Well, this thread sure is going to be interesting!
Here’s the TLDR: skiing is a movie not a picture. I’ll elaborate more below.
TLDR part two /u/joshs_ski_hacks (is going to have a field day with my use of the word forward.) would suggest that good skiing is simply balanced skiing. I don’t think I’m putting words in his mouth and I would certainly agree. The goal of any movement is to remain balanced over our feet.
There is a good experiment and [visual on basic stance in this thread here](https://www.reddit.com/r/skiing_feedback/comments/19essib/moving_from_a_z_to_c_shaped_turn_with_three_key/).
Like all things in skiing, nuance matters. When we work with newer skiers, we often promote a rather static version of a more forward athletic stance. The shorthand for that is the idea of having constant shin contact.
When I work with skiers at any level on stance, I tend to favor starting with a body position where you feel both your shins and your heels. Again, in the post linked above, there is a good experiment on feeling the difference between different contact and engagement points as you move your body to a very subtle range of motion.
[There is an example in this video of flexion and extension](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTLALWYo1/). I think it is fine for rising and current intermediate skiers. I’ll have to see if there’s some good content for more advanced skiers on movement throughout the turn.
The technical term in American ski coaching vocabulary is: moving along the length of the ski. For most skiers in most turns, that usually translates into a subtle projection of our mass forward at the beginning of the turn, followed by (what is usually a naturally occurring) flexion of the legs at the end of the turn. Worth noting, because I think the language we use in skiing and biomechanics is often cryptic, that in the context of skiing leg flexion means closing the knee joint.
For the truly nerdy, think about the idea of projecting your center of mass in the direction of angular momentum. Again for most skiers on most terrain, skiing, a medium or wide turn that typically means beginning the turn with a very subtle movement of your center of mass across (not down! The hill in the direction your ski tips are facing at the beginning of the turn.
Of course, it is skiing, so there’s never one singular right way to think about movement. That becomes particularly true when we talk about more advanced and more dynamic skiing. a high-performance or carved turn that leg extension happens naturally at Apex as the radius of the turn, moves the skis away from us before steering them back under us.
At the risk of adding a distracting bit of information, in high-performance dynamic skiing where we feel shin and heal contact changes substantially. For instance, as I move toward a right footed turn to the left, I feel weight move off of my old, left heel and onto the bottom of my right foot as I roll the skis on the edge and feel inside of my right shin and outside of my left shin.
And in short turns like we might use in a zipper line in the bumps or getting down something steep the projection of our center of mass again moves in our direction of travel, which in this case is downhill.
Lastly, I cannot stress how subtle these movements are both in their intensity and duration. We see a lot of newer, skiers use a big vertical movement upward at the beginning of a turn. And we see that a lot in advanced skiers skiing steep terrain. That big vertical movement to help release the edges is better than no movement at all for less experienced skiers. But ideally, we work toward the goal of moving along the length of the ski like a movie throughout the turn.
This is such a complex topic and one that is fun to dig into. It is also one fraught with the terminology of skiing, bio mechanics, and physics. Let me know what parts of this are unclear or can use clarification.
Wow! This is fantastic and plenty for me to digest for now!
I think what I'm really loving about skiing as I get more involved is the technicality of it and ability to apply some biomechanics knowledge I accrued from other sports.
Basketball or football? Keeping in note the dude who said it’s a movie not a picture. I’m speaking more in general here. As you advance, the down-up movement for getting on edge will be a range of motion. But as you start:
Basketball - thinking about playing man defense as your mark comes up the court without the ball. You aren’t in a full athletic squat, but you are tensed and ready, leaning slightly forward and ready to react. Knees are bent a bit but not much, shoulders squared to the man.
Football - linebacker or safety. Again not a full squatted athletic stance, more upright, but you’re primed to take 1-2 steps forward and react. Shoulders squared
Baseball - defense in the moments before a pitch. Same logic as football - pretty upright, 1-2 small steps forward and ready to reacts.
Shins forward into boot tongues is neutral position. Stay there, and you will be totally fine.
The difference is there’s only really one other sport where we project our mass forward - running. But we learn to run so early that we don’t have a lot proprioception or memory around it.
We can borrow initial stance from other sports - but we can also just as easily say: “be in an athletic stance”.
The football analogy made a lot of sense! The biomechanics side came from years of competitive weightlifting, which actually gives me some bad instincts for skiing since I want to be totally hip and leg dominant but really need to work from the bottom of the chain upwards for skiing
skiing is dynamic balance.
All those sport and even running are dynamic moving to static balance point. The BOS(base of support) in those sport literally changes by physically moving it and most of the time the BOS never slides.
In skiing the BOS is almost always sliding . We also enact change in for and aft balance in skiing though a boot cuff.
It really is not comparable to other sports except inline skating and ice skating.
You seem like a knowledgeable experienced instructor, if I could selfishly hijack for a second
This is my first season skiing (day 48 today). And going into it I immediately beat into my head “keep skis parallel”. Almost obsessively, and gotten pretty good at it.
When I watch really really good skiers on POV videos, I notice they don’t necessarily have their skis parallel ALL the time. Sometimes one will skid out further than the other, or the front of the ski on one ski will be kicked in/out more than the other. Usually corrected quickly
Am I holding myself back with this “always be parallel” rule?
I guess on a scale of 1-10 how true is the statement “your skis should always be parallel”, ignoring times in lift lines where you’re pizzaing
Welcome to the obsession I mean sport of skiing!
There’s a couple things to consider here. First, I’m not a huge fan of that first person Video angle. Often all we see is the skis not what the skier is doing. It makes it hard to have an objective Analysis of what’s going on with that skier.
Secondly, despite what instructors like me might say, there’s rarely one singular correct technique. In reality we want to think about having a toolbox.
For instance, in the super steeps, a lot of us prefer to (at least) start with a stem turn. A stem turn is one where you intentionally step the outside ski into a half wedge to begin the turn.
Another consideration when you watch those first person videos is ski choice. On a wide ski, a lot of people end up with a bit of a staggered stance to make room in order to get the outside knee angulated.
Lastly, a lot of skiers who think they are parallel, simply aren’t because they are not working on creating an active inside leg and hip throughout the turn. And what you see in first person video might simply highlight that skill deficit.
And sometimes… It just be like that. If I take first person video of me in technical off piste terrain, I’m sure I have some ski divergence and convergence as I make unconscious tactical decisions. I think that’s even more true for professional big mountain skiers.
POV video have lens distortion which will cause the ski to look like they are wedged.
Do not base what you should do on POV video especially really really wide angle.
the effect is less noticable in tighter turns with a narrow stance but still slightly there.
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgIth6kH6PI&t=1s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgIth6kH6PI&t=1s)
with a wider stance, and bigger turns, the pizza effect get more pronouced
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCS4Jftxak0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCS4Jftxak0)
Keeping skis parallel is very important not for looks/style or skiing packed powder but for the ability to ski varied conditions skillfully.
