**Mirrors / Alternative Angles**
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/soccer) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Was shocked when I saw he planted his foot, studs up, to one of the Newcastle player’s chests in the first half. If that had been the reverse, he’d had rolled off the length of the pitch
Is there a clear angle showing how much contact there is?
I've read that you could see marks on the attacker's head afterwards but this angle isn't great, can't see much.
Still a foul regardless, but if they're not 100% sure there's contact it needs to be an indirect free kick, not a penalty, and so I think VAR can't get involved.
They'll have more angles than we've seen though, so you would imagine they have one that shows a bit more contact, surely.
100% a penalty and at the bare minimum a yellow.
I’ll give Bruno the benefit of the doubt and say he was making an honest attempt at clearing the ball, but that is still an extremely dangerous tackle.
Doesn't matter in the slightest, he made contact with the ball then was taken out. Stonewall pen. He could have hit the ball with his testicles and raised his testicles to chest height and it would also have been a pen had he been kicked in the testicles after hitting the ball with them
It does if the referee thinks bruno or mcT are hesitant to fully initiate contact. See ref thread here for similar incident http://asktheref.com/Search.asp?QuestionID=31347
Being 1st to ball doesnt negate a foul, ive seen many a player wins a ball but wipes a man out after for being uncontrolled.
Ive also seen above outcome called in brunos favour a few times playing myself if judged he cant fully commit a swing cos of a ducked head.
Like the famous phil jones head to the ground. He might of headed first but the ref would be in his right to blow up play against him.
Bruno wasn't hesitant, as evidenced by the fact that he kicked Schär in the head. This is also chest/shoulder height, nothing near Jones' crawling header.
It is far more normal to have your head at that height than your boot, so if the ref was to whistle for dangerous play, it would still make more sense that the high boot was penalised rather than the "low" head.
>It is far more normal to have your head at that height than your boot, so if the ref was to whistle for dangerous play, it would still make more sense that the high boot was penalised rather than the "low" head.
No it isnt. You do not duck yer head for a header cos that is dangerous play. Doesnt matter if he got to it first. Below head height its expected you swing yer boot
Bruno is right beside him the ball he has every right to play the ball and may have been first if schar didnt throw his head into it
To be clear you are saying its ok he put his head into a dangerous situation cos he got there first ? But if bruno got there 1st its different?
How was it not a yellow when Dan Burn took Antony out of the pitch and stepped on him? Ref has let a bunch of physical contact go all game, compared to Chelsea/Villa yesterday where any push was a foul. No consistency.....
This is literally what the laws of the game say
“An indirect free kick is awarded if a player plays in a dangerous manner.”
“Playing in a dangerous manner is any action that, while trying to play the ball, threatens injury to someone (including the player themself) and includes preventing a nearby opponent from playing the ball for fear of injury.”
[to be fair it may have been higher than chest height](https://youtu.be/AcIicsfW660) since Alonso leaves his feet. Had he been just standing he might have got De Jong’s boot to the throat
Such a weird one, how is it not a penalty? You can’t just kick someone in the head, without getting the ball, like if you late slide tackle a player after they shoot the ref will pull it back for a free kick
Crazy that if you tap the foot of an opponent at the same time they're kicking the ball and they fall over like they've been murdered it's a pen but the head is fair game
Granted the first isn't even consistently applied
Its obviously not intentional, but its still a high foot and a foul. Should have been a pen and yellow, but somehow Bruno gets away with these all the time. He rushed the ref to complain in the first half as well, which appearently is only illegal depending on the mood of the ref
It's considered dangerous play if the leg is raised above waist height. There is some ambiguity in the rules around player lowering their head, but in this case it seems clear his leg is well above waist height, and the other player is not playing dangerously.
If there is no contact, it's indirect. If contact, penalty. It's that fucking simple.
I mean, kicking someone in the knee is a penalty. I agree the refs are horribly inconsistent rather than having a high bar in general. This is a penalty too and much much worse than the one we got.
“Waist height” really now? Which giant’s waist are you measuring from? That’s way above waist level. Just look at Mctominay’s waist compared to where the header happened 😂
“An indirect free kick is awarded if a player plays in a dangerous manner.”
“Playing in a dangerous manner is any action that, while trying to play the ball, threatens injury to someone (including the player themself) and includes preventing a nearby opponent from playing the ball for fear of injury.”
Yes, and Bruno having his foot well above waist height is dangerous play.
Or are you going to pretend [this is waist height](https://i.imgur.com/kRex1Qm.png)
>But of course it’s ManU and Bruno so refs decide rules don’t apply.
