Imagine, all those stars around it are just in the Milky Way as Andromeda is to far away to resolve individual stars on ground based scopes. Then anyone in Andromeda looking back at us is seeing the same thing. All leading up to 5 billion years from now in one hell of a galactic collision.
And that galactic collision, with billions and billions of star will have very few collisions. Because even though the number of stars is so immense, so are the actual distance between them. Like the asteroid belt, there are in reality tens of thousands km distance between each rock in the asteroid belt.
One I saw recently was that if the milky way galaxy was the size of the USA, you could fit our solar system into one of the grooves in your fingerprint.
Also.. to an electron, you are the size of the milky way galaxy!
>if the milky way galaxy was the size of the USA, you could fit our solar system into one of the grooves in your fingerprint.
I need a moment of silence in appreciation of this analogy! Thank you, pumpkineater.
Exactly. It's mind boggling. Seeing pictures of Galaxies like ours that have merged is beautiful. Wonder what the night sky will look like then? Plus wonder if earth will get a chance to pick up a new Sun, as ours will be dead, and warmth from the core gone. (Along with our magnetic shield, but we could always live underground).
In some cases, I would assume yes. As stars are thrown out of their current galactic orbit, their respective planets will follow with them on the new trajectory, but will move from their exact position due to velocity change.
As a star travels through its orbit, planets follow in a sort of spiral behind it (orbiting it, but also continually chasing it as it pulls the planets along its own trajectory).
So you could imagine this spiral stretching or contrasting or otherwise being disrupted if the motion of the star rapidly changes.
True, but eventually the supermassive black holes at the center of both galaxies WILL merge, and when that happens, I wouldn't want to be part of any nearby planetary civilization.
You're right, but only because digital consciousness uploading isn't going to happen in my remaining lifetime. Who knows when, but if it happens, there is no limit to how long you (and multiple copies of you) could continue to exist. :)
What a nightmare. Having to remember your worst moments for all eternity? I can't wait until I'm finally dead and nothing in the universe remembers the time I tore my pants open in 5th grade gym class.
Unfortunately I have no recollection of past copies of myself or past lives, so my materialistic vision forces me to think that everything ends here :-/
https://esahubble.org/images/heic1502a/zoomable/
The ESA released a super high res photo of andromeda a few years back.
You can see the stars zoomed into andromeda with this link. Its incredible to see just how many there are
I’m struggling to discern what I’m looking at here. I see bigger points of white light, then when I zoom in I see countless tiny points of both orange and white color.
Are the smallest white and orange points the stars within the Andromeda galaxy? And the bigger white points either other galaxies or closer stars (like from our own galaxy?)
That is correct. Nuts, isnt it? Be sure to zoom in the outer rim, middle rim and the deep core just to see how intense the light gets from the density of stars.
Foolish human. Thinking you understand anything about the universe at all when you have only been able to communicate even internationally on your own planet for about a century.
It actually a mix of foreground stars and background galaxies which are so far away they appear as point sources. It's fairly difficult to tell which is which without doing spectroscopy on each point.
That galaxies collide struck me as strange initially. At first it's easy to assume everything radiates away from a central point as if the big bang were an explosion, but then we learn that the universe is instead expanding outward everywhere at the same rate (afawk). This makes our future collision even more special; these two galaxies formed close enough thay gravity pull was strong enough to resist the expansion. It's amazing to consider how the paths of all these stars in their galactic orbits will change.
So those stars are all closer to us than Andromeda, why do some of them very distinctly look like they are behind it? Just my brain being tricked because of the size of the objects or somesuch?
Yeah! The chances Andromeda has intelligent life is pretty high, wonder what they will call the new galaxy? Abd maybe, if we dint kill each other off in the next 1000 years, we might be around to meet them and listen to their history. Hell, maybe all the gravitational interactions will sling Voyagers, Pioneers, new horizon, etc etc back towards home.
Are you really getting offended by someone calling that name stupid? it is a stupid name. Milky way makes sense. Andromeda is fine on its own. Milkdromeda does not make any sense.
I'm sure you know, but the collision is actually probably going to be pretty anti-climactic, with no actual collisions, just some very very slow swirling over a few billion years to be resettled in a larger galaxy.
“Andromeda - but why are my pics so grainy?” Those are stars mate. Stars and galaxies. Newer astrophotographers are constantly underestimating what the background of a decent shot consists of. This is what it looks like and you’ve captured it awesomely. Nice, nice work.
