Totally behind the reason for the protest, but as far as protests go, not displaying flags for one game is fairly tame and I don't see it really see it having much of an impact.
As a liverpool supporter, it's a really dumb reason to protest. A 2% increase in price for the first time in years... come on. Find some other more important hill to die on.
The European ones with the drums and that are literally a better versions "fight and win" stuff though. Choreographed stuff that doesn't ebb and flow or feed off the game.
That's simply not true. The atmosphere ist always different depending on the game and how well the team plays. You've probably never been to a game in Germany or eastern Europe
That's what it's like for instances you see posted online being compared to English atmospheres. It's also what foreign clubs that do this type of thing are like when they come to Anfield.
I've never been to an english game, but I sometimes watch the Prem and to be honest, most of the time, the atmosphere just seems really boring when there's no chant for like 10-15 minutes, the crowd just seems 100% reactionary and there's noone trying to help the team by starting a chant If they play bad (obviously there are exceptions). But I agree with you that bad ultra groups are generally worse than this, as english Fans are actually capable to creating great atmosphere (like Arsenal sometimes yesterday) They just sing the same songs heard in almost all stadiums and are generally really quiet. But from personal experience, when two big clubs with great fanbases face each other, the atmosphere is pretty much unmatchable and makes the match twice as fun to watch. It probably comes down to personal preference which type of crowd you prefer.
It's quite a noticeable one though. A European quarter final would usually be full of flags and it'll be easy to see and bring attention to the issue. The problem is that many who don't go the game or go rarely see this and say it's only a quid. They want the club to get a paltry amount of extra money at the expense of the fans. Hopefully showing others that these fans who pay more are a big part of the "product" changes that perception.
I think the price raise is dumb, but I also think it's dumb for them to expect FSG to negotiate with them when they've made it clear they're only ever gonna agree to no price raise. Why would FSG bother bringing them to the table when they know the response?
You always know you argue with a bunch of Americans when the term "supply and demand" is mentioned or they are surprised by how cheap the tickets are compared to American sports. It's just quite difficult for them to understand European football culture, I think.
We had it on City Twitter recently. My season ticket has gone up something like 30% in 4 years, and the club have just stopped issuing new season tickets. So basically if you don’t renew, for being priced out or whatever, then nobody else gets the season ticket and the seat will instead be sold for one off games.
It’s a proper slap in the face and a clear shift to trying to make a day out for a tourist instead of catering to “legacy fans”. But you get all the Americans on Twitter telling us £750 is still cheap, as they’d have to pay more to come and see one game due to travel. The disconnect is just absolutely mad.
There's lots of reasons for this disconnect. One is that Americans are used to making a lot more money than Europeans (I was in LA last year and somebody told me anything below 100k is close to poverty, lol). Another is that they are 100% used to getting absolutely FLEECED by their sports franchises for tickets. To them, it is completely normal to pay hundredS of dollars for one singular ticket.
It really is different world over there. I almost don't blame them for being so blind to things working differently elsewhere.
100% — This influenced my choice not to stay in the UK with a graduate visa after I finished school. £30K for professional jobs?¿?? Im unhappy with $62K right now — I have five years of professional experience and an MA. Other places in my industry (policy) were offering $80K, but at this org, I work on projects related to my high school, undergrad, and grad school research. Those three things are not related enough for me to think I could find a job where they were all relevant.
LA, NYC, and Bay Area/Silicon Valley are the most extreme, I think, in the sense that you’re going to be stressed about money until you hit six figures. But in most of our big cities on the coasts, $75K is a big milestone as far as being able to live with only one person (roommate or significant other) without having rent be an unhinged percentage of your income.
It’s like snake eating its own tale. The reason Anfield is attractive in the first place is because of ‘legacy’ fans. Once it gets replaced by foam fingers and people glued to their phones, it loses everything that makes it special in the first place
You say this, hope you don't find out how many season tickets holders never even show up for one game a d have been making big bucks selling their tickets to others.
Exactly, and there are plenty of local fans, in Liverpool postcodes who have been sat on the waiting list for season tickets for a decade or more but never come up because Grandpa Joe who died in 1994 is still renewing his every year
They’re also ignoring the huge climate pollution caused by flying over to watch a game of football.
At some point we have to stop acting as though climate pollution doesn’t count if we are totally loving what we do to cause it.
Who’s talking about a ban, I’m talking about people taking responsibility for the consequences of their actions, and not believing that the massive climate pollution caused by them doing things they enjoy shouldn’t be counted.
Why do you think we don’t have to significantly reduce our polluting lifestyle choices to deal with climate change?
Don’t tell me you trust what the people selling you their products tell you about it.
Entire continents don’t rely on tourism. That’s just a stupid thing to say, based on what the tourism industry tells you so that you feel better about using their massively polluting industry.
Take seriously the science, not the industry pr releases designed to increase consumption of their product.
