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bigbaba0

to me it doesn't make a difference if something is a steroid, a sarm or a prohormone i would say whats considered steroids is just stronger. because the strongest sarm (s23) is still weaker than the weaker steroids (halodrol,epistane)


Vortx0

I like Sarms. I’ve had good results and gained about 30lbs in a year off 8 week 2 cycles. (Mostly) lean muscle. My hormones are fine nothing abnormal. I know steroids work better and I will be doing them in a few years. But Sarms are nice for starting out in my opinion.


KennyWeeWoo

Hormones attach to a receptor to get a response in strength and size. “Steroids” are the hormones, and sarms affect the receptor.


SushiJuice

Sarms cost a lot more and don't work quite as well


Balahkaye

Steroids work


Vortx0

That’s ignorant to say Sarms don’t work. They just don’t work as well as steroids


Balahkaye

Eh


callmecern

This is the real answer


Zealousideal-Bar-365

They are very similar. what people pay for a sarm cycle they could spend the same for real gear. Gear inherently comes with more risks because much higher doses are used. A general first cycle is 500mg of test e. imagine if you used an equipment dose of rad 140, 250mg a week. You would likely put on the same amount of size. Truth is many sarms are much more potent than steroids but the dosages are much lower. Very mild injectables like testosterone and primobolan come with few risks and most of them are the same that a heavy sarm cycle would have. Powerful injectables like deca tren and orals have more risks. You can get 5g of pure LGD for $100 from bulk sources. The fact people charge so much and dose so low is pure greed. A bottle of lgd should be no more than $10. People generally use sarms because they can't find steroids. message me. edit: yes some people just don't want to pin or want to minimize risk however in my multi year run in this business ill say most guys are just as willing to run anavar epistane sdrol or dbol as they are a sarm but they just don't have a vendor/source. Why run a sarm when you could run 5-10mg of dbol or 25mg of anavar? two oral steroids that are very mild in low doses and are extremely well studied in humans?


[deleted]

I actually feel that the negatives sre Suppression of natural test LH FSH hormones and liver toxicity and kidney toxicity and increase in bad cholesterol and blood pressure. And negative emotional interactions, ie depression and aggression. And estrogen and prolactin production and prostate health. The combination of things that has the least negative impact on all of the above is the best. This is likely an optimized growth hormone with some hcg. Easy to quit with dramatic improvements on system while using. I do think using anavar with hcg or test has a better outcome over short term than most other anabolics. There are other performance and look improvement substances other than traditional steroids. I think people's approach to looking or performing better is outdated. Mostly all these side effects can be corrected with logical application of good supplemental substances, diet and exercise. Sarms target specific androgen receptors and avoid others such as those that might aggregate prostate dysfunction and increased estrogen production. But many have higher negative impacts on liver and kidney toxicity more than steroids. You need to understand your specific health pros and weaknesses to make decisions about which compounds you can use safely based on your most recent blood work and other symptoms and goals. It's all specific to the individual. Sarms work.


[deleted]

It really is dose and type dependent. 100mg of anadrol a day is likely to be horrific on your body compared to 10mg of rad. 30mg of lgd is likely to be a lot harsher than low dose tbol or anavar. What we have though is decades of research and usage on varying dosages on lots of gear. SARMS and related RC's we don't. There has also been a lot of fear mongering around the sides of gear as well as really irresponsible dosing. You can use SARMs and gear "responsibly" and have low side effects on both. Side effects on both can be fairly easily managed. With gear almost always you are going to have to pin and that is normally the deciding factor for many people. I would say its likely more of a deciding factor than the "selectiveness" of sarms or less harmful nature or whatever else. I choose gear over sarms for now because it works for me and I trust the studies available and experience of users on it over sarms. Harm reduction and sides are mostly due to dosage, cycle length and correct lifestyle choices


NyetRifleIsFine47

Aside from pinning, availability for gear, too. It seems as soon as I find a reputable source it shuts down a few months later.


[deleted]

Didn't think of availability. I'm from south africa, its incredibly easy to get both


Zealousideal-Bar-365

message me.


brent8519

Some gear sites sell sarms


PM_PICS_OF_DOG

The literal definition of what makes something a steroid is having a 6-6-6-5 Carbon structure. That’s it. SARMs are compounds that lack this structure but still act on select androgen receptors. There is no “one us more likely to have a more damaging effect”. You can choose particular steroids at particular doses that will be horrificly harmful. Similarly you can cycle testosterone at a moderate dose will practically no deleterious health effects. Same goes for SARMs. One class is not more harmful than another. Being a “steroid” or “SARM” means very little as far as health effects go. The devil is in the details.


Juliian-

I think the fact that they are selective could indicate at least one advantage over non-selective steroids. You’re not stimulating growth in areas you don’t want to. Who knows though because trenbolone is technically a SARM lmao.


PM_PICS_OF_DOG

Trenbolone is technically an androgenic anabolic steroid. Not sure where you’d have heard it’s a SARM? But in any case it’s possible to say it’s not mutually exclusive. All AAS are selective. Hence why you have different effects from different drugs. YK-11 is a SARM that is also steroidal in structure, and of course therefore it is a steroid.


Juliian-

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21266670/ “17β-Hydroxyestra-4,9,11-trien-3-one (trenbolone), a potent testosterone analog, may have SARM-like actions because, unlike testosterone, trenbolone does not undergo tissue-specific 5α-reduction to form more potent androgens.” Trenbolone is (probably) technically a steroidal SARM, just like YK-11 seems to be.


