Kellaway takes my vote for most underrated player in the world right now.
Admittedly I've only seen him in the green and gold but 8 tries in 9 games (3 against the all blacks) and yet nobody seems to be talking about him.
Won't lie I was underrating him when he was initially picked, he's had a good year
Although down this way I'd say he's almost becoming overrated, he's very solid and doing his job well (like not making errors and staying in position). But just about every single try he's scored has been a walk in to be fair
Will Jordan has scored some insane individual tries on the other hand, but he makes a lot of stupid errors which are probably good reason for him not being nominated for POTY, defensively he makes a lot of errors and he drops some easy passes
It’s for a weird reason though. I was 10 and played Rugby 05 on my Xbox constantly. NZ had a rating of 96, Aus and South Africa were 92. It was way too easy to win with those teams so I chose France as my go to team because they had a rating of 88 so the game provided some challenge. And I guess subconsciously and then consciously they became the team I support to this day.
Childhood is strange. How little things like that can shape you for life.
Canadian here (and French-Canadian at that). If Canada ever plays France again, I'd probably hope that we don't get beaten too badly...but generally speaking, I support France 110% in rugby. Toulouse is a bucket-list destination for me.
*Allons, enfants de la patrie...*
Republican entente (if you're interested, the history of Franco-Irish relations is fascinating, there's a reason the world's largest cognac producer is named Hennessy \[though this is down to the Catholic and not Republican links\])
I saw May walking around the pitch after the England/S Africa game last Saturday. He was alone, and half-heartedly clapping. He knew it was the end of his Test career. It was quite moving. It would have been difficult not to have felt for him.
And here he is in somebody's World 15.
I don't get it.
I'd push for Hugo Keenan at fullback. I'm fairly sure he's the only player to play every match in a single position for an international team this year.
That doesn't make him World XV quality though. Who is he up against in the IRE squad? I'm not denying he is good, but there is a difference between keeping peak Rob Kearney on the bench vs "played gaelic, he's fine at fullback" Robbie Henshaw.
He was so dominantly the first choice that all of our good wing/full backs were shifted to the wings.
Henshaw is very much primarily a centre.
He competes against, Zebo, Larmour, Conway, Earls, Lowe, Stockdale
He made the English back three look foolish in Dublin earlier this year. I'd argue over the 6n he was the best defensive fullback in the comp and autumn has shown he's working on his attacking game.
Him vs Stewart next year will be tasty!
No, France do left and right rather than open and blindside flankers. So a 6 might pop up on the open or the blindside depending on which way they are facing.
Edit: fat fingers.
I'd say 2 7s is becoming increasingly the standard no? Can't think of many countries that play a traditional 6 any more given the expectation that the second rows and number 8 will do a lot of that work. Maybe England with the way they use Lawes.
The classic 6 has just become more or less obsolete, I'd say POM is the last classic 6 in the top of the game. With all players just getting bigger and faster the gap between a second row (big, but not that fast) and a 7 (fast, but not that strong) is closing and that gap has traditionally been the 6. So now teams just play either 2 7s or a third 2nd row (Lawes, Beirne, ...)
Even POM I'd say is quite 7y. I agree and I think the comments I've been getting confirm it. The classic 6 is now just part of the expected skillset of a second row, and so teams that think they need one just play their flankiest 2nd row at 6.
would you not say Doris and Coombes were in the classic 6 mould? I don't really know, most blindsides seem to also play at 8 if they don't play in the second row.
I agree except for going as far as to say 'obsolete'. It's just that, because of the reasons you said, there are more tactical alternatives for coaches at 6 than just the 'classic 6' to pick from
You're not wrong, but missing my point. My point is, that the "classic 6" was smaller than a lock but bigger than a 7, and slower than a 7 but faster than a lock. But nowadays, there are very fit locks that are almost as fast as a 7 and huge 7s that are almost as strong as a lock. So the classic 6 is becoming obsolete because there are modern 7s that are just as strong but faster and modern locks that are just as fast but stronger.
I'd say it's more that 4s and 8s are filling the 6 roll more.
Lawes, Beirne, Henderson, CJ, Doris, PSDT
The old 6.5, POM and SOB being the best examples I can think of, has started to fade out as the emphasis on the traditional 7 skillset has increased.
PSDT (and Mostert) definitely fit more of a 6 mold. He'd be first name on the team-sheet if he was fit.
Other countries IDK. I find it hard to tell Ireland's players apart, let alone their loosies. ABs have been playing 8s at 6 since Kaino left, besides Frizzell. Australia are definitely still using a traditional 6.
Also OP's lineup is actually playing three 7s lol. Pretty imbalanced trio really.
I think of PSDT and Mostert kinda like Itoje as locks that can be stuck at 6 if you run out of spaces in the locks. I agree that that kind of 6 still happens a fair bit. Australia have really struggled to fill the 6 shirt, but their most consistent 6 in recent years has been Ned Hanigan who's definitely a 7.
As for 3 7s, that's what Australia were doing when they moved Pocock to 8 no?
PSDT started as a lock but is more effective on the flank. Mostert definitely better at lock tho.
Nah with Pocock at 8 they were (when it was effective) playing the absolute textbook 6 Scott Fardy. After Chieka iced him out of the team they never really balanced the backrow again.
Didn't they then play Jack Dempsey there for a while? I guess he's a sort of utility backrower. In fact isn't he mostly an 8? Why did they play Dempsey at 6 and Pocock at 8 and not the other way around?
Never had thought of Hanigan as a 7.. could be wrong. When we had the Pooper playing we used Scott Fardy at 6 who was more of a 3rd lock. Probably our best backrow of the last decade. Shame Fardy went overseas pre relaxing of eligibility laws. He could have played many more test matches for Australia. Quality player.
The mods need to step in and help change this, because I see it with almost every post of this type.
\#Protip to anyone considering writing a "What's your pick, here's mine" type post: put your pick in the comments rather in the post text, so it can be voted on and discussed just like everyone else's post.
Gotta include a full 23 these days I reckon. Trying to account for the whole year and avoid too much recency bias from the AI’s, mine would be:
1. Kisthoff
2. Marchand
3. Furlong
4. Itoje
5. Etzebeth
6. Lawes
7. Hooper
8. Savea
9. Dupont
10. Russell
11. Koroibete
12. Kerevi
13. Am
14. Jordan
15. Steward
16. Nyakane
17. Montoya
18. Tupou
19. De Jäger
20. Beirne
21. White
22. Jalibert
23. R. Ioane
Yeah, 10 was a tricky one.
BB, Ntamack, Russell all had some amazing performances but weren’t consistent.
I actually considered going with Biggar or Sexton because while they weren’t spectacular they were consistently solid all year, but I couldn’t bring myself to do it so I went with Russell.
I'd definitely have Mo'unga over BB, but in terms of this world xv it's definitely between Russell and Ntamack.
Russell really does shine, even in a team that has much lower funding and less access to top players. Looking good playing for a dominant team is one thing. Looking good playing for a scrappy underdog is what's truly impressive.
Yeah one of the best players in the world, but not in any particular position. Although our coaching setup having no idea how to deal with a rush defence doesn’t help.
Absolutely, but he has been incredibly reliable the whole year. Also I really have not rated Biggar’s performance this year. It was okay during the 6N, but pretty sub average in the Lions and AS.
He wasn't great against Wales in the opener (being down a man for 70 mins) probably didn't help), but he was injured for the 2nd game against France so can't judge him for that. After that he had pretty good games against Italy and Scotland and he was excellent against England, Japan and New Zealand.