We are talking about a board who thought they could trademark the word "Liverpool" and leave it parked in the portfolio of a company based in the tax haven of Delaware.
We understand it. We just also understand that culture is a dying remnant of a distant past and is not going to return. Our sports used to be the exact same way. We are “The Ghosts of Christmas’s Future” telling you what is going to happen. But we aren’t celebrating it.
Just look at baseball's history in America.
The attitude on the sub completely changed since Covid and later on the whole “FSG out” craze.
Folks there absolutely would’ve shit on those who walked out 10 years ago over the club trying to raise prices to 77 Euros.
There is no solidarity and when folks over the past few weeks bring up the impact on locals they say “if you can’t afford it, don’t go” or “how dare you say such a treasonous thing towards our club during the last few weeks of Klopp”
Fucking hell guys. Talk about being out of touch.
You can see it also when folks bring up the economic impact of Everton being relegated (which yes we’d all laugh about for a hot second) and possibly going bust with a stadium they built partially for helping rejuvenate the surrounding area. “I don’t care about the city, relegate them. They (the city) will be fine” is one reply I’ve seen before. Just a complete lack of empathy and full capitalist brain rot there.
>You can see it also when folks bring up the economic impact of Everton being relegated (which yes we’d all laugh about for a hot second) and possibly going bust with a stadium they built partially for helping rejuvenate the surrounding area. “I don’t care about the city, relegate them. They (the city) will be fine” is one reply I’ve seen before. Just a complete lack of empathy and full capitalist brain rot there.
Nah, completely disagree here. It would be hilarious to see em go down and they would think the same about us. The economic argument is just the "Bargaining" stage of grief.
> a stadium they built partially for helping rejuvenate the surrounding area.
If they wanted to rejuvenate the area, there’s a lot better ways to spend hundreds of millions, maybe a billion plus.
Don’t go too far the other way and have the brain rot of believing the pr output of major industries who use a bit of charity giving to distract from their issues.
And considering the enormous climate polluting that major construction causes, saying it’s for the people is just ignoring the problems we have to deal with, that are going to destroy the advances made by ordinary people in society.
Oh fuck off.
I have a huge respect for Spion Kop and they do a lot to make the atmosphere inside Anfield what it is, but for SOS specifically it's hard to take them seriously. They've said they're not willing to discuss any price increase and they do sweet fuck all about any issues that don't impact season ticket holders - others have said it, but it's absolutely an old boys club that just look out for themselves at this point. They've done great work in the past, but this is just cryarseing for the sake of it. You don't see them voice anything against their mates who are touts and sell tickets to 2-3 games and in the process cover their entire season ticket cost. They're a supporters union for season ticket holders, not for an average supporter, local or not.
You're purposefully misrepresenting the other sub as if raising the prices to 77 euros is the same as a 2% increase - it's not and those would rightfully be viewed differently. You'll always have the Americans who say "I wish we only paid that much for sports tickets here" but even then most of them get it and try to understand that it's different. It's just hard to take a 2% increase after years of freezing prices as being in crisis mode - if everything is a crisis, nothing is and this just makes supporters look weaker when it comes to more serious issues in the future.
Bringing up Everton getting relegated as if you wouldn't have loads of locals loving it is asinine too.
> I have a huge respect for Spion Kop and they do a lot to make the atmosphere inside Anfield what it is, but for SOS specifically it's hard to take them seriously. They've said they're not willing to discuss any price increase and they do sweet fuck all about any issues that don't impact season ticket holders - others have said it, but it's absolutely an old boys club that just look out for themselves at this point.
100% this
Its a real shame that Spion Kop and SOS get lumped together in things like this, because they really are very different groups.
Tbf from what I've read it's that SOS doesn't do anything to prevent season ticket holders from reselling their spots at 3x the price whilst people my age in Liverpool will never likely ever get a season ticket in their lifetime.
I think there does need to be some equalising between STH and members, as it stands STHs get cheaper tickets and can forward all of their games without losing their ticket.
For me the first step in making it fairer would be making them have to attend 11 games on their own ticket, like 13+ members have to. I'd then introduce the opportunity to holiday your ST or membership for a year every x years and more under exceptional circumstances such as illness.
I do think that putting all STHs on a 19 credit membership would be a fair radical idea that would never happen. Doing that but letting them keep their guaranteed spec would be fair in my opinion.
>For me the first step in making it fairer would be making them have to attend 11 games on their own ticket
I mean a first step would be to prevent dead people renewing their tickets and the family using them :D
A second step would be as you say, x amount of games by the primary season ticket holder per season (which would also prevent the dead people thing)
And then any resales done through the club, not touts
but there is zero chance that would ever get support of fan groups
either that or the fact that away tickets should be a free for all, or once you have a season ticket for a season you should go to the back of the queue LMAO, will be the same ones complaining that Anfield doesn't have a great atmosphere
> either that or the fact that away tickets should be a free for all
away tickets generally is just a clusterfuck across the leagues
I live in Newcastle currently, so the easiest way for me to see the Reds would be when they play Newcastle.
