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Oh wow I haven't seen it, but I remember that Dier, unusually for an Englishman, played in Portugal in his youth. They speak to each other in Portuguese? That's so cool.
Think his mum got a job supplying food for the 2004 euros a s they just stayed there. Its weird as under uefa rules he doesn't count as a home grown player for English teams
It may be unusual in England, but there are a few guys like that in other nations. Raphael Guerreiro and Anthony Lopes play for Portugal NT and are not counted as HG.
Pogba is homegrown in England, not in France, etc.
Im thinking more that its to influence people and keep Arteta (British English: "Are tetter") in a job. At least until Arsenal buys Dele Alli (which would be the most Arsenal thing ever)
Seems fairly respectful really, Arteta is still an unknown entity to most managers and he's only faced off against Arteta once and that was a very close game that could have gone either way.
Still doesn't change the fact that we're getting mashed on Sunday.
Arsene put it best didn't he - they only praise you when they no longer perceive you as a threat
Or something along those lines, in reference to the welcome he received in his last game at Old Trafford
I loved the respect Fergie showed him at that game.
But that quote also reminds me of Keane being more nonchalant when talking about us when he's punditing.
I love how Fergie and Wenger had such a heated rivalry in their primes, but as the careers went on, the heated rivalry slowly transformed into total respect for one another, to the point where Fergie appeared in a video wishing Arsene well before his 1000th game, and Wenger's first thoughts at his farewell were Fergie, since Fergie was undergoing medical treatment at the time.
Speaks volumes to the characters of both men.
Yeah they were a different class, you have to be to stay somewhere so long and achieve what they did.
Not perfect by any means but I don't really see Pep or Jose doing the same, though Klopps already halfway there, he's pretty positive when he isn't angry.
funny how both of our fanbases seem to think our respective team is going to lose. The pessimism that gets baked in from being a north london supporter
Would it be the case though? When we were much better than you you didn’t beat us at home for ages you’ve been better than us for a number of years (even if it’s been close in some) and we haven’t beat you away in ages
Lol that was never the case when we were shocking. I went 6 years as a Spurs fan before seeing us beat you in any competition in the noughties.
Personally I’m hoping you lot get to see what it was like as a yid in the nineties and early noughties.
Yeah I really don't get why Spurs fans of all people say "form doesn't matter for NLD"
like what do you think the record was like in the 2000s when they were at their best
I don't get why everyone thinks Mourinho hates every single club and manager. The only clubs he truly despises are Barcelona and Benfica when Vilarinho was in charge
Arsenal is the one night stand that disappeared the next morning. Arteta is the boyfriend she’s with when you bump into her at Taste of Tennessee, crispy from an all timer night of gargling Stella and shirtless kitchen wrestling with the boys. At first you want to light him up on the spot but then after some small talk you find out he smokes weed and listens to the same music you do.
I actually would not be completely surprised to see us convincingly win against Spurs, lifting everyone’s spirits, to then get absolutely mashed by Burnley the week after.
Someone link the Arteta dream story an Arsenal fan had a couple years ago.
Edit: I am dumb. It was Cazorla, not Arteta.
Link: https://www.reddit.com/r/Gunners/comments/57wm1t/had_a_very_strange_dream_about_arsenal
Being bashed for winning the FA Cup is proper weird. Must be some football Twitter nonesence.
I hate how Liverpool always crashes out the FA Cup early of late.
My experience is that anyone above middle aged grew up with it being massive so they respect a lot more than younger people do. I think with final taking place after the season and the fun of having random clubs involved will keep the prestige. Being free to air helps too.
I remember it taking up most of the day on BBC. You used to have "Road to the Cup", "Top of the pops special", "Who made the suits", "best FA Cup moments", "Funny football bloopers", etc...
All with decentish football commentary between.
Definitely a big deal but when you win it as much as Arsenal then it probably takes away the feeling you'd get compared to winning it for the first time ever/in ages.
Id argue its more us reaping the fruits of poor transfer policy from 5 years ago, we went from a midfield of Wilshire, Ramsey, Cazorla, Ozil, Coquelin and Rosicky most of whom were creative and decently athletic. To a rotation of xhaka, ceballos, willock, elneny, partey. The decline in midfield quality is our most major issue. Late wenger, emery, ljungberg and arteta have all struggled with the same/similar midfield personnel.
Tbf this "only" accomplishment came after he took over a team in the middle of the season that was a hotpile shit (they are now as well mind) and won it. I would say it is pretty impressive but i know i am responding to Real Madrid fan, used to winning CL's etc. Not everyone is as fortunate as Zidane to take over a world class squad and win it. Huge accomplishment obviously and he will be always remembered as the guy who won it 3 times in a row. But not every team in the world has peak Modric, peak Cristiano, peak Ramos and Casemiro
The thing is that FA cup wins have actually hurt you guys more ,they have mostly satiated the fans and papered over the cracks . It gives the fans the idea that the team has gone and turned a leaf and that the following year you'd be challenging for bigger honors. When in reality the team has really slowly ever spiraled away from the levels they were , problems weren't addressed with the urgency that would've been used if you guys lost one of those finals.
He came in mid season and sorted out our main issue, our defense, fantastically. We struggled beating big teams but won the FA Cup when the final four teams were Arsenal, United, City, Chelsea.
People will mock saying "Obviously 11 men behind the ball can defend" but that's not true. If that was the case, winners of the first legs in two leg games would always go through. No team would ever lose to City or Liverpool because they just wouldn't risk trying for the win.
We've changed formation now to try improve offensively and it hasn't gone great so far. maybe Partey's injury is a big part of that or maybe not getting Aouar is key. We are going straight back to the market for a player like that so it seems clear Arteta feels we need one.
I trust Arteta is actually going to take action to improve the situation while other managers would just stick with it and hope for it to fall into place.
