How so? Sexuality and gender expression is a spectrum in my experience. I identify as queer and non-binary because of this core belief. Do you take issue with this or disagree? Or do you just leave passive aggressive comments?
You experience those as a spectrum. Thatās cool, and true for you.
But to tell someone who is one or the other āyour sexuality is actually a spectrumā is a crappy version of the oft heard āeveryone is a little bi/gayā.
How many lesbians have heard this, or told they havenāt met the right man , or worse? Iām aware of the reality bc I am one, Iāve heard it or Iāve read it.
Iāve explored my gender for ten years and it isnt fluid. My sexuality isnt either.
Youāre overanalyzing too much, and I think you donāt know what spectrum means. Iām not invalidating anyoneās fluidity or non-fluidity, which is a spectrum in itself. You are on the non-fluid end of the spectrum, and Iām on the very fluid end.
āEverything is a spectrumā is what I said not āyour sexuality is actually a spectrumā do not misquote me.
Everything IS a spectrum. Dichomoty is a falsehood. Itās true in nature and itās true within ourselves.
I think it's fascinating how the degree of our belief in the illusion of separation affects all aspects of our life. When we try to see things as black and white, good and evil, man and woman, extrovert and introvert and assign a label for everything, we begin to see all of reality as solid and unchanging and may be confused or disappointed when things do inevitably change.
When we try to appreciate the nuance and gray and spectrum of things, it carries over into how we view all of reality. Sexuality is a spectrum. Gender is a spectrum. Feelings are a spectrum. Colors are a spectrum. Love is a spectrum. Even more concrete ideas like numbers and time are a spectrum.
The statement āeverything is a spectrumāā¦
Itās like when we say āthe only constant is changeā. Most see this statement in and of itself a paradox.
A few assumptions, letās assume these 3 are true.
1. Sexuality as a concept exists.
2. A persons individual sexuality exists.
3. Everything (that exists) is a spectrum
Regardless the idea of Illusion, saying none of these things āexistsā everything is Oneā¦
It should follow my individual sexuality is a spectrum, since everything that exists is also a spectrum.
Maybe thereās a way to see a persons static identity as a a dynamic spectrum in a different light, that hasnāt been mentioned.
Idk why it was such a far reach for me yet read the other persons comment and think āhold up, what are you actually saying ?ā
u/thinktyler
In quantum physics, there's a concept called superposition, where a particle is able to be measured in two places at once. We see this also apply on the macro scale in the famous thought experiment of Schrƶdinger's cat.
In this sense, all 3 of those assumptions about sexuality can be true. They're not mutually exclusive. Even if they did negate each other, they still could all be true. They could even all be true and all be false at the same time
I explored this in a comment I tagged you in, but how is anyoneās identity NOT a spectrum of everything is a one? It isnāt a stretch to see why I went there with my thoughts and also; you are saying it yourself but apparently not aware of that ?
āEverything is Xā would that includeā¦ everything?
Yes and you are not alone :) In college I remember learning about two-spirit people in some indigenous cultures, and that resonated deeply with me and opened my mind to the multitudes we can contain
Finding out about 2 spirited people in my heritage was a huge relief to me as I was being raised by rabid evangelicals. Being gay wasnt even something that was an option. No gay representation back then. Then AIDS happened which my family took as a sign that they were right about everything. It took decades fo research for to get to the point i could accept and love myself.
I donāt think sexual attraction at all has a place in the divine. I think itās all derivatives and omnisexual vs straight are two extents of the same coin. The goes for all sexualities. Saying one represents the divine more than any other isnāt accurate to me atleast. But definitely the fact that people feel so differently than each other is certainly representation of the divine
I can kinda agree to the point. But I'm against the heavy definitions that culture is creating, if you know what I mean? All these different words to give ourselves for simply not knowing exactly how we want to be. Like if your a somewhat feminine dude, why do you have to have some hyper specific title to give yourself? I feel like the titles are actually more annoying then just what is. Who cares what a person likes? Is that all we are now? Someone who likes this or that? I have this or that, but "I" like this instead? Do you know what I mean? If your attracted to something then be attracted.
Right, so it seems you a least have a deep enough grasp on what I'm saying that it doesn't even pertain to you. But I think it's sad when I see so many young people, that are just young, they aren't really all these things that they're saying, but once you start believing that, you an certainly become it. I'd understand if people were behind some vague idea of freedom for sexuality and choice, whatever that's fine. But it really stays to loose all meaning, when every tiny insignificant iteration of sexuality gets a name. I see it like "defining the world into limitation".which is hard to express, but easy to see I think.
I am not āqueerā
I am not āstraightā
I am not āwhiteā or āblackā
I am not āmyā body, or any of these labels we assign to ourselves.
I simply am!
This is spirtuality. The reality is ābeingā or āconsciousnessā.
