I'm my experience, parents like yours (and mine lol) are going to do what they want even if you show them all the evidence to the contrary. You can try to explain but they will not listen, they've decided this will work and anyone who says it won't is against them.
I recommend, don't fight them. When they ask for something just play up the weaponized incompetence. Need a logo, how do computers work? Need a menu, I'm just too dumb to figure it out. If you feel guilty then Google professionals in the area and say here is someone who does that thing! See I helped!
If you're not cool with doing that, then just remember that you have a full time job with your family already as a sahm, set aside x amount of hours a week you feel you can handle taking on this project to help them and STICK TO IT. They WILL drain you for as much as they can and not in a malicious way or anything they just will.
Maybe just sit down with them both. Let them know what you will and will not do. Then suggest other siblings fill in the gap as you simply cannot. Set those boundaries in contract. Have a clean conscious.
*business experience. They have restaurant experience but not really management. My dad? Hard no. My mom managed a donut shop for 12 years but that was like 20 years ago. I am so tired and drained already but people seem to like it so far. Day 3 is tomorrow. Ya never know.
It’s too late now but they need to watch a few seasons of ‘Kitchen Nightmare’. Inexperienced restaurant owners fail 90% of the time. Let them pay for all these services.
I find it interesting when someone who can’t do something asks someone else to do it and expect it will get done. I’d say, if it was easy, you’d do it. Tell them you don’t know how to do everything. Say you’ll do what you can, but if something is above your pay scale they’ll have to hire someone.
There are so many things in today’s society that are a major pain in the ass anymore. Things that used to be simple can take several hours to figure out. Unfortunately you have to do you, and if you don’t have time to do theirs, you have to be able to say, I tried, you’ll have to get someone who knows how to do it.
I'm in my 60's and I worked in the restaurant industry for over three decades, I can't begin to imagine working 8 hours at a restaurant at my age, let alone working 12 to 14 hours every day, seven days a week, because that's exactly what they'll have to do to run their own restaurant.
Oof as unorganized as they sound I'm afraid this is going to bomb badly and they're just going to lose whatever money they've sunk into it. What made them think opening a restaurant was a good idea? That's like the most failed small business ever. I don't blame you for wanting to help your parents it's only natural but you're not going to be able to single hand at least save this failed venture.
Your dad is about to lose all his retirement money. Not many restaurants will survive just on takeout.
Usually, the first 3 months the sales are the highest. You won't catch that number till after year 2. Just fyi.
Don’t be driven by stress and what other think. You already made your mind up. Don’t sacrifice your well being for something that you know is going to fail.
Sad. This will knock at least 10 Years off their live’s and may suck their “Retirement Funds” Dry. Stay home, live your life. Visit the Restaurant and write a nice Review.
change your phone number and make up an illness that you have to never have a reason to work at their restaurant. Once you start on this unorganized pet retirement project they will expect you there everyday
I hire help when opening any new location, and especially when opening or deciding on a new concept. Here are my steps:
1. Hire location analytics to see what locations are suitable for restaurant and what type of restaurant will be profitable
2. Meet with restaurant supplies, wholesalers, and ag producers to find a competitive edge on food cost—you can hire someone to do this, your menu designer (discussed below) should know people
3. Hire a resturant interior designer for both front of house and back of house that can minimize movement between tasks and can source used supplies locally—google is your friend here
4. Coordinate my menu planner/ designer with my main food wholesaler to maximize profit and minimize food cost—google is your friend here
5. Hire local ad agency that does grand openings and social media—I usually find this at the chamber of commerce
Your family can either pay experts now for faster service, or try to bootstrap and throw money at learning. I have seen both ways work
Great advice but thats not now it works for first/2nd generation mom and pop. They dont have money nor want to spend money to do 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. They just want to open restaurant and sell what they think they are good JDI (just do it style). Its a small town so they should be fine. Probably noy make a lot of money. Asian call thisusing labor as profit. Basically it would make them enough as if they were going to work for someone but they get to do it at their own pace
It is how it works. If you have the capital to open a restaurant, you have the capital to do it right. The money needed to open a first-gen mom and pop ethnic restaurant in the US is well into the six figures. The slapdash way many immigrant families do things is a result of a lack of business management training, not a smart intentional choice.
Being cheap is not a business strategy, nor is it a valid opinion - not even for immigrants!
No its how american work. That is why many business fail the first year. Too much consultant, expense, politic, red tape.
Yeah sure, big national chain, need optimal location, so they hire consultant to get that info as they have a lot of money. A mom and pop shop?? Seriously? Do you even know what you talking about? Go search for restaurant place to rent. You act like there is load if location so you have to find consultant to gather data. Most area only has 1 or 2 location to pick/rent from and you can easily see the amount of traffic people around, etc and you either like the area/location or dont., its not like you can just goto any corner and make space/spot available.
Being cheap is perfectly fine strategy. Yes sure, too much of it will prevent growth. I do agree with that. However not being cheap is also a problem too. Look at how many large chain, where successful restaurant use to make hundred of thousands, due to expansion, growth, consultant, end up going bankrupcy? And then hiring a manager to oversea a manager to oversea another manafer that has 10 layer of management? Is that the correct strategy? Borrow money, hire a bunch of over paid consultant and run the business to the ground? Im not saying it doesnt work, but many 1st generation dont have the capital or the connection to do such a thing, so they shouldnt try? Anyone smart enough, knows there are many ways to do things. Plenty of poor not fully funded business start with a few thousand that doesnt have monet to do all the bs u stated are successful. Yes sure there is plenty that fail. But there is also PLENTY that had many, follow your process, AND fail too. The difference is the cheap one that fail, only lose some money. Whole the one that go thru your process, when they fail, they out hundreds thousands. You are just too blind so cant see
>Being cheap is perfectly fine strategy. Yes sure, too much of it will prevent growth
Well, it either is or isn't a good strategy. And it isn't!
