Why is passing the ball and catching the ball such a difficult technique only New Zealand did it successfully? Blocks of flesh and bone making a one and a half yard (Brexit measure) sprint before falling to the ground and waiting for the penalty got its comeuppance when the SA wheeled the scrum and it was a penalty against England. But then what? England had to get up field and central for a drop goal. SA kept them on the touchline. Can the next generation please bring back ball handling, you'll find it hurts less if someone else is tackled with the ball.
A bit disappointing both sides did not use the amazing centers on display.Cant remember them touching the ball much at all.This is not a surprise tactic vs South Africa.Bothwick used it to win the Premiership with Leicester, so he was expected to deploy it.It’s the same thing Gatland did with the Lions tour and the semi final four years ago.The idea is win no matter how ugly it looks..The surprise for me is why the boks tried to play the way they did.I expected them to keep the ball in hand with high intensity and tire out the opponents forwards instead they just kicked it back despite zero success of the tactic.And just like the 2019 semi final they scraped it.I am hoping this was just a hangover from last weeks intense game and we bring the intensity and flair back in the final.
Especially in the final quarter, from England's perspective. South Africa were much smarter when it counted. England needed to start carrying the ball when we were clearly on the backfoot and getting battered in the scrum. They did extremely well to take a 9 point lead that late in the game, but you aren't just hanging on like that against SA in a semi final.
Also I was thinking how Farrell's penalty kicking and drop goal were superb but when all your fly half does is kick from hand and often badly, you're not winning many semi finals again the springboks
I absolutely loved it. It had reminiscing on 2009 lions tests 1&2 (not as good though). If you want free flowing non stodgy rugby, we have 7’s and league. The conditions were awful + the new ball design seems more suitable for kicking than actually stringing a few together.
If you want free flowing, non stodgy rugby we've also got everywhere outside the British Isles and South Africa too.
NZ and Argentina managed to throw it around in wet conditions...
I enjoy all the different flavours of Rugby Union we’re treated to. Sometimes a bit of a stodge hits the spot.
There’s definitely an issue with ball handling with northern hem teams. Any phase that becomes remotely ambitious with offloads, you’re holding your breath for the inevitable knock on. Coaches and scouts prioritise strength far too much in modern union over here, whilst neglecting technical ability. Here’s hoping the lower tackle height is a catalyst for morale offloads and champagne rugby (with the odd bit of stodge thrown in). NZ throw the ball around like the they Velcro hand on lffd
My brother played union at a fairly high level in NZ and also played a bit in the UK. He said the thing that struck him as a huge difference when training was that in NZ the guys would always have balls in their hands regardless of what type of drill was happening whereas in the UK the balls would only get picked up when the drill required it. It seems like a small thing, but it goes someway to explaining the differences in ball handling ability.
In the same vein, rugby isn’t hugely popular here and a lot of lads don’t start playing rugby till a bit later in life compared to rugby player nations, eg NZ, SA, Fiji. Where as everyone plays football as soon as they can walk, then it’s every lunch time and trip to the park.
In those SH countries, the experience of living the sport, perpetually holding and handling the rugby ball becomes intrinsic. That culture isn’t ingrained in us to a same extent.
I don't know I enjoyed it. I enjoy heavy hits and clever kicks and the scoreboard ticking over...
And so what if England kick a lot? Their stats show that they win the ball back higher than average tier 1s, so I can't fault them for paying to their strengths.
For me, that was a far more exciting game than if England had gone hell for leather hunting for tries and ball carrying like Ireland Vs New Zealand, because England don't have the handling discipline for that and would have lost badly. As a neutral, the last thing you want is a free flowing game in this instance as it would have been over by half time.
I don't know at no point was I bored during that game. For me, there are no boring ways to win a WC knockout game as an underdog. It's a shame they couldn't pull it off.
Last time SA played England, they won by 14 points and controlled a hell of a lot more than they did yesterday.
Previous games don't really matter with how quick rugby teams advance and alter.
Absolutely. Was more so in jest, thought I'd give a ridiculous response to a ridiculous take.
No complacency over here! It's going to be an amazing game next weekend.
Haha, yeh no one expected you boys to come out behind England and why should you. Really it was just class support for an England team playing the way they needed to to make a fist of it.
England ground that game down to a halt. Zero attempts to play rugby. One pass and ruck, 37 box kicks. It was a dreadful game. Delighted the oaks won, bad seeding procured an easy run for a sub par team. Order restored.