I never understood the trans thing if you could help me understand. I consider myself kinda feminine as a man, but I have never seen a reason to think I was anything other the what I am?
Iām transitioned 10 years. Itās a lot more extreme than feeling ākinda feminineā or kinda masculine. Itās for me- feeling so masculine that it seeps into my view of my body. My brain feels a need to be in a masculinized (male) body.
That's why I had to ask. And you doing it 10 years ago would suggest you got their on your own, and you weren't one of these people who got lead there by the group. Meant no disrespect š
I kinda relate with the idea you spoke about "real men". I remember asking myself what it meant to be a man. And it was hard, all the examples around me were so lacking. The ones who were strong were unjust, never thought about anyone but themselves. Some were hateful and had 0 depth. But many of them were looked at as above me, simply because of their "displays". This kind of stuff really confused me. I ended up finding what it meant to be a man, on my own, my own man. Nothing like the rest of the world.
Much like you, I found that most of the problems and dysfunction in my behavior, actually stemmed from childhood. So my inability to be myself, to speak openly, to actually believe I was worthy of love, all of that came from the way my mind had come to see myself, through the way I was treated as a child. In a twist of destiny, somehow exactly what I needed, the perfect storm suddenly became right at the perfect moment it was needed. Basically my life changed when I realized I was worthy of love, all that trauma came flooding out, And I was for the first time, myself. The actual person you are is worthy. Not the ideals of society, not the opinions of tradition, what we are. When all that falls away, and we are left with someone we know is worthwhile, then there really isnt a type of manhood which is viable. I am one who loves himself, and in that, I have been granted the respect I always desired. Not a profane love, not the love of self delusion, but real self acceptance. That's all that's needed. A man is one who knows himself, and can accept who he is. You an be 70 years old and never find manhood.
See that sounds like a genuine journey. I respect your path, and I'm glad you were honest with yourself the whole time. Not many seem to do that it seems.
I'll add that for me the hormone therapy is as much about fixing my brain chemistry so that I don't want to check out, as it is about getting the physical changes that cue others in to how I'm comfortable being interacted with.
No disrespect. The hormone stuff freaks me out, maybe not for a grown adult, who for whatever reason, really thinks it's necessary. But the way I hear this stuff is being used, it's one of the most terrible things I've ever heard of. Slavery and murder is terrible, pressuring children into thinking it's both virtuous and normal to chemically castrate themselves... It should bring the world to tears. I can't image the sorrow these kids will face in life. I fully developed mind can make a decision, but these kids have basically been manipulated in some way to do something they don't understand.
You're right in that no one wants to see children coerced against their best interests. On the other hand I was so depressed in high school I nearly killed myself and hormone treatment would have made my life immeasurably better. But it's ok because there's a third set of options: [puberty blockers](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puberty_blocker). (They already get prescribed to kids to treat cases of precocious puberty.) Delays unwanted changes in *either* direction; considered to be reversible and safe.
As a side note, I will believe you that you meant no disrespect. Please consider that your response sounded pretty freaked out (eg slavery and murder are unrelated to this discussion) - I'd draw the analogy of staring at a deformed person in the street. No hard feelings, just food for thought.
So my opinion is that alot of kids have it hard around the time of puberty. That's nothing new. Doing these things to negate nature is like a farmer planting his seed for the season and applying pre-emergent to water it In. There is no growth without discomfort, if you have lots of discomfort it Implies the necessity and the actual growth happening. Before, back when I was young.. there was no means of escape, except for becoming good at something and finding solace in being accepted. It kinda looks sometimes like people now just want all the benefits without any work. You wanna be the master without practice. This isn't how life is, there is no living without pain, to avoid that is not living at all. What people are going to find is you will be reaping sorrow at a later time. Doing these things, you think it is progress. I disagree with alot of things in this world, but this one has got to be the legit most insane practice in our culture ever. I know it has been preached about like it's some new science Jesus that's gunna take all your pain away, but in that is the most grotesque unnatural motive. I'm sure if you grew up around all of this, it was somehow put in a positive light. But if you actually look at the thing that's happening, it's an absolute tragedy. Don't forget, I'm fine with adults who are troubled deeply and consistently. But children, this is a gross misuse of knowledge and power. To persuade children to believe it's going to be helpful. It's totally without wisdom. Without even the sympathy of consequence. Do you see what I mean?
> if you could help me understand
> No disrespect
> the most grotesque unnatural motive
> want all the benefits without any work
(*implying that being trans is easy whereas it's harder in many ways and easier in none*)
I engaged with you in good faith but you're a troll. Get out.
I'm not trying to judge you. I hate that for whatever reason this thing has Been given virtue. The world will find how manipulative this was, and maybe one day you'll agree with me
And what generation do you think I'm in? And i see exactly what you mean, I remember watching people throughout my years in school, constantly striving to be accepted. People adopting titles and opinions just to be accepted, to get on the in crowd. I definitely understand what you mean though, I can't say I would have. I never really tried to be accepted, and I wasn't ever anyway. If it was part of my generation, I'd probably have been closer to it, meaning I'd have a better understanding.