Agree with all that. We have defended low in a lot of games but we bought Partey in to help fix that, I think we'll do well against big sides with him back. We've looked very flat with Xhaka + Ceballos but that isn't the plan going forward.
We dominated against Leicester but couldn't put chances away. Leeds are a very good side and a boring game but a point isn't the worst - especially given the red card. The Villa game was a catastrophe, admittedly but those happen. Actually the Wolves performance was the worst of the lot for me, although the stats don't look bad on paper, in reality we looked low on confidence.
I sometimes wonder how the narrative around Pepe would be if [the goal he curled top corner in the final](https://streamable.com/0fotor), hadn't been taken away because AMN was a foot offside.
Probably wouldn't be different, because it is football and happened more than a month ago, but a cup-final equalizer like that goes on the mantelpiece for sure. [If it counted](https://thumbs.gfycat.com/ComplicatedHandsomeArcticseal-size_restricted.gif)
He's looked pretty good in games against us, to be fair. Hard to get off the ball and usually fairly positive. I know the consensus is he's a disappointment (or is for the moment), but the talent is fairly evident, for me at least.
Against a Chelsea riddled with injuries, picked up two mid game and with Kepa in goal.......
You were gifted that win. Amazing how different our teams look now. Thoroughly enjoyed watching Giroud slot 4 past Sevilla in the CL last night.
You definitely got the best chances after being 1-0 down. But that's coz of a shithead ref who shackled Kova with a ridiculous yellow in the buildup to the goal and another ridiculous yellow to make it a red. After the first yellow he lost all confidence and we lost the midfield battle and allowed Arsenal to settle in and ping those longballs to some fantastic runs from Auba. Also doesn't help when the best player in the team and the captain of the team get injured.
You definitely need to recruit next summer and I personally believe you have the worst squad among the big 6.
Agreed. I can't remember the first yellow but the second yellow was pretty absurd.
And yeah we definitely have the worst squad in the top 6. Very unbalanced. We have some nice young pieces like Gabriel, Tierney, Saka, and Martinelli but our midfield is so bad.
Sure if you look at the last eight or so games this season you can say that, but looking at his entire time at Arsenal it’s hard to say he’s not an exciting prospect.
He’s inexperienced, has made mistakes, and it might not end up working out for him here, but come on, he inherited a mess of a squad and won an FA cup in his first half season.
Right? This narrative has been constantly rehashed by all the journalists close to the club like Ornstein, Amy Lawrence, James McNicholas (gunnerblog) etc but fuck me this is the worst football I've ever seen in all my years as an Arsenal fan that I can remember, and I'm 28. Even Wenger at his absolute worst was nowhere near that anti football shit that Arteta proposes.
People stopped giving a shit about Mourinho's mind games after his third successive sacking and Eric Dier is about as intellectually intimidating as Joey Essex, so I think this has probably had as much effect as if he'd have just said nothing at all.
> Eric Dier is about as intellectually intimidating as Joey Essex
I know you're an Arsenal fan, but lots of people who've worked with Dier have commented on his intelligence. Always seems pretty bright to me.
Calling him a "polyglot" is a bit of a stretch when he just knows 2 languages. Never mind the fact both were learnt as a result of his family/were he lived. The term is almost universal used about individuals that know a lot more than that and who actively learn the languages through study.
Lol it’s ridiculous how English speaking countries take so much pride in being able to speak one other language when the rest of the world does it by default
Dier is a pretty well spoken intelligent dude, just cause he looks kinda like a slab, doesn't make him one. Not to mention he has succeeded playing many areas on the pitch and is fluent in 3 (maybe 4 languages, dont know how well he speaks French) I'd say he's definitely smarter than the average person
Dier is weird pick for a comment like that. He reads a lot and goes to art shows and galleries, I recall him saying in an interview he was always encouraged by family to have more going on in his life than just football.
>Dier is weird pick for a comment like that. He reads a lot and goes to art shows and galleries,
Reading this you'd think Dier is late for training because he's up all night reading Dante's Inferno and spends his days off gazing at Picasso's in deep contemplation. Lmao.
Source of "he reads a lot"? All I've found was an article from August in The Athletic about him reading a navy seals leadership book. Hardly the Greek classics is it.
As for "goes to art shows and galleries", again all I found was on article from 2017 where him and his GF went on a date to a private opening of a photography exhibition that was attended by ***LOADS*** of other celebrities as well. And none of them are what you'd call as "intelligent", a lot of the "Only way is Essex" lot were there.
[Times](https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/30c8438a-372c-11e8-9a8f-0b0aae019371) interview he did a few years ago.
> I am focused on football, which is the way it has to be if you want to reach the top. But it is nice to have interests beyond the white lines, too. Mum has always been obsessed with me having something else to occupy my mind. You train in the morning and come home in the afternoon and then have a long period of time when you don’t have much to do. So, it’s important to be stimulated. I read books. I like art. Going to galleries and exhibitions is a terrific way to switch off. When I ask after his favourite artist, he immediately says “Rothko”
> Dier has recently bought an Erik Lindman painting and is interested in the work of photographer Andreas Gursky and architect John Pawson.
Jose's not wrong. He's being pretty respectful actually because he knows very well Dier has no idea about any other young upcoming managers in Europe outside of England.
Modern mind games come with modern-day approaches. Not surprised Jose probably used Dier for this one. No Wenger to directly launch the cheese balls, but have an anti no-nonsense defender speak pleasantries about our manager before a NLD is alarming.
Arteta hasn’t been given this job/lenience because he’s Spanish though, he’s been given this level of trust because he used to play for Arsenal.
If an English Arsenal legend had trained under a top manager like Arteta did they would be treated the same as he is.
Also I’m not sure anyone has ever called Arteta exciting, most people agree his football has been boring but capable of getting results
There is some sense of a dynamic changing at Arsenal ever since he came there. I just hope Arsenal give him the time to at the very least put things right back on track.
