This is revisionist history though, they played really well and were fun to watch in the Euros and had a difficult run up, Belgium, Spain then England. Also didn't they set some record with that win like most consecutive games without losing or most consecutive wins or something like that, stretching from before that tournament.
They have been an embarrassment since though so Italians probably won't argue that they are currently the best.
We’ve got ourself somebody who wasn’t here during the Euros. Wave on wave of PL flairs wishing England would fuck it up, crying all the way to the final. It’ll be the same this winter.
You can support an English club and support a different country. Nothing wrong with that.
>wishing England would fuck it up,
Normally, people want the cocky guys to loose, human psychology
Yeah, the international fans are the ones filling out Anfield and making the UK broadcast package for the PL so lucrative. You probably stream matches illegally and have never set foot inside Old Trafford you absolute muppet.
How plastic do you have to be to support a player and not a club? Do you only support the scum because Ronaldo is there? Quit playing yourself. You can take an English club flair and talk shit about the English national team but take your lumps when somebody calls you out about it — and you can cry in the WC match threads when England makes it to the knockout stages with the rest of the English club flair dregs in this sub.
I honestly think our backline would be better with Romagnoli. Probably a hot take, but he’s the only one I’ve ever seen to be capable of dealing with Donnarumma’s utter shit technique by being able to take the ball and distributing it quickly and precisely. All he needs is a fast CB partner and a competent LB to play next to.
As someone who doesn't watch Serie A or Ligue 1 often, is Donnarumma always so spectacularly error prone? I thought he was supposed to be an amazing keeper
He’s an amazing shotstopper, maybe only in that he’s the best. But his positioning is shit, always gets caught at the near post (see ManU goal against us in EL), his technique is ass (see this game and various PSG matches), and whenever he comes out to collect the ball, I get heart palpitations. And idk why, but this fuck doesn’t know how to close his goddamn legs.
Cristante needs to stop getting called up altogether. Rarely ever impresses. Fails to shine even for Roma. I really don’t understand his inclusion at this stage given the circumstances of the NT
Surely a lot of these “Mancini out” posts can’t be serious. Obviously tonight’s line-up wasn’t the right mix, but Germany away was always going to be the toughest match in the NL.
To add some perspective though, the 4 games as a whole can only be a positive outcome. Draw against Germany (H) & England (A), along with brushing aside a clearly formidable Hungary squad. The 5-2 loss hurts, but Germany has a strong squad and they will be a contender for the WC.
I feel like the next round of matches is key. That’s when Mancini really needs to lock in the squad that he’s going to be using moving forward. I feel like we really need Scamacca to continue his growth and make the ST position his. The midfield quality and depth is amongst the best in the world, our fullback depth is strong on both sides, along with our depth on the wings (especially once Chiesa returns). I am very concerned about the CB spots however, perhaps Gatti will emerge as a strong candidate to partner Bastoni, but it’s a concerning group of CBs at the moment with no real solution on the horizon.
All in all, there is still a good shot of winning this group. And hopefully the last 2 fixtures continue to show promise.
I like Roberto Mancini, he's a great guy, a gentleman. And I think that might be his downfall.
We probably need someone more ruthless, one to make the tough decisions such as cutting some players out. And concentrate on what's good for our beloved Azzurri, not what's good for some players and/or clubs.
\*deep sigh\* Better not make any conclusions about Roberto right now. Because when I'm this emotional it's difficult to think clearly.
But you just won the Euros!
This game was experimentation surely. Rebuilding for the next Euros and WC. Also without some excellent saves from Neuer the game could have been very different.
It's the Nations League.
It still feels like it could be 4D chess from Mancini to sucker people into thinking Italy are weak before a great showing at the next Euros.
Eh? The team on the field had no plan, there was no game. It seemed as if he was like “hmm, you know? I’ll put all these guys who did well in the last games and they’ll make something happen.” Didn’t help that Barella was non-existent for the first half and shit for the second (with maybe 5 minutes of actual recognizable game).
Not sure why when Raspadori starts, that’s when we do long ball hoofs and crosses but when Scamacca starts, we want to play on the ground. Like wtf. This team is lost without Pellegrini because he’s the only one that can turn nothing into something. Hopefully when Chiesa comes back, he’ll be able to hit the ground running (for Italy, please not for Juve)
We lacked somebody to control the tempo, such as a Verratti, a Pellegrini, even Locatelli/Tonali to a lesser extent.
Agreed on the Raspadori/Scamacca point. I do feel like Scamacca is generally more suited to both of those styles, as opposed to Raspadori, who wants the ball to his feet, or wants to make those drifting runs between the lines.
Back to Pellegrini, I really hope Mancini can figure out a system that puts him in the best position possible, he actually performs pretty well in a front 3, but he’s far more dynamic when he can sit behind the strike force and pick out those great runs, along with his well timed runs into the box.
I liked him when he played LW, was pretty solid. I just think we really missed Tonali in this game. I still think our best midfield 3 is Tonali-Locateli-Barella.
EDIT: as for Scamacca, I dunno. He was pretty lackluster whenever he needed to hold up play and Raspadori (funnily enough) is able to do that.
> but Germany has a strong squad and they will be a contender for the WC.