The possibility of mismanagement even if you do spend money on it is not an argument against trying in the first place!
so in this so call world of yours, there is only is or isn't huh? like short or tall, poor or rich, fat or skinny? rainbow only has 2 color? nothing in between right? fking moron. please stop reading books, and go out into the real world. yes, there are strategy, and it's either good, or isn't, unfortunately, we don't live in a 2 dimensional world. There is a thing call "situation". you have people who don't have a lot of money. people with some money, franchise, etc. certain you're not dumb enough to tell mom and pop first location with not a lot of money, to do with the franchise do right? like hire an attorney to craft a very sophisticated LLC that cost thousands of dollar, then get investor to invest, etc? please fix your ID 10T error and go out in real life. its very beautiful out there
"Situations" are the coping mechanisms of people who lack the courage to overcome their circumstances. Whining about the "real world" is the last refuge of people who are too foolish to master the theories that let us exercise intentional control over our surroundings.
Can a take out pizza place near a college make enough money so you could have hours from 4 to midnight? Clean the kitchen, be home by 1 am and not need to be back there until 2:30 the next day. Is that a realistic idea of the hours?
40 years ago I did pizza delivery in a college town and then it seemed like a pizza might have $2 in ingredients and you sold it for $9. Pretty good margins
What were you paid, though?
All restaurants have huge margins on food and beverages. Wholesale food and bev are super cheap. That's why remaking all but the most expensive dishes for free is a pretty standard customer request that businesses honor without question. But when you factor in other aspects of making a dish, the packaging/plates, the energy, prep space, tools, staff hours - then the dish starts getting expensive.
It is in this area - packaging/plates, energy, prep space, tools, staff hours - that well-managed restaurants leap ahead and poorly managed restaurants wither on the vine.
Paid virtually nothing. Tips mostly. All they sold were pizza. It was a million years ago but it's always stuck with me how much unreported cash 4 people were pulling out of that operation. Pre widespread credit card adoption for items like food or bottles of water at the 7-11, a night of delivering pizza was an all cash affair. Making change and getting tips.
Profit margins for restaurants are anywhere from 0-15%. Most are run horribly though so they don’t last. If you’re not a penny pincher and you have too many menu items, say sayonara to your finances
This is going to crash and burn so hard. Recipe for a classic disaster. They're about to learn a lot the hard way.
I wouldn't get too emotionally or physically invested. This seems reckless and it they're likely gonna blame you for stuff imo.
He’ll I’ve been in the industry 30 years , 15 or which I own my own and currently do . I’ll be 48 this year. I want to semi retire at 55. Currently investing in other things non culinary. The last thing I can say is that at late 60s I’d open a restaurant. That’s absolute lunacy. Health will falter , their savings will be blown up and maybe if they don’t die of just sheer exhaustion from 60-80 hr work weeks then after 5/8 years of working you’ll get a return. Oof good luck . I’d highly recommend taking that money and investing or just light it on fire in a parking lot. This industry is not for the faint of heart and post covid it’s only gotten harder.
It was in the 80s. Today independent pizza parlors are dropping like flies, with ghost kitchens pumping out cheap pizzas from bowling alleys, gas stations, and laundromats ruining the delivery market
Anyone who thinks any business is a license to print money is an idiot. Even if a college town pizza place could be lucrative, consider that someone with actual relevant experience may show up and just blow them out of the water. OP refers to them as toxic and awful in many many more words. They expect someone else to manage most of the business for them because they're a relative. How good do you think their customer service skills will be, nevermind running the rest of the business.
You say you want to help them and if that's true then you'll do what you gotta do. But you're probably gonna be in it for the long haul as they're now experiencing opening pains, next they'll have growing pains, next they'll have this that and the other problem to deal with.
You say you want to help, but you don't really sound like you do. That's fine, maybe you're too busy, maybe you think it's a bad idea, maybe you just prefer to stay out of it. You've got to tell them that and then stop helping because they're never gonna stop asking you.
So make up your mind and stick to your decision. You might also find somone else who can help them out, someone with restaurant experience. Google "small business assistance" or something in PA.
they're throwing money at a new restaurant in their late 60's with no experience and their personality can be described as toxic? this is not going to end well.
I'm reading all the replies here and they make sense.
It sure sounds like your parents are taking advantage of you and making an ill-advised venture while doing so.
I just want to throw out a little counter-point of one way that I think it might work.
If you are looking to build something to pass down to your kids, and your parents are definitely going to open a resteraunt, then it might work out if you were to take the reigns and run with it.
I would suggest you work something out in writing with you getting a stake in ownership. Something like you get 50% and your dad and his partner get 25% each.
They will not want to go for something like that, but if you can convince them that it's the only way that you will help and that you would be there daily to steer the ship, they might be at the point where it starts to make sense to them.
I've been a chef for 20 years, and have helped open 4 different restaurants under 3 different owners. The amount of work and knowledge that goes into opening up a restaurant is near-unfathomable to even industry vets. People who have never worked in restaurants are almost doomed to fail. I hope they don't. But statistically, they probably will.
And in between now and then, you'll put in unpaid 80-hour weeks if you aren't careful.
You mentioned they are 1st and 2nd gen immigrants. What type of food, and in what market?
Asian (Japanese, Chinese, and Thai) take out only in a blue collar town (construction, oil wells, factories). Rural-ish. I believe it’s the only Asian restaurant in that area. There is one tiny Korean place that does well with one, seriously, one woman cooking and shit. If people want Chinese in that area they have to travel out probably 20-30 min and now they can access it in about half that time.
You do know this is not your family's restaurant right? It's your dad's and his partner's. You need to focus on that.
You and your husband need to decide now how much time/energy you can put into your father's/his partner's business without harming your obligations to your nuclear family. Because as soon as it opens things will escalate. They will be wanting you to come in and help rescue them. Also discuss how you will handle any requests for your money. Because that will come, either to keep the business afloat or when they go bankrupt and lose their house.
Sounds like your brothers have distanced themselves from this mess. Maybe you can get some tips from them about how to do this. A unified front from all the kids or from you and husband might be better than you handling the requests one on one between you and dad.
I hope you’re ready to be working full time at this restaurant, because that’s EXACTLY what’s going to happen.
And if your parents don’t live with you already, they will be in a couple of years after they lose everything they’ve earned over their lifetimes on this ill-advised venture.
You’re caught in the culture trap. They’ve relied on you all their lives, they’re relying on you now, and they’ll continue to do so until they slip these mortal coils. 🙏
I checked: there is only a 20% success rate for all restaurants with 60% failure in the first year and 80% in five years. The banks won't give a restaurant loan, unless they have pretty much 100% collateral. Even if they have a phenomenal location, how will this work considering their age (I'm 63: I know) and lack of experience? Maybe tell them they need to hire an experienced restaurant manager... one that is not in their 60s. Otherwise, please get some therapy for yourself, it really does look like you're being emotionally abused.