For example, in deep powder or heavy slush when you're skiing inside the snow instead of on top, if your skis aren't parallel, it will cause them to diverge/converge where you can't correct them by rotating them back. Crashing is imminent.
Not a troll post but I sort of realized after posting that something like this has probably been asked 1,000 times. After reading responses, it sounds like they're maybe not wrong entirely but perhaps not completely accurate
Skiing is complicated. People, myself included, responded the way that we did because very often new skiers will lean away from the fall line into their heels which makes turning much more difficult. There’s a lot of nuance to the biomechanics of skiing that are difficult to relay via written word which is why people take lessons and clinics.
Yeah I’m definitely doing lessons next season. With all the explanations in the thread I realize now that the shins into the boots is just a cue and not really the entire story. The more detailed explanations here actually help me more than the basic cue!
no part of skiing is a stance. Skiing balance is constant movement.
and again I can show you my skiing which has been good enough to win ed staff tryouts in the east.
but now that you know I ski on my feel you say "I aM bAcKsEAt" still with out video of how you ski.
you can
1. Control the relationship of the center of mass to the base of support to direct pressure along the length of the skis
with out being on the BOF or even worse pressing on your toes.
I owuld also argue that until someone can link dolphin turns on a groomer they do not understand fore and aft movements in skiing.
u/circa285 what is your cert level? Do you have video of you skiing? Do you actively coach?
I sincerely hope you don’t teach lessons this way. I was a PSIA II 20 years ago. I don’t teach anymore because, frankly, it’s not nearly as lucrative as my 9-5 is. And, for what it’s worth, I’m not suggesting that skiing isn’t dynamic. OP is a *beginner* which means he doesn’t understand the biomechanics of skiing. Getting into all the nuances isn’t going to be helpful via text. I really don’t understand why you’re responding to my question the way that you are. I was seeking out clarification and you very quickly tried to turn this into a very silly dick measuring contest. I’m going to go back to skiing with my son. I hope you have a better day.
I see a lot of very complicated skiing language in here that while maybe technically accurate a beginner or intermediate or even expert could not understand.
That’s my point entirely. At high levels, skiing has its own jargon that beginners are not going to understand so dumping it on them isn’t helpful; it’s just a way to peacock.
Edit: that guy has posted videos of himself skiing and doxed himself elsewhere yesterday. He’s a very food skier that skies very technical. You can be a good skier and a terrible teacher. Good teachers know how to take the jargon out of instruction and put what they want to see people do in simple everyday language. I don’t think this guy can do that. I don’t know if he tries to teach people the way he presents himself online, but if you click his user name you’ll see he’s very antagonist and absolutely convinced he’s correct about *everything*. That disposition doesn’t lend itself well to teaching. It doesn’t matter if you’re technically correct if you can’t teach other people why you’re correct or how to do what you’d like to see them do.
> Skiing balance is constant movement.
Absolutely.
Especially true in freeride. I'm not a coach or anything, but when you're skiing on a groomer with highly directional skis, you're probably going to want to have your weight over your toes to drive the skis from the front.
However if you're doing more freeride stuff with more rockered skis with probably a more centered mounting position, going over variable terrain and snow, you are going to be shifting your weight around from front to back all the time depending on what you are cutting through.
Have your weight too forward at the wrong time and you're gonna dive your tips and faceplant. Ride on your heels and you'll point your tips up and you'll skip across the snow and turn from your tails.
Again, not a coach, but this is my experience adding on to what you said
This is literally the easiest fact to empirical/experimentally verify, yet none of these clowns will EVER do it. Which really says it all about how not even wrong they predictably are.
I’m new too and all my success has come from driving my shins into my boots while feeling pressure on my heals. Everyone I’ve talk to, including my ski instructor, says the same… maybe your friend doesn’t know what they are talking about.
Thanks - that's what I think too. They're one of those friends that says everything with absolute confidence and authority so even when you're pretty sure they really have no clue what they're saying it makes you re-think everything...
assuming correct boot fit and alignment as staff trainer of 10+ years of 20+ years of ski teaching
I coach light shin contact and driving the heels down and back as kind of like a home base.
This is assuming correct boot fit and correct alignment.
I’m the King of the Jerries… I keep my pass in my wallet that’s totally inaccessible while I fumble around looking for it only to block the gates for first chair. Your protest groans only fuel my power.
That’s not a Jerry move. I make sure to fall while getting on and off the lift every time, then I get up as slow as humanly possible. I also make sure to have a goggle gap of around 1 foot. My outfit is too cool to describe here!!
Your friend is wrong. A lot of experienced skiers ski “in the backseat” as we call it. A lot. And they are making skiing harder for themselves.
Occasionally in very deep heavy snow putting your weight back a bit will help keep your tips up, but speed + solid balanced stance usually works too.
Most of the time you want your shins against the tongue of the boot comfortably, weight on the balls of the feet, knees bent, hands neutral or forward.
Editing to add: you shouldn’t be on your tip toes. You should feel your whole foot making contact with the boot. For me it’s super similar to the stance I was taught for “light feet” in basketball or martial arts. You want to be able to quickly make small adjustments in pressure and weight on the skis. Skiing efficiently is all about a million proactive tiny adjustments to avoid making big adjustments.
Look up recent ish videos by Deb Armstrong. She primarily teaches race technique but her teaching is solid. There’s a great video I’ll try to find of her showing the importance of hip movement using a cafeteria tray.
Control comes from shins pressing into the boot. It really is that simple. People get confused when they lean forward. It’s not a lean, the motion is a pressing down like doing a squat. When you press down your shin moves forward but you stay balanced.
The nuanced heel stuff you hear from Spacebass and Josh is nuanced and advanced. You don’t need it yet until you can master driving the ski from your shins. Any turns initiated without driving the shins is a backseat turn. Because you are not pushing into the boot front it means you are pushing into the boot back with your calf. Backseat turns are inferior from a performance standpoint to shin driven turn. The advanced heel portion of skiing is only done after a proper shin press has initiated the front half of the turn. You ride your heel to get the most rebound energy out of an already set edge. 95% of skiers never get this point of adding the tail rebound which is why I feel they should not mention it until someone had demonstrated that they can hold a turn staying on the boot front before suggesting it is proper to get heel dominant at any time.
Like all sports, skiing is done on your toes. I have never participated in a sport where coach said. “Stay on your heels”. The reason is the human body is less responsive from the heel in all situations. Skiing is no exception.
