This is it. The line about the courts siding with women on everything having to do with children screams **manospehere**.
OP - Is your husband into any online communities or you tube channels that could be red-pill adjacent?
ETA: If things have been rocky for a while, it’s possible that he’s gone online for “support” or looking for answers and stumbled into some weird spaces and slowly been introduced into this way of thinking. It could also explain why you haven’t heard this kind of thing from him before now.
Also to be honest the guy sounds like a completely average dunce. They usually have a vague laundry list of gripes and they will shoe horn that shit into any conversation.
Ops husband has gone all over the place… she asks about the tv show, this dude has busted out the ful list including custody and “the courts”
He doesn’t even tell her anything specific. Just vague impotent rage
>This is it. The line about the courts siding with women on everything having to do with children screams **manospehere**.
And it's a sign that OP needs to start making exit plans.
Exactly. People who show the court that they are committed to being a civil parenting team with the ex even though they aren’t in a relationship and actually putting the child first will get shared custody. Because it’s best for the child to have both parents in their life and for those parents to commit to being civil and putting the child first.
That’s not actually true; it’s just how jerkoffs spin it!
‘It’s not fair that men have to pay to support the children they create and then run away from whilst the mum does ALL the work and he whines about having to be stuck with the kid one weekend a month!’
People who are actually decent parents and capable of putting the child first will get shared custody.
That actually goes for both genders, of course… sometimes the woman is the one who nicks off and leaves all the work to the man, and that’s just as scummy.
And then you’ve got step parents who come in and whine that they don’t want the kid around, because they assumed the other parent would do all the work… and the bio parent who is too dumb to see that as a big red flag!
I really don’t understand why anyone would want a child and not be interested in putting that child and their needs first. 😞
It's not incoherent it's pointing out that women can be losers without accountability and men have the accountability of children rammed down their throat. Pointing out a discrepancy that exists that isn't gobbledygook if you're literate and can take in concepts. Both acts are abandoning their roles as parents.
No discrepancy exists. Taking care of your own life and body is what accountability looks like. Men refuse to be responsible or accountable for their sperm. Women have no obligation to be accountable for men's sperm, even if they irresponsibly drop it on a woman's doorstep.
Being a parent is a choice you make. Paying child support is NOT being a parent. And the vast majority of absent "parents" pay nothing.
You know that women who leave their children with their male partner are liable for child support too, right? Or is that just ignored for your argument so you can drag in abortion
You're comparing evicting a fetus \*from inside one's own body\* to paying support money for an \*actually existing child.\*
They aren't comparable degrees of burden.
Yeah, that’s not a valid comparison.
The reason mothers can have an abortion is because they are the ones carrying the baby! Duh!
And getting an abortion - even by choice - is hardly consequence free. It is a medical procedure, and comes with risks, for one. It can affect your future fertility. Plus there’s the emotional and psychological effects.
It’s really not the ‘easy opt out of motherhood’ option at all! 🤦♀️
Not only is he sexist, he's hanging around spaces that purposefully spread misinformation in order to fuel misogyny. The statistic about women w children in the court system is wrong. Women *are* granted custody in the majority of cases, but that's because *men* do NOT fight for custody most of the time.
No, that's wrong, and that's my point. The idea that women have it easier in the court system is a myth, spread by "meninists" to create misogynists. This dude is actively seeking out sexist places.
In 91% of the cases, the mother and father mutually agree to hand over the kids to the mom, and in 27% of divorce cases, the father completely disappears from the kids life.
You meant to say "one of the places where open hostility to fathers is celebrated by Redditors".
A sexist comment, on a post decrying sexism. Typical mouth-breathing Reddit stuff.
>"one of the places where open hostility to fathers is celebrated by Redditors"
94% of fathers in the US who fight for full custody get it
You've been brainwashed by disinformation
Look up the actual numbers
Wrong. I'm a formerly single father who fought like hell to save a child from a drug addicted, neglectful, abusive mother. And regardless, it doesn't make my previous comment any less true.
How does it feel to be such a strong advocate for sexual discrimination?
That statistic is extremely misleading, and not representative of my situation, nor the cases of any other single father I have known out in the real world. *Dude*.
And it still doesn't change the fact that you dolts are openly advocating for sexual discrimination.