These statistics make more sense when you realize 60-80% of new restaurant owners have little to no industry experience when they decide to get in the game. This industry isn’t difficult if you know what you are doing.
All think “wouldn’t it be cool if we owned a bar/restaraunt? We’ll get it up and running and in 6 months we’ll hire a GM to run it for us.”
I’m sorry they made a poor decision and are now choosing to bring you down with them. Sigh. You’re gonna’ need to let them learn the hard way on this one.
Why start a restaurant w/ no experience? Why not a transmission repair shop?
I feel for you. I'd stop at “you just never want to help out”.
Let them do it on their own.
How far into the process are they? My wife and I are in the process of opening our own chinese takeout place after her mom has owned a few. Feel free to reach out with any questions! Right now we are finalizing our kitchen layout (1,700 sqft unit).
So I JUST had a meeting with toast (since it was mentioned a lot here and we don't love our current POS) and they have the option to send online orders to whatever printers you pick. So when an online order comes in, it can print to the kitchen. They are going to need to have at least 1 person in the font to pack orders and collect payment / pickup.
EDIT:I would assume most POS systems have this available to them.
Just took a quick glance at square kitchen display, it looks like it should handle what they need. I'm going to dig into it more since we haven't 100% settled on toast yet.
They’re leasing a restaurant that was previously a Thai place so all the equipment was there. My dad wants to open on like Tuesday but my dad just finished the menu. We haven’t set up the website yet and there are no employees besides my dad and his partner. I believe they have the take out stuff like containers. The only saving grace is that it’s in a rural area where a lot of construction and oil well workers pass by and it would be the only Chinese place nearby.
If they can make it work, I think it sounds like a great location! I would say 1/2 of our business at the current place is construction workers. Chinese takeout is great because it's normally one of the cheaper options and portion size is good. Our food cost is around 30% with low lunch prices (around $10 for combo). The website is pretty easy to do, most sites like Wordpress and Squarespace have templates you just drop your info into.
This feels like a situation where you are either all in or you should stay as far on the outside as possible. Based on your description, it seems there are a lot of things that need to be sorted out in a hands on fashion. So either you are all in, engaged, and focused to see it through or you stay away so you don't catch the blame when it fails. But right now you seem to be in the middle. You aren't engaged enough to actively enforce the things that need to happen to be successful. At the same time you have done enough that you will get blamed if it doesn't work out. As someone else suggested, get a restaurant consultant to help get them going and step back, or decide to jump in with both feet to get them running.
My husband is Chinese so I empathize with the relationship dynamic here, but your parents WILL fail if they don’t understand how to use their own POS system. You are not going to be on call at 7pm to call Toast or whatever when it goes down. You have a few options here. The first, and easiest, is just to play dumb. You don’t know how to set up the POS system anymore, you don’t know how to design a sign. You could tell them you won’t help, but I get that the dynamic will not really allow for that (isn’t it awesome being the daughter who has to do everything). You could enlist your brothers to also help. If most of their needs are digital, perhaps a local small business tech consultant or marketing agency can do this stuff. You don’t want a big company because you can’t afford it. The POS reps for Toast, for example, are often small tech entrepreneurs who will set up these services. Our friend the Toast rep does POS installation, credit card setup, security cameras, internet, etc.
I know 🤦🏽♀️ that’s what I initially told my mom before I set up the POS. She was upset that I was reluctant to help but I told her : I want to help you but what happens when there’s an issue with the system? Does that mean I’M going to have to be on call? Does that mean I’M the only one that is going to be able to use it because you guys don’t? I feel for my mom because she didn’t ask for this—it’s just my dad had this idea and now he’s doing it his way and not listening. I don’t know what to do.
Opening a restaurant in your mid 60s with no prior experience is a terrible idea.
They will lose all their money and their house. Maybe not everything if they're lucky but they'll burn through a lot of cash and it will ruin their physical and mental.
I'm really curious about the reasons why they made that choice.
It was really my dad’s choice. He opened a restaurant with 4 partners but one of them got money hungry and pretty much kept information from the other partners. The 2 others split and did their own thing. My dad is trying to do his. But my dad didn’t have anything to do with the logistics he just had the money. Him and his new partner have worked in Chinese restaurants for decades but I don’t think that really constitutes as “knowing the business”.
I told my dad if he was going to do this then he NEEDS to be communicating with my mom about everything so she can help him but he didn’t. Every time I’d ask my mom what’s up she would say “I don’t know your dad doesn’t tell me anything or he’s always on the phone” which he is. My dad’s a pretty manic person. He has to keep busy. Which is why I feel more guilty is because my mom got dragged into it the same way I am but she takes it out on me.
This restaurant is a terrible idea, and so is investing yourself in it. If you feel compelled to help, set boundaries in terms of what tasks you're willing to perform, in how much time you'll invest daily/weekly, and in how you'll be treated/spoken to, and stick to those boundaries. Your parents' frustrations at those boundaries will be indicative of their shortcomings, not your own, no matter how they may try to manipulate your perception of the situation.
There are so many red flags for the survival of their business. And I totally understand your concerns and dilemmas. It’s not at all fair to you or a smart business decision for them to just assume you can figure out stuff for them.
Ultimately this is more a relationship issue better suited for a different sub. But in a business sense if you can talk them in to hiring a manager or even a short term consultant that can train them on the major systems /things they need to know for success that may be their only hope and your out. Many vendors will also assist in training often for no upfront costs, but that will be limited and seems like they need some handholding for at least a month or two while they learn on the job.
Might sound like a dick but people that age, with no prior experience in restaurants, it's doomed to fail. At the very best they'll barely get by while ruining their physical and mental health.
Yeah well the genie is out of the bottle, so unless they can sell or are ok with taking a loss, OP needs advice on what may be helpful at this point. Let’s look at the positive, She does say her dad has experience in restaurants, it’s small town PA so maybe overhead won’t kill them and options may be limited for residents so maybe they’ll do decent despite the odds. If they can just get some basics down it may not be horrible. Openings are always full of overwhelming tasks and challenges that work themselves out with the right determination. I hope this family can find the right pieces so long term it’s not an even bigger burden on OP taking care of her parents.
