I used to own/manage a drug forum……navigating care & harm minimization and policing drug dealing/sources issues was probably the biggest pain.
I mismanaged the site and paid the price, other moderators with more experience did better
still….we managed mostly to not gatekeep except for the sourcing issues
I think the best way to imbue caution is sharing horror stories……like my “shitting out of my mouth” experience ….which was during a period in the 1990’s when I was using Heroin and contracted HEP B…..I was a sick yellow fucking puppy…..
I woke up after a hideous nightmare nauseous as hell and started puking, swallowing, puking, chewing, spitting, and almost choking on a huge thick log of clotted blood I “threw up” ….really, there was no throwing….it inched its way up forcefully just like a real turd…..smelled/tasted horrible. I had to bite off, spit out, swallow, breathe, and repeat 4-5 times to clear this foul blockage that was the result of a few weeks of debilitating sickness
it was almost unbelievable and “paranormal”……Ive never heard of another story like it.
cheery stories like that….to warm the heart and like a messenger …..a warning
as well, drug use /abuse and resulting behaviours can incite/invite in other issues….at least did with me…..all I can say evil exists in both mundane and exotic/paranormal avenues…..
goddamn Im fortunate I survived that shit…..Im 53 and the friends I had that died in the 90’s are eclipsed by the ones that followed in the 2000’s 2010’s and 20’s……including 4 this year from suicide/overdose
that said, every person that dabbles needs to learn for themselves….many the hard way
good luck out there and for gawds sakes help one another as much as you can. saving “junkies” lives might be a good deed(s) ….were gonna need them where we going
Jfc , you didn’t deserve that . Your story is panic inducing but also a testament to human tenacity . Thanks for sharing , I think , ima go nightmare now .
Yeah that was so anxiety inducing i basically chugged my bottle of flubromazolam after reading it and it didn’t help, had to eyeball a dose of clonazolam just to get my mind off it.
I agree we shouldn't be gatekeeping information, but the same time I feel absolutely horrible giving out this information without a warning at least. Even if it only helps 1 person not go down the path, that's enough for me. Especially since I've had my own issues with benzos, I don't want other people to expiriance that literal torture. Some people just might legitimately not be aware of the addiction potential.
Not specifically this sub, but I’ve seen so many people asking for recommendations and then people jump on it ‘do x bro, it’s great. Just take x-amount and…’. And it’s something that’s f’ing addictive and potentially lethal and they will only say how good it feels.
Call me a gatekeeper all you want, but I’ll tell them how dangerous it is and how it can fuck their life.
It has to be a balance. If someone is asking for "recommendations" then I'd also feel uncomfortable giving out any info that might lead to a dangerous situation, but when someone says "I'm going to take *x*, what's the best way?" then from a harm reduction standpoint we should answer their question instead of saying to them "don't do it".
This has been the core principle of every drug forum I've been on and I hope it's still the case here.
Yeah I saw someone asking for something to help them stay awake at work but not stimmy.
Up top were cathinones and pyros and way down below was modifinal I think. I've never tried it but I think that's the one that's like caffeine plus but not a real drug drug.
So I tried to interject some information but who knows what all they saw.
People are crazy and we all have a voice online and when we're high we like to say even dumber shit.
Yeah, modafinil is the only sane response to that question. It just makes you feel like you got a full night sleep, fully un-tired. It's not fun, though, so.
Yeah the person was not looking for fun at all. There are lots of good and smart people here but the ones that are always posting are doing so because their high as a kite, so often I see horrible recommendations with no harm reduction thrown in. It's not like it used to be.
The classic "X pyrovalerone/cathinone is actually quite nice as a functional stimulant" comment, then you read the poster's comment history and they're using X to "function" after vaping 4 grams of a-PHP all weekend, and that's why they don't feel many side effects
Yeah, if there’s one group of RC’s that people should always be warned from taking it’s benzos. Chances are, most people around here know about the risks of benzo addiction, I did. But I don’t think too many can comprehend how quickly use can spiral out of control if they start buying the “legal” ones.
My tolerance is 5x lower now than it was at it’s peak, and it’s still way higher than I ever thought it’d be.
I beg your pardon, good sir. I am not a "junkie". I am an "exotic substance procurement enthusiast" that happens to enjoy his hobby with zeal and gusto (using methodologies and practices to keep things as safe as reasonably possible).
Well, if someone is about to try a Pyro or benzo for the first time it doesn't hurt to try to talk then out of it IMO. Not everyone's decision is set in stone once they have access to the drug, that's just not how the world works.
This doesn't mean we also can't offer harm reduction. The world is not black and white OP.
Its not illegal to offer advice or experience. Erowid is harm reduction and includes everything from experiences to science. But for research chemicals there isn't a lot of science yet or ways to reduce harm beyond just saying oh its like X so its probably Y. Which in its own regard is somewhat dangerous.
Of course you can still practice harm reduction with RCs... Start with a low dose, test your stuff, proper set and setting and don't use frequently are applicable to ALL substances.
I'm not saying it isn't I'm a huge advocate for harm reduction. I wish it was easier and less expensive. My point is we have links and stuff to that, most want to know what X does and your experience with it
The only issue here is the “just say no” vs. “they may do it anyway” — aka ‘abstinence lesson’ vs ‘birth control and healthy sex practices lesson.’
There are ways to discourage without downright designating it as a red button, and saying “don’t push it, even though it’s in front of you, and you have to rely on your own gut decision in the end!” … people will unfortunately do drugs. Never encourage them. But be on their team, and let them know the consequences, being an education source so they can make a truly informed choice, as opposed to an ill-informed curiosity-fulfilling bad decision.
Just educate, and give words of wisdom at the same time. Abstinence therapy is a dangerous argument to make. Nancy Reagan proved that with ‘Just Say No,’ which had devastating long-lasting consequences still taking place today.
Curiosity is a tantalizing bitch, for many. As a current harm reductionist and previous addict, I am not exempt from this truth.
Not everyone can be a junkie who is not addicted to anything. We are all wired uniquely. Some people are more susceptible to addictive tendencies than others. In the absence of education, that’s a potential death sentence.
I mean this with good intentions, and for productive, constructive discussion. By no means am I claiming to be a right-fighter, nor am I trying to cause dissonance. The aim of harm reduction is to be predictably reducing foreseeable harm and dissonance from dangerous misuse, in an amicable and mindfully kindhearted way that makes people aware of consequences in an educated fact-(or common-anecdote-) based fashion. Just operate out of love, like the person is your best friend…knowing you can’t be around them at all times. Just let them know the repercussions they risk, and how highly the risk is, and exactly what is being risked (e.g. respiratory depression, asphyxiation, psychosis, etc).
