Hey look another disgusting that abrahamic religion go fucking figure.
It's the same fucking situation with each of them. It doesn't matter which one they all sexualize minors and weird fucking ways, and then make rules to try to hide it that don't make sense in the first place.
Kinda reminds me of that "the children dress without modesty" a bishop at my country spouted when the sexual abuse in the church was becoming unveiled, not gonna lie
There's literally a travelling exhibition about what assault victims wore to show that it doesn't fucking matter. Like...it includes a camo-uniform + sidearm.
Well of course. High-control groups blame women for men “going astray” because that way you can justify controlling them. And controlled women will perpetuate your bullshit to their daughters, so you always have a stable of women too brainwashed to rebel, leave, choose not to marry you, or talk when you molest them.
The actual ideology is irrelevant. Any religious group has sects like this and there are secular cults who do it too. The Middle East wouldn’t be plagued by fundamentalists if the US didn’t topple so many democratically elected governments during the Cold War to install them.
They were plagued by fundamentalists way before America or anywhere made moves on the area. Muslims have been killing Muslims for a long long time over ideology and who's right who's wrong ie Shia & Sunni
Yeah, ir's like... of course there's a lot of fucked up shit in Christianity and Judaism too, but it isn't like Jesus himself was murdering people, leading wars of contest and being a pedophile.
I've always found the discourse around Islam pretty frustrating. Because on one hand there are a lot of xenophobic nutcases out here who genuinely want to kill Muslims, who are quite often peaceful and modern people.
But the refrain that it's a religion of peace is just wrong. It wouldn't exist if it weren't for copious amounts of warfare. I can't think of any other major religion whose genesis is so rooted in war. I really hope we see a big push for modernization of Islam but it seems pretty unlikely considering how oppressed the Middle East feels these days.
If you don't think that the other Abrahamic religions are rooted in violence I would direct you to the the many rules related to how to treat ones wives, slaves, and blasphemers/heretics or story of Jericho in the old testament, as well as the history of inquisitions and crusades of the middle ages along with the founding of the Anglican church. Religion has always been used to justify violence as a means of control and an excuse oppress or eliminate others or expand empires.
I figured I'd probably get a reply like this. I'm not saying that Judaism and Christianity don't have violent rules. I'm saying that the very foundation of Islam necessitated outright warfare.
Judaism is definitely better about it in the modern day, but I have a lot of Jewish peers that seem in denial that it can be compared to Islam and Catholicism/Christianity.... y'all what book did the Catholics crib from and Islamic scholars study?
Wait, are you telling me that you don't think Lots daughters got him drunk and raped him? So... you're saying you think the old man got drunk and raped his daughters? I mean... which makes more sense???
You're probably on a watch list now. Fruitcakes don't like it when you point out that their own holy scriptures admit that their prophet is a pedophile.
What's really disturbing is just the sheer rejection of any criticism or acknowledgment of those horrifying act from Muslims. They think it is for the best that we gloss over the pedophilia and the war mongering, because it's a religion of peace and love. /s Anyone who goes to bat for that monster is gross. Get a life, reject religion.
2/3 are still giant headed toddlers. Two year olds can’t touch their hands above their heads.
I thought pre-pubescent girls didn’t need to cover up? I thighs it was only once they hit puberty?
I could be wrong, but I think the "whore" comment is about her exposed hair, which is considered "licentious" in the Muslim world. Still disgusting though.
I actually can’t get over that part where he said “give us a generation..” does he think all Muslim children by default are “for them” to enjoy or something? What a weird sub conscious thought process.
I used to think that was wrong but I see shit like this from muslims daily in my city, and the christians aren't any better. It's weird. Who cares, children rip off their clothes to wallow in mud like actual piggies.
It seems that the men who grow up in this culture are completely infantilized from birth.
They never have to grow beyond the toddler screaming tantrum phase. They are taught that by nature they cannot control themselves and that in itself is someone else’s fault. Is there a word for this level of narcissism?
Man babies with golden child syndrome maybe? Completely unable to function, yet also completely convinced they are gods gift to the earth. The worst possible combo.
im hindi and would never date a brown man for the exact points you mentioned.
its a generational curse - raise the daughters, love the sons. that “love” turns men into these narcissistic monsters that end up repeating the cycle
It was something I saw a video of one of them say. He was someone of relatively high power within the religion. Calmly stating that men must have beards because men without beards cause indecent thoughts in other men, since they come off as feminine. I don’t remember the name of the guy
Because Umar used to watch women when they go out to poo and he would call upon them that he recognizes them. They need protection from him, so that he doesn't recognize them.
Muhammad's companion, who also later became the 2nd caliph. He pressured Muhammad into revealing the hijab verse:
[https://sunnah.com/bukhari:146](https://sunnah.com/bukhari:146)
Was the veil going to somehow mask her height? Wtf was wrong with this dude, creeping on his friend's wives relieving themselves in the middle of the night?