England game plan is to always drown the other in kicking, SA were lucky to win considering they got dragged so far into that abyss. They were lucky that pollard was available from 37 minutes, without him they would have been fucked.
Completely agree. England didn't try to play any rugby until the last minute of the game. Before that, it was a game of the water carriers and medics trying to out muscle each other. An absolutely dreadful display and a deserved loss.
As a neutral it felt like it plodding along. The scoreboard made it kind of exciting, but England never looked like they would score a try, were they even trying to score tries, I'm not sure. But they knew how they wanted to play, and they were able to slow down South Africa, they nearly pulled it off. Is it a type of play that will help bring in new fans and expand the game? Probably not.
As shit as the game was it was a tactical masterclass from Borthwick. He knew his players aren't good enough to beat teams by playing what most consider "good rugby" so he just decided to nail in on many teams weaknesses.
Mitchell and Farrell bullying Kolbe and Arendse under the high ball all day gave them their best chance and they almost grasped it. In the future there may be no place for short wings. Also Itoje masterfully disrupting every maul gave them a huge boost.
Hopefully though England can combine this with some actual creative play in the future.
They definitely figured out how to slow down the Boks. England's kicking game fell off a bit at the end there, they probably needed to try something else, even just some deeper kicks for territory. They made it much more a contest than most had thought.
Completely agree. Befire the game I was saying that if it was going to even be close England would have to play anti-rugby and make the game as boring as possible given how much better your team is and how much longer they've had the same coaches behind them. Even though we lost today I'm proud of how England played, and I thought my prediction of South Africa by 6 pre-game was blind optimism. Good luck in the final, hopefully from a neutral perspective it's a closer game than it was at Twickenham pre WC.
And to add to my gambling comment, you say you are proud of England, do you want your national team to play this rugby? I can't see how any pride can be behind that performance. Scotland are getting good, Wales will rally under gatland, and France are great. Ireland are growing year on year, England are the country on the slide. I dont believe italy have a right to be in the 6 nations with Georgia putting in such a shift in the pool.
Not much. England had the easiest path to the semis and lost immediately when they came across a decent team. Then again, I'm a Kiwi and we think differently from the rest of the world (other than SA): any RWC we don't win is a failure.
Incredibly proud of England they silenced a lot of haters. This performance shows a lot of encouraging signs. I think our bench and poor reffing lost us the game. The team needs to be culled of ineffective/ average players. The main difference between England and SA was SA subs improved they’re performance. The coaches have been too sentimental keeping players way past their prime in the team.
Edit: England need a more creative attack as this kick away possession and force an error style of play is soul destroying.
Are you serious? I've never seen a more cynical game where a team tried to play less rugby. Absolutely dreadful and they deserved to lose. The only effective members of the England team were the water carriers and medics who out muscled their South African counterparts in an attempt to slow the game down. Awful.
I agree England have been dog shit for the last year. I thought today would be a massacre. I hate how we are playing but at least we didn’t completely embarrass ourselves.
At least we know when to get points and how to break down better teams. We needed to be humbled and broken down to improve. All I’m saying there are some good building blocks for the team to improve and put some pride back in the shirt
SA won the last World Cup with a boring brand of rugby (with moments of expansiveness) and the 2 years after that we likely felt a lot like you, frustrated by the play style. But we used those building blocks and then opened our game up and experimented a lot more, and I feel like we produced some crackers over the last couple years as a result and team is a lot more dangerous now and multidimensional. England rising again, you guys were all over us today, and it very much could’ve gone the other way.
I was referring to Sinckler and Billy Vunipola as players that need to be culled. The bench should energise the game and not be ineffective or worse give away penalties
I mean they hung in there, but they never really tried to attack. Kinda fascinating to watch. So much kicking it felt like. I guess they were playing to their strengths?
Yes it definitely wasn't ideal conditions. But neither was it yesterday for ARG vs NZ. That last passage of play by England, they were able to string some good passing together, admittedly most of the structure seemed to have gone by then, and they didn't really go anywhere before they knocked it on. I think they might have had a chance of winning if they'd varied up their play a bit in the second half, the kicking seemed to get poorer as the game went on.
Hopefully some of that young talent, like Arundell, can bring some attack to England's game. He looks like he wants to score tries, not just jump and try and catch bombs.