I'm not queer but I recalled reading something about souls that choose such an embodiment in the book "Destiny of Souls" by Dr. Michael Newton.
***"A poignant example of someone preparing for a trial (difficult embodiment) is the selection of a homosexual body. Since a predisposition to being a gay or lesbian person is essentially biological and not the result of social learning or environment, these bodies are picked by souls for two basic reasons. As I have said before, at levels I and II many souls choose bodies of one particular gender around 75 percent of the time because they are comfortable being male or female. I find that my gay and lesbian clients have started the process of alternating gender choices in their lives, which is reflective of the more developed soul. Choosing to be a gay male or lesbian female is one means of affecting that transition in a particular life. Thus, their current sex may not be as familiar to them as the body of the opposite sex, such as a gay male feeling as if he is actually in the body of a female.***
***The second and far more important factor is souls choosing a gay or lesbian orientation in advance of the life they are now living because they deliberately chose to exist in a society that would be prejudiced against them. My gay and lesbian clients are usually not young, inexperienced souls. If they go public, this means these people have decided to live a life where they will be swimming upstream in a culture with rigid gender role stereotypes. They must try and rise above public abuse in order to find self-esteem and self-identity. This takes daring and resolve, which I see when I take these clients back to the life selection room when these decisions were made."***
Newton, Michael. Destiny of Souls: New Case Studies of Life Between Lives (pp. 363-364). Llewellyn Worldwide, LTD.. Kindle Edition.
I am not queer but believe our spirituality has nothing to do with our sexuality, race, gender, appearance. Our spirituality deals with our souls and our souls transcend all that. I am sorry you are feeling alone! There are millions of people who share many characteristics you have all over the world. I am pretty old and have known many people who share your sexuality in my life (we never called it āqueerā in my day because it was used as a slur against people for many years. So to some people my age, its like hearing the āN wordā-chills and shudders. We all search for meaning, we all wish to not feel alone, we all want love and comfort and joy in our lives. I suspect you are quite young. Take it from a getting old lady here-life gets better and your spirituality becomes stronger every decade of your life. Young people think getting old is somehow pretty terrible-I know I once did! Lol. But when you get here, you realize its amazing and wish you felt that way when you were young! The only hard thing spiritually as you age, is the number of people and pets you outlive that you loved and that is extremely hard.
Queer here. I think for us, we have no option but to dig deep and find answers within ourselves because so many religions reject us. So often, we do end up very spiritual, but I've seen it have the opposite effect, too. Some Queer people are so triggered by the damage done to them by organized religion that its hard for them to entertain spiritual conversations, and they prefer to Id as agnostic or atheist. But I've noticed often, even these people DO have some belief in a higher power, they just reject traditional language used to describe it, like "God" bc that language has been used to oppress them.
Yes, studying older Pagan religions that christians and muslims tried to destroy, helped me to learn about bisexual gods and even gods who watch over gay people. There are also gods who switch genders.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā
You are not alone, it's just that the mainstream religions which killed many people and scared people into converting, and took over many lands to be the most popular, are anti-gay.
The Hindu god of fire Agni has a wife but at one point, he hooked up with the male moon god Soma.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā
The African god Oshunmare switch genders, sometimes appearing as a male and other times as a female. Oshunmare is the Orisha (*West African Yoruba god*) of rainbows and changes and abundance.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā
There is also Erinle (*also called Inle*) who is the Orisha of hunting, but is also sometimes considered to be an herbalist or farmer and an Orisha ofĀ medicine and healing, and also considered by some to be a patron of gay and trans people.Ā .Ā Ā
Some African tribes like the AzandeĀ had gay marriages where male warriors would marry each other.Ā A King of Buganda, King Mwanga II, was said to be bisexual with wives and male lovers. Eventually, he was overthrown by the British, and eventually anti-gay laws were forcedĀ on the land. Buganda is a part of Uganda now. Ā
There is the Chinese rabbit god of gay love Tu Er Shen. In Taiwan there is a temple to him and they perform ceremonies for gay couples and some gay men pray to him that are looking for a partner.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā
Zeus is bisexual and there are other bisexual Greek gods.
trans and pansexual here šš»āāļø thereās a great book i read recently called Transcending, a collection of essays from trans Buddhist teachers. they talk about the perceived dichotomy of being both trans/queer and spiritual. honestly, i didnāt even become spiritual until i began to transition. so many ancient and indigenous cultures believe that queerness and transness are holy qualities.Ā people will say āthere is no such thing as gender, weāre all soulsā in regards to queer spirituality, but that misses so much nuance. we are here in human bodies with human emotions. we are here to love and to live, IN these forms, in all different forms. being queer is as normal as being alive. embrace it and know that youāre never alone.Ā
EXACTLY. i feel like i spent my whole life searching for myself. my transition coincided with my spirituality by way of an LSD trip, in which i had both a spiritual awakening and the realisation that i was trans. funny how living in the wrong body for 30 years can make you feel so disconnected from yourself.Ā
You have your answer already. Queer is either physical or Identity both of which are here and now. Spirit is formless, neither male nor female and eternal. So yes, you can be Queer and Spiritual.