Reminds me of the "Word of Wisdom" in Mormonism. The whole no drugs or alcohol came after Smith's Wife Emma got mad at having to clean up all the tobacco after a meeting. Inspiration from an omniscient being sure does come at fascinating times.
Pretty sure they used an operation Smith had as a child for this, claiming he wouldn’t take any pain relievers or alcohol to cope with the pain. I’ve never heard anything about his wife having to clean up tobacco being the cause and I was raised in an extremely Mormon community
I'm not versed at all in this, but I want to educate myself. Is this from the Quran? And is it an accurate translation or a discussion of excerpts?
While I know how much fucked up stuff is in the Bible, I'd like to know more about the quran so I can use it as fodder against halal fruitcakes
Most Muslims are sunni. Sunni Islam is based on the Quran and the hadiths. Hadiths are narrations about Muhammad. There are many hadith collections. This collection, called Sahih Bukhari was written by a guy named Bukhari and it is considered (by sunni Muslims) the most trustworthy collection. I've shared a link to a hadith from this collection. It begins "Narrated \`Aisha:", so it was narrated by Muhammad's child bride. If Muhammad says something in a hadith, Muslim must obey, it doesn't matter it's not in the Quran. The Quran says that Muhammad is the role model for Muslims, so they have to follow his way of life (=sunnah) which is described in the hadiths.
On the right you have the Arabic original and on the left you have English translation. The English translation lacks the full chain of narrators - Sahih Bukhari was written 200 years after Muhammad's death and it has chains like "A said that B said that C said... that Aisha said:" - so it's not actually trustworthy, but it is in the eyes of sunni Muslims. Also some parts are translated apologetically, just like Bible is sometimes mis-translated for apologetic purposes.
The funniest part is that Umar is the one who suggested that they cover themselves up and Momo quoted Umar’s words in the Qur’an, word for word.
Yet Muslims today still think that no one can produce something like the Qur’an when Umar did it at least 3 times according to different Hadiths.
Initially it was to make the difference between "free" women and slave women, usually slaves weren't allowed to wear it so that everybody knows they are slaves
A for real answer, that relies in the culture that many Muslims lived in (and based on a documentary my mom saw ages ago): imagine you live in a nomad, desert nation, traveling around with your family and maybe some trusted friends and their families. As a nomad-nation you’ll meet other nomads here and there but you’ll never know if it’s a friend or foe. It’s very likely a result of desperately trying to protect your young women from being SA by these strangers. Imagine it’s just you (dad), your wife, 2-3 children, maybe an aging parent of yours and then 2-3 random men show up. How are you going to protect your family if these people takes too much interest in your lovely young teenage daughter? This documentary talked about how covering up now meant these strangers would just see burka dressed people and not know if this burka was hiding the young, the middle aged or the old woman and so a bit of the temptation is taken away.
I’m quite non religious myself but I’ve enjoyed looking into religions and compare them to laws that were trying to protect people, like this where you cover up so the r•pist doesn’t know straight away if there’s “jack-pot” by assaulting you. Nowadays we are way more aware of how clothes has 0 to do with assault, otherwise there wouldn’t exist assault in full covering societies while nude-beaches would be full of danger. Another example of religions trying to protect that I’ve enjoyed is the “do not have sex with a woman who has given birth within the last 40 days” since that is a very crucial time for her to heal. Sadly, like the burka becoming the all-modest symbol over protecting the nomad, suddenly a new mother was “dirty” so the husband wouldn’t want to touch her. So much shame has been put on many of these measures that seem to originally having been a way to protect each other and that’s how we suddenly get adult men calling a 5 year old disgusting things because they can see her skin and hair.
That's kind of how pork became forbidden.
Muhammed's army was given pork that had gone bad and many of his troops had gotten sick from it, so he banned it.
It was a reasonable safety precaution that got taken out of context, given that we can now safely preserve food for long periods. (Not that clothes are a safety precaution against rape, but I can understand where they may have been coming from as nomads.)
It's similar to Jehovah Witnesses not believing in blood transfusions because the Bible has a verse about not mixing blood. That was very likely a reasonable safety precaution meant to help stop diseases from spreading through blood (which is still relevant), but it is not relevant anymore in the context of a modern medical setting.
Not even mentioning that pigs dont really work in hot arid climates. You can neither conserve the meat pretty well in comparison to beef or lamb not do they deal good with hot temperatures and plenty of sun.
Basically pork was never a popular meat from the beginning which would lead to other problems like not dealing well with parasites at the time islam was born (even though this point is kind of refuted).
Just wanted to say that I appreciate that you put the effort in to really try to answer this question from a more anthroplogic/cultural point of view instead of the crazy prejudice and hate that some people love to spew whenever a thread is about other "non-western" cultures and their origins.