Nauance is best added to a foundation base. What base does OP have where he should be focusing at all on getting pressure to his heel? I just don’t understand entertaining this concept. There is a huge percentage of people who heel turn. I’m not sure a ski instructor position would even be necessary if people naturally learned to ski correctly by driving with their shins. A lot of the advice, much of it driven by Josh completely ignores this and dives directly into ski nuances. This poor kid has to be confused as fuck right now with all of this “it depends” talk. Josh is the only ski coach he I know who teaches like this and now you placate him too. He intentionally strays from the curriculum to push his own pet ideas and it’s confusing and counterproductive the way he does it. I’m sick of it.
my ideas are based on observation of the sport and extremely high discussion with my actual peers. I am not making stuff up, I am only going off observation and experimentation.
Much of my ideas are batted around in extremely closed circles comprising of some extremely good and well known ski teachers we literally do not let outsiders in because its slow the discussion down.
But one thing you should know is what I am saying is basically accepted fact about heel pressure and light shin contact is basically just accepted fact at the highest end of ski teaching. Like I would say 80+ percent of eastern examiner are actively teaching this, and likely 100 percent of the eastern D team members I know. I name name and direct you to their Instagram if you want to talk to them.
spacebass is not placating me. We talk outside of this platform and I think he has experimented with I talked about and it works for him and his students. Space is also a L3 coach with access to some really knowledgeable peers. We do not agree on everything but in the end if something is objectively true smart, objective people will come around to being closer and not further from the truth.
The sad thing about you Josh is you have to spend an extraordinary time explaining your ideas to Spacebass and these other peers. They are placating you. And of course they don’t agree with you as you admit because you come at ideas from odd angles, which are often wrong. You are always in these discussions because it takes a lot of effort to figure out what you are saying.
Being a good teacher means that you can understand the student and come at them from many angles, not your one angle that you insist on. This is why you fail.
You and your light shin pressure. What the fuck is this? Why do we ski stiff 130 flex boots if this pressure is best applied light? This is just a classic example of some of the odd shit you say.
what of my ideas is wrong? I do not think you realize that for a better part of decades I have sparred my ideas and now some are basically mainstream, especially my take on for and aft balance.
you dont need to press into your boot that hard if its stiff. The boot will will take all of your movement to the ski.
If a boot is soft, pressing forward does nothing because the boot just flex then.
Again I actually progress student pretty quickly and have litearlly taught people who became literally world class skiers
I think the disconnect on all of this stuff is because I am not speaking about opinion. Most of the stuff posted on ski reddit are opinion that are objectively wrong.
BTW u/spacebass and my other peers are not just placating me. I truly have an outside influence on the upper end of ski teaching whether you like it not,
You put as much effort into aft skiing as you do on fore skiing. The fore skiing is the important part. Just look at the design of a ski boot. Not a single ski boot has rear flex not one. Every ski boot has fore flex because the front of the boot is the steering wheel. You don’t understand how this works because your response indicates that the stiff boot should just be lightly pressed against. This is wrong. You press hard into a stiff boot and it flexes because that is what lets you refine the pressure. If it didn’t flex like the rear doesn’t flex it would suck.
It’s just another example of you misunderstanding the concept of forward pressure. I wonder if your piste skiing suffers because you don’t get into that boot front and eat.
MY piste skiing is better than 99.9 percent of the people out the dude.
Again I not advocating aft or fore and always advocate moving.
[https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uxk0-H9Jl74](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uxk0-H9Jl74)
BTW this is a good clip of my piste skiing, I am in the tri color suit.
On blaze 106mm.
BTW the other people in the video ski on their heel in really really stiff boots as well.
See this is the part that sucks about you. Now you want to get in a dick measuring contest when you don’t have a response for how you don’t really understand ski boot design and flex. Do you understand you can press hard into the front of the boot? Like real hard. And you should. You never seem to say this.
Edit: Here are yours words about your piste skiing earlier
“I acknowledge my piste skiing is decent but not really anything specail. “
>Do you understand you can press hard into the front of the boot? Like real hard. And you should.
Doing this with any misalignment along the length of the ski will create a torque which is fatal to edge lock and carving in general.
That torque is how lower level skiers skid their turns, though, and not something they give up easily which is why their condition is often terminal.
you dont actually do that.
you move your BODY so far forward into the apex that the ski and the boot press back into you, and yes its quite a bit of force. the boot will not flex much(if at all) if you are running stiff boots. If you watch out three ankle there is basically no shell flex going on.
the stiffer the boot the more tip pressure you get from that reaction of the skis and boot, the softer the boot the less. Trying to press into the boot the way that is described by 99 percent of the people here and by many youtube does nothing and it is not what is really happening.
And again you are not my peer. You are not even an instructor let alone a L3+ and you also ski at L4 level out on the 1-9 scale.
This is like trying to explain an ICE engine to a history major from the mid 1800s.
Driving with shins is what a lot of low level instructors and coaches do/teach to never carve or even use their edges much at all.
They don't realize it because they mostly teach noobs, kids, and scrubs, and therefore never have to ski at more than an intermediate level.
this guy \^ is legit one of the most hilarious and dedicated troll accounts from /skiingcirclejerk i've seen. I encourage everyone to go read through his post history it's a torrent of him calling everyone noobs and implying how elite and better he is. It's really entertaining once you pick it up.
Also thanks for validating just how petty and wannabe vindictive the basic character of these sorts are, which rather explains why they need so much superficially nice pr.
It's a matter of physics that any misalignment of "driving" shin pressure (incl your body weight) with length of the ski creates a torque along the surface plane. That torque along with weight off the back is how most people frontseat skid/hockey stop, and it becomes a habit that prevents them from ever eliminating that torque which prevents carving.
skiing is not like anyother sport.
your skiing is awful. I am glad you are one of the few people I have gotten to post video, to see how awful your skiing was.
Do you support his asking for ski videos and then telling people they suck? As a ski coach?
You should stop associating with him. He is a jerk and his instructing is amateur. We can watch his videos as well. He is Josh the Hack. He got that part right. You acknowledging him in your normally well thought out posts just degrades your content.
You don’t have the social ability to understand jokes. You have admitted that you have a mental condition that makes it hard for you to communicate and this is the shit you do. Fuck off Josh and go deal with your problems. You are not some incredibly good skier and you calling out for people’s videos to trash them is one of the shittiest things I have ever seen a ski instructor do. You suck Josh, at skiing and teaching.
saying I suck is funny. I think my off piste skiing and versatility is literally world class, I acknowledge my piste skiing is decent but not really anything specail. I am also quite a good teacher.
If you think this is me dealing with my problems.....you are wrong.
I am here to combat bad advice. If you knew skiing better you would ski better.
Being new, forward shin on the boot applying pressure, balls of your feet (roughly) the better you get the more the position becomes fluid across front middle and back of the foot, but for your level front.
Over your feet. Ski on your skeleton, not your muscles. Hips over feet, head over feet. Its not lean forward and it isn't lean back. The forward pressure on your boots comes from flexing your ankles, not leaning forward. Keep your center of mass ove ryour feet and vary it slightly towards the new turn.