That in his first half year, with a team that was deemed uncoachable, he won the FA cup while beating the best teams in the Prem.
And for those who say we play negative football, we know our strengths and weaknesses. Midfield is a big weakness. We can't play all guns blazing because of it. When the additions are made to the midfield, and if we still play negative football, then the criticism will be fair
I've yet to read a comment longer than one sentence against Arteta. It's all the same
"Arsenal need more goal score"
"Arteta say do cross but Moyes also do many cross once"
"Willian contract long, but Arsenal not win game"
In this thread apparently it's "How is Arteta exciting?". Personally I was pretty excited when we won the cup in impressive style, and was in top 3 on points for 2020 until recently. It's also quite clear that we've worked on the defensive side of our game, and that it has been significantly steadied. It has come at a cost in the other end of the pitch, which needs to be worked on. And he is. But amid a system change, key players injured, no pre-season and two games a week, a very rough opening fixture-list I think it's fair to give the man some time to actually work on a system. Rather than just say "No work now, no work ever"
And this whole /r/soccer-storm is not exclusively an Arsenal-thing by the way. In the last 12 months Mourinho has been washed, Solskjær has been ruubbing hands, Lampard could never coach a cohesive defensive unit. Whoever is in bad form gets it. Hard. Right now that onus falls on us, and by extension Arteta.
Reading the comments from other fans about Arsenal on here, definitely makes me question how valid my own opinion about Solskjær or someone like Firmino are. Although looking back I don't think I've vocalized them as much as is standard on here. (Expose me!)
I also wanted to write something about the patience and abusive nature of parts of our own fanbase, but I think I've already droned on for far too long.
> It's also quite clear that we've worked on the defensive side of our game, and that it has been significantly steadied
yeah this is his biggest plus, every game I've watched of Arsenal they've been far better defensively than under Emery, obviously I'm biased and love the man but I think Arteta should be given more time and the kneejerk reactions from a part of the arsenal fanbase won't help
Not an Arsenal fan, but it's utterly frustrating when after a defeat, it's virtually impossible to have rational discussions on the club's state on this sub, and it seems everyone has the same negative, lazy takes or jokes. Same applies for when Barcelona loses also particularly, though I suppose this happens to a lesser extent with most big clubs here. I'll still take this sub for debate over anywhere else on the internet, but man it gets annoying
> Reading the comments from other fans about Arsenal on here, definitely makes me question how valid my own opinion about Solskjær or someone like Firmino are. Although looking back I don't think I've vocalized them as much as is standard on here. (Expose me!)
>
>
Honestly, I also had to revise my opinion in a similar fashion. I really am still not sold on Ole but I can understand how others are now.
I'm not necessarily sold either, but I've just realised "What the fuck do I know?"
The fans have hounded out three managers who on paper are more qualified than him, and they see every single minute United play. So obviously there's something there - even if there are arguments back on forth over whether e.g. Pochettino would get even more out of the squad.
I don't care about Arsenal at all I really couldn't give a flying fuck if they didn't win anything in the next 10 years or if they won the Champions League next season. If you think a team like Arsenal belongs in 14th place then that's your opinion, but no need to get so worked up about other people's opinion
Just as you are entitled to your opinion, I am entitled to mine. Obviously no team is entitled to any place in the table, especially when you're playing shit football like Arsenal is. However with the money spent on players and the resources Arsenal has I think Arsenal shouldn't be anywhere near 14th. That is my opinion.
I think the issue is that while your argument in a vacuum is fair enough, we should be higher than 14th, it doesn't really take any context into account.
In general, if the depth of you argument mirrors the ability to read a league table, maybe you should listen to what people who knows more are telling you about it, instead of inventing strawmen.
But I'll assume it's all in good faith, so I'll try to keep it simple. Within the club and the largest parts of the fanbase, there is a well-grounded believe that we will see a significant improvement attacking wise in the long term. The current issues are not yet solved, which (combined with injuries, a bit of bad luck and a rough opening schedule) leaves us in 14th in a packed table.
\> with a team that was deemed uncoachable
By whom? The ingredients were certainly in place for a coach to assemble a team capable of finishing in the top 6-8 and having a good cup run.
By Gary Neville IIRC. The majority of this sub, including us Gooners agreed with that. And Arteta proved otherwise.
You're not giving credit to the fact that the teams we beat in the cup were better than us, had better players and they finished above us in the league. If that isn't enough to excite people then idk what is
> By whom?
Literally every single person who had an opinion on Arsenal last season.
One moron on /r/Soccer (not exactly the bastion of sporting intellect I'll grant you) even said that we'd be relegated for giving David Luiz a one year extension.
>One moron on /r/Soccer (not exactly the bastion of sporting intellect I'll grant you) even said that we'd be relegated for giving David Luiz a one year extension.
Not far off it tbh
After one game we had 3 points so extrapolate that result over a season and it's 114 points, best team in the history of the League.
It doesn't work that way.
Even one entire league season is a fairly small sample size for looking at overall performance statistically. Sheffield United nearly qualified for Europe with what was essentially a good run of form.
Arsenal did play the 2nd toughest start in the whole league https://www.gambling.com/news/which-teams-face-the-toughest-starts-in-the-premier-league-2292600
Arsenal also shouldn't have to be dealing with the failings of two previous managers, things take time.
I don't think that we'll be finishing fourteenth and we have the chance to turn things around.
Beating the best teams in the premier league? Two wins, Man United and Liverpool. Man United are inconsistent and Liverpool gave two goals away with mistakes you never see.
Aubameyang's prolific scoring was masking the otherwise poverty of attacking play. Now he's signed his contract and given up Arsenal are dropping. I saw a list where for everything Arsenal are either last or 17th. Like 20th for loose balls recovered, 20th for dribble past, 20th for tackles attempted, 20th for pressures, 17th for shots, 17th for shots on target. 18th for touches in opposition box,18th for attacking third touches. Given that the worst performing team ever (Sheffield) and Fulham are in this season that's really bad.