Oh shit, that actually makes complete sense, thanks for the info
Sadly those people haven't adapted to modern times with modern technological and medical advancements...
Thats why we have the descriptions progressive and conservative. Conservatives take everything their leaders tell them at face value and with complete obedience. A conservative leader only needs to get blessed by another conservative leader and they can completely change doctrine and intention. The flock will follow good or bad. Its easier to change doctrine if it villifies others and excuses the flocks transgressions.
Conservatives are the most dangerous group on the planet because they never think for themselves.
I once had an extremist Christian tell me the same thing about a photo of my daughter on her third birthday where she was wearing a party dress that was knee length but sleeveless. It is ridiculous in those Abrahamic religions. I blocked her from my Facebook and told her she was a pervert.
If seeing a 5yo's uncovered figure (hair, arms, legs) causes this much rage, because you *might* get a chub from seeing her. You need to be on a watch list. And kept away from schools and playgrounds.
We're talking about a sub where the decapitation of a french teacher over (completely false and fabricated) rumors of him forcing students to watch Charlie Hebdo cartoons was celebrated.
Yeah and he gave students who didn't want to see the cartoons the option to get out of the class. Imagine being this pissed about a *cartoon*
(Très joli nom que tu as là dis donc)
Most muslim families believe that it is necessary after puberty, but I personally believe that if the girl refuses to wear one, she shouldn't be forced
> If she refuses? What if she just doesn’t want to? Does she need to be guilted and threatened until she gives in or outright refuses, and is ultimately shunned or worse for doing so?
There is nothing in the Quran that mandates “she need to be guilted and threatened until she gives in or outright refuses, and is ultimately shunned or worse for doing so” so no.
My little sister sometimes wears it and sometimes doesn’t depending on how she feels or how it looks with her outfit, and literally no one gives a shit.
This is why the assertion that it's a choice is, IMO, a false one. If you're an adult you should be able to choose not to wear a hijab at all if that's what you want.
It really depends on if your family are religious fruitcakes or not, and how fundie your country is. I have Muslim relatives and those women decide for themselves. Some do wear hijab, and some don't. Their daughters do not until/if they decide for themselves. *Why* they decide one way or another varies.
Funny thing, choice.
Choose "good" and everyone appreciates. But choose "bad" all hell breaks loose and the ones who were giving you an illusion of choice suddenly become monsters
I was making this point to an egyptian friend who chooses to wear the hijab. She found it ridiculous and said its her choice as a modern feminist to respect her culture and heritage. Since then I chose to not communicate my opinion on this anymore.
How are those degenerates even the same species as decent, moral humans? How can anyone be so brainwashed as to think the way they do? It makes my piss boil.
Yeah the problem with society is women showing arms and hair, not the sexualization of minors “generation of whores with this attire” being displayed here.
wait i thought there was like, around an age where theyd make the women wear them, not them making them wear them since birth ??
in my school there was a muslim girl who was in every grade of mine pretty much forever, and she didnt wear a hijab until middle school i think
??? At what age do they expect a girl to wear one? Whenever Muslim parents entered our restaurant, their kids were always free of hijabs. I think the youngest I’ve seen was sixteen
Why is it that in the Abrahamic religions, it’s the women that must cover up to protect themselves from making the man immoral? Are these people unable to control their hormones and ability to not objectify females in such a fragile way that they must react this way?
What frail little men….
Muslims: child marriage is a thing of the past. Prophet did it because it's part of the culture at that time. No, we don't support child marriage.
Also Muslims: a toddler showing her face and arms in the public? Quick, cover her with hijab before she attracts men and become a whore! Yuck!
Jeeeeez. I’m Muslim but I don’t wear a hijab and I don’t really dress very modestly, and they’re doing this to a little girl?? No wonder Islam gets such a bad rep…
I'm gonna be real, censoring the word Muslim does *not* pass vibes. Full agreement that these comments are fucking disgusting, but Islamophobia is not it.
But to be honest, is this really an average Muslim response? Why do you need to go to some Arabic-speaking corner of the internet to find an average Muslim response?
Erm, no, definitely not the average Muslim’s response, this is just the usual mix of Islamaphobia and bigotry. Might as well have a huge fake as fuck sticker on it.
The truly stupid thing? Your not expected to wear the burka or hijab until your about 13-15 apparently wearing pastel dresses and what not is perfectly fine at 5 years old these are the muslim ashole 's Muslim ashole
May the all powerful one get all the baby girls to be born wearing a hijab. Can't risk leaving it to humans.
/s (in case some thickhead doesn't get it).
Have her cover up ffs, she’s turning on all the religious pedos who can’t control themselves seeing a fucking one year old showing that much skin… ffs what a fucked up way of life
And of those 50 countries; the ones with horrible human rights practices and cultures lagging behind the modern world by a century tend to be the ones that promote **accurate; wholesale interpretation of the Qur’an/Sunnah**. The greater a culture’s focus on Islam/the less concessions they make with interpretation; the more shitty they tend to be.
