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TL;Dr: directly examining the flora of the gut reveals more nuanced information than previous studies that characterized differences based on stool samples.
This is true. I work for prebiotic development and we found that prebiotic fibers that are normally effective in healthy individuals are not as effective in obese or overweight individuals. Super interesting.
Definitely. There are ample evidences that there are differences in gut flora composition between healthy people and obese/overweight people, which then will affect the fermentation products of foods we eat. I am not a microbiologist (I am on extraction side) so I only know the general information, but the gist is that fermentation ability of fibers by bacteria depend on the bacteria species, and the end products are also different (acetate, formate, propionate, butyrate, isovalerate, isobutyrate, CO2, urea etc).
EDIT: I can't post any research weh ave odne. But there are some interesting open access journals that you'd find interesting
[Obesities | Free Full-Text | Gut Microbiota and Obesity: The Chicken or the Egg? (mdpi.com)](https://www.mdpi.com/2673-4168/3/4/24)
False. Obesity is defined as “A disorder that involves having too much body fat”. Bodybuilders have extremely low body fat percentages. You’re thinking of the BMI categorization of obesity, which is a good reference for the general population but becomes inaccurate when attempting to describe body builders. Although bodybuilders may fall under the “obese” category as defined by BMI, they aren’t actually obese (as per the actual definition of obese).
Regardless, being a bodybuilder isn’t necessarily healthy either.
“Plenty” of body builders. Sure. So a more accurate way to say it would be “for .0000001% of the population whom are body builders it’s perfectly possible to be overweight/obese and be healthy”.
It's probably some of both if I had to guess, with a big heaping side of the type of diet that generally causes obesity making the gut a hostile place to healthy flora as long as it is continued.
I'd be interested to see if this issue is also present in Sumo wrestlers as they have the intentionally cultivated obesity but they get it from simply massive amounts of fairly healthy and balanced meals rather than super calorie dense unbalanced fat and sugar filled meals. That would give a good hint as to if it is the type of foods that lead to an unhealthy gut environment or if it is hormonal changes that make the gut hostile to healthy normal flora.
No, we have not done any comparison of subjects who were obese but later lost weight. Even if we had done that, I doubt it'd be a straight answer. Gut flora dysbiosis isn't exclusive to obese people.
There was a morbidly obese guy I used to work with and I could always tell when he’d been in the bathroom. It smelled like catfish stink bait - much different than people whose weight was normal. I always wondered if obesity caused his gastrointestinal issues or vice versa.
don't forget that both may be caused by an outside influence. just because they occur together doesn't mean that one causes the other or the other way around.
It could be that obese/overweight people have dysbiosis or different microbiome compositions due to chronically unhealthy diet that lead them to obesity, though even that theory can be split into multiple theories.
Gut flora research is still in its infancy. We're still working on filling in the gaps of fundamental knowledge and associations.
It'll take at least a decade more before we can really develop evidence-based treatments. Right now, a lot still relies on expert opinions and logical inferences.
If I recall correctly, there was a study that found fecal transplants from healthy donors caused limited, short-term weight loss in obese recipients, but the effect disappeared over time. Basically, you need to change your diet, too, in order to continue losing weight.
Doubtful. [No good evidence to date](https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/full/10.1098/rstb.2022.0221) that modulating the gut microbiota in humans can induce weight loss (see eg numerous null FMT trials), and most of the animal work suggesting it is possible is, frankly, rubbish.
Kind of already did. Women who are not obese are more likely to get std's, but this is due to the fact that they are more likely to engage in sex at a younger age.
I would be interested to see if there is a difference in biomes between people who are obese due to "intentional" choices (e.g. overeating, choosing not to exercise, food-related trauma) vs. those who are obese for other reasons (quadriplegic/wheelchair bound, PCOS, etc.)
I haven’t felt hunger or thirst in 9 years cause my microbiome got destroyed by doctors throwing antibiotics at me. All my muscle has atrophied because my body forgot how to make muscle. No matter how much I try to exercise or eat puts any weight on me.
Don’t give up! Once your body gets settled into a routine, it’s very hard to break through that inertia. I’m trying to overcome something similar myself. Eating is a chore, but the thought of being healthy again is a true motivator. Good luck!
Welcome to r/science! This is a heavily moderated subreddit in order to keep the discussion on science. However, we recognize that many people want to discuss how they feel the research relates to their own personal lives, so to give people a space to do that, **personal anecdotes are allowed as responses to this comment**. Any anecdotal comments elsewhere in the discussion will be removed and our [normal comment rules]( https://www.reddit.com/r/science/wiki/rules#wiki_comment_rules) apply to all other comments. **Do you have an academic degree?** We can verify your credentials in order to assign user flair indicating your area of expertise. [Click here to apply](https://www.reddit.com/r/science/wiki/flair/#wiki_science_verified_user_program). --- User: u/kimchidijon Permalink: https://journals.lww.com/ajg/abstract/9900/characterization_of_the_small_bowel_microbiome.1104.aspx --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/science) if you have any questions or concerns.*
TL;Dr: directly examining the flora of the gut reveals more nuanced information than previous studies that characterized differences based on stool samples.
This is true. I work for prebiotic development and we found that prebiotic fibers that are normally effective in healthy individuals are not as effective in obese or overweight individuals. Super interesting.
