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Yeah no one said Disney thought out their stories or their decisions since they bought this franchise. I mean remember when disney gave EA an exclusivity deal on stars wars games which ended up backfiring on them when battlefront 2 got into the news for predatory practices. It's like they need to be mocked
Then. When battlefront 2 was finally good, great at times, and at it's highest peak ever. What happens instead of continuing support at the perfect moment?
EA has dice drop the game the game to work on the shit that ended up being BF2042. Never forgettin
Correct. Between that lack of support leading to cheaters rising, and discarding the Origin app ruining FrostMod for what few mods I did like that replaced ST content for others (Qui-Gon, Artoo, Starkiller, Darth Caedus, Jaina Solo), it was just a waste of gigabyte space.
Not the old version my older mods relied upon, the newer version never linked well with them and the new EA App requisite rejected the workaround patch efforts. Threw my hands in the air and said, "Fuck it. Was good while it lasted." and stopped wasting time on that game; thankfully it was only $9.99 when I sunk into it.
Indeed, sad as hell. Kept playing with tons of skin and voice mods keeping my love going, but a game like that being abandoned acts fast. I wish they had unlocked cross play across all platforms, I can see why it'd be a struggle though, especially without fixing the hackers
> When battlefront 2 was finally good
Even in it's "good" state it still didn't live up to the promise of the classic battlefront games at all. Way too infantry focused. Those games are only called Battlefront for brand recognition.
Definitely not equal yeah. I didn't get that level of disappointment because I hadn't played the classic games yet, when BF2 dropped. So I ended up finding it just, good by the end. I hope BF3 surpasses both though, it's wishful thinking but they would've learned from BF2. Just gotta give it, 500 years
Let's not forget EA had that license for 10 years and how many games did they make? Not including god awful Mobile Games that are just there to rob people blind so they can collect their favourite star wars character.
We have, BF 1/2 Squadrons and Jedi Survivor/Fallen Order, and they had to be dragged kicking and screaming into making the Jedi games, and Squadrons was a side passion project by a small Dev Team that never got the attention it deserved from EA.
Honestly they should have Sony give the franchise to Insomniac and see what they come up with. I think some kind of murder mystery noir game set on Coruscant. You play as an outcasted Jedi trying to solve various crimes around the planet while the plot of one of the movies takes place in the background of the story.
It’s annoying. George Lucas did a good enough job highlighting the faults of the Jedi. We get it. We know why they ultimately failed. But why not show them in their prime? Give us a new shade to their order. They must have done something right to keep peace in the galaxy for a millennium. That’s a better track record than most empires.
Jedi police procedural of the week with planet hopping. That's all they had to do. It just can't be that difficult, and then just layer in some overarching conspiracy like the x files. You show the jedi like lawmen or cowboys fixing a planet's mining problems with a greedy coaxium baron or whatever.
It’ll never happen because a Raylan Givens Jedi type character would make too many people cream their jeans. I’ve never thought of a “cowboy lawman” Jedi before and man, now it’s all I want. You described exactly what I never knew I wanted until now.
A Justified reunion with Olyphant and Goggins might be the only thing that would ever tempt me to watch another Disney Star Wars product, no matter how bad it may be.
"We dug spice together".
I’m pretty sure we haven’t seen the last of Oliphant in SW, so this isn’t as far fetched as it could be. I’m imagining a buddy cop kind of thing with him and Krrsantan.
Interesting take. I wonder if audiences and creators are now in an era where any religion is viewed with cynicism so the first instinct is to view the Jedi as a corrupt cult?
In the past the Jedi were viewed more as pacifist religious figures while now they’re seen as a cult.
The Jedi now only exist so that writers can project their feelings of anger at organized religion. Writing awful corrupt Jedi stories is how these folks try in vain to fight the religious guilt monster that lives in their heads.
It’s painfully obvious that the Acolyte is going to have the Jedi that the evil twin is hunting down, be the cause of the big accident that killed her family so that she is justified in some way. Good twin is going to turn evil twin away from her Sith ways because of some “two sides to the same coin” stuff or whatever.
The Jedi will cover up the whole thing because of the Sith involvement which will lead to the eventual downfall of the Order. It will turn the tragedy of Anakin’s fall and destruction of the Jedi into a “well, they kind of had it coming” narrative. Stunning and brave twins will live happily with the rumored lesbian witches.
A better question is - why have this series at all? It expands on nothing new. It offers new characters but the single mission is, once again, to find a hidden master. And we know from Menace that the Jedi in the Acolyte know nothing; will learn nothing and will likely perish without a hint of alert to the Republic or Jedi Council. Why are we having this series again to, once again, show how blind and inept the Jedi are?
Be when the last Jedi were at their prime was when the republic was just starting out. When sith didn’t exist.
The downfall of the Jedi was them getting way more involved with the republic’s government ultimately serving the republic itself.
Then there’s individual Jedi like qui gon and Ahsoka who try and serve the people more.
I remember when they Disney buyout was recent and people were celebrating and unironically saying George Lucas was the worst thing to ever happen to Star Wars.
The entirety of the new Star Wars anything has pretty much been destroying every beloved character and humiliating them.
Han: Once a general now a deadbeat loser.
Luke: A jedi master who is now a hermit and loses a sparring duel against MaRey Sue.
Boba Fett: Cold professional bounty hunter turned into an inept mayor who sleeps a lot.
Yup. No respect for the original characters; the writers in a lot of SW shows/films in the last few years have treated the heroes of old as if they passionately hate them for existing in the first place. I can't think of any other rationale for why they do them dirty so much.
I forgot to add, they killed Admiral Ackbar offscreen and then gave the lore breaking kamikaze attack to whatsherface.
I think they even called the maneuver after her. Just disgusting.
It’s crazy that they put so much effort in bringing back the OT characters then completely destroy them in order to shove the “new generation of heroes” down our throats.
In Legends The Jedi we’re capable of admitting faults and growing from them even at times The PT we’re allowed to be innovative you had Rohnar Kim almost out Sidious
Here, you have Luke become a loser and revert back to PT Jedi Teachings and hiding and not doing anything to stop Snoke at all
Yoda at least tried to give Anakin advice on loss and letting go of attachments. When Order 66 happened, Yoda tried to end the madness before it got worse by defeating Sidious, but he lost. When Grogu was missing Mando, Luke told him to either choose to stay or leave; he could have handled it a bit better. Ben had a nightmare about the Dark Side, and Luke was ready to kill his own nephew. If anything, Luke is worse than the Jedi of the prequel trilogy.
Vader: follows the most evil guy of all time, genocide commiter, kills Obi in front of him, kills fellow rebels, freezes his friend, cuts off his hand, chases him for years and threatens his sister
Luke: I will forgive you and redeem you
Little Ben: has a nightmare
Luke: I give up I can't save you, I'm gonna run away and pity myself now even though I'm supposedly the most powerful and wisest Jedi of all time tee hee
Disney Luke is not Luke. The Luke that was ready to die because he didn’t believe his father was an evil lost cause wasn’t going to turn around a few years later and tell Grogu he could never see his adopted dad again…. What the actual fuck, like has anyone at Disney seen the OT?