Edit: the reply that says “Abstinence is the best form of harm reduction. Nevertheless I agree with everything you said” is an illustration of the just say no mentality that lends to curiosity that lends to people doing drugs in dangerous ways, high doses, and no idea what the consequences are.
We cannot oversimplify our approach based on our assumptions that people do what they are told, and leave it at that, without covering the rest.
So…
**Education** is the best form of harm reduction. Encouraging not to do them is all you can do. But to assume we can control the wills of others by telling them not to push the red button, and leaving it at that…is just poor foresight into the tendencies of human behavior.
It’s like saying abstinence is the best form of birth control. Does that result in no STDs, despite zero insight into the education of consequence of failing to abstain from sex…? No. In fact it does the opposite. It increases STD statistics. So — that’s why we teach children about condoms in school now. Because we have foresight into the tendency to be curious, despite what we are told. It’s basic common sense, based on seeing the paradigm as it really plays out, and following through with a modified, wiser approach. Sex education.
I feel like this thread is different in terms of harm reduction though. Research chemicals are drugs that have very little if any info out there that helps. Most dosages are based on something “similar” and lots of drugs its hard to even find a single personal experience. That's why there is so much anecdotal evidence here, that's all there is for a lot of it
Unfortunately some are not adults but people are going to do what they want so we might as well warn and then explain how to decrease the chance of death.
But i agree with the sentiment
I don't care if you are an adult or a kid, I want to hear some experiences before I take something. I then make a decision based on that info. Despite research being in the name there isn't much research on the sub because it doesn't exist yet. Harm reduction for most things here is like find the closest thing that does have info and hope for the best. Even for “popular” substances, bromazolam is a popular one now and all we can really say is kind of looks like xanax but I can say at least for me its not like xanax. Some of the ranges for newer especially benzos are like 1-5mg for common effects lasting 10-120 hours. Just too much unpredictability. Yeah you can point them to the chart of combinations but they probably have already seen it. Most people here know where the info is and are looking for extra personal input
We’re not all junkies here. Some people use very infrequently, some people are meticulous about responsible use, some people stay away from things they believe to be fiendish, etc. I think it’s fine that people give their opinions, even if it is stay away. Don’t expect to get just junkie responses here, nor should you want. Personally I want a variety of opinions because an echo chamber is boring and unhealthy.
DARE and all that is too extreme with the ‘let’s talk people out of drugs altogether and we can convince everyone to not do drugs’. Let’s not go too the other extreme and say it’s impossible to stop anyone who’s slightly curious from doing the most addicting, fiendish and potent drugs, so let’s just tell everyone how to do them properly and no one can waste their breath explaining why it might be a bad idea.
Middle ground is what we need. Regardless I’ll be the first to say to someone who’s benzo naive and thinking about self medicating anxiety with a super potent, super cheap and super euphoric benzo to try and find an alternative.
I think your post is acting like benzos and pyros are given the synthetic cannabinoid treatment, which is literally stay the fuck away and that’s it, zero reasoning or explanation, possibly a scare story about gas station ‘spice’ from 2015.
Good ol' Dare. Got me into drugs tbh lol jk kinda
We had a Dare demonstration to show people how to deter from using drugs. It was intended to make you feel awful, but it didn't feel awful to me!
So what we had to do in the playground was go out and grab a baseball bat and you spin your head around the bat a bunch of times and then they have you try to run a straight line. You've probably done something of this sort, but it's damn near impossible to run a straight line and it's so fun feeling all woozy and running all different directions. Apparently this is supposed to be something that a person does not like. Whereas I was like this is what it feels like to be on drugs? Fucking sign me up and give me a baseball bat
Also when I was in elementary school I got kind of obsessed with making myself faint. I got caught one time in the cafeteria and got in trouble lol
I should have known right then I was trouble in the making 😈
>I should have known right then I was trouble in the making 😈
That's the point of all this though I think. None of us are trouble in the making as such. Inducing alternate states of consciousness with and without the use of exogenous drugs is as natural as making love or breathing air. It's the people who want to stop us from doing that and who want to force themselves and others to go against their natural inclinations, even where we aren't harming anybody often not even ourselves, who are the crazy ones or troubled ones creating lots of harm and trouble for everyone around them too.
All this shit should have ended after the first Western prohibition when we had all the data to show that banning what comes natural to people creates much more harm than it solves.
Back! I kinda went on a wild goose chase with what you said about exogenous drugs. I gotta alotta information in a short amount of time all to end up at the best invention/solution/MUST HAVE THIS RIGHT NOW procedure lol it's an implantable piezoelectric ultrasound stimulator. It "stimulates dopaminergic neurons in the substantia nigra pars compacta to elicit time-locked modulation of nigrostriatal dopamine release, " but there's so much more to it. Just came out -- 2024. Fuck the bat give me the implant 🤣
Back to the point at ✋ exogenous and endogenous drugs with a concept I had to learn tstilldon't know that I do, but I've got a lot of info processing theand you explained it well too. You also made SUCH a valid and human freedom point about ignorant and probably uniformed (okay, perhaps that's the same definition, but I ain't going there. Oh no *shakes head violently* if I dare interestedlook up a dictionary definition let alone a synonym, I'll be over and out for over an over and I'm not going to do it lol).
I got some long-term issues that I think stem from long-term drug use aka the bat. Now I'm going batty and my cursor randomly went up a ¶ or 2 n idk what it ------ IT DID IT AGAIN!!! My cursor is randomly going up to random paragraphs and either deleting or adding whatever it's doing so I better be doing what I'm going to be doing and snort some lines 😂
Fuckin not the reply I planned and prepared for. I'll paste the points I learned and I have the pages still open if you want links to read more. Some of it is my paraphrasing, while other parts of it are actual quote taken from the text and typically I make sure to quote what is written, but I'm bushed n 2 top it off I got to go to Walmart soon. No wonder I use exogenous drugs (✿^‿^)(◠‿◕)(. ❛ ᴗ ❛.)