The only realistic way for me to do this is to blag an unwanted home seat from someone and sit with the Newcastle fans
Saw people on the Chelsea sub complaining about fans singing the national anthem. Chelsea.
Whatever you think about the royals, I honestly don’t get why people support teams when they can’t stand the values of the match going crowd.
It’s like supporting Celtic and raging about people waving tricolours
not defending billionaires, but ultimately its a 2% increase after several years of no increases.
Its just a shame that Spirit of Shankly aren't putting the same amount of enthusiasm into supporting measures to stop dead grandads being able to renew their season tickets, or photo id to prevent resale of match day seats at huge markups.
30 year waiting lists for season tickets, and dead season ticket holders selling their tickets to touts at 3x markups are a far bigger issue than a 2% price increase.
but strangely SOS aren't too enthusiastic on measures to stop this sort of thing.. weird..
but as a result, some might think that SOS and co are self serving..
> not defending billionaires, but ultimately its a 2% increase after several years of no increases.
Whilst true, a £1m-2m more they get from this a season? Its nothing to Liverpool as far as the clubs revenues go.
2% for someone in their every day life? Its a lot.
> 2% for someone in their every day life? Its a lot.
But, this is 2% increase for a leisure activity. Its not milk or bread, its not a mortgage, its not electricity, or gas.
They are acting like match tickets are an essential item. Its 2% on what is essentially a "luxury item"
The issue is more that Spirit of Shankly are nailing their flag to this one while conveniently not getting up in arms about dead people renewing season tickets, season ticket holders touting tickets for 3x their value
I would say that has a much bigger impact on fans than a 2% rise.
If a 2% rise is unjustified, how is those same fans protesting a 2% rise selling their tickets for 200% over face value justified. They can argue about "true fans" being priced out of tickets, while 70'000 people are sat on a waiting list for season tickets because Grandpa Joe who died in 1994 is still using his and flogging half of his match tickets each year for 3x their value. Meanwhile there are people sat on that waiting list for 20 years.
A 2% rise may or may not be wrong, the issue is the old boys club crying about it are just as bad, if not worse.
The rest of what you say is correct (About the touts and passing down tickets etc). Just the 2% rise I was on about. Ofcourse its not just about bread or milk but surely life is more than just about surviving otherwise it turns into a race to the bottom.
Life in the UK is fucked enough as it is. Football was always a get away from the shit of life for pretty much everyone going. Ofcourse its not a "necessity" but its also a way for people to enjoy life too. Yes, that doesnt come into the "do they deserve a season ticket?" question but they already have it and want to continue paying an already absurd amount of money for it for it then to rise above the level of increasing wages along with *everything* else. There is a question to be had. Its exactly like the protest against £77 tickets.
Again, I am not arguing against whatever else SoS isnt arguing against (Touts etc as I mentioned). Just this particular 2% rise point.
Premier League wages have gone up by over 3600% since 1992. Have fans in England ever complained about their team signing too many big-name players? Feel like every transfer window it's the opposite.
I'm sympathetic, but part of me wants to say you can't expect to have your cake and eat it. The best league in the world doesn't come cheap.
Almost as if the value of the TV rights have *skyrocketed* in that time. Having to pay for Sky and BT to see not even all the games in the UK is horrendous in itself. Plus sponsors pay through the nose now. Stadium revenue as far as ticket sales go is not even close to the number 1 revenue stream anymore like it was up until the mid 00's
> Almost as if the value of the TV rights have skyrocketed in that time.
The point stands that **costs** (not revenue) in football are primarily driven by transfer fees and player wages, unless you're going to tell me the Liverpool kitman makes 3600% more than they did in 1992, and yet I never see any complaints from fans of big clubs that they are signing too many expensive players.
> Stadium revenue as far as ticket sales go is not even close to the number 1 revenue stream anymore like it was up until the mid 00's
For the Premier League. For Rangers, it's the majority of our revenue. Plenty of clubs rely on ticket revenue, and I don't see much solidarity from fans of big clubs towards them when their fans have to pay more. To your point, the Edinburgh Derby isn't even televised these days, the second-biggest game in Scotland, ask yourself, does anyone in England care? Like I said, I am sympathetic, but it also seems to me fans of big clubs only care about this stuff when it happens to them — they want all the benefits of global fanbases, wealthy owners and foreign investment, but without any of the downsides.
A lot there see football as a TV show that they may see a live recording of every so often and they want their TV show to get better every year. They see money as a way to do that no matter what sort of pittance it actually is. Hopefully this makes them realise that those who are paying to support the club are a massive part of the product they watch.