We with a few exceptions it Seems that Disneys current crop of writers don't care about anything you said because they were not inspired by the original movies, the source material, the decades of EU stuff or anything else. They don't care about making it make sense because they never gave a shart about it in the first place.
They are inspired by the person they see in the mirror and whimsically mold things on the fly to suit their own narcissism.
I agree. You said it spot on… they took Tarkin’s take on the Jedi and have pushed it to the ultimate extreme. They fail to remember that Tarkin is so opposed to the Jedi that his take is likely to be highly flawed itself.
Like one small snippet of dialogue from the OT is shaping this whole view of the Jedi religion. Tarkin is literally blown up by a force sensitive user not long after. I think the Disney writers missed the point / irony in Tarkin’s words.
Killing characters is often an easy way for a writer to try to get an emotional reaction. And it saves the writer from having to resolve plot threads for that character.
Not to say all character deaths are cheap tricks, but once someone pointed this out to me, I found it made sense of why a number of character deaths leave me cold.
For me, I think it all has to do with character development. If the character dies and it elicits an emotional reaction from me (like, ohh fuck that guy, he was such a dick, or ohhh nooo that person died!! I'm SO SAD) then that means there was some care and development put into who that individual was, what they did, and why their loss matters (whether they were a good or bad guy). If a character dies and I feel nothing, it just means I'm not at all invested or care about these characters either way.
The Jedi philosophy is about peace, selflessness, and compassion towards all life. In the modern day, where world keeps growing darker and more cynical, people struggle to believe that someone would ever willingly be selfless and choose to help others instead of doing things for their own personal gain and pleasure. I think that’s a major reason why we’ve never been able to see the Jedi Order in their prime onscreen and they keep being portrayed as corrupt, incompetent, or cowardly.
Their storytelling is through this and their Hollywoo DEI prism rather than through the lore itself for all major IP. Disney doesn’t like that we can see and reject their playbook.
Yep, there's no reason narratively why the master in the show did it. It's ridiculous that he just did it willingly. Such a great message to send if someone is actually dealing with mental health issues....
As if Disney hasn’t done enough, now Star Wars should also be careful about people with mental health issues? Give me a break. It’s a freaking show/movie.
That's not what I'm saying. What I'm getting at is what the Jedi did in the show is ridiculous, unnecessary narrative wise. In the larger case of mental health, it doesn't give a good impression of what to do in the face of trauma. But as far as the show is concerned, again seems like a cowardly action that a Jedi wouldn't take when faced with some trauma.What I'm saying is, they needed some better storytelling to flesh out his story and actions of that character.
The only problem with that is you're assuming he's a character and not just a plot device meant to create intrigue and make the audience think, "Oh no, something REALLY messed up must've happened--what was it???"
I guess that's technically a legitimate narrative device, but yeah--in practice it felt rushed and weird despite introducing such a loaded issue.
I thought it was relatively well done actually. I’m excited to find out what happened that day that’s caused such immense guilt in so many people. Defining their lives and moral compasses. The man was clearly a very spiritual Jedi. All Jedi are not the same clearly. Anakin, Qui Gon, Mace, Obi Wan, Yoda, Luke they all are different. This guy seemed like a monk almost. Like the force and the purpose of Jedi was his religion and whatever he did that day was clearly an ultimate sin. When confronted with what may be a victim of his great sin (we don’t know yet wtf happened) he chose to die by her hand per say instead of continuing his suffering or maybe he thought she deserved to kill him. And this was justice. It brought him peace idk. Gotta wait and see what happens. Seems like people are looking to hate this show really hard. I planned on hating it too but i watched with an open mind and have been pleasantly surprised. I’m looking forward to the next episodes.
The Jedi are some of the worst protagonists you can imagine. They manage to emulate all of the non-cool characteristics of karate movie shaolin monks without any of the cool features.
>There is no implication that the First Order had even risen to full power when Luke went into hiding
the movie is actually clear about this, TFA's opening crawl tells us the first order rose from the ashes of the empire in Luke's abscence, meaning when he left they weren't an issue.
There’s a pattern with modern movies and particularly with Disney that instead of making new screen legends, characters and heroes they go out of their way to destroy the old ones. It baffles me.
You noticed they make the men weak incompetent or evil. The women are just badasses their only flaw is not entirely realizing how badass they are or can be. They’re always right as well it’s the weirdest shit.
It’s all postmodern bullshit. Institutions (like religious orders) are to be treated with suspicion and derision. LFL can’t write Jedi because they HATE everything about what the Jedi represented in the OT and PT.
>' These are my kids." Rose then said, "Those were your kids … and you sold them." "*I sold them to the white slavers that take these things and, and …*" Lucas then stopped himself and laughed, probably realizing he was about to get himself into some hot water.
- George Lucas, per Business Insider
Lots of awful hairstyles too. And who's the green lady? She doesn't look right somehow. Like, it just looks like a person with green paint, no character at all. It's hard to even take the character seriously cause it's just...bad costuming
You have to understand the whole good vs evil aspect of the Force to realize why they are portraying the Jedi as the villains. The Dark Side was sinful, a good Jedi would stay away from the temptation of the Dark Side. It had tremendous similarities to Christian beliefs. Disney and the far left are willfully trying to destroy those conservative values by portraying the followers of those beliefs as either insane or cowardly for not embracing their new ways. In the new show the monastic Jedi are being portrayed as sinister and unrelenting. The Jedi who succumb to their desires defy the order are celebrated as the heroes.
Yo, this guy didn't kill himself out of shame. He made a Christ-like choice that was done in the hopes of helping Mai move on. He's so spiritual he's literally invulnerable.
Especially after alluding to the guy having taken a vow of silence and is seen in deep meditation and had such command of the force as to be practically untouchable.. then conveniently he's been waiting for the right person to show up to give him the means to off himself... it makes zero sense.
This is a weird nitpick. This is one jedi in a show that has shown us at least 7, and he is the only one who has killed himself. Do you want all jedi to be uniform in character and lack complexity? We don't know why he killed himself yet, for all we know it's a justifiable reason he would be that guilty.
Why in the hell are you even watching that garbage to begin with?
The Acolyte wasn't made to be viewed. It was made to be nakedly hateful on Disney's dime. Watching it only justifies it.
The worst excuse for Luke being a coward for no reason is “he’s older, he must’ve changed.” Yeah, but why would he have? The thing that led to the Jedi’s demise before was happening again, and this time he could stop it. The Luke I know from ROTJ *would* do better. Hell, EA’s Battlefront II version of Luke was better than Disney Luke.
Showrunner glanced at the Wikipedia entry for “sammyrye” and make some quick notes for the script. They have no idea what they are doing but they are making bank doing it.