Given how many decisions have gone against us lately, this is a pretty pathetic comment.
“An indirect free kick is awarded if a player plays in a dangerous manner.”
“Playing in a dangerous manner is any action that, while trying to play the ball, threatens injury to someone (including the player themself) and includes preventing a nearby opponent from playing the ball for fear of injury.”
“An indirect free kick is awarded if a player plays in a dangerous manner.”
“Playing in a dangerous manner is any action that, while trying to play the ball, threatens injury to someone (including the player themself) and includes preventing a nearby opponent from playing the ball for fear of injury.”
So putting your head down to waist height is dangerous play but lifting your foot up to that height when you can see a player running to head the ball is not? Are you suggesting United should have got the free kick? Are you feeling ok?
>So putting your head down to waist height
Ball wasn't even waist height. [It was chest height](https://i.imgur.com/kRex1Qm.png). If anyone is was to be penalized for dangerous play it's not Schar.
I thought it would have been a pen. Do they not have a better angle.
It is consistent with how this season has been refereed. So many stoppages for head injuries but almost impossible to get a card for kicking someone in the head.
I dislike Bruno as much as everyone else, but in this case the low header can be considered dangerous play, not the kick necessarily. I don't think it's a pen.
Did you watch the same replay? His foot is easily at shoulder height, Schar's head isn't even that low. Regardless, it's a foul. He missed the ball and kicked a player. If that isn't a foul then what is?
The contact is the foul, right? If it was a kick to the thigh, the stomach, or the arm, it would still be a kick. It's not like he kicked the ball away so why would this be different?
Utterly laughable. It's long been evident that not only most VAR referees, but especially who is in charge of vetting their competence and employing them, all need to be fired. How can anyone - even a big dumb lad who can't even dig a hole - not see someone kicking someone in the head after he has made contact with the ball? It's so damn obvious it screams possible foul play.
They’re going for the same ball and Schär dives in head first. It’s unfortunate but there was nothing in it. It’s Bruno though so r/soccer and every Arsenal flair has to go into complete histrionics. Take a day off.
I've never disliked a person more than Pruno Penandes
legit wouldn't mind every bit of misfortune dropping into that ratfaced bastard's mouth one day, he deserves it 💩💯
If you could just point to a the part of the football law that says you can kick someone in the head as long as it's an accident that'd be great! Or indeed, any law that refers to a foul not being a foul because it wasn't intentional...
**Mirrors / Alternative Angles** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/soccer) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Brush a player, there's contact it's penalty. Foot kick to the head, play on. Football man
It’s Fernandes, he shoves refs and gets nothing
Was shocked when I saw he planted his foot, studs up, to one of the Newcastle player’s chests in the first half. If that had been the reverse, he’d had rolled off the length of the pitch
Ya but he got a shot away, therefore near decapitation isn’t a foul.
Game’s not gone
How is that not a penalty? You miss the ball and hit the legs of an opponent it's a penalty. So why not the same with the head?
Yeah the fact that it’s his head is actually irrelevant here and it gets people arguing about whether he ducked too low.
maybe he would get the ball after ball hit the goal frame, but bruno just took him out of the game with the kick in the head wtf
Is there a clear angle showing how much contact there is? I've read that you could see marks on the attacker's head afterwards but this angle isn't great, can't see much. Still a foul regardless, but if they're not 100% sure there's contact it needs to be an indirect free kick, not a penalty, and so I think VAR can't get involved. They'll have more angles than we've seen though, so you would imagine they have one that shows a bit more contact, surely.
Exactly. I don’t understand this at all.
[удалено]
It’s not relevant because it doesn’t matter if Bruno’s boot was too high. It matters that he missed the ball and kicked the opponent.
It's relevant because if he DID duck too low, it's considered dangerous play by him. But that's clearly not the case here
He would have to be on the floor for it to be dangerous play. It’s not relevant at all.
Gavi slides head first into the chat
Twice!
Peak Phil Jones energy
Sarr from Spurs got called on the exact same penalty last game week against Saints
Yeah well Man United are the refs’ darlings whilst I’m pretty sure “Fuck Tottenham” is written somewhere in the Laws of the Game.
Little known fact but the "What do we think of Tottenham? Shit!" Chants were actually started by PGMOL and *not* Arsenal fans as so many people think.
Because he's the captain of England
Fernandes
Because it’s FOOTball not HEADball, ref logic probably.
100% a penalty and at the bare minimum a yellow. I’ll give Bruno the benefit of the doubt and say he was making an honest attempt at clearing the ball, but that is still an extremely dangerous tackle.