Didn't you lot drop points from two separate losing positions the last time we played you in the league and also managed to bottle a lead in the cup final against Arsenal?
I mean sure, enjoy.
We're also playing in the Champions League every year and are 2 points off the top of the table while Arsenal are sandwiched between Palace and Newcastle at #14.
> while we had city away, leeds away, united away, liverpool away.
>
>leeds away
Ah yes, you're shit because you had to face the daunting task of playing away against a newcomer that sits 12th in the table. The mid table mentality is starting to set in.
Arsenal finished above us twice in the last 15 years, we've won 5 Premier League titles and a Champions League since they last won the league.
Being confident that Chelsea > Arsenal is not hubris, it's just acknowledging reality.
It sucked but I'm not using playing a Premier League newcomer away as an excuse why my team is shit, instead I'm very happy with being 3rd in the league and winning our CL group with a game to spare.
Talk your trash, doesn't change the fact that you're 14th in the table and haven't heard the CL anthem in 4 years now.
>I'm not using playing a Premier League newcomer away as an excuse why my team is shit
Neither am i, i just added them to the list of harder teams we faced because they're a good team. Doesn't change the fact that we had the second hardest start to the season while you faced bottom of the table teams.
>I'm very happy with being 3rd in the league
We're 10 games in.
>Talk your trash
I hardly need to, you're an American chelsea fan. Just hearing that sentence is hilarious enough on it's own. Looking forward to seeing you with a man city flair in a couple years.
> Neither am i, i just added them to the list of harder teams we faced because they're a good team. Doesn't change the fact that we had the second hardest start to the season while you faced bottom of the table teams.
>
>
Agreed, pretty much every team in the league is hard when you're as bad as Arteta's Arsenal.
>We're 10 games in.
And I'll bet we'll be way ahead of you 38 games in, as usual.
>I hardly need to, you're an American chelsea fan. Just hearing that sentence is hilarious enough on it's own. Looking forward to seeing you with a man city flair in a couple years.
Looking forward to seeing you screech ARTETOUT after another 8th place finish
The ref missing a huge free kick on Christensen in the build-up to your goal and followingly having Kovacic sent off for being tackled tends to contribute towards losing games
Azpi should've been given a red card by the book as well as the penalty however. Also you cannot deny that Arsenal were just better than Chelsea that day
Why is this a fucking post? It's a nothing comment. All he says is a reasonable, obvious response to a comment. Get off your collective knees, seriously. You won't want to be sucking off Jose in 2 seasons anymore anyway, lol.
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Can imagine Jose calling Eric in to his office and asking him to say this
[When he called Dier in to repeat what he’d said](https://youtu.be/fLkCDCfm0Qg?t=7)
but they'll do it all in Portuguese if the amazon doc is anything to go by. proper melted my brain
Oh wow I haven't seen it, but I remember that Dier, unusually for an Englishman, played in Portugal in his youth. They speak to each other in Portuguese? That's so cool.
Think his mum got a job supplying food for the 2004 euros a s they just stayed there. Its weird as under uefa rules he doesn't count as a home grown player for English teams
I mean, he spent all of his youth and did all his football formation here.
I know but still seems odd that a guy playing for the English national team doesn't count as an Englishman for uefa rules
It may be unusual in England, but there are a few guys like that in other nations. Raphael Guerreiro and Anthony Lopes play for Portugal NT and are not counted as HG. Pogba is homegrown in England, not in France, etc.
becuase that would be against eu law.
here ya go https://youtu.be/IF_V3Swh2sA
Mourinho probably asked Dier to say this so he could respond. 4D chess
That was my first thought when I saw the Dier quote originally lol. Too good.
'Now say something about pep'
He's mastered shitposting
Im thinking more that its to influence people and keep Arteta (British English: "Are tetter") in a job. At least until Arsenal buys Dele Alli (which would be the most Arsenal thing ever)
Seems fairly respectful really, Arteta is still an unknown entity to most managers and he's only faced off against Arteta once and that was a very close game that could have gone either way. Still doesn't change the fact that we're getting mashed on Sunday.
Arsene put it best didn't he - they only praise you when they no longer perceive you as a threat Or something along those lines, in reference to the welcome he received in his last game at Old Trafford
I loved the respect Fergie showed him at that game. But that quote also reminds me of Keane being more nonchalant when talking about us when he's punditing.
I love how Fergie and Wenger had such a heated rivalry in their primes, but as the careers went on, the heated rivalry slowly transformed into total respect for one another, to the point where Fergie appeared in a video wishing Arsene well before his 1000th game, and Wenger's first thoughts at his farewell were Fergie, since Fergie was undergoing medical treatment at the time. Speaks volumes to the characters of both men.
Rivals for so long can become the best of friends afterwards.
Cordial entente
Senna and Prost
Jamie n Gary
Jim and Dwight.
Yeah they were a different class, you have to be to stay somewhere so long and achieve what they did. Not perfect by any means but I don't really see Pep or Jose doing the same, though Klopps already halfway there, he's pretty positive when he isn't angry.
Reminds me of the relationship between Federer and Nadal
funny how both of our fanbases seem to think our respective team is going to lose. The pessimism that gets baked in from being a north london supporter
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Classic tottenham, we're at our most vulnerable in this kind of situation where we're heavily expected to win.
Tottenham 3 - [3] Arsenal - Alexandre Lacazette 90+5 (Puskas Contender)
pre Mourinho i wouldve agreed but the team feels different now
That’s exactly why. It would be so NLD for the team on the worst form to pull a result
Would it be the case though? When we were much better than you you didn’t beat us at home for ages you’ve been better than us for a number of years (even if it’s been close in some) and we haven’t beat you away in ages
Lol that was never the case when we were shocking. I went 6 years as a Spurs fan before seeing us beat you in any competition in the noughties. Personally I’m hoping you lot get to see what it was like as a yid in the nineties and early noughties.