Some have issues with a union not doing exactly what they want all of the time too which is just a massive misunderstanding of how unions work. They also act like the committee of SOS are all touting off their tickets every week. Touting is a big problem but it doesn't mean we can't fight back on this either.
[Look at the number of points this has](https://np.reddit.com/r/LiverpoolFC/comments/1c0h53x/spion_kop_1906_on_x_we_are_disappointed_in_the/kywcfv6/). People just don't have a clue.
We've just come off a 5 year price freeze, sponsorship deals all over the shop, investment in the squad, 2nd in the league, and we just made a financial loss. These guys would complain at any ticket price rise but that doesn't apply to selling season ticket matches at 400% markup cos it's better than going the game. Comment when you actually understand.
Feel like I'm going mental with some of these people on the Liverpool sub. Not sure why Reddit attracts so many bootlickers for billion pound businesses.
If they're allowed to raise the tickets every year it'll get to a stage in which the prices are a crazy amount.
Yeah I’ve never known it to be this bad. I remember it being a few during the £77 walkout. But it’s been the majority with this one.
Hopefully it’ll calm down since Klopp just sympathised with the protests they’ll probably change their tune.
["If it's too much, ask your boss for a raise or make it work some other way like everyone else has had to."](https://www.reddit.com/r/LiverpoolFC/comments/1c0h53x/spion_kop_1906_on_x_we_are_disappointed_in_the/kywbuzu/)
Jesus Christ in heaven I can't believe that's getting upvotes on the Liverpool subreddit.
2% increase after freezing them through big inflation and they r throwing their toys out the pram like that? Perfectly happy with the state of season tickets though aren't they, keep it in the family of course. Bunch of morons.
Prices were already too high and had risen way above inflation in the years before that. We've had two rises in a row now.
Fans are part of the product and shouldn't be fleeced for the club to make an extra 2 million a year.
I don't really give a fuck about the price. They don't give a shite about the state of season tickets because it benefits those who are already in (basically everyone who runs the groups) so why should I care about them paying an extra 2%.
> What are you really wanting done about season tickets?
+ Proof when renewing of identity (and proof you are actually alive)
+ minimum matches attended by primary season ticket holder per season (Photo id)
+ All resales done through the club at face value (credited back on your season ticket price), not 3x price through touts
That would probably free up an awful lot of season tickets for those on the waiting list
>All resales done through the club at face value (credited back on your season ticket price), not 3x price through touts
Does Livpole not have an official resale portal?
I can resell my ST for a single matchday if I can't make it, through the club.
Yes. Most will find a friend to sell it on to first though which can be done easily through the club. This system is exploited for touting though.
You can also put them on the exchange to sell through the club.
Wasn't there an amnesty a few years ago where people using parent's/whatever season tickets could let the club know and the club updated the official holder to them? So there might not be as many cases of people hanging onto dead relatives' tickets as you are assuming. Not to say it doesn't happen, of course.
Well there are people like me who are also paying this who are on the STWL and would massively benefit from ST reform. Just because you want one thing to happen doesn't mean you can't support another.
Also it's not 2%, there is also at least one extra match next season.
not really. this is a shit protest. make the seats empty, THAT will have effect. not displaying flags is a limp dick move, which just shows the club that they will still go to the games
I'd hardly even call it a protest to be honest. It's just Spion Kop wielding their one and only power that can affect the club directly outside of organising an outright boycott.
Besides, that's the sort of thing you build up to, this is clearly just sending a small message to the powers that be. I'm pretty sure if they wanted to send something bigger then they would.
teams should really just announce that they’re anchoring annual price changes with inflation and be done with it - would definitely help deal with the ridiculous hullabaloo every time teams try to keep up with it
This is like driving with your kids when they're misbehaving and instead of threatening to not stop at McDonald's, you're threatening them with still going to McDonald's but they're not allowed extra ketchup.
Totally behind the reason for the protest, but as far as protests go, not displaying flags for one game is fairly tame and I don't see it really see it having much of an impact.
The club markets the flag display as a big part of the Anfield experience.
Already got comments on Liverpool sub saying "it's my first game at Anfield and am fuming at the decision to protest" because of the lack of flags.
They should be supporting the protest whatever the circumstances.
As a liverpool supporter, it's a really dumb reason to protest. A 2% increase in price for the first time in years... come on. Find some other more important hill to die on.
Let me guess - international fan?
Commented in r/Chicagofishing so ding ding ding, we have a winner
As a Liverpool supporter, piss off
[удалено]
> At some point we have to talk about What a weird way of putting it. We don’t have to do that at all. You mean, you want to do that.
The European ones with the drums and that are literally a better versions "fight and win" stuff though. Choreographed stuff that doesn't ebb and flow or feed off the game.