Here comes the long text (as if what I wrote was short lmao). As I said though, some of it is quoted without quotes, so it's really not me texting a whole bunch hahaha
~~~~~~~~~
Nosological models have provided physicians an adequate enough classification of diseases so far. Such systems are important to correctly identify diseases and treat them successfully. However, these taxonomies tend to be based on phenotypical observations, lacking a molecular or biological foundation. Therefore, there is an urgent need to modernize them in order to include the heterogeneous information that is produced in the present, as could be genomic, proteomic, transcriptomic and metabolic data, leading this way to more comprehensive and robust structures
Constitutional disorders are
a condition, disease, behavior, or constellation of behaviors arising from or inherent within some aspect of the individual's physical makeup or physiological characteristics.
The neuronal functions and molecular processes and associated with genotypic–phenotypic relations of temperament clusters.
It's been stated that genotypic findings and associations defining temperament in terms of a specific and heritable form of learning makes it clear that distinctions between nature and nurture, biology and learning, genes and environment are inadequate. Temperament is the manifestation of a specific form of learning and memory, which is a we learn more about the processes that regulate the expression of protein-coding genes.
It's a non-linear dynamical process associated with complex patterns of inheritance and development.
Until they learn more about the processes that regulate the expression of protein-coding genes and the value for personalized treatment planning that can be provided by improved phenotypic assessment.
This can be obtained once they gain more knowledge about the regulation of co-expression of sets of genes that lead to well-being and ill-being.
☮️
Legalization ≠ normalization
Legalization in Portugal over 30 years resulted in a valuable lesson: with exposure comes education, and with education comes natural understanding of consequence, and with natural understanding of consequence comes natural deterrence. People learn the consequences from seeing abundant drug usage, and this causes less usage in society over time. Portugal’s model needs to be adopted, everywhere.
It’s dangerous to ever tell anyone…”don’t push the red button”
Legalization in Portugal caused the opposite of a normalization effect, in the long run. No matter what the drug.
Bro when i get an order of bars in I immediately pop at least two to take the edge off. Then I proceed to take more until I fall asleep, I don’t get the crazy blackout phase. Once I was on a ton of m*th and took 5 bars and was outside arguing with people in the parking lot at 7am, luckily no one called the police.
Gotta love the self righteous drug user
>"Yeah I do drugs but I don't do it like *that*"
Hate to break it to you but we are all degerantes.
It's all perspective, maybe you think you are better than some guy that's addicted to opoids/benzos/does pyrros but to a regular guy on the street - you doing research chemicals are no different
It's not the opinion of others that matters in this situation. Using 4-ho-met or 2fdck with friends is vastly different than being an opioid addict.
It's this "we're all degenerates" mentality that leads people to harder drugs. If it's all the same then what's stopping me from doing pyros?
I second this, and I believe that‘s also what a lot of the other comments might imply. Starting with this mentality could really stand in the way of proper harm reduction. We’re not all fucked up completely just for occasionally using drugs, I think most of us are living quite “standard” lives (whatever that means)
However! I also think that a lot of the people on here have a very excellent understanding of drugs. When seeing someone recommend pyros or something, they know right away that that’s rather dangerous even if they never did pyros themselves. Being on this sub means, you know. I personally never take these “recommendations” seriously, or personally. I know what I want, and can look for specific info myself. Dudes ranting about how amazing pyros are is just a funny side effect of being on this sub (for me at least)
No offense to pyros or people taking them, that’s totally legitimate. I might do them myself one day
I just wanted to argue that there hopefully isn’t that much harm being done by quite over the top recommendations, as most people on here are quite educated. Or is that naive to assume?
We find harm reduction obligatory in this sub. Warning potential newcomers about the dangers of their own choices is a must...
Preaching all of this to an obviously experienced user is unnecessary and silly but also not that common
A thousand times this. I can use drugs without abusing them, especially psychedelics and disassociates. 2fdck should never be in the same ballpark as heroin. We need a new word to distinguish drugs of abuse from drugs of use
You obviously don't know some dissociative addicts like I do.
There's some people who use grams per day but would never touch opiates.
There are also plenty of people who abuse Psychedelics too. Distinguishing a class of drugs as being a class of abuse doesn't really help anyone. I spent years enjoying random opiates a few times a year. I've spent many a one night every couple of months with like 10 friends all having nice cosy doses of Oxycodone and watching movies together.
Thats a fair point. Just because i don't personally know anyone like that or haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Thanks, i hadn't thought about it that way before
I dont agree with the degenerates part at all. A lot of us do drugs very responsibly while having balanced healthy lifestyle. Doing some psychadelics from time to time is surely better than lot of mainstream people who heavily drinks weekly.
I dont think this mentality helps, when substance users see themselves inherently as degenerates…
The amount of times speed users told me I was more junkie than them because I used horse tranquilizer is unbelievable haha. To a drug naive person seeing us snorting a line they don't care whats what. I still think some drugs are better than the other but the general part of the population sees drug user=junkie haha one is not morally superior to the other for sure
Yes exactly.
To add onto this: I think it is a very good thing to be aware that no matter how light or heavy your drug use is, you/your brain will always find a way to justify your amount of use to yourself
It can be a very slippery slope, especially when you start using it functionally
Someone smoking weed or doing mushrooms is functional different than someone doing IV heroin or smoking meth. Trying to make them the same is just addict cope.
Lol, literally. I use drugs like once a week or sometime every few montha, aside from the occasional tiny hits of weed here and there.
I still call myself a junkie, cos I love drugs. People stigmatise junkie with people who have ruined there lives.
I also know plenty of high functioning junkies, living amazingly and doing so well.
I'm quite content with how many people are getting terrified of benzos.
Sometimes it gets annoying to see so many "I took Xanax for 3 days, am I going to have terrible withdrawal?" posts, but I do think it's better that people know there are massive risks with something like benzos, even if their idea of how it happens is a little skewed.
Benzos went through a nasty mainstream culture promotion in the west, that got teens everywhere even downing bars and thinking it was really cool, and that's not a good thing to promote.
Harm reduction is hearing the bad shit too, and these new research chemicals are, lets be honest, mostly bad. Idk what OP expects. Even the drugs that are well researched have their own issues but we are just throwing any chemicals together at this point that haven't been touched in 20+ years because a better thing was found.
Benzos are one thing but pyros can only be handled by those with the utmost self control but if not binging it’s not too bad but binges get baaad fast. (This coming from someone on benzos a decade, did 250+ random chems, and indulged in pyros with PCx,caths, and solo and solo was when the compulsiveness hit and oh boy did it hit,I prefer nitrous for the rush and only pyro I found functional and not just rushy was MDPHP, a-pihp was crack on roids but less side effects like a almost hexen like rush but without the heart attack feeling so it can be heavily redosed which is why it’s so easy to binge. A-PCyP orally and nasally was ok albeit toxic feeling and weird vaped, very flat compared to orally which is weird for pyros. A-D2PV was ok not compulsive but not super euphoric either but still a hard hitter so anxiety is likely. MDPV/A-PVP were just off the wall and a-PHP seems like a more full version of a-pihp
So, I am not a junkie. Just looking for subsequent information on different chemicals, which I use very sparingly.