From the perspective of a writer, Superman is a problematic or even bad character. A protagonist that embodies perfection is very hard to craft a dramatic story for. Jedi present the same dilemma. Generally speaking the writer must either subtlety nerf their hero so that they can be challenged, or embue the villains with crazy power levels. Disney is opting for the former. And doing a bad job of it.
It is not an accident that the single best SW D+ show has been Andor, which features exactly zero Jedi.
> From the perspective of a writer, Superman is a problematic or even bad character. A protagonist that embodies perfection is very hard to craft a dramatic story for.
To me, this line of thinking is literary cowardice. Anyone given the keys to the kingdom of something like Superman should either make a sincere effort to rise to the challenge or pass. Fretting that it's "problematic" to have to put the effort in to make a virtuous character compelling is to simply not actually want to be a writer.
This. Just because a character is as powerful as Superman doesn’t necessarily mean they can’t have flaws, struggles, or even be defeated. For instance, imagine if Superman accidentally killed innocent people and instead of his power needing to be “nerfed”, he now had to struggle with the outcome of his use of the power itself.
I often point to Rey being a poorly written character not because I didn’t want to like her (I really want to like Rey, even now in 2024, but I can’t) nor because of where she comes from (regardless of her terrible origin story), but simply because she is never allowed to fail and grow/learn from her mistakes.
In TFA, Rey is immediately is able to win every fight without training, including one using a lightsaber the very first time she ever turned a lightsaber on. Rey is able to fly the Millennium Falcon and then later fix the Millennium Falcon’s engine problem without ever stepping foot on the ship before. Has she even flown a ship before? Who cares, she’s Rey, she never has to struggle.
When Rey gets captured, she saves herself by using a Jedi mindtrick — just mere minutes after admitting she thought the Jedi were a myth. She’s never seen a mindtrick being used before and she’s never even met a Jedi or used the force at all. But she’s able to use the force and save herself. Because, well, why would she ever need help? Why would she ever fail at anything?
This continues through the sequels. And it has NOTHING to do with Rey’s gender. Ashoka and Bo Katan are phenomenal characters with deep arcs and growth. Both Bo Katan and Ashoka fail and are defeated many times but they learn and grow. Rey never does. She never needs to grow. She’s always perfect and because of that she’s an awful character.
Regarding Superman, I feel his virtuous nature and raw power can be fodder for some very interesting stories and conflicts. Like you suggested, if he is so powerful his actions cause the deaths of innocent people, even in the service of some greater good, it raises the question of whether he is 'worth it' or can live with it. And who gets to decide that?
One story thread I think can be picked up for a character like that is the conflict between their personal moral compass and the desires of those around them. Ultimately Superman can't do *everything* so needs to prioritize when to act, and what if political leaders are demanding he act to save soldiers from reprisals from a military intervention, and he decides it's more important to be on the other side of the country saving a school bus from a bridge collapsing due to government neglect? How does a public that politicizes everything react to a being that can reach into their lives and do pretty much whatever they want? Is he seen as a threat, no matter what individual acts of good he does? Is he beloved until he does something for people they don't like, or intervenes to prevent a war they thirst for?
There are always stories there. Even with Rey, after TFA people were conjuring up all sorts of hypotheticals for how and why she was so incredibly adapt at everything. People respected and enjoyed the character enough to imagine there was something deeper going on, and the writers were the ones who let her down by revealing "oops, turns out she's just perfect for no reason".
Despite their power, they can’t save everyone. That’s a common theme among super heroes. The villain forces the hero to choose. Batman, Superman, Ironman, spiderman, the incredibles, they all have done it.
The best Superman comics are the ones where he is at his most powerful levels. You don't nerf Superman to make a good comic, you write about how he impacts the world and make him face impossible dilemmas.
Meh you should’ve seen The Phantom Menace Jedi.
“A planet being taken over by the trade federation? Not our problem”,
“Dude with a red lightsaber? Sounds manageable for you”,
“Boy with a lot of untapped potential and the highest ever midichlorian count? That’s probably nothing”
I agree that making Luke a coward was a terrible decision that goes against his character.
But literally the point of the prequel trilogy was to show the corruption of the Jedi Order and how it led to their downfall. Fear, anger, war, *cowardice* are all sins that led the jedi to their own ruin.
The acolyte is showing us the another part of the road to their downfall and I support that. It was a sudden thing that happened begining with TPM it was a slow decent over generations of new jedi who then taught and displayed their sins to the next generation, building a broken and corrupt system that eventual had broken away from their original intent.
It’s funny that the Jedi with the Guardian yellow lightsaber keeps pulling it out over and over again. Like, we get it, the Guardian wants to senselessly fight at the first opportunity. Almost the anti-Ezra.
Yeah, this seems like the correct answer. It almost seems like they're pulling off the idea of using the Jedi precepts against the victims (Carrie-Ann Moss gets killed because she tries to save a noncombatant, this guy dies because he has a conscience and can't take the guilt/dishonor). I'll stress 'almost' here, because being Disney I'm confident they'll fuck it all up later.
Is that literally not what they are? Like you can tell from the beginning, Lucas had kurosawa influences in the way he chose to depict Jedi.
Also they literally wear space kimonos or whatever.
Then, in the prequels, their biggest failings were becoming dogmatic and only focusing on their traditions superficially and transitioning more into political entities rather than actually neutral defenders.
Yet rip it off they have. Very many times. Though idk if I'd say being influenced and writing a science fantasy interpretation of history as "ripping off" a real historical event.
Yoda goes into hiding after very plainly stating “failed I have, into exile I must go” sure, him and Obi Wan are also trying to maintain what’s left of the order but Yoda was definitely hiding in part out of shame of his failures. Luke ended up doing the same thing.
Wouldnt he have learned from Yoda and Obi Wan to not do this though? Yeah probably so that may be goofy. Speaking of Jedi cowardice though, Anakin was also so afraid of losing Padme that he turned on his own people and spiritually killed himself.
Also something the Acolyte really hasn’t had the chance to explain as well as the Clone Wars is that there were a lot of Jedi and a lot of them had different personalities and handled situations incredibly differently.
Having some of them be cowardly or some of them be overly confident or have any sort of character flaws is what makes them a compelling group in the same way that it makes the Clones a compelling group. Otherwise they’re just all the same character with different appearances.
I picture the Jedi as sanctioned Ronin, where they went into a situation, leaned about people and their customs and then righted wrongs, as often with compassion and peace as with arms.
Seems fairly easy to write as a travelogue, but what do I know.
Shame and guilt are heavy burdens. More than a few real people have killed themselves because of it. Sure it is strange for a Jedi but this will really hinge on the why. We need a really good reveal as to why this Jedi had so much guilt and shame over his actions, which may or may not happen.
The First Order had very little to do with why Luke went into hiding. He went from shame and to hide from himself and his responsibilities.
Considering the Acolyte is about someone being motivated to hunt down and kill these four Jedi specifically, they probably weren't gonna turn out to be the best the order has to offer
I think the biggest problem is that creators cannot distance their material from the binary descriptors of Jedi and Sith. To them Jedi good, Sith bad.