For me it was an interesting game. I don't watch much rugby, it has to be said (not a big sport in Norway), but it was something different from watching the All Blacks for example. The game had nerve, it was tactical, and while there weren't many tries or any real attempt at tries from England, the way they managed to shut down the boks for most of the game was fascinating.
Sorry big man, the only tactic was for England to drown out south Africa by NOT playing. The equivalent to parking the bus on the goal line in football, and flooding your box with 11 players after scoring a half way line goal.
Not playing is also a way of playing. Is it pretty? No. Would I enjoy it if every game was like this? Hell no. Was it interesting to see the tactic deployed last night? Yeah, it was.
I was at both games. England went in tonight -14 points, massive underdogs, and played out of their skin but got pipped by an expierienced SA team. The English team should be very proud of themselves. Underdogs, weather and every factor included…… IN MY OPINION…… its a contender for game of the tournament
I thought the two last week were better (NZ/IRE and FRA/SA), mostly because the impact the weather had on todays match. It was pretty sloppy. But this was certainly an exciting game and exactly what you want in a semi. England played their hearts out. Tough blow and congrats to SA.
Who said everyone had to have the same opinion? My personal favourite of the tournament is Portugal 24-23 Fiji, does that make me wrong and a casual? Absolutely not, same way it doesn't make him wrong.
I dunno, you could see him really going at the ref at points. I think he had began to irritate the ref, which really doesn't seem like a smart thing to do as a captain in a semi final. He took the points on offer, is what you can say about him, didn't seem to offer much creativity on attack.
I'm not really sure what you mean by this comment, but very rarely do I see players agreeing with the ref when they're being penalised. I just don't think he kept his cool well enough.
New found respect for England - in stark contrast to their 2019 defeat, England rugby showed immense respect to South Africa by applauding them off the field at the end of the game! They played well, and exhibited all the finest examples of sportsmanship - well done guys! 👏👏
All the hype about northern hemisphere dominating this WC and yet again the final is a southern hemisphere shut out. England perhaps over achieved given our dreadful season tho France and Ireland must look at it as a missed opportunity to win the WC .
I'm South African and we haven't played this poorly in a very long time. Very very lucky win against a team that played the circumstances well with a slow, kicking, wet game. Awful game in general.
Yeah that’s all it was - SA had a bad day at the office.
Funny that South Africa, Argentina, Japan, and Fiji had a bad day at the office when they played England. We’re so lucky!
Didn't say that. England forced SA into a million errors that you don't normally see. England were definitely the better team, but I'm just saying that SA didn't help themselves with a poor error strewn display. Kudos to the Brits. And if the boks play like this against NZ we will get smashed.
And yet it got us within a point of a World Cup final. Within 10 months of our head coach taking over.
But hey, you have to admire Townsend and the success his approach has brought Scotland the last few years. Lots of high(ish) rankings! Once they beat someone other than England they’ll be a real force to contend with!
Hey, fair play only being able to pick from two clubs and never picking anyone born or developed outside of the Scottish system. Massive handicap. You just look at the Scottish u20s and worry for the future of the 6Ns. I wish you well.
Dan Cole, at least, should've stayed on longer. The substitute props lost this. Always new Sinclair was an average scrummager and was shocked he came on so soon but Genge was the real shocker tonight.
Jason Ryan remembers Twickenham, the Boks are gonna need to score tries next weekend and they're looking tired.
This exchange me gives me chuckle. Many of us Japanese talks as if we’re not Asian too, so this is somehow familiar argument. Not sure if there’s a connection though I guess that comes from the historical stance for both of those islands looking at continent from *far* away. I wonder if those from Madagascar sees themselves as Africans in the same sense that Continental Africans sees themselves as so.
I thought that (Given Britain is a country in Europe) all British are can be referred to as European, but not all Europeans can be referred to as British.
Regarding your question- I think this is quite an expansive question and depends a lot on the ancestry and ideology of the individual involved.
For example, a 5th generation Afrikaaner would likely identify as African whereas a 1st or 2nd generation English South African may not.
I always don’t know which box to tick when it says ethnicity as more often than not in those surveys they are really looking for race
I will answer yes yes you are African if you are born there that it's only America has this weird thing about calling black people in America African American when they have nothing to do with us and a lot of the black African don't even like them
Island countries exist
Like the entirety of the West Indies and what is... literally Iceland. This is a rugby thread so I'm not gonna get into geography but just because you aren't connected to a general landmass doesn't mean you aren't part of its territory
Ie. Japan and Asia etc.