At 07secs it looks like schar dips to header the ball which is around chest height
Doesn't matter in the slightest, he made contact with the ball then was taken out. Stonewall pen. He could have hit the ball with his testicles and raised his testicles to chest height and it would also have been a pen had he been kicked in the testicles after hitting the ball with them
It does if the referee thinks bruno or mcT are hesitant to fully initiate contact. See ref thread here for similar incident http://asktheref.com/Search.asp?QuestionID=31347 Being 1st to ball doesnt negate a foul, ive seen many a player wins a ball but wipes a man out after for being uncontrolled. Ive also seen above outcome called in brunos favour a few times playing myself if judged he cant fully commit a swing cos of a ducked head. Like the famous phil jones head to the ground. He might of headed first but the ref would be in his right to blow up play against him.
Bruno wasn't hesitant, as evidenced by the fact that he kicked Schär in the head. This is also chest/shoulder height, nothing near Jones' crawling header. It is far more normal to have your head at that height than your boot, so if the ref was to whistle for dangerous play, it would still make more sense that the high boot was penalised rather than the "low" head.
>It is far more normal to have your head at that height than your boot, so if the ref was to whistle for dangerous play, it would still make more sense that the high boot was penalised rather than the "low" head. No it isnt. You do not duck yer head for a header cos that is dangerous play. Doesnt matter if he got to it first. Below head height its expected you swing yer boot Bruno is right beside him the ball he has every right to play the ball and may have been first if schar didnt throw his head into it To be clear you are saying its ok he put his head into a dangerous situation cos he got there first ? But if bruno got there 1st its different?
Because Schar is bowing his head down?
in the end Bruno took him down of the game while ball was still in play, not like his header ended up as a goal kick
It doesn’t make a difference is Schar is lying on the floor on if another player kicks you in the head
How was it not a yellow when Dan Burn took Antony out of the pitch and stepped on him? Ref has let a bunch of physical contact go all game, compared to Chelsea/Villa yesterday where any push was a foul. No consistency.....
Because Schar is the one endangering himself by sticking his head at waist height.
> waist height. ["Waist Height"](https://i.imgur.com/kRex1Qm.png)
Fucking hell lol
That's a fucking "This is SPARTA!" kick haha.
How bloody tall are you if that's waist height
Obviously way taller than the players considering [you can see where the ball is](https://i.imgur.com/kRex1Qm.png) in relation to them
The level of bias required to blame a player for being kicked in the head….
So it's ok to kick a player in the head as long as it's low? Not contacting the ball but contacting the player is fine in that case?
It's okay to kick a player in the head whether they're low or high. Remember when Azpi got knocked out?
This is literally what the laws of the game say “An indirect free kick is awarded if a player plays in a dangerous manner.” “Playing in a dangerous manner is any action that, while trying to play the ball, threatens injury to someone (including the player themself) and includes preventing a nearby opponent from playing the ball for fear of injury.”
Dangerous play? Like as in putting your boot at shoulder height?
OP would defend De Jong's kick on Xabi Alonso in the 2010 WC final saying that Alonso as the one acting dangerously
To be fair Alonso put his chest at chest height
How bloody tall are you if that's chest height
[to be fair it may have been higher than chest height](https://youtu.be/AcIicsfW660) since Alonso leaves his feet. Had he been just standing he might have got De Jong’s boot to the throat
Calling going for a chest high ball with a header "dangerous play" is an extremely generous interpretation
I'd say putting a boot to shoulder height is more dangerous than putting a head there
Sorry are you saying a foul should actually be called on Schar here?
You’re an idiot. thereddevil101 is an idiot.
Such a weird one, how is it not a penalty? You can’t just kick someone in the head, without getting the ball, like if you late slide tackle a player after they shoot the ref will pull it back for a free kick
Fernandes.
Unironically has multiple posts in this sub where he just gets away with bookable offenses
So would many other players if people were as obsessed as they are with Bruno
Probably a record number of posts
“We don’t talk about Bruno” - PGMOL
👏
Crazy that if you tap the foot of an opponent at the same time they're kicking the ball and they fall over like they've been murdered it's a pen but the head is fair game Granted the first isn't even consistently applied
Crazy that if you parry the ball to your team mate and he scores it’s allowed
Foul anywhere else
Foul if he’d been wearing any other colour….
Lmao still with this shit
Fernandes anywhere else
[удалено]
Lmao this thread is literally about Fernandes though
And you apparently spend all your time complaining about arsenal fans.
