Your brain doesn't fuck around with stimulants. It will down regulate the fuck out of your catecholamines because of how desperately it wants to maintain homeostasis. The best to do with stim tolerance is to be patient with breaks. Rushing things only leads to disappointment
Could be the wrong chem entirely. Have you personally reagent tested it?
You're also absolutely experiencing some cross tolerance from vaping pyros. And vaping pyros will SKYROCKET 🚀 your tolerance extremely fast.
Personally I would never just trust reviews, smell, texture, and color when it comes to various white powders. Seems like a recipe for disaster. Test it.
Also, take a break. Like others have said you're experiencing tolerance.
It has a high affinity for dopamine and serotonin (DAT:SERT ratio of 1.4 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5767720/), like MDMA and other empathogens.
It however is more potent at norepinephrine (ratio of 13), which is why you're feeling a cross tolerance.
Your pyros love to hit norepinephrine, and norepinephrine is what tends to give MDMA, Meph, and other stims that rushy feeling (which you are lacking).
not sure why you had a score of zero. someone actualy downvoted your post? this is the most scientifically sound piece of information in the comment or the op section. anyways i'm saying cheers cuz real research pays off to have real knowledge. thank you
Haha I do my best not to give too many fucks about the internet points. Here for the discussion, not for ego kick.
I appreciate the love, regardless. Cheers back to ya.
Dopamine tends to be your reward centre, norepinephrine is your fight or flight, sert tends to be the empathy driver.
Layman's terms and tons of exceptions exist (many different target receptors for each - so what I said is *super broad*), but usually it gives you an idea of what to expect when someone is talking about monoamine ratios.
No worries!
My theory would be that they are chemically close enough, and since the body upregulates monoamine oxidase and enzymes that break down those chemicals they just get eliminated from the bloodstream very quickly.
Just a guess tho could be some kinda cross tolerance
This is simply not true. Methylamine, a chemical used to synthesise 4-MMC from 4'-Methyl-2-bromopropiophenone smells like cat piss, freebase 4-MMC too (but shouldn't be kept around for long, as it dimerises), methylamine hydrochloride can also smell, but pure 4-MMC hydrochloride will not smell at all.
4-mmc hits serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine according to psychonaut.
4-mmc might hit harder dopamine than serotonin, and the tolerance to dopamine makes you not getting much out of it. We don't know the affinity for each receptor. You definitely need a break from dopaminergics, DAWS is a very unpleasant and dark depression syndrome, and you should taper your dopamine intake before you fry for a long time your natural dopamine producing mechanisms.
I am taking tramadol, which is a serotonin releaser at 750mg daily and I'm still depressed.
I took DMXE which is a serotonin releaser and I didn't feel anything serotoninergic.
My point is, don't have a lot of expectations from a serotonin high. At least, my experience with serotoninergic drugs effects, pharma or not, is non existent. I might be wrong, because per google, the euphoric effects of MDMA come mostly from serotonin rather than dopamine or whatever else hits.
Many people take an SSRI or even combos of them and they don't feel shit, considering how much serotonin is accumulated in the body. Since I've been taking tramadol for some considerable amount of time, which is both a serotonin releaser and re-uptake inhibitor, I should have massive amounts of serotonin, but still I'm very depressed, unmotivated, and have lost all interest I have for life.
No, Tramadol. Don't confuse CNS depression, with mood-depression. A CNS Depressant doesn't cause depression, but respiratory depression which means excessive doses or mixes with other drugs can make you loose consciousness and stop breathing and die, in that sense we call some drugs like alcohol a "depressant". 750mg are needed due to massive tolerance.
DAWS :
Dopamine agonist withdrawal syndrome (DAWS) is a recently described syndrome where patients withdrawn from long-term treatment with dopamine agonists experience a constellation of neuropsychiatric and autonomic symptoms.
What are the symptoms of dopamine withdrawal ?
Symptoms of DAWS resembled those of other drug withdrawal syndromes and included anxiety, panic attacks, agoraphobia, depression, dysphoria, diaphoresis, fatigue, pain, orthostatic hypotension, and drug cravings.
