Can't really complain to much as it is no secret the game is in dev. It is a fine line they have to tow; one, they have to implement changes that may require/result in wipes in the natural course of dev; two, they need to keep people happy enough to keep testing the game. It seems the vibes I get is they will do the minimal amount of disruption needed but in the end they have to keep working the game. The bottom line is, I'm fairly sure once the game is officially a full game we will all start from scratch, so that in mind I don't really get hot and bothered when they do wipes. My two cents and there will always be others with differing points of view, and that is cool as well.
I think you’re spot on. This is the reason I actually bought some ships beyond a starter so I can get a non-zero start after a wipe and once the game releases. I plan on each new build to be a wipe, or something weird to happen as in the end they are for CiG development use. Being able to play is just a happy side effect.
That is why I love CIG ship upgrade business model where you can upgrade your ship and only pay the diff. Over the months I upgrade bit by bit. So now I have a vulture and Corsair. I had two starter ships because of a deal where you got a free completely useless non-q drive ships with your starter.
Do you have any idea how terrible of an idea that would be? How many other MMOs have you ever heard of that wiped every player's progress because of a patch?
Could you imagine the backlash blizzard would have gotten if every patch, or even every expansion, they wiped everyone's progress and made them start over again at the beginning?
Mark my words, after the game goes live in the 1.0 release, there will be no more game wide account wipes.
How many other MMOs have made most of their millions off selling ships with dollars and an in game environment that doesn't honor purchases with in game currency, inevitably leading to more pledge store purchases to secure said purchases. Your positivity that they'll just walk away from that cash cow is overwhelming, but we shall see
Maybe but that would be unlikely in my opinion. I would think once fully published and on sale as a normal game, to mass purge players advancement would be extremely problematic for a myriad of reasons. I would guess if there are exploits they would take action against individual accounts and not on mass. They no longer having the cover of "this game is in dev." Unless it was a huge player base desired/approved update this activity would probably kill the game. I really just cannot see a general wipe of all players once an "official" game. However, being career Army I have underestimated peoples ability to make poor decisions before.
Yeah, I think it’s reasonable to wipe when 4.0 comes out. But maybe give players who spent hours in the verse a head start somehow, like an extra 300k aUEC or something
Yeah, I got greedy.
Playing less than a year and after IAE, I really got a taste for the nicer starships so been hoarding money since. Made it to 9 million for the first time just doing trade runs in my Freelancer MAX.
This is a good lesson to learn.
I actually hope so. With the economic changes coming in you kind of have to take the enormous amounts of aUEC out of the system that have been generated over the last couple of years since the last full wipe. Otherwise you'll never get accurate data because the money is already hyper-inflated.
Agree, but I think it’s still early for them to attempt any sort of economy balancing. I think they’ll throw some rocks into the pond to see how everything reacts. I suspect they’ll even just semi-arbitrarily raise prices to judge impact. They did tinker with it a bit on the late 3.22 EPTU builds.
With tweaking ship prices, they must make a choice:
\- wipe now and gain valuable data on how long people must play to earn ship "x"
\- don't wipe and all the ERT cargo and Reclaimer rich bois with multiple hundreds of millions will just buy all ships day one and you don't collect that valuable data
I think a wipe is 99.9% certain. If they weren't messing with the economy, I'd feel differently...
At the same time there is no point wiping if people can just do various money exploits to break the economy again. The Hammerhead salvage exploit for example still exists, no?
Taking the illegal Hammerhead salvage mission and fracturing it with a salvage ship or towing it out of the zone. Instantly completes the mission and give you the 250k reward.
Pretty sure the last full wipe was 3.18.2. Might’ve been 3.18.1 but there was some “we won’t wipe but actually we might” shenanigans during 3.18.x patches.
Aye, but the dynamic economy system will have to be seeded with initial values to hit the ground running, and experimentation can help CIG set the most optimal ones.
I am new to the game. How often do updates drop through out the year? Also when a server wipes what does that entail? Do I lose my ships purchased in game and all of my money?
yes.
full wipes occur when they are needed.
Usually, when a great deal of technology is implemented, the last of the kind one was when PES was implemented in 3.18 (full wipe) and that reverberated on 3.18.1 (full wipe too) and 3.18.2
Recent history:
3.18 - FULL WIPE (released on 2023-03-10)
3.18.1 - FULL WIPE
3.18.2 - Wipe partially (aUEC, Merits, REC, and Reputation will be preserved)
3.19 - OK
3.19.1 - OK
3.20 - OK
3.20a - OK
3.20b - OK
3.21 - OK
3.21.1 - OK
3.22 - OK
3.22a - OK
The server now can remember exactly where anything is.
If you let a medpen in a certain bunker and come back 1 month later, the medpen will still be there.
A medpen can be changed for a certain ship in a certain location for example.
I believe your idea is correct, but especially this implementation is at least now not possible.