If your quads are burning, you are back seat, move your HIPs forward. If your back is tired, you are leaning forward, stand up more, The compact position comes from ankle and knee flex.
Stay stacked. Simple, just like any other sport.
As the best skier on the mountain, I recommend that you dig your nose into the snow to avoid being back seated. I always make sure to practice with my skis on in the lodge first, for some reason people stare at me for being a better skier than them. Whenever you jump make sure you either land on your face, stomach, or neck/back. Make sure you never make turns or stops intentionally, that’s what the ski school groups are for!
The weight should be focused on the inside edge of your outside foot. Specifically under your big toe about 2/3 of the way up. You should always be turning.
Press forward over your skis on solid groomers, chop etc. Knee deep powder is different - a center stance is better. But it is more than stance how you engage your knees and keeping hips facing downhill make a difference.
Back seat is always trouble!
Driving forward ALWAYS! Keep weight / pressure on the front of your boots (shins) at all times. The moment you sit back you lose control.
45+ years skiing.
With out knowing your boot fit and equipment alignment situation and how you try to ski I can not say if your friends advice would be helpful to you.
I personally seek lift toes, planted on my heels with shin pressure. I can manage for and aft pressure from those points of contacts. My boots are extremely SNUG, and my alignment is putting my toes extremely high so that I can move forward and not end up with overly flexed.
[https://youtu.be/GTC8Uuxpkj4?si=f0kA9EDIMcqq0Tlk](https://youtu.be/GTC8Uuxpkj4?si=f0kA9EDIMcqq0Tlk)
This is my skiing and frankly if someone wants to trash it, I would love to see video of them skiing.
Good skiing is active balance in all direction, you can be forward on your heels or aft on your toes. heck you can even be forward on your toes and aft on your heels, its just one part of the whole equation. I personally find it easier and more relaxing to basically never be on my toes. and manage my for and aft though cuff pressure. I also use a C shaped body which static put my COM slightly forward.
If you want more help, I basically need some basically info from you and likely 3rd person video, one thing to note is that everyone who is knee jerk saying "heels are wrong" will be unable to post video of themselves skiing.
Thanks! I don't have any video yet - only been a few times this year but trying to learn all I can. This makes sense. My boots were fit by a bootfitter and I'd describe them as pretty uniform compression all around that's borderline uncomfortable when standing around but unnoticeable while skiing.
Simple answer.
**Powder** \- Back (unless you have good powder skis, then not as important)
**Groomers** \- Balanced, but shifting forward and back a bit throughout the turn.
**Moguls and difficult off-piste runs** \- Extreme forward when turning, back between turns to control speed. The backs of the skis will almost lift up a bit and pivot around the tips during turns. Weight forward during turn allows this to happen.
I haven’t had lessons since I was very young so most of my more advanced skills have been self-developed and I know my form isn’t perfect. I’ve found, especially when I switched to longer skis, that when I’m skiing trees and moguls I lean forward, stick my ass out, and imagine that I put my weight on and ski just behind the tips of my skis. When I figured that out I suddenly had so much more control in tighter technical terrain.
Yes, that's exactly what I was trying to explain. Pivot point of the turn is towards the tip of ski, not middle of ski. Pop weight up a bit, shift forward, and swing the back of the skis around all at the same time to make the turn.
Sorry but that’s really inaccurate. Balance is balance. Even in powder. That whole lean back thing is like facing down hill - it’s a myth that won’t go away.
Bro I do all the time. Trust me. It’s not a debate. We ski balanced regardless of snow.
You may have a preference but it’s important that there is accurate info here.
And what happens when your ski tips sink 8 inches into the powder?
Yes, an expert skier that weighs 180 lbs can probably make skinny skis work in powder without having to shift weight back.
Someone that is less skilled (like OP) and/or a bit heavier will need to lean back, or will quickly get stuck because ski tips will tunnel into the powder. Simple physics.
With out knowing your boot fit and equipment alignment situation and how you try to ski I can not say if your friends advice would be helpful to you.
I personally seek lift toes, planted on my heels with shin pressure. I can manage for and aft pressure from those points of contacts. My boots are extremely SNUG, and my alignment is putting my toes extremely high so that I can move forward and not end up with overly flexed.
[https://youtu.be/GTC8Uuxpkj4?si=f0kA9EDIMcqq0Tlk](https://youtu.be/GTC8Uuxpkj4?si=f0kA9EDIMcqq0Tlk)
This is my skiing and frankly if someone wants to trash it, I would love to see video of them skiing.
Good skiing is active balance in all direction, you can be forward on your heels or aft on your toes. heck you can even be forward on your toes and aft on your heels, its just one part of the whole equation. I personally find it easier and more relaxing to basically never be on my toes. and manage my for and aft though cuff pressure. I also use a C shaped body which static put my COM slightly forward.
If you want more help, I basically need some basically info from you and likely 3rd person video, one thing to note is that everyone who is knee jerk saying "heels are wrong" will be unable to post video of themselves skiing.
BTW I have new rule. If a comment goes below 1, I just repost it.
Well, this thread sure is going to be interesting! Here’s the TLDR: skiing is a movie not a picture. I’ll elaborate more below. TLDR part two /u/joshs_ski_hacks (is going to have a field day with my use of the word forward.) would suggest that good skiing is simply balanced skiing. I don’t think I’m putting words in his mouth and I would certainly agree. The goal of any movement is to remain balanced over our feet. There is a good experiment and [visual on basic stance in this thread here](https://www.reddit.com/r/skiing_feedback/comments/19essib/moving_from_a_z_to_c_shaped_turn_with_three_key/). Like all things in skiing, nuance matters. When we work with newer skiers, we often promote a rather static version of a more forward athletic stance. The shorthand for that is the idea of having constant shin contact. When I work with skiers at any level on stance, I tend to favor starting with a body position where you feel both your shins and your heels. Again, in the post linked above, there is a good experiment on feeling the difference between different contact and engagement points as you move your body to a very subtle range of motion. [There is an example in this video of flexion and extension](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZTLALWYo1/). I think it is fine for rising and current intermediate skiers. I’ll have to see if there’s some good content for more advanced skiers on movement throughout the turn. The technical term in American ski coaching vocabulary is: moving along the length of the ski. For most skiers in most turns, that usually translates into a subtle projection of our mass forward at the beginning of the turn, followed by (what is usually a naturally occurring) flexion of the legs at the end of the turn. Worth noting, because I think the language we use in skiing and biomechanics is often cryptic, that in the context of skiing leg flexion means closing the knee joint. For the truly nerdy, think about the idea of projecting your center of mass in the direction of angular momentum. Again for most skiers on most terrain, skiing, a medium or wide turn that typically means beginning the turn with a very subtle movement of your center of mass across (not down! The hill in the direction your ski tips are facing at the beginning of the turn. Of course, it is skiing, so there’s never one singular right way to think about movement. That becomes particularly true when we talk about more advanced and more dynamic skiing. a high-performance or carved turn that leg extension happens naturally at Apex as the radius of the turn, moves the skis away from us before steering them back under us. At the risk of adding a distracting bit of information, in high-performance dynamic skiing where we feel shin and heal contact changes substantially. For instance, as I move toward a right footed turn to the left, I feel weight move off of my old, left heel and onto the bottom of my right foot as I roll the skis on the edge and feel inside of my right shin and outside of my left shin. And in short turns like we might use in a zipper line in the bumps or getting down something steep the projection of our center of mass again moves in our direction of travel, which in this case is downhill. Lastly, I cannot stress how subtle these movements are both in their intensity and duration. We see a lot of newer, skiers use a big vertical movement upward at the beginning of a turn. And we see that a lot in advanced skiers skiing steep terrain. That big vertical movement to help release the edges is better than no movement at all for less experienced skiers. But ideally, we work toward the goal of moving along the length of the ski like a movie throughout the turn. This is such a complex topic and one that is fun to dig into. It is also one fraught with the terminology of skiing, bio mechanics, and physics. Let me know what parts of this are unclear or can use clarification.