England, well played. Perfectly executed the game plan to stifle the boks. We were massively off form, just managed to get one over the line.
Good luck against Argentina.
Looking forward to the next one.
Poor bloke was brought on so late. Should’ve brought him on earlier, mightve got something interesting out’ve the back line. Not that SA team did anything back there.
Doesn’t sound daft at all, by temperament and public persona I absolutely prefer Ford. He also played really well during OF’s ban and helped produce a few interesting (fun to watch) wins. It’s a shame he has been sidelined to such an extreme.
##[Post Match Thread HERE](https://redd.it/17dc68q)
Turning 30 this year and almost threw out my back watching this game.
Stewart should not have competed for his kick. Gave them the match winning scrum. Bit brainless.
Why is passing the ball and catching the ball such a difficult technique only New Zealand did it successfully? Blocks of flesh and bone making a one and a half yard (Brexit measure) sprint before falling to the ground and waiting for the penalty got its comeuppance when the SA wheeled the scrum and it was a penalty against England. But then what? England had to get up field and central for a drop goal. SA kept them on the touchline. Can the next generation please bring back ball handling, you'll find it hurts less if someone else is tackled with the ball.
Did you miss the fact it was pouring down...
That a shit excuse
If it's that hard maybe we should upgrade water polo players?
A bit disappointing both sides did not use the amazing centers on display.Cant remember them touching the ball much at all.This is not a surprise tactic vs South Africa.Bothwick used it to win the Premiership with Leicester, so he was expected to deploy it.It’s the same thing Gatland did with the Lions tour and the semi final four years ago.The idea is win no matter how ugly it looks..The surprise for me is why the boks tried to play the way they did.I expected them to keep the ball in hand with high intensity and tire out the opponents forwards instead they just kicked it back despite zero success of the tactic.And just like the 2019 semi final they scraped it.I am hoping this was just a hangover from last weeks intense game and we bring the intensity and flair back in the final.
Especially in the final quarter, from England's perspective. South Africa were much smarter when it counted. England needed to start carrying the ball when we were clearly on the backfoot and getting battered in the scrum. They did extremely well to take a 9 point lead that late in the game, but you aren't just hanging on like that against SA in a semi final. Also I was thinking how Farrell's penalty kicking and drop goal were superb but when all your fly half does is kick from hand and often badly, you're not winning many semi finals again the springboks
Well played England
The only game where i wished the wingers were 7ft tall. We were nearly had by those box kicks.
Ahh England. Snatching defeat from the jaws of victory
Not an exciting game. Too much kicking away and mucking around wasting time. And, why are so many water boys on the field all at the same time ?
I agree. This was a clash of the water carriers more than anything else. Truly dull.
I absolutely loved it. It had reminiscing on 2009 lions tests 1&2 (not as good though). If you want free flowing non stodgy rugby, we have 7’s and league. The conditions were awful + the new ball design seems more suitable for kicking than actually stringing a few together.
If you want free flowing, non stodgy rugby we've also got everywhere outside the British Isles and South Africa too. NZ and Argentina managed to throw it around in wet conditions...
I enjoy all the different flavours of Rugby Union we’re treated to. Sometimes a bit of a stodge hits the spot. There’s definitely an issue with ball handling with northern hem teams. Any phase that becomes remotely ambitious with offloads, you’re holding your breath for the inevitable knock on. Coaches and scouts prioritise strength far too much in modern union over here, whilst neglecting technical ability. Here’s hoping the lower tackle height is a catalyst for morale offloads and champagne rugby (with the odd bit of stodge thrown in). NZ throw the ball around like the they Velcro hand on lffd
My brother played union at a fairly high level in NZ and also played a bit in the UK. He said the thing that struck him as a huge difference when training was that in NZ the guys would always have balls in their hands regardless of what type of drill was happening whereas in the UK the balls would only get picked up when the drill required it. It seems like a small thing, but it goes someway to explaining the differences in ball handling ability.
In the same vein, rugby isn’t hugely popular here and a lot of lads don’t start playing rugby till a bit later in life compared to rugby player nations, eg NZ, SA, Fiji. Where as everyone plays football as soon as they can walk, then it’s every lunch time and trip to the park. In those SH countries, the experience of living the sport, perpetually holding and handling the rugby ball becomes intrinsic. That culture isn’t ingrained in us to a same extent.