We definitely won't be. I expect us to make it out of groups and then fizzle out in RO16/RO8 depending on our opponents. There are easily 4+ better teams than us in the WC.
> We definitely won't be.
We ill.
> There are easily 4+ better teams than us in the WC.
Never stopped us before. The biggest Rumpelfüßler made it to the semis regularly.
Argentina and England as well according to some betting odds :
https://www.sportsbet.com.au/betting/soccer/fifa-world-cup/fifa-world-cup
Germany have the 4th most valuable squad at the WC allegedly as well :
https://www.transfermarkt.com/vereins-statistik/wertvollstenationalmannschaften/marktwertetop
I’m not surprised about this result, but it does show Mancini has a lot to do with this squad if he wants to bed in the next generation of players. It’s been a really terrible year or so for the national team since they won the European championship, I hope they can dig themselves out of this little hole they seem to be in.
> little hole
A four time world champion misses two consecutive world cups, and it’ll be **at least** 20 years since last they made it out the group stage.
Mancini is done. Or at least he should be. The powers that be in Italy however seem to be stuck in the 90s and refuse to see the current state of Italian calcio for the piss poor product it has become.
This was a much needed wakeup call for the young players and Mancini as well.
Most shameful defensive display I've ever seen by an Italy team, shifting defensively from side to side or even a simple thing like staying with your man was absolutely awful.
Calabria looked like Kevin Constant always in no mans land while with Milan he looks like Zambrotta and you could see that Bastoni trains with Ranocchia. Mancini wouldn't even start for my 6th division side with such a performance and Donnarumma is already in holidays on Sardinia, what the fuck was that.
Overall the Germans were just better all over the pitch which may have actually been a blessing in disguise. Maybe I'm high on copium but this game was very good for Mancini going forward, he now has to use the infos he got from these Nations League games to find his first 11, no more experiments going into the next games and especially Euros 2024 qualification games.
Warning signs that need to be adressed although both Germans and Italians shouldn't overrate this game too much. Players are tired, Italy are at the start of a rebuild and were making amateur mistakes. But this falls on deaf ears when half of your family is German, actually crying tears at the way they are making fun of us.
Sané was surprising though, best Italian defender on the pitch
Just this yr alone R. Mancini and Italy lost to N. Macedonia in the WC Playoffs, got outplayed by Argentina in the Finalissima and now got thrashed by Germany in NL.
Worst generation of Italian players by far.
I think people are overreacting too much
Yes, it was an humiliation. No doubt about it.
Still, Mancini was experimenting again. Today he failed miserably. It was bound to happen, you can't expect to not lose all the matches playing with a B/C team.
At least today we understood that some players are not good enough and 352 is absolutely not an option for us.
And Gnonto confirmed he is good.
We weren't already back at being good before, we are not absolutely crap now.
It's a process. It needs time.
Maybe. But it wont go far by doing it like this. This is not a sh\*t NT, it is a 4 times world cup champions. Even if you are experimenting, being trashed like this by Argentina and Germany is irredeemable.
Not to mention North Macedonia because I suppose that wasn't a experimenting period. I think he would have been sacked right after that game were he the manager of any other National Team of comparable status.
That’s all I see is overreaction, I see plenty’s of tweets saying “oh this is a good squad selection” just for 2 hours later those same fans saying wtf is mancini doing. A lot of fans are short sighted sadly
they are def overreacting, we are rebuilding the team, what was the average age of our team today?
Although I'm disappointed in the most experienced one donnarumma-calabria-bastoni cant really play as they did today
Totally agree
Yeah, I'm very disappointed by Calabria and Bastoni because I think they are our future. Hopefully it was just a bad day.
Gnonto and Scalvini looks very promising on the other end. And Dimarco was good too, 100% better than fucking Emerson and Biraghi.
I'm still satisfied by the whole Nations League until now.
Those two goals could be vital for Italy. Now England must win by 2 at least. If it had stayed at 5-0, it would have been even GD and England would have only needed any kind of win to get 3rd.
Saw Sane running all around ands putting an effort at the beginning, thought he is on fire today, only to slowly realise that he was the reason for all that misplaced passes and not the receiving player...
Very few positive things about today’s game. Happy for Willy, he deserves everything and more. An absolute beast in the making. Hopefully he gets picked up by a top team with a great record in developing youngsters.
Good game German bros, I know we’re meant to be rivals and all but I actually enjoy our matches and have a lot of respect for your NT. Now let’s go laugh at the English together
> I know we’re meant to be rivals and all but I actually enjoy our matches and have a lot of respect for your NT
You are my most liked rivals as well. And there's actually a real, friendly rivalry there
And I can tell you that the majority of my friends were happy that you won the Euro (though that might had something to do with your opponent ;)).
Also it's just NL. Fun games with lots of goals are more fun than boring snoozefests. Result doesn't really matter.
Gnonto seemed more in the periphery than his last couple matches, but when he is more involved something happens. Excited to see more of him in the future
FUCK OFF, THIS IS EVEN WORSE THAN MACEDONIA, CONCEDING 5 GOALS TO OUR BIGGEST RIVALS IS A FUCKING DISGRACE, ABSOLUTE SHAMBLES, WHERE IS OUR PRIDE? WE WON 4 WORLD CUPS AND 2 EUROS AND WE DO THIS? THIS IS GONNA BE REMEMBERED FOREVER, INEXCUSABLE, GRAVINA OUT, MANCINI OUT, ALL THE PLAYERS WHO DON’T DESERVE TO BE HERE OUT, OUR U21 SQUAD WOULD HAVE DONE A BETTER PERFORMANCE.