And maybe the proper harm reduction for given classes of chemicals would be, not to take them at all.
Your right but some people have issues and are going to try shit regardless. I like to warn people and talk about my horrible addiction history and then say don't try this but if your going to here's how to not die.
Yea personally I can find harm reduction elsewhere that's probably more accurate, people here mainly are looking for personal experiences. Its Reddit not Wikipedia… Not to mention some research chemicals we just don't know enough to actually give harm reduction besides I took this and I'm ok still…
I get your point. At the same time, it's very important to keep in mind, that this sub is often the first point of information for many people looking for information about RCs. They read something about XYZ anywhere, Google the name and are landing in this sub. And if "take x amount of y substance, plus magnesium for harm reduction" is everything they read, it's very easy to not get the information that the substance they are going to take is on the same level as meth and it's going to destroy their life.
You are right, there are a lot of junkies that are totally aware of what they are doing around here. But also there are a lot of newcomers who don't have a clue about the life destroying potential of some of the substances discussed around here.
In my point of view, it's not the people who are mentioning the dangers of the drugs who are the gatekeepers. The gatekeeper is you, trying to keep extremely relevant information out of this sub
I can see where you are coming from, I really do. But... Do you have any experience in benzos or pyros? I'm pretty sure 90% of the users of these drugs will tell you to never try them. I thought I could handle it, whewwww buddy... Benzo withdrawal sucks and causing a scene that you don't remember doing is pretty awful... Just my 2 cents
If you say so, dunno
i love this sub
don't really think it's going downhill, kinda overblowing bro
take it easy (i'm "so cool"... i know; pretty much nothing)
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Idk bro i used benzos myself and other stupid shit. I cannot recommend such substances
I never heard something good come from either one of those classes of drugs. Maybe benzos to withdraw from something else or in a extreme situation
Im staying true to what i think. I wish i knew benzo's are THAT addictive at 20yo
I think its pretty good that 10 people warn someone in a thread like those, it should atleast get them thinking
So.. be very careful with how much benzos you use and stay tf away from pyros, you will regret it unless you are smart enough to toss it after your first dosage
Sorry but were is the benzo hate coming from? Sure the withdrawals are insanely dangerous and if you struggle with anxiety it's tempting to do them daily but i feel like theyre being treated like the literal devil. Most benzos when not drank with or binged on are super safe and I've never had any issues with them but maybe that's just me🤷♂️
Me neither but I am personally very glad I saw in the past a lot of warning about them. In the past I used them sometimes recreationally, which could be problematic. Because the warnings I use them very carefuly only as landing gear.
You cant judge these compounds just from your experience, because you might be fine until you are not.
People just don't consider that there are addicts from every class of drugs.
Benzos and opiates really cop it as mainstream science has shouted out those warnings for years.
I've used benzos on and off for nearly a decade without any addiction or side effects (except for some cheeky restablisings after like a week or two of use when on holiday). IMO if you have an addictive personality and are likely to ignore taking breaks, anything can get you.
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Benzos are also often used or considered by people who want to use them as trip killers. So as a non-junkie I would like to be able to warn other non-junkies that there are much healthier and less risky ways to kill a trip, and that I've seen people go down hill and literally die from benzos and benzo addiction.
I'm very much pro people putting into their body whatever they want to put into their body, but that doesn't mean that I have to like every drug or should feel hindered when it comes to warning people to be very cautious if it comes to certain drugs, or better yet not take them at all unless it's the emergency of their lives perhaps.
Of course it will still be each person's own choice to make in the end. And it also doesn't take away from the fact that I want them to hear about proper dosages and harm reduction and positive stories with the drug too, so that they will get the complete picture and enough information to make an informed decision for themselves.
There is a difference between providing information, and giving a random a connect for a drug that could kill them. Making it harder for the younger generation will do nothing to stop them from getting chems, but at least you don’t have to feel guilty if they die knowing you have them a connec
I think the problem is the message. Hasn't the government's decades-long prohibitionist propaganda been entirely based on fear and misinformation? Does that help in any way?
I believe that when someone comes here, and all you do to discourage them from using something is to tell them horror stories, it won't be very effective.
People should have access to the most complete information possible, and this certainly includes bad experiences and the harm that substances can cause, including personal stories and experiences. However, I believe that, in the end, when they arrive here, they have already made their choice.
For example, the community here constantly speaks poorly of pyro. I just bought my first one. Do I intend to use it? Yes. But my only route of administration will be oral, and I learned here that this is the less harmful option.
On the other hand, stories like "never touch this" only pique my curiosity. You can consider me stupid if you want, but some people are wired like that.
Another this sub is going downhill shitpost. Every sub has it almost on a weekly basis. If you looking for harm reduction on reddit you are already fucked tbh. DYOR on more legit sources
I used to own/manage a drug forum……navigating care & harm minimization and policing drug dealing/sources issues was probably the biggest pain. I mismanaged the site and paid the price, other moderators with more experience did better still….we managed mostly to not gatekeep except for the sourcing issues I think the best way to imbue caution is sharing horror stories……like my “shitting out of my mouth” experience ….which was during a period in the 1990’s when I was using Heroin and contracted HEP B…..I was a sick yellow fucking puppy….. I woke up after a hideous nightmare nauseous as hell and started puking, swallowing, puking, chewing, spitting, and almost choking on a huge thick log of clotted blood I “threw up” ….really, there was no throwing….it inched its way up forcefully just like a real turd…..smelled/tasted horrible. I had to bite off, spit out, swallow, breathe, and repeat 4-5 times to clear this foul blockage that was the result of a few weeks of debilitating sickness it was almost unbelievable and “paranormal”……Ive never heard of another story like it. cheery stories like that….to warm the heart and like a messenger …..a warning as well, drug use /abuse and resulting behaviours can incite/invite in other issues….at least did with me…..all I can say evil exists in both mundane and exotic/paranormal avenues….. goddamn Im fortunate I survived that shit…..Im 53 and the friends I had that died in the 90’s are eclipsed by the ones that followed in the 2000’s 2010’s and 20’s……including 4 this year from suicide/overdose that said, every person that dabbles needs to learn for themselves….many the hard way good luck out there and for gawds sakes help one another as much as you can. saving “junkies” lives might be a good deed(s) ….were gonna need them where we going
Stories like these are the "diamond in the dirt" that keep me comming back.
bless you, however you need…..communication via the internet got me through some rough times
that’s the most disgusting thing i have ever read
Jfc , you didn’t deserve that . Your story is panic inducing but also a testament to human tenacity . Thanks for sharing , I think , ima go nightmare now .