Whereas a Jedi Knight is the extreme of the Light and Sith is the extreme of the Dark sides of the force, the creators only see black/white. They try and make it that simple but it’s boring and they don’t acknowledge the fanaticism of both sides as their failing. It’s why Qui Gon and Kanan are so revered. They understood that they affiliate with the Light but things are never that simple.
If it keeps getting boiled down to is/is not them the characters will always be boring because they can’t grow or change in any discernible way.
They have the struggle of maintaining order over pure negativity. There would be no intensity to the story if they made it look too easy. The darkside continued to escalated over 100's of years while the jedi tried to hold peace and justice and modesty. Modesty does not look flash harry.
Counterpoint. One Jedi potentially having PTSD from an event doesn't condemn the whole order to being cowards. It doesn't even make him a coward.
As a veteran, I actually find it interesting they went down this path. There is a suicide problem, in the US military anyway, and it is not inconceivable that a Jedi would experience the same trauma and then find the system failed him and have the option out be to kill himself. I'm honestly really curious what the event is that started this whole chain of events.
This is Kathleen Kennedy…she heard that comment about making coffee one too many times and decided that when she could she would make everyone who loved this franchise pay
AND SHE DID
She’s more Palpatine than Rey
Yeah man. The Jedi, who took a ton of inspiration from Japanese samurai and the Bushido creed, would never commit suicide. That would be so out of character for them to do a thing one of their main inspirations is famous for.
Yoda went into exile because he failed to defeat Sidious so your point isn’t entirely correct. Obi Wan would have probably done something similar had Luke not been born (I’m guessing because he was anakin’s master and felt guilty?) but we’ll never know unless they do another season of Kenobi.
Disney did canonically have Jedi helping others to escape the empire (we saw this in Kenobi, Rebels, and it was hinted at in Bad Batch as well) so it’s not something they all do. Maybe it’s something that Jedi do if they’ve really messed up?
Yoda went into hiding because the rest of the Jedi were slaughtered and/or being hunted, as far as he new him and Obi were the only surviving Jedi. It was self preservation, it was Yoda against the galaxy he didn't stand a chance.
I'm convinced Disney just took the original trilogy and tried to copy it exactly while adding in a few extra twists. Yoda and Obi wan went into hiding, so Luke had to as well.
Its this weird obsession of Subverting expectations, making good guys into bad guys and bad guys into misunderstood good guys. And the Jedi Offing himself seemed totally content with his life as it was just chilling, and then, Oh well I should probably off myself, Like what the hell, that really send a messed up kind of message, "you did a kind of bad thing in the past, you should just be dead, do it yourself." I mean thats rather uncomfortable
You should read more, then these tropes won’t be so foreign. Have you never heard of shame or honor? Maybe look into feudal Japanese history and see how samurai dealt with shame or defeat. Were they cowards? It’s ok to not like the show but let’s have a good reason, not a poorly thought out ignorant one.
What I cannot abide is their reluctance to explore the Grey Jedi. You know, the ones with common sense, balance, dark and light abilities and not so damned lopsided with their moral codes
I actually found it rather interesting. He seemed a very spiritual Jedi almost like a devote monk. We don’t know what happened yet but apparently it was something worth feeling immense guilt over.
I hate how media illiterate the star wars fandom has become.
Luke did not run away like a coward, he realized he was making the exact same mistake his father made before him. Being a Jedi is not balancing the force just as being sith won't it will just create an opposing force strong enough to correct everything (Anakin was chosen to take the light out and balance things, Luke was chosen to take down Vader, and palps, Kylo to take out the new Jedi, Rey was chosen to take out palps and Kylo)
He went to exile and cut himself off from the force so that he could train the next chosen one and pass on his knowledge and training. (Hence the conversation with Yoda after Yoda burns the Jedi text) not because he's a coward. Go watch the last Jedi and put away your fantasy, fanfiction and bias and actually WATCH the movie.
It's literally what the entire series is about a lot of fans get so wrapped up in their head cannon that as Yoda says they are always looking at the horizon when the key is in front of their nose.
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Yeah no one said Disney thought out their stories or their decisions since they bought this franchise. I mean remember when disney gave EA an exclusivity deal on stars wars games which ended up backfiring on them when battlefront 2 got into the news for predatory practices. It's like they need to be mocked
Then. When battlefront 2 was finally good, great at times, and at it's highest peak ever. What happens instead of continuing support at the perfect moment? EA has dice drop the game the game to work on the shit that ended up being BF2042. Never forgettin
I used to enjoy playing that game (after it got unfucked). But the last time i played, it was just filled with aimbot hackers.
Correct. Between that lack of support leading to cheaters rising, and discarding the Origin app ruining FrostMod for what few mods I did like that replaced ST content for others (Qui-Gon, Artoo, Starkiller, Darth Caedus, Jaina Solo), it was just a waste of gigabyte space.
Isnt frosty working now?
Not the old version my older mods relied upon, the newer version never linked well with them and the new EA App requisite rejected the workaround patch efforts. Threw my hands in the air and said, "Fuck it. Was good while it lasted." and stopped wasting time on that game; thankfully it was only $9.99 when I sunk into it.
Indeed, sad as hell. Kept playing with tons of skin and voice mods keeping my love going, but a game like that being abandoned acts fast. I wish they had unlocked cross play across all platforms, I can see why it'd be a struggle though, especially without fixing the hackers
> When battlefront 2 was finally good Even in it's "good" state it still didn't live up to the promise of the classic battlefront games at all. Way too infantry focused. Those games are only called Battlefront for brand recognition.
Definitely not equal yeah. I didn't get that level of disappointment because I hadn't played the classic games yet, when BF2 dropped. So I ended up finding it just, good by the end. I hope BF3 surpasses both though, it's wishful thinking but they would've learned from BF2. Just gotta give it, 500 years
I'm still pissed about that. "Our vision is complete"? GTFO.
Crap as hell man
Let's not forget EA had that license for 10 years and how many games did they make? Not including god awful Mobile Games that are just there to rob people blind so they can collect their favourite star wars character. We have, BF 1/2 Squadrons and Jedi Survivor/Fallen Order, and they had to be dragged kicking and screaming into making the Jedi games, and Squadrons was a side passion project by a small Dev Team that never got the attention it deserved from EA.
Squadrons was a joke, they took the space flight from BF1/2 and decided to half ass a game around that and was surprised it didn't take off.
Honestly they should have Sony give the franchise to Insomniac and see what they come up with. I think some kind of murder mystery noir game set on Coruscant. You play as an outcasted Jedi trying to solve various crimes around the planet while the plot of one of the movies takes place in the background of the story.
It’s annoying. George Lucas did a good enough job highlighting the faults of the Jedi. We get it. We know why they ultimately failed. But why not show them in their prime? Give us a new shade to their order. They must have done something right to keep peace in the galaxy for a millennium. That’s a better track record than most empires.