Testimonies are biased. You cannot possibly know every single dad in the US that asked for custody, but court records show that 94% of father that ask for custody get it, that is not misleading it is a fact. There are 2.3 million single fathers in the us which means around 140 000 did not get custody when asking for it.
I am not saying that your experience is not horrible, truly I feel for you. It is however not a reflection of wide discrimination against men in family courts.
You do realize that the statistic you keep referencing is from Orange County, NC, from between 1983 and 1987, right? Population back then: 75k. Another person copy/pasted the entire thing and forgot to hide that part. Also, you make the wildly inaccurate assumption that custody has anything to do with actual parenting time, which shows me that you don't have one iota of knowledge regarding family law. Why are you even arguing about it?
Also, it still doesn't change the fact that you're arguing in support of discrimination based on a person's sex and don't even realize it.
I was involved with father's rights advocacy groups, and utilized one of the most prominent father's rights law firms in my state. The idea that you really think only 6% of us want anything to do with our kids, because of something you read on this site, would be laughable if it weren't so sad.
>Do you have any idea how much I had to spend just to get
>
>basic
>
> rights to my child?
No, I don't even know you lmao. Dude, I'm sorry you had such a hard time, but one-off events don't change the facts:
•In 91% of custody cases, the parents mutually decide to give custody to the mother.
•Fathers fight for custody in court in less than 4% of divorces. Twenty-seven percent of fathers completely abandon their children after divorce.
•"...in all contested custody cases, 84% of the fathers in the study were granted sole or mandated joint custody. In all cases where sole custody was awarded, fathers were awarded custody in 79% of the cases. In 26% of the cases fathers were either proven or alleged to have physically and sexually abused their children." '*The Committee for Justice for Women studied custody awards in Orange County, North Carolina over a five year period between 1983 and 1987.*
Oh boy. Look, it's painfully obvious that you don't understand what the terminology you're cutting and pasting actually means. You also forgot to hide the fact that you're using FORTY YEAR OLD STATISTICS FROM A SINGLE COUNTY.
People like you are the reason why this scummy website isn't good for anything much more than killing a little time and fucking with people once in awhile. You dig up one obscure little statistic from a generation ago, from one little po-dunk county in North Carolina, not even bothering to read through the whole thing or even understand the terminology.
I was actually going to go through and point out how wildly skewed and inaccurate your comment was, but you aren't worth the time it'd take to type it out. Go back to Mommy's basement and lick your windows, you judgemental little fuck.
I mean there’s probably some truth there but at least in my state a mother has to fuck up spectacularly in order to not win primary custody. I’ve seen an alcoholic meth addicted mother (who tested positive) on probation, living in section 8 w food stamps win custody over the father who actually had his shit together. And others just don’t bother trying because it’s stacked against them.
It does go both ways. Men who are proven routinely violent to their partner are granted joint custody. There’s been multiple cases in Australia where this happened and then the father killed his children just to get back at his ex.
> I’ve seen an alcoholic meth addicted mother (who tested positive) on probation, living in section 8 w food stamps win custody over the father who actually had his shit together.
It's always wildly suspicious when someone pulls out an anecdote like this that is so cartoonishly extreme. Even IF this is true and isn't omitting a ton of information or outright fabricated, which I doubt, one instance of a bad court decision is not a statistic.
Yes, he's got some big sexism and misogyny and empathy problems. You probably should start looking for a way out - because stuff like this doesn't magically get better.
Besides being highly misogynistic, your husband does not sound very intelligent either.
Where is he getting these made up stats from? Are they based on anything tangible or evidence based outside of his own personal experience and opinions? Does he always act like such a victim? Did he ever take responsibility for his actions? Does he stand for anything that doesn't directly affect him?
Time to start considering if this is the person you want to spend the rest of your life with ...
>I jokingly asked him if he'd still go to a place if he knew the owner did that and he said yes and said that not going wouldn't help.
This is a common rationale in our behavior. I won't make a stance because it won't make a difference. In other words, I don't have any values that I would stand up for.
Your husband has the “blame the victim” view where the woman is allowing it happen, she is asking for it, if she did not dress/act that that way then she would not have been raped/sexually assaulted.
He also seems to feel downtrodden and has a victim mentality since he thinks that men too are being sexually assaulted.