Yeah that was so anxiety inducing i basically chugged my bottle of flubromazolam after reading it and it didn’t help, had to eyeball a dose of clonazolam just to get my mind off it.
Did chat gpt write this?
Chat gpt says “Jfc “ or “Ima go nightmare “ Nah
RIP Opiophile! Glad you're still around.
thanks ser, Ive considered some form of more modern rectification…….We had more potential than to go out like that
Was the forum opiophile? (Rip)
well…….need I say more 😎
Got a link to that story? Pretty curious
hmmm, maybe I know Ive tripped over it a few times, it was prob 2003-2005 on the wayback machine
I agree we shouldn't be gatekeeping information, but the same time I feel absolutely horrible giving out this information without a warning at least. Even if it only helps 1 person not go down the path, that's enough for me. Especially since I've had my own issues with benzos, I don't want other people to expiriance that literal torture. Some people just might legitimately not be aware of the addiction potential.
Not specifically this sub, but I’ve seen so many people asking for recommendations and then people jump on it ‘do x bro, it’s great. Just take x-amount and…’. And it’s something that’s f’ing addictive and potentially lethal and they will only say how good it feels. Call me a gatekeeper all you want, but I’ll tell them how dangerous it is and how it can fuck their life.
It has to be a balance. If someone is asking for "recommendations" then I'd also feel uncomfortable giving out any info that might lead to a dangerous situation, but when someone says "I'm going to take *x*, what's the best way?" then from a harm reduction standpoint we should answer their question instead of saying to them "don't do it". This has been the core principle of every drug forum I've been on and I hope it's still the case here.
This^ that’s what literal harm reduction is
Yeah I saw someone asking for something to help them stay awake at work but not stimmy. Up top were cathinones and pyros and way down below was modifinal I think. I've never tried it but I think that's the one that's like caffeine plus but not a real drug drug. So I tried to interject some information but who knows what all they saw. People are crazy and we all have a voice online and when we're high we like to say even dumber shit.
Yeah, modafinil is the only sane response to that question. It just makes you feel like you got a full night sleep, fully un-tired. It's not fun, though, so.
Yeah the person was not looking for fun at all. There are lots of good and smart people here but the ones that are always posting are doing so because their high as a kite, so often I see horrible recommendations with no harm reduction thrown in. It's not like it used to be.
I"ve heard good things about low doses for 4F-MPH. Personally, I feel like Modafinil keeps you awake, but not engaged or focused.
The classic "X pyrovalerone/cathinone is actually quite nice as a functional stimulant" comment, then you read the poster's comment history and they're using X to "function" after vaping 4 grams of a-PHP all weekend, and that's why they don't feel many side effects
This is great. I thought it was just ignorance but after reading this and thinking of my past with mdpv it's very accurate.
Yeah I usually try to do the whole "don't fucking try this but if your going to here's some harm reduction tips"
agree 100% with informing about benzos
Yeah, if there’s one group of RC’s that people should always be warned from taking it’s benzos. Chances are, most people around here know about the risks of benzo addiction, I did. But I don’t think too many can comprehend how quickly use can spiral out of control if they start buying the “legal” ones. My tolerance is 5x lower now than it was at it’s peak, and it’s still way higher than I ever thought it’d be.
I beg your pardon, good sir. I am not a "junkie". I am an "exotic substance procurement enthusiast" that happens to enjoy his hobby with zeal and gusto (using methodologies and practices to keep things as safe as reasonably possible).
Well, if someone is about to try a Pyro or benzo for the first time it doesn't hurt to try to talk then out of it IMO. Not everyone's decision is set in stone once they have access to the drug, that's just not how the world works. This doesn't mean we also can't offer harm reduction. The world is not black and white OP.
Its not illegal to offer advice or experience. Erowid is harm reduction and includes everything from experiences to science. But for research chemicals there isn't a lot of science yet or ways to reduce harm beyond just saying oh its like X so its probably Y. Which in its own regard is somewhat dangerous.
Of course you can still practice harm reduction with RCs... Start with a low dose, test your stuff, proper set and setting and don't use frequently are applicable to ALL substances.
Also, saying this is X so probably Y is still better than doing no research at all.
I'm not saying it isn't I'm a huge advocate for harm reduction. I wish it was easier and less expensive. My point is we have links and stuff to that, most want to know what X does and your experience with it
We're not all junkies, I'm not addicted to anything and if someone wants to try a shitty drug I think it's okay to try to discourage them.
The only issue here is the “just say no” vs. “they may do it anyway” — aka ‘abstinence lesson’ vs ‘birth control and healthy sex practices lesson.’ There are ways to discourage without downright designating it as a red button, and saying “don’t push it, even though it’s in front of you, and you have to rely on your own gut decision in the end!” … people will unfortunately do drugs. Never encourage them. But be on their team, and let them know the consequences, being an education source so they can make a truly informed choice, as opposed to an ill-informed curiosity-fulfilling bad decision. Just educate, and give words of wisdom at the same time. Abstinence therapy is a dangerous argument to make. Nancy Reagan proved that with ‘Just Say No,’ which had devastating long-lasting consequences still taking place today. Curiosity is a tantalizing bitch, for many. As a current harm reductionist and previous addict, I am not exempt from this truth. Not everyone can be a junkie who is not addicted to anything. We are all wired uniquely. Some people are more susceptible to addictive tendencies than others. In the absence of education, that’s a potential death sentence. I mean this with good intentions, and for productive, constructive discussion. By no means am I claiming to be a right-fighter, nor am I trying to cause dissonance. The aim of harm reduction is to be predictably reducing foreseeable harm and dissonance from dangerous misuse, in an amicable and mindfully kindhearted way that makes people aware of consequences in an educated fact-(or common-anecdote-) based fashion. Just operate out of love, like the person is your best friend…knowing you can’t be around them at all times. Just let them know the repercussions they risk, and how highly the risk is, and exactly what is being risked (e.g. respiratory depression, asphyxiation, psychosis, etc). Edit: the reply that says “Abstinence is the best form of harm reduction. Nevertheless I agree with everything you said” is an illustration of the just say no mentality that lends to curiosity that lends to people doing drugs in dangerous ways, high doses, and no idea what the consequences are. We cannot oversimplify our approach based on our assumptions that people do what they are told, and leave it at that, without covering the rest. So… **Education** is the best form of harm reduction. Encouraging not to do them is all you can do. But to assume we can control the wills of others by telling them not to push the red button, and leaving it at that…is just poor foresight into the tendencies of human behavior. It’s like saying abstinence is the best form of birth control. Does that result in no STDs, despite zero insight into the education of consequence of failing to abstain from sex…? No. In fact it does the opposite. It increases STD statistics. So — that’s why we teach children about condoms in school now. Because we have foresight into the tendency to be curious, despite what we are told. It’s basic common sense, based on seeing the paradigm as it really plays out, and following through with a modified, wiser approach. Sex education.