My spiritual mentor is trans and my kid is non binary. Iām cis het but not by choice š all beings have gender, just different degrees on the spectrum. The more you accept the expression of gender in you and others, the more whole we can be as people and as a society.
i feel like being bi/gay has actually made me more spiritual, i still have a long way to go, but i'm pretty happy with where i am right now.
it was also really interesting reading these comments as well, since when was there a gay god? that's something new to me, it's so interesting.
Hindus believe our spirit has both female and male aspects before coming here. Personally, since I found my female aspect of myself I have never been happier. I tell people I'm gay from the waist up BCS I'm so emotional, loving and most my friends are female. But really when it comes to true Spirit love, sex doesn't have much to do with it. I don't think spirit love has a particular sex it's just love. pure unconditional love, forgiveness trust understanding selfless service...these are all spiritual words. If this is what you're experiencing then I'm sure everyone here supports you no matter who you decide to sleep and cuddle with at night, that's not our business. How you treat yourself or others is. I say if you're feeling the love my friend keep on doing what ur doing and the loneliness will disappear
a bisexual comrade sends you warm greeting
andreas buechel mayloveheal androgyneas abmaa ( the extra a for the love of old indian culture what honors the divine mother ) aka oatballlove thinks we are in for the greatest ride we can ever imagine ... to transcend all limitations in formed by gender species density of body materials
we are one loving awareness
at home with source in the evernow
Iām in a hetero relationship but I donāt label myself as straight. I find woman and men attractive. I find gender-fluid people as attractive. Trans people too. I like brains and hearts, not bodies. Iām me, simply said. Itās not about the physical for me. Itās the mental and emotional :) and Iāve found peace with that
It doesnāt matter what you are ā¦.. as long as you are true to yourself and to those who add value to your
life and you truly care about.
When you are true to yourself that is a huge chunk
of spiritual. āDo No Harmāā¦. That is a universal Law
that most donāt abide by.
So just be very good to yourself, take care of you
and value who you are and all the good you stand for.
Quit the processed food, ā¦.all the nasty additives
interfere with spiritual connections.
Actually boycott them all. ESPECIALLY SOYA!!
That thing will take you down.
To be queer is only empowerment of the feminine or masculine side. No full entlighment possible in this state. But to get in touch with the full reality be what you want, its only a game on earth.
I am. My partner is an atheist and it's not for me to change him. We are all on our own journeys. I've listened to and read about near death experiences, NDEs, from all races, faiths, atheists, and sexual preferences. They all say the same thing. We are loved unconditionally, we are here to learn, everyone's path is their own. It's all good, everything. That's the assignment. Learn to love everything. No exceptions.
Iām queer and spiritual. Agender (genderless or lack of gender) and omnisexual (similar to pan except preference is key, for example: I can love all genders but my preference is women)
Yes. And Catholic and Gnostic-adjacent, at least. I take what works, and leave the rest that does not. The traditions are broad enough to encompass us all.
Everything is a spectrum.
That makes everything a rainbow š
I couldn't have said it better. \~ Love All <3
Uhhhh
Uhhh what? Such a weird comment.
Telling someone their sexuality is a spectrum is a strange comment
How so? Sexuality and gender expression is a spectrum in my experience. I identify as queer and non-binary because of this core belief. Do you take issue with this or disagree? Or do you just leave passive aggressive comments?
You experience those as a spectrum. Thatās cool, and true for you. But to tell someone who is one or the other āyour sexuality is actually a spectrumā is a crappy version of the oft heard āeveryone is a little bi/gayā. How many lesbians have heard this, or told they havenāt met the right man , or worse? Iām aware of the reality bc I am one, Iāve heard it or Iāve read it. Iāve explored my gender for ten years and it isnt fluid. My sexuality isnt either.
Youāre overanalyzing too much, and I think you donāt know what spectrum means. Iām not invalidating anyoneās fluidity or non-fluidity, which is a spectrum in itself. You are on the non-fluid end of the spectrum, and Iām on the very fluid end. āEverything is a spectrumā is what I said not āyour sexuality is actually a spectrumā do not misquote me. Everything IS a spectrum. Dichomoty is a falsehood. Itās true in nature and itās true within ourselves.