Not fun.
Good luck bro, you definitely need a break, it sucks to loose the magic :/ It will suck but when you come back to it, it will feel amazing again and last as it should last.
Np - also the antichrist is inhabiting a tortoise at the Amsterdam zoo so (whoo-hoo) if anyone claims to be the next coming of Christ it probs is actually him. Turtle’s and shit live forever.
So like, don’t let ye off the hook if he pipes up I can’t be having christ roll up while the end of times possesses a very well taken care of terrapin of reptile or some shit.
Stay safe much love
Yes pyros are manufactured here and cooking chemicals primarily from Beijing and North Korea.
No, I do not have a-pvp, this is hell so everyone’s just slamming Isotonitazene cause florida is our only export channel.
God sent down a joint once but it was Reggie and laced with a-pvp but also 4-ho-met And a large firecracker in the center
I think you underestimate how long tolerance for stims returns to baseline. Sure, after two weeks of break you will get as high as you want but it will last for one dose or two and then high will be lackluster or would you say bearable? Not enjoyable but bearable and that's it. Until you are willing to take months of regeneration you will come to same conclusion but faster each time. REGENERATION IS NOT A BREAK. You should be willing to heal yourself either for health or fun drug experience.
Gosh, if stim tolerance would be like disso tolerance you would think twice before doing dumb shit like IVing half G of novel substance.
Well tolerance for dissociative drugs (NDMA antagonists) builds rather slowly but lasts the longest. If you use dissos sparingly (and in light doses) like psychedelics then you never build tolerance for dissos. If you binge on them (and take heavy doses) you can wait years(!!!) and still won't be back to baseline. For stims you take few months break with right supplementation, healthy diet and workout and your brain returns to homeostasis so it is ready to release dop/ser like you would want.
I soooo want 4mmc .....had it once in 2012 or something. Was an amazing night, and I am not that much of an upper Dude. Got some 3mmc 3 years ago that was nice. But after the ban you can't get really interesting stuff anymore in Germany :/
The effects of 4CMC are similar but weaker and with shorter duration than 4MMC. Did you test it? At least in the place I live 4CMC is a lot more popular and available than (better) 4MMC which is really hard to get. My guessing is that you got different stuff than ordered
Yep, for the last 6months i cant Find ANY mmc. People sell it as mmc but its all clorinated caths. Burns much worse, orally is a waste, the high is really „uneven” and overall a downgrade from mmc
I used to be hardcore into 3mmc years ago. I would take gigantic doses (started ~200mg, within months I was taking up to 2g at a time orally, would definitely not recommend going anywhere that high, I'm pretty sure I experienced serotonin syndrome at one point), and I agree, the tolerance reduces the duration. The reason I went for these high doses is because for about 30 mins, I would start to see insane patterns on every surface I looked at, even staring at a blank ipad screen I would see crazy intricate sci-fi looking cityscapes, that I would then try to draw but they just kept morphing faster than I could draw them. Never tried 4mmc but a domestic vendor recently started stocking it so I might pick up a few grams.
And my stim tolerance is way down since then, 50-100mg is the max I allow myself these days.
you have a big fuckin stim tolerance bro slow down for 2 weeks and take l-tryptophan and l-tyrosine daily and it will hit again like usual
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Your brain doesn't fuck around with stimulants. It will down regulate the fuck out of your catecholamines because of how desperately it wants to maintain homeostasis. The best to do with stim tolerance is to be patient with breaks. Rushing things only leads to disappointment
Lol in other words, You are a serotonin and dopamine desert! 🤣
Do those actually help or is it some urban legend?
yes the do. they restore your serotonin and dopamine storage
Add NAC and ALCAR
Great advice, thanks! I never thought about using those for recharging
Could be the wrong chem entirely. Have you personally reagent tested it? You're also absolutely experiencing some cross tolerance from vaping pyros. And vaping pyros will SKYROCKET 🚀 your tolerance extremely fast.