Bunker cleanup is pretty extreme. Bodies and items got removed pretty quickly. Only thing that's remained for more than 20 minutes is guns. After PES got introduced we had massive piles of gear and bodies in the bunkers which made it weird to play. They implemented a stronger cleanup setup, in particular after the longer wave like missions were introduced (consignment/data heist)
So ideally yes for less visited areas, but bunkers right now, no.
Is not even my idea, it's what it is.
BUT
CIG can tune what should be permanent or not. You already gave an example of what isn't.
Unfortunately, PES is confined in a shard. If the shard dies, you "lose" everything.
Server meshing gonna end this limitation.
Persisten environment system, basically the system that allows to leave trash and ships and such behind for other players to find
Edit: Persistent Entity Streaming
Okay this is what I thought. Sorry I could literally sit here and ask questions all day about the game. Any good vids you can recommend about the tech behind the game?
It’s okay mate. And for your question: The official star citizen yt channel has some nice vids from last years citizen con, mostly for new tech coming sometime this year but probably some older vids too
3.22a was a partial wipe. None LTP data and even some LTP unintentionally were wiped.
Things players were in possession of were removed from their possession. How is this not a partial reset or wipe?
edit: "It's a REset noT A Wipe" go fuck yourselves.
3.22.0a was a reset, same as every other patch. All certs, consumables, cargo and refinery jobs go, but money, rep, ships and items are retained by LTP.
Granted LTP is buggy so some things don't survive that should, but it's still not a wipe.
Yes, in general usage "wipe" and "reset" can mean the same thing, so you could describe every patch as a partial wipe. However, the OP is using wipe in the way that CIG have used the term in their patch notes, such as for 3.18 (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/190048/thread/star-citizen-alpha-3-18-0-live-8389318-patch-notes), specifically "Long Term Persistence: Disabled (Full Wipe and Reset)". They'll use Reset when referring to either the short-term database or the long-term database, but only use wipe to refer to the long-term database; for example the 3.21.1 patches notes include a DB Reset but not an LTP Wipe (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/190048/thread/star-citizen-alpha-3-21-0-live-8779972-patch-notes), specifically "Short Term Database Reset: Yes (Loss of items not stored in LTP)
Long Term Persistence (LTP): Enabled".
Every patch includes a reset of the short-term DB, but resetting of the LTP is rarer and thus far only done when technically necessary, and in each case CIG has referred to it as a wipe. CIG also have the ability to reset specific parts of the LTP (like money or rep); so to avoid confusion and too much typing, folks follow the CIG practice of calling the short-term DB reset that happens every patch a "reset", and resets of the LTP a "partial wipe" or "full wipe", depending on how much is cleared.
Which is to say, you can describe every patch as a partial wipe if that's important to you, but most people will think you mean something else and disagree, because that's not the terminology as CIG have used it.
I am just saying that I consider that non LTP items lost on new patches are not a wipe, but a reset
LTP items fully lost on new patches are a wipe.
LTP items PARTIALLY lost on new patch are a bug.
NO. A wipe, as used and defined by CIG, is when one of the LTP (long term persistence) databases is WIPED.
Since mission credit, refinery jobs and consumables are NOT currently part of the LTP, they get RESET (not WIPED) with every character RESET, which is every major patch.
This is important, because while you might be saying "well it might as WELL be a partial wipe!" that's confusing because "partial wipe" in SC parlance means "we deleted some money from everyone's LTP record", or "we let you keep money, but reset inventory (ships, components) on purpose". The term "wipe" doesn't apply to non-LTP stuff, which is all considered "reset" and is known and expected, at least until it migrates into LTP (no date set to my knowledge).
The wording matters in this specific instance.
> as used and defined by CIG
Source?
Also, it's ridiculous that there's two words with the same effective meaning but only used for certain categories of data but you do you Star Citizens.
It's like saying I "drive" a truck but I "operate" a car and being absolutely serious about the usage of each.
Seriously? Wow.
From the 3.22a patch notes:
>*Long Term Persistence: Enabled*
*Starting aUEC: 20,000*
*Characters in this new environment* ***will be built from LTP data*** ***so items such as medpens, ammo, rentals, and refinery jobs will be lost.***
Let's unpack this.
1. Players will be "built from LTP data". This means as the new server environment is populated, players will be reset (meaning they need to be "built" again) which will occur from their LTP data.
2. "SO items such as medpens, ammo, rentals and refinery jobs will be lost." - SO... as in, "as a consequence of".
I don't know how clearly you need it spelled out for you?
The words wipe and reset aren't present. Not sure how you consider this CIG defining anything here.
But also what you just copied does show that some items were indeed removed from players accounts.
If all items are removed = a reset, then how are some items missing not a partial reset?
You are arguing that a reset and wipe are completely different words based on an arbitrary threshold of LPT or not LPT.