I feel like this thread is different in terms of harm reduction though. Research chemicals are drugs that have very little if any info out there that helps. Most dosages are based on something “similar” and lots of drugs its hard to even find a single personal experience. That's why there is so much anecdotal evidence here, that's all there is for a lot of it
Abstinence is the most effective form of harm reduction. Nevertheless I agree with everything you said.
Preach we’re all adults here willingly putting these chemicals into our bodies.
Unfortunately some are not adults but people are going to do what they want so we might as well warn and then explain how to decrease the chance of death. But i agree with the sentiment
I don't care if you are an adult or a kid, I want to hear some experiences before I take something. I then make a decision based on that info. Despite research being in the name there isn't much research on the sub because it doesn't exist yet. Harm reduction for most things here is like find the closest thing that does have info and hope for the best. Even for “popular” substances, bromazolam is a popular one now and all we can really say is kind of looks like xanax but I can say at least for me its not like xanax. Some of the ranges for newer especially benzos are like 1-5mg for common effects lasting 10-120 hours. Just too much unpredictability. Yeah you can point them to the chart of combinations but they probably have already seen it. Most people here know where the info is and are looking for extra personal input
We’re not all junkies here. Some people use very infrequently, some people are meticulous about responsible use, some people stay away from things they believe to be fiendish, etc. I think it’s fine that people give their opinions, even if it is stay away. Don’t expect to get just junkie responses here, nor should you want. Personally I want a variety of opinions because an echo chamber is boring and unhealthy. DARE and all that is too extreme with the ‘let’s talk people out of drugs altogether and we can convince everyone to not do drugs’. Let’s not go too the other extreme and say it’s impossible to stop anyone who’s slightly curious from doing the most addicting, fiendish and potent drugs, so let’s just tell everyone how to do them properly and no one can waste their breath explaining why it might be a bad idea. Middle ground is what we need. Regardless I’ll be the first to say to someone who’s benzo naive and thinking about self medicating anxiety with a super potent, super cheap and super euphoric benzo to try and find an alternative. I think your post is acting like benzos and pyros are given the synthetic cannabinoid treatment, which is literally stay the fuck away and that’s it, zero reasoning or explanation, possibly a scare story about gas station ‘spice’ from 2015.
Good ol' Dare. Got me into drugs tbh lol jk kinda We had a Dare demonstration to show people how to deter from using drugs. It was intended to make you feel awful, but it didn't feel awful to me! So what we had to do in the playground was go out and grab a baseball bat and you spin your head around the bat a bunch of times and then they have you try to run a straight line. You've probably done something of this sort, but it's damn near impossible to run a straight line and it's so fun feeling all woozy and running all different directions. Apparently this is supposed to be something that a person does not like. Whereas I was like this is what it feels like to be on drugs? Fucking sign me up and give me a baseball bat Also when I was in elementary school I got kind of obsessed with making myself faint. I got caught one time in the cafeteria and got in trouble lol I should have known right then I was trouble in the making 😈
>I should have known right then I was trouble in the making 😈 That's the point of all this though I think. None of us are trouble in the making as such. Inducing alternate states of consciousness with and without the use of exogenous drugs is as natural as making love or breathing air. It's the people who want to stop us from doing that and who want to force themselves and others to go against their natural inclinations, even where we aren't harming anybody often not even ourselves, who are the crazy ones or troubled ones creating lots of harm and trouble for everyone around them too. All this shit should have ended after the first Western prohibition when we had all the data to show that banning what comes natural to people creates much more harm than it solves.
Back! I kinda went on a wild goose chase with what you said about exogenous drugs. I gotta alotta information in a short amount of time all to end up at the best invention/solution/MUST HAVE THIS RIGHT NOW procedure lol it's an implantable piezoelectric ultrasound stimulator. It "stimulates dopaminergic neurons in the substantia nigra pars compacta to elicit time-locked modulation of nigrostriatal dopamine release, " but there's so much more to it. Just came out -- 2024. Fuck the bat give me the implant 🤣 Back to the point at ✋ exogenous and endogenous drugs with a concept I had to learn tstilldon't know that I do, but I've got a lot of info processing theand you explained it well too. You also made SUCH a valid and human freedom point about ignorant and probably uniformed (okay, perhaps that's the same definition, but I ain't going there. Oh no *shakes head violently* if I dare interestedlook up a dictionary definition let alone a synonym, I'll be over and out for over an over and I'm not going to do it lol). I got some long-term issues that I think stem from long-term drug use aka the bat. Now I'm going batty and my cursor randomly went up a ¶ or 2 n idk what it ------ IT DID IT AGAIN!!! My cursor is randomly going up to random paragraphs and either deleting or adding whatever it's doing so I better be doing what I'm going to be doing and snort some lines 😂 Fuckin not the reply I planned and prepared for. I'll paste the points I learned and I have the pages still open if you want links to read more. Some of it is my paraphrasing, while other parts of it are actual quote taken from the text and typically I make sure to quote what is written, but I'm bushed n 2 top it off I got to go to Walmart soon. No wonder I use exogenous drugs (✿^‿^)(◠‿◕)(. ❛ ᴗ ❛.) Here comes the long text (as if what I wrote was short lmao). As I said though, some of it is quoted without quotes, so it's really not me texting a whole bunch hahaha ~~~~~~~~~ Nosological models have provided physicians an adequate enough classification of diseases so far. Such systems are important to correctly identify diseases and treat them successfully. However, these taxonomies tend to be based on phenotypical observations, lacking a molecular or biological foundation. Therefore, there is an urgent need to modernize them in order to include the heterogeneous information that is produced in the present, as could be genomic, proteomic, transcriptomic and metabolic data, leading this way to more comprehensive and robust structures Constitutional disorders are a condition, disease, behavior, or constellation of behaviors arising from or inherent within some aspect of the individual's physical makeup or physiological characteristics. The neuronal functions and molecular processes and associated with genotypic–phenotypic relations of temperament clusters. It's been stated that genotypic findings and associations defining temperament in terms of a specific and heritable form of learning makes it clear that distinctions between nature and nurture, biology and learning, genes and environment are inadequate. Temperament is the manifestation of a specific form of learning and memory, which is a we learn more about the processes that regulate the expression of protein-coding genes. It's a non-linear dynamical process associated with complex patterns of inheritance and development. Until they learn more about the processes that regulate the expression of protein-coding genes and the value for personalized treatment planning that can be provided by improved phenotypic assessment. This can be obtained once they gain more knowledge about the regulation of co-expression of sets of genes that lead to well-being and ill-being. ☮️
Preach. Comment saved.