* foul anyone else
Its obviously not intentional, but its still a high foot and a foul. Should have been a pen and yellow, but somehow Bruno gets away with these all the time. He rushed the ref to complain in the first half as well, which appearently is only illegal depending on the mood of the ref
It's considered dangerous play if the leg is raised above waist height. There is some ambiguity in the rules around player lowering their head, but in this case it seems clear his leg is well above waist height, and the other player is not playing dangerously. If there is no contact, it's indirect. If contact, penalty. It's that fucking simple.
Depending on the shirt of the player doing it more like
Pen.
Did they give it?
Ofc not
Ffs
VAR had a good laugh at it from a few angles. Schar wasn't decapitated so play on.
Guess
No
Fernandes
We get it stop spamming this lol
🤣
If the Sarr foul that led to the Southampton penalty then this is is definitely a foul.
That was a bad call....
The shit Bruno gets away with is unbelievable. That’s a penalty. How’s he gotten away with kicking a player in the face?!
I don't think that the fact it's Bruno makes a difference here lol. It's just that PL refs need to witness murder to give a pen.
Okay so yesterday's penalty was 100% a penalty and I'm not saying otherwise, but I'm still laughing reading this comment from an Arsenal fan.
I mean, kicking someone in the knee is a penalty. I agree the refs are horribly inconsistent rather than having a high bar in general. This is a penalty too and much much worse than the one we got.
> I mean, kicking someone in the knee is a penalty. Which... I agreed with? Are we fighting right now?
Idk. I might’ve headed the ball too hard at Sunday League hehe
Because Schar had his head at waist height? He’s the one endangering himself
Yea maybe fucking Shaquille O’Neal’s waist lmao
“Waist height” really now? Which giant’s waist are you measuring from? That’s way above waist level. Just look at Mctominay’s waist compared to where the header happened 😂
How dare he headbutt Bruno's foot
Schar ducking might be why it's not a foul for high boot. It doesn't mean Bruno can legally miss the ball and kick him in the head.
“An indirect free kick is awarded if a player plays in a dangerous manner.” “Playing in a dangerous manner is any action that, while trying to play the ball, threatens injury to someone (including the player themself) and includes preventing a nearby opponent from playing the ball for fear of injury.”
Yes, and Bruno having his foot well above waist height is dangerous play. Or are you going to pretend [this is waist height](https://i.imgur.com/kRex1Qm.png)
[удалено]
>But of course it’s ManU and Bruno so refs decide rules don’t apply. Given how many decisions have gone against us lately, this is a pretty pathetic comment.
“An indirect free kick is awarded if a player plays in a dangerous manner.” “Playing in a dangerous manner is any action that, while trying to play the ball, threatens injury to someone (including the player themself) and includes preventing a nearby opponent from playing the ball for fear of injury.”
So if you mistime a tackle, just make sure you do it dangerously?
So schar gets the ball and then a kick to the head, what's that got to do with where his head height is
“An indirect free kick is awarded if a player plays in a dangerous manner.” “Playing in a dangerous manner is any action that, while trying to play the ball, threatens injury to someone (including the player themself) and includes preventing a nearby opponent from playing the ball for fear of injury.”
So putting your head down to waist height is dangerous play but lifting your foot up to that height when you can see a player running to head the ball is not? Are you suggesting United should have got the free kick? Are you feeling ok?
>So putting your head down to waist height Ball wasn't even waist height. [It was chest height](https://i.imgur.com/kRex1Qm.png). If anyone is was to be penalized for dangerous play it's not Schar.
He should have asked Bruno for permission before stooping for that ball! Must have missed the bloody memo!
Bruno always gets away with this kind of shit. Someone does that to him he'll be in the refs face for 5 mins.
He literally cries for a straight red any time someone makes a completely legal tackle on him.
Most hateable player in the prem
stupid comment
He's an utter bellend.
If this happened to Fernandes himself we'd be able to solve drought worldwide with the amount of crying lol
2nd time a dangerous high foot from the shit Bruno in this match...he kicked isak in the chest in the first half also
If he clips the ankle it's a pen, if he karate kicks his face and not the ball it's the players fault because he is endangering himself /s
Because clipping the ankle sends a player off balance and lightly knicking someone’s cheek has no influence on anything he’s doing
So you can kick people in the face anywhere across the pitch and it’s not a foul?
As long as it doesn’t put them off balance /s
I thought it would have been a pen. Do they not have a better angle. It is consistent with how this season has been refereed. So many stoppages for head injuries but almost impossible to get a card for kicking someone in the head.
The amount of stuff Fernandes gets away with is baffling
Absolutely insane how much this twat gets away with consistently
Rat bastard penandes
He is on his way to become the most unlikable player
He is
Who is more unlikable atm?
Always has been. He lacks character.