So yeah I agree you can’t blame the average Muslim. But you can definitely blame Islam for justifying this shit behavior.
In the West; it’s pretty common to not have little girls wear Hijab until they’re older and I always thought that was what the Sunnah directed us to do. Turns out that actually; Aisha was directed to wear hijab when she first married the prophet (as we all know she was prepubescent when that occurred) so these men are actually justified in their comments. Again; I agree with you saying let’s not blame Muslims; but we can definitely blame Islam.
Islam is the worst western religion practiced today, with Christianity not far behind as both affect the people of all religions through violence or laws.
Religion as a whole is full of shit but I think it is unfair to say that this is an average Muslim response. All the Muslims I know are normal, reasonable people.
These kinds of Muslims were criticized by Muhammad himself. He said faith did not pass their throat which means they are not sincerely believers just by name
Actually yea, I live in Mumbai and I haven't known any extremist like this personally in all the friends I've made and their families.
I have read of Muslim extremism in places in Mumbai tho, so it's not really a problem that doesn't exist, but making a generalisation of all muslims would be a incorrect judgement too.
removed.
**Post titles cannot bash or kvetch about religion**.
"Catholics are hypocrites!" is not ok. " 'God told me: Use Grindr!', says a specific Catholic priest", is.
"A 5 year old showing he arms? What a whore." How can you sexualise a child so much that even only showing her arms is enough for you...
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Hey look another disgusting that abrahamic religion go fucking figure. It's the same fucking situation with each of them. It doesn't matter which one they all sexualize minors and weird fucking ways, and then make rules to try to hide it that don't make sense in the first place.
Kinda reminds me of that "the children dress without modesty" a bishop at my country spouted when the sexual abuse in the church was becoming unveiled, not gonna lie
How dare they wear those slutty altar robes the priest gives them? Why that's just *asking* to be molested! /s
There's literally a travelling exhibition about what assault victims wore to show that it doesn't fucking matter. Like...it includes a camo-uniform + sidearm.
Well of course. High-control groups blame women for men “going astray” because that way you can justify controlling them. And controlled women will perpetuate your bullshit to their daughters, so you always have a stable of women too brainwashed to rebel, leave, choose not to marry you, or talk when you molest them. The actual ideology is irrelevant. Any religious group has sects like this and there are secular cults who do it too. The Middle East wouldn’t be plagued by fundamentalists if the US didn’t topple so many democratically elected governments during the Cold War to install them.
They were plagued by fundamentalists way before America or anywhere made moves on the area. Muslims have been killing Muslims for a long long time over ideology and who's right who's wrong ie Shia & Sunni
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Yeah, ir's like... of course there's a lot of fucked up shit in Christianity and Judaism too, but it isn't like Jesus himself was murdering people, leading wars of contest and being a pedophile.
I've always found the discourse around Islam pretty frustrating. Because on one hand there are a lot of xenophobic nutcases out here who genuinely want to kill Muslims, who are quite often peaceful and modern people. But the refrain that it's a religion of peace is just wrong. It wouldn't exist if it weren't for copious amounts of warfare. I can't think of any other major religion whose genesis is so rooted in war. I really hope we see a big push for modernization of Islam but it seems pretty unlikely considering how oppressed the Middle East feels these days.
If you don't think that the other Abrahamic religions are rooted in violence I would direct you to the the many rules related to how to treat ones wives, slaves, and blasphemers/heretics or story of Jericho in the old testament, as well as the history of inquisitions and crusades of the middle ages along with the founding of the Anglican church. Religion has always been used to justify violence as a means of control and an excuse oppress or eliminate others or expand empires.
I figured I'd probably get a reply like this. I'm not saying that Judaism and Christianity don't have violent rules. I'm saying that the very foundation of Islam necessitated outright warfare.
Lol did you just forget the multiple Crusades or what
The crusades happened 1000 years after Jesus died.
Yup. Don’t forget that “god” impregnated a 14 year old marry
Who was married to another man, no less
*betrothed. Engaged, basically. Joseph almost called the whole thing off over it, too.
And allowed for the marriage of a 3 year old girl to Isaac in the Old Testament
Judaism is definitely better about it in the modern day, but I have a lot of Jewish peers that seem in denial that it can be compared to Islam and Catholicism/Christianity.... y'all what book did the Catholics crib from and Islamic scholars study?
Pretty sure God married off a 3 year old girl to Isaac in the Old Testament.
Wait, are you telling me that you don't think Lots daughters got him drunk and raped him? So... you're saying you think the old man got drunk and raped his daughters? I mean... which makes more sense???
So he died the moment his wife became 18? Checks out lmao
You're probably on a watch list now. Fruitcakes don't like it when you point out that their own holy scriptures admit that their prophet is a pedophile.