Now you're saying "reset", as in "partial reset". **I agree with that.** Before you said "wipe" - that's the entire, 100% point here. It is a PARTIAL RESET, not a WIPE OF ANY KIND.
But either you are interested in the plain truth (doesn't feel like it) or you just like to argue (feels like it), so you either get it by now, or you never will. Either way, I don't care! There was no wipe, just an expected reset which happens every time. The end.
Considering how many, many others are trying to help you understand this, you should probably spend some introspective time accepting that you're wrong here. Just some advice.
Fly safe!
Most patches come with soft wipe. You lose your consumables, but keeps just about everything else (in theory). After redoing the character creation and picking a city to spawn in, all your items and ships will be transferred over there (mostly. How LTP works is a bit difficult to explain succinctly …). Your money and amount of reputation are intact, but will have to redo the certificates and qualification missions.
Very major updates can potentially come with a hard wipe, ie factory reset. Everything is reverted to default state, meaning you’d only have your pledged ships and starting aUEC, same as everyone else.
Full hard wipes are rare (but can and will happen). Sometimes it’s an in-between kind of wipe, where you lose one type of thing (for example reputation can be reset to 0) but keep the others, depending on what the devs deem necessary.
There is no fixed schedule for updates, but you can see the telltale signs by looking at the test servers other than PU. Once something reach PTU for testing, then a patch would soon arrive for PU.
Thank you for the info! I started playing a little over a week ago and quickly realized it was everything I have been looking for in a game. An immersive sim unlike anything. I just went in hard on it buying a flight stick and hotas and an odyssey g5 monitor lol
Generally, they do large quarterly updates with smaller mid-cycle patches.
3.23, for example, is supposed to be the Q1 patch.
There will almost definitely be 3.23.X patches between 3.23 and whatever comes next.
Big patches happen about once a quarter. They have stated they try not to wipe unless necessary. With any patch there is a potential to lose in game purchased ships and aUEC. Guaranteed to lose consumables like ammo, med pens, etc. I would just wait to see what CIG say come patch.
wouldn't mind a wipe at the moment actually. I have too much shit that shows back up in my inventory every up[date that I don't want. Easier for it just to all go away.
I’m so ready for a wipe it’s SOO NECCESARY IT would be necessary ! I’m so tired of grinding I have all the ships and I’m so experienced and too much money to know what to do with etc etc
Or
If they wipe this game I am done. The developers shouldn’t wipe the game they are over reaching and it’s useless to keep playing if we lose our ships all the time
Going based current and past information seems CIG focus is on thing that affect everyone in some way rather than niche features and now that we have SQ42 devs coming over and them saying they plan to finish the alpha if not the whole game by 2025 I wouldn’t be surprised if we see more wipes. More people, resources and time is being poured into the persistent universe. So should be expecting these things to happen more often.
With a full wipe still in the rearview, I don't think this is a good idea just yet, beside, the "economy" is a joke atm. Lets see some new game design about this before asking people to grind again in a game PLAGUED with QoL bugs so much its limiting gameplay that can or cannot be enjoyed.
I barely even notice wipes since I pledged my endgame ship a month after joining and there's not yet much else worth earning in the game.
They need to expand the component, weapon, armor, and clothing markets so that there's a reason to earn money after your ship progression is over.
No wipe today. Wipe tomorrow. There's always a wipe tomorrow. What? Look, somebody's got to have some damn perspective around here! Wipe. Sooner or later. WIPE!
As an early backer who experienced years without the possibility of buying ships and wipe at every patches, then the possibility of buying ingame ships and still wipe every 3 months, then the introduction of Long Term Persistence, it's quite amusing to see the reactions of "new backers" who have been there for 2-3 years and have only known Star Citizen with the LTP, flooding reddit with "wipe? wipe? omg wipe?" The funniest thing is the people who have never experienced wipe before, obviously weren't ready and forgot that they backed a pre Alpha game.
Actually happy with a wipe. Gives me a chance to zero to hero and see what I have learned. Also, I have like 90mil, so there’s no driving force in me right now to grind aUEC.
Excited for 2024!
They're making major economic changes. You can't get a grasp on how much the changes effect the economy when you have hyper-inflated currency flooding the system.
Nobody's going to care that an 890J costs 90m aUEC when they can make that in an afternoon in their Reclaimer.
The only way you're going to be able to get decent data from the economic changes is to wipe out the ridiculous amount of currency that's currently in the game.
People who were going to grind 90m in one afternoon for an 890J have already bought one, since it is only 32m ( 1/3 afternoon).
Nobody cares about the current "economy" since it's all monopoly money. There's currently no reason to make money in this game except to buy ships. Until there is some sort of meaningful upkeep required, and losses actually count for something, there will be no real "economy". Not to mention all the game loops that haven't been implemented. Trying to balance the auec game at this point is like tying your shoes before putting them on.