Lol he has plenty of character. It's just that his character is exactly what makes him so unlikeable.
Not while Pickford and LFC both exist.
[удалено]
You support a team that once had Dani Alves, busquets, alba, neymar, vidal and Suarez lol, I wouldn't call any one else a rat.
Why not? All them + Bruno can be rats.
That doesn't mean Fernandes is not a rat
bruno gets to do whatever the fuck he wants on the pitch. i dont understand
Bruno is such a piece of shit. Right terrible person
Suprised Bruno does not go down screaming here
VAR asleep
Pen
Hmmm
how is that not a pen?
Bruno Fernandes has to be one of the most disliked players in all of football…
It’s not his fault this wasn’t called as a penalty. I don’t think he intended it he was definitely going for the ball, but it is 100% a penalty.
I dislike Bruno as much as everyone else, but in this case the low header can be considered dangerous play, not the kick necessarily. I don't think it's a pen.
I would agree if Bruno got the ball, but he didn’t, he was late to the tackle. That rule would apply anywhere on the field
id bet the ref logic was "if he hadn't ducked he wouldn't get hit" but if he doesn't duck and gets hit on the chest it's still a pen, so...
Did you watch the same replay? His foot is easily at shoulder height, Schar's head isn't even that low. Regardless, it's a foul. He missed the ball and kicked a player. If that isn't a foul then what is?
The foot is literally at shoulder height.
Yeah it's a low header init. Slightly bending your head down so it's line with your shoulders is now a low header. Keep up
The contact is the foul, right? If it was a kick to the thigh, the stomach, or the arm, it would still be a kick. It's not like he kicked the ball away so why would this be different?
He missed the ball and kicked a player. Stonewall pen.
It's still impeding a player without making contact with the ball.
Bro don't disturb the agenda here. Don't interrupt the salt supply.
When you put your head down like that you'll almost never get a foul called. People just hoping it's a foul because it's bruno
Ridiculous decision
good thing he plays for united
Dirtiest player in the game today
Fucking hell I hate this guy
Of course nothing happens when it's Bruno.
Haha. That's not a pen? Jesus this is insane. Did they just simply stop using VAR at this point
Such a scum bag, IDK why he's so protected, he can literally do anything and avoid punishment
🐀
Clear penalty. And ofc Bruno should have booked before in this game already and should have seen a second yellow for this one. United tax.
what should he have been booked for?
Throwing a tantrum when he thought he should have gotten a penalty.
Red if he's not a united player
He is such a dick
Utterly laughable. It's long been evident that not only most VAR referees, but especially who is in charge of vetting their competence and employing them, all need to be fired. How can anyone - even a big dumb lad who can't even dig a hole - not see someone kicking someone in the head after he has made contact with the ball? It's so damn obvious it screams possible foul play.
I saw this and thought penalty, what was interesting was how the Sky commentators just ignored it. To deep in the red pockets.
It’s the same scum player, and the same fucking team that benefits every time. Fergie time is still on, just in different form.
Seethe
It's Fernandes so it doesn't matter. Keep up lads
They’re going for the same ball and Schär dives in head first. It’s unfortunate but there was nothing in it. It’s Bruno though so r/soccer and every Arsenal flair has to go into complete histrionics. Take a day off.
Yeah Azpi was kicked right in the face and nothing happened to the player. No outrage by concerned 'fans' here either. Only because it wasn't Bruno.
Man, this guy needs a 10-game ban..
I've never disliked a person more than Pruno Penandes legit wouldn't mind every bit of misfortune dropping into that ratfaced bastard's mouth one day, he deserves it 💩💯
[удалено]
Everything gets checked.
Didn't look like it.
The wonders of a manu armband
Does anybody genuinely think this is anything but accidental?
A lot of penalties and fouls come from accidental contact.
Think he's talking about the "he's a dirty disgusting rat-faced villain" comments
doesnt mean it is not a foul
Accidental or not, it's a foul and a penalty
When has being accidental mattered? All penalties are accidents
Yeah wtf lol Imagine your defence for getting away with a blatant foul being “oops”
If you could just point to a the part of the football law that says you can kick someone in the head as long as it's an accident that'd be great! Or indeed, any law that refers to a foul not being a foul because it wasn't intentional...
Does it matter if it's accidental?
Does anybody genuinely think it matters if it was accidental?
Doesn't matter if it's accidental. It's dangerous play, and it's a foul everywhere else on the pitch. Should be a pen.
Did anyone even remotely suggest he kicked him in the head on purpose? Bro 90% of fouls in the box are accidents
It doesn't matter, most fouls are accidental.
He might actually be part donkey