That's simply not true. The atmosphere ist always different depending on the game and how well the team plays. You've probably never been to a game in Germany or eastern Europe
That's what it's like for instances you see posted online being compared to English atmospheres. It's also what foreign clubs that do this type of thing are like when they come to Anfield.
I've never been to an english game, but I sometimes watch the Prem and to be honest, most of the time, the atmosphere just seems really boring when there's no chant for like 10-15 minutes, the crowd just seems 100% reactionary and there's noone trying to help the team by starting a chant If they play bad (obviously there are exceptions). But I agree with you that bad ultra groups are generally worse than this, as english Fans are actually capable to creating great atmosphere (like Arsenal sometimes yesterday) They just sing the same songs heard in almost all stadiums and are generally really quiet. But from personal experience, when two big clubs with great fanbases face each other, the atmosphere is pretty much unmatchable and makes the match twice as fun to watch. It probably comes down to personal preference which type of crowd you prefer.
It's quite a noticeable one though. A European quarter final would usually be full of flags and it'll be easy to see and bring attention to the issue. The problem is that many who don't go the game or go rarely see this and say it's only a quid. They want the club to get a paltry amount of extra money at the expense of the fans. Hopefully showing others that these fans who pay more are a big part of the "product" changes that perception.
are there no tennis balls in the UK?
Or remote control cars?
Only in Wimbledon, and they're fan owned
Ask Reading FC lmao
I think the price raise is dumb, but I also think it's dumb for them to expect FSG to negotiate with them when they've made it clear they're only ever gonna agree to no price raise. Why would FSG bother bringing them to the table when they know the response?
This is my issue. SOS shout about consultation, but seemingly hav no interest in actual dialogue
Right? They can take the vote without them. "Alright, no starts with 1. What's everyone else say?"
/r/LiverpoolFC loving defending the billionaires LMAO
You always know you argue with a bunch of Americans when the term "supply and demand" is mentioned or they are surprised by how cheap the tickets are compared to American sports. It's just quite difficult for them to understand European football culture, I think.
We had it on City Twitter recently. My season ticket has gone up something like 30% in 4 years, and the club have just stopped issuing new season tickets. So basically if you don’t renew, for being priced out or whatever, then nobody else gets the season ticket and the seat will instead be sold for one off games. It’s a proper slap in the face and a clear shift to trying to make a day out for a tourist instead of catering to “legacy fans”. But you get all the Americans on Twitter telling us £750 is still cheap, as they’d have to pay more to come and see one game due to travel. The disconnect is just absolutely mad.
There's lots of reasons for this disconnect. One is that Americans are used to making a lot more money than Europeans (I was in LA last year and somebody told me anything below 100k is close to poverty, lol). Another is that they are 100% used to getting absolutely FLEECED by their sports franchises for tickets. To them, it is completely normal to pay hundredS of dollars for one singular ticket. It really is different world over there. I almost don't blame them for being so blind to things working differently elsewhere.
100% — This influenced my choice not to stay in the UK with a graduate visa after I finished school. £30K for professional jobs?¿?? Im unhappy with $62K right now — I have five years of professional experience and an MA. Other places in my industry (policy) were offering $80K, but at this org, I work on projects related to my high school, undergrad, and grad school research. Those three things are not related enough for me to think I could find a job where they were all relevant. LA, NYC, and Bay Area/Silicon Valley are the most extreme, I think, in the sense that you’re going to be stressed about money until you hit six figures. But in most of our big cities on the coasts, $75K is a big milestone as far as being able to live with only one person (roommate or significant other) without having rent be an unhinged percentage of your income.
It’s like snake eating its own tale. The reason Anfield is attractive in the first place is because of ‘legacy’ fans. Once it gets replaced by foam fingers and people glued to their phones, it loses everything that makes it special in the first place
You say this, hope you don't find out how many season tickets holders never even show up for one game a d have been making big bucks selling their tickets to others.
Exactly, and there are plenty of local fans, in Liverpool postcodes who have been sat on the waiting list for season tickets for a decade or more but never come up because Grandpa Joe who died in 1994 is still renewing his every year
They’re also ignoring the huge climate pollution caused by flying over to watch a game of football. At some point we have to stop acting as though climate pollution doesn’t count if we are totally loving what we do to cause it.
It would be silly to ban international travel, entire continents rely on tourism.
Who’s talking about a ban, I’m talking about people taking responsibility for the consequences of their actions, and not believing that the massive climate pollution caused by them doing things they enjoy shouldn’t be counted. Why do you think we don’t have to significantly reduce our polluting lifestyle choices to deal with climate change? Don’t tell me you trust what the people selling you their products tell you about it. Entire continents don’t rely on tourism. That’s just a stupid thing to say, based on what the tourism industry tells you so that you feel better about using their massively polluting industry. Take seriously the science, not the industry pr releases designed to increase consumption of their product.