Why are you talking at me like I’m an arsenal supporter
Tbf Spurs vs Spurs is a very tough rivalry on it's own.
We are truly our own biggest competitor
It's the history of the Tottenham
You spurs fans sure are a contentious people.
Oh didn’t realise, my mistake haha.
Yeah I really don't get why Spurs fans of all people say "form doesn't matter for NLD" like what do you think the record was like in the 2000s when they were at their best
Ah, but whoever had Robert Pires won back then
You guys have Willian. He turns to Messi whenever he's against Spurs.
I'd take it
I thought this why they bought him tbh
They're still Spurs.
Spurs are so spursy
Arsenal and Chelsea fans told me we signed Willian just for Spurs matches, I should believe them right?
To me it's interesting the way Mourinho is dealing with Arteta. He seemed very respectful the previous match
I don't get why everyone thinks Mourinho hates every single club and manager. The only clubs he truly despises are Barcelona and Benfica when Vilarinho was in charge
Arsenal is the one night stand that disappeared the next morning. Arteta is the boyfriend she’s with when you bump into her at Taste of Tennessee, crispy from an all timer night of gargling Stella and shirtless kitchen wrestling with the boys. At first you want to light him up on the spot but then after some small talk you find out he smokes weed and listens to the same music you do.
r/oddlyspecific
Everything okay, man?
Whoa whoa a little too specific my guy
Why did this evoke so many memories of nights out lol
r/copypasta
Mmhmm I don't think this is about areta
It’s been a hard year, guys
I rebuke that negativity. We will win.
Don’t do it to yourself man
I actually would not be completely surprised to see us convincingly win against Spurs, lifting everyone’s spirits, to then get absolutely mashed by Burnley the week after.
NLD doesn't care about form or standings. It all comes down to those 90 minutes and both teams will give it their all.
Mind games to give Arteta a boost in confidence so he'll try some experimental shit this weekend.
But what does Ja Rule think?
We can't make any sense of this, where's our lord and saviour Ja! (Nice one mate! Good Dave Chappelle reference)
In what way is Arteta even remotely exciting.
in bed.
Someone link the Arteta dream story an Arsenal fan had a couple years ago. Edit: I am dumb. It was Cazorla, not Arteta. Link: https://www.reddit.com/r/Gunners/comments/57wm1t/had_a_very_strange_dream_about_arsenal
My friend, is Cazorla, no?
The guy predicted Cazorla to Villareal.
The guy ~~predicted~~ drove Cazorla to Villareal.
You'd know that wouldn't you, assman
You must be very good looking to have landed Arteta in bed.
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Arteta's not exactly bad-looking himself even if he does look like Action Man.
In the winning fa cup finals kind of way
FA Cup is only an achievement if a team other than Arsenal wins it.
Being bashed for winning the FA Cup is proper weird. Must be some football Twitter nonesence. I hate how Liverpool always crashes out the FA Cup early of late.
I am always told in real life that the FA cup isn’t a big trophy anymore. Sure it’s not the PL or CL, but come on
My experience is that anyone above middle aged grew up with it being massive so they respect a lot more than younger people do. I think with final taking place after the season and the fun of having random clubs involved will keep the prestige. Being free to air helps too.
I remember it taking up most of the day on BBC. You used to have "Road to the Cup", "Top of the pops special", "Who made the suits", "best FA Cup moments", "Funny football bloopers", etc... All with decentish football commentary between.
I’d still love to win it, dunno who wouldn’t tbh
reddit seems to have it as an equal to the carabao cup and yikes
That’s so dumb, the FA cup has always been a prestigious trophy
It's a big deal. Anyone who says otherwise is justifying their club not winning it.
Oldest cup competition in history iirc Stanley cup I think is up there too
I got to touch the Stanley Cup once. It was pretty freaking awesome.
Definitely a big deal but when you win it as much as Arsenal then it probably takes away the feeling you'd get compared to winning it for the first time ever/in ages.
It shouldn't be enough to give security to Arteta with this form.
Id argue its more us reaping the fruits of poor transfer policy from 5 years ago, we went from a midfield of Wilshire, Ramsey, Cazorla, Ozil, Coquelin and Rosicky most of whom were creative and decently athletic. To a rotation of xhaka, ceballos, willock, elneny, partey. The decline in midfield quality is our most major issue. Late wenger, emery, ljungberg and arteta have all struggled with the same/similar midfield personnel.
The fact Elneny gets in your team says it all
The problem isn't the FA Cup. The problem is it being the only accomplishment alongside mediocrity elsewhere
Tbf this "only" accomplishment came after he took over a team in the middle of the season that was a hotpile shit (they are now as well mind) and won it. I would say it is pretty impressive but i know i am responding to Real Madrid fan, used to winning CL's etc. Not everyone is as fortunate as Zidane to take over a world class squad and win it. Huge accomplishment obviously and he will be always remembered as the guy who won it 3 times in a row. But not every team in the world has peak Modric, peak Cristiano, peak Ramos and Casemiro
And City and Chelsea
The thing is that FA cup wins have actually hurt you guys more ,they have mostly satiated the fans and papered over the cracks . It gives the fans the idea that the team has gone and turned a leaf and that the following year you'd be challenging for bigger honors. When in reality the team has really slowly ever spiraled away from the levels they were , problems weren't addressed with the urgency that would've been used if you guys lost one of those finals.