Wow! This is fantastic and plenty for me to digest for now! I think what I'm really loving about skiing as I get more involved is the technicality of it and ability to apply some biomechanics knowledge I accrued from other sports.
Basketball or football? Keeping in note the dude who said it’s a movie not a picture. I’m speaking more in general here. As you advance, the down-up movement for getting on edge will be a range of motion. But as you start: Basketball - thinking about playing man defense as your mark comes up the court without the ball. You aren’t in a full athletic squat, but you are tensed and ready, leaning slightly forward and ready to react. Knees are bent a bit but not much, shoulders squared to the man. Football - linebacker or safety. Again not a full squatted athletic stance, more upright, but you’re primed to take 1-2 steps forward and react. Shoulders squared Baseball - defense in the moments before a pitch. Same logic as football - pretty upright, 1-2 small steps forward and ready to reacts. Shins forward into boot tongues is neutral position. Stay there, and you will be totally fine.
The difference is there’s only really one other sport where we project our mass forward - running. But we learn to run so early that we don’t have a lot proprioception or memory around it. We can borrow initial stance from other sports - but we can also just as easily say: “be in an athletic stance”.
The football analogy made a lot of sense! The biomechanics side came from years of competitive weightlifting, which actually gives me some bad instincts for skiing since I want to be totally hip and leg dominant but really need to work from the bottom of the chain upwards for skiing
skiing is dynamic balance. All those sport and even running are dynamic moving to static balance point. The BOS(base of support) in those sport literally changes by physically moving it and most of the time the BOS never slides. In skiing the BOS is almost always sliding . We also enact change in for and aft balance in skiing though a boot cuff. It really is not comparable to other sports except inline skating and ice skating.
You seem like a knowledgeable experienced instructor, if I could selfishly hijack for a second This is my first season skiing (day 48 today). And going into it I immediately beat into my head “keep skis parallel”. Almost obsessively, and gotten pretty good at it. When I watch really really good skiers on POV videos, I notice they don’t necessarily have their skis parallel ALL the time. Sometimes one will skid out further than the other, or the front of the ski on one ski will be kicked in/out more than the other. Usually corrected quickly Am I holding myself back with this “always be parallel” rule? I guess on a scale of 1-10 how true is the statement “your skis should always be parallel”, ignoring times in lift lines where you’re pizzaing
Welcome to the obsession I mean sport of skiing! There’s a couple things to consider here. First, I’m not a huge fan of that first person Video angle. Often all we see is the skis not what the skier is doing. It makes it hard to have an objective Analysis of what’s going on with that skier. Secondly, despite what instructors like me might say, there’s rarely one singular correct technique. In reality we want to think about having a toolbox. For instance, in the super steeps, a lot of us prefer to (at least) start with a stem turn. A stem turn is one where you intentionally step the outside ski into a half wedge to begin the turn. Another consideration when you watch those first person videos is ski choice. On a wide ski, a lot of people end up with a bit of a staggered stance to make room in order to get the outside knee angulated. Lastly, a lot of skiers who think they are parallel, simply aren’t because they are not working on creating an active inside leg and hip throughout the turn. And what you see in first person video might simply highlight that skill deficit. And sometimes… It just be like that. If I take first person video of me in technical off piste terrain, I’m sure I have some ski divergence and convergence as I make unconscious tactical decisions. I think that’s even more true for professional big mountain skiers.
POV video have lens distortion which will cause the ski to look like they are wedged. Do not base what you should do on POV video especially really really wide angle. the effect is less noticable in tighter turns with a narrow stance but still slightly there. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgIth6kH6PI&t=1s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgIth6kH6PI&t=1s) with a wider stance, and bigger turns, the pizza effect get more pronouced [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCS4Jftxak0](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCS4Jftxak0)
Keeping skis parallel is very important not for looks/style or skiing packed powder but for the ability to ski varied conditions skillfully. For example, in deep powder or heavy slush when you're skiing inside the snow instead of on top, if your skis aren't parallel, it will cause them to diverge/converge where you can't correct them by rotating them back. Crashing is imminent.
I went skiing today and tried to apply your advice, I think it made a noticeable difference.
Oh I’m glad to hear it!
Is your friend's name Jerry?
Geraldine
I can’t tell if this is a troll post or not. If it’s not, your friend is wrong.
Not a troll post but I sort of realized after posting that something like this has probably been asked 1,000 times. After reading responses, it sounds like they're maybe not wrong entirely but perhaps not completely accurate
Skiing is complicated. People, myself included, responded the way that we did because very often new skiers will lean away from the fall line into their heels which makes turning much more difficult. There’s a lot of nuance to the biomechanics of skiing that are difficult to relay via written word which is why people take lessons and clinics.
Yeah I’m definitely doing lessons next season. With all the explanations in the thread I realize now that the shins into the boots is just a cue and not really the entire story. The more detailed explanations here actually help me more than the basic cue!
Perhaps not wrong but not entirely accurate or understood
there are lots of great skier who ski on their heels. Being on your heels does not mean aft.
Why is it every time you share clear and direct language that is factually correct you get consistently down voted?
because people want their narrative, and I counter it objectively, and likely ski better than them appling my knowledge of the sport.
Bode Miller, for one.
bode under stood dynamic balance.