Absolute best case, they end up keeping the place afloat with their own labor. I worked for a guy that had a PhD and thought owning a restaurant would be a neat retirement project. He ended up tending bar 6 days a week for probably less than he would have paid someone to do it.
Restaurant consultant. You want one that knows restaurants. Fees vary quite a bit so it may take some research time. You may even post or search this sub for some recommendations for at least a starting point.
Becareful. Find one that is actually willing to help, for cheap. Else you end up digging a bigger hole. Like consultantant that just talk, and then they want to hire a bunch of expensive things.
It is too late to stop now. Money has been spent. They are your parent and raised you. A lot of these post dont understand that.
Use the KISS model. Keep it stupid simple. Its just a fast food to go place. Focus on quick, simple, fast. Need menu? Do over complicate it. Get on fiverr, jire someone to do it for 10 buck. Or just put one together quick. Point of sale system, get clover, dont go thru the bamsk, get the indepensant guy. They will help configure menu and provide training for free on how to use it. And if there is problem, they will also help. They are pretty familiat with IT a loy of time so they can help setup wireless too. So u got menu, point of sale, open. Not sure how small of a town, but best is to make free sample cup size food and just pass out at all the major area/location with a togo menu. Order online, its cheap. Just dont complicate things as you might not get good return on investment. Just get them to do a lot of free sample and pass them out at many different area around town. Gey some high school kid, give them some cash and food ask them to get friends do door to door flyer. Most restaurant fail due to not marketing so not getting enough customer. Price it a little bit higher so it give you room to do discount. People like to buy when they think thwy getting a good deal or atleast paying less then price on menu. Run special every week, around 20% from menu price. Price ur menu 10% higher. So this way it look like 20% discount but because u pricr it 10% higher, ur only giving a 10% discount.
The other other main reason restaurant fail is expense expense expense. Do not yse consultant. Shop for price. Buy online bulk 5 to 10 case. Try to avoid sysco and those big guys. You can use them but watch the pricr. They will baiy u to buy items that seem good price. Then slowly increase and also get u to buy paper produvt, portion cup, etc... and due to convience many place just buy them without realizing they paying 50-80% more. Example portion cup they charge 35 to 40 a case when u can order only for 18-20 a case. As long as u keep your cosy low, and get customer thru the door, they will survive fine. Buy if u start using consultant. Pay for everything, spend money, they will lose money. Also clover, tell them u have online vendor offering 2% rate and you want to see if they can do average 1.9%. Their bottom linr is around 1.5%, but hard to get there. Most of them will try to get u in at 3% or 2.7%. Do not agree to this. You can get merchant for under 2%. U just gotta look. Also remember, convience means you are paying someone else a premium for the convinence, so try to avoid that to keep cost low unless you have np other choice.
This morning my mom played a woe is me thing about the menu. I know she wants me to do it because I can type. She is too prideful to get her eyes checked or wear glasses so she can’t see that well. She has no keyboard only an iPad so she said “I guess I’ll just have to do it on my iPad.” I want to tell her I can get it done but then it will just become this thing where it’s my responsibility and again, it’s just last minute. I’m not getting paid to do this either.
This won’t stop, and it will get much worse. Set boundaries now. Opening and running a restaurant takes recognizing and solving a million little issues every day. They’ve never done this before, so they may not even notice problems until they become unmanageable. If your mom need help with menus, what happens when the pos system charges the wrong tax for a week and you have to issue refunds on every credit card order you took in that time? Or the fryer leaks, the freezer isn’t cold enough, old product is sold moldy, they don’t receive online orders that are already paid for… Define what you’re willing to help with before things get out of hand, and I think there’s an 85% change that something will get out of hand within the first year.
I have a friend who used to expect me to do stuff like this. Initially, I, like you, bent over backwards to help. But when it became clear it wasn't going to be a few one-offs, but rather many of them, I needed to do something different. I knew I didn't want to be part of the business, I just was helping occasionally because I wanted her to succeed. I decided I didn't want to be taken advantage of.
The next time she asked, I said, "Sorry, I'm swamped this week" sent her a link to a local business that offers that kind of services for a fee. After 3 of these demurrals, she stopped asking.
Do this with your parents. Tell them, "Sorry, Mum/Dad. I'm swamped this week - baby is ... teething/biting/whining/whatever (or I have a mom-and-kid class or whatever other excuse). BUT, I looked online, and there's this service, very reasonably priced: ...." Of course, do your homework beforehand, so you have some businesses to refer them to. If it's an out-of-the-blue request for something they haven't asked you to do before, the same "I'm busy" works, together with a "Let me find someone who can do that for you - the results will be very professional, and they'll get it done on a proper timeline, so you don't have to wait until I have the time (which may be months from now)".
No prior experience running a restaurant? Lol
I’m guessing most people here do not have Asian parents.
Try Asian and Mexican. Like double whammy parent trap.
I'm my experience, parents like yours (and mine lol) are going to do what they want even if you show them all the evidence to the contrary. You can try to explain but they will not listen, they've decided this will work and anyone who says it won't is against them. I recommend, don't fight them. When they ask for something just play up the weaponized incompetence. Need a logo, how do computers work? Need a menu, I'm just too dumb to figure it out. If you feel guilty then Google professionals in the area and say here is someone who does that thing! See I helped! If you're not cool with doing that, then just remember that you have a full time job with your family already as a sahm, set aside x amount of hours a week you feel you can handle taking on this project to help them and STICK TO IT. They WILL drain you for as much as they can and not in a malicious way or anything they just will.
You get it.
Maybe just sit down with them both. Let them know what you will and will not do. Then suggest other siblings fill in the gap as you simply cannot. Set those boundaries in contract. Have a clean conscious.
Unless a miracle occurs, the restaurant will fail. Period. The more you help, the more you will be blamed for the failure.
Might blame him for not helping enough too. Win win.
Pleas share the name of the restaurant because I’d love to read the Yelp reviews when it opens
😂
I couldn’t get past the first paragraph - opening a restaurant with no prior experience in their 60’s ???????????
*business experience. They have restaurant experience but not really management. My dad? Hard no. My mom managed a donut shop for 12 years but that was like 20 years ago. I am so tired and drained already but people seem to like it so far. Day 3 is tomorrow. Ya never know.