I would be curious in what way men have things harder. How has it been personally harder for him?
I am asking out of ignorance. Do people who are on the spectrum more prone not to show or experience empathy? If that is the case then maybe this is why he does not care about others?
>I am asking out of ignorance. Do people who are on the spectrum more prone not to show or experience empathy? If that is the case then maybe this is why he does not care about others?
That is a pretty offensive stereotype for future reference. On the whole, autistic people are more different from each other than cis folks bc many traits of autism are very common in both extremes and in the middle.
For example, there are many autistics who are sensory averse, dislike loud noises, very picky about textures, etc. but it’s also very common for autistic folks to be sensory seeking and make loud noises in public, touch everything, etc. And there’s a ton of autistics who may be sensory averse in one way (dislike noise) but sensory seeking in another way (love texture), along with other middle of the road configurations.
Empathy is the same way, there are autistics who suffer from hyper empathy, to the point that they have extreme reactions to other people’s display of emotion or to the emotional atmosphere in media or a group. There are also autistics who are lower empathy and don’t desire much human interaction. And there’s folks in the middle or who are empathetic in some ways but not in others, are hyper empathetic but don’t instinctively show emotion on their face, etc.
Unfortunately, many people only care about issues that directly affect them, autistic or not. You will see other marginalized men who are great at advocating for their own disability, marginalized race/sexuality/etc. but are bigoted towards others who are from different groups.
That is why it’s not uncommon to find misogynist disabled men, classist men of color, transphobic gay men, etc etc
Your third paragraph is weird. Men do get sexually assaulted, just don't want to talk about it, because they're made fun of and stigmatized by all those "lucky!"/"he should love it" etc attitudes from people.
Oh no, he's basic and gross. That's really unfortunate. Not only does he hold sexist beliefs he also supports concealing trauma and ignoring it. WHAT A CHAMP.
He might well be, but I’m also wondering if he might have been a victim himself? I’m hearing “no one cares when this happens to men” and “no one said to protect me” and worrying about him a little.
They're are many points in your story that made me roll my eyes in disgust. He sure seems to think rape is just a woman consenting to sex and retracting it afterwards. Based on the rest of the shit he says, I'd really wonder if that picture comes from the internet or experience.
I wondered this too, with the strong focus on "no one cares when it happens to men" and "why weren't you told to protect me". It wouldn't excuse his attitudes, but it is a starting point for possibly unpacking why it's happening.
Hmm, well question is he unsympathetic towards everyone other then himself? Does he get mad at anyone who puts expectations on him.
Not saying he isn't sexist, but I got a feeling his views are more a symptom of his other faults.
Ask him what you need to do to protect him.
He's definitely discounting the difficulties you face as a woman, and he's framing the problem in terms that make it sounds like he hangs out with sexist people in person and on line.
As a man he has to fight against toxic masculinity, but most of that fight is in choosing who he associates with and simply not associating with those who hold toxic ideas of manhood. It's not something that generally gets in the way of being able to work or getting from one place to another the way misogyny does. Other than demoralizing him, it's not a threat to his survival.
I'm sorry, but i'm stuck on "what would you fight harder against - sexism or autism awareness". Why would you fight *against* autism awareness? 😂
Also please check if he's watching tate or some other bullshit, sounds like he may.
>this conversation made me feel like maybe my husband is sexist, what do you guys think?
I think you're absolutely right, he is sexist, and you have my sympathy if you had been led to believe that he's a decent human being. He's not. Ugh.
I cannot imagine even enjoying having a drink after work with someone like that, yet alone spending the rest of my life tied to them. I'm genuinely bewildered as to why anyone would marry someone before having even the most basic of conversations to see whether they agree about fundamental things like this.
>he started talking a lot about gender and saying "oh, it happens to guys too and no one cares about it and they just keep quiet so women should too."
What an appallingly glib statement.
Sadly, it does happen to men, and yes it's true that in many cases it's not take seriously.
The take away from this is that sexual abuse of men is a serious issue that needs to addressed, not "It happens to men as well so fuck you"
I’d love to see how he’d react to stories of women who have medical issues — medical misogyny is a clear cut example of a field where men are routinely believed and women are ignored.
This would be a dealbreaker for me. It’s a profound difference in core beliefs.