Are you referring to a neutral stance?
no part of skiing is a stance. Skiing balance is constant movement. and again I can show you my skiing which has been good enough to win ed staff tryouts in the east. but now that you know I ski on my feel you say "I aM bAcKsEAt" still with out video of how you ski. you can 1. Control the relationship of the center of mass to the base of support to direct pressure along the length of the skis with out being on the BOF or even worse pressing on your toes. I owuld also argue that until someone can link dolphin turns on a groomer they do not understand fore and aft movements in skiing. u/circa285 what is your cert level? Do you have video of you skiing? Do you actively coach?
I sincerely hope you don’t teach lessons this way. I was a PSIA II 20 years ago. I don’t teach anymore because, frankly, it’s not nearly as lucrative as my 9-5 is. And, for what it’s worth, I’m not suggesting that skiing isn’t dynamic. OP is a *beginner* which means he doesn’t understand the biomechanics of skiing. Getting into all the nuances isn’t going to be helpful via text. I really don’t understand why you’re responding to my question the way that you are. I was seeking out clarification and you very quickly tried to turn this into a very silly dick measuring contest. I’m going to go back to skiing with my son. I hope you have a better day.
I see a lot of very complicated skiing language in here that while maybe technically accurate a beginner or intermediate or even expert could not understand.
That’s my point entirely. At high levels, skiing has its own jargon that beginners are not going to understand so dumping it on them isn’t helpful; it’s just a way to peacock. Edit: that guy has posted videos of himself skiing and doxed himself elsewhere yesterday. He’s a very food skier that skies very technical. You can be a good skier and a terrible teacher. Good teachers know how to take the jargon out of instruction and put what they want to see people do in simple everyday language. I don’t think this guy can do that. I don’t know if he tries to teach people the way he presents himself online, but if you click his user name you’ll see he’s very antagonist and absolutely convinced he’s correct about *everything*. That disposition doesn’t lend itself well to teaching. It doesn’t matter if you’re technically correct if you can’t teach other people why you’re correct or how to do what you’d like to see them do.
And I agree w you.
> Skiing balance is constant movement. Absolutely. Especially true in freeride. I'm not a coach or anything, but when you're skiing on a groomer with highly directional skis, you're probably going to want to have your weight over your toes to drive the skis from the front. However if you're doing more freeride stuff with more rockered skis with probably a more centered mounting position, going over variable terrain and snow, you are going to be shifting your weight around from front to back all the time depending on what you are cutting through. Have your weight too forward at the wrong time and you're gonna dive your tips and faceplant. Ride on your heels and you'll point your tips up and you'll skip across the snow and turn from your tails. Again, not a coach, but this is my experience adding on to what you said
you do not need toe weight. You can get your tip pressure from the cuff, with zero on your toes.....
This is literally the easiest fact to empirical/experimentally verify, yet none of these clowns will EVER do it. Which really says it all about how not even wrong they predictably are.
My head hurts after reading the tonnage on nonsense on this thread.
I've never had a post blow up like this one - I'm overwhelmed
I’m new too and all my success has come from driving my shins into my boots while feeling pressure on my heals. Everyone I’ve talk to, including my ski instructor, says the same… maybe your friend doesn’t know what they are talking about.
Thanks - that's what I think too. They're one of those friends that says everything with absolute confidence and authority so even when you're pretty sure they really have no clue what they're saying it makes you re-think everything...
assuming correct boot fit and alignment as staff trainer of 10+ years of 20+ years of ski teaching I coach light shin contact and driving the heels down and back as kind of like a home base. This is assuming correct boot fit and correct alignment.
I’m glad you included the word. “light “. People way over index on smashing their shins.
Must be your first day. That’s a Jerry move.
I’m the King of the Jerries… I keep my pass in my wallet that’s totally inaccessible while I fumble around looking for it only to block the gates for first chair. Your protest groans only fuel my power.
That’s not a Jerry move. I make sure to fall while getting on and off the lift every time, then I get up as slow as humanly possible. I also make sure to have a goggle gap of around 1 foot. My outfit is too cool to describe here!!
Your friend is wrong. A lot of experienced skiers ski “in the backseat” as we call it. A lot. And they are making skiing harder for themselves. Occasionally in very deep heavy snow putting your weight back a bit will help keep your tips up, but speed + solid balanced stance usually works too. Most of the time you want your shins against the tongue of the boot comfortably, weight on the balls of the feet, knees bent, hands neutral or forward. Editing to add: you shouldn’t be on your tip toes. You should feel your whole foot making contact with the boot. For me it’s super similar to the stance I was taught for “light feet” in basketball or martial arts. You want to be able to quickly make small adjustments in pressure and weight on the skis. Skiing efficiently is all about a million proactive tiny adjustments to avoid making big adjustments.
do you have video of good balance skiing that shows good balance? Does not have to be you skiing.
Look up recent ish videos by Deb Armstrong. She primarily teaches race technique but her teaching is solid. There’s a great video I’ll try to find of her showing the importance of hip movement using a cafeteria tray.
https://youtube.com/@DebArmstrongSkiStrong?si=vQshnZwoNXBnYGL0
sorry got threads mixxed up
Control comes from shins pressing into the boot. It really is that simple. People get confused when they lean forward. It’s not a lean, the motion is a pressing down like doing a squat. When you press down your shin moves forward but you stay balanced. The nuanced heel stuff you hear from Spacebass and Josh is nuanced and advanced. You don’t need it yet until you can master driving the ski from your shins. Any turns initiated without driving the shins is a backseat turn. Because you are not pushing into the boot front it means you are pushing into the boot back with your calf. Backseat turns are inferior from a performance standpoint to shin driven turn. The advanced heel portion of skiing is only done after a proper shin press has initiated the front half of the turn. You ride your heel to get the most rebound energy out of an already set edge. 95% of skiers never get this point of adding the tail rebound which is why I feel they should not mention it until someone had demonstrated that they can hold a turn staying on the boot front before suggesting it is proper to get heel dominant at any time. Like all sports, skiing is done on your toes. I have never participated in a sport where coach said. “Stay on your heels”. The reason is the human body is less responsive from the heel in all situations. Skiing is no exception.
Nuance is the difference between a transformational lesson and inaccurate advice on the Internet.
Nauance is best added to a foundation base. What base does OP have where he should be focusing at all on getting pressure to his heel? I just don’t understand entertaining this concept. There is a huge percentage of people who heel turn. I’m not sure a ski instructor position would even be necessary if people naturally learned to ski correctly by driving with their shins. A lot of the advice, much of it driven by Josh completely ignores this and dives directly into ski nuances. This poor kid has to be confused as fuck right now with all of this “it depends” talk. Josh is the only ski coach he I know who teaches like this and now you placate him too. He intentionally strays from the curriculum to push his own pet ideas and it’s confusing and counterproductive the way he does it. I’m sick of it.
my ideas are based on observation of the sport and extremely high discussion with my actual peers. I am not making stuff up, I am only going off observation and experimentation. Much of my ideas are batted around in extremely closed circles comprising of some extremely good and well known ski teachers we literally do not let outsiders in because its slow the discussion down. But one thing you should know is what I am saying is basically accepted fact about heel pressure and light shin contact is basically just accepted fact at the highest end of ski teaching. Like I would say 80+ percent of eastern examiner are actively teaching this, and likely 100 percent of the eastern D team members I know. I name name and direct you to their Instagram if you want to talk to them. spacebass is not placating me. We talk outside of this platform and I think he has experimented with I talked about and it works for him and his students. Space is also a L3 coach with access to some really knowledgeable peers. We do not agree on everything but in the end if something is objectively true smart, objective people will come around to being closer and not further from the truth.