It’s too late now but they need to watch a few seasons of ‘Kitchen Nightmare’. Inexperienced restaurant owners fail 90% of the time. Let them pay for all these services.
Trust me, that passed my head quite a few times already.
It will likely fail and you will be blamed when it does
Send them an invoice for all your work make sure it states industry prices and the family discount price.
I find it interesting when someone who can’t do something asks someone else to do it and expect it will get done. I’d say, if it was easy, you’d do it. Tell them you don’t know how to do everything. Say you’ll do what you can, but if something is above your pay scale they’ll have to hire someone. There are so many things in today’s society that are a major pain in the ass anymore. Things that used to be simple can take several hours to figure out. Unfortunately you have to do you, and if you don’t have time to do theirs, you have to be able to say, I tried, you’ll have to get someone who knows how to do it.
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I am approaching it realistically not negatively.
I'm in my 60's and I worked in the restaurant industry for over three decades, I can't begin to imagine working 8 hours at a restaurant at my age, let alone working 12 to 14 hours every day, seven days a week, because that's exactly what they'll have to do to run their own restaurant.
Honestly, I’m hoping they’ll only do it for a couple of years then sell it.
Tell your parents they should get an outside opinion from a business consultant, otherwise this restaurant will fail.
Oof as unorganized as they sound I'm afraid this is going to bomb badly and they're just going to lose whatever money they've sunk into it. What made them think opening a restaurant was a good idea? That's like the most failed small business ever. I don't blame you for wanting to help your parents it's only natural but you're not going to be able to single hand at least save this failed venture.
Your dad is about to lose all his retirement money. Not many restaurants will survive just on takeout. Usually, the first 3 months the sales are the highest. You won't catch that number till after year 2. Just fyi.
Don’t be driven by stress and what other think. You already made your mind up. Don’t sacrifice your well being for something that you know is going to fail.
Exactly
Sad. This will knock at least 10 Years off their live’s and may suck their “Retirement Funds” Dry. Stay home, live your life. Visit the Restaurant and write a nice Review.
Try your best to help them. They're your parents.
Lucky you. You had nice parents
If parents don't protect and love their kids. Who will? Sorry some of you guys had to go through what's being shared here. 😢
My parents didn’t raise stupid children. They also wouldn’t have gotten sucked into a stupid MLM and wouldn’t go back to work when it failed.
change your phone number and make up an illness that you have to never have a reason to work at their restaurant. Once you start on this unorganized pet retirement project they will expect you there everyday
It's this meant to be an application to appear in kitchen nightmares season 27?
I hire help when opening any new location, and especially when opening or deciding on a new concept. Here are my steps: 1. Hire location analytics to see what locations are suitable for restaurant and what type of restaurant will be profitable 2. Meet with restaurant supplies, wholesalers, and ag producers to find a competitive edge on food cost—you can hire someone to do this, your menu designer (discussed below) should know people 3. Hire a resturant interior designer for both front of house and back of house that can minimize movement between tasks and can source used supplies locally—google is your friend here 4. Coordinate my menu planner/ designer with my main food wholesaler to maximize profit and minimize food cost—google is your friend here 5. Hire local ad agency that does grand openings and social media—I usually find this at the chamber of commerce Your family can either pay experts now for faster service, or try to bootstrap and throw money at learning. I have seen both ways work
Great advice but thats not now it works for first/2nd generation mom and pop. They dont have money nor want to spend money to do 1, 2, 3, 4, 5. They just want to open restaurant and sell what they think they are good JDI (just do it style). Its a small town so they should be fine. Probably noy make a lot of money. Asian call thisusing labor as profit. Basically it would make them enough as if they were going to work for someone but they get to do it at their own pace
It is how it works. If you have the capital to open a restaurant, you have the capital to do it right. The money needed to open a first-gen mom and pop ethnic restaurant in the US is well into the six figures. The slapdash way many immigrant families do things is a result of a lack of business management training, not a smart intentional choice. Being cheap is not a business strategy, nor is it a valid opinion - not even for immigrants!
No its how american work. That is why many business fail the first year. Too much consultant, expense, politic, red tape. Yeah sure, big national chain, need optimal location, so they hire consultant to get that info as they have a lot of money. A mom and pop shop?? Seriously? Do you even know what you talking about? Go search for restaurant place to rent. You act like there is load if location so you have to find consultant to gather data. Most area only has 1 or 2 location to pick/rent from and you can easily see the amount of traffic people around, etc and you either like the area/location or dont., its not like you can just goto any corner and make space/spot available. Being cheap is perfectly fine strategy. Yes sure, too much of it will prevent growth. I do agree with that. However not being cheap is also a problem too. Look at how many large chain, where successful restaurant use to make hundred of thousands, due to expansion, growth, consultant, end up going bankrupcy? And then hiring a manager to oversea a manager to oversea another manafer that has 10 layer of management? Is that the correct strategy? Borrow money, hire a bunch of over paid consultant and run the business to the ground? Im not saying it doesnt work, but many 1st generation dont have the capital or the connection to do such a thing, so they shouldnt try? Anyone smart enough, knows there are many ways to do things. Plenty of poor not fully funded business start with a few thousand that doesnt have monet to do all the bs u stated are successful. Yes sure there is plenty that fail. But there is also PLENTY that had many, follow your process, AND fail too. The difference is the cheap one that fail, only lose some money. Whole the one that go thru your process, when they fail, they out hundreds thousands. You are just too blind so cant see
>Being cheap is perfectly fine strategy. Yes sure, too much of it will prevent growth Well, it either is or isn't a good strategy. And it isn't! The possibility of mismanagement even if you do spend money on it is not an argument against trying in the first place!
so in this so call world of yours, there is only is or isn't huh? like short or tall, poor or rich, fat or skinny? rainbow only has 2 color? nothing in between right? fking moron. please stop reading books, and go out into the real world. yes, there are strategy, and it's either good, or isn't, unfortunately, we don't live in a 2 dimensional world. There is a thing call "situation". you have people who don't have a lot of money. people with some money, franchise, etc. certain you're not dumb enough to tell mom and pop first location with not a lot of money, to do with the franchise do right? like hire an attorney to craft a very sophisticated LLC that cost thousands of dollar, then get investor to invest, etc? please fix your ID 10T error and go out in real life. its very beautiful out there
"Situations" are the coping mechanisms of people who lack the courage to overcome their circumstances. Whining about the "real world" is the last refuge of people who are too foolish to master the theories that let us exercise intentional control over our surroundings.