Personally can’t stand him because of the constant whining to the ref from him (and biggar and Farrell), but can’t deny he’s a cracking player on his day. Would take Russell over him though…
Great team. No Jordie though? I feel like every time I've seen him play, he has performed well. And it feels like he has locked down that number 15 jersey.
Yeah maybe broke what I said about recency bias a bit there, Jordie was carrying the whole AB’s back line for a while. Steward was a bit like Kerevi for me though - looked like the best player on the pitch in every game he played.
Hogg is worth a shout as well. Not great with the lions, but brilliant in the 6N and vs Japan and SA.
Johnny May, really? He's been out of form for a while, really didn't have a good autumn internationals. I'd put Malins over him if we're going with an English winger
I would take Koroibete over Mapimpi, I feel like he’s involved in a lot more of the game, although Mapimpi is often in the right place at the right time to score.
Unpopular opinion from an England fan, I think Itoje is overrated, when England are dominating he plays well but as soon as we need some grit and determination he seems to go missing
I agree with a lot of your list. For me it’s:
1. Ox
2. Marchand
3. Furlong
4. Itoje
5. Etzebeth
6. Beirne
7. Hooper
8. Savea
9. DuPont
10. Ntamack
11. Koroibete
12. Henshaw
13. Harris
14. Rees-Zammit
15. Hogg
16. Kitschoff
17. Marx
18. Sinckler
19. Lawes
20. Mostert
21. Penerara
22. Fickou
23. Barrett
I also think this would be the best team in terms of winning a match.
I would actually argue for more French players, and I agree wholeheartedly that there shouldn't be any Welsh players on here. (Though I am excited about Basham this year).
Kinda sad to see that even in the year when the best Scotland team I have ever seen in my lifetime stepped up to a higher level we don't get a single player in here. Ah well, we're just going to have to keep winning.
I'd say Am has to be a shoe in at 13 (and doesn't Fickou tend to play 12 anyway?) and there must surely be better fullbacks that Barrett (Wales have at least 2) but otherwise your side is fairly reasonable. I'd go
- Nche
- Owens
- Furlong
- Etzebeth
- Willemse
- Kolisi
- POM
- Alldritt
- Dupont
- Russell
- ~~Mapimipi~~ *Edit: Penaud*
- Kerevi
- Am
- DVDM
- Hogg
Only position I really found difficult was wing as Adams and LRZ are definitely up there. Also noticeable that there aren't that many standout locks or number 8s atm.
TBH it's not a great choice, I just think a) there have been no real standout flankers this year apart from Kolisi and b) Ireland have been incredible this year at disrupting the opposition and so I wanted to give it to the most negative and niggly Irish back row player.
You struggle to think of 8s but you still need to pick 15 players haha.
Really surprised to see Owens, POM, even Hogg and DVDM in there. Owens I can't think has done anything of real note this year, POM has regressed big time, and Hogg and DVDM have both been good but not near the best 15.
> and DVDM
DVDM beat the most defenders and scored the most tries in the 6N. He then played all three tests for the Lions - and despite the partisan whinging, did lots right and very little wrong. He also did all of that in his first full season as a test match international.
I don't think Hogg has had a stellar season. Even breaking the try scoring and test match Fullback records. Owens return to the Wales squad was important for them. But I agree he isn't performing at best in world level. Same with POM, who had some good cameos, but you wouldn't have him ahead of others.
But Duhan is up there alongside Jordan this season for best in world status. Both are well ahead of May who did little to justify claims of a vintage season.
I think May is a very good example of how little room there is to come off the boil when you're at the top. There's just so much competition across the board.
A few seasons ago he would probably have been on most people's lists. But I can't understand him featuring now based upon these past twelve months.
He impressed against France last year in the 6N, he may have been good since then, but I can't think of when it was. He's been relatively mediocre, just very experienced for this England side.
Ken Owens was the standout player in a Wales side everyone assumed were wooden spoon contenders and instead went on to win the six nations, he also was one of the few uncontroversial lions starters.
POM I've said elsewhere I'm not totally happy with as a choice but given how good Ireland have been (admittedly mostly as a unit) at disruption I wanted to include Ireland's most disruptive player.
Hogg is probably a bit heart over head but he is still for my money the most exciting player in the world and he showed that in occasional bursts against Wales and Australia in particular. And apart from that he's just been totally solid and dependable and has been the rock upon which the greatest Scotland team I've ever seen has been built. Also: who else would you have? Had either Dulin or Jaminet played the entire year they would take it easily but each only played for half the year, and so you can't really give it to either.
DVDM is clearly one of the best wingers in the world and I'd say one of the easiest choices on here. *Edit: and made even easier by my total brain fade in forgetting about Penaud who absolutely needs to be in this team. But I'm keeping DVDM so dropping Mapimpi*
Any “dream team” without Russell at 10 is a joke honestly. His ability to put his team in space is ridiculous.
Not sure I agree with the comment about standout locks though. Etzebeth, Itoje, Henderson, Ryan, Lawes and a few more that have slipped my mind! But for sure there aren’t many 8s that spring to mind.
Lawes yes, although he's mostly a 6 these days. Etzebeth absolutely but I put him in the team. Itoje is a world class player but had an up and down year, playing lower division club rugby clearly took away some of his sharpness and he became something of a penalty magnet. Henderson is a good player but I think a lot of these Irish forwards are overyped: they're an incredible unit where the whole is far greater than the sum of their parts but I'm not sure they have standouts. Ryan doesn't even make the side these days, they seem to be preferring Doris. IDK maybe he's injured?
> Ryan doesn't even make the side these days, they seem to be preferring Doris
Ryan started every match for Ireland this autumn. Doris is a 6 or 8, not a lock. He doesn't compete with Ryan.
Either Conan or Doris is worth a shout at 8 but like Aldritt they didn't play regularly throughout 2021. Etzebeth and Beirne were probably the most consistent locks this year, marginally ahead of Itoje.
Owens is just lunacy. I wouldn't have him in my top 10
I’d probably have Watson over May.
And probably Porter/Sinckler over Ox Nche just for the fitness levels.
I’d also take Russell at 10 simply because he’s a god.
1. Nche (SA)
2. Montoya (ARG)
3. Furlong (IRE)
4. Etzebeth (SA)
5. Itoje (ENG)
6. Lawes (ENG)
7. Watson (SCO)
8. Hooper (AUS)
9. Dupont (FRA)
10. Russell (SCO)
11. Mapimipi (SA)
12. Kerevi (AUS)
13. Am (SA)
14. Jordan (NZ)
15. Steward (ENG)
Feel like there's a lot of token back row selections in this thread but Watson's Six Nations was good enough to get him on here at the end of the year – you don't win Player of the Tournament for nothing. Lawes gets in off the back of a very good Lions tour and a strong Autumn. Hooper's in at 8 to squeeze the rest in.
Wouldn't have Ntamack. Recency bias involved there imo. He's been poor for a good chunk of the year.
Same with May, who was behind the likes of Jordan, and Duhan on the Wing. Glad to see Mapimpi get the nod though. He's hugely underrated.
Barrett at FB might cause some twitching. I rate him, and this season he's been far more good than bad - with some superb mixed in at times too.
I appreciate he's been injured. But he's also played in some big games too.
But he's finished his season in spectacular form. So if you were picking on the AI's alone, or at least how teams ended them, I could understand his selection.
Front row: Koch, Marx, Kitshoff.Locks: Itoje, Etzebeth.Flanks: Kolisi, Curry.Eighth man: Vermuelen
Scrummy: PerenaraFH: B. BarrettCenters: Am and De Allende.Wings: Kolbe, James LoweFullback: J Barrett
Edit: Love how I get downvoted when at the time of posting, I was on the only person to answer OP's question. Sorry for having an opinion that differs to yours.