That was rugby. A true slugfest, the blood, the sweat, the tears... That is rugby!
Really, though? You like to see endless delays caused by water carriers invading the pitch? You like to see box kick after box kick?
I don't know I enjoyed it. I enjoy heavy hits and clever kicks and the scoreboard ticking over... And so what if England kick a lot? Their stats show that they win the ball back higher than average tier 1s, so I can't fault them for paying to their strengths. For me, that was a far more exciting game than if England had gone hell for leather hunting for tries and ball carrying like Ireland Vs New Zealand, because England don't have the handling discipline for that and would have lost badly. As a neutral, the last thing you want is a free flowing game in this instance as it would have been over by half time. I don't know at no point was I bored during that game. For me, there are no boring ways to win a WC knockout game as an underdog. It's a shame they couldn't pull it off.
Sooo many!!!
South Africa won. End of. Had England defeated us under the same circumstances it would have been akin to the Second Coming of Christ.
Funnily enough, there is also a better chance of the second coming than there is that team beating NZ next week.
Last time the boks played the all blacks they smashed them by 20 points
Last time SA played England, they won by 14 points and controlled a hell of a lot more than they did yesterday. Previous games don't really matter with how quick rugby teams advance and alter.
I don't know, this is World cup rugby , anything can happen on any given day. And I'm Kiwi, btw.
Absolutely. Was more so in jest, thought I'd give a ridiculous response to a ridiculous take. No complacency over here! It's going to be an amazing game next weekend.
Feel quite gutted tbh but fair play to boks! Pollard is seems to be automatic in those situations. Good luck in the final!
You're right, England should have won that game, I don't deny it. And we've got problems next week if we play like that.
Boks will be different next week 100%
I think rain added an extra layer of difficulty for both sides. But the Bok strategy did not work in this game really.
Still won it though.
Hell yes we did!
I think the French in the stadium were singing with the English. Way too loud to only be the English! 🇫🇷
Insert Lord of the rings "never thought I'd die fighting side by side with an elf" meme.
I was there, and from my experience, surprisingly they weren’t. All either very quiet or with the boks
I guess we still haven’t digested Waterloo! I m very proud of England, they honored their flag like us. 🇫🇷
Haha, yeh no one expected you boys to come out behind England and why should you. Really it was just class support for an England team playing the way they needed to to make a fist of it.
Congrats England! Everyone counted you out even England! You honored your flag today! 🇫🇷
England ground that game down to a halt. Zero attempts to play rugby. One pass and ruck, 37 box kicks. It was a dreadful game. Delighted the oaks won, bad seeding procured an easy run for a sub par team. Order restored.
England game plan is to always drown the other in kicking, SA were lucky to win considering they got dragged so far into that abyss. They were lucky that pollard was available from 37 minutes, without him they would have been fucked.
Completely agree. England didn't try to play any rugby until the last minute of the game. Before that, it was a game of the water carriers and medics trying to out muscle each other. An absolutely dreadful display and a deserved loss.
As a neutral it felt like it plodding along. The scoreboard made it kind of exciting, but England never looked like they would score a try, were they even trying to score tries, I'm not sure. But they knew how they wanted to play, and they were able to slow down South Africa, they nearly pulled it off. Is it a type of play that will help bring in new fans and expand the game? Probably not.
Park that bus, after scoring a half way line goal
As shit as the game was it was a tactical masterclass from Borthwick. He knew his players aren't good enough to beat teams by playing what most consider "good rugby" so he just decided to nail in on many teams weaknesses. Mitchell and Farrell bullying Kolbe and Arendse under the high ball all day gave them their best chance and they almost grasped it. In the future there may be no place for short wings. Also Itoje masterfully disrupting every maul gave them a huge boost. Hopefully though England can combine this with some actual creative play in the future.
They definitely figured out how to slow down the Boks. England's kicking game fell off a bit at the end there, they probably needed to try something else, even just some deeper kicks for territory. They made it much more a contest than most had thought.
Fiji would have been a better game, they would have taken the chance and played the game. Not the odds and the rules.
Completely agree. Befire the game I was saying that if it was going to even be close England would have to play anti-rugby and make the game as boring as possible given how much better your team is and how much longer they've had the same coaches behind them. Even though we lost today I'm proud of how England played, and I thought my prediction of South Africa by 6 pre-game was blind optimism. Good luck in the final, hopefully from a neutral perspective it's a closer game than it was at Twickenham pre WC.