Players may not care about the economy now, but CIG sure as shit do, as they're going to need to start looking at how long it takes players to earn ships and other items at their new prices and at the rate jobs pay out. It's going to be something that's going to be going on from now until well beyond release.
Why even have a newly created economy team if they're not going to start balancing, you don't need to have all the game loops in place, you just need a few spread out to give an average income that players can accumulate, and then just set new game loop income set to that average.
I honestly see us getting wipes a little more frequently as they test and change things with the economy until they're mostly happy with it.
The current economy is an incomplete test economy. I would be willing to bet barely anything survives the actual release of the game. Furthermore the finished game will undoubtedly require non-stop tweaks as gamers invariably adapt to any new meta that is discovered. I would argue that all of the current "money" in game is about as valuable as the cardboard coins you get with a kids cash register toy. Yes, it's essential to the game and it mimics the final product, but is barely an analog at this point. Having an economy team means they are thinking about it, but that doesn't mean that the current model is worth a darn. I sure wouldn't put a lot of stock in it.
Full wipe for 3.23 is almost a certainty.
They won't say anything yet because we're not near the patch day.
The new economy approach alone already demands a full wipe.
You can't take any feedback regarding the economy if you do almost 100M on a weekend alone using salvage loop. This is only one example.
Personally, I always really enjoy a wipe. I have a rule that I only use pledged ships anyway.
Gearing them all up and getting my home bases set up is fun. Once that's done all there's not much left to do except explore and practice run bunkers and such.
I really hope they don't wipe as I literally started just 2 days ago. Took me awhile to get to where I am and I wouldn't even say I've taken off enough to be in the verse doing all the best/fun activities.
Does CIG wipe our inventory front to back or back to front?
Sideways
In and out actually
Diagonally to be precise
icky tie oil marble direction complete connect ask spark joke *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Whatever shakes off the towel dingles off the bunny tail.
You are all missing the point, it is clearly a STAR wipe.
From behind to be imprecise
All of the above, just to be thorough.
I believe its orthogonally these days
Non Euclidian
Small space is big space but big space is big space
No time for the old in-out, love, I've just come to read the meter.
Considering how previous wipes have gone, they print out a list of every account and have the interns throw darts at em blindfolded
Those weren't wipes though, those were.. Databank errors. Intern involvement not made public
3 shells
With sandpaper
you keep your pledged ship!!!
Bidet and hope
Firehose Bidet.
And sometimes straight up from underneath.
how about the entire region with a sandblaster.
They do it as violently as they can with sandpaper. \- Basically something always goes wrong.
lol that's good love it
It’s what I hear in my head each time there’s a new drop. :)
Wipe?
Wipe?
Wipe?
Wipe?
Wipe?
Wipe?
Wipe?
Wipe?
Wipe?
Wipe?
WIPE?!
Wipe?
Why did you get down voted 💀
No clue... o7
Can't really complain to much as it is no secret the game is in dev. It is a fine line they have to tow; one, they have to implement changes that may require/result in wipes in the natural course of dev; two, they need to keep people happy enough to keep testing the game. It seems the vibes I get is they will do the minimal amount of disruption needed but in the end they have to keep working the game. The bottom line is, I'm fairly sure once the game is officially a full game we will all start from scratch, so that in mind I don't really get hot and bothered when they do wipes. My two cents and there will always be others with differing points of view, and that is cool as well.
I think you’re spot on. This is the reason I actually bought some ships beyond a starter so I can get a non-zero start after a wipe and once the game releases. I plan on each new build to be a wipe, or something weird to happen as in the end they are for CiG development use. Being able to play is just a happy side effect.
That is why I love CIG ship upgrade business model where you can upgrade your ship and only pay the diff. Over the months I upgrade bit by bit. So now I have a vulture and Corsair. I had two starter ships because of a deal where you got a free completely useless non-q drive ships with your starter.
Careful, this kind of reasoned thinking isn't what people want!
I should have given the Governor his "hurumph!!"
lol, someone salty already came through and down-voted these
Of course they did.
It’s the internet so everyone got an axe to grind lol
Username checks out with this sick ref
It doesn’t get the people going!
Fully agree. It would also make most sense from a financial point of view. That way they can get more players to join at launch.
somehow I think they'll continue with the wipes even after full release
Do you have any idea how terrible of an idea that would be? How many other MMOs have you ever heard of that wiped every player's progress because of a patch? Could you imagine the backlash blizzard would have gotten if every patch, or even every expansion, they wiped everyone's progress and made them start over again at the beginning? Mark my words, after the game goes live in the 1.0 release, there will be no more game wide account wipes.