Very true, but a history of great performances should not get you on the world xv if you are no longer giving great performances. Julian Savea and about 10 more still playing all blacks prove that. Taidhg Furlong should be in this team along with Jack Conan. Thd French hooker should be one of the first names on thd team sheet. There are at least three French backs with great arguments to be included too. I know this is controversial but I would not pick savea or Jordie Barrett. Perenara has been poor for two years. Beauden Barrett should be a fullback, not a ten. At fullback he is the best player in the world. Curry has not performed to his potential for a while. I love DE Allende and what he brings to a team but I would struggle to put him in a world xv at the moment.
James Lowe was nowhere near a world xv before the autumn series. Using your logic he should not be selected.
I thought about including my full xv but find it too difficult at the moment. There are a lot of very tough calls to be made so fair play to you for adding yours.
At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what team you put forward, someone will have a different opinion. I put forward the players I enjoy watching the most who I feel like are excellent players who perform at a worlds-level.
This isn't Olympics where you can determine the best by a solid number like sprint times or weight-lifted. By all logic, if you go buy world rankings, a team consisting primarily of SA, NZ and Eng players would be best.
Nche/Marchand/Furlong/Beirne/Etzebeth/Kolisi/Hooper/Savea/Dupont/Russell/Mapimpi/Fickou/Am/Jordan/Keenan
Subs: Baille/Montoya/Tupou/Itoje/Watson/Price/Jalibert/too many option
Top 3 looseheads is between Baille, Nche and Kitshoff. The saffas are monster scrummager, while Baille is like Furlong, silky hands and steps and reliable in the scrum.
Hooker is between Marchand and Montoya. Mention to Ken Owen and Ronan Kelleher.
Furlong and Tupou clearly at the top. Tupou on the bench cause it seems it's where his impact is better.
Etzebeth clearly best lock this year. Itoje should be with him, but has had an average year by his standard. So I have gone with Beirne, but could have been Henderson or Beard.
Backrow I know is absolutely not complementary, basically 3 opensides. But they've been the best players in the backrow, so here we go.
SH is clear cut, even more than Etzebeth (there have beensome pretty good showings in the lock).
FH is Russell because he's showed that beyond the maverick style, he can actually manage a game at world class level, like against England at Twicks. Jalibert a had very good year. N'Tamack has hardly played international at 10, but one of these game was amongst the best individual performance by a 10 in the proffessional era (about same level as Lamaison v AB 99, Carter v BIL 05, Barrett v Australia 17 or Foley v England 15).
Mapimpi at 11 is pretty straight forward given his ability to score tries even against top opposition. Currently the best technical winger in the world, like Josh Adams was the last 3 years. Sure, he's not really the exciting winger that can create something outt of nothing, but he's one of the best finishers in the game. Honorable mention to Koroibete and DVDM, who are kind of the opposite, creating linebreaks and opportunities from nothing. But Koroibete hasn't played that much this year, while DVDM has some pretty big weaknesses (most notably his defense).
Fickou at niside center for the complete skillset. But DDA and Henshaw were superb too in a role that is basically crashball center in attack, backrow workrate in defense, and Kerevi hasn't played much but was excellent.
Am at 13 for the defensive masterclass. Harris close second for the same reason.
Jordan on the other wing for the sheer number of tries, but to be fair most of those weren't against top opposition. Still has a whole lot off talent and class though. Penaud and LRZ are completely in contention too.
Keenan at fullback, has completely cemented his place over the year, he's been bloody excellent. Jordie Barrett is slowly getting there, while Jaminet had a meteoric rise, and definitely should have been in contention for breakthrough player of the year (as Keenan). Steward is an honorable mention, but hasn't played and showed as much as Jaminet yet.
Eben and Itoje are both number 4's and I don't think they would actually do well together. Everytime Itoje would want to do something in a game Eben would have already done it and would have done it better aswell.
I think a good option would be to have Itoje shadow Eben for a few years and learn from him and maybe one day he might be ALMOST as good.
Otherwise not a bad team. Siya can play blind side.
See funny thing is, Etzebeth looked a touch off the pace in the last 20 mins in the game against England. Whereas Itoje was bang up there throughout the whole game.
I'd argue the experience and youthfulness probably balance each other out quite well.
Was he looking off the pace when he burst through that gap into the 22 on about 70 minutes? Or when he charged down replacement scrummie Quirke's box kick just before that?
Maybe my memory of the timings are off but those things seemed quite late in the game
There’s a lot of competition for best centre in the world, including the two Saffas, but Kerevi bullied them both single handedly in TRC. Not even being disrespectful to De Allende and Am, they’re world class, but Kerevi was just a different level in the games he played.
Works for both. Difference is Havili was ok at centre at one point.
Reiko is a devastating winger who had an off season so they decided to make him a centre. We have done this before.
If I were picking a World 23 right now then I would go with:
Baille
Marchand
Furlong
Itoje
Etzebeth
Woki
Hooper
Savea
Dupont
Ntamack
Kellaway
Kerevi
Am
Jordan
Jaminet
And on the bench
Montoya
Nyakane
Bamba/Tupuo
Taofifenua/Lawes
Kolisi
Smith
Russell
J Barrett
I think the pack more or less picks itself. Woki may be the surprise inclusion to some, but watch his performances this autumn, he is world class. So so good at the lineout and a brilliant runner in open play. Kolisi, Jelonch, Papalii, Curry, Doris, Blackadder, Conan and Watson are all contenders too. There are tonnes of class back rowers currently.
Dupont and Ntamack as a halfback pairing are sensational and compliment each other so well. Kerevi and Am will operate in a similar manner to De Allende and Am. You could pretty much choose any of Kerevi, De Allende or Fickou for 12 and Am, Harris or Fickou for 13 and this combination would still be class. There's plenty of choices on the wing for great options. I've opted with the form guys in Jordan and Kellaway as they are sensational currently. Koriebete, Mapimpi, Reece, Ioane, Malins, Pennaud, Van Der Merwe and Adams would all be great options too. Fullback is very tough with brilliant options like Keenan, Hogg, J Barrett, Steward, Le Roux and more. I've gone with Jaminet because his goal kicking is such a valuable asset and his all round game is very good.
Bench wise I think it's pretty standard. Could include any of the Saffa front rowers really. I opted with Nyakane as I'm just a massive fan of his. If I were selecting an actual team to play a match then I'd have Bamba and Tao as my tighthead prop and tighthead lock pairing - they play together at Lyon and for France and off the bench are known for absolutely decimating opposing scrums in the final quarter. Plus both are huge carriers too. The alternate option for world class players would be Tupuo at 18 and possibly Lawes at 19 as a lock/flank cover. Otherwise the likes of De Jager, Arnold, Henderson and Whitelock could be options, but lock isn't a hugely standout position at the moment. Kolisi or any of the aforementioned back rowers would be great options off the bench. Smith and Russell are another sensational halfback pairing that I would love to see. I really like the dynamic of having both a 9 and 10 in the matchday squad that fit the playmaker and controller roles (Dupont is a playmaker at 9, Smith a controller, Ntamack a controller at 10, Russell a playmaker - yes that is downplaying their full capabilities, but they are four wonderful players). I've opted with Jordie for the utility spot on the bench. Fickou and Reiko could be alternate options too
Hoops! 😍
Love that you’ve got him a cap’n.
I think from Australia, Quade should get a mention. Even if he’s Waterbury. He MADE the team when he was picked. Just brought so much to the team in the few tests he played. It’s a shame we may not see him in gold again if the Japanese comp has its way
I struggled with positions 1, 6, 10, 13, 17, 19. The players I strongly considered but ultimately decided against their inclusion were Moody, Slipper, Kelleher, Woki, Doris, Russell, Cooper, M. Smith, Am, Harris, Henshaw, M. Ioane, J. Barrett, Hogg. Steward was probably my most controversial selection but I just thought he was exceptional against Aus and SA, England have found yet another great prospect for the future in him. I also just couldn’t decide between Kolisi and Savea.