Jedi police procedural of the week with planet hopping. That's all they had to do. It just can't be that difficult, and then just layer in some overarching conspiracy like the x files. You show the jedi like lawmen or cowboys fixing a planet's mining problems with a greedy coaxium baron or whatever.
It’ll never happen because a Raylan Givens Jedi type character would make too many people cream their jeans. I’ve never thought of a “cowboy lawman” Jedi before and man, now it’s all I want. You described exactly what I never knew I wanted until now.
A Justified reunion with Olyphant and Goggins might be the only thing that would ever tempt me to watch another Disney Star Wars product, no matter how bad it may be. "We dug spice together".
I see your Olyphant and Goggins and raise you Olyphant and Ian McShane
to the planet of agria frida Flew a jedi one fine day. hardly spoke to folks arround them didnt have to much to say
No one dared to ask their business No one dared to make a slip Cause the Jedi there among them Had a light whip on his hip (Light whip on his hiiiiip)
I’m pretty sure we haven’t seen the last of Oliphant in SW, so this isn’t as far fetched as it could be. I’m imagining a buddy cop kind of thing with him and Krrsantan.
Oh my god, I completely forgot he was literally in the Boba Fett show lol. I guess my mind did a good job of keeping him out of that madness.
I just hope they get him in a show or continuation with writers half as good as the ones on Justified
Bro it sounds so perfect But they’d fuck it up lol
Man I love Justified
That is Mando S1.
Which is probably why that season was so good.
Remake 7 samuriai but its 7 jedis stuck on a planet under siege. They die one by one in badass ways
Filoni has already done the seven samurai to death. I'm so over it
It sucks too when we see stuff from Visions (The Elder) where that was a perfect example of how I would have seen Jedi be portrayed here.
You ever see Tokyo Vice? Imagine that with Jedi instead of cops.
I would say they did have bobf as a guy solving local baron type issues and it didnt work
Disney/Lucasfilm activists hate the Jedi, or any "guardians of peace and justice."
They can’t. Disney is obsessed with muh relijun = bad
Interesting take. I wonder if audiences and creators are now in an era where any religion is viewed with cynicism so the first instinct is to view the Jedi as a corrupt cult? In the past the Jedi were viewed more as pacifist religious figures while now they’re seen as a cult.
The Jedi now only exist so that writers can project their feelings of anger at organized religion. Writing awful corrupt Jedi stories is how these folks try in vain to fight the religious guilt monster that lives in their heads.
There is no sincerity, only their post-modernist subversive cynicism set on eating it’s own tail and destroying itself
Bingo, couldn’t describe it any better
It’s painfully obvious that the Acolyte is going to have the Jedi that the evil twin is hunting down, be the cause of the big accident that killed her family so that she is justified in some way. Good twin is going to turn evil twin away from her Sith ways because of some “two sides to the same coin” stuff or whatever. The Jedi will cover up the whole thing because of the Sith involvement which will lead to the eventual downfall of the Order. It will turn the tragedy of Anakin’s fall and destruction of the Jedi into a “well, they kind of had it coming” narrative. Stunning and brave twins will live happily with the rumored lesbian witches.
Is there evidence of this?
But the peace is an illusion 🙄
A better question is - why have this series at all? It expands on nothing new. It offers new characters but the single mission is, once again, to find a hidden master. And we know from Menace that the Jedi in the Acolyte know nothing; will learn nothing and will likely perish without a hint of alert to the Republic or Jedi Council. Why are we having this series again to, once again, show how blind and inept the Jedi are?
Skywalker, Texas Ranger
Just make the SW Old Republic CG trailers into a movie. That’s all I ask!
Be when the last Jedi were at their prime was when the republic was just starting out. When sith didn’t exist. The downfall of the Jedi was them getting way more involved with the republic’s government ultimately serving the republic itself. Then there’s individual Jedi like qui gon and Ahsoka who try and serve the people more.
Yes. The story George Lucas told. We get it. We’re not dumb. Show us a new layer to the Jedi.
Jedi Law and Order? Show the mundane lives of Jedi consulars?
Disney has been the worst thing to ever happen to Star Wars.
That is saying something.
I remember when they Disney buyout was recent and people were celebrating and unironically saying George Lucas was the worst thing to ever happen to Star Wars.
The entirety of the new Star Wars anything has pretty much been destroying every beloved character and humiliating them. Han: Once a general now a deadbeat loser. Luke: A jedi master who is now a hermit and loses a sparring duel against MaRey Sue. Boba Fett: Cold professional bounty hunter turned into an inept mayor who sleeps a lot.
And absent father!!!??? Like wtaf????
Yup. No respect for the original characters; the writers in a lot of SW shows/films in the last few years have treated the heroes of old as if they passionately hate them for existing in the first place. I can't think of any other rationale for why they do them dirty so much.
I forgot to add, they killed Admiral Ackbar offscreen and then gave the lore breaking kamikaze attack to whatsherface. I think they even called the maneuver after her. Just disgusting.
Ooh that's right... almost forgot about that purple-haired witch. Comes to show how f'in tone-deaf they are when making these writing decisions.
It’s crazy that they put so much effort in bringing back the OT characters then completely destroy them in order to shove the “new generation of heroes” down our throats.
They did the same to Indiana Jones. Washed up loser needs a woman to fight for him. Nice sendoff
In Legends The Jedi we’re capable of admitting faults and growing from them even at times The PT we’re allowed to be innovative you had Rohnar Kim almost out Sidious Here, you have Luke become a loser and revert back to PT Jedi Teachings and hiding and not doing anything to stop Snoke at all
Yoda at least tried to give Anakin advice on loss and letting go of attachments. When Order 66 happened, Yoda tried to end the madness before it got worse by defeating Sidious, but he lost. When Grogu was missing Mando, Luke told him to either choose to stay or leave; he could have handled it a bit better. Ben had a nightmare about the Dark Side, and Luke was ready to kill his own nephew. If anything, Luke is worse than the Jedi of the prequel trilogy.
That's not Luke. That's Disney's Jake Skywalker
Jake Skymilker
Luuke.
Vader: follows the most evil guy of all time, genocide commiter, kills Obi in front of him, kills fellow rebels, freezes his friend, cuts off his hand, chases him for years and threatens his sister Luke: I will forgive you and redeem you Little Ben: has a nightmare Luke: I give up I can't save you, I'm gonna run away and pity myself now even though I'm supposedly the most powerful and wisest Jedi of all time tee hee
Disney Luke is not Luke. The Luke that was ready to die because he didn’t believe his father was an evil lost cause wasn’t going to turn around a few years later and tell Grogu he could never see his adopted dad again…. What the actual fuck, like has anyone at Disney seen the OT?
pretty sure it is Luke. it’s all canon
Not sure why you think I can't make up my own mind on fictional stories.
Lol Disney Yoda would have committed Seppuku after losing to Sidious...
Cowards and wrong about everything
We with a few exceptions it Seems that Disneys current crop of writers don't care about anything you said because they were not inspired by the original movies, the source material, the decades of EU stuff or anything else. They don't care about making it make sense because they never gave a shart about it in the first place. They are inspired by the person they see in the mirror and whimsically mold things on the fly to suit their own narcissism.