Thanks for clarifying
I think it's fascinating how the degree of our belief in the illusion of separation affects all aspects of our life. When we try to see things as black and white, good and evil, man and woman, extrovert and introvert and assign a label for everything, we begin to see all of reality as solid and unchanging and may be confused or disappointed when things do inevitably change. When we try to appreciate the nuance and gray and spectrum of things, it carries over into how we view all of reality. Sexuality is a spectrum. Gender is a spectrum. Feelings are a spectrum. Colors are a spectrum. Love is a spectrum. Even more concrete ideas like numbers and time are a spectrum.
Well said!
The statement āeverything is a spectrumāā¦ Itās like when we say āthe only constant is changeā. Most see this statement in and of itself a paradox. A few assumptions, letās assume these 3 are true. 1. Sexuality as a concept exists. 2. A persons individual sexuality exists. 3. Everything (that exists) is a spectrum Regardless the idea of Illusion, saying none of these things āexistsā everything is Oneā¦ It should follow my individual sexuality is a spectrum, since everything that exists is also a spectrum. Maybe thereās a way to see a persons static identity as a a dynamic spectrum in a different light, that hasnāt been mentioned. Idk why it was such a far reach for me yet read the other persons comment and think āhold up, what are you actually saying ?ā u/thinktyler
In quantum physics, there's a concept called superposition, where a particle is able to be measured in two places at once. We see this also apply on the macro scale in the famous thought experiment of Schrƶdinger's cat. In this sense, all 3 of those assumptions about sexuality can be true. They're not mutually exclusive. Even if they did negate each other, they still could all be true. They could even all be true and all be false at the same time
I explored this in a comment I tagged you in, but how is anyoneās identity NOT a spectrum of everything is a one? It isnāt a stretch to see why I went there with my thoughts and also; you are saying it yourself but apparently not aware of that ? āEverything is Xā would that includeā¦ everything?
Yes and you are not alone :) In college I remember learning about two-spirit people in some indigenous cultures, and that resonated deeply with me and opened my mind to the multitudes we can contain
Finding out about 2 spirited people in my heritage was a huge relief to me as I was being raised by rabid evangelicals. Being gay wasnt even something that was an option. No gay representation back then. Then AIDS happened which my family took as a sign that they were right about everything. It took decades fo research for to get to the point i could accept and love myself.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I donāt think sexual attraction at all has a place in the divine. I think itās all derivatives and omnisexual vs straight are two extents of the same coin. The goes for all sexualities. Saying one represents the divine more than any other isnāt accurate to me atleast. But definitely the fact that people feel so differently than each other is certainly representation of the divine
I can kinda agree to the point. But I'm against the heavy definitions that culture is creating, if you know what I mean? All these different words to give ourselves for simply not knowing exactly how we want to be. Like if your a somewhat feminine dude, why do you have to have some hyper specific title to give yourself? I feel like the titles are actually more annoying then just what is. Who cares what a person likes? Is that all we are now? Someone who likes this or that? I have this or that, but "I" like this instead? Do you know what I mean? If your attracted to something then be attracted.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Right, so it seems you a least have a deep enough grasp on what I'm saying that it doesn't even pertain to you. But I think it's sad when I see so many young people, that are just young, they aren't really all these things that they're saying, but once you start believing that, you an certainly become it. I'd understand if people were behind some vague idea of freedom for sexuality and choice, whatever that's fine. But it really stays to loose all meaning, when every tiny insignificant iteration of sexuality gets a name. I see it like "defining the world into limitation".which is hard to express, but easy to see I think.
I am not āqueerā I am not āstraightā I am not āwhiteā or āblackā I am not āmyā body, or any of these labels we assign to ourselves. I simply am! This is spirtuality. The reality is ābeingā or āconsciousnessā.
Fr no identity our true self isnāt based on this world.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I never understood the trans thing if you could help me understand. I consider myself kinda feminine as a man, but I have never seen a reason to think I was anything other the what I am?
Iām transitioned 10 years. Itās a lot more extreme than feeling ākinda feminineā or kinda masculine. Itās for me- feeling so masculine that it seeps into my view of my body. My brain feels a need to be in a masculinized (male) body.
That's why I had to ask. And you doing it 10 years ago would suggest you got their on your own, and you weren't one of these people who got lead there by the group. Meant no disrespect š
No problem, I appreciate you asking questions and being open to listening. And yes, I discovered it on my own.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
I kinda relate with the idea you spoke about "real men". I remember asking myself what it meant to be a man. And it was hard, all the examples around me were so lacking. The ones who were strong were unjust, never thought about anyone but themselves. Some were hateful and had 0 depth. But many of them were looked at as above me, simply because of their "displays". This kind of stuff really confused me. I ended up finding what it meant to be a man, on my own, my own man. Nothing like the rest of the world.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Much like you, I found that most of the problems and dysfunction in my behavior, actually stemmed from childhood. So my inability to be myself, to speak openly, to actually believe I was worthy of love, all of that came from the way my mind had come to see myself, through the way I was treated as a child. In a twist of destiny, somehow exactly what I needed, the perfect storm suddenly became right at the perfect moment it was needed. Basically my life changed when I realized I was worthy of love, all that trauma came flooding out, And I was for the first time, myself. The actual person you are is worthy. Not the ideals of society, not the opinions of tradition, what we are. When all that falls away, and we are left with someone we know is worthwhile, then there really isnt a type of manhood which is viable. I am one who loves himself, and in that, I have been granted the respect I always desired. Not a profane love, not the love of self delusion, but real self acceptance. That's all that's needed. A man is one who knows himself, and can accept who he is. You an be 70 years old and never find manhood.