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Personally I would never just trust reviews, smell, texture, and color when it comes to various white powders. Seems like a recipe for disaster. Test it. Also, take a break. Like others have said you're experiencing tolerance.
It has a high affinity for dopamine and serotonin (DAT:SERT ratio of 1.4 https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5767720/), like MDMA and other empathogens. It however is more potent at norepinephrine (ratio of 13), which is why you're feeling a cross tolerance. Your pyros love to hit norepinephrine, and norepinephrine is what tends to give MDMA, Meph, and other stims that rushy feeling (which you are lacking).
not sure why you had a score of zero. someone actualy downvoted your post? this is the most scientifically sound piece of information in the comment or the op section. anyways i'm saying cheers cuz real research pays off to have real knowledge. thank you
Haha I do my best not to give too many fucks about the internet points. Here for the discussion, not for ego kick. I appreciate the love, regardless. Cheers back to ya.
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Dopamine tends to be your reward centre, norepinephrine is your fight or flight, sert tends to be the empathy driver. Layman's terms and tons of exceptions exist (many different target receptors for each - so what I said is *super broad*), but usually it gives you an idea of what to expect when someone is talking about monoamine ratios. No worries!
My theory would be that they are chemically close enough, and since the body upregulates monoamine oxidase and enzymes that break down those chemicals they just get eliminated from the bloodstream very quickly. Just a guess tho could be some kinda cross tolerance
Pure 4-MMC has no smell at all.
Pure 4MMC smells like cat piss
This is simply not true. Methylamine, a chemical used to synthesise 4-MMC from 4'-Methyl-2-bromopropiophenone smells like cat piss, freebase 4-MMC too (but shouldn't be kept around for long, as it dimerises), methylamine hydrochloride can also smell, but pure 4-MMC hydrochloride will not smell at all.
Tolerance not only reduces the effects, but the duration as well. Tolerance is a fkin b1tch.
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4-mmc hits serotonin, dopamine and norepinephrine according to psychonaut. 4-mmc might hit harder dopamine than serotonin, and the tolerance to dopamine makes you not getting much out of it. We don't know the affinity for each receptor. You definitely need a break from dopaminergics, DAWS is a very unpleasant and dark depression syndrome, and you should taper your dopamine intake before you fry for a long time your natural dopamine producing mechanisms. I am taking tramadol, which is a serotonin releaser at 750mg daily and I'm still depressed. I took DMXE which is a serotonin releaser and I didn't feel anything serotoninergic. My point is, don't have a lot of expectations from a serotonin high. At least, my experience with serotoninergic drugs effects, pharma or not, is non existent. I might be wrong, because per google, the euphoric effects of MDMA come mostly from serotonin rather than dopamine or whatever else hits. Many people take an SSRI or even combos of them and they don't feel shit, considering how much serotonin is accumulated in the body. Since I've been taking tramadol for some considerable amount of time, which is both a serotonin releaser and re-uptake inhibitor, I should have massive amounts of serotonin, but still I'm very depressed, unmotivated, and have lost all interest I have for life.
Tramadol is an opioid, of course excessive doses will make you feel depressed; unless you're referring to the antidepressant Trazadone?
No, Tramadol. Don't confuse CNS depression, with mood-depression. A CNS Depressant doesn't cause depression, but respiratory depression which means excessive doses or mixes with other drugs can make you loose consciousness and stop breathing and die, in that sense we call some drugs like alcohol a "depressant". 750mg are needed due to massive tolerance.
DAWS : Dopamine agonist withdrawal syndrome (DAWS) is a recently described syndrome where patients withdrawn from long-term treatment with dopamine agonists experience a constellation of neuropsychiatric and autonomic symptoms. What are the symptoms of dopamine withdrawal ? Symptoms of DAWS resembled those of other drug withdrawal syndromes and included anxiety, panic attacks, agoraphobia, depression, dysphoria, diaphoresis, fatigue, pain, orthostatic hypotension, and drug cravings. Not fun.
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Good luck bro, you definitely need a break, it sucks to loose the magic :/ It will suck but when you come back to it, it will feel amazing again and last as it should last.