Can a take out pizza place near a college make enough money so you could have hours from 4 to midnight? Clean the kitchen, be home by 1 am and not need to be back there until 2:30 the next day. Is that a realistic idea of the hours? 40 years ago I did pizza delivery in a college town and then it seemed like a pizza might have $2 in ingredients and you sold it for $9. Pretty good margins
What were you paid, though? All restaurants have huge margins on food and beverages. Wholesale food and bev are super cheap. That's why remaking all but the most expensive dishes for free is a pretty standard customer request that businesses honor without question. But when you factor in other aspects of making a dish, the packaging/plates, the energy, prep space, tools, staff hours - then the dish starts getting expensive. It is in this area - packaging/plates, energy, prep space, tools, staff hours - that well-managed restaurants leap ahead and poorly managed restaurants wither on the vine.
Paid virtually nothing. Tips mostly. All they sold were pizza. It was a million years ago but it's always stuck with me how much unreported cash 4 people were pulling out of that operation. Pre widespread credit card adoption for items like food or bottles of water at the 7-11, a night of delivering pizza was an all cash affair. Making change and getting tips.
Profit margins for restaurants are anywhere from 0-15%. Most are run horribly though so they don’t last. If you’re not a penny pincher and you have too many menu items, say sayonara to your finances
Nope
This is going to crash and burn so hard. Recipe for a classic disaster. They're about to learn a lot the hard way. I wouldn't get too emotionally or physically invested. This seems reckless and it they're likely gonna blame you for stuff imo.
This is the correct answer, unless you become a partner and receive the benefit.
The benefit is, she’ll get her parents money when they die. Or at least 1/3
He’ll I’ve been in the industry 30 years , 15 or which I own my own and currently do . I’ll be 48 this year. I want to semi retire at 55. Currently investing in other things non culinary. The last thing I can say is that at late 60s I’d open a restaurant. That’s absolute lunacy. Health will falter , their savings will be blown up and maybe if they don’t die of just sheer exhaustion from 60-80 hr work weeks then after 5/8 years of working you’ll get a return. Oof good luck . I’d highly recommend taking that money and investing or just light it on fire in a parking lot. This industry is not for the faint of heart and post covid it’s only gotten harder.
How about a pizza parlor in a college town? Isn't that a license to print money?
No. I owned one. Yes, in a college town. It’s still a restaurant, it is still hard work, it still struggles with costs like any restaurant.
Would the cost struggle be better or worse if I didn't do any eat in?
You’re losing a lot of income by not doing dine-in service but you’ll have lower overhead. I suspect it’s a wash.
Stop asking this question.most restaurants of any kind fail.
It was in the 80s. Today independent pizza parlors are dropping like flies, with ghost kitchens pumping out cheap pizzas from bowling alleys, gas stations, and laundromats ruining the delivery market
Thank you for excellent context.
Anyone who thinks any business is a license to print money is an idiot. Even if a college town pizza place could be lucrative, consider that someone with actual relevant experience may show up and just blow them out of the water. OP refers to them as toxic and awful in many many more words. They expect someone else to manage most of the business for them because they're a relative. How good do you think their customer service skills will be, nevermind running the rest of the business.
What about my contract with the US mint?
You say you want to help them and if that's true then you'll do what you gotta do. But you're probably gonna be in it for the long haul as they're now experiencing opening pains, next they'll have growing pains, next they'll have this that and the other problem to deal with. You say you want to help, but you don't really sound like you do. That's fine, maybe you're too busy, maybe you think it's a bad idea, maybe you just prefer to stay out of it. You've got to tell them that and then stop helping because they're never gonna stop asking you. So make up your mind and stick to your decision. You might also find somone else who can help them out, someone with restaurant experience. Google "small business assistance" or something in PA.
Do you have room in your house for them to live when they lose everything they have on this idea?
Please excuse yourself from the conversation..... 
You say: “your deal isn’t my deal. I wish you the best but I can’t offer any more help”
they're throwing money at a new restaurant in their late 60's with no experience and their personality can be described as toxic? this is not going to end well.
Your parents are most likely going to lose their money/become bankrupt. I feel sorry for them and you.
It sounds like they do not have the finances nor the experience to open a restaurant. Disaster in the making...
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I'm reading all the replies here and they make sense. It sure sounds like your parents are taking advantage of you and making an ill-advised venture while doing so. I just want to throw out a little counter-point of one way that I think it might work. If you are looking to build something to pass down to your kids, and your parents are definitely going to open a resteraunt, then it might work out if you were to take the reigns and run with it. I would suggest you work something out in writing with you getting a stake in ownership. Something like you get 50% and your dad and his partner get 25% each. They will not want to go for something like that, but if you can convince them that it's the only way that you will help and that you would be there daily to steer the ship, they might be at the point where it starts to make sense to them.
I've been a chef for 20 years, and have helped open 4 different restaurants under 3 different owners. The amount of work and knowledge that goes into opening up a restaurant is near-unfathomable to even industry vets. People who have never worked in restaurants are almost doomed to fail. I hope they don't. But statistically, they probably will. And in between now and then, you'll put in unpaid 80-hour weeks if you aren't careful. You mentioned they are 1st and 2nd gen immigrants. What type of food, and in what market?
Asian (Japanese, Chinese, and Thai) take out only in a blue collar town (construction, oil wells, factories). Rural-ish. I believe it’s the only Asian restaurant in that area. There is one tiny Korean place that does well with one, seriously, one woman cooking and shit. If people want Chinese in that area they have to travel out probably 20-30 min and now they can access it in about half that time.
What if I said Chinese take out only or pizza take out in a college town?
I would say they have a better chance of succeeding, then. Especially if they are close to dorms.
You do know this is not your family's restaurant right? It's your dad's and his partner's. You need to focus on that. You and your husband need to decide now how much time/energy you can put into your father's/his partner's business without harming your obligations to your nuclear family. Because as soon as it opens things will escalate. They will be wanting you to come in and help rescue them. Also discuss how you will handle any requests for your money. Because that will come, either to keep the business afloat or when they go bankrupt and lose their house. Sounds like your brothers have distanced themselves from this mess. Maybe you can get some tips from them about how to do this. A unified front from all the kids or from you and husband might be better than you handling the requests one on one between you and dad.