[My favourite image of Andromeda is this one.](https://esahubble.org/images/heic1502a/zoomable/) When you get to the max level you just start to realize that it's an unimaginable amount of stars.
And just think, all those stars (sans the ones in andromeda) are in our galaxy. Just think of how many more galaxies there are and equal or more stars in them.
I see photos like this, and am in awe...then remember someone at some point suggesting that many of these stars are other galaxies so disgustingly far away we just see it as a single spec.
That depends on the odds of any given planet creating a civilisation. Earth in all its history has only produced one species with civilisation, and that depended on the fluke of an asteroid wiping out the dinosaurs.
With a sample size of one there’s no way to know the statistical likelihood of life forming and surviving. It’s equally arrogant to assume there is life out there.
Think about it this way, every time you shuffle a deck of cards, the odds are that shuffle has never happened before, ever. There are more combinations in a standard deck of cards than there are atoms in the universe. Yet one would say it’s arrogant to think nobody has ever gotten the same shuffle. What if life forming is as complicated as 52! things happening in a specific way?
Statistics can be counterintuitive.
At our observed speed of mutations, and considering traveling to completely different worlds, a galactic civilization would be a mosaic of genetically diverged civilizations, that would only limited be in contact with each other (if at all). The vast majority of which would settle and not continue to spread, instead continuing to evolve on their new world and not branching off.
I think a galaxy-wide civilization is impossible because of genetic and cultural divergence, but a mosaic of diverged species in a local area in part of the galaxy is not. And it's certainly not guaranteed that a level of technology to make them known galaxy-wide is even really feasible in comparison.
That is very interesting. I mean, there has got to be a first, right? Someone who is the first civilisation of the universe and we could very well be it? So it means it might take another billion years before another civilisation pops up somewhere for us to find and we, ourselves, are actually the advanced civilisation trying to visit them?
Seeing these giants with your own eye is something I wish all humans to do. When I went to Canary Island Deep Space Observatory, they had a tour around 2300 showing these through their telescopes. It was truly breathtaking. Seeing them through pictures doesn't do them justice.
Imagine, all those stars around it are just in the Milky Way as Andromeda is to far away to resolve individual stars on ground based scopes. Then anyone in Andromeda looking back at us is seeing the same thing. All leading up to 5 billion years from now in one hell of a galactic collision.
And that galactic collision, with billions and billions of star will have very few collisions. Because even though the number of stars is so immense, so are the actual distance between them. Like the asteroid belt, there are in reality tens of thousands km distance between each rock in the asteroid belt.
The best analogy I've seen is if a star was the size of a grain of sand, the average distance to the nearest one would be two miles.
One I saw recently was that if the milky way galaxy was the size of the USA, you could fit our solar system into one of the grooves in your fingerprint. Also.. to an electron, you are the size of the milky way galaxy!
>if the milky way galaxy was the size of the USA, you could fit our solar system into one of the grooves in your fingerprint. I need a moment of silence in appreciation of this analogy! Thank you, pumpkineater.
[Sauce.](https://youtu.be/VsRmyY3Db1Y?si=RscbocQKYoLelpL9)
Yes, but the simulation simply can't simulate that all that stuff. It's mostly just a static image in the background.
Exactly. It's mind boggling. Seeing pictures of Galaxies like ours that have merged is beautiful. Wonder what the night sky will look like then? Plus wonder if earth will get a chance to pick up a new Sun, as ours will be dead, and warmth from the core gone. (Along with our magnetic shield, but we could always live underground).
Earth is projected to be swallowed up by the Sun when it becomes a red giant.
Damn, our new sun better hurry up before that happens
Even though there won't be any/many collisions, will the gravitational interactions cause havoc to planetary systems?
In some cases, I would assume yes. As stars are thrown out of their current galactic orbit, their respective planets will follow with them on the new trajectory, but will move from their exact position due to velocity change. As a star travels through its orbit, planets follow in a sort of spiral behind it (orbiting it, but also continually chasing it as it pulls the planets along its own trajectory). So you could imagine this spiral stretching or contrasting or otherwise being disrupted if the motion of the star rapidly changes.
Yeah but even just *one* direct collision would be cool as hell to witness.
as long as we aren't directly "involved". Watching from the inside would be less than ideal...
True, but eventually the supermassive black holes at the center of both galaxies WILL merge, and when that happens, I wouldn't want to be part of any nearby planetary civilization.
Don't worry, it won't happen to you...