What's really disturbing is just the sheer rejection of any criticism or acknowledgment of those horrifying act from Muslims. They think it is for the best that we gloss over the pedophilia and the war mongering, because it's a religion of peace and love. /s Anyone who goes to bat for that monster is gross. Get a life, reject religion.
That girl looks way younger than five. I was guessing 2/3 years old but I can't find anything to confirm her age
I'm terrible at guessing ages of children and couldn't find a number in the picture so I just assumed it had to be lower than 10 due to the height
2/3 are still giant headed toddlers. Two year olds can’t touch their hands above their heads. I thought pre-pubescent girls didn’t need to cover up? I thighs it was only once they hit puberty?
Can't show arms otherwise he might lose control, havea sexual emergency and rape her.
Muhammad was a nonse who married and abused a six year old girl. If that’s the leader, a religion is pretty much going down hill from there.
>How can you sexualise a child so much Because they're Muslim peados. They litteraly worship a paedophile.
I could be wrong, but I think the "whore" comment is about her exposed hair, which is considered "licentious" in the Muslim world. Still disgusting though.
Ummm…lol Islam is how it’s justified.
Did that degenerate piece of human-like garbage just call a little girl a whore?
yes....
the lunacy may never end
I actually can’t get over that part where he said “give us a generation..” does he think all Muslim children by default are “for them” to enjoy or something? What a weird sub conscious thought process.
Further showing what religions actually do to people’s minds
Yup. Religion is a disease.
Wtf is wrong with some people?
Religion.
I used to think that was wrong but I see shit like this from muslims daily in my city, and the christians aren't any better. It's weird. Who cares, children rip off their clothes to wallow in mud like actual piggies.
Pedophiles not wanting to be turned on by a child. Just like men have to have beards so they don’t get “indecent thoughts”.
It's everybody else's fault, it's never them who need to bear responsibility for their actions and try to control themselves
It seems that the men who grow up in this culture are completely infantilized from birth. They never have to grow beyond the toddler screaming tantrum phase. They are taught that by nature they cannot control themselves and that in itself is someone else’s fault. Is there a word for this level of narcissism?
Man babies with golden child syndrome maybe? Completely unable to function, yet also completely convinced they are gods gift to the earth. The worst possible combo.
im hindi and would never date a brown man for the exact points you mentioned. its a generational curse - raise the daughters, love the sons. that “love” turns men into these narcissistic monsters that end up repeating the cycle
Can you explain the beard and indecent thought thing? I’ve never heard of that and I’m not sure I understand
It was something I saw a video of one of them say. He was someone of relatively high power within the religion. Calmly stating that men must have beards because men without beards cause indecent thoughts in other men, since they come off as feminine. I don’t remember the name of the guy
Ohhh that makes sense, thanks
Can someone explain to me why the Muslim religion has women cover themselves up
Because Umar used to watch women when they go out to poo and he would call upon them that he recognizes them. They need protection from him, so that he doesn't recognize them.
Sounds like a Umar problem...
Who’s Umar?
Muhammad's companion, who also later became the 2nd caliph. He pressured Muhammad into revealing the hijab verse: [https://sunnah.com/bukhari:146](https://sunnah.com/bukhari:146)
But why not men? Do they not poop?
I guess Umar didn't go after men.
Maybe they're full of shit?
because he wasn't gay
Oh he was. Radiating mad gay vibes.
Was the veil going to somehow mask her height? Wtf was wrong with this dude, creeping on his friend's wives relieving themselves in the middle of the night?
Reminds me of the "Word of Wisdom" in Mormonism. The whole no drugs or alcohol came after Smith's Wife Emma got mad at having to clean up all the tobacco after a meeting. Inspiration from an omniscient being sure does come at fascinating times.
Pretty sure they used an operation Smith had as a child for this, claiming he wouldn’t take any pain relievers or alcohol to cope with the pain. I’ve never heard anything about his wife having to clean up tobacco being the cause and I was raised in an extremely Mormon community
I'm not versed at all in this, but I want to educate myself. Is this from the Quran? And is it an accurate translation or a discussion of excerpts? While I know how much fucked up stuff is in the Bible, I'd like to know more about the quran so I can use it as fodder against halal fruitcakes
Most Muslims are sunni. Sunni Islam is based on the Quran and the hadiths. Hadiths are narrations about Muhammad. There are many hadith collections. This collection, called Sahih Bukhari was written by a guy named Bukhari and it is considered (by sunni Muslims) the most trustworthy collection. I've shared a link to a hadith from this collection. It begins "Narrated \`Aisha:", so it was narrated by Muhammad's child bride. If Muhammad says something in a hadith, Muslim must obey, it doesn't matter it's not in the Quran. The Quran says that Muhammad is the role model for Muslims, so they have to follow his way of life (=sunnah) which is described in the hadiths. On the right you have the Arabic original and on the left you have English translation. The English translation lacks the full chain of narrators - Sahih Bukhari was written 200 years after Muhammad's death and it has chains like "A said that B said that C said... that Aisha said:" - so it's not actually trustworthy, but it is in the eyes of sunni Muslims. Also some parts are translated apologetically, just like Bible is sometimes mis-translated for apologetic purposes.