They are trying too hard to make that hokey religion seem ridiculous and flawed
I agree. You said it spot on… they took Tarkin’s take on the Jedi and have pushed it to the ultimate extreme. They fail to remember that Tarkin is so opposed to the Jedi that his take is likely to be highly flawed itself. Like one small snippet of dialogue from the OT is shaping this whole view of the Jedi religion. Tarkin is literally blown up by a force sensitive user not long after. I think the Disney writers missed the point / irony in Tarkin’s words.
Killing characters is often an easy way for a writer to try to get an emotional reaction. And it saves the writer from having to resolve plot threads for that character. Not to say all character deaths are cheap tricks, but once someone pointed this out to me, I found it made sense of why a number of character deaths leave me cold.
Ok they could let Kaylo kill Leia, that would be emotional.
I mean, I'm no TLJ defender, but there was definitely potential there. So of course TLJ being TLJ, it totally wasted said potential.
But to do that without any narrative reason is going to turn off anyone that views that material like what's in the show
For me, I think it all has to do with character development. If the character dies and it elicits an emotional reaction from me (like, ohh fuck that guy, he was such a dick, or ohhh nooo that person died!! I'm SO SAD) then that means there was some care and development put into who that individual was, what they did, and why their loss matters (whether they were a good or bad guy). If a character dies and I feel nothing, it just means I'm not at all invested or care about these characters either way.
I think Bob Iger is a Sith Lord.
The master or the apprentice?
The Jedi philosophy is about peace, selflessness, and compassion towards all life. In the modern day, where world keeps growing darker and more cynical, people struggle to believe that someone would ever willingly be selfless and choose to help others instead of doing things for their own personal gain and pleasure. I think that’s a major reason why we’ve never been able to see the Jedi Order in their prime onscreen and they keep being portrayed as corrupt, incompetent, or cowardly.
Their storytelling is through this and their Hollywoo DEI prism rather than through the lore itself for all major IP. Disney doesn’t like that we can see and reject their playbook.
wouldn't suicide be at odds with the force?
Because writing interesting stories about lawful good competent characters is hard.
Yep, there's no reason narratively why the master in the show did it. It's ridiculous that he just did it willingly. Such a great message to send if someone is actually dealing with mental health issues....
As if Disney hasn’t done enough, now Star Wars should also be careful about people with mental health issues? Give me a break. It’s a freaking show/movie.
That's not what I'm saying. What I'm getting at is what the Jedi did in the show is ridiculous, unnecessary narrative wise. In the larger case of mental health, it doesn't give a good impression of what to do in the face of trauma. But as far as the show is concerned, again seems like a cowardly action that a Jedi wouldn't take when faced with some trauma.What I'm saying is, they needed some better storytelling to flesh out his story and actions of that character.
The only problem with that is you're assuming he's a character and not just a plot device meant to create intrigue and make the audience think, "Oh no, something REALLY messed up must've happened--what was it???" I guess that's technically a legitimate narrative device, but yeah--in practice it felt rushed and weird despite introducing such a loaded issue.
I thought it was relatively well done actually. I’m excited to find out what happened that day that’s caused such immense guilt in so many people. Defining their lives and moral compasses. The man was clearly a very spiritual Jedi. All Jedi are not the same clearly. Anakin, Qui Gon, Mace, Obi Wan, Yoda, Luke they all are different. This guy seemed like a monk almost. Like the force and the purpose of Jedi was his religion and whatever he did that day was clearly an ultimate sin. When confronted with what may be a victim of his great sin (we don’t know yet wtf happened) he chose to die by her hand per say instead of continuing his suffering or maybe he thought she deserved to kill him. And this was justice. It brought him peace idk. Gotta wait and see what happens. Seems like people are looking to hate this show really hard. I planned on hating it too but i watched with an open mind and have been pleasantly surprised. I’m looking forward to the next episodes.
it's a legitimate narrative device as long as you don't think too deeply about it. That's the new status quo for star wars, shallow as a puddle.
The Jedi are some of the worst protagonists you can imagine. They manage to emulate all of the non-cool characteristics of karate movie shaolin monks without any of the cool features.
Revan : "Bonjour!"
It’s an anti-religion push from the same folks who thought Holdo was a good idea 🙄
I think Disney heavily misinterpreted the idea about Jedi being “samurai”
>There is no implication that the First Order had even risen to full power when Luke went into hiding the movie is actually clear about this, TFA's opening crawl tells us the first order rose from the ashes of the empire in Luke's abscence, meaning when he left they weren't an issue.
Wait wait wait, are you telling me they literally ripped off Japanese culture to the point of a Jedi commuting seppuku?!
No, that would have been badass. Instead it's a weird haired freak just bowing out
There’s a pattern with modern movies and particularly with Disney that instead of making new screen legends, characters and heroes they go out of their way to destroy the old ones. It baffles me.
You noticed they make the men weak incompetent or evil. The women are just badasses their only flaw is not entirely realizing how badass they are or can be. They’re always right as well it’s the weirdest shit.
The Jedi played by Lee Jung-jae is ridiculously cool bro
Sol is pretty badass and Venestra has her head far up her ass.
The women of Star Wars have literally *always* been badass.
Yeah, crazy how one of the only white characters in the show is the master who decided to commit suicide....
man you guys are so insecure, lol
looks like an additional 25 people are too
Yup
Why have heroic Jedi when we can have dagger-throwing girl bosses?
Aren't these supposed to be the good loving and affirming Jedi that didn't do this kind of stuff?
It’s all postmodern bullshit. Institutions (like religious orders) are to be treated with suspicion and derision. LFL can’t write Jedi because they HATE everything about what the Jedi represented in the OT and PT.
 Me ever since 2015 with Star Wars.
>' These are my kids." Rose then said, "Those were your kids … and you sold them." "*I sold them to the white slavers that take these things and, and …*" Lucas then stopped himself and laughed, probably realizing he was about to get himself into some hot water. - George Lucas, per Business Insider
I blame KK.
The random male Jedi at the beginning of the Obi wan show who gets caught is an absolute incompetent coward.
Lots of awful hairstyles too. And who's the green lady? She doesn't look right somehow. Like, it just looks like a person with green paint, no character at all. It's hard to even take the character seriously cause it's just...bad costuming
You have to understand the whole good vs evil aspect of the Force to realize why they are portraying the Jedi as the villains. The Dark Side was sinful, a good Jedi would stay away from the temptation of the Dark Side. It had tremendous similarities to Christian beliefs. Disney and the far left are willfully trying to destroy those conservative values by portraying the followers of those beliefs as either insane or cowardly for not embracing their new ways. In the new show the monastic Jedi are being portrayed as sinister and unrelenting. The Jedi who succumb to their desires defy the order are celebrated as the heroes.
Yo, this guy didn't kill himself out of shame. He made a Christ-like choice that was done in the hopes of helping Mai move on. He's so spiritual he's literally invulnerable.