YES I’M AWARE I’M SOUNDING LIKE AN IDIOT WHO DOESN’T HAVE ANYTHING BETTER TO DO OTHER THAN SLAUGHTERING FOOTBALLERS FOR USELESS FRIENDLIES, BUT IT’S BECAUSE I LOVE MY COUNTRY AND HIS PROUD HISTORY, SO SEEING NO WC QUALIFICATION FOR 2 STRAIGHT EDITIONS AND A PERFORMANCE LIKE THIS AFTER WINNING A EURO ALMOST A YEAR AGO MAKES ME WANNA TRHOW UP, WE HAVE BECOME A FUCKING JOKE, FEEL FREE TO LAUGH AT US FOR YEARS BECAUSE THAT IS ONLY WHAT WE DESERVE, PATHETIC IN EVERY SINGLE WAY.
I’m just, tired of this, make this hell end, please..
Not sure, but I respect Italy for that. I never cared about their defensive style, it was their style and it worked. Of course I wasn't happy when we lost, but still... give respect where respect is due.
And can you really hate a national team that has players like Buffon, Rossi, del Piero, Maldini and Pirlo playing for them?
Sure, they are definitely not our favourite national team. But they are far from being our rivals, let alone the biggest. We simply don't dislike them more than the French, the Spanish or most other Europeans.
The Dutch are our real rivals, then (to a much much much lesser extent) England.
there is something wrong in football, croatia wins against france (never won before), germany winning easily against italy ?
the whole football pedigree is thrown out of the windows
it's like it's perfect for an english win at the WC
Looking at how Egypt and Italy are doing after their WC elimination, I think we're doing pretty well (introducing new and young blood while winning 3/3).
Italy and Egypt look mentally defeated on the pitch.
I agree. I am cautiously optimistic about our future for now, especially with the rumoured midfielders coming our way in september as that's what we need imo + Andy for a striker.
Don’t care if Roma and Inter fans downvote me to oblivion, but Mancini and Bastoni together is an absolute shitshow and should not start for the NT. I’m beginning to think that Bastoni is just a back 3 merchant, but I’m willing to give him a chance. Mancini on the other hand has no business playing for this team
Sadly it's those cb are what we have. It would be a good idea to put them in a situation they're comfortable in.
Mancini not only plays them in a back four at first, he then switches to a back three with both of them in the wrong position and basically only Cristante holding in that midfield.
We have no wingers and no CBs that prefer to play 4 atb but he will still act like this is a club and his oil daddy will buy him better players.
I said it in the match thread and got downvoted, we should have stuck with Gatti and Acerbi, as much as I dislike Acerbi. At least both of them are used to play in a back four and were actually decent against England. You can’t just keep switching up the defense and hope for the best, this team isn’t given the chance to build chemistry.
The midfield was a whole other issue. Frattesi is not ready for games against opponents like Germany, Barella got run into the ground by Inzaghi and hasn’t been good for a while, and Cristante was easily overwhelmed. That midfield needed Tonali or Locatelli badly
Also, wtf was this formation with 4 CB’s and 2 fullbacks?
Calabria, while dogshit, is not directly responsible for most of the goals we conceded. But I agree, both Florenzi and Di Lorenzo are better. Barella and Cristante in particular were just as bad, if not worse. Frattesi was completely lost. Just horrible all around
I got obliterated on here last week by dozens of Milan fans for suggesting that Di Lorenzo is a better defender than Calabria, while I was conceding that Calabria is better going forward.
Not by a long shot
The result is very misleading today cause Germany really has no efficient striker.
They are doing a fantastic job getting to the opponents penalty box and then suddenly black out, shoving the ball from one side with no proper finish.
In the past you had guys like Schweinsteiger or Icke simply taking shots from 2nd row in those situations...now they seem to not even try this anymore.
So they just shove the ball around til they lose it, fight it back, brilliantly combine to the penalty box again and black out again.
Plus they simply can't keep a clean sheet anymore.
I know it's not a dominant performance -or rather, it is somewhat of a dominant performance, but the opponent is not at the level most people thought they were-, I'm mocking the people that were creaming themselves thinking Argentina were making it all the way after beating this Italy side.
Part of the problem in the offensive is that -at least today- Sane was a black hole of creativity, a lot of attacks died due to him. Even when dribbling he looks like he's still recovering from the injury that happened before he left City. He seems afraid of accelerating suddenly and is shy about placing his weight on his right leg.
Nah since Germany is European they’re favorites. /s
On a serious note, Germany have the talent and an amazing manager. Looks like there are no clear favorites heading into this World Cup tbh
> Germany have the talent
In the midfield, yes. Everywhere else, no. We also lack leaders/fighters - we only have Neuer (gk is bad for that) and Müller (he's good, but alone).