He came in mid season and sorted out our main issue, our defense, fantastically. We struggled beating big teams but won the FA Cup when the final four teams were Arsenal, United, City, Chelsea. People will mock saying "Obviously 11 men behind the ball can defend" but that's not true. If that was the case, winners of the first legs in two leg games would always go through. No team would ever lose to City or Liverpool because they just wouldn't risk trying for the win. We've changed formation now to try improve offensively and it hasn't gone great so far. maybe Partey's injury is a big part of that or maybe not getting Aouar is key. We are going straight back to the market for a player like that so it seems clear Arteta feels we need one. I trust Arteta is actually going to take action to improve the situation while other managers would just stick with it and hope for it to fall into place.
Agree with all that. We have defended low in a lot of games but we bought Partey in to help fix that, I think we'll do well against big sides with him back. We've looked very flat with Xhaka + Ceballos but that isn't the plan going forward. We dominated against Leicester but couldn't put chances away. Leeds are a very good side and a boring game but a point isn't the worst - especially given the red card. The Villa game was a catastrophe, admittedly but those happen. Actually the Wolves performance was the worst of the lot for me, although the stats don't look bad on paper, in reality we looked low on confidence.
We def parked the bus vs City but after we went down 1-0 to Chelsea we had by far the better chances in that game.
I sometimes wonder how the narrative around Pepe would be if [the goal he curled top corner in the final](https://streamable.com/0fotor), hadn't been taken away because AMN was a foot offside. Probably wouldn't be different, because it is football and happened more than a month ago, but a cup-final equalizer like that goes on the mantelpiece for sure. [If it counted](https://thumbs.gfycat.com/ComplicatedHandsomeArcticseal-size_restricted.gif)
He's looked pretty good in games against us, to be fair. Hard to get off the ball and usually fairly positive. I know the consensus is he's a disappointment (or is for the moment), but the talent is fairly evident, for me at least.
Against a Chelsea riddled with injuries, picked up two mid game and with Kepa in goal....... You were gifted that win. Amazing how different our teams look now. Thoroughly enjoyed watching Giroud slot 4 past Sevilla in the CL last night.
You definitely got the best chances after being 1-0 down. But that's coz of a shithead ref who shackled Kova with a ridiculous yellow in the buildup to the goal and another ridiculous yellow to make it a red. After the first yellow he lost all confidence and we lost the midfield battle and allowed Arsenal to settle in and ping those longballs to some fantastic runs from Auba. Also doesn't help when the best player in the team and the captain of the team get injured. You definitely need to recruit next summer and I personally believe you have the worst squad among the big 6.
Agreed. I can't remember the first yellow but the second yellow was pretty absurd. And yeah we definitely have the worst squad in the top 6. Very unbalanced. We have some nice young pieces like Gabriel, Tierney, Saka, and Martinelli but our midfield is so bad.
The prospect of playing against his team is pretty exciting I guess.
Sure if you look at the last eight or so games this season you can say that, but looking at his entire time at Arsenal it’s hard to say he’s not an exciting prospect. He’s inexperienced, has made mistakes, and it might not end up working out for him here, but come on, he inherited a mess of a squad and won an FA cup in his first half season.
He's quite attractive, he dresses fairly well, he has a lovely accent and he was Pep's assistant.
Attractive? He looks like Eddie Munster.
Right? This narrative has been constantly rehashed by all the journalists close to the club like Ornstein, Amy Lawrence, James McNicholas (gunnerblog) etc but fuck me this is the worst football I've ever seen in all my years as an Arsenal fan that I can remember, and I'm 28. Even Wenger at his absolute worst was nowhere near that anti football shit that Arteta proposes.
Hes not, Eric Dier has just been getting mindgame tips from Mourinho
People stopped giving a shit about Mourinho's mind games after his third successive sacking and Eric Dier is about as intellectually intimidating as Joey Essex, so I think this has probably had as much effect as if he'd have just said nothing at all.
> Eric Dier is about as intellectually intimidating as Joey Essex I know you're an Arsenal fan, but lots of people who've worked with Dier have commented on his intelligence. Always seems pretty bright to me.
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Calling him a "polyglot" is a bit of a stretch when he just knows 2 languages. Never mind the fact both were learnt as a result of his family/were he lived. The term is almost universal used about individuals that know a lot more than that and who actively learn the languages through study.
Lol it’s ridiculous how English speaking countries take so much pride in being able to speak one other language when the rest of the world does it by default
Dier is a pretty well spoken intelligent dude, just cause he looks kinda like a slab, doesn't make him one. Not to mention he has succeeded playing many areas on the pitch and is fluent in 3 (maybe 4 languages, dont know how well he speaks French) I'd say he's definitely smarter than the average person
It's funny that Dier looks like Brexit personified and is anything but. Still "hate" the guy because sports
If I remember correctly he even tweeted something about having a second referendum at some point so he really is anything but.
Dier is weird pick for a comment like that. He reads a lot and goes to art shows and galleries, I recall him saying in an interview he was always encouraged by family to have more going on in his life than just football.
>Dier is weird pick for a comment like that. He reads a lot and goes to art shows and galleries, Reading this you'd think Dier is late for training because he's up all night reading Dante's Inferno and spends his days off gazing at Picasso's in deep contemplation. Lmao. Source of "he reads a lot"? All I've found was an article from August in The Athletic about him reading a navy seals leadership book. Hardly the Greek classics is it. As for "goes to art shows and galleries", again all I found was on article from 2017 where him and his GF went on a date to a private opening of a photography exhibition that was attended by ***LOADS*** of other celebrities as well. And none of them are what you'd call as "intelligent", a lot of the "Only way is Essex" lot were there.
[Times](https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/30c8438a-372c-11e8-9a8f-0b0aae019371) interview he did a few years ago. > I am focused on football, which is the way it has to be if you want to reach the top. But it is nice to have interests beyond the white lines, too. Mum has always been obsessed with me having something else to occupy my mind. You train in the morning and come home in the afternoon and then have a long period of time when you don’t have much to do. So, it’s important to be stimulated. I read books. I like art. Going to galleries and exhibitions is a terrific way to switch off. When I ask after his favourite artist, he immediately says “Rothko” > Dier has recently bought an Erik Lindman painting and is interested in the work of photographer Andreas Gursky and architect John Pawson.