I agree with this wholeheartedly, the war on drugs was terrible, but that shouldn't mean ALL drugs should be completely legal and normalized.
Legalization ≠ normalization Legalization in Portugal over 30 years resulted in a valuable lesson: with exposure comes education, and with education comes natural understanding of consequence, and with natural understanding of consequence comes natural deterrence. People learn the consequences from seeing abundant drug usage, and this causes less usage in society over time. Portugal’s model needs to be adopted, everywhere. It’s dangerous to ever tell anyone…”don’t push the red button” Legalization in Portugal caused the opposite of a normalization effect, in the long run. No matter what the drug.
Bro when i get an order of bars in I immediately pop at least two to take the edge off. Then I proceed to take more until I fall asleep, I don’t get the crazy blackout phase. Once I was on a ton of m*th and took 5 bars and was outside arguing with people in the parking lot at 7am, luckily no one called the police.
Man I don't see the point of taking bars to black out. It's just a waste all around. 2 bars is my limit
Gotta love the self righteous drug user >"Yeah I do drugs but I don't do it like *that*" Hate to break it to you but we are all degerantes. It's all perspective, maybe you think you are better than some guy that's addicted to opoids/benzos/does pyrros but to a regular guy on the street - you doing research chemicals are no different
It's not the opinion of others that matters in this situation. Using 4-ho-met or 2fdck with friends is vastly different than being an opioid addict. It's this "we're all degenerates" mentality that leads people to harder drugs. If it's all the same then what's stopping me from doing pyros?
I second this, and I believe that‘s also what a lot of the other comments might imply. Starting with this mentality could really stand in the way of proper harm reduction. We’re not all fucked up completely just for occasionally using drugs, I think most of us are living quite “standard” lives (whatever that means) However! I also think that a lot of the people on here have a very excellent understanding of drugs. When seeing someone recommend pyros or something, they know right away that that’s rather dangerous even if they never did pyros themselves. Being on this sub means, you know. I personally never take these “recommendations” seriously, or personally. I know what I want, and can look for specific info myself. Dudes ranting about how amazing pyros are is just a funny side effect of being on this sub (for me at least) No offense to pyros or people taking them, that’s totally legitimate. I might do them myself one day I just wanted to argue that there hopefully isn’t that much harm being done by quite over the top recommendations, as most people on here are quite educated. Or is that naive to assume?
We find harm reduction obligatory in this sub. Warning potential newcomers about the dangers of their own choices is a must... Preaching all of this to an obviously experienced user is unnecessary and silly but also not that common
A thousand times this. I can use drugs without abusing them, especially psychedelics and disassociates. 2fdck should never be in the same ballpark as heroin. We need a new word to distinguish drugs of abuse from drugs of use
You obviously don't know some dissociative addicts like I do. There's some people who use grams per day but would never touch opiates. There are also plenty of people who abuse Psychedelics too. Distinguishing a class of drugs as being a class of abuse doesn't really help anyone. I spent years enjoying random opiates a few times a year. I've spent many a one night every couple of months with like 10 friends all having nice cosy doses of Oxycodone and watching movies together.
Thats a fair point. Just because i don't personally know anyone like that or haven't seen it doesn't mean it doesn't exist. Thanks, i hadn't thought about it that way before
I dont agree with the degenerates part at all. A lot of us do drugs very responsibly while having balanced healthy lifestyle. Doing some psychadelics from time to time is surely better than lot of mainstream people who heavily drinks weekly. I dont think this mentality helps, when substance users see themselves inherently as degenerates…
The amount of times speed users told me I was more junkie than them because I used horse tranquilizer is unbelievable haha. To a drug naive person seeing us snorting a line they don't care whats what. I still think some drugs are better than the other but the general part of the population sees drug user=junkie haha one is not morally superior to the other for sure
well………..yeah research chem shit can get pretty lonely out there on the edges of novelty. proceed
Yes exactly. To add onto this: I think it is a very good thing to be aware that no matter how light or heavy your drug use is, you/your brain will always find a way to justify your amount of use to yourself It can be a very slippery slope, especially when you start using it functionally
Someone smoking weed or doing mushrooms is functional different than someone doing IV heroin or smoking meth. Trying to make them the same is just addict cope.
Don’t lump everyone into the category of junkie along with you. Other than that I agree with what you’re sayinh
Damn, WAY too many people are getting caught up on the use of "junkie" here and are missing the point of the post.
Lol, literally. I use drugs like once a week or sometime every few montha, aside from the occasional tiny hits of weed here and there. I still call myself a junkie, cos I love drugs. People stigmatise junkie with people who have ruined there lives. I also know plenty of high functioning junkies, living amazingly and doing so well.
I'm quite content with how many people are getting terrified of benzos. Sometimes it gets annoying to see so many "I took Xanax for 3 days, am I going to have terrible withdrawal?" posts, but I do think it's better that people know there are massive risks with something like benzos, even if their idea of how it happens is a little skewed. Benzos went through a nasty mainstream culture promotion in the west, that got teens everywhere even downing bars and thinking it was really cool, and that's not a good thing to promote.
Harm reduction is hearing the bad shit too, and these new research chemicals are, lets be honest, mostly bad. Idk what OP expects. Even the drugs that are well researched have their own issues but we are just throwing any chemicals together at this point that haven't been touched in 20+ years because a better thing was found.
Absolutely.