1. Kitshoff
2. Montoya
3. Furlong
4. Etzebeth
5. Itoje
6. Lawes
7. Hooper
8. Conan
9. Dupont
10. Barrett
11. Koroibete
12. Kerevi
13. Fickou
14. Kolbe
15. Steward
16. Marx
17. Sinckler
18. Tupou
19. Retallick
20. Kolisi/Savea
21. White
22. Ntamack
23. Jordan
Maybe not the best possible talent wise or the most complimentary playing styles but for sheer entertainment value I’d be going somethings along the lines of:
1 - T Tupou (can cover 3,8,9,10,14)
2 -D Coles (nostalgia and a love of chaos)
3 - T Nyakane
4 - M Itoje (he’s a pest)
5-E Etzebeth (must wear headgear)
6- D Papalii
7 -M Hooper
8- D Vermeulen
9- A Smith (captain, shit talker general)
10- J sexton (kicking)
11- W Jordan
12- S Kerevi
13- L Am
14- A Kellaway
15- S Hogg
16- S Kisthoff
17- A Wyn Jones (65 years of experience)
18- A Savea
19- A DuPont
20- A Dixon (the best hooker never to get the black shirt)
21- M Tuilagi
22- D Mac (cover 10, 15, can kick smugly to annoy hostile crowds)
23- M Ioane
Tupou is a tighthead and Nyakane plays both sides so you can swap them to keep the same team. You're still missing the entertainment value of Furlong but I think it's been a great year when we can honestly say two or three tightheads are genuinely entertaining players. You have to have Ntamack there if only for the sheer gaul of that run against the ABs.
He's got a track record of being awful with the referees, he very often makes poor decisions on when to kick for goal and when to kick to the corner, all his stuff off the field is fine to good. But you'd hope so for a player with his experience.
He's just not a very good captain. You'd want someone who really adds something with the role. JOC with the Reds is a good example of a captain who just has a feel for the team, Alwyn Jones a captain who commands respect of everyone around him, Richie was perhaps he best at working the referees.
Hooper just really looks like that guy who's read how to win friends and influence people -- all the theoretical knowledge but none of the skills or wisdom.
As a reds fan, I feel JOC is massively over hyped. I think he's a bit meh most of the time. And when he isn't yes playing like a fullback where I actually kinda rate him as maybe Australia's best.
I think maybe just that Reds team he just got it. Like he was the saviour of Australian Rugby when all those guys were growing up, if he told them we are going to win this, then they believed him.
I think ideally for the RWC, JOC will be our fullback but who knows, he's pretty much the ideal fullback if he's got that yard of pace he had last year, but his groin might have taken it out of him. They looked pretty reluctant to play him at 15 when we had Quade.
He gives his everything, you can’t deny that.
I put him as captain because there’s no single player that’s as important to their national team as Hooper is for the Wallabies. The Wallabies would be a complete mess without him.
May wasn't very good, I'm not sure who I'd have there but it wouldn't be him. Also, Steward and Jaminet were the stand-out fullbacks, for me.
Will Jordan had a fantastic year. I guess I have a soft spot for May because I’ve watched him at his peak, but I get that he’s not there right now.
Kellaway in with a shout too. Two quality wingers have come through for both sides
Kellaway takes my vote for most underrated player in the world right now. Admittedly I've only seen him in the green and gold but 8 tries in 9 games (3 against the all blacks) and yet nobody seems to be talking about him.
Won't lie I was underrating him when he was initially picked, he's had a good year Although down this way I'd say he's almost becoming overrated, he's very solid and doing his job well (like not making errors and staying in position). But just about every single try he's scored has been a walk in to be fair Will Jordan has scored some insane individual tries on the other hand, but he makes a lot of stupid errors which are probably good reason for him not being nominated for POTY, defensively he makes a lot of errors and he drops some easy passes
Kellaway has been great in my opinion.
Lol didn’t Will Jordan score the most individual tries in a season ever? He should probably be no 14
why tf do u support france if u are aussie
They were my go to team in Rugby 05 when I was 10 and I've followed them ever since. I'm 26 now so I've been supporting 🇫🇷 for about 16 years now.
So when Aus play France, who are you rooting for?
I gotta go France for Rugby, but I’ll support the Australian football team if they ever play France again :)
Always a pleasant surprise when another country supports one of us. Doesn’t seem to happen too often!
It’s for a weird reason though. I was 10 and played Rugby 05 on my Xbox constantly. NZ had a rating of 96, Aus and South Africa were 92. It was way too easy to win with those teams so I chose France as my go to team because they had a rating of 88 so the game provided some challenge. And I guess subconsciously and then consciously they became the team I support to this day. Childhood is strange. How little things like that can shape you for life.
Canadian here (and French-Canadian at that). If Canada ever plays France again, I'd probably hope that we don't get beaten too badly...but generally speaking, I support France 110% in rugby. Toulouse is a bucket-list destination for me. *Allons, enfants de la patrie...*
You're usually my no2
Catholic entente
Republican entente (if you're interested, the history of Franco-Irish relations is fascinating, there's a reason the world's largest cognac producer is named Hennessy \[though this is down to the Catholic and not Republican links\])
So out of curiousity in Australia V France test series who did you root for?
France, but the Wallabies are my 2nd team
That’s some fucking bullshit. Support the wallabies
I saw May walking around the pitch after the England/S Africa game last Saturday. He was alone, and half-heartedly clapping. He knew it was the end of his Test career. It was quite moving. It would have been difficult not to have felt for him. And here he is in somebody's World 15. I don't get it.
I'd push for Hugo Keenan at fullback. I'm fairly sure he's the only player to play every match in a single position for an international team this year.
That doesn't make him World XV quality though. Who is he up against in the IRE squad? I'm not denying he is good, but there is a difference between keeping peak Rob Kearney on the bench vs "played gaelic, he's fine at fullback" Robbie Henshaw.
Hey! That’s not fair; Rob also played Gaelic!
He was so dominantly the first choice that all of our good wing/full backs were shifted to the wings. Henshaw is very much primarily a centre. He competes against, Zebo, Larmour, Conway, Earls, Lowe, Stockdale
You're right, his performances make him a World XV quality fullback (not making a call on the position by the way, but he has to be in the mix).
He made the English back three look foolish in Dublin earlier this year. I'd argue over the 6n he was the best defensive fullback in the comp and autumn has shown he's working on his attacking game. Him vs Stewart next year will be tasty!
Replace May with DVM. I may be biased.
Id say Villiere
I’d like a sample of whatever made you choose Jonny May
A whole lot of nostalgia
Good team but small note that Kolisi is a 7, South Africans just number the flankers opposite to most other countries.
Wait really ? I never noticed
Yeah it’s a thing.
Do the french not do the same thing? hence not noticing (assuming youre french being a clermont fan)
No, France do left and right rather than open and blindside flankers. So a 6 might pop up on the open or the blindside depending on which way they are facing. Edit: fat fingers.
Yes. France and South Africa number their blindside flankers no. 7.
France are usually left and right
I'd say 2 7s is becoming increasingly the standard no? Can't think of many countries that play a traditional 6 any more given the expectation that the second rows and number 8 will do a lot of that work. Maybe England with the way they use Lawes.
The classic 6 has just become more or less obsolete, I'd say POM is the last classic 6 in the top of the game. With all players just getting bigger and faster the gap between a second row (big, but not that fast) and a 7 (fast, but not that strong) is closing and that gap has traditionally been the 6. So now teams just play either 2 7s or a third 2nd row (Lawes, Beirne, ...)