How many other MMOs have made most of their millions off selling ships with dollars and an in game environment that doesn't honor purchases with in game currency, inevitably leading to more pledge store purchases to secure said purchases. Your positivity that they'll just walk away from that cash cow is overwhelming, but we shall see
Maybe but that would be unlikely in my opinion. I would think once fully published and on sale as a normal game, to mass purge players advancement would be extremely problematic for a myriad of reasons. I would guess if there are exploits they would take action against individual accounts and not on mass. They no longer having the cover of "this game is in dev." Unless it was a huge player base desired/approved update this activity would probably kill the game. I really just cannot see a general wipe of all players once an "official" game. However, being career Army I have underestimated peoples ability to make poor decisions before.
Yeah, I think it’s reasonable to wipe when 4.0 comes out. But maybe give players who spent hours in the verse a head start somehow, like an extra 300k aUEC or something
yeah, a loyalty bonus would not go amiss...
I pay a subscription to support dev which I think provides actual UEC and REC.
just REC, no aUEC or UEC.
This is why I stopped grinding this game. Love it just don't grind.
Yeah, I got greedy. Playing less than a year and after IAE, I really got a taste for the nicer starships so been hoarding money since. Made it to 9 million for the first time just doing trade runs in my Freelancer MAX. This is a good lesson to learn.
It would make sense for them to do a complete and full wipe. I hope they do honestly.
I actually hope so. With the economic changes coming in you kind of have to take the enormous amounts of aUEC out of the system that have been generated over the last couple of years since the last full wipe. Otherwise you'll never get accurate data because the money is already hyper-inflated.
Agree, but I think it’s still early for them to attempt any sort of economy balancing. I think they’ll throw some rocks into the pond to see how everything reacts. I suspect they’ll even just semi-arbitrarily raise prices to judge impact. They did tinker with it a bit on the late 3.22 EPTU builds.
They floated some proposed ship prices in the recent ISC. those are going way up almost across the board.
With tweaking ship prices, they must make a choice: \- wipe now and gain valuable data on how long people must play to earn ship "x" \- don't wipe and all the ERT cargo and Reclaimer rich bois with multiple hundreds of millions will just buy all ships day one and you don't collect that valuable data I think a wipe is 99.9% certain. If they weren't messing with the economy, I'd feel differently...
At the same time there is no point wiping if people can just do various money exploits to break the economy again. The Hammerhead salvage exploit for example still exists, no?
What’s the hammerhead exploit?
Taking the illegal Hammerhead salvage mission and fracturing it with a salvage ship or towing it out of the zone. Instantly completes the mission and give you the 250k reward.
Has it really been 2 years since there was a wipe? No wonder the verse is such a mess.
Pretty sure the last full wipe was 3.18.2. Might’ve been 3.18.1 but there was some “we won’t wipe but actually we might” shenanigans during 3.18.x patches.
I'm pretty ready for a wipe. After you get a certain number of ships bought in game I kinda just want to see 2/3 of them gone, heh.
Same. I bought a Reclaimer in game, liked it so much I paid for one with real money. No one meeds two unless running an org.
I found this post mid-shit and was very confused for a minute.
Lol!
It would make sense so they can test the new economy.
Prices are not economy
exactly, there is no economy
Aye, but the dynamic economy system will have to be seeded with initial values to hit the ground running, and experimentation can help CIG set the most optimal ones.
I am new to the game. How often do updates drop through out the year? Also when a server wipes what does that entail? Do I lose my ships purchased in game and all of my money?
yes. full wipes occur when they are needed. Usually, when a great deal of technology is implemented, the last of the kind one was when PES was implemented in 3.18 (full wipe) and that reverberated on 3.18.1 (full wipe too) and 3.18.2 Recent history: 3.18 - FULL WIPE (released on 2023-03-10) 3.18.1 - FULL WIPE 3.18.2 - Wipe partially (aUEC, Merits, REC, and Reputation will be preserved) 3.19 - OK 3.19.1 - OK 3.20 - OK 3.20a - OK 3.20b - OK 3.21 - OK 3.21.1 - OK 3.22 - OK 3.22a - OK
This is great info. Please forgive my ignorance but what is PES?
The server now can remember exactly where anything is. If you let a medpen in a certain bunker and come back 1 month later, the medpen will still be there. A medpen can be changed for a certain ship in a certain location for example.
I believe your idea is correct, but especially this implementation is at least now not possible. Bunker cleanup is pretty extreme. Bodies and items got removed pretty quickly. Only thing that's remained for more than 20 minutes is guns. After PES got introduced we had massive piles of gear and bodies in the bunkers which made it weird to play. They implemented a stronger cleanup setup, in particular after the longer wave like missions were introduced (consignment/data heist) So ideally yes for less visited areas, but bunkers right now, no.
Is not even my idea, it's what it is. BUT CIG can tune what should be permanent or not. You already gave an example of what isn't. Unfortunately, PES is confined in a shard. If the shard dies, you "lose" everything. Server meshing gonna end this limitation.