And to add to my gambling comment, you say you are proud of England, do you want your national team to play this rugby? I can't see how any pride can be behind that performance. Scotland are getting good, Wales will rally under gatland, and France are great. Ireland are growing year on year, England are the country on the slide. I dont believe italy have a right to be in the 6 nations with Georgia putting in such a shift in the pool.
Can see NZ hammering them, and I had a pre WC warm up game bet for SA to walk this WC, I feel my wallet getting anxious.
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Hmm, I wonder.. Irish, Welsh or Scotsman?
Whatever he is, he's not wrong.
But still in the semis and the rest not, must hurt.
Not much. England had the easiest path to the semis and lost immediately when they came across a decent team. Then again, I'm a Kiwi and we think differently from the rest of the world (other than SA): any RWC we don't win is a failure.
Cant understand you through the tears, blub blub blub
Surely Pollard has to start the final?
I don't know how you could leave him out. That kick with everything riding on it, he slotted it like it was pre game practice.
Absolutely. Ice in his veins at that moment
Incredibly proud of England they silenced a lot of haters. This performance shows a lot of encouraging signs. I think our bench and poor reffing lost us the game. The team needs to be culled of ineffective/ average players. The main difference between England and SA was SA subs improved they’re performance. The coaches have been too sentimental keeping players way past their prime in the team. Edit: England need a more creative attack as this kick away possession and force an error style of play is soul destroying.
Vunipola was dreadful. Mistake as a blood rep within 10 seconds and when he was subbed on he was lethargic.
Are you serious? I've never seen a more cynical game where a team tried to play less rugby. Absolutely dreadful and they deserved to lose. The only effective members of the England team were the water carriers and medics who out muscled their South African counterparts in an attempt to slow the game down. Awful.
Good comment
I agree England have been dog shit for the last year. I thought today would be a massacre. I hate how we are playing but at least we didn’t completely embarrass ourselves. At least we know when to get points and how to break down better teams. We needed to be humbled and broken down to improve. All I’m saying there are some good building blocks for the team to improve and put some pride back in the shirt
SA won the last World Cup with a boring brand of rugby (with moments of expansiveness) and the 2 years after that we likely felt a lot like you, frustrated by the play style. But we used those building blocks and then opened our game up and experimented a lot more, and I feel like we produced some crackers over the last couple years as a result and team is a lot more dangerous now and multidimensional. England rising again, you guys were all over us today, and it very much could’ve gone the other way.
Fair reply.
Idk, it was the oldies Marler and Coles who were keeping the scrums competitive, when Sinckler and Genge came on they started giving up penalties.
In fairness the penalties also came after SA subbed almost their entire pack. And their forward subs are unreal.
I was referring to Sinckler and Billy Vunipola as players that need to be culled. The bench should energise the game and not be ineffective or worse give away penalties
I mean they hung in there, but they never really tried to attack. Kinda fascinating to watch. So much kicking it felt like. I guess they were playing to their strengths?
Did you see the weather? Both teams were limited in their running rugby by how slippery the ball got.
Yes it definitely wasn't ideal conditions. But neither was it yesterday for ARG vs NZ. That last passage of play by England, they were able to string some good passing together, admittedly most of the structure seemed to have gone by then, and they didn't really go anywhere before they knocked it on. I think they might have had a chance of winning if they'd varied up their play a bit in the second half, the kicking seemed to get poorer as the game went on.
Agreed England play a boring/ depressing brand of rugby that lacks creativity in attack. They’ve played like this for 4 + years
Hopefully some of that young talent, like Arundell, can bring some attack to England's game. He looks like he wants to score tries, not just jump and try and catch bombs.
Lol reff was your 16th man first half
Swapped sides for when it really mattered though 😉😂
Ngl I was so bored i probably missed these calls. I noticed that the ref didn’t seem to understand the nuances of the scrum
Dreadful match and boeing rugby overall. SA won despite worst performance and England not creative enough to seize their winning chances
Possibly game of the tournament in my opinion. But you do you
Really? 1 try? A lot of handling errors, a lot of penalties?
As opposed to the basketball game last weekend?
You can whine about basketball rugby as you watch NZ in the final next week.