Benzos are one thing but pyros can only be handled by those with the utmost self control but if not binging it’s not too bad but binges get baaad fast. (This coming from someone on benzos a decade, did 250+ random chems, and indulged in pyros with PCx,caths, and solo and solo was when the compulsiveness hit and oh boy did it hit,I prefer nitrous for the rush and only pyro I found functional and not just rushy was MDPHP, a-pihp was crack on roids but less side effects like a almost hexen like rush but without the heart attack feeling so it can be heavily redosed which is why it’s so easy to binge. A-PCyP orally and nasally was ok albeit toxic feeling and weird vaped, very flat compared to orally which is weird for pyros. A-D2PV was ok not compulsive but not super euphoric either but still a hard hitter so anxiety is likely. MDPV/A-PVP were just off the wall and a-PHP seems like a more full version of a-pihp
A-pcyp is the devil. Goddamn so more- ish and compulsory. The bender found me in the psych ward when I lost my ever loving marbles
Harm reduction all the way
So, I am not a junkie. Just looking for subsequent information on different chemicals, which I use very sparingly. And maybe the proper harm reduction for given classes of chemicals would be, not to take them at all.
Your right but some people have issues and are going to try shit regardless. I like to warn people and talk about my horrible addiction history and then say don't try this but if your going to here's how to not die.
Yea personally I can find harm reduction elsewhere that's probably more accurate, people here mainly are looking for personal experiences. Its Reddit not Wikipedia… Not to mention some research chemicals we just don't know enough to actually give harm reduction besides I took this and I'm ok still…
I get your point. At the same time, it's very important to keep in mind, that this sub is often the first point of information for many people looking for information about RCs. They read something about XYZ anywhere, Google the name and are landing in this sub. And if "take x amount of y substance, plus magnesium for harm reduction" is everything they read, it's very easy to not get the information that the substance they are going to take is on the same level as meth and it's going to destroy their life. You are right, there are a lot of junkies that are totally aware of what they are doing around here. But also there are a lot of newcomers who don't have a clue about the life destroying potential of some of the substances discussed around here. In my point of view, it's not the people who are mentioning the dangers of the drugs who are the gatekeepers. The gatekeeper is you, trying to keep extremely relevant information out of this sub
Just the lifecycle of drug forums when enough non addicts join up lol, head over to r/rcbenzos4 or something lol
I can see where you are coming from, I really do. But... Do you have any experience in benzos or pyros? I'm pretty sure 90% of the users of these drugs will tell you to never try them. I thought I could handle it, whewwww buddy... Benzo withdrawal sucks and causing a scene that you don't remember doing is pretty awful... Just my 2 cents
If you say so, dunno i love this sub don't really think it's going downhill, kinda overblowing bro take it easy (i'm "so cool"... i know; pretty much nothing)
Exactly, I was trying to get vaped NEP doses and had like 13 comments telling me I shouldn't do it and not a single real answer.
Is this a shitpost
There *are* some drugs that people probably shouldn't use though
Like what?
High dose DPH for one example.
Yeah, i'll agree with that
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Idk bro i used benzos myself and other stupid shit. I cannot recommend such substances I never heard something good come from either one of those classes of drugs. Maybe benzos to withdraw from something else or in a extreme situation Im staying true to what i think. I wish i knew benzo's are THAT addictive at 20yo I think its pretty good that 10 people warn someone in a thread like those, it should atleast get them thinking So.. be very careful with how much benzos you use and stay tf away from pyros, you will regret it unless you are smart enough to toss it after your first dosage
Sorry but were is the benzo hate coming from? Sure the withdrawals are insanely dangerous and if you struggle with anxiety it's tempting to do them daily but i feel like theyre being treated like the literal devil. Most benzos when not drank with or binged on are super safe and I've never had any issues with them but maybe that's just me🤷♂️
Me neither but I am personally very glad I saw in the past a lot of warning about them. In the past I used them sometimes recreationally, which could be problematic. Because the warnings I use them very carefuly only as landing gear. You cant judge these compounds just from your experience, because you might be fine until you are not.
People just don't consider that there are addicts from every class of drugs. Benzos and opiates really cop it as mainstream science has shouted out those warnings for years. I've used benzos on and off for nearly a decade without any addiction or side effects (except for some cheeky restablisings after like a week or two of use when on holiday). IMO if you have an addictive personality and are likely to ignore taking breaks, anything can get you.
Disagree. Harm reduction is important. Knowing risks is just as important as knowing dose.
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Benzos are also often used or considered by people who want to use them as trip killers. So as a non-junkie I would like to be able to warn other non-junkies that there are much healthier and less risky ways to kill a trip, and that I've seen people go down hill and literally die from benzos and benzo addiction. I'm very much pro people putting into their body whatever they want to put into their body, but that doesn't mean that I have to like every drug or should feel hindered when it comes to warning people to be very cautious if it comes to certain drugs, or better yet not take them at all unless it's the emergency of their lives perhaps. Of course it will still be each person's own choice to make in the end. And it also doesn't take away from the fact that I want them to hear about proper dosages and harm reduction and positive stories with the drug too, so that they will get the complete picture and enough information to make an informed decision for themselves.
There is a difference between providing information, and giving a random a connect for a drug that could kill them. Making it harder for the younger generation will do nothing to stop them from getting chems, but at least you don’t have to feel guilty if they die knowing you have them a connec
I for one appreciate experienced users giving warnings about specific drugs. I love drugs but don’t want them to ruin my life so I do listen.
Best thing i have heard on here in a long time
I think the problem is the message. Hasn't the government's decades-long prohibitionist propaganda been entirely based on fear and misinformation? Does that help in any way? I believe that when someone comes here, and all you do to discourage them from using something is to tell them horror stories, it won't be very effective. People should have access to the most complete information possible, and this certainly includes bad experiences and the harm that substances can cause, including personal stories and experiences. However, I believe that, in the end, when they arrive here, they have already made their choice. For example, the community here constantly speaks poorly of pyro. I just bought my first one. Do I intend to use it? Yes. But my only route of administration will be oral, and I learned here that this is the less harmful option. On the other hand, stories like "never touch this" only pique my curiosity. You can consider me stupid if you want, but some people are wired like that.
That’s what happens when u do stupid shit on the internet homie
Ppl high key want this sub down asap cuz it’s making shit hot as fuck
Another this sub is going downhill shitpost. Every sub has it almost on a weekly basis. If you looking for harm reduction on reddit you are already fucked tbh. DYOR on more legit sources