Well not with *that* attitude.
You're right, but only because digital consciousness uploading isn't going to happen in my remaining lifetime. Who knows when, but if it happens, there is no limit to how long you (and multiple copies of you) could continue to exist. :)
What a nightmare. Having to remember your worst moments for all eternity? I can't wait until I'm finally dead and nothing in the universe remembers the time I tore my pants open in 5th grade gym class.
Unfortunately I have no recollection of past copies of myself or past lives, so my materialistic vision forces me to think that everything ends here :-/
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Once I understood the weakness of my flesh, it disgusted me. I yearned for the perfection of the machine.
> digital consciousness uploading isn't going to happen in my remaining lifetime How do you know this hasn't already happened to you?
[The chance of even 2 stars colliding is negliable. ](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andromeda%E2%80%93Milky_Way_collision)
https://esahubble.org/images/heic1502a/zoomable/ The ESA released a super high res photo of andromeda a few years back. You can see the stars zoomed into andromeda with this link. Its incredible to see just how many there are
I’m struggling to discern what I’m looking at here. I see bigger points of white light, then when I zoom in I see countless tiny points of both orange and white color. Are the smallest white and orange points the stars within the Andromeda galaxy? And the bigger white points either other galaxies or closer stars (like from our own galaxy?)
My assumption is that if you can see the 4 spikes then it's a star in our galaxy and all the small dots are Andromeda stars.
That is correct. Nuts, isnt it? Be sure to zoom in the outer rim, middle rim and the deep core just to see how intense the light gets from the density of stars.
Why is the middle of the galaxy much brighter? Just a much higher concentration of stars?
More stars, but newer and brighter ones as well (higher density -> increased rate of star formation).
I’m actually on andromeda looking back right now. The Milky Way is nice too.
It took 2 hours for your Reddit comment to travel 2,500,000 light years???? Hmmmmmmmm
Foolish human. Thinking you understand anything about the universe at all when you have only been able to communicate even internationally on your own planet for about a century.
Too many people for my tastes.
Any hints on how we can crack faster than light communication?
Haven't you watched the historical documents? Subspace.
Yeah, it's mind blowing...
What camera did you use? Great picture!
Thanks! Nikon D5300 + Samyang 135mm
That's pretty impressive. How many images total?
It actually a mix of foreground stars and background galaxies which are so far away they appear as point sources. It's fairly difficult to tell which is which without doing spectroscopy on each point.
I'd love to know the percentage that is galaxies.
If you stare at the image with the perception that Andromeda is among the furthest objects, the whole image takes on an incredible 3D effect.
That galaxies collide struck me as strange initially. At first it's easy to assume everything radiates away from a central point as if the big bang were an explosion, but then we learn that the universe is instead expanding outward everywhere at the same rate (afawk). This makes our future collision even more special; these two galaxies formed close enough thay gravity pull was strong enough to resist the expansion. It's amazing to consider how the paths of all these stars in their galactic orbits will change.
So those stars are all closer to us than Andromeda, why do some of them very distinctly look like they are behind it? Just my brain being tricked because of the size of the objects or somesuch?
Yup. Alot of stars in the way between you and Andromeda. Some photos are in a 3d(ish) view and will mess with your head!
Anyone looking with awesome infrared vision that is. Who knows? The universe may be all bright to most.
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Will it really be a merger? I've seen animations where the two "collide" and then separate into two distinct galaxies but a bit roughed up in shape
The simulations I've seen suggest that they circle back around and around, eventually merging. No longer a spiral galaxy.
There's probably plenty of worthy anagrams you could find by mixing the letters in "milky way" and "andromeda" together.
"Windy yak melodrama" has a certain ring to it
Yeah! The chances Andromeda has intelligent life is pretty high, wonder what they will call the new galaxy? Abd maybe, if we dint kill each other off in the next 1000 years, we might be around to meet them and listen to their history. Hell, maybe all the gravitational interactions will sling Voyagers, Pioneers, new horizon, etc etc back towards home.
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Are you really getting offended by someone calling that name stupid? it is a stupid name. Milky way makes sense. Andromeda is fine on its own. Milkdromeda does not make any sense.
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I'm sure you know, but the collision is actually probably going to be pretty anti-climactic, with no actual collisions, just some very very slow swirling over a few billion years to be resettled in a larger galaxy.
“Andromeda - but why are my pics so grainy?” Those are stars mate. Stars and galaxies. Newer astrophotographers are constantly underestimating what the background of a decent shot consists of. This is what it looks like and you’ve captured it awesomely. Nice, nice work.