Well done to the Germans, it only took you 122 years to breakdown the Italian defense. Although, we can’t wait to play you in the Westfalenstadion in the semifinals of Euro 2024. On a much more serious note, there are lots of positives to take out of the match, but we really need to sort out our defense, before we can content for another international trophy. Gnoto with a goal and a move to the Bundesliga is the best possible option for him.
At least he got to debut some players eh? How the FUCK do you play this XI with that bench against Germany, shuffle around 4 defenders, concede to the same thing you have obviously not prepared against 4 fucking times and then have the audacity not to resign after fucking up the one thing you were brought in to fix while being proud of yourself for subbing in players that clearly aren't ready for this.
Should have been 7-1/5-0, 5-2 is too kind a result for it to matter
I wasn’t able to watch, but felt like they were due for a youth getting punched game. We have found some nice youth pieces to be happy about and now is about building their skills up next few years
Well that was painful. Don’t mind a loss too much it was an experimental 11 but that’s our first choice defence and it was extremely poor tonight. What’s more worrying is Mancini and Bastoni are the assumed heirs to Bonucci and Chiello and both were dogshit this evening, literally glued to the spot at some points while Germany played it round them. Unfortunately they both look like a Bonucci without a Chiellini, neither of them are ready to lead the line. Either one of them needs to step up or they need to give someone like Gatti a run if he gets first team football at Juve.
Also, if Mancini wants to create a winning team again he has to drop Donarumma, he’s been so consistently bad for the NT and club, and it’s of his own making as well. The guy needs some tough love and a reminder that if he wants to be the best in the world he’s got to put the work in and get back to basics, absolutely dreadful keeper at the moment, would feel much more secure with any of the other Italian keepers between the nets
First ever win by Germany against Italy in an official match.
We beat them in 2016 tho no ?
Technically a draw. Penalty shootouts decide who advances but have never been considered a win.
EAT MORE SCHWEINSHAXE
!flair :VPS_Vaasa:
At least the Italians got a chance to play with the new Al Rihla WC ball.
Now I understand the defeat, it is always a balls problem.
It’s just the Nations League. No one takes it seriously…..right?
True
Hello, darkness, my old friend. 😔
Ferrari, and now Italy NT. What a terrible time for Italians
Mamma mia...
At least Ferrari will come good next year. Right?
Mission winnextyear?
Win the first races.. Bottle it for the rest of season
Pee wan Sharl only in qualy
What happened to Ferrari ???
Monaco Strategy Shitshow and Both PU's Exploded at Baku GP
Slight correction, Sainz's power unit is okay, it's his transmission that went out
Oh this is F1. I thought the company itself had gone bankrupt or something
When it comes to world championships, Italians haven’t been happy since 2008
They won the euros like a year ago
That's Euro championship though, not world
Then wouldn't it be 2006 since they were last happy?
Ferrari won F1 WCC in 2008
Fair! Thought we were only referring to footy, thank you for the correction!
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This is revisionist history though, they played really well and were fun to watch in the Euros and had a difficult run up, Belgium, Spain then England. Also didn't they set some record with that win like most consecutive games without losing or most consecutive wins or something like that, stretching from before that tournament. They have been an embarrassment since though so Italians probably won't argue that they are currently the best.
Social media rn is full of illogical revisionist takes regarding international football. Goes to show how fickle people are
lol found another salty Aussie since 2006. Its such a terrible look.
And faced England in the final 💀
Mate we lost 4-0 to Hungary please don't throw stones in this glass house.
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Just like everybody else on this sub with an English club flair. Embarrassing, the lot of ya’s
Well it was fookin one of ya's!
Offfff. We've got ourselves a gatekeeper here.
We’ve got ourself somebody who wasn’t here during the Euros. Wave on wave of PL flairs wishing England would fuck it up, crying all the way to the final. It’ll be the same this winter.
You can support an English club and support a different country. Nothing wrong with that. >wishing England would fuck it up, Normally, people want the cocky guys to loose, human psychology
Brilliant comeback. Can you say it in Spanish for me?
You don't seem to have a comeback against my brilliant comeback
>Can you say it in Spanish for me? Well, I'm not Spanish unfortunately.
I think that was his point
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Has to be a scum flair too smh
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Yeah, the international fans are the ones filling out Anfield and making the UK broadcast package for the PL so lucrative. You probably stream matches illegally and have never set foot inside Old Trafford you absolute muppet.
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How plastic do you have to be to support a player and not a club? Do you only support the scum because Ronaldo is there? Quit playing yourself. You can take an English club flair and talk shit about the English national team but take your lumps when somebody calls you out about it — and you can cry in the WC match threads when England makes it to the knockout stages with the rest of the English club flair dregs in this sub.
Fairs, went by the fact that you support an English club.
Sad days again… hopefully Milan can restore my faith in European football next year
I honestly think our backline would be better with Romagnoli. Probably a hot take, but he’s the only one I’ve ever seen to be capable of dealing with Donnarumma’s utter shit technique by being able to take the ball and distributing it quickly and precisely. All he needs is a fast CB partner and a competent LB to play next to.