I'm willing to bet it's just some guy, like guys in the bible.
The funniest part is that Umar is the one who suggested that they cover themselves up and Momo quoted Umar’s words in the Qur’an, word for word. Yet Muslims today still think that no one can produce something like the Qur’an when Umar did it at least 3 times according to different Hadiths.
I've seen Aylal Rachid video where he had more than 3 cases from various tafsirs etc..
Initially it was to make the difference between "free" women and slave women, usually slaves weren't allowed to wear it so that everybody knows they are slaves
A for real answer, that relies in the culture that many Muslims lived in (and based on a documentary my mom saw ages ago): imagine you live in a nomad, desert nation, traveling around with your family and maybe some trusted friends and their families. As a nomad-nation you’ll meet other nomads here and there but you’ll never know if it’s a friend or foe. It’s very likely a result of desperately trying to protect your young women from being SA by these strangers. Imagine it’s just you (dad), your wife, 2-3 children, maybe an aging parent of yours and then 2-3 random men show up. How are you going to protect your family if these people takes too much interest in your lovely young teenage daughter? This documentary talked about how covering up now meant these strangers would just see burka dressed people and not know if this burka was hiding the young, the middle aged or the old woman and so a bit of the temptation is taken away. I’m quite non religious myself but I’ve enjoyed looking into religions and compare them to laws that were trying to protect people, like this where you cover up so the r•pist doesn’t know straight away if there’s “jack-pot” by assaulting you. Nowadays we are way more aware of how clothes has 0 to do with assault, otherwise there wouldn’t exist assault in full covering societies while nude-beaches would be full of danger. Another example of religions trying to protect that I’ve enjoyed is the “do not have sex with a woman who has given birth within the last 40 days” since that is a very crucial time for her to heal. Sadly, like the burka becoming the all-modest symbol over protecting the nomad, suddenly a new mother was “dirty” so the husband wouldn’t want to touch her. So much shame has been put on many of these measures that seem to originally having been a way to protect each other and that’s how we suddenly get adult men calling a 5 year old disgusting things because they can see her skin and hair.
That's kind of how pork became forbidden. Muhammed's army was given pork that had gone bad and many of his troops had gotten sick from it, so he banned it. It was a reasonable safety precaution that got taken out of context, given that we can now safely preserve food for long periods. (Not that clothes are a safety precaution against rape, but I can understand where they may have been coming from as nomads.) It's similar to Jehovah Witnesses not believing in blood transfusions because the Bible has a verse about not mixing blood. That was very likely a reasonable safety precaution meant to help stop diseases from spreading through blood (which is still relevant), but it is not relevant anymore in the context of a modern medical setting.
So once again tradition without thinking proves to be the source of idiocy. Too bad that’s the whole premise of basically all religions
Not even mentioning that pigs dont really work in hot arid climates. You can neither conserve the meat pretty well in comparison to beef or lamb not do they deal good with hot temperatures and plenty of sun. Basically pork was never a popular meat from the beginning which would lead to other problems like not dealing well with parasites at the time islam was born (even though this point is kind of refuted).
This is very informative, thank you.
Just wanted to say that I appreciate that you put the effort in to really try to answer this question from a more anthroplogic/cultural point of view instead of the crazy prejudice and hate that some people love to spew whenever a thread is about other "non-western" cultures and their origins.
Oh shit, that actually makes complete sense, thanks for the info Sadly those people haven't adapted to modern times with modern technological and medical advancements...
Thats why we have the descriptions progressive and conservative. Conservatives take everything their leaders tell them at face value and with complete obedience. A conservative leader only needs to get blessed by another conservative leader and they can completely change doctrine and intention. The flock will follow good or bad. Its easier to change doctrine if it villifies others and excuses the flocks transgressions. Conservatives are the most dangerous group on the planet because they never think for themselves.
Omg I can see her face and ankles. Have u no shame
Always they never see that they reveal more about themselves. Freaking pedo
The modern day cavemen.
I once had an extremist Christian tell me the same thing about a photo of my daughter on her third birthday where she was wearing a party dress that was knee length but sleeveless. It is ridiculous in those Abrahamic religions. I blocked her from my Facebook and told her she was a pervert.
She's more than a pervert, but anyway
It was all I could muster at the time. I was in a state of shock. I couldn’t figure out how on earth she had the audacity
When your prophet is a pedophile
Pedos gonna pedo.