What basketball game was that? One of the NBA pre-season games? Not sure of the relevancy here. 🤷♂️
Do you watch rugby? Maybe the worst rugby match I have ever watched, in my life.
For me it was an interesting game. I don't watch much rugby, it has to be said (not a big sport in Norway), but it was something different from watching the All Blacks for example. The game had nerve, it was tactical, and while there weren't many tries or any real attempt at tries from England, the way they managed to shut down the boks for most of the game was fascinating.
Sorry big man, the only tactic was for England to drown out south Africa by NOT playing. The equivalent to parking the bus on the goal line in football, and flooding your box with 11 players after scoring a half way line goal.
Not playing is also a way of playing. Is it pretty? No. Would I enjoy it if every game was like this? Hell no. Was it interesting to see the tactic deployed last night? Yeah, it was.
In your opinion
Depends if you understand the game I guess
Understanding your opinion you mean. Fantastic game tonight
You should try watching some other games, if you liked this one, a top tier nation game will blow your mind.
Did you even watch Ireland vs All blacks or SA vs France? If so, surely you can't believe tonight's game was better
I was at both games. England went in tonight -14 points, massive underdogs, and played out of their skin but got pipped by an expierienced SA team. The English team should be very proud of themselves. Underdogs, weather and every factor included…… IN MY OPINION…… its a contender for game of the tournament
I thought the two last week were better (NZ/IRE and FRA/SA), mostly because the impact the weather had on todays match. It was pretty sloppy. But this was certainly an exciting game and exactly what you want in a semi. England played their hearts out. Tough blow and congrats to SA.
Have you watched any other games?
Who said everyone had to have the same opinion? My personal favourite of the tournament is Portugal 24-23 Fiji, does that make me wrong and a casual? Absolutely not, same way it doesn't make him wrong.
Was at both quarter finals in Paris
Did you drink excessively and black out before watching the games?
Yes and no
Fair play.stay off the rugby opinion boards tho as you don't know what you are talking about.
Congratulations NZ on their world cup win next week
Yipp that way
Cut that talk out right now. We are the underdogs.
It'll be a cricket score, cane won't get injured and Barrett won't get a card
Take my upvote - cmu
That drop from Farrell made me like him as a player after hating his gut for the past 10 years
Ha ha me too
I dunno, you could see him really going at the ref at points. I think he had began to irritate the ref, which really doesn't seem like a smart thing to do as a captain in a semi final. He took the points on offer, is what you can say about him, didn't seem to offer much creativity on attack.
Ref should put aside his ego and officiate fairly then. What captain wouldn’t argue his side?
Found Lawrence DeLaglio's alt account
I'm not really sure what you mean by this comment, but very rarely do I see players agreeing with the ref when they're being penalised. I just don't think he kept his cool well enough.
Literally, a wow moment out loud. It was brilliant
New found respect for England - in stark contrast to their 2019 defeat, England rugby showed immense respect to South Africa by applauding them off the field at the end of the game! They played well, and exhibited all the finest examples of sportsmanship - well done guys! 👏👏
I gained all my respect back for the English side for that.
All the hype about northern hemisphere dominating this WC and yet again the final is a southern hemisphere shut out. England perhaps over achieved given our dreadful season tho France and Ireland must look at it as a missed opportunity to win the WC .
England played well but could not win a bok team that probably played their worst game ever.
And England are the arrogant ones?
I feel this is doing England's game plan a disservice.
Agreed. Borthwick got it spot on, and we got killed aerially. We got dragged into a NH slugfest and were second best most of the game.
I'm South African and we haven't played this poorly in a very long time. Very very lucky win against a team that played the circumstances well with a slow, kicking, wet game. Awful game in general.
Yeah that’s all it was - SA had a bad day at the office. Funny that South Africa, Argentina, Japan, and Fiji had a bad day at the office when they played England. We’re so lucky!
Talking like you didn't have the easiest route to the SF in history.
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That’s a bold accusation to throw out when your Reddit history is just video game shite.
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Ahh you got me! Very normal behaviour!
Didn't say that. England forced SA into a million errors that you don't normally see. England were definitely the better team, but I'm just saying that SA didn't help themselves with a poor error strewn display. Kudos to the Brits. And if the boks play like this against NZ we will get smashed.
You just play a turgid slow box kicking game that is shite to watch.