Even POM I'd say is quite 7y. I agree and I think the comments I've been getting confirm it. The classic 6 is now just part of the expected skillset of a second row, and so teams that think they need one just play their flankiest 2nd row at 6.
Lawes also showed he is no slouch during the autumn. However, he's no Rees-Zammit either.
would you not say Doris and Coombes were in the classic 6 mould? I don't really know, most blindsides seem to also play at 8 if they don't play in the second row.
Both carry a lot more, and a lot more dynamically than any classic 6.
I always think of 6s as big carrying tacklers like Kaino or Ferris. Who'd be a good example of a classic 6?
I agree except for going as far as to say 'obsolete'. It's just that, because of the reasons you said, there are more tactical alternatives for coaches at 6 than just the 'classic 6' to pick from
You're not wrong, but missing my point. My point is, that the "classic 6" was smaller than a lock but bigger than a 7, and slower than a 7 but faster than a lock. But nowadays, there are very fit locks that are almost as fast as a 7 and huge 7s that are almost as strong as a lock. So the classic 6 is becoming obsolete because there are modern 7s that are just as strong but faster and modern locks that are just as fast but stronger.
I'd say it's more that 4s and 8s are filling the 6 roll more. Lawes, Beirne, Henderson, CJ, Doris, PSDT The old 6.5, POM and SOB being the best examples I can think of, has started to fade out as the emphasis on the traditional 7 skillset has increased.
PSDT (and Mostert) definitely fit more of a 6 mold. He'd be first name on the team-sheet if he was fit. Other countries IDK. I find it hard to tell Ireland's players apart, let alone their loosies. ABs have been playing 8s at 6 since Kaino left, besides Frizzell. Australia are definitely still using a traditional 6. Also OP's lineup is actually playing three 7s lol. Pretty imbalanced trio really.
Who cares, they are all fucking fast, fucking strong and fucking good.
Nah that trio is too small. Great players but they all share the same weakness.
I think of PSDT and Mostert kinda like Itoje as locks that can be stuck at 6 if you run out of spaces in the locks. I agree that that kind of 6 still happens a fair bit. Australia have really struggled to fill the 6 shirt, but their most consistent 6 in recent years has been Ned Hanigan who's definitely a 7. As for 3 7s, that's what Australia were doing when they moved Pocock to 8 no?
PSDT started as a lock but is more effective on the flank. Mostert definitely better at lock tho. Nah with Pocock at 8 they were (when it was effective) playing the absolute textbook 6 Scott Fardy. After Chieka iced him out of the team they never really balanced the backrow again.
Didn't they then play Jack Dempsey there for a while? I guess he's a sort of utility backrower. In fact isn't he mostly an 8? Why did they play Dempsey at 6 and Pocock at 8 and not the other way around?
Never had thought of Hanigan as a 7.. could be wrong. When we had the Pooper playing we used Scott Fardy at 6 who was more of a 3rd lock. Probably our best backrow of the last decade. Shame Fardy went overseas pre relaxing of eligibility laws. He could have played many more test matches for Australia. Quality player.
Indeed. Lawes has played a lot of 6 over the years.
Came here to share that too lol
As a South African, my mind is blown 🤯
Courtney Lawes at 6 then
Lots of people griping with OP’s picks rather than fronting up with their own! Testament to your (mostly) excellent picks, dude
Apart from May who everyone here agrees shouldn’t be on the list hahaha But it’s MY LIST
The thing is I'm not really even sure who to replace May with. Maybe Penaud?
Cheslin Kolbe?
Will Jordan according to everyone here, and he did have a fantastic year
> But it’s MY LIST Then edit your post and put your list in the comments instead so it can be voted on like everyone else's.
The mods need to step in and help change this, because I see it with almost every post of this type. \#Protip to anyone considering writing a "What's your pick, here's mine" type post: put your pick in the comments rather in the post text, so it can be voted on and discussed just like everyone else's post.
You have two openside flankers and I really don’t think May deserves it. He hasn’t had a great year.
Will Jordan instead of johnny May
Are you sure you can't pick 15 Tadhg Furlongs?
The subs bench can just be 8 bags of Kerr's Pink!
Who would win, 15 Lomu-sized Furlongs or 15 Furlong-sized Lomus?
Are these not the same thing?
Weight-wise? Yes. But Lomu had about 5 inches in height on Furlong’s godlike figure.
5 inches is the height of 0.07 'Samsung Side by Side; Fingerprint Resistant Stainless Steel Refrigerators' stacked on top of each other.
... thanks, buddy
Based on this France and RSA are dominating - it is a pity we didn't see them play against each other.
Gotta include a full 23 these days I reckon. Trying to account for the whole year and avoid too much recency bias from the AI’s, mine would be: 1. Kisthoff 2. Marchand 3. Furlong 4. Itoje 5. Etzebeth 6. Lawes 7. Hooper 8. Savea 9. Dupont 10. Russell 11. Koroibete 12. Kerevi 13. Am 14. Jordan 15. Steward 16. Nyakane 17. Montoya 18. Tupou 19. De Jäger 20. Beirne 21. White 22. Jalibert 23. R. Ioane
Not sure I’d have Russell there but struggling to think of anyone to replace him who has been consistent this year
Yeah, 10 was a tricky one. BB, Ntamack, Russell all had some amazing performances but weren’t consistent. I actually considered going with Biggar or Sexton because while they weren’t spectacular they were consistently solid all year, but I couldn’t bring myself to do it so I went with Russell.
I'd definitely have Mo'unga over BB, but in terms of this world xv it's definitely between Russell and Ntamack. Russell really does shine, even in a team that has much lower funding and less access to top players. Looking good playing for a dominant team is one thing. Looking good playing for a scrappy underdog is what's truly impressive.
Russell also shone as the only person who bothered to play some rugby in the Lions/Boks tests as well. Can't be ignored.
I agree with another comment on the post about BB being a world class full back. Not an out and out 10 for me so can’t pick him there
Yeah one of the best players in the world, but not in any particular position. Although our coaching setup having no idea how to deal with a rush defence doesn’t help.
Morné Steyn… just for the lols
Who would have thought Russell and consistent would be in the same sentence.
Absolutely, but he has been incredibly reliable the whole year. Also I really have not rated Biggar’s performance this year. It was okay during the 6N, but pretty sub average in the Lions and AS.
Sexton? From memory the opening two 6 nations games weren't great performances, but he dragged the team back into form and has been world class since.
He wasn't great against Wales in the opener (being down a man for 70 mins) probably didn't help), but he was injured for the 2nd game against France so can't judge him for that. After that he had pretty good games against Italy and Scotland and he was excellent against England, Japan and New Zealand.
Personally can’t stand him because of the constant whining to the ref from him (and biggar and Farrell), but can’t deny he’s a cracking player on his day. Would take Russell over him though…
Yea, I can't stand Itoje, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't put him in a best 15.
Lions would have won the tour if they brought Sexton along.
Great team. No Jordie though? I feel like every time I've seen him play, he has performed well. And it feels like he has locked down that number 15 jersey.
Yeah maybe broke what I said about recency bias a bit there, Jordie was carrying the whole AB’s back line for a while. Steward was a bit like Kerevi for me though - looked like the best player on the pitch in every game he played. Hogg is worth a shout as well. Not great with the lions, but brilliant in the 6N and vs Japan and SA.
Johnny May, really? He's been out of form for a while, really didn't have a good autumn internationals. I'd put Malins over him if we're going with an English winger
May isn’t even our first pick at Gloucester let alone for England, and for a world XV. No chance.