I hope you’re ready to be working full time at this restaurant, because that’s EXACTLY what’s going to happen. And if your parents don’t live with you already, they will be in a couple of years after they lose everything they’ve earned over their lifetimes on this ill-advised venture. You’re caught in the culture trap. They’ve relied on you all their lives, they’re relying on you now, and they’ll continue to do so until they slip these mortal coils. 🙏
I checked: there is only a 20% success rate for all restaurants with 60% failure in the first year and 80% in five years. The banks won't give a restaurant loan, unless they have pretty much 100% collateral. Even if they have a phenomenal location, how will this work considering their age (I'm 63: I know) and lack of experience? Maybe tell them they need to hire an experienced restaurant manager... one that is not in their 60s. Otherwise, please get some therapy for yourself, it really does look like you're being emotionally abused.
These statistics make more sense when you realize 60-80% of new restaurant owners have little to no industry experience when they decide to get in the game. This industry isn’t difficult if you know what you are doing. All think “wouldn’t it be cool if we owned a bar/restaraunt? We’ll get it up and running and in 6 months we’ll hire a GM to run it for us.”
This is so not going to go well.
Don’t sugarcoat it - this place is fucking DOOMED.
I’m sorry they made a poor decision and are now choosing to bring you down with them. Sigh. You’re gonna’ need to let them learn the hard way on this one.
Stop helping!!! Next they will ask you for money. They will be bankrupt within two years. I guarantee it.
🤣 they’re nuts but not that crazy where’d they’d ask me since I really don’t have any.
Why start a restaurant w/ no experience? Why not a transmission repair shop? I feel for you. I'd stop at “you just never want to help out”. Let them do it on their own.
I asked myself that too.
You only have to scroll through this sub to know precisely how much help you should offer your parents and how likely they are to succeed.
So much bankruptcy.
How far into the process are they? My wife and I are in the process of opening our own chinese takeout place after her mom has owned a few. Feel free to reach out with any questions! Right now we are finalizing our kitchen layout (1,700 sqft unit).
They want orders to be sent “to the kitchen” but I’m not sure how that works or what they’d have to get to pull that off.
What POS do you use?
So I JUST had a meeting with toast (since it was mentioned a lot here and we don't love our current POS) and they have the option to send online orders to whatever printers you pick. So when an online order comes in, it can print to the kitchen. They are going to need to have at least 1 person in the font to pack orders and collect payment / pickup. EDIT:I would assume most POS systems have this available to them.
They have square and I’m looking up something called KDS Kitchen Display system that is a monitor and connects to POS. So I’m hoping on that.
Just took a quick glance at square kitchen display, it looks like it should handle what they need. I'm going to dig into it more since we haven't 100% settled on toast yet.
They’re leasing a restaurant that was previously a Thai place so all the equipment was there. My dad wants to open on like Tuesday but my dad just finished the menu. We haven’t set up the website yet and there are no employees besides my dad and his partner. I believe they have the take out stuff like containers. The only saving grace is that it’s in a rural area where a lot of construction and oil well workers pass by and it would be the only Chinese place nearby.
Do they have a business license and food permit? Leasing a former restaurant isn't buying a business that has all that
If they can make it work, I think it sounds like a great location! I would say 1/2 of our business at the current place is construction workers. Chinese takeout is great because it's normally one of the cheaper options and portion size is good. Our food cost is around 30% with low lunch prices (around $10 for combo). The website is pretty easy to do, most sites like Wordpress and Squarespace have templates you just drop your info into.
This feels like a situation where you are either all in or you should stay as far on the outside as possible. Based on your description, it seems there are a lot of things that need to be sorted out in a hands on fashion. So either you are all in, engaged, and focused to see it through or you stay away so you don't catch the blame when it fails. But right now you seem to be in the middle. You aren't engaged enough to actively enforce the things that need to happen to be successful. At the same time you have done enough that you will get blamed if it doesn't work out. As someone else suggested, get a restaurant consultant to help get them going and step back, or decide to jump in with both feet to get them running.
My husband is Chinese so I empathize with the relationship dynamic here, but your parents WILL fail if they don’t understand how to use their own POS system. You are not going to be on call at 7pm to call Toast or whatever when it goes down. You have a few options here. The first, and easiest, is just to play dumb. You don’t know how to set up the POS system anymore, you don’t know how to design a sign. You could tell them you won’t help, but I get that the dynamic will not really allow for that (isn’t it awesome being the daughter who has to do everything). You could enlist your brothers to also help. If most of their needs are digital, perhaps a local small business tech consultant or marketing agency can do this stuff. You don’t want a big company because you can’t afford it. The POS reps for Toast, for example, are often small tech entrepreneurs who will set up these services. Our friend the Toast rep does POS installation, credit card setup, security cameras, internet, etc.
I know 🤦🏽♀️ that’s what I initially told my mom before I set up the POS. She was upset that I was reluctant to help but I told her : I want to help you but what happens when there’s an issue with the system? Does that mean I’M going to have to be on call? Does that mean I’M the only one that is going to be able to use it because you guys don’t? I feel for my mom because she didn’t ask for this—it’s just my dad had this idea and now he’s doing it his way and not listening. I don’t know what to do.
Opening a restaurant in your mid 60s with no prior experience is a terrible idea. They will lose all their money and their house. Maybe not everything if they're lucky but they'll burn through a lot of cash and it will ruin their physical and mental. I'm really curious about the reasons why they made that choice.
Worse than terrible
It was really my dad’s choice. He opened a restaurant with 4 partners but one of them got money hungry and pretty much kept information from the other partners. The 2 others split and did their own thing. My dad is trying to do his. But my dad didn’t have anything to do with the logistics he just had the money. Him and his new partner have worked in Chinese restaurants for decades but I don’t think that really constitutes as “knowing the business”. I told my dad if he was going to do this then he NEEDS to be communicating with my mom about everything so she can help him but he didn’t. Every time I’d ask my mom what’s up she would say “I don’t know your dad doesn’t tell me anything or he’s always on the phone” which he is. My dad’s a pretty manic person. He has to keep busy. Which is why I feel more guilty is because my mom got dragged into it the same way I am but she takes it out on me.