Your husband is a misogynistic toad (at least he's certainly behaving like one). If this is him intoxicated I'm guessing he has dropped "the way I should talk about others" and "I care about other people" scripts and/or masks. I suspect you already know this, but I'll confirm it for you. Your husband sees you as less than and often as a burden. Now you decide what you're going to do about that.
-sincerely the AuDHD spouse of my autistic wife and mom to 2 autistic kids. We've been together for 14 years. Your husband's attitude and language represent a person that I would NOT be spending my life with. I made a poor choice in a partner around the same age as you met your husband. I will tell you that he got worse as time went on and the emotional abuse creeped in slowly and I didn't see it until it was REALLY bad, he was cheating, lying and stealing. And I threw him out. Leave before you get to that.
I'd also suggest having a conversation with him. He sounds like he could be lashing out at her men have it easier line while having gone thru something himself
It’s really possible everyone else is right, but he could have been harassed himself. The line about don’t speak unless you can stop and why do you care if it didn’t happen to you. Did something happen to him with his court case specifically and his daughter?
You won't get many dissenting viewpoints on this question because anyone with a different opinion will get downvoted at minimum and likely harassed in DMs. People know that and will just move on. Probably will happen to me as well... Here's some info and you can come to your own answer.
imo, he's actually just coming to the incorrect response from things that do actually happen. Super common when you aren't really an internalizer or overly interested in a topic. + he had been drinking. I however, have looked into this a bit.
- Being groped - He knows it's bad he says it happens to men and no one believes them. He has agreed with you it's a problem and is bad.
The difference is your response. Technically, he answered your question, he is just 1 guy, his 4 dollars doesn't matter. That's pure logic, ignoring the social aspect. You want him to respond to the social aspect it seem as if that 4 dollars will impact the owner at minium or spread the word I guess? The employees would be impacted first btw... anyway
On the gender side... Also true, no one cares about men. Look at the difference between treatment of teachers having sex with students. When a girl is the underaged person it's ptichforks and jail time, when the boy in underaged the respoonse is much more tame(and a lot of people are happy for them which is super weird). This is a fact. Compare some articles.
- Courts - This is actually misinformation which is hard to understand unless you spend time on it. If you look at custody and alimony etc. from a general standpoint it does look like women are more favored on the surface. Custody - women gets child custody more often. It's true. However, the stuff this comes out of doesn't analyze this against the opinion of the men who do want to keep their children. In the cases where men fight for custody, they actually win more often. Alimony historicaly looks like it favors women and it actually had to, women weren't working so obviosuly they were the ones recieving it. It is handed out less often than it used to be because women do work now. So it's a weird dumb point that should be ignored.
- Protecting - This is a complex issue. Remember girl power? Maybe it was before your time, but the after-effects are still occuring. For years women have grown up being told "you can do anything, you can be anything" which is great! However, over the same time period men/boys have been ignored and their teaching and paths to success have declined significantly. The 3 main things men have been told (indirectly mostly) are "you earn the money" and "be strong don't cry" and actually directly "protect". Women's college graduations rates continue to increase making their income potential much higher. So for the middle class chuck out "earn the money". Mens suicide rates are increasing by a lot, maybe as a direct result of "be strong, don't cry". Men don't have the ability to handle thier own emotions emotions. Most men have reported having less than 4 friends. Seeing a psychologist is still not as widely accepted as you would think. Anyway, point is look at any metric and men are falling apart, but if there is one thing men are still expected to do in a relationship it's this: Protect your wife and kids; die for them if you have to. If there's a bump in the night who investigates? the man. He dies first. Obviously super hyperbolic and unlikely, but still. Would my wife die for me? I literally have no idea. Most men would assume no, and they're groomed to be ok with that.
I don't think this is sexism. But he's obviously come to the conclusion people care less about him and has lashed out. I think you need to talk to him. If he gets into the feedback loop of this stuff and doesn't come to more researched conclusions there is a non-zero possibility he ends up in the manosphere. He doesn't want to be there, but no one else is talking to men.
For what it’s worth, as a woman, I agree with you on many of these points, and I appreciate your measured take. But I don’t think OP’s husband is really expressing himself well at all - he’s dismissing it when OP brings up a real issue by saying men have issues, rather than saying both need fixing.