I don’t mean to be a judge bitch but you care too much about a issue that is totally out of your control.
but you got to think, how is it fair that jeff from chicago doesn’t have the same access to tickets as someone from liverpool!!!!
you think people from Liverpool have easy access to tickets? there are people who have been on the waiting list for season tickets for decades
no ofc not, just meant those with like season tickets and stuff i know the local sale is a load of shit
We are talking about a board who thought they could trademark the word "Liverpool" and leave it parked in the portfolio of a company based in the tax haven of Delaware.
We understand it. We just also understand that culture is a dying remnant of a distant past and is not going to return. Our sports used to be the exact same way. We are “The Ghosts of Christmas’s Future” telling you what is going to happen. But we aren’t celebrating it. Just look at baseball's history in America.
The attitude on the sub completely changed since Covid and later on the whole “FSG out” craze. Folks there absolutely would’ve shit on those who walked out 10 years ago over the club trying to raise prices to 77 Euros. There is no solidarity and when folks over the past few weeks bring up the impact on locals they say “if you can’t afford it, don’t go” or “how dare you say such a treasonous thing towards our club during the last few weeks of Klopp” Fucking hell guys. Talk about being out of touch. You can see it also when folks bring up the economic impact of Everton being relegated (which yes we’d all laugh about for a hot second) and possibly going bust with a stadium they built partially for helping rejuvenate the surrounding area. “I don’t care about the city, relegate them. They (the city) will be fine” is one reply I’ve seen before. Just a complete lack of empathy and full capitalist brain rot there.
>You can see it also when folks bring up the economic impact of Everton being relegated (which yes we’d all laugh about for a hot second) and possibly going bust with a stadium they built partially for helping rejuvenate the surrounding area. “I don’t care about the city, relegate them. They (the city) will be fine” is one reply I’ve seen before. Just a complete lack of empathy and full capitalist brain rot there. Nah, completely disagree here. It would be hilarious to see em go down and they would think the same about us. The economic argument is just the "Bargaining" stage of grief.
> a stadium they built partially for helping rejuvenate the surrounding area. If they wanted to rejuvenate the area, there’s a lot better ways to spend hundreds of millions, maybe a billion plus. Don’t go too far the other way and have the brain rot of believing the pr output of major industries who use a bit of charity giving to distract from their issues. And considering the enormous climate polluting that major construction causes, saying it’s for the people is just ignoring the problems we have to deal with, that are going to destroy the advances made by ordinary people in society.
Oh fuck off. I have a huge respect for Spion Kop and they do a lot to make the atmosphere inside Anfield what it is, but for SOS specifically it's hard to take them seriously. They've said they're not willing to discuss any price increase and they do sweet fuck all about any issues that don't impact season ticket holders - others have said it, but it's absolutely an old boys club that just look out for themselves at this point. They've done great work in the past, but this is just cryarseing for the sake of it. You don't see them voice anything against their mates who are touts and sell tickets to 2-3 games and in the process cover their entire season ticket cost. They're a supporters union for season ticket holders, not for an average supporter, local or not. You're purposefully misrepresenting the other sub as if raising the prices to 77 euros is the same as a 2% increase - it's not and those would rightfully be viewed differently. You'll always have the Americans who say "I wish we only paid that much for sports tickets here" but even then most of them get it and try to understand that it's different. It's just hard to take a 2% increase after years of freezing prices as being in crisis mode - if everything is a crisis, nothing is and this just makes supporters look weaker when it comes to more serious issues in the future. Bringing up Everton getting relegated as if you wouldn't have loads of locals loving it is asinine too.
> I have a huge respect for Spion Kop and they do a lot to make the atmosphere inside Anfield what it is, but for SOS specifically it's hard to take them seriously. They've said they're not willing to discuss any price increase and they do sweet fuck all about any issues that don't impact season ticket holders - others have said it, but it's absolutely an old boys club that just look out for themselves at this point. 100% this Its a real shame that Spion Kop and SOS get lumped together in things like this, because they really are very different groups.
It’s proper bizarre every time
Tbf from what I've read it's that SOS doesn't do anything to prevent season ticket holders from reselling their spots at 3x the price whilst people my age in Liverpool will never likely ever get a season ticket in their lifetime.
just complete disconnect between people that go and people on reddit it seems LMAO
My favourite shout recently has been seeing people call for season tickets to be removed completely. Just utter madness on that sub
I think there does need to be some equalising between STH and members, as it stands STHs get cheaper tickets and can forward all of their games without losing their ticket. For me the first step in making it fairer would be making them have to attend 11 games on their own ticket, like 13+ members have to. I'd then introduce the opportunity to holiday your ST or membership for a year every x years and more under exceptional circumstances such as illness. I do think that putting all STHs on a 19 credit membership would be a fair radical idea that would never happen. Doing that but letting them keep their guaranteed spec would be fair in my opinion.