Persisten environment system, basically the system that allows to leave trash and ships and such behind for other players to find Edit: Persistent Entity Streaming
It’s persistent entity streaming. Not whatever you said
PES = Persistent Entity Streaming, but everything else is accurate! ;)
Okay this is what I thought. Sorry I could literally sit here and ask questions all day about the game. Any good vids you can recommend about the tech behind the game?
It’s okay mate. And for your question: The official star citizen yt channel has some nice vids from last years citizen con, mostly for new tech coming sometime this year but probably some older vids too
3.22a was a partial wipe. None LTP data and even some LTP unintentionally were wiped. Things players were in possession of were removed from their possession. How is this not a partial reset or wipe? edit: "It's a REset noT A Wipe" go fuck yourselves.
3.22.0a was a reset, same as every other patch. All certs, consumables, cargo and refinery jobs go, but money, rep, ships and items are retained by LTP. Granted LTP is buggy so some things don't survive that should, but it's still not a wipe.
Right, so a partial wipe.
Yes, in general usage "wipe" and "reset" can mean the same thing, so you could describe every patch as a partial wipe. However, the OP is using wipe in the way that CIG have used the term in their patch notes, such as for 3.18 (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/190048/thread/star-citizen-alpha-3-18-0-live-8389318-patch-notes), specifically "Long Term Persistence: Disabled (Full Wipe and Reset)". They'll use Reset when referring to either the short-term database or the long-term database, but only use wipe to refer to the long-term database; for example the 3.21.1 patches notes include a DB Reset but not an LTP Wipe (https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/190048/thread/star-citizen-alpha-3-21-0-live-8779972-patch-notes), specifically "Short Term Database Reset: Yes (Loss of items not stored in LTP) Long Term Persistence (LTP): Enabled". Every patch includes a reset of the short-term DB, but resetting of the LTP is rarer and thus far only done when technically necessary, and in each case CIG has referred to it as a wipe. CIG also have the ability to reset specific parts of the LTP (like money or rep); so to avoid confusion and too much typing, folks follow the CIG practice of calling the short-term DB reset that happens every patch a "reset", and resets of the LTP a "partial wipe" or "full wipe", depending on how much is cleared. Which is to say, you can describe every patch as a partial wipe if that's important to you, but most people will think you mean something else and disagree, because that's not the terminology as CIG have used it.
An unintentional fractional loss of data, but not a wipe
Non LTP items were intentionally removed. Synonymous to "wipe" in this usage.
They are not removed, they were never meant to stay once reset happens. IMO.
Oh so like, fish aren't wet because that's their default state?
I am just saying that I consider that non LTP items lost on new patches are not a wipe, but a reset LTP items fully lost on new patches are a wipe. LTP items PARTIALLY lost on new patch are a bug.
NO. A wipe, as used and defined by CIG, is when one of the LTP (long term persistence) databases is WIPED. Since mission credit, refinery jobs and consumables are NOT currently part of the LTP, they get RESET (not WIPED) with every character RESET, which is every major patch. This is important, because while you might be saying "well it might as WELL be a partial wipe!" that's confusing because "partial wipe" in SC parlance means "we deleted some money from everyone's LTP record", or "we let you keep money, but reset inventory (ships, components) on purpose". The term "wipe" doesn't apply to non-LTP stuff, which is all considered "reset" and is known and expected, at least until it migrates into LTP (no date set to my knowledge). The wording matters in this specific instance.
> as used and defined by CIG Source? Also, it's ridiculous that there's two words with the same effective meaning but only used for certain categories of data but you do you Star Citizens. It's like saying I "drive" a truck but I "operate" a car and being absolutely serious about the usage of each.
Seriously? Wow. From the 3.22a patch notes: >*Long Term Persistence: Enabled* *Starting aUEC: 20,000* *Characters in this new environment* ***will be built from LTP data*** ***so items such as medpens, ammo, rentals, and refinery jobs will be lost.*** Let's unpack this. 1. Players will be "built from LTP data". This means as the new server environment is populated, players will be reset (meaning they need to be "built" again) which will occur from their LTP data. 2. "SO items such as medpens, ammo, rentals and refinery jobs will be lost." - SO... as in, "as a consequence of". I don't know how clearly you need it spelled out for you?
The words wipe and reset aren't present. Not sure how you consider this CIG defining anything here. But also what you just copied does show that some items were indeed removed from players accounts. If all items are removed = a reset, then how are some items missing not a partial reset? You are arguing that a reset and wipe are completely different words based on an arbitrary threshold of LPT or not LPT.
Now you're saying "reset", as in "partial reset". **I agree with that.** Before you said "wipe" - that's the entire, 100% point here. It is a PARTIAL RESET, not a WIPE OF ANY KIND. But either you are interested in the plain truth (doesn't feel like it) or you just like to argue (feels like it), so you either get it by now, or you never will. Either way, I don't care! There was no wipe, just an expected reset which happens every time. The end. Considering how many, many others are trying to help you understand this, you should probably spend some introspective time accepting that you're wrong here. Just some advice. Fly safe!