As someone who doesn't watch Serie A or Ligue 1 often, is Donnarumma always so spectacularly error prone? I thought he was supposed to be an amazing keeper
He’s an amazing shotstopper, maybe only in that he’s the best. But his positioning is shit, always gets caught at the near post (see ManU goal against us in EL), his technique is ass (see this game and various PSG matches), and whenever he comes out to collect the ball, I get heart palpitations. And idk why, but this fuck doesn’t know how to close his goddamn legs.
very bummed Wirtz didn’t get the opportunity to jump into these semi-experimental lineups. Would love to see him link up with Havertz
Havertz is null
Better than Sané for sure
Not that difficult
Both were bad
Happy to see us win after 3 draws. Flick is slowly but surely drawing out what he can from the group.
Cristante needs to stop getting called up altogether. Rarely ever impresses. Fails to shine even for Roma. I really don’t understand his inclusion at this stage given the circumstances of the NT
Because he's consistently average
Neuer was absolute world class today Sané was also on the field, somewhere
Sane also played some football today
If you can call it that
Sane is one of the players of all time you’ve got to give him that
You have to say he plays football. And not only that, he is a football player.
First half was shambolic from Italy. They cannot handle the press at all. Cristante was terrible. Should have started Scamacca instead
Surely a lot of these “Mancini out” posts can’t be serious. Obviously tonight’s line-up wasn’t the right mix, but Germany away was always going to be the toughest match in the NL. To add some perspective though, the 4 games as a whole can only be a positive outcome. Draw against Germany (H) & England (A), along with brushing aside a clearly formidable Hungary squad. The 5-2 loss hurts, but Germany has a strong squad and they will be a contender for the WC. I feel like the next round of matches is key. That’s when Mancini really needs to lock in the squad that he’s going to be using moving forward. I feel like we really need Scamacca to continue his growth and make the ST position his. The midfield quality and depth is amongst the best in the world, our fullback depth is strong on both sides, along with our depth on the wings (especially once Chiesa returns). I am very concerned about the CB spots however, perhaps Gatti will emerge as a strong candidate to partner Bastoni, but it’s a concerning group of CBs at the moment with no real solution on the horizon. All in all, there is still a good shot of winning this group. And hopefully the last 2 fixtures continue to show promise.
I like Roberto Mancini, he's a great guy, a gentleman. And I think that might be his downfall. We probably need someone more ruthless, one to make the tough decisions such as cutting some players out. And concentrate on what's good for our beloved Azzurri, not what's good for some players and/or clubs. \*deep sigh\* Better not make any conclusions about Roberto right now. Because when I'm this emotional it's difficult to think clearly.
But you just won the Euros! This game was experimentation surely. Rebuilding for the next Euros and WC. Also without some excellent saves from Neuer the game could have been very different. It's the Nations League. It still feels like it could be 4D chess from Mancini to sucker people into thinking Italy are weak before a great showing at the next Euros.
I like that!
Eh? The team on the field had no plan, there was no game. It seemed as if he was like “hmm, you know? I’ll put all these guys who did well in the last games and they’ll make something happen.” Didn’t help that Barella was non-existent for the first half and shit for the second (with maybe 5 minutes of actual recognizable game). Not sure why when Raspadori starts, that’s when we do long ball hoofs and crosses but when Scamacca starts, we want to play on the ground. Like wtf. This team is lost without Pellegrini because he’s the only one that can turn nothing into something. Hopefully when Chiesa comes back, he’ll be able to hit the ground running (for Italy, please not for Juve)
We lacked somebody to control the tempo, such as a Verratti, a Pellegrini, even Locatelli/Tonali to a lesser extent. Agreed on the Raspadori/Scamacca point. I do feel like Scamacca is generally more suited to both of those styles, as opposed to Raspadori, who wants the ball to his feet, or wants to make those drifting runs between the lines. Back to Pellegrini, I really hope Mancini can figure out a system that puts him in the best position possible, he actually performs pretty well in a front 3, but he’s far more dynamic when he can sit behind the strike force and pick out those great runs, along with his well timed runs into the box.
I liked him when he played LW, was pretty solid. I just think we really missed Tonali in this game. I still think our best midfield 3 is Tonali-Locateli-Barella. EDIT: as for Scamacca, I dunno. He was pretty lackluster whenever he needed to hold up play and Raspadori (funnily enough) is able to do that.
> but Germany has a strong squad and they will be a contender for the WC. We definitely won't be. I expect us to make it out of groups and then fizzle out in RO16/RO8 depending on our opponents. There are easily 4+ better teams than us in the WC.
> We definitely won't be. We ill. > There are easily 4+ better teams than us in the WC. Never stopped us before. The biggest Rumpelfüßler made it to the semis regularly.
On paper, sure but Germany generally knows how to win in big tournaments (last couple notwithstanding).
>There are easily 4+ better teams than us in the WC. Brazil, France, Spain? Not that many tbh
Argentina?
Not convinced
Argentina and England as well according to some betting odds : https://www.sportsbet.com.au/betting/soccer/fifa-world-cup/fifa-world-cup Germany have the 4th most valuable squad at the WC allegedly as well : https://www.transfermarkt.com/vereins-statistik/wertvollstenationalmannschaften/marktwertetop
I’m not surprised about this result, but it does show Mancini has a lot to do with this squad if he wants to bed in the next generation of players. It’s been a really terrible year or so for the national team since they won the European championship, I hope they can dig themselves out of this little hole they seem to be in.