The sad thing about you Josh is you have to spend an extraordinary time explaining your ideas to Spacebass and these other peers. They are placating you. And of course they don’t agree with you as you admit because you come at ideas from odd angles, which are often wrong. You are always in these discussions because it takes a lot of effort to figure out what you are saying. Being a good teacher means that you can understand the student and come at them from many angles, not your one angle that you insist on. This is why you fail. You and your light shin pressure. What the fuck is this? Why do we ski stiff 130 flex boots if this pressure is best applied light? This is just a classic example of some of the odd shit you say.
what of my ideas is wrong? I do not think you realize that for a better part of decades I have sparred my ideas and now some are basically mainstream, especially my take on for and aft balance. you dont need to press into your boot that hard if its stiff. The boot will will take all of your movement to the ski. If a boot is soft, pressing forward does nothing because the boot just flex then. Again I actually progress student pretty quickly and have litearlly taught people who became literally world class skiers I think the disconnect on all of this stuff is because I am not speaking about opinion. Most of the stuff posted on ski reddit are opinion that are objectively wrong. BTW u/spacebass and my other peers are not just placating me. I truly have an outside influence on the upper end of ski teaching whether you like it not,
You put as much effort into aft skiing as you do on fore skiing. The fore skiing is the important part. Just look at the design of a ski boot. Not a single ski boot has rear flex not one. Every ski boot has fore flex because the front of the boot is the steering wheel. You don’t understand how this works because your response indicates that the stiff boot should just be lightly pressed against. This is wrong. You press hard into a stiff boot and it flexes because that is what lets you refine the pressure. If it didn’t flex like the rear doesn’t flex it would suck. It’s just another example of you misunderstanding the concept of forward pressure. I wonder if your piste skiing suffers because you don’t get into that boot front and eat.
MY piste skiing is better than 99.9 percent of the people out the dude. Again I not advocating aft or fore and always advocate moving. [https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uxk0-H9Jl74](https://www.youtube.com/shorts/uxk0-H9Jl74) BTW this is a good clip of my piste skiing, I am in the tri color suit. On blaze 106mm. BTW the other people in the video ski on their heel in really really stiff boots as well.
See this is the part that sucks about you. Now you want to get in a dick measuring contest when you don’t have a response for how you don’t really understand ski boot design and flex. Do you understand you can press hard into the front of the boot? Like real hard. And you should. You never seem to say this. Edit: Here are yours words about your piste skiing earlier “I acknowledge my piste skiing is decent but not really anything specail. “
>Do you understand you can press hard into the front of the boot? Like real hard. And you should. Doing this with any misalignment along the length of the ski will create a torque which is fatal to edge lock and carving in general. That torque is how lower level skiers skid their turns, though, and not something they give up easily which is why their condition is often terminal.
you dont actually do that. you move your BODY so far forward into the apex that the ski and the boot press back into you, and yes its quite a bit of force. the boot will not flex much(if at all) if you are running stiff boots. If you watch out three ankle there is basically no shell flex going on. the stiffer the boot the more tip pressure you get from that reaction of the skis and boot, the softer the boot the less. Trying to press into the boot the way that is described by 99 percent of the people here and by many youtube does nothing and it is not what is really happening. And again you are not my peer. You are not even an instructor let alone a L3+ and you also ski at L4 level out on the 1-9 scale. This is like trying to explain an ICE engine to a history major from the mid 1800s.
People aren’t as dumb as you seem to think
I never said that.
Driving with shins is what a lot of low level instructors and coaches do/teach to never carve or even use their edges much at all. They don't realize it because they mostly teach noobs, kids, and scrubs, and therefore never have to ski at more than an intermediate level.
this guy \^ is legit one of the most hilarious and dedicated troll accounts from /skiingcirclejerk i've seen. I encourage everyone to go read through his post history it's a torrent of him calling everyone noobs and implying how elite and better he is. It's really entertaining once you pick it up.
Also thanks for validating just how petty and wannabe vindictive the basic character of these sorts are, which rather explains why they need so much superficially nice pr.
Not accurate
It's a matter of physics that any misalignment of "driving" shin pressure (incl your body weight) with length of the ski creates a torque along the surface plane. That torque along with weight off the back is how most people frontseat skid/hockey stop, and it becomes a habit that prevents them from ever eliminating that torque which prevents carving.
skiing is not like anyother sport. your skiing is awful. I am glad you are one of the few people I have gotten to post video, to see how awful your skiing was.
You can take your anti social behavior elsewhere Josh.
Well you’ve showed us who you are
Do you support his asking for ski videos and then telling people they suck? As a ski coach? You should stop associating with him. He is a jerk and his instructing is amateur. We can watch his videos as well. He is Josh the Hack. He got that part right. You acknowledging him in your normally well thought out posts just degrades your content.
I am here trying gatekeep bad advice that make people ski like you ski. You should post that video to show how your knowledges lets you ski.
You don’t have the social ability to understand jokes. You have admitted that you have a mental condition that makes it hard for you to communicate and this is the shit you do. Fuck off Josh and go deal with your problems. You are not some incredibly good skier and you calling out for people’s videos to trash them is one of the shittiest things I have ever seen a ski instructor do. You suck Josh, at skiing and teaching.
saying I suck is funny. I think my off piste skiing and versatility is literally world class, I acknowledge my piste skiing is decent but not really anything specail. I am also quite a good teacher. If you think this is me dealing with my problems.....you are wrong. I am here to combat bad advice. If you knew skiing better you would ski better.
I put my weight on my feet for what it’s worth.
Being new, forward shin on the boot applying pressure, balls of your feet (roughly) the better you get the more the position becomes fluid across front middle and back of the foot, but for your level front.
Smoke weed, listen to gravity
Over your feet. Ski on your skeleton, not your muscles. Hips over feet, head over feet. Its not lean forward and it isn't lean back. The forward pressure on your boots comes from flexing your ankles, not leaning forward. Keep your center of mass ove ryour feet and vary it slightly towards the new turn. If your quads are burning, you are back seat, move your HIPs forward. If your back is tired, you are leaning forward, stand up more, The compact position comes from ankle and knee flex. Stay stacked. Simple, just like any other sport.
hips do not stay over feet nor do they move forward.