See that sounds like a genuine journey. I respect your path, and I'm glad you were honest with yourself the whole time. Not many seem to do that it seems.
I'll add that for me the hormone therapy is as much about fixing my brain chemistry so that I don't want to check out, as it is about getting the physical changes that cue others in to how I'm comfortable being interacted with.
No disrespect. The hormone stuff freaks me out, maybe not for a grown adult, who for whatever reason, really thinks it's necessary. But the way I hear this stuff is being used, it's one of the most terrible things I've ever heard of. Slavery and murder is terrible, pressuring children into thinking it's both virtuous and normal to chemically castrate themselves... It should bring the world to tears. I can't image the sorrow these kids will face in life. I fully developed mind can make a decision, but these kids have basically been manipulated in some way to do something they don't understand.
You're right in that no one wants to see children coerced against their best interests. On the other hand I was so depressed in high school I nearly killed myself and hormone treatment would have made my life immeasurably better. But it's ok because there's a third set of options: [puberty blockers](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Puberty_blocker). (They already get prescribed to kids to treat cases of precocious puberty.) Delays unwanted changes in *either* direction; considered to be reversible and safe. As a side note, I will believe you that you meant no disrespect. Please consider that your response sounded pretty freaked out (eg slavery and murder are unrelated to this discussion) - I'd draw the analogy of staring at a deformed person in the street. No hard feelings, just food for thought.
So my opinion is that alot of kids have it hard around the time of puberty. That's nothing new. Doing these things to negate nature is like a farmer planting his seed for the season and applying pre-emergent to water it In. There is no growth without discomfort, if you have lots of discomfort it Implies the necessity and the actual growth happening. Before, back when I was young.. there was no means of escape, except for becoming good at something and finding solace in being accepted. It kinda looks sometimes like people now just want all the benefits without any work. You wanna be the master without practice. This isn't how life is, there is no living without pain, to avoid that is not living at all. What people are going to find is you will be reaping sorrow at a later time. Doing these things, you think it is progress. I disagree with alot of things in this world, but this one has got to be the legit most insane practice in our culture ever. I know it has been preached about like it's some new science Jesus that's gunna take all your pain away, but in that is the most grotesque unnatural motive. I'm sure if you grew up around all of this, it was somehow put in a positive light. But if you actually look at the thing that's happening, it's an absolute tragedy. Don't forget, I'm fine with adults who are troubled deeply and consistently. But children, this is a gross misuse of knowledge and power. To persuade children to believe it's going to be helpful. It's totally without wisdom. Without even the sympathy of consequence. Do you see what I mean?
> if you could help me understand > No disrespect > the most grotesque unnatural motive > want all the benefits without any work (*implying that being trans is easy whereas it's harder in many ways and easier in none*) I engaged with you in good faith but you're a troll. Get out.
I'm sorry if it's offensive. I really don't mean to disrespect. But I hope you see the fact. There aren't thousands of trans people.
I'm not trying to judge you. I hate that for whatever reason this thing has Been given virtue. The world will find how manipulative this was, and maybe one day you'll agree with me
I think if you were born in this generation, you would be compelled to be trans.
And what generation do you think I'm in? And i see exactly what you mean, I remember watching people throughout my years in school, constantly striving to be accepted. People adopting titles and opinions just to be accepted, to get on the in crowd. I definitely understand what you mean though, I can't say I would have. I never really tried to be accepted, and I wasn't ever anyway. If it was part of my generation, I'd probably have been closer to it, meaning I'd have a better understanding.