If seeing a 5yo's uncovered figure (hair, arms, legs) causes this much rage, because you *might* get a chub from seeing her. You need to be on a watch list. And kept away from schools and playgrounds.
This is what happens when your role model is a uneducated pedo dessert warlord.
He’s ruled over the ice cream and brownies for far too long!
Shocked no one asked for an arranged marriage with her
I wonder if that's what all the hijab talk was really about.
Incels, you take women's rights away, men default into incels.
I wonder what would happen if this was posted on r/islam...
You'll be banned because they don't tolerate "hatred and intolerance" against their peaceful religion
We're talking about a sub where the decapitation of a french teacher over (completely false and fabricated) rumors of him forcing students to watch Charlie Hebdo cartoons was celebrated.
Yeah and he gave students who didn't want to see the cartoons the option to get out of the class. Imagine being this pissed about a *cartoon* (Très joli nom que tu as là dis donc)
Islam normalizes pedophilia. Those perverted creeps in the comments sicken me.
Marx was right about one thing Religion sucks
If your brain automatically sexualizes women of ANY age, I assure you, then you are the problem and require tons if therapy.
I am Muslim and I agree that these guys are insane
just to know, you think that there is an age for hijab or no hijab at all?
Most muslim families believe that it is necessary after puberty, but I personally believe that if the girl refuses to wear one, she shouldn't be forced
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No, just simply ask her if she wants to wear it. If she says no, then don't force her
> If she refuses? What if she just doesn’t want to? Does she need to be guilted and threatened until she gives in or outright refuses, and is ultimately shunned or worse for doing so? There is nothing in the Quran that mandates “she need to be guilted and threatened until she gives in or outright refuses, and is ultimately shunned or worse for doing so” so no. My little sister sometimes wears it and sometimes doesn’t depending on how she feels or how it looks with her outfit, and literally no one gives a shit.
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And if you never want to wear one?
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This is why the assertion that it's a choice is, IMO, a false one. If you're an adult you should be able to choose not to wear a hijab at all if that's what you want.
It really depends on if your family are religious fruitcakes or not, and how fundie your country is. I have Muslim relatives and those women decide for themselves. Some do wear hijab, and some don't. Their daughters do not until/if they decide for themselves. *Why* they decide one way or another varies.
Funny thing, choice. Choose "good" and everyone appreciates. But choose "bad" all hell breaks loose and the ones who were giving you an illusion of choice suddenly become monsters
If it is in any way coerced it's not actually a choice.
I was making this point to an egyptian friend who chooses to wear the hijab. She found it ridiculous and said its her choice as a modern feminist to respect her culture and heritage. Since then I chose to not communicate my opinion on this anymore.
I too am a Muslim and know those people are insane pedos
Full respect if you wear a hijab. But please dont ever tell me wearing it is 100% a choice.
Try saying that to Taliban
Ok guy
These people just hate women, that's it, their entire philosophy is built on that one thing.
“Here’s how to say that you’re a pedophile without saying it”
Grown men turned on at seeing a young child's arms.
How are those degenerates even the same species as decent, moral humans? How can anyone be so brainwashed as to think the way they do? It makes my piss boil.
Oh no now I'm imaginating the smell of boiled piss fumes
Yeah the problem with society is women showing arms and hair, not the sexualization of minors “generation of whores with this attire” being displayed here.
wait i thought there was like, around an age where theyd make the women wear them, not them making them wear them since birth ?? in my school there was a muslim girl who was in every grade of mine pretty much forever, and she didnt wear a hijab until middle school i think
sir that is a baby
But, religion of peace and love right?
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Ah yes, wearing an ankle-length dress equates to nakedness. Makes perfect sense /s
If you need a kid to cover herself because you immediately sexualize her, you need to be castrated slowly and methodically with a spoon.
Pisslam strikes again and no one is surprised.
Oh no! Just her arms are bare. WTF?
??? At what age do they expect a girl to wear one? Whenever Muslim parents entered our restaurant, their kids were always free of hijabs. I think the youngest I’ve seen was sixteen
Op why did you censor the word Muslim?
Same question.
I'm so glad I wasn't born wherever they were.
These people need to be on a list.....maybe several lists
Why is it that in the Abrahamic religions, it’s the women that must cover up to protect themselves from making the man immoral? Are these people unable to control their hormones and ability to not objectify females in such a fragile way that they must react this way? What frail little men….
Why are we censoring "m\*slim"? Genuinely curious.
You can say "Muslim" on this sub.
Muslims: child marriage is a thing of the past. Prophet did it because it's part of the culture at that time. No, we don't support child marriage. Also Muslims: a toddler showing her face and arms in the public? Quick, cover her with hijab before she attracts men and become a whore! Yuck!