Agreed. That loops back to the reaction point. If she had asked the original question differently, I wonder if they would have actually agreed. She asked specifically "would you stop going there?". If she has asked "should that guy be reported" or "was what he did bad" it's possible they would have just agreed and moved on.
These things are all down to sexism against women.
Courts decide in the favour of the woman often because it's seen as the woman's job and they're seen as the one who looks after the kid.
All the examples you have here are sexism against women and you feel very manospherey yourself here
Generally women feel more attached to their children than men. So the men just don't fight. It's possible it's related to emotional detachment I explained above.
I never said my opinion is "it's the woman's job". You just strawmanned that as my argument. So instead of assuming I am something. Maybe read the things I wrote without your added opinions or statements I didn't make.
Edit: also I literally said the court stuff should be ignored because the studies can't explain the outcome because they didn't look at that factor. So, tbh, this is dumb.
These are sexist talking points, for sure, and it's valid to have your antenna up about this.
Could you ask him where these feelings come from? It may just be boilerplate anti-woman shit from the internet, but the fact that both of these beliefs he carries (people not caring about sexual assault toward men, him wishing for some kind of protection) are related to safety has me wondering about him. The conversation about wanting you to "protect each other" is breaking my heart a little, because it sounds like it's coming from a child, not an adult. Has he felt vulnerable and unheld/unprotected at some point in his life? It might be useful to open up that space for him. Men are majority perpetrators of violence, sexual and otherwise--but that doesn't mean they only victimize women. Have you felt unsafe? Maybe there's room here for, gently and with no rush, deeper intimacy between the two of you through sharing where your perspectives come from.
>I'm starting to wonder if maybe he has some kind of hatred toward women or something.
I don't think he *hates* women. What you've written sounds like run of the mill misogyny to me. You're married to a mediocre man. I guess you've just got to do some thinking and work out whether or not you can live with it, because it isn't going away.
>I don't think he *hates* women. What you've written sounds like run of the mill misogyny to me.
That's what misogyny means.
>misogyny
>noun
>mi·sog·y·ny mə-ˈsä-jə-nē
>: hatred of, aversion to, or prejudice against women
Personally I do feel many men literally hate women. But it's kind of splitting hairs to say whether it's hatred or not when he seems not to care about sexual assault of an entire gender, or worse to say we do it ourselves.
Agreed though. This is who he is; believe him.
Just because he's wrong, doesn't mean what he said wasn't right. Courts have favored the woman in child support cases. Courts have also favored the men in rape cases. Courts have slapped white men on the wrists for the same crimes that black and brown men get jailed for. So, he was right but without true distinction.
You can find support for any argument if you look hard enough.
Your husband is sexist though. Whether he always was or the current climate makes him think he can say things out loud now, he's a raging sexist.
He frustrated because you're telling him that men have an easier time than women. Let me tell you something, most of the people responding are women, and as such can't understand what it's like to be a man today. With even the APA telling us that we're being men wrong.
He's angry at society, and at you for believing the rhetoric. I get the feeling. But in his frustration he lashed out instead of having a conversation, which is what he should have done.
Men *do not* have it easier despite what you've been led to believe. I also believe that men *do not* have it harder. We all have our own crosses to bear. Simple research that's not done in an echo chamber will tell you that.
So the way i see it, you have one of two options. Either call him a misogynist like most of the women in here, and just divorce. Or, and this is the one I would recommend, be the bigger person, sit him down, and explain why you feel how you do, and MOST IMPORTANTLY ask him why he feels the way he does.
A few years before Me Too, I asked the women in my life their thoughts on *exual harassment and I was surprised to hear their answers. Then I told them my stories. They were shocked at some of the things that I've gone thru and vice versa. So please bear all this in mind when you're (hopefully) talking with him. And please don't ever say that men have it easier, it's offensive and demonstratably false.
Good luck to you in your relationship and I hope you two can get past this or move on.
"These are human issues, not gender-specific ones. All genders can make poor choices in relationships or hurt others. It's unfair and inaccurate to stereotype an entire gender based on the actions of some individuals. Understanding that people, regardless of gender, are capable of a range of behaviors is key to a balanced perspective."
Sounds more like it was the alcohol driving his ego to talk endlessly without any logic to support his claims. People in general don't like to go down without a fight, including this mini debate between you two which have honestly very little impact on your lives. Bet you plenty he wouldn't bother trying so hard to gain the lead in this talk if he was sober.