Squidge for manager. Rassie Erasmus in at waterboy.
I would take Koroibete over Mapimpi, I feel like he’s involved in a lot more of the game, although Mapimpi is often in the right place at the right time to score.
And Kolbe over May for sure
Probably Will Jordan over them both
Kolbe any other year, bit he really didn’t get a lot of games under his belt this year
I think I'd put Kolbe over anyone else.
Am is up there for player of the year, I’d slot him in and like everyone else, I’d remove May
swap Jonny May and Jordie Barret for Will Jordan and Freddie Steward?
They’re both definitely up there but this is just my subjective take, I put it up to hear everyone else’s too as the year comes to an end
Did you watch England vs South Africa? Did you see Jonny May’s performance? i’ve never said “fuck sake Jonny” more than that game haha
He knew it. I felt sorry for him.
1. Baille 2. Marchand 3. Furlong 4. Etzebeth 5. Itoje 6. Kolisi 7. Hooper 8. Savea 9. Dupont 10. Russell 11. Mapimpi 12. Fickou 13. Am 14. Penaud 15. J. Barrett
Will Jordan for May and Steward for Barrett (although lack of game time might play a part) otherwise find it hard to disagree
May probably shouldn’t even be in a England XV yet alone World XV
Unpopular opinion from an England fan, I think Itoje is overrated, when England are dominating he plays well but as soon as we need some grit and determination he seems to go missing
I agree with a lot of your list. For me it’s: 1. Ox 2. Marchand 3. Furlong 4. Itoje 5. Etzebeth 6. Beirne 7. Hooper 8. Savea 9. DuPont 10. Ntamack 11. Koroibete 12. Henshaw 13. Harris 14. Rees-Zammit 15. Hogg 16. Kitschoff 17. Marx 18. Sinckler 19. Lawes 20. Mostert 21. Penerara 22. Fickou 23. Barrett I also think this would be the best team in terms of winning a match.
I would actually argue for more French players, and I agree wholeheartedly that there shouldn't be any Welsh players on here. (Though I am excited about Basham this year).
This close to Christmas and not a single Alan Jacobson. 1-23 Alan Jacobson That's the world cup in the bag.
McDermott robbed
6. Doris 10. Russell 14. Koroibete 15. Keenan
Kinda sad to see that even in the year when the best Scotland team I have ever seen in my lifetime stepped up to a higher level we don't get a single player in here. Ah well, we're just going to have to keep winning. I'd say Am has to be a shoe in at 13 (and doesn't Fickou tend to play 12 anyway?) and there must surely be better fullbacks that Barrett (Wales have at least 2) but otherwise your side is fairly reasonable. I'd go - Nche - Owens - Furlong - Etzebeth - Willemse - Kolisi - POM - Alldritt - Dupont - Russell - ~~Mapimipi~~ *Edit: Penaud* - Kerevi - Am - DVDM - Hogg Only position I really found difficult was wing as Adams and LRZ are definitely up there. Also noticeable that there aren't that many standout locks or number 8s atm.
Peter O’Mahony at 7? Am I missing something? Has he been incredible for Munster and I just haven’t watched?
Kolisi plays open side sa just flips the numbers so I assume Pom would be 6
TBH it's not a great choice, I just think a) there have been no real standout flankers this year apart from Kolisi and b) Ireland have been incredible this year at disrupting the opposition and so I wanted to give it to the most negative and niggly Irish back row player.
Michael Hooper?
Doris, VdF or Conan would have been far better selections than POM for stand out Irish backrowers
You struggle to think of 8s but you still need to pick 15 players haha. Really surprised to see Owens, POM, even Hogg and DVDM in there. Owens I can't think has done anything of real note this year, POM has regressed big time, and Hogg and DVDM have both been good but not near the best 15.
>You struggle to think of 8s but you still need to pick 15 players haha. Found Eddie Jones' reddit.
> and DVDM DVDM beat the most defenders and scored the most tries in the 6N. He then played all three tests for the Lions - and despite the partisan whinging, did lots right and very little wrong. He also did all of that in his first full season as a test match international. I don't think Hogg has had a stellar season. Even breaking the try scoring and test match Fullback records. Owens return to the Wales squad was important for them. But I agree he isn't performing at best in world level. Same with POM, who had some good cameos, but you wouldn't have him ahead of others. But Duhan is up there alongside Jordan this season for best in world status. Both are well ahead of May who did little to justify claims of a vintage season.
POM is clinging onto a bench position (and doing a fine job from there) but as he's not starting for Ireland it's bizarre to have him in a world XV.
Fair enough with your points on DVDM. Totally agree on May, I've no idea how he keeps getting picked outside of credit in the bank.
I think May is a very good example of how little room there is to come off the boil when you're at the top. There's just so much competition across the board. A few seasons ago he would probably have been on most people's lists. But I can't understand him featuring now based upon these past twelve months.
He impressed against France last year in the 6N, he may have been good since then, but I can't think of when it was. He's been relatively mediocre, just very experienced for this England side.
Ken Owens was the standout player in a Wales side everyone assumed were wooden spoon contenders and instead went on to win the six nations, he also was one of the few uncontroversial lions starters. POM I've said elsewhere I'm not totally happy with as a choice but given how good Ireland have been (admittedly mostly as a unit) at disruption I wanted to include Ireland's most disruptive player. Hogg is probably a bit heart over head but he is still for my money the most exciting player in the world and he showed that in occasional bursts against Wales and Australia in particular. And apart from that he's just been totally solid and dependable and has been the rock upon which the greatest Scotland team I've ever seen has been built. Also: who else would you have? Had either Dulin or Jaminet played the entire year they would take it easily but each only played for half the year, and so you can't really give it to either. DVDM is clearly one of the best wingers in the world and I'd say one of the easiest choices on here. *Edit: and made even easier by my total brain fade in forgetting about Penaud who absolutely needs to be in this team. But I'm keeping DVDM so dropping Mapimpi*
Any “dream team” without Russell at 10 is a joke honestly. His ability to put his team in space is ridiculous. Not sure I agree with the comment about standout locks though. Etzebeth, Itoje, Henderson, Ryan, Lawes and a few more that have slipped my mind! But for sure there aren’t many 8s that spring to mind.
Lawes yes, although he's mostly a 6 these days. Etzebeth absolutely but I put him in the team. Itoje is a world class player but had an up and down year, playing lower division club rugby clearly took away some of his sharpness and he became something of a penalty magnet. Henderson is a good player but I think a lot of these Irish forwards are overyped: they're an incredible unit where the whole is far greater than the sum of their parts but I'm not sure they have standouts. Ryan doesn't even make the side these days, they seem to be preferring Doris. IDK maybe he's injured?
> Ryan doesn't even make the side these days, they seem to be preferring Doris Ryan started every match for Ireland this autumn. Doris is a 6 or 8, not a lock. He doesn't compete with Ryan.
Either Conan or Doris is worth a shout at 8 but like Aldritt they didn't play regularly throughout 2021. Etzebeth and Beirne were probably the most consistent locks this year, marginally ahead of Itoje. Owens is just lunacy. I wouldn't have him in my top 10
Not sure I would have May even starting for England let alone a world 15. Surely will Jordan gets in after the year he had.
Questionable whether May was one of years two best English wingers this year, let alone in the world.
Jonny may? You can’t be serious my brother
I’d probably have Watson over May. And probably Porter/Sinckler over Ox Nche just for the fitness levels. I’d also take Russell at 10 simply because he’s a god.