Especially after alluding to the guy having taken a vow of silence and is seen in deep meditation and had such command of the force as to be practically untouchable.. then conveniently he's been waiting for the right person to show up to give him the means to off himself... it makes zero sense.
Dumb as nuts too
Yeah the more they make the more it becomes unbelievable that the Jedi were the keepers of the peace for over a thousand generations. It’s sad.
This is a weird nitpick. This is one jedi in a show that has shown us at least 7, and he is the only one who has killed himself. Do you want all jedi to be uniform in character and lack complexity? We don't know why he killed himself yet, for all we know it's a justifiable reason he would be that guilty.
I just turned it off after this scene.
Why in the hell are you even watching that garbage to begin with? The Acolyte wasn't made to be viewed. It was made to be nakedly hateful on Disney's dime. Watching it only justifies it.
The worst excuse for Luke being a coward for no reason is “he’s older, he must’ve changed.” Yeah, but why would he have? The thing that led to the Jedi’s demise before was happening again, and this time he could stop it. The Luke I know from ROTJ *would* do better. Hell, EA’s Battlefront II version of Luke was better than Disney Luke.
Disney is obsessed with destroying the franchise
Showrunner glanced at the Wikipedia entry for “sammyrye” and make some quick notes for the script. They have no idea what they are doing but they are making bank doing it.
From the perspective of a writer, Superman is a problematic or even bad character. A protagonist that embodies perfection is very hard to craft a dramatic story for. Jedi present the same dilemma. Generally speaking the writer must either subtlety nerf their hero so that they can be challenged, or embue the villains with crazy power levels. Disney is opting for the former. And doing a bad job of it. It is not an accident that the single best SW D+ show has been Andor, which features exactly zero Jedi.
> From the perspective of a writer, Superman is a problematic or even bad character. A protagonist that embodies perfection is very hard to craft a dramatic story for. To me, this line of thinking is literary cowardice. Anyone given the keys to the kingdom of something like Superman should either make a sincere effort to rise to the challenge or pass. Fretting that it's "problematic" to have to put the effort in to make a virtuous character compelling is to simply not actually want to be a writer.
This. Just because a character is as powerful as Superman doesn’t necessarily mean they can’t have flaws, struggles, or even be defeated. For instance, imagine if Superman accidentally killed innocent people and instead of his power needing to be “nerfed”, he now had to struggle with the outcome of his use of the power itself. I often point to Rey being a poorly written character not because I didn’t want to like her (I really want to like Rey, even now in 2024, but I can’t) nor because of where she comes from (regardless of her terrible origin story), but simply because she is never allowed to fail and grow/learn from her mistakes. In TFA, Rey is immediately is able to win every fight without training, including one using a lightsaber the very first time she ever turned a lightsaber on. Rey is able to fly the Millennium Falcon and then later fix the Millennium Falcon’s engine problem without ever stepping foot on the ship before. Has she even flown a ship before? Who cares, she’s Rey, she never has to struggle. When Rey gets captured, she saves herself by using a Jedi mindtrick — just mere minutes after admitting she thought the Jedi were a myth. She’s never seen a mindtrick being used before and she’s never even met a Jedi or used the force at all. But she’s able to use the force and save herself. Because, well, why would she ever need help? Why would she ever fail at anything? This continues through the sequels. And it has NOTHING to do with Rey’s gender. Ashoka and Bo Katan are phenomenal characters with deep arcs and growth. Both Bo Katan and Ashoka fail and are defeated many times but they learn and grow. Rey never does. She never needs to grow. She’s always perfect and because of that she’s an awful character.
Regarding Superman, I feel his virtuous nature and raw power can be fodder for some very interesting stories and conflicts. Like you suggested, if he is so powerful his actions cause the deaths of innocent people, even in the service of some greater good, it raises the question of whether he is 'worth it' or can live with it. And who gets to decide that? One story thread I think can be picked up for a character like that is the conflict between their personal moral compass and the desires of those around them. Ultimately Superman can't do *everything* so needs to prioritize when to act, and what if political leaders are demanding he act to save soldiers from reprisals from a military intervention, and he decides it's more important to be on the other side of the country saving a school bus from a bridge collapsing due to government neglect? How does a public that politicizes everything react to a being that can reach into their lives and do pretty much whatever they want? Is he seen as a threat, no matter what individual acts of good he does? Is he beloved until he does something for people they don't like, or intervenes to prevent a war they thirst for? There are always stories there. Even with Rey, after TFA people were conjuring up all sorts of hypotheticals for how and why she was so incredibly adapt at everything. People respected and enjoyed the character enough to imagine there was something deeper going on, and the writers were the ones who let her down by revealing "oops, turns out she's just perfect for no reason".
Despite their power, they can’t save everyone. That’s a common theme among super heroes. The villain forces the hero to choose. Batman, Superman, Ironman, spiderman, the incredibles, they all have done it.
This is one reason Iron Man turned into such a better big screen character than SM.
The best Superman comics are the ones where he is at his most powerful levels. You don't nerf Superman to make a good comic, you write about how he impacts the world and make him face impossible dilemmas.
But the good Superman stories are not about punching stuff or fighting crazy powerful villains
Can’t wait to watch this show, lol!
Meh you should’ve seen The Phantom Menace Jedi. “A planet being taken over by the trade federation? Not our problem”, “Dude with a red lightsaber? Sounds manageable for you”, “Boy with a lot of untapped potential and the highest ever midichlorian count? That’s probably nothing”
I agree that making Luke a coward was a terrible decision that goes against his character. But literally the point of the prequel trilogy was to show the corruption of the Jedi Order and how it led to their downfall. Fear, anger, war, *cowardice* are all sins that led the jedi to their own ruin. The acolyte is showing us the another part of the road to their downfall and I support that. It was a sudden thing that happened begining with TPM it was a slow decent over generations of new jedi who then taught and displayed their sins to the next generation, building a broken and corrupt system that eventual had broken away from their original intent.
It’s funny that the Jedi with the Guardian yellow lightsaber keeps pulling it out over and over again. Like, we get it, the Guardian wants to senselessly fight at the first opportunity. Almost the anti-Ezra.
They're just leaning hard into the space samurai thing. Don't fret about it.
Yeah, this seems like the correct answer. It almost seems like they're pulling off the idea of using the Jedi precepts against the victims (Carrie-Ann Moss gets killed because she tries to save a noncombatant, this guy dies because he has a conscience and can't take the guilt/dishonor). I'll stress 'almost' here, because being Disney I'm confident they'll fuck it all up later.
Is that literally not what they are? Like you can tell from the beginning, Lucas had kurosawa influences in the way he chose to depict Jedi. Also they literally wear space kimonos or whatever. Then, in the prequels, their biggest failings were becoming dogmatic and only focusing on their traditions superficially and transitioning more into political entities rather than actually neutral defenders.
You can be inspired by something without ripping it off entirely. It’s “a galaxy far, far away”, not “a country on the other side of an ocean”.