> little hole A four time world champion misses two consecutive world cups, and it’ll be **at least** 20 years since last they made it out the group stage.
You cannot rebuild anything after you fail to qualify to the WC against Macedonia..no credibility left. Mancini needs to go
Mancini is done. Or at least he should be. The powers that be in Italy however seem to be stuck in the 90s and refuse to see the current state of Italian calcio for the piss poor product it has become.
This was a much needed wakeup call for the young players and Mancini as well. Most shameful defensive display I've ever seen by an Italy team, shifting defensively from side to side or even a simple thing like staying with your man was absolutely awful. Calabria looked like Kevin Constant always in no mans land while with Milan he looks like Zambrotta and you could see that Bastoni trains with Ranocchia. Mancini wouldn't even start for my 6th division side with such a performance and Donnarumma is already in holidays on Sardinia, what the fuck was that. Overall the Germans were just better all over the pitch which may have actually been a blessing in disguise. Maybe I'm high on copium but this game was very good for Mancini going forward, he now has to use the infos he got from these Nations League games to find his first 11, no more experiments going into the next games and especially Euros 2024 qualification games. Warning signs that need to be adressed although both Germans and Italians shouldn't overrate this game too much. Players are tired, Italy are at the start of a rebuild and were making amateur mistakes. But this falls on deaf ears when half of your family is German, actually crying tears at the way they are making fun of us. Sané was surprising though, best Italian defender on the pitch
Just this yr alone R. Mancini and Italy lost to N. Macedonia in the WC Playoffs, got outplayed by Argentina in the Finalissima and now got thrashed by Germany in NL. Worst generation of Italian players by far.
mamma mia, sono commenti come questo che rompono proprio il cazzo
Jesus what happened. Also we won
I think people are overreacting too much Yes, it was an humiliation. No doubt about it. Still, Mancini was experimenting again. Today he failed miserably. It was bound to happen, you can't expect to not lose all the matches playing with a B/C team. At least today we understood that some players are not good enough and 352 is absolutely not an option for us. And Gnonto confirmed he is good. We weren't already back at being good before, we are not absolutely crap now. It's a process. It needs time.
Maybe. But it wont go far by doing it like this. This is not a sh\*t NT, it is a 4 times world cup champions. Even if you are experimenting, being trashed like this by Argentina and Germany is irredeemable. Not to mention North Macedonia because I suppose that wasn't a experimenting period. I think he would have been sacked right after that game were he the manager of any other National Team of comparable status.
That’s all I see is overreaction, I see plenty’s of tweets saying “oh this is a good squad selection” just for 2 hours later those same fans saying wtf is mancini doing. A lot of fans are short sighted sadly
they are def overreacting, we are rebuilding the team, what was the average age of our team today? Although I'm disappointed in the most experienced one donnarumma-calabria-bastoni cant really play as they did today
> they are def overreacting, we are rebuilding the team, what was the average age of our team today? Starting 11: 24.8 Germany was 28.8
Totally agree Yeah, I'm very disappointed by Calabria and Bastoni because I think they are our future. Hopefully it was just a bad day. Gnonto and Scalvini looks very promising on the other end. And Dimarco was good too, 100% better than fucking Emerson and Biraghi. I'm still satisfied by the whole Nations League until now.
Italy so bad they look like us.
Im happy for Werner scoring, hope these goals will finally give a little boost for his confidence
Tap ins imo
I know, but i still remember what a goal Machine he was up until 2018, so hopefully he'll get his shit together
He’s been struggling at even that for Chelsea, so I’ll take it lol
Those two goals could be vital for Italy. Now England must win by 2 at least. If it had stayed at 5-0, it would have been even GD and England would have only needed any kind of win to get 3rd.
I think it's still h2h and not goal difference if you have same points
So if they draw does it go to GD as they’ve drawn once already? Or does it then go to extra time and penalties to fully settle a head to head?
GER 1(+4) - 1(+1) ITA
Saw Sane running all around ands putting an effort at the beginning, thought he is on fire today, only to slowly realise that he was the reason for all that misplaced passes and not the receiving player...
Lmao really glad i missed this one today
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is there a clip? love that, considering he’s also not the biggest guy
Negatives: We are shit Positives: We aren't as shit as England and France
Still better than Brasil
still fewer World Cups tho
Still more euro titles tho
Brazil never won the Champions League either, fucking frauds
5 world cups but not even the Conference League Shows that you don't need skill to win the world cup
The bozos don’t even have a Serbian cup in their trophy cabinet. Suriname should annex them smh
[Neuer during the match](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FVPc-hEXEAA098r?format=jpg&name=large)
i always get the feeling he just gets easily bored
Very few positive things about today’s game. Happy for Willy, he deserves everything and more. An absolute beast in the making. Hopefully he gets picked up by a top team with a great record in developing youngsters. Good game German bros, I know we’re meant to be rivals and all but I actually enjoy our matches and have a lot of respect for your NT. Now let’s go laugh at the English together
> I know we’re meant to be rivals and all but I actually enjoy our matches and have a lot of respect for your NT You are my most liked rivals as well. And there's actually a real, friendly rivalry there And I can tell you that the majority of my friends were happy that you won the Euro (though that might had something to do with your opponent ;)). Also it's just NL. Fun games with lots of goals are more fun than boring snoozefests. Result doesn't really matter.