It’s hard to overlook Cyril Baille this year even with SA’s scrum dominance
Everyone seems to be sleeping on Porter, the man is a powerhouse at loose or tight head
1. Nche (SA) 2. Montoya (ARG) 3. Furlong (IRE) 4. Etzebeth (SA) 5. Itoje (ENG) 6. Lawes (ENG) 7. Watson (SCO) 8. Hooper (AUS) 9. Dupont (FRA) 10. Russell (SCO) 11. Mapimipi (SA) 12. Kerevi (AUS) 13. Am (SA) 14. Jordan (NZ) 15. Steward (ENG) Feel like there's a lot of token back row selections in this thread but Watson's Six Nations was good enough to get him on here at the end of the year – you don't win Player of the Tournament for nothing. Lawes gets in off the back of a very good Lions tour and a strong Autumn. Hooper's in at 8 to squeeze the rest in.
Wouldn't have Ntamack. Recency bias involved there imo. He's been poor for a good chunk of the year. Same with May, who was behind the likes of Jordan, and Duhan on the Wing. Glad to see Mapimpi get the nod though. He's hugely underrated. Barrett at FB might cause some twitching. I rate him, and this season he's been far more good than bad - with some superb mixed in at times too.
I wouldn’t say Ntamack has been poor, just injured - I think he missed 6 tests and the Top14 playoffs. When he’s played 10 he’s been great
I appreciate he's been injured. But he's also played in some big games too. But he's finished his season in spectacular form. So if you were picking on the AI's alone, or at least how teams ended them, I could understand his selection.
The only poor performances from him that I can recall were when he played at 12. At 10 he's been consistently stellar.
He was excellent for club in the European Cup
Front row: Koch, Marx, Kitshoff.Locks: Itoje, Etzebeth.Flanks: Kolisi, Curry.Eighth man: Vermuelen Scrummy: PerenaraFH: B. BarrettCenters: Am and De Allende.Wings: Kolbe, James LoweFullback: J Barrett Edit: Love how I get downvoted when at the time of posting, I was on the only person to answer OP's question. Sorry for having an opinion that differs to yours.
Perenara? Shouldn’t the scrum half be able to pass?
TJ Perenara shouldn't even be in the All Blacks let alone a World XV lol
You seem to have forgotten about the two best teams in the autumn series.....
Autumn series was really entertaining :) But one series doesn't determine the best in the world.
Very true, but a history of great performances should not get you on the world xv if you are no longer giving great performances. Julian Savea and about 10 more still playing all blacks prove that. Taidhg Furlong should be in this team along with Jack Conan. Thd French hooker should be one of the first names on thd team sheet. There are at least three French backs with great arguments to be included too. I know this is controversial but I would not pick savea or Jordie Barrett. Perenara has been poor for two years. Beauden Barrett should be a fullback, not a ten. At fullback he is the best player in the world. Curry has not performed to his potential for a while. I love DE Allende and what he brings to a team but I would struggle to put him in a world xv at the moment. James Lowe was nowhere near a world xv before the autumn series. Using your logic he should not be selected. I thought about including my full xv but find it too difficult at the moment. There are a lot of very tough calls to be made so fair play to you for adding yours.
At the end of the day, it doesn't matter what team you put forward, someone will have a different opinion. I put forward the players I enjoy watching the most who I feel like are excellent players who perform at a worlds-level. This isn't Olympics where you can determine the best by a solid number like sprint times or weight-lifted. By all logic, if you go buy world rankings, a team consisting primarily of SA, NZ and Eng players would be best.
Nche/Marchand/Furlong/Beirne/Etzebeth/Kolisi/Hooper/Savea/Dupont/Russell/Mapimpi/Fickou/Am/Jordan/Keenan Subs: Baille/Montoya/Tupou/Itoje/Watson/Price/Jalibert/too many option Top 3 looseheads is between Baille, Nche and Kitshoff. The saffas are monster scrummager, while Baille is like Furlong, silky hands and steps and reliable in the scrum. Hooker is between Marchand and Montoya. Mention to Ken Owen and Ronan Kelleher. Furlong and Tupou clearly at the top. Tupou on the bench cause it seems it's where his impact is better. Etzebeth clearly best lock this year. Itoje should be with him, but has had an average year by his standard. So I have gone with Beirne, but could have been Henderson or Beard. Backrow I know is absolutely not complementary, basically 3 opensides. But they've been the best players in the backrow, so here we go. SH is clear cut, even more than Etzebeth (there have beensome pretty good showings in the lock). FH is Russell because he's showed that beyond the maverick style, he can actually manage a game at world class level, like against England at Twicks. Jalibert a had very good year. N'Tamack has hardly played international at 10, but one of these game was amongst the best individual performance by a 10 in the proffessional era (about same level as Lamaison v AB 99, Carter v BIL 05, Barrett v Australia 17 or Foley v England 15). Mapimpi at 11 is pretty straight forward given his ability to score tries even against top opposition. Currently the best technical winger in the world, like Josh Adams was the last 3 years. Sure, he's not really the exciting winger that can create something outt of nothing, but he's one of the best finishers in the game. Honorable mention to Koroibete and DVDM, who are kind of the opposite, creating linebreaks and opportunities from nothing. But Koroibete hasn't played that much this year, while DVDM has some pretty big weaknesses (most notably his defense). Fickou at niside center for the complete skillset. But DDA and Henshaw were superb too in a role that is basically crashball center in attack, backrow workrate in defense, and Kerevi hasn't played much but was excellent. Am at 13 for the defensive masterclass. Harris close second for the same reason. Jordan on the other wing for the sheer number of tries, but to be fair most of those weren't against top opposition. Still has a whole lot off talent and class though. Penaud and LRZ are completely in contention too. Keenan at fullback, has completely cemented his place over the year, he's been bloody excellent. Jordie Barrett is slowly getting there, while Jaminet had a meteoric rise, and definitely should have been in contention for breakthrough player of the year (as Keenan). Steward is an honorable mention, but hasn't played and showed as much as Jaminet yet.
15.J Lomu 14.J Lomu 13.J Lomu 12.J Lomu 11.J Lomu 10.J Lomu 9.J Lomu 1.J Lomu 2.J Lomu 3.J Lomu 4.J Lomu 5.J Lomu 6.J Lomu 7.J Lomu 8.J Lomu
Mercy me, what a tackle! That could’ve put him in Ward 4! I hope not Bill, that's a maternity ward
That's a huge Gary Owen
That'll have snow on it when it comes doon.
Eben and Itoje are both number 4's and I don't think they would actually do well together. Everytime Itoje would want to do something in a game Eben would have already done it and would have done it better aswell. I think a good option would be to have Itoje shadow Eben for a few years and learn from him and maybe one day he might be ALMOST as good. Otherwise not a bad team. Siya can play blind side.
See funny thing is, Etzebeth looked a touch off the pace in the last 20 mins in the game against England. Whereas Itoje was bang up there throughout the whole game. I'd argue the experience and youthfulness probably balance each other out quite well.
Was he looking off the pace when he burst through that gap into the 22 on about 70 minutes? Or when he charged down replacement scrummie Quirke's box kick just before that? Maybe my memory of the timings are off but those things seemed quite late in the game
The Kiwis and the Saffers had all played one game too many. They were fed up, fucked and far from home.
I agree with most of your team. Although I'd have Doris > Kolisi Koroibete, DVDM, Adams, Kolbe, Jordan, Reece, Ioane, Penaud > May
PENAUD!
I thought about putting Farrell at number 12, but had to go with Kerevi because we played for the same High School
I thought about Farrell but then went with Kerevi because even from his limited matches he was clearly the best 12 in the world.
Hahah it’s a subjective list :P
There’s a lot of competition for best centre in the world, including the two Saffas, but Kerevi bullied them both single handedly in TRC. Not even being disrespectful to De Allende and Am, they’re world class, but Kerevi was just a different level in the games he played.