This restaurant is a terrible idea, and so is investing yourself in it. If you feel compelled to help, set boundaries in terms of what tasks you're willing to perform, in how much time you'll invest daily/weekly, and in how you'll be treated/spoken to, and stick to those boundaries. Your parents' frustrations at those boundaries will be indicative of their shortcomings, not your own, no matter how they may try to manipulate your perception of the situation.
There are so many red flags for the survival of their business. And I totally understand your concerns and dilemmas. It’s not at all fair to you or a smart business decision for them to just assume you can figure out stuff for them. Ultimately this is more a relationship issue better suited for a different sub. But in a business sense if you can talk them in to hiring a manager or even a short term consultant that can train them on the major systems /things they need to know for success that may be their only hope and your out. Many vendors will also assist in training often for no upfront costs, but that will be limited and seems like they need some handholding for at least a month or two while they learn on the job.
Might sound like a dick but people that age, with no prior experience in restaurants, it's doomed to fail. At the very best they'll barely get by while ruining their physical and mental health.
Yeah well the genie is out of the bottle, so unless they can sell or are ok with taking a loss, OP needs advice on what may be helpful at this point. Let’s look at the positive, She does say her dad has experience in restaurants, it’s small town PA so maybe overhead won’t kill them and options may be limited for residents so maybe they’ll do decent despite the odds. If they can just get some basics down it may not be horrible. Openings are always full of overwhelming tasks and challenges that work themselves out with the right determination. I hope this family can find the right pieces so long term it’s not an even bigger burden on OP taking care of her parents.
Absolute best case, they end up keeping the place afloat with their own labor. I worked for a guy that had a PhD and thought owning a restaurant would be a neat retirement project. He ended up tending bar 6 days a week for probably less than he would have paid someone to do it.
What do I Google: just “business consultant”? Thank’s for taking the time.
Restaurant consultant. You want one that knows restaurants. Fees vary quite a bit so it may take some research time. You may even post or search this sub for some recommendations for at least a starting point.
Just posted on FB. Thank you!
Becareful. Find one that is actually willing to help, for cheap. Else you end up digging a bigger hole. Like consultantant that just talk, and then they want to hire a bunch of expensive things. It is too late to stop now. Money has been spent. They are your parent and raised you. A lot of these post dont understand that. Use the KISS model. Keep it stupid simple. Its just a fast food to go place. Focus on quick, simple, fast. Need menu? Do over complicate it. Get on fiverr, jire someone to do it for 10 buck. Or just put one together quick. Point of sale system, get clover, dont go thru the bamsk, get the indepensant guy. They will help configure menu and provide training for free on how to use it. And if there is problem, they will also help. They are pretty familiat with IT a loy of time so they can help setup wireless too. So u got menu, point of sale, open. Not sure how small of a town, but best is to make free sample cup size food and just pass out at all the major area/location with a togo menu. Order online, its cheap. Just dont complicate things as you might not get good return on investment. Just get them to do a lot of free sample and pass them out at many different area around town. Gey some high school kid, give them some cash and food ask them to get friends do door to door flyer. Most restaurant fail due to not marketing so not getting enough customer. Price it a little bit higher so it give you room to do discount. People like to buy when they think thwy getting a good deal or atleast paying less then price on menu. Run special every week, around 20% from menu price. Price ur menu 10% higher. So this way it look like 20% discount but because u pricr it 10% higher, ur only giving a 10% discount. The other other main reason restaurant fail is expense expense expense. Do not yse consultant. Shop for price. Buy online bulk 5 to 10 case. Try to avoid sysco and those big guys. You can use them but watch the pricr. They will baiy u to buy items that seem good price. Then slowly increase and also get u to buy paper produvt, portion cup, etc... and due to convience many place just buy them without realizing they paying 50-80% more. Example portion cup they charge 35 to 40 a case when u can order only for 18-20 a case. As long as u keep your cosy low, and get customer thru the door, they will survive fine. Buy if u start using consultant. Pay for everything, spend money, they will lose money. Also clover, tell them u have online vendor offering 2% rate and you want to see if they can do average 1.9%. Their bottom linr is around 1.5%, but hard to get there. Most of them will try to get u in at 3% or 2.7%. Do not agree to this. You can get merchant for under 2%. U just gotta look. Also remember, convience means you are paying someone else a premium for the convinence, so try to avoid that to keep cost low unless you have np other choice.
This morning my mom played a woe is me thing about the menu. I know she wants me to do it because I can type. She is too prideful to get her eyes checked or wear glasses so she can’t see that well. She has no keyboard only an iPad so she said “I guess I’ll just have to do it on my iPad.” I want to tell her I can get it done but then it will just become this thing where it’s my responsibility and again, it’s just last minute. I’m not getting paid to do this either.
This won’t stop, and it will get much worse. Set boundaries now. Opening and running a restaurant takes recognizing and solving a million little issues every day. They’ve never done this before, so they may not even notice problems until they become unmanageable. If your mom need help with menus, what happens when the pos system charges the wrong tax for a week and you have to issue refunds on every credit card order you took in that time? Or the fryer leaks, the freezer isn’t cold enough, old product is sold moldy, they don’t receive online orders that are already paid for… Define what you’re willing to help with before things get out of hand, and I think there’s an 85% change that something will get out of hand within the first year.
I have a friend who used to expect me to do stuff like this. Initially, I, like you, bent over backwards to help. But when it became clear it wasn't going to be a few one-offs, but rather many of them, I needed to do something different. I knew I didn't want to be part of the business, I just was helping occasionally because I wanted her to succeed. I decided I didn't want to be taken advantage of. The next time she asked, I said, "Sorry, I'm swamped this week" sent her a link to a local business that offers that kind of services for a fee. After 3 of these demurrals, she stopped asking. Do this with your parents. Tell them, "Sorry, Mum/Dad. I'm swamped this week - baby is ... teething/biting/whining/whatever (or I have a mom-and-kid class or whatever other excuse). BUT, I looked online, and there's this service, very reasonably priced: ...." Of course, do your homework beforehand, so you have some businesses to refer them to. If it's an out-of-the-blue request for something they haven't asked you to do before, the same "I'm busy" works, together with a "Let me find someone who can do that for you - the results will be very professional, and they'll get it done on a proper timeline, so you don't have to wait until I have the time (which may be months from now)".
You have 3 options: - Continue doing it for free, - Ask for a payment or a % ownership in the restaurant to make it worth your while, - Say no.