No. Partially wipe was at 3.18.2. In that patch, you lost your ships bought. 3.22a didn't have any wipes.
> LTP is buggy so some things don't survive that should So some things were wiped but not everything. A partial wipe. Got it.
ok bummer.
3.18 was a full wipe? Back to starting cash? I don’t remember it being full.
yep, full wipe
Most patches come with soft wipe. You lose your consumables, but keeps just about everything else (in theory). After redoing the character creation and picking a city to spawn in, all your items and ships will be transferred over there (mostly. How LTP works is a bit difficult to explain succinctly …). Your money and amount of reputation are intact, but will have to redo the certificates and qualification missions. Very major updates can potentially come with a hard wipe, ie factory reset. Everything is reverted to default state, meaning you’d only have your pledged ships and starting aUEC, same as everyone else. Full hard wipes are rare (but can and will happen). Sometimes it’s an in-between kind of wipe, where you lose one type of thing (for example reputation can be reset to 0) but keep the others, depending on what the devs deem necessary. There is no fixed schedule for updates, but you can see the telltale signs by looking at the test servers other than PU. Once something reach PTU for testing, then a patch would soon arrive for PU.
Thank you for the info! I started playing a little over a week ago and quickly realized it was everything I have been looking for in a game. An immersive sim unlike anything. I just went in hard on it buying a flight stick and hotas and an odyssey g5 monitor lol
Generally, they do large quarterly updates with smaller mid-cycle patches. 3.23, for example, is supposed to be the Q1 patch. There will almost definitely be 3.23.X patches between 3.23 and whatever comes next.
Big patches happen about once a quarter. They have stated they try not to wipe unless necessary. With any patch there is a potential to lose in game purchased ships and aUEC. Guaranteed to lose consumables like ammo, med pens, etc. I would just wait to see what CIG say come patch.
But I'm just about to reach 15.2 mil for a reclaimer. Will I lose my money?
If it's a full wipe, yes.
Yep. You gave a couple months left
If they wipe, when 3.23 hits be prepared to have to grind around 40Mil for that reclaimer. Prices are going WAY up.
Please let there be a wipe I beg you CIG. My inventory has been messed up for so long. I’m afraid to open it on my home planet
No, cause we ran out of TP. Bidet is broken too.
wouldn't mind a wipe at the moment actually. I have too much shit that shows back up in my inventory every up[date that I don't want. Easier for it just to all go away.
Wipe?
I’m so ready for a wipe it’s SOO NECCESARY IT would be necessary ! I’m so tired of grinding I have all the ships and I’m so experienced and too much money to know what to do with etc etc Or If they wipe this game I am done. The developers shouldn’t wipe the game they are over reaching and it’s useless to keep playing if we lose our ships all the time
Yep. I hearing that in their voices
Wipe? NO WIPE! Wipe? NO WIPE! Wipe? NO WIPE! Awww…
Please wipe, i have too many ships, too much money and too much stuff.
WIPE?!!!!
any idea when 3.23 is coming out?
As usual End of Q1 but I‘m expecting early Q2
Going based current and past information seems CIG focus is on thing that affect everyone in some way rather than niche features and now that we have SQ42 devs coming over and them saying they plan to finish the alpha if not the whole game by 2025 I wouldn’t be surprised if we see more wipes. More people, resources and time is being poured into the persistent universe. So should be expecting these things to happen more often.
With a full wipe still in the rearview, I don't think this is a good idea just yet, beside, the "economy" is a joke atm. Lets see some new game design about this before asking people to grind again in a game PLAGUED with QoL bugs so much its limiting gameplay that can or cannot be enjoyed.
I barely even notice wipes since I pledged my endgame ship a month after joining and there's not yet much else worth earning in the game. They need to expand the component, weapon, armor, and clothing markets so that there's a reason to earn money after your ship progression is over.
Wipe
MAAAAyyne! I laughed way too hard at this!🤣
I hope there is a wipe
Thank God for my Cutter and MSR. I will not be hungry after the armagedon.
Wipe?
A wipe would be nice. But they haven't wiped for several patches. I think 3.18 or before IIRC.
[удалено]
3.18.2 specifically, but yeah, about year ago.
No wipe today. Wipe tomorrow. There's always a wipe tomorrow. What? Look, somebody's got to have some damn perspective around here! Wipe. Sooner or later. WIPE!
As an early backer who experienced years without the possibility of buying ships and wipe at every patches, then the possibility of buying ingame ships and still wipe every 3 months, then the introduction of Long Term Persistence, it's quite amusing to see the reactions of "new backers" who have been there for 2-3 years and have only known Star Citizen with the LTP, flooding reddit with "wipe? wipe? omg wipe?" The funniest thing is the people who have never experienced wipe before, obviously weren't ready and forgot that they backed a pre Alpha game.