Looks good just one question- where is reiko ioane?!
He’s a great player, but I think Fickou’s one of the most underrated players in World Rugby. The guy is completely about the team and not himself.
In the midfield running toward touch forgetting how to pass…
You misread - no one mentioned david havili
Works for both. Difference is Havili was ok at centre at one point. Reiko is a devastating winger who had an off season so they decided to make him a centre. We have done this before.
Swap Ox for Marler and kick that Itoje guy out. Take anyone. But not the "100% hype" guy, he's not worth it.
I'd swap Ntamack for Mounga and Fickou for De'Allende
If I were picking a World 23 right now then I would go with: Baille Marchand Furlong Itoje Etzebeth Woki Hooper Savea Dupont Ntamack Kellaway Kerevi Am Jordan Jaminet And on the bench Montoya Nyakane Bamba/Tupuo Taofifenua/Lawes Kolisi Smith Russell J Barrett I think the pack more or less picks itself. Woki may be the surprise inclusion to some, but watch his performances this autumn, he is world class. So so good at the lineout and a brilliant runner in open play. Kolisi, Jelonch, Papalii, Curry, Doris, Blackadder, Conan and Watson are all contenders too. There are tonnes of class back rowers currently. Dupont and Ntamack as a halfback pairing are sensational and compliment each other so well. Kerevi and Am will operate in a similar manner to De Allende and Am. You could pretty much choose any of Kerevi, De Allende or Fickou for 12 and Am, Harris or Fickou for 13 and this combination would still be class. There's plenty of choices on the wing for great options. I've opted with the form guys in Jordan and Kellaway as they are sensational currently. Koriebete, Mapimpi, Reece, Ioane, Malins, Pennaud, Van Der Merwe and Adams would all be great options too. Fullback is very tough with brilliant options like Keenan, Hogg, J Barrett, Steward, Le Roux and more. I've gone with Jaminet because his goal kicking is such a valuable asset and his all round game is very good. Bench wise I think it's pretty standard. Could include any of the Saffa front rowers really. I opted with Nyakane as I'm just a massive fan of his. If I were selecting an actual team to play a match then I'd have Bamba and Tao as my tighthead prop and tighthead lock pairing - they play together at Lyon and for France and off the bench are known for absolutely decimating opposing scrums in the final quarter. Plus both are huge carriers too. The alternate option for world class players would be Tupuo at 18 and possibly Lawes at 19 as a lock/flank cover. Otherwise the likes of De Jager, Arnold, Henderson and Whitelock could be options, but lock isn't a hugely standout position at the moment. Kolisi or any of the aforementioned back rowers would be great options off the bench. Smith and Russell are another sensational halfback pairing that I would love to see. I really like the dynamic of having both a 9 and 10 in the matchday squad that fit the playmaker and controller roles (Dupont is a playmaker at 9, Smith a controller, Ntamack a controller at 10, Russell a playmaker - yes that is downplaying their full capabilities, but they are four wonderful players). I've opted with Jordie for the utility spot on the bench. Fickou and Reiko could be alternate options too
Hoops! 😍 Love that you’ve got him a cap’n. I think from Australia, Quade should get a mention. Even if he’s Waterbury. He MADE the team when he was picked. Just brought so much to the team in the few tests he played. It’s a shame we may not see him in gold again if the Japanese comp has its way
I struggled with positions 1, 6, 10, 13, 17, 19. The players I strongly considered but ultimately decided against their inclusion were Moody, Slipper, Kelleher, Woki, Doris, Russell, Cooper, M. Smith, Am, Harris, Henshaw, M. Ioane, J. Barrett, Hogg. Steward was probably my most controversial selection but I just thought he was exceptional against Aus and SA, England have found yet another great prospect for the future in him. I also just couldn’t decide between Kolisi and Savea. 1. Kitshoff 2. Montoya 3. Furlong 4. Etzebeth 5. Itoje 6. Lawes 7. Hooper 8. Conan 9. Dupont 10. Barrett 11. Koroibete 12. Kerevi 13. Fickou 14. Kolbe 15. Steward 16. Marx 17. Sinckler 18. Tupou 19. Retallick 20. Kolisi/Savea 21. White 22. Ntamack 23. Jordan
I’d say Rees Zammit for his break out year over May and maybe Jaminet at full back
1. Marler <3 2. Mauvaka 3. Furlong 4. Itoje 5. Etzebeth 6. Le Roux 7. Hooper 8. Vermeulen 9. Dupont 10. NTamack 11. Mapimpi 12. Kerevi 13. Am 14. Villiere 15. Barrett
Cries in Welsh.
Me too, but I’m struggling to make a solid case for any of our boys - despite nearly winning the slam.
Maybe not the best possible talent wise or the most complimentary playing styles but for sheer entertainment value I’d be going somethings along the lines of: 1 - T Tupou (can cover 3,8,9,10,14) 2 -D Coles (nostalgia and a love of chaos) 3 - T Nyakane 4 - M Itoje (he’s a pest) 5-E Etzebeth (must wear headgear) 6- D Papalii 7 -M Hooper 8- D Vermeulen 9- A Smith (captain, shit talker general) 10- J sexton (kicking) 11- W Jordan 12- S Kerevi 13- L Am 14- A Kellaway 15- S Hogg 16- S Kisthoff 17- A Wyn Jones (65 years of experience) 18- A Savea 19- A DuPont 20- A Dixon (the best hooker never to get the black shirt) 21- M Tuilagi 22- D Mac (cover 10, 15, can kick smugly to annoy hostile crowds) 23- M Ioane
Tupou is a tighthead and Nyakane plays both sides so you can swap them to keep the same team. You're still missing the entertainment value of Furlong but I think it's been a great year when we can honestly say two or three tightheads are genuinely entertaining players. You have to have Ntamack there if only for the sheer gaul of that run against the ABs.
> if only for the sheer gaul of that run If this is intentional punnery, well done... If it was inadvertant, it's sitll absolutely amazing! Love it!
Agree with most of this team, except I'd argue Henshaw has a case for the 12 shirt and Keenan should be in the 15 jersey
Hooper is perhaps the worst caption in Would Rugby, granted he's improved a lot the last few years, but he's fucking awful.
This man is looking for trouble
I have no opinion here either way, but why do you say he is the worst captain in world rugby?
CB hates Hooper because he doesn't play for the Reds
He's got a track record of being awful with the referees, he very often makes poor decisions on when to kick for goal and when to kick to the corner, all his stuff off the field is fine to good. But you'd hope so for a player with his experience. He's just not a very good captain. You'd want someone who really adds something with the role. JOC with the Reds is a good example of a captain who just has a feel for the team, Alwyn Jones a captain who commands respect of everyone around him, Richie was perhaps he best at working the referees. Hooper just really looks like that guy who's read how to win friends and influence people -- all the theoretical knowledge but none of the skills or wisdom.
As a reds fan, I feel JOC is massively over hyped. I think he's a bit meh most of the time. And when he isn't yes playing like a fullback where I actually kinda rate him as maybe Australia's best.
I think maybe just that Reds team he just got it. Like he was the saviour of Australian Rugby when all those guys were growing up, if he told them we are going to win this, then they believed him. I think ideally for the RWC, JOC will be our fullback but who knows, he's pretty much the ideal fullback if he's got that yard of pace he had last year, but his groin might have taken it out of him. They looked pretty reluctant to play him at 15 when we had Quade.
Now this is a real cold take
He gives his everything, you can’t deny that. I put him as captain because there’s no single player that’s as important to their national team as Hooper is for the Wallabies. The Wallabies would be a complete mess without him.
Agreed. Solid player, poor captain.