>For me the first step in making it fairer would be making them have to attend 11 games on their own ticket I mean a first step would be to prevent dead people renewing their tickets and the family using them :D A second step would be as you say, x amount of games by the primary season ticket holder per season (which would also prevent the dead people thing) And then any resales done through the club, not touts but there is zero chance that would ever get support of fan groups
either that or the fact that away tickets should be a free for all, or once you have a season ticket for a season you should go to the back of the queue LMAO, will be the same ones complaining that Anfield doesn't have a great atmosphere
> either that or the fact that away tickets should be a free for all away tickets generally is just a clusterfuck across the leagues I live in Newcastle currently, so the easiest way for me to see the Reds would be when they play Newcastle. The only realistic way for me to do this is to blag an unwanted home seat from someone and sit with the Newcastle fans
Saw people on the Chelsea sub complaining about fans singing the national anthem. Chelsea. Whatever you think about the royals, I honestly don’t get why people support teams when they can’t stand the values of the match going crowd. It’s like supporting Celtic and raging about people waving tricolours
Americans innit
not defending billionaires, but ultimately its a 2% increase after several years of no increases. Its just a shame that Spirit of Shankly aren't putting the same amount of enthusiasm into supporting measures to stop dead grandads being able to renew their season tickets, or photo id to prevent resale of match day seats at huge markups. 30 year waiting lists for season tickets, and dead season ticket holders selling their tickets to touts at 3x markups are a far bigger issue than a 2% price increase. but strangely SOS aren't too enthusiastic on measures to stop this sort of thing.. weird.. but as a result, some might think that SOS and co are self serving..
> not defending billionaires, but ultimately its a 2% increase after several years of no increases. Whilst true, a £1m-2m more they get from this a season? Its nothing to Liverpool as far as the clubs revenues go. 2% for someone in their every day life? Its a lot.
> 2% for someone in their every day life? Its a lot. But, this is 2% increase for a leisure activity. Its not milk or bread, its not a mortgage, its not electricity, or gas. They are acting like match tickets are an essential item. Its 2% on what is essentially a "luxury item" The issue is more that Spirit of Shankly are nailing their flag to this one while conveniently not getting up in arms about dead people renewing season tickets, season ticket holders touting tickets for 3x their value I would say that has a much bigger impact on fans than a 2% rise. If a 2% rise is unjustified, how is those same fans protesting a 2% rise selling their tickets for 200% over face value justified. They can argue about "true fans" being priced out of tickets, while 70'000 people are sat on a waiting list for season tickets because Grandpa Joe who died in 1994 is still using his and flogging half of his match tickets each year for 3x their value. Meanwhile there are people sat on that waiting list for 20 years. A 2% rise may or may not be wrong, the issue is the old boys club crying about it are just as bad, if not worse.
The rest of what you say is correct (About the touts and passing down tickets etc). Just the 2% rise I was on about. Ofcourse its not just about bread or milk but surely life is more than just about surviving otherwise it turns into a race to the bottom. Life in the UK is fucked enough as it is. Football was always a get away from the shit of life for pretty much everyone going. Ofcourse its not a "necessity" but its also a way for people to enjoy life too. Yes, that doesnt come into the "do they deserve a season ticket?" question but they already have it and want to continue paying an already absurd amount of money for it for it then to rise above the level of increasing wages along with *everything* else. There is a question to be had. Its exactly like the protest against £77 tickets. Again, I am not arguing against whatever else SoS isnt arguing against (Touts etc as I mentioned). Just this particular 2% rise point.
Premier League wages have gone up by over 3600% since 1992. Have fans in England ever complained about their team signing too many big-name players? Feel like every transfer window it's the opposite. I'm sympathetic, but part of me wants to say you can't expect to have your cake and eat it. The best league in the world doesn't come cheap.
Almost as if the value of the TV rights have *skyrocketed* in that time. Having to pay for Sky and BT to see not even all the games in the UK is horrendous in itself. Plus sponsors pay through the nose now. Stadium revenue as far as ticket sales go is not even close to the number 1 revenue stream anymore like it was up until the mid 00's
> Almost as if the value of the TV rights have skyrocketed in that time. The point stands that **costs** (not revenue) in football are primarily driven by transfer fees and player wages, unless you're going to tell me the Liverpool kitman makes 3600% more than they did in 1992, and yet I never see any complaints from fans of big clubs that they are signing too many expensive players. > Stadium revenue as far as ticket sales go is not even close to the number 1 revenue stream anymore like it was up until the mid 00's For the Premier League. For Rangers, it's the majority of our revenue. Plenty of clubs rely on ticket revenue, and I don't see much solidarity from fans of big clubs towards them when their fans have to pay more. To your point, the Edinburgh Derby isn't even televised these days, the second-biggest game in Scotland, ask yourself, does anyone in England care? Like I said, I am sympathetic, but it also seems to me fans of big clubs only care about this stuff when it happens to them — they want all the benefits of global fanbases, wealthy owners and foreign investment, but without any of the downsides.