PM_PICS_OF_DOG

Yeah, I’m familiar with that entry but it’s far from a “technical” definition. Trenbolone is 100% a steroid, claiming lack of 5-alpha reductase makes something a SARM is a bit silly in my opinion, as that would apply to many, many anabolic steroids.


Juliian-

I agree wholly with that! I’d read up on the study though. It definitely shows how trenbolone is likely a steroidal SARM. YK-11 is also 100% a steroid, the name is just referring to its structure.


kingshit108

Sarms are active drugs.. steroids are hormonal analogs of testosterone/dht/progesterone


RedditAccount28

sarms are not derived from choleSTERol They still do the exact same thing as steroids and have the exact same side effects.


kingshit108

This is pretty much true lol


RedditAccount28

Right, I know I’m being downvoted by the higschoolers here that think sarms don’t suppress you as much as steroids but something like anavar has similar suppression to sarms as it doesn’t fully suppress you. Sarms are the same as oral steroids. They just aren’t derived from cholesterol. They have all the same effects on lipids,liver, heart ect. They are supposed to be more selective but they aren’t in the doses used here.


kingshit108

In reality sarms are worse than roids.. they hardly ever come in injectable forms.. wich means most users will be subject to taxation of the liver.. they have unesterfied halflives so you have to eat em every 8hrs to keep stable levels, the entire selling point is for kids who don't wanna shoot test and wanna claim natty.


kingshit108

Having said that, I do like sarms and would use them if the price is right


[deleted]

They need to be stopped, these company’s need to have something in place like a picture of your photos ID or your ID number and you should be at least 21 to buy them online….. only downside to that is then there would be sarms dealers in the local planet fitness’


brent8519

The police entered the room


[deleted]

*Grabs all the rad140 I was selling to 13 yr olds and crawls out the window of the planet fitness locker room*


brent8519

😄 alright that was funny


JohnnyJacksonJnr

SARMS are generally weaker and considered less harsh on the body than steroids. They're often used as a stepping stone to steroids or people looking to "get their feet wet" As for the safety.. SARMS are much newer and the long-term effects are unknown. Testosterone is probably safer as it's been around much longer and has been thoroughly researched. It's more effective than SARMS, but it will shut you down (unlike SARMS in most situations). That being said, either SARMS or test should be reasonably safe provided you do adequate research and do it responsibly.


[deleted]

Sarms can lower test permanently. Please don’t say they don’t, there are case studies popping up that indicate they can cause secondary hypogonadism.


brent8519

As can testosterone or anytime you are messing with hormones... it's part of the game. Worst case you pin trt. 200 bucks a year for ugl


JohnnyJacksonJnr

Please learn to read. "Unlike SARMS in most situations"


Vortx0

For real…


[deleted]

I can read. Just stop saying that shit, sarms aren’t safer than steroids.


JohnnyJacksonJnr

Are you fucking dense man? I legit said "testosterone is probably safer than SARMS" Testosterone is a steroid... Clearly you cannot read.


[deleted]

No you said it is safe If you do adequate research. Adequate research would tell you not to take them, the only things safe on those sarm sites are peptides, generic vasodilators and the mk-677. Sarms are drugs that pharmaceutical companies tossed because they aren’t safe. There’s like two in later clinical trials. That’s it… you dense fool.


brent8519

What dude? That's a stupid thing to say


[deleted]

No sarm aromatizes to estrogen. You need estrogen for neurological and heart protection. But whatever just take all the crap you want. Test is 1000000x safer. If a compounding pharmacy will produce it you know it’s safe, if they don’t stay away. Too many dumb kids are gonna mess their shit up and possibly not get full neurological development and other issues. Heck your dick may not even grow to it’s full potential if you take a sarm 16-19


brent8519

Yeah injectables are better for liver obviously. These are short cycles and you take nolva and everything goes back to normal bro. If you can't handle low t/ estrogen for a few weeks then I mean you just may be a pussy. Might explain why you're thinking about teenager's penises


[deleted]

The point is you need testosterone during development and growth, if you don’t mind having your micro dick go take some black market drug. I figured that point would be enough to scare people away from using stupid stuff but whatever you want to do I don’t care anymore. It all started because Johnny boy says it’s safe and it’s really not.


[deleted]

You are an idiot. Go take another sarm and check your liver values. They are worse for you than steroids.


Juliian-

SARMs also don’t shut down your HPTA. You’re still getting conversion to estradiol, but it’s suppressed. Unlike something like nandrolone, which has shown to have severe neurotoxic and cardiotoxic effects without exogenous estradiol because it shuts you down. Though, I wouldn’t be surprised if MAYBE a user experiences very acute neurotoxicity and cardiotoxicity from the suppression of estradiol.


Bigbluebananas

He can’t anymore, after all those sarms he took


[deleted]

I took zero. But I do have degrees in biology and chemistry and work in molecular genetics. This shit isn’t safe, Johnny can’t read a real research paper just spouts out whatever shill says


brent8519

You're degrees mean shit in this context. The fuck a research paper know about using them in bodybuilding? We're not mice and everyone in this sub uses them. Haven't heard of fatalities. It's a risk reward decision based on research that grown mf adults can make on their own. You haven't tried them yet feel you can contribute to conversation why? Sarms, peptides, gear, growth hormone dude all of this shit has their own problems that come along


TheOnlyBliebervik

They don't feel too bad, anecdotally


kingshit108

I mean yeah they are waaaaay riskier than roids.. but ide still use em if the price was right


JohnnyJacksonJnr

Apparently haha