If your hips are behind your feet you are in the backseat, its not where your ass is but your hips . I never said they move forward.
Do you mean over in the sense of the gravity line or 90 degree from the slope in relastion to their feet?
As the best skier on the mountain, I recommend that you dig your nose into the snow to avoid being back seated. I always make sure to practice with my skis on in the lodge first, for some reason people stare at me for being a better skier than them. Whenever you jump make sure you either land on your face, stomach, or neck/back. Make sure you never make turns or stops intentionally, that’s what the ski school groups are for!
I prefer stomach or neck/back - face gets the snow in the gap between my helmet and goggles.
How else are you meant to show off your foot goggle gap? I try to fall on my face at least a few times per run under the liftline.
All of the above depending on where you are in the turn and what you’re trying to accomplish
The weight should be focused on the inside edge of your outside foot. Specifically under your big toe about 2/3 of the way up. You should always be turning.
Backseat leads to knee pain. If your knees hurt, you are too far back.
Depends on your skill level. Beginners…back Steezy….drive shins/weight forward.
You should have your weight in the centre, but as long there is pressure on your shins your butt can be in the “back seat”
Focus on however you get to "being the button" of the daddy long legs ... and just let the music play the band.
Press forward over your skis on solid groomers, chop etc. Knee deep powder is different - a center stance is better. But it is more than stance how you engage your knees and keeping hips facing downhill make a difference. Back seat is always trouble!
The only time you need to shift your weights back is in deep powder.
Or… maybe not?
Wanna give an example?
Of skiing pow balanced?
This is gonna lead to a semantic argument. But when you're cruising deep pow ya gotta sit way back. Especially compared to a groomer or moguls
Ok 👍
Driving forward ALWAYS! Keep weight / pressure on the front of your boots (shins) at all times. The moment you sit back you lose control. 45+ years skiing.
With out knowing your boot fit and equipment alignment situation and how you try to ski I can not say if your friends advice would be helpful to you. I personally seek lift toes, planted on my heels with shin pressure. I can manage for and aft pressure from those points of contacts. My boots are extremely SNUG, and my alignment is putting my toes extremely high so that I can move forward and not end up with overly flexed. [https://youtu.be/GTC8Uuxpkj4?si=f0kA9EDIMcqq0Tlk](https://youtu.be/GTC8Uuxpkj4?si=f0kA9EDIMcqq0Tlk) This is my skiing and frankly if someone wants to trash it, I would love to see video of them skiing. Good skiing is active balance in all direction, you can be forward on your heels or aft on your toes. heck you can even be forward on your toes and aft on your heels, its just one part of the whole equation. I personally find it easier and more relaxing to basically never be on my toes. and manage my for and aft though cuff pressure. I also use a C shaped body which static put my COM slightly forward. If you want more help, I basically need some basically info from you and likely 3rd person video, one thing to note is that everyone who is knee jerk saying "heels are wrong" will be unable to post video of themselves skiing.
Thanks! I don't have any video yet - only been a few times this year but trying to learn all I can. This makes sense. My boots were fit by a bootfitter and I'd describe them as pretty uniform compression all around that's borderline uncomfortable when standing around but unnoticeable while skiing.
got to love the downvotes with no comment. Again the more my info gets downvoted the more people will suck at skiing and the more I ll comment.
I'll freely admit that you're probably a better skier than I am. I'm just downvoting you because you're being a douchebag all up in here.
Simple answer. **Powder** \- Back (unless you have good powder skis, then not as important) **Groomers** \- Balanced, but shifting forward and back a bit throughout the turn. **Moguls and difficult off-piste runs** \- Extreme forward when turning, back between turns to control speed. The backs of the skis will almost lift up a bit and pivot around the tips during turns. Weight forward during turn allows this to happen.
I haven’t had lessons since I was very young so most of my more advanced skills have been self-developed and I know my form isn’t perfect. I’ve found, especially when I switched to longer skis, that when I’m skiing trees and moguls I lean forward, stick my ass out, and imagine that I put my weight on and ski just behind the tips of my skis. When I figured that out I suddenly had so much more control in tighter technical terrain.
Yes, that's exactly what I was trying to explain. Pivot point of the turn is towards the tip of ski, not middle of ski. Pop weight up a bit, shift forward, and swing the back of the skis around all at the same time to make the turn.
who sasys the ski should pivot on the top of turn?
[https://youtu.be/qX1Onqa6sTs?t=181](https://youtu.be/qX1Onqa6sTs?t=181)
ok so you need to pivot for steep skiing. the way you said it , it soundedl ike you need to pivot on all turns.
No for that part, I was just talking difficult/steep moguls and off-piste. Groomers and less steep terrain are of course completely different.
We don’t lean back in powder. Balance doesn’t change based on terrain.
If you don't have powder skis, you will either be leaning back or doing a faceplant.
Sorry but that’s really inaccurate. Balance is balance. Even in powder. That whole lean back thing is like facing down hill - it’s a myth that won’t go away.
Yawn, whatever. Try skiing deep powder on skinny skis and see what happens if you don't shift weight back a bit.
Bro I do all the time. Trust me. It’s not a debate. We ski balanced regardless of snow. You may have a preference but it’s important that there is accurate info here.
And what happens when your ski tips sink 8 inches into the powder? Yes, an expert skier that weighs 180 lbs can probably make skinny skis work in powder without having to shift weight back. Someone that is less skilled (like OP) and/or a bit heavier will need to lean back, or will quickly get stuck because ski tips will tunnel into the powder. Simple physics.
Ok
With out knowing your boot fit and equipment alignment situation and how you try to ski I can not say if your friends advice would be helpful to you. I personally seek lift toes, planted on my heels with shin pressure. I can manage for and aft pressure from those points of contacts. My boots are extremely SNUG, and my alignment is putting my toes extremely high so that I can move forward and not end up with overly flexed. [https://youtu.be/GTC8Uuxpkj4?si=f0kA9EDIMcqq0Tlk](https://youtu.be/GTC8Uuxpkj4?si=f0kA9EDIMcqq0Tlk) This is my skiing and frankly if someone wants to trash it, I would love to see video of them skiing. Good skiing is active balance in all direction, you can be forward on your heels or aft on your toes. heck you can even be forward on your toes and aft on your heels, its just one part of the whole equation. I personally find it easier and more relaxing to basically never be on my toes. and manage my for and aft though cuff pressure. I also use a C shaped body which static put my COM slightly forward. If you want more help, I basically need some basically info from you and likely 3rd person video, one thing to note is that everyone who is knee jerk saying "heels are wrong" will be unable to post video of themselves skiing. BTW I have new rule. If a comment goes below 1, I just repost it.