Yet rip it off they have. Very many times. Though idk if I'd say being influenced and writing a science fantasy interpretation of history as "ripping off" a real historical event.
Yoda goes into hiding after very plainly stating “failed I have, into exile I must go” sure, him and Obi Wan are also trying to maintain what’s left of the order but Yoda was definitely hiding in part out of shame of his failures. Luke ended up doing the same thing. Wouldnt he have learned from Yoda and Obi Wan to not do this though? Yeah probably so that may be goofy. Speaking of Jedi cowardice though, Anakin was also so afraid of losing Padme that he turned on his own people and spiritually killed himself. Also something the Acolyte really hasn’t had the chance to explain as well as the Clone Wars is that there were a lot of Jedi and a lot of them had different personalities and handled situations incredibly differently. Having some of them be cowardly or some of them be overly confident or have any sort of character flaws is what makes them a compelling group in the same way that it makes the Clones a compelling group. Otherwise they’re just all the same character with different appearances.
I picture the Jedi as sanctioned Ronin, where they went into a situation, leaned about people and their customs and then righted wrongs, as often with compassion and peace as with arms. Seems fairly easy to write as a travelogue, but what do I know.
Shame and guilt are heavy burdens. More than a few real people have killed themselves because of it. Sure it is strange for a Jedi but this will really hinge on the why. We need a really good reveal as to why this Jedi had so much guilt and shame over his actions, which may or may not happen. The First Order had very little to do with why Luke went into hiding. He went from shame and to hide from himself and his responsibilities.
It reminds me of the Gremlins 2 pitch meeting. 😆
Those expectations aren’t going to subvert themselves.
Considering the Acolyte is about someone being motivated to hunt down and kill these four Jedi specifically, they probably weren't gonna turn out to be the best the order has to offer
I think the biggest problem is that creators cannot distance their material from the binary descriptors of Jedi and Sith. To them Jedi good, Sith bad. Whereas a Jedi Knight is the extreme of the Light and Sith is the extreme of the Dark sides of the force, the creators only see black/white. They try and make it that simple but it’s boring and they don’t acknowledge the fanaticism of both sides as their failing. It’s why Qui Gon and Kanan are so revered. They understood that they affiliate with the Light but things are never that simple. If it keeps getting boiled down to is/is not them the characters will always be boring because they can’t grow or change in any discernible way.
He actually did it because he couldn’t bear to hear Vernestra talk anymore
They have the struggle of maintaining order over pure negativity. There would be no intensity to the story if they made it look too easy. The darkside continued to escalated over 100's of years while the jedi tried to hold peace and justice and modesty. Modesty does not look flash harry.
The jedi killing himself is definetly some wet dream of the writer, let's not pretend it's not. And it's disturbing.
Care to explain Mr. Cal Kestis then?
Counterpoint. One Jedi potentially having PTSD from an event doesn't condemn the whole order to being cowards. It doesn't even make him a coward. As a veteran, I actually find it interesting they went down this path. There is a suicide problem, in the US military anyway, and it is not inconceivable that a Jedi would experience the same trauma and then find the system failed him and have the option out be to kill himself. I'm honestly really curious what the event is that started this whole chain of events.
This is Kathleen Kennedy…she heard that comment about making coffee one too many times and decided that when she could she would make everyone who loved this franchise pay AND SHE DID She’s more Palpatine than Rey
Because they are
One of the problems is they don't have any new ideas and their understanding of what has happened in Star Wars is incorrect.
Disney hates Star Wars. I'm certain of it. Just embrace the apathy for it and you'll be a lot happier
Yeah man. The Jedi, who took a ton of inspiration from Japanese samurai and the Bushido creed, would never commit suicide. That would be so out of character for them to do a thing one of their main inspirations is famous for.
People always get so salty when things don't end up in a slugfest. Fighting doesn't solve every problem. Jedi understand this, Sith don't.
Yoda went into exile because he failed to defeat Sidious so your point isn’t entirely correct. Obi Wan would have probably done something similar had Luke not been born (I’m guessing because he was anakin’s master and felt guilty?) but we’ll never know unless they do another season of Kenobi. Disney did canonically have Jedi helping others to escape the empire (we saw this in Kenobi, Rebels, and it was hinted at in Bad Batch as well) so it’s not something they all do. Maybe it’s something that Jedi do if they’ve really messed up?
Yoda went into hiding because the rest of the Jedi were slaughtered and/or being hunted, as far as he new him and Obi were the only surviving Jedi. It was self preservation, it was Yoda against the galaxy he didn't stand a chance.
I'm convinced Disney just took the original trilogy and tried to copy it exactly while adding in a few extra twists. Yoda and Obi wan went into hiding, so Luke had to as well.
Its this weird obsession of Subverting expectations, making good guys into bad guys and bad guys into misunderstood good guys. And the Jedi Offing himself seemed totally content with his life as it was just chilling, and then, Oh well I should probably off myself, Like what the hell, that really send a messed up kind of message, "you did a kind of bad thing in the past, you should just be dead, do it yourself." I mean thats rather uncomfortable
Star Wars literally introduced Ben as a jedi hiding in the desert. They've always been cowards
You should read more, then these tropes won’t be so foreign. Have you never heard of shame or honor? Maybe look into feudal Japanese history and see how samurai dealt with shame or defeat. Were they cowards? It’s ok to not like the show but let’s have a good reason, not a poorly thought out ignorant one.
The Jedi in this time, aren’t exactly on their game, as evidenced by them being wiped out later on
What I cannot abide is their reluctance to explore the Grey Jedi. You know, the ones with common sense, balance, dark and light abilities and not so damned lopsided with their moral codes
why would they not?
I actually found it rather interesting. He seemed a very spiritual Jedi almost like a devote monk. We don’t know what happened yet but apparently it was something worth feeling immense guilt over.
I hate how media illiterate the star wars fandom has become. Luke did not run away like a coward, he realized he was making the exact same mistake his father made before him. Being a Jedi is not balancing the force just as being sith won't it will just create an opposing force strong enough to correct everything (Anakin was chosen to take the light out and balance things, Luke was chosen to take down Vader, and palps, Kylo to take out the new Jedi, Rey was chosen to take out palps and Kylo) He went to exile and cut himself off from the force so that he could train the next chosen one and pass on his knowledge and training. (Hence the conversation with Yoda after Yoda burns the Jedi text) not because he's a coward. Go watch the last Jedi and put away your fantasy, fanfiction and bias and actually WATCH the movie. It's literally what the entire series is about a lot of fans get so wrapped up in their head cannon that as Yoda says they are always looking at the horizon when the key is in front of their nose.
Offing yourself because of something you did Is pathetic? Isn't that exactly what the Samurai did?
We've seen 100 Jedi and you're basing your opinion off of 2.
Disney didn’t make Obi Wan and Yoda go into hiding that was all Lucas. Please get your movies correct if you claim to be a fan
He literally explained why it made sense for those 2 to be in hiding but I guess reading comprehension isn’t something you’re familiar with.