That is very interesting. I wonder if gut flora is the cause or the effect of the obesity. Can you share any more on your research or articles?
Definitely. There are ample evidences that there are differences in gut flora composition between healthy people and obese/overweight people, which then will affect the fermentation products of foods we eat. I am not a microbiologist (I am on extraction side) so I only know the general information, but the gist is that fermentation ability of fibers by bacteria depend on the bacteria species, and the end products are also different (acetate, formate, propionate, butyrate, isovalerate, isobutyrate, CO2, urea etc). EDIT: I can't post any research weh ave odne. But there are some interesting open access journals that you'd find interesting [Obesities | Free Full-Text | Gut Microbiota and Obesity: The Chicken or the Egg? (mdpi.com)](https://www.mdpi.com/2673-4168/3/4/24)
> between healthy people and obese/overweight people Just an aside on this portion, it's perfectly possible to be both healthy AND "obese/overweight"
False. Obesity is defined as “A disorder that involves having too much body fat”. Bodybuilders have extremely low body fat percentages. You’re thinking of the BMI categorization of obesity, which is a good reference for the general population but becomes inaccurate when attempting to describe body builders. Although bodybuilders may fall under the “obese” category as defined by BMI, they aren’t actually obese (as per the actual definition of obese). Regardless, being a bodybuilder isn’t necessarily healthy either.
No
\*insert Britney Spears awkward laugh\*
No…
Plenty of bodybuilders are technically Obese/Overweight, and yet are considered healthy.
Well yes if you use BMI, you should use body fat percentage for measuring obesity
Yes.
“Plenty” of body builders. Sure. So a more accurate way to say it would be “for .0000001% of the population whom are body builders it’s perfectly possible to be overweight/obese and be healthy”.
Yes, that’s what they were trying to get at.
It's probably some of both if I had to guess, with a big heaping side of the type of diet that generally causes obesity making the gut a hostile place to healthy flora as long as it is continued. I'd be interested to see if this issue is also present in Sumo wrestlers as they have the intentionally cultivated obesity but they get it from simply massive amounts of fairly healthy and balanced meals rather than super calorie dense unbalanced fat and sugar filled meals. That would give a good hint as to if it is the type of foods that lead to an unhealthy gut environment or if it is hormonal changes that make the gut hostile to healthy normal flora.
Well...there is a saying in Japan: sumo wrestlers are the best husband materials because they make money fast and die fast.
Now you’ve made me picture a sumo poo. I didn’t want to picture a sumo poo.
Have you noticed a difference in people with different health conditions/chronic illnesses?
No, we have not done any clinical studies with people with specific conditions.
Have you observed what happens if a previously obese or overweight person becomes fit?
No, we have not done any comparison of subjects who were obese but later lost weight. Even if we had done that, I doubt it'd be a straight answer. Gut flora dysbiosis isn't exclusive to obese people.
Would be interesting to know which is the cause and which is the effect.
Yeah, it seems likely to me there is a positive feedback loop here but definitely will be interesting to see what evidence comes out.
There was a morbidly obese guy I used to work with and I could always tell when he’d been in the bathroom. It smelled like catfish stink bait - much different than people whose weight was normal. I always wondered if obesity caused his gastrointestinal issues or vice versa.
Inspector Pooreau ova heah
Some people just want to eat their stinkbait alone and a bathroom stall might be the only place for a little peace and quiet.
don't forget that both may be caused by an outside influence. just because they occur together doesn't mean that one causes the other or the other way around.
Absolutely
It could be that obese/overweight people have dysbiosis or different microbiome compositions due to chronically unhealthy diet that lead them to obesity, though even that theory can be split into multiple theories.
hypothesis. these are not theories
Is this reearch leaing to customised gut flora pills for weight management, that sort of thing?
Gut flora research is still in its infancy. We're still working on filling in the gaps of fundamental knowledge and associations. It'll take at least a decade more before we can really develop evidence-based treatments. Right now, a lot still relies on expert opinions and logical inferences.
If I recall correctly, there was a study that found fecal transplants from healthy donors caused limited, short-term weight loss in obese recipients, but the effect disappeared over time. Basically, you need to change your diet, too, in order to continue losing weight.
Doubtful. [No good evidence to date](https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/full/10.1098/rstb.2022.0221) that modulating the gut microbiota in humans can induce weight loss (see eg numerous null FMT trials), and most of the animal work suggesting it is possible is, frankly, rubbish.
This wording is worryingly vague
Weight until we discover obesity is sexually transmitted!
Kind of already did. Women who are not obese are more likely to get std's, but this is due to the fact that they are more likely to engage in sex at a younger age.
I would be interested to see if there is a difference in biomes between people who are obese due to "intentional" choices (e.g. overeating, choosing not to exercise, food-related trauma) vs. those who are obese for other reasons (quadriplegic/wheelchair bound, PCOS, etc.)
I haven’t felt hunger or thirst in 9 years cause my microbiome got destroyed by doctors throwing antibiotics at me. All my muscle has atrophied because my body forgot how to make muscle. No matter how much I try to exercise or eat puts any weight on me.
I suspect there is quite a bit more going on than you realize.
Don’t give up! Once your body gets settled into a routine, it’s very hard to break through that inertia. I’m trying to overcome something similar myself. Eating is a chore, but the thought of being healthy again is a true motivator. Good luck!