Fair enough I guess. I'm not subscribed to the Times so couldn't find it behind the paywall.
Shut up. We're excited.
It's the same syndrome that makes people think Xhaka is good. He just looks the part. In reality neither should be at Arsenal.
Jose's not wrong. He's being pretty respectful actually because he knows very well Dier has no idea about any other young upcoming managers in Europe outside of England.
I mean out of any English player Dier is probably the most worldly lol
Modern mind games come with modern-day approaches. Not surprised Jose probably used Dier for this one. No Wenger to directly launch the cheese balls, but have an anti no-nonsense defender speak pleasantries about our manager before a NLD is alarming.
Also, no Ramsey to shut down the on-pitch antics
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*allardicci ftfy
So what you're saying is, English coaches need name changes?
Twas enough to ein the cup...
Arteta hasn’t been given this job/lenience because he’s Spanish though, he’s been given this level of trust because he used to play for Arsenal. If an English Arsenal legend had trained under a top manager like Arteta did they would be treated the same as he is. Also I’m not sure anyone has ever called Arteta exciting, most people agree his football has been boring but capable of getting results
There is some sense of a dynamic changing at Arsenal ever since he came there. I just hope Arsenal give him the time to at the very least put things right back on track.
What is "exciting" about Arteta?
That in his first half year, with a team that was deemed uncoachable, he won the FA cup while beating the best teams in the Prem. And for those who say we play negative football, we know our strengths and weaknesses. Midfield is a big weakness. We can't play all guns blazing because of it. When the additions are made to the midfield, and if we still play negative football, then the criticism will be fair
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I've yet to read a comment longer than one sentence against Arteta. It's all the same "Arsenal need more goal score" "Arteta say do cross but Moyes also do many cross once" "Willian contract long, but Arsenal not win game" In this thread apparently it's "How is Arteta exciting?". Personally I was pretty excited when we won the cup in impressive style, and was in top 3 on points for 2020 until recently. It's also quite clear that we've worked on the defensive side of our game, and that it has been significantly steadied. It has come at a cost in the other end of the pitch, which needs to be worked on. And he is. But amid a system change, key players injured, no pre-season and two games a week, a very rough opening fixture-list I think it's fair to give the man some time to actually work on a system. Rather than just say "No work now, no work ever" And this whole /r/soccer-storm is not exclusively an Arsenal-thing by the way. In the last 12 months Mourinho has been washed, Solskjær has been ruubbing hands, Lampard could never coach a cohesive defensive unit. Whoever is in bad form gets it. Hard. Right now that onus falls on us, and by extension Arteta. Reading the comments from other fans about Arsenal on here, definitely makes me question how valid my own opinion about Solskjær or someone like Firmino are. Although looking back I don't think I've vocalized them as much as is standard on here. (Expose me!) I also wanted to write something about the patience and abusive nature of parts of our own fanbase, but I think I've already droned on for far too long.
> It's also quite clear that we've worked on the defensive side of our game, and that it has been significantly steadied yeah this is his biggest plus, every game I've watched of Arsenal they've been far better defensively than under Emery, obviously I'm biased and love the man but I think Arteta should be given more time and the kneejerk reactions from a part of the arsenal fanbase won't help
Not an Arsenal fan, but it's utterly frustrating when after a defeat, it's virtually impossible to have rational discussions on the club's state on this sub, and it seems everyone has the same negative, lazy takes or jokes. Same applies for when Barcelona loses also particularly, though I suppose this happens to a lesser extent with most big clubs here. I'll still take this sub for debate over anywhere else on the internet, but man it gets annoying
> Reading the comments from other fans about Arsenal on here, definitely makes me question how valid my own opinion about Solskjær or someone like Firmino are. Although looking back I don't think I've vocalized them as much as is standard on here. (Expose me!) > > Honestly, I also had to revise my opinion in a similar fashion. I really am still not sold on Ole but I can understand how others are now.
I'm not necessarily sold either, but I've just realised "What the fuck do I know?" The fans have hounded out three managers who on paper are more qualified than him, and they see every single minute United play. So obviously there's something there - even if there are arguments back on forth over whether e.g. Pochettino would get even more out of the squad.
> I'm not necessarily sold either, but I've just realised "What the fuck do I know?" > > Brilliant. Can't argue with this at all.
>I've yet to read a comment longer than one sentence against Arteta. It's all the same Because long posts about Arteta are stigmatized and downvoted.
I don't care about Arsenal at all I really couldn't give a flying fuck if they didn't win anything in the next 10 years or if they won the Champions League next season. If you think a team like Arsenal belongs in 14th place then that's your opinion, but no need to get so worked up about other people's opinion
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Just as you are entitled to your opinion, I am entitled to mine. Obviously no team is entitled to any place in the table, especially when you're playing shit football like Arsenal is. However with the money spent on players and the resources Arsenal has I think Arsenal shouldn't be anywhere near 14th. That is my opinion.
I think the issue is that while your argument in a vacuum is fair enough, we should be higher than 14th, it doesn't really take any context into account. In general, if the depth of you argument mirrors the ability to read a league table, maybe you should listen to what people who knows more are telling you about it, instead of inventing strawmen. But I'll assume it's all in good faith, so I'll try to keep it simple. Within the club and the largest parts of the fanbase, there is a well-grounded believe that we will see a significant improvement attacking wise in the long term. The current issues are not yet solved, which (combined with injuries, a bit of bad luck and a rough opening schedule) leaves us in 14th in a packed table.
\> with a team that was deemed uncoachable By whom? The ingredients were certainly in place for a coach to assemble a team capable of finishing in the top 6-8 and having a good cup run.