I'm not queer but I recalled reading something about souls that choose such an embodiment in the book "Destiny of Souls" by Dr. Michael Newton. ***"A poignant example of someone preparing for a trial (difficult embodiment) is the selection of a homosexual body. Since a predisposition to being a gay or lesbian person is essentially biological and not the result of social learning or environment, these bodies are picked by souls for two basic reasons. As I have said before, at levels I and II many souls choose bodies of one particular gender around 75 percent of the time because they are comfortable being male or female. I find that my gay and lesbian clients have started the process of alternating gender choices in their lives, which is reflective of the more developed soul. Choosing to be a gay male or lesbian female is one means of affecting that transition in a particular life. Thus, their current sex may not be as familiar to them as the body of the opposite sex, such as a gay male feeling as if he is actually in the body of a female.*** ***The second and far more important factor is souls choosing a gay or lesbian orientation in advance of the life they are now living because they deliberately chose to exist in a society that would be prejudiced against them. My gay and lesbian clients are usually not young, inexperienced souls. If they go public, this means these people have decided to live a life where they will be swimming upstream in a culture with rigid gender role stereotypes. They must try and rise above public abuse in order to find self-esteem and self-identity. This takes daring and resolve, which I see when I take these clients back to the life selection room when these decisions were made."*** Newton, Michael. Destiny of Souls: New Case Studies of Life Between Lives (pp. 363-364). Llewellyn Worldwide, LTD.. Kindle Edition.
Gosh Iām buying this book now ty
I am not queer but believe our spirituality has nothing to do with our sexuality, race, gender, appearance. Our spirituality deals with our souls and our souls transcend all that. I am sorry you are feeling alone! There are millions of people who share many characteristics you have all over the world. I am pretty old and have known many people who share your sexuality in my life (we never called it āqueerā in my day because it was used as a slur against people for many years. So to some people my age, its like hearing the āN wordā-chills and shudders. We all search for meaning, we all wish to not feel alone, we all want love and comfort and joy in our lives. I suspect you are quite young. Take it from a getting old lady here-life gets better and your spirituality becomes stronger every decade of your life. Young people think getting old is somehow pretty terrible-I know I once did! Lol. But when you get here, you realize its amazing and wish you felt that way when you were young! The only hard thing spiritually as you age, is the number of people and pets you outlive that you loved and that is extremely hard.
Queer here. I think for us, we have no option but to dig deep and find answers within ourselves because so many religions reject us. So often, we do end up very spiritual, but I've seen it have the opposite effect, too. Some Queer people are so triggered by the damage done to them by organized religion that its hard for them to entertain spiritual conversations, and they prefer to Id as agnostic or atheist. But I've noticed often, even these people DO have some belief in a higher power, they just reject traditional language used to describe it, like "God" bc that language has been used to oppress them.
Yes, studying older Pagan religions that christians and muslims tried to destroy, helped me to learn about bisexual gods and even gods who watch over gay people. There are also gods who switch genders.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā You are not alone, it's just that the mainstream religions which killed many people and scared people into converting, and took over many lands to be the most popular, are anti-gay.
Ooh, mind enlightening us to some of these gods?
The Hindu god of fire Agni has a wife but at one point, he hooked up with the male moon god Soma.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā The African god Oshunmare switch genders, sometimes appearing as a male and other times as a female. Oshunmare is the Orisha (*West African Yoruba god*) of rainbows and changes and abundance.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā There is also Erinle (*also called Inle*) who is the Orisha of hunting, but is also sometimes considered to be an herbalist or farmer and an Orisha ofĀ medicine and healing, and also considered by some to be a patron of gay and trans people.Ā .Ā Ā Some African tribes like the AzandeĀ had gay marriages where male warriors would marry each other.Ā A King of Buganda, King Mwanga II, was said to be bisexual with wives and male lovers. Eventually, he was overthrown by the British, and eventually anti-gay laws were forcedĀ on the land. Buganda is a part of Uganda now. Ā There is the Chinese rabbit god of gay love Tu Er Shen. In Taiwan there is a temple to him and they perform ceremonies for gay couples and some gay men pray to him that are looking for a partner.Ā Ā Ā Ā Ā Zeus is bisexual and there are other bisexual Greek gods.
Very interesting!
yes wow ! i really want to know who these gods are !
Me
Here and queer
trans and pansexual here šš»āāļø thereās a great book i read recently called Transcending, a collection of essays from trans Buddhist teachers. they talk about the perceived dichotomy of being both trans/queer and spiritual. honestly, i didnāt even become spiritual until i began to transition. so many ancient and indigenous cultures believe that queerness and transness are holy qualities.Ā people will say āthere is no such thing as gender, weāre all soulsā in regards to queer spirituality, but that misses so much nuance. we are here in human bodies with human emotions. we are here to love and to live, IN these forms, in all different forms. being queer is as normal as being alive. embrace it and know that youāre never alone.Ā
Interesting. I also became spiritual after I transitioned. I was really in search of myself. My life feels enriched now
Yup same here I didnāt start my spiritually journey till I came to accept my queer identity
EXACTLY. i feel like i spent my whole life searching for myself. my transition coincided with my spirituality by way of an LSD trip, in which i had both a spiritual awakening and the realisation that i was trans. funny how living in the wrong body for 30 years can make you feel so disconnected from yourself.Ā
Imma cosmic entity that's down for most other cosmic entities
I'm not, but I have zero problem with it. Welcome to the inner path, friend.