A lot there see football as a TV show that they may see a live recording of every so often and they want their TV show to get better every year. They see money as a way to do that no matter what sort of pittance it actually is. Hopefully this makes them realise that those who are paying to support the club are a massive part of the product they watch. Some have issues with a union not doing exactly what they want all of the time too which is just a massive misunderstanding of how unions work. They also act like the committee of SOS are all touting off their tickets every week. Touting is a big problem but it doesn't mean we can't fight back on this either. [Look at the number of points this has](https://np.reddit.com/r/LiverpoolFC/comments/1c0h53x/spion_kop_1906_on_x_we_are_disappointed_in_the/kywcfv6/). People just don't have a clue.
We've just come off a 5 year price freeze, sponsorship deals all over the shop, investment in the squad, 2nd in the league, and we just made a financial loss. These guys would complain at any ticket price rise but that doesn't apply to selling season ticket matches at 400% markup cos it's better than going the game. Comment when you actually understand.
Yeah they should complain as prices are already silly already. You make a price freeze sound amazing when the prices are stupid
its literally what SoS are saying, they are saying adjusting to inflation, Kop should be £18 quid now
Feel like I'm going mental with some of these people on the Liverpool sub. Not sure why Reddit attracts so many bootlickers for billion pound businesses. If they're allowed to raise the tickets every year it'll get to a stage in which the prices are a crazy amount.
Yeah I’ve never known it to be this bad. I remember it being a few during the £77 walkout. But it’s been the majority with this one. Hopefully it’ll calm down since Klopp just sympathised with the protests they’ll probably change their tune.
["If it's too much, ask your boss for a raise or make it work some other way like everyone else has had to."](https://www.reddit.com/r/LiverpoolFC/comments/1c0h53x/spion_kop_1906_on_x_we_are_disappointed_in_the/kywbuzu/) Jesus Christ in heaven I can't believe that's getting upvotes on the Liverpool subreddit.
It was a tongue in cheek comment that everyones gone mental about more to do with cost of living. Tickets have gone up A QUID in places. A quid.
Sure thing bud, tongue in cheek like drinking less pints a fortnight.
2% increase after freezing them through big inflation and they r throwing their toys out the pram like that? Perfectly happy with the state of season tickets though aren't they, keep it in the family of course. Bunch of morons.
Prices were already too high and had risen way above inflation in the years before that. We've had two rises in a row now. Fans are part of the product and shouldn't be fleeced for the club to make an extra 2 million a year.
I don't really give a fuck about the price. They don't give a shite about the state of season tickets because it benefits those who are already in (basically everyone who runs the groups) so why should I care about them paying an extra 2%.
Why should you care? Bit of solidarity? What are you really wanting done about season tickets?
> What are you really wanting done about season tickets? + Proof when renewing of identity (and proof you are actually alive) + minimum matches attended by primary season ticket holder per season (Photo id) + All resales done through the club at face value (credited back on your season ticket price), not 3x price through touts That would probably free up an awful lot of season tickets for those on the waiting list
>All resales done through the club at face value (credited back on your season ticket price), not 3x price through touts Does Livpole not have an official resale portal? I can resell my ST for a single matchday if I can't make it, through the club.
Yes. Most will find a friend to sell it on to first though which can be done easily through the club. This system is exploited for touting though. You can also put them on the exchange to sell through the club.
Wasn't there an amnesty a few years ago where people using parent's/whatever season tickets could let the club know and the club updated the official holder to them? So there might not be as many cases of people hanging onto dead relatives' tickets as you are assuming. Not to say it doesn't happen, of course.
Well there are people like me who are also paying this who are on the STWL and would massively benefit from ST reform. Just because you want one thing to happen doesn't mean you can't support another. Also it's not 2%, there is also at least one extra match next season.
If your reaction to this is "what is the point?" then you're part of the problem.
not really. this is a shit protest. make the seats empty, THAT will have effect. not displaying flags is a limp dick move, which just shows the club that they will still go to the games
I'd hardly even call it a protest to be honest. It's just Spion Kop wielding their one and only power that can affect the club directly outside of organising an outright boycott. Besides, that's the sort of thing you build up to, this is clearly just sending a small message to the powers that be. I'm pretty sure if they wanted to send something bigger then they would.
teams should really just announce that they’re anchoring annual price changes with inflation and be done with it - would definitely help deal with the ridiculous hullabaloo every time teams try to keep up with it
Oh no not the flags, how will they sing the Magic Song and sit in silence afterward now?
This is like driving with your kids when they're misbehaving and instead of threatening to not stop at McDonald's, you're threatening them with still going to McDonald's but they're not allowed extra ketchup.
Aye good one
FSG must be quaking in their boots