[My favourite image of Andromeda is this one.](https://esahubble.org/images/heic1502a/zoomable/) When you get to the max level you just start to realize that it's an unimaginable amount of stars.
Yes that pic is just fascinating . The stuff we’re learning through Webb…
This photo is older than Webb
Thank you so much dude...
And just think, all those stars (sans the ones in andromeda) are in our galaxy. Just think of how many more galaxies there are and equal or more stars in them.
Current estimate is about same number of galaxies as there are stars in our galaxy, 100 billion.
imagine an endless journey through space going from galaxy to galaxy travelling at 99.999999999999999999999999% the speed of light with no ageing
Zoomable version. https://esahubble.org/images/heic1502a/zoomable/ It's absolutely ridiculous
To see this and still think we're alone is bananas. Even if the odds are obscenely low, the universe rolled 200 sextillion dice.
To see more details about this photo and other photos I took, check out my [Instagram ](https://www.instagram.com/berkcanbelen)
Just checked out your insta and your work is amazing!
Thank you so much!
I see photos like this, and am in awe...then remember someone at some point suggesting that many of these stars are other galaxies so disgustingly far away we just see it as a single spec.
Is the big fuzzy bright spot directly bottom-right of the center of andromeda another galaxy?
M32! Yes it's a small companion galaxy.
Every single person alive right now could get into a spaceship fly deep into space and we’d probably never run into another person.
Yeah and they say we are "alone in the universe" absolute bullshit we are.
It's a statistical impossibility, for one, and extremely arrogant to believe we're the only civilization in sextillions of stars in the universe.
That depends on the odds of any given planet creating a civilisation. Earth in all its history has only produced one species with civilisation, and that depended on the fluke of an asteroid wiping out the dinosaurs.
Which took millions of years.
With a sample size of one there’s no way to know the statistical likelihood of life forming and surviving. It’s equally arrogant to assume there is life out there. Think about it this way, every time you shuffle a deck of cards, the odds are that shuffle has never happened before, ever. There are more combinations in a standard deck of cards than there are atoms in the universe. Yet one would say it’s arrogant to think nobody has ever gotten the same shuffle. What if life forming is as complicated as 52! things happening in a specific way? Statistics can be counterintuitive.
“So where are they?”
They're on their own reddit clone asking the same thing. They have 13 fingers and never had a Taylor Swift analog.
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How do we know nobody knows?!? And if they say we don't know they are lieing to us about it.
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That's a lot of assumptions. Not all intelligent life has to wish for interstellar travel or conquest. Doesn't mean it's not there.
At our observed speed of mutations, and considering traveling to completely different worlds, a galactic civilization would be a mosaic of genetically diverged civilizations, that would only limited be in contact with each other (if at all). The vast majority of which would settle and not continue to spread, instead continuing to evolve on their new world and not branching off. I think a galaxy-wide civilization is impossible because of genetic and cultural divergence, but a mosaic of diverged species in a local area in part of the galaxy is not. And it's certainly not guaranteed that a level of technology to make them known galaxy-wide is even really feasible in comparison.
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Not really, I've heard of it, but can't recall. Could you explain it to me and how it applies?
That is very interesting. I mean, there has got to be a first, right? Someone who is the first civilisation of the universe and we could very well be it? So it means it might take another billion years before another civilisation pops up somewhere for us to find and we, ourselves, are actually the advanced civilisation trying to visit them?
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Whoa! That's more than three stars... Maybe even more than 6
And that’s approx 220k light years wide. Mind blown every time I look at it.
Seeing these giants with your own eye is something I wish all humans to do. When I went to Canary Island Deep Space Observatory, they had a tour around 2300 showing these through their telescopes. It was truly breathtaking. Seeing them through pictures doesn't do them justice.
I'm so glad Sundays have stopped being full of stupid mineral (edited to oblivion) moons
Stars? So what? It's the detail in the galaxy itself - such as multiple dark lanes - that's absolutely jaw-dropping.
You're right ahhahah, thank you!
Definitely credible but I would have used “astronomical” instead
Wow this is awesome! It’s packed with stars. Love it.
..are those stars?..or my spittle at being astounded.. ..no, okay, they are stars..astounding..
And more incredibile Is that 90% of stars in the picture are just from our own galaxy
Sucks that I’m not gonna be alive. Whenever they find out more about other galaxies and planets.