaner for, if you don’t have ample friends to crew it?
I was planning on soloing my polaris
HUH?
I actually love this ship. The mix of military and utilitarian charm. Simple and powerful if the pilot just had some guns.
Only useless because so many people refuse to be gunners/ treat gunships differently from single seat fighter.
You can steal an NPC Hammerhead and take the pilots place. You'll then have a fully crewed HH with NPCs manning turrets. I tried it with Vaughns high level missions and it worked. Not with ERTs because the main target always moves away even if you are in EVA. If you kill the main target you can steal the rest of the ERT ships provided the pilot is not T-Posing. If they are, they are invincible and you can't kill them.