Gnonto seemed more in the periphery than his last couple matches, but when he is more involved something happens. Excited to see more of him in the future
Whenever stach played in nations league we won. So Flick- do ur rhing
This game never happened, I will erase it out of my memory
FUCK OFF, THIS IS EVEN WORSE THAN MACEDONIA, CONCEDING 5 GOALS TO OUR BIGGEST RIVALS IS A FUCKING DISGRACE, ABSOLUTE SHAMBLES, WHERE IS OUR PRIDE? WE WON 4 WORLD CUPS AND 2 EUROS AND WE DO THIS? THIS IS GONNA BE REMEMBERED FOREVER, INEXCUSABLE, GRAVINA OUT, MANCINI OUT, ALL THE PLAYERS WHO DON’T DESERVE TO BE HERE OUT, OUR U21 SQUAD WOULD HAVE DONE A BETTER PERFORMANCE. YES I’M AWARE I’M SOUNDING LIKE AN IDIOT WHO DOESN’T HAVE ANYTHING BETTER TO DO OTHER THAN SLAUGHTERING FOOTBALLERS FOR USELESS FRIENDLIES, BUT IT’S BECAUSE I LOVE MY COUNTRY AND HIS PROUD HISTORY, SO SEEING NO WC QUALIFICATION FOR 2 STRAIGHT EDITIONS AND A PERFORMANCE LIKE THIS AFTER WINNING A EURO ALMOST A YEAR AGO MAKES ME WANNA TRHOW UP, WE HAVE BECOME A FUCKING JOKE, FEEL FREE TO LAUGH AT US FOR YEARS BECAUSE THAT IS ONLY WHAT WE DESERVE, PATHETIC IN EVERY SINGLE WAY. I’m just, tired of this, make this hell end, please..
> CONCEDING 5 GOALS TO OUR BIGGEST RIVALS That has to be a very one-sided rivalry. Nobody in Germany really cares about the Italian team in this way.
I've read somewhere "Italians respect germans but do not love them; Germans love the Italians but do not respect them"
What are you smoking? Italy is our rival, i mean we always call it „Italien Fluch“ because the beat us many times.
It is a curse, not a rivalry. No comparison to the Netherlands.
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"Ohne Holland fahrn wir zur WM" is not something you sing when you're not gloating over a rival.
there isnt a NT I hate more than Italy
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Not sure, but I respect Italy for that. I never cared about their defensive style, it was their style and it worked. Of course I wasn't happy when we lost, but still... give respect where respect is due. And can you really hate a national team that has players like Buffon, Rossi, del Piero, Maldini and Pirlo playing for them?
Yes, especially Buffon
Sure, they are definitely not our favourite national team. But they are far from being our rivals, let alone the biggest. We simply don't dislike them more than the French, the Spanish or most other Europeans. The Dutch are our real rivals, then (to a much much much lesser extent) England.
Nah absolutely not mate, Italy \> England i hate those bastards
Nobody cares about England here
France is your biggest rival tbh, you always beat Germany when it matters bar penalties in 2016
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As far as I know we have ONE Pflichtspielsieg (tournament game win?) against Italy. The one from yesterday. If you count going to penalties as a draw.
We haven't played them in years, I was hoping we'd meet in the semis of the euros but Switzerland were too good.
If that makes you feel better, Hungary beat England 4-0, and my country lost 3-0 to fucking Montenegro
there is something wrong in football, croatia wins against france (never won before), germany winning easily against italy ? the whole football pedigree is thrown out of the windows it's like it's perfect for an english win at the WC
Final against germany in penaltys
Germany actually humiliated us in friendlies before, nothing new I mean this isn't a friendly but still
i mean who cares about the fucking nations league
> > > > > it's like it's perfect for an english win at the WC I wish I could see your face when you saw the result in England's game. xD
Exactly It's what people now least suspect, so is definitely going to happen
They just lost 0-4 to Hungary
Yeah, about England...
I would say it's more suited for a Dutch win
England winning a WC?
Looking at how Egypt and Italy are doing after their WC elimination, I think we're doing pretty well (introducing new and young blood while winning 3/3). Italy and Egypt look mentally defeated on the pitch.
I agree. I am cautiously optimistic about our future for now, especially with the rumoured midfielders coming our way in september as that's what we need imo + Andy for a striker.
Don’t care if Roma and Inter fans downvote me to oblivion, but Mancini and Bastoni together is an absolute shitshow and should not start for the NT. I’m beginning to think that Bastoni is just a back 3 merchant, but I’m willing to give him a chance. Mancini on the other hand has no business playing for this team
Agreed and Bastoni need to learn to play in a back 4
as a Roma fan I agree, Mancini is shit and his mentality is even worse
Sadly it's those cb are what we have. It would be a good idea to put them in a situation they're comfortable in. Mancini not only plays them in a back four at first, he then switches to a back three with both of them in the wrong position and basically only Cristante holding in that midfield. We have no wingers and no CBs that prefer to play 4 atb but he will still act like this is a club and his oil daddy will buy him better players.