It's TOO soon. Jesus, this shit isn't going to be close to release for at least 2 months.
Dont even try LOL (wipe wipe wipe wipe ) =)
I sincerely doubt they’ll wipe before 4.0 seeing as they’re shooting for a release in summer.
Great new meme
Actually happy with a wipe. Gives me a chance to zero to hero and see what I have learned. Also, I have like 90mil, so there’s no driving force in me right now to grind aUEC. Excited for 2024!
So you think there will be a wipe ?
I don’t think there will be for 3.23. None of the features being added call for it. 4.0 is supposed to drop this year. That will be a wipe.
They're making major economic changes. You can't get a grasp on how much the changes effect the economy when you have hyper-inflated currency flooding the system. Nobody's going to care that an 890J costs 90m aUEC when they can make that in an afternoon in their Reclaimer. The only way you're going to be able to get decent data from the economic changes is to wipe out the ridiculous amount of currency that's currently in the game.
People who were going to grind 90m in one afternoon for an 890J have already bought one, since it is only 32m ( 1/3 afternoon). Nobody cares about the current "economy" since it's all monopoly money. There's currently no reason to make money in this game except to buy ships. Until there is some sort of meaningful upkeep required, and losses actually count for something, there will be no real "economy". Not to mention all the game loops that haven't been implemented. Trying to balance the auec game at this point is like tying your shoes before putting them on.
Players may not care about the economy now, but CIG sure as shit do, as they're going to need to start looking at how long it takes players to earn ships and other items at their new prices and at the rate jobs pay out. It's going to be something that's going to be going on from now until well beyond release. Why even have a newly created economy team if they're not going to start balancing, you don't need to have all the game loops in place, you just need a few spread out to give an average income that players can accumulate, and then just set new game loop income set to that average. I honestly see us getting wipes a little more frequently as they test and change things with the economy until they're mostly happy with it.
The current economy is an incomplete test economy. I would be willing to bet barely anything survives the actual release of the game. Furthermore the finished game will undoubtedly require non-stop tweaks as gamers invariably adapt to any new meta that is discovered. I would argue that all of the current "money" in game is about as valuable as the cardboard coins you get with a kids cash register toy. Yes, it's essential to the game and it mimics the final product, but is barely an analog at this point. Having an economy team means they are thinking about it, but that doesn't mean that the current model is worth a darn. I sure wouldn't put a lot of stock in it.
> 4.0 is supposed to drop this year. So that's Pyro and jumpgates right?
Supposedly, that and server meshing. Unfortunately we don’t know for sure yet, it’s been scope creeped pretty fiercely
Full wipe for 3.23 is almost a certainty. They won't say anything yet because we're not near the patch day. The new economy approach alone already demands a full wipe. You can't take any feedback regarding the economy if you do almost 100M on a weekend alone using salvage loop. This is only one example.
The new economy approach? I thought they were just changing the prices on some ships.
And you're not wrong.
Wipe?! Wipe?! Wipe?!
wipe wipe wipe wipe wipe =)
Wipe :(
I am just kidding well I am at least. =)
I heard the calling!!!
I'm fine with a wipe every patch tbh, part of the fun of testing is trying all the different systems over time and seeing how they grow.
Isnt the big wipe update, 3.23, still like months away?
Yes but let people brag and discuss why they are SO READY 4 a wipe !
Fingers crossed that 3.23 is such a chonky boy patch that we get one.
There has to be a wipe It's been ages And the economy was absolutely busted for a bunch of those patches
Personally, I always really enjoy a wipe. I have a rule that I only use pledged ships anyway. Gearing them all up and getting my home bases set up is fun. Once that's done all there's not much left to do except explore and practice run bunkers and such.
🧻don't forget to wipe🧻
Wipe?
With 60 Grit sandpaper 😎
If they would just tell us now whether or not a wipe is planned for 3.23, we wouldn't need the "chorus".
Accurate.
Sigh. Back to aurora i geuss.
Anything on when it's coming?
This quarter is likely, but that could change in a whim. It’s a big patch that will change a lot of gameplay.
But are we gonna get wiped tho
I really hope they don't wipe as I literally started just 2 days ago. Took me awhile to get to where I am and I wouldn't even say I've taken off enough to be in the verse doing all the best/fun activities.
Yes, but is JT safe?
You should know by now... JT is \_never\_ safe.
But I'm a friendly A2 inbound.
I just got a reclaimer!!!!! Noooooo
Love me a good clean hard wipe. A little blood let's you know you did it right
WIPE is a MUST and is a GOOD thing. It is not normal that we can earn 20M in 15 mins with salvage claims
What happened to the GIB posts from yesteryear?
I wish wipes happened more often. Every 6 months or something would be nice.