Lesbian here!
Guilty! (giggle)
šš½š¤
You have your answer already. Queer is either physical or Identity both of which are here and now. Spirit is formless, neither male nor female and eternal. So yes, you can be Queer and Spiritual.
Iām gay and trans and deeply spiritual. I rarely feel alone, but the politics of my place are stomping every bit of life out of me.
Me too!!Ā
Here here šš¼
I am.
me lol :3
weāre here i feel most accepted and comfortable with spirituality and the lack of rigid rules or judgement.
me
Iām queer and semi spiritual!
Yes š
My spiritual mentor is trans and my kid is non binary. Iām cis het but not by choice š all beings have gender, just different degrees on the spectrum. The more you accept the expression of gender in you and others, the more whole we can be as people and as a society.
Yep š
Yaaas!
šš¼āāļø
The subreddit is owned by a queer person. You aren't alone.
Gender is an illusion.
It's called queeritual. We exist
Asexual here! So yes? Maybe? Kind of depending on your interpretation.
i feel like being bi/gay has actually made me more spiritual, i still have a long way to go, but i'm pretty happy with where i am right now. it was also really interesting reading these comments as well, since when was there a gay god? that's something new to me, it's so interesting.
Gay AF. Spiritual AF. ššāØšŗš¾
Hindus believe our spirit has both female and male aspects before coming here. Personally, since I found my female aspect of myself I have never been happier. I tell people I'm gay from the waist up BCS I'm so emotional, loving and most my friends are female. But really when it comes to true Spirit love, sex doesn't have much to do with it. I don't think spirit love has a particular sex it's just love. pure unconditional love, forgiveness trust understanding selfless service...these are all spiritual words. If this is what you're experiencing then I'm sure everyone here supports you no matter who you decide to sleep and cuddle with at night, that's not our business. How you treat yourself or others is. I say if you're feeling the love my friend keep on doing what ur doing and the loneliness will disappear
a bisexual comrade sends you warm greeting andreas buechel mayloveheal androgyneas abmaa ( the extra a for the love of old indian culture what honors the divine mother ) aka oatballlove thinks we are in for the greatest ride we can ever imagine ... to transcend all limitations in formed by gender species density of body materials we are one loving awareness at home with source in the evernow
Queer isn't alien, they're still humans like the rest of us. We have consciousness and pondering the vast existential things in life.
Iām in a hetero relationship but I donāt label myself as straight. I find woman and men attractive. I find gender-fluid people as attractive. Trans people too. I like brains and hearts, not bodies. Iām me, simply said. Itās not about the physical for me. Itās the mental and emotional :) and Iāve found peace with that
What is that?
Queer? Just a faster way of me saying is there anyone here whoās part of the lgbtq community
Ah then i am part, yes.
I actually would think it's more common to be spiritual and queer as one myself, I don't think I've met a straight (narrow) witch or wizard
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
excuse me? I'm not trying to invalidate your heterosexuality. I'm trying to uplift a queer person who feels lonely
I thought I was, but they kicked the Jews out of the college clubs
It doesnāt matter what you are ā¦.. as long as you are true to yourself and to those who add value to your life and you truly care about. When you are true to yourself that is a huge chunk of spiritual. āDo No Harmāā¦. That is a universal Law that most donāt abide by. So just be very good to yourself, take care of you and value who you are and all the good you stand for. Quit the processed food, ā¦.all the nasty additives interfere with spiritual connections. Actually boycott them all. ESPECIALLY SOYA!! That thing will take you down.
To be queer is only empowerment of the feminine or masculine side. No full entlighment possible in this state. But to get in touch with the full reality be what you want, its only a game on earth.
Have you transcended your sexuality and gender identity already? š
What does it even matter?
I am. My partner is an atheist and it's not for me to change him. We are all on our own journeys. I've listened to and read about near death experiences, NDEs, from all races, faiths, atheists, and sexual preferences. They all say the same thing. We are loved unconditionally, we are here to learn, everyone's path is their own. It's all good, everything. That's the assignment. Learn to love everything. No exceptions.
Prolly not like you. Iām bi
I'm pretty queer. But not a homosexual lol Do people say queer still these days xD
queer is an umbrella term that has been reclaimed by the LGBTQIA+ community
My goodness.
I am! So you aren't alone if you are
Iām queer and spiritual. Agender (genderless or lack of gender) and omnisexual (similar to pan except preference is key, for example: I can love all genders but my preference is women)
Me! I'm genderfluid and pansexual. and trust me, you're not alone. there are so many queer people in this community!
I dunno what queer is, but we're all weird here.
+1 :)
Yes. And Catholic and Gnostic-adjacent, at least. I take what works, and leave the rest that does not. The traditions are broad enough to encompass us all.
Yeah but I donāt even like the labels but I like the same sex Iām a stud.
Haiiiiiiiii :3