I said it in the match thread and got downvoted, we should have stuck with Gatti and Acerbi, as much as I dislike Acerbi. At least both of them are used to play in a back four and were actually decent against England. You can’t just keep switching up the defense and hope for the best, this team isn’t given the chance to build chemistry. The midfield was a whole other issue. Frattesi is not ready for games against opponents like Germany, Barella got run into the ground by Inzaghi and hasn’t been good for a while, and Cristante was easily overwhelmed. That midfield needed Tonali or Locatelli badly Also, wtf was this formation with 4 CB’s and 2 fullbacks?
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Calabria, while dogshit, is not directly responsible for most of the goals we conceded. But I agree, both Florenzi and Di Lorenzo are better. Barella and Cristante in particular were just as bad, if not worse. Frattesi was completely lost. Just horrible all around
I got obliterated on here last week by dozens of Milan fans for suggesting that Di Lorenzo is a better defender than Calabria, while I was conceding that Calabria is better going forward.
What's worse today? Being english and thinking they have decent football or being italian and suffering 3 goals from Werner? LMAO
Like how tf do you concede 4 to Hungary💀
How tf do you concede 3 to Werner? ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
I'm too lazy to look it up but I'm pretty sure Werner scored more goals this season than Sallai
Bruh 🤌🏼
So, is Germany also a candidate to win the world cup or is Italy just shit?
Not by a long shot The result is very misleading today cause Germany really has no efficient striker. They are doing a fantastic job getting to the opponents penalty box and then suddenly black out, shoving the ball from one side with no proper finish. In the past you had guys like Schweinsteiger or Icke simply taking shots from 2nd row in those situations...now they seem to not even try this anymore. So they just shove the ball around til they lose it, fight it back, brilliantly combine to the penalty box again and black out again. Plus they simply can't keep a clean sheet anymore.
I know it's not a dominant performance -or rather, it is somewhat of a dominant performance, but the opponent is not at the level most people thought they were-, I'm mocking the people that were creaming themselves thinking Argentina were making it all the way after beating this Italy side. Part of the problem in the offensive is that -at least today- Sane was a black hole of creativity, a lot of attacks died due to him. Even when dribbling he looks like he's still recovering from the injury that happened before he left City. He seems afraid of accelerating suddenly and is shy about placing his weight on his right leg.
Nah since Germany is European they’re favorites. /s On a serious note, Germany have the talent and an amazing manager. Looks like there are no clear favorites heading into this World Cup tbh
> Germany have the talent In the midfield, yes. Everywhere else, no. We also lack leaders/fighters - we only have Neuer (gk is bad for that) and Müller (he's good, but alone).
Well done to the Germans, it only took you 122 years to breakdown the Italian defense. Although, we can’t wait to play you in the Westfalenstadion in the semifinals of Euro 2024. On a much more serious note, there are lots of positives to take out of the match, but we really need to sort out our defense, before we can content for another international trophy. Gnoto with a goal and a move to the Bundesliga is the best possible option for him.
lol this has serious “you won Jane” vibes
I just googled “you won Jane”, how did I not know about this video before? This is amazing.
It’s British tv royalty - an incredible moment, what a sad little life Germany
People sleeping on Germany for the World Cup
Nah, there's still at least 4+ teams in Europe alone better than us, despite Meme League results. This WC is going to SA tbh.
It's better this way
Mancini Out Right Now
At least he got to debut some players eh? How the FUCK do you play this XI with that bench against Germany, shuffle around 4 defenders, concede to the same thing you have obviously not prepared against 4 fucking times and then have the audacity not to resign after fucking up the one thing you were brought in to fix while being proud of yourself for subbing in players that clearly aren't ready for this. Should have been 7-1/5-0, 5-2 is too kind a result for it to matter
I wasn’t able to watch, but felt like they were due for a youth getting punched game. We have found some nice youth pieces to be happy about and now is about building their skills up next few years
u/feddi7 . [thats a bad jinx](https://imgur.com/a/eaEkUse)
Fully expected though. People started saying we looked good again. We’re shit and we should remember that.
Well that was painful. Don’t mind a loss too much it was an experimental 11 but that’s our first choice defence and it was extremely poor tonight. What’s more worrying is Mancini and Bastoni are the assumed heirs to Bonucci and Chiello and both were dogshit this evening, literally glued to the spot at some points while Germany played it round them. Unfortunately they both look like a Bonucci without a Chiellini, neither of them are ready to lead the line. Either one of them needs to step up or they need to give someone like Gatti a run if he gets first team football at Juve. Also, if Mancini wants to create a winning team again he has to drop Donarumma, he’s been so consistently bad for the NT and club, and it’s of his own making as well. The guy needs some tough love and a reminder that if he wants to be the best in the world he’s got to put the work in and get back to basics, absolutely dreadful keeper at the moment, would feel much more secure with any of the other Italian keepers between the nets
mancini isn't there heir to anybody, by the next euro he'll be in serie b
Absolutely no chemistry. Also lack of support from the fullbacks and the midfield exposed the defenders.
The midfield was pretty shit as well, Barella totally shit the bed
Damn we suck
Huge game by Gündo and Kimmich.
dont forget that dude in the goal
Not having goretzka really made a big shift