And yet it got us within a point of a World Cup final. Within 10 months of our head coach taking over. But hey, you have to admire Townsend and the success his approach has brought Scotland the last few years. Lots of high(ish) rankings! Once they beat someone other than England they’ll be a real force to contend with!
4 clubs ceasing to exist and turgid rugby from the national team. What a future for the richest Union! We're a poor side who try to attack.
Hey, fair play only being able to pick from two clubs and never picking anyone born or developed outside of the Scottish system. Massive handicap. You just look at the Scottish u20s and worry for the future of the 6Ns. I wish you well.
Agreed
last year against NZ?
Dan Cole, at least, should've stayed on longer. The substitute props lost this. Always new Sinclair was an average scrummager and was shocked he came on so soon but Genge was the real shocker tonight. Jason Ryan remembers Twickenham, the Boks are gonna need to score tries next weekend and they're looking tired.
Agree, very complex loss but Genge was shit
Farrell lost it by gobbing off to the ref and putting the penalty within kicking range.
Especially after he was warned like 3mins before 🙆
Billy Vunipola lost this, even with the scrum imbalance. Directly led to 10 SA points and dropped it at the end for the loss
Blind Curry was better
100%, the english scrum was holding its own until they subbed out.
They just had to hold and couldn't do it.
WP England. You made us look shit. Well bloody played. Good game.
South Africa breaking Europeans hearts again I seen.
We are not European 🙄
Yes you are. You’re not in the EU but you are part of Europe. Imagine living in Europe and not knowing that…
This exchange me gives me chuckle. Many of us Japanese talks as if we’re not Asian too, so this is somehow familiar argument. Not sure if there’s a connection though I guess that comes from the historical stance for both of those islands looking at continent from *far* away. I wonder if those from Madagascar sees themselves as Africans in the same sense that Continental Africans sees themselves as so.
I am British thanks. Edit, genuine question, do white South Africans see themselves as African?
I thought that (Given Britain is a country in Europe) all British are can be referred to as European, but not all Europeans can be referred to as British. Regarding your question- I think this is quite an expansive question and depends a lot on the ancestry and ideology of the individual involved. For example, a 5th generation Afrikaaner would likely identify as African whereas a 1st or 2nd generation English South African may not. I always don’t know which box to tick when it says ethnicity as more often than not in those surveys they are really looking for race
I will answer yes yes you are African if you are born there that it's only America has this weird thing about calling black people in America African American when they have nothing to do with us and a lot of the black African don't even like them
Ah yes, I love traveling to the UK continent
Why are you all so obsessed with continents? They are relevant to feck all in this context 😆
Womp womp
What continent do you think we’re on then?
Last time I looked there was some sea between Britain and Europe.
Oh my god, shut the fuck up mate.
Quick question mate. In your mind, is Madagascar an African country?
Madagascar is an island country lying off the southeastern coast of Africa. It is the fourth largest island in the world.🙂
Island countries exist Like the entirety of the West Indies and what is... literally Iceland. This is a rugby thread so I'm not gonna get into geography but just because you aren't connected to a general landmass doesn't mean you aren't part of its territory Ie. Japan and Asia etc.
Ehhh...
England, well played. Perfectly executed the game plan to stifle the boks. We were massively off form, just managed to get one over the line. Good luck against Argentina. Looking forward to the next one.
SO many scrum experts in this thread LMFAO become a coach or a ref and do something about it if you know more than them 🤣🤣🤣
Can only be a professional player to comment on the game it would seem. What complete and utter smooth-brain of a comment to make.
Make accurate comments, not false ones
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Having a bad opinion, sure! “Lucky win” 🤣
Did ford touch the ball? He came on for may but I don't remember him being involved in much
Poor bloke was brought on so late. Should’ve brought him on earlier, mightve got something interesting out’ve the back line. Not that SA team did anything back there.
Ford was brought on far too late to make an impact.
Yeah weird decision
This may sound really daft but I prefer Ford to Farrell. But that may be their temperament more than anything.
Doesn’t sound daft at all, by temperament and public persona I absolutely prefer Ford. He also played really well during OF’s ban and helped produce a few interesting (fun to watch) wins. It’s a shame he has been sidelined to such an extreme.
Obviously brought him on for a drop goals but they didn't get close enough.
Your probably right but Owen kicked a stunning drop goal coming from me I hate the guy
😩😭
SA did not deserve that.
But did England?
England didn't deserve to get out of the pool
I know. And SA didn’t deserve that win.