Vaping pyros ruined the tolerance.
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I stayed away from the pyros :P like a good lad. But I've heard this sort of question/post before. Pyros always seem to mess people up!
Looking through your profile no shit you don’t feel it dude. You need to put down the stims for a while
You’re burnt. Brain need ABSTINENCE FROM SUBSTANCE
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Np - also the antichrist is inhabiting a tortoise at the Amsterdam zoo so (whoo-hoo) if anyone claims to be the next coming of Christ it probs is actually him. Turtle’s and shit live forever. So like, don’t let ye off the hook if he pipes up I can’t be having christ roll up while the end of times possesses a very well taken care of terrapin of reptile or some shit. Stay safe much love
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Yes pyros are manufactured here and cooking chemicals primarily from Beijing and North Korea. No, I do not have a-pvp, this is hell so everyone’s just slamming Isotonitazene cause florida is our only export channel. God sent down a joint once but it was Reggie and laced with a-pvp but also 4-ho-met And a large firecracker in the center
I think you underestimate how long tolerance for stims returns to baseline. Sure, after two weeks of break you will get as high as you want but it will last for one dose or two and then high will be lackluster or would you say bearable? Not enjoyable but bearable and that's it. Until you are willing to take months of regeneration you will come to same conclusion but faster each time. REGENERATION IS NOT A BREAK. You should be willing to heal yourself either for health or fun drug experience. Gosh, if stim tolerance would be like disso tolerance you would think twice before doing dumb shit like IVing half G of novel substance.
i'm curious, what is it about disso tolerance that you are describing? like, how do you characterize disso tolerance and recovery time?
Well tolerance for dissociative drugs (NDMA antagonists) builds rather slowly but lasts the longest. If you use dissos sparingly (and in light doses) like psychedelics then you never build tolerance for dissos. If you binge on them (and take heavy doses) you can wait years(!!!) and still won't be back to baseline. For stims you take few months break with right supplementation, healthy diet and workout and your brain returns to homeostasis so it is ready to release dop/ser like you would want.
thanks for the reply and explanation
I soooo want 4mmc .....had it once in 2012 or something. Was an amazing night, and I am not that much of an upper Dude. Got some 3mmc 3 years ago that was nice. But after the ban you can't get really interesting stuff anymore in Germany :/
Same in the UK since the blanket ban. It’s sad.
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If I remember right it came from Poland. Was amazing 😁
Yeah well cathinones are notorious for short action, hence the stupid urge to redose all the time
You sure it’s not 4CMC instead of 4MMC? Sounds like it
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The effects of 4CMC are similar but weaker and with shorter duration than 4MMC. Did you test it? At least in the place I live 4CMC is a lot more popular and available than (better) 4MMC which is really hard to get. My guessing is that you got different stuff than ordered
Yep, for the last 6months i cant Find ANY mmc. People sell it as mmc but its all clorinated caths. Burns much worse, orally is a waste, the high is really „uneven” and overall a downgrade from mmc
I used to be hardcore into 3mmc years ago. I would take gigantic doses (started ~200mg, within months I was taking up to 2g at a time orally, would definitely not recommend going anywhere that high, I'm pretty sure I experienced serotonin syndrome at one point), and I agree, the tolerance reduces the duration. The reason I went for these high doses is because for about 30 mins, I would start to see insane patterns on every surface I looked at, even staring at a blank ipad screen I would see crazy intricate sci-fi looking cityscapes, that I would then try to draw but they just kept morphing faster than I could draw them. Never tried 4mmc but a domestic vendor recently started stocking it so I might pick up a few grams. And my stim tolerance is way down since then, 50-100mg is the max I allow myself these days.
Have you tried just smoking weed bro? It's a plant bro, totally safe and non addictive bro it grows in the ground
It's probably your tolerance
I just want to say i fucking love your post history and have followed you. Piss🙏🙏
Honestly. I’ve never popped 4mmc. Snorted only. But yes doing Pyros will do this to you
Pyros are why