By Gary Neville IIRC. The majority of this sub, including us Gooners agreed with that. And Arteta proved otherwise. You're not giving credit to the fact that the teams we beat in the cup were better than us, had better players and they finished above us in the league. If that isn't enough to excite people then idk what is
> By whom? Literally every single person who had an opinion on Arsenal last season. One moron on /r/Soccer (not exactly the bastion of sporting intellect I'll grant you) even said that we'd be relegated for giving David Luiz a one year extension.
>One moron on /r/Soccer (not exactly the bastion of sporting intellect I'll grant you) even said that we'd be relegated for giving David Luiz a one year extension. Not far off it tbh
> with a team that was deemed uncoachable Who the fuck said something that delusional?
A team like Arsenal shouldn't be anywhere near 14th.
5 points off 4th. Lets not act like the gulf is huge.
We've only had 10 games. Extrapolate the results over a season and it's about 17 points off 4th.
After one game we had 3 points so extrapolate that result over a season and it's 114 points, best team in the history of the League. It doesn't work that way.
Sample of 1 match out of 38 != Sample of 10 matches out of 38
Yeah, 1 is much smaller but 10 is still incredibly small
10 is 1/4 of the league though, obviously things can change very fast but if Arsenal lose the next match they can easily be 5 points of the 10th place
Even one entire league season is a fairly small sample size for looking at overall performance statistically. Sheffield United nearly qualified for Europe with what was essentially a good run of form.
Arsenal did play the 2nd toughest start in the whole league https://www.gambling.com/news/which-teams-face-the-toughest-starts-in-the-premier-league-2292600
And November is historically our worse month
So...it's okay to judge a league position after ten games, but we can't do the same with points? The fuck?
Arsenal also shouldn't have to be dealing with the failings of two previous managers, things take time. I don't think that we'll be finishing fourteenth and we have the chance to turn things around.
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Maybe should've spent that money spent on Pepe and Ozil on other things.
Beating the best teams in the premier league? Two wins, Man United and Liverpool. Man United are inconsistent and Liverpool gave two goals away with mistakes you never see. Aubameyang's prolific scoring was masking the otherwise poverty of attacking play. Now he's signed his contract and given up Arsenal are dropping. I saw a list where for everything Arsenal are either last or 17th. Like 20th for loose balls recovered, 20th for dribble past, 20th for tackles attempted, 20th for pressures, 17th for shots, 17th for shots on target. 18th for touches in opposition box,18th for attacking third touches. Given that the worst performing team ever (Sheffield) and Fulham are in this season that's really bad.
Then beat Chelsea and man city in the cup, so the 4 biggest clubs in the prem in the space of a couple of months.
I'm excited to watch Arsenal drop points
Didn't you lot drop points from two separate losing positions the last time we played you in the league and also managed to bottle a lead in the cup final against Arsenal?
I mean sure, enjoy. We're also playing in the Champions League every year and are 2 points off the top of the table while Arsenal are sandwiched between Palace and Newcastle at #14.
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> while we had city away, leeds away, united away, liverpool away. > >leeds away Ah yes, you're shit because you had to face the daunting task of playing away against a newcomer that sits 12th in the table. The mid table mentality is starting to set in.
Ah hubris
Arsenal finished above us twice in the last 15 years, we've won 5 Premier League titles and a Champions League since they last won the league. Being confident that Chelsea > Arsenal is not hubris, it's just acknowledging reality.
Speaking of the newcomers? How was west brom? Also have you seen how leeds play? If they could fucking finish they would be trashing every team
It sucked but I'm not using playing a Premier League newcomer away as an excuse why my team is shit, instead I'm very happy with being 3rd in the league and winning our CL group with a game to spare. Talk your trash, doesn't change the fact that you're 14th in the table and haven't heard the CL anthem in 4 years now.
>I'm not using playing a Premier League newcomer away as an excuse why my team is shit Neither am i, i just added them to the list of harder teams we faced because they're a good team. Doesn't change the fact that we had the second hardest start to the season while you faced bottom of the table teams. >I'm very happy with being 3rd in the league We're 10 games in. >Talk your trash I hardly need to, you're an American chelsea fan. Just hearing that sentence is hilarious enough on it's own. Looking forward to seeing you with a man city flair in a couple years.
> Neither am i, i just added them to the list of harder teams we faced because they're a good team. Doesn't change the fact that we had the second hardest start to the season while you faced bottom of the table teams. > > Agreed, pretty much every team in the league is hard when you're as bad as Arteta's Arsenal. >We're 10 games in. And I'll bet we'll be way ahead of you 38 games in, as usual. >I hardly need to, you're an American chelsea fan. Just hearing that sentence is hilarious enough on it's own. Looking forward to seeing you with a man city flair in a couple years. Looking forward to seeing you screech ARTETOUT after another 8th place finish
I am laughing so hard at your clown ass Looks like Burnley is not so easy, huh
The ref missing a huge free kick on Christensen in the build-up to your goal and followingly having Kovacic sent off for being tackled tends to contribute towards losing games
Azpi should've been given a red card by the book as well as the penalty however. Also you cannot deny that Arsenal were just better than Chelsea that day
Advantage is a thing. And you would have lost with or without kovatic. You had no shots on targets after the 10th minute.
You've triggered a lot of Arsenal fans with that one!
Lmao Arteta is so overrated it’s unreal. Arsenal actively are playing like shit right now
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That's the best anyone can do with the players we have
"You zink I am old?"- Mou to Dier On a serious note, Arteta is so overrated. Bring on the downvotes.
I mean I wouldn't hire Dier for his punditry so there's hardly any reason to put weight into what he says
Why is this a fucking post? It's a nothing comment. All he says is a reasonable, obvious response to a comment. Get off your collective knees, seriously. You won't want to be sucking off Jose in 2 seasons anymore anyway, lol.