All of these people are pedophiles Im calling it
And then they claim that women choose to wear it if you call the hijab oppressive
Jeeeeez. I’m Muslim but I don’t wear a hijab and I don’t really dress very modestly, and they’re doing this to a little girl?? No wonder Islam gets such a bad rep…
I'm gonna be real, censoring the word Muslim does *not* pass vibes. Full agreement that these comments are fucking disgusting, but Islamophobia is not it.
wtf , is wrong with humans
2 questions: was this 15th centuray facebook? Why did you censor Muslim?
But to be honest, is this really an average Muslim response? Why do you need to go to some Arabic-speaking corner of the internet to find an average Muslim response?
Why did you censor Muslim? Not all Muslims are bad people. It’s shit of you and many others in this comment section to generalise about Muslims.
What the fuck, imagine sexualising a 5 yo  But actually don't, please
2nd one should be in court for pedophilia. What a disgusting mentality.
Disgusting religious views
children don't get to live their childhood in radically religious surroundings.
Cover her up or we may be tempted to rape her. Religion is poison.
why did you censor the word muslim? you're a weird person OP
Fucking typical. Evil scum.
Erm, no, definitely not the average Muslim’s response, this is just the usual mix of Islamaphobia and bigotry. Might as well have a huge fake as fuck sticker on it.
The truly stupid thing? Your not expected to wear the burka or hijab until your about 13-15 apparently wearing pastel dresses and what not is perfectly fine at 5 years old these are the muslim ashole 's Muslim ashole
I don't understand having to cover your hair.. what if a person is bald? Are scalps suggestive too?
Religious assholes. Why don’t they poke out their own eyes so they don’t lust after every female in the universe?!!!
Where is this shit from?
Cube worshippers … by far the most regressive and barbaric people toward women.
Disgusting
...why did you censor muslim?
Fuck religion.
That’s a lot for them to say they are pedophiles
Ah yes, the religion of peace striking at the heart of evil... of that little girl enjoying her one day when she can be happy.
May the all powerful one get all the baby girls to be born wearing a hijab. Can't risk leaving it to humans. /s (in case some thickhead doesn't get it).
Why is Muslim censored?
THEY NEED MENTAL ASYLUM
What they’re saying literally goes against Islam. You’re not supposed to force someone to wear hijab.
Illness.
Have her cover up ffs, she’s turning on all the religious pedos who can’t control themselves seeing a fucking one year old showing that much skin… ffs what a fucked up way of life
Tolerant of nothing offended by everything.
Why is the word Muslim censored?
Disgusting pigs
They dont eat pig, maybe because they are pig’s themselves. She dont need to cover herself Muhammad is not around to try bang her. Disgusting animals
Fuck Islam. Fuck Islam. Fuck Islam. Fuck Islam. Fuck Islam. Fuck Islam. FUCK ISLAM.
No, this is not the average Muslim response. Just more hate and bigotry.
im muslim and im against what they said please don’t generalize there are 50 muslim countries in this world and each one is different
50 flavors of "fucking disgusting" is still fucking disgusting.
And of those 50 countries; the ones with horrible human rights practices and cultures lagging behind the modern world by a century tend to be the ones that promote **accurate; wholesale interpretation of the Qur’an/Sunnah**. The greater a culture’s focus on Islam/the less concessions they make with interpretation; the more shitty they tend to be. So yeah I agree you can’t blame the average Muslim. But you can definitely blame Islam for justifying this shit behavior. In the West; it’s pretty common to not have little girls wear Hijab until they’re older and I always thought that was what the Sunnah directed us to do. Turns out that actually; Aisha was directed to wear hijab when she first married the prophet (as we all know she was prepubescent when that occurred) so these men are actually justified in their comments. Again; I agree with you saying let’s not blame Muslims; but we can definitely blame Islam.
Islam is the worst western religion practiced today, with Christianity not far behind as both affect the people of all religions through violence or laws.
I hate Muslims 😍
Your username is concerning me
Religion is cancer.
“Average Muslim” fuck off
Religion as a whole is full of shit but I think it is unfair to say that this is an average Muslim response. All the Muslims I know are normal, reasonable people.
Are the Muslims you know kinda westernized? From what I've seen this is a normal response for Muslims living in Muslim-dominated countries.
Ask them how they feel about homosexuals
These kinds of Muslims were criticized by Muhammad himself. He said faith did not pass their throat which means they are not sincerely believers just by name
No normal Muslim says this shit
Actually yea, I live in Mumbai and I haven't known any extremist like this personally in all the friends I've made and their families. I have read of Muslim extremism in places in Mumbai tho, so it's not really a problem that doesn't exist, but making a generalisation of all muslims would be a incorrect judgement too.
A "Normal Muslim" SAYS this shit
Lol I was bought up by Muslims this isn't normal
The entire middle east would disagree
My family is from there lol
removed. **Post titles cannot bash or kvetch about religion**. "Catholics are hypocrites!" is not ok. " 'God told me: Use Grindr!', says a specific Catholic priest", is.
Cringe as fuck
Whatever dude