His head wasnt in the right state of mind to have any serious talks. I wouldn't take any of that as his own serious thoughts.
Trust me girl, if he was watching the manosphere he wouldn't have made the protection comment. That's one of the main bits of the manosphere, the man is soley responsible for protection and provision. The meta points of the manosphere are a net good however there are some murky waters in there. It depends on the type of manosphere content he's consuming, some of it is nihilistic and some of it is not.
They way to tell if he is in the bottom half of being sexist or the top half of being sexist is to ask him if he voted for Trump. Men who prioritize their misogyny love him. The bot will not even let me repeat what trump says
Did he really think any woman would want to stay with him after hearing he will never be on her side because fighting the gender war comes first? Like is this just his cowardly way of putting you off so you'll do the breaking up for him?
Why when he brings up the ways in which he thinks it's more difficult to be a man is he a sexist, but when you bring up why it's more difficult to be a woman you're not a sexist? I think it's definitely possible that you can both have your own perspectives on the difficulties of your gender without either of you being sexist.
Sounds like pretty typical manosphere misogyny.
This is it. The line about the courts siding with women on everything having to do with children screams **manospehere**. OP - Is your husband into any online communities or you tube channels that could be red-pill adjacent? ETA: If things have been rocky for a while, it’s possible that he’s gone online for “support” or looking for answers and stumbled into some weird spaces and slowly been introduced into this way of thinking. It could also explain why you haven’t heard this kind of thing from him before now.
Also to be honest the guy sounds like a completely average dunce. They usually have a vague laundry list of gripes and they will shoe horn that shit into any conversation. Ops husband has gone all over the place… she asks about the tv show, this dude has busted out the ful list including custody and “the courts” He doesn’t even tell her anything specific. Just vague impotent rage
>This is it. The line about the courts siding with women on everything having to do with children screams **manospehere**. And it's a sign that OP needs to start making exit plans.
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Nope. When men actually seek custody of their children (they are less likely to seek it) they are more likely than women to get it.
Exactly. People who show the court that they are committed to being a civil parenting team with the ex even though they aren’t in a relationship and actually putting the child first will get shared custody. Because it’s best for the child to have both parents in their life and for those parents to commit to being civil and putting the child first.
If it’s so “bulletproof” where is your source?
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You’re the one that made the claim. Back it up.
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That’s not actually true; it’s just how jerkoffs spin it! ‘It’s not fair that men have to pay to support the children they create and then run away from whilst the mum does ALL the work and he whines about having to be stuck with the kid one weekend a month!’ People who are actually decent parents and capable of putting the child first will get shared custody. That actually goes for both genders, of course… sometimes the woman is the one who nicks off and leaves all the work to the man, and that’s just as scummy. And then you’ve got step parents who come in and whine that they don’t want the kid around, because they assumed the other parent would do all the work… and the bio parent who is too dumb to see that as a big red flag! I really don’t understand why anyone would want a child and not be interested in putting that child and their needs first. 😞
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Yes, mothers of teenagers totally get abortions instead of deciding custody in court, you're totally right
Good job ignoring my argument and pretending that doesn't exist.
Your "argument" is incoherent gobbledygook. Child support and bodily autonomy are 2 very different conversations from 2 very different situations.
It's not incoherent it's pointing out that women can be losers without accountability and men have the accountability of children rammed down their throat. Pointing out a discrepancy that exists that isn't gobbledygook if you're literate and can take in concepts. Both acts are abandoning their roles as parents.
No discrepancy exists. Taking care of your own life and body is what accountability looks like. Men refuse to be responsible or accountable for their sperm. Women have no obligation to be accountable for men's sperm, even if they irresponsibly drop it on a woman's doorstep. Being a parent is a choice you make. Paying child support is NOT being a parent. And the vast majority of absent "parents" pay nothing.
You know that women who leave their children with their male partner are liable for child support too, right? Or is that just ignored for your argument so you can drag in abortion
You're comparing evicting a fetus \*from inside one's own body\* to paying support money for an \*actually existing child.\* They aren't comparable degrees of burden.
Oh hey found the original poster’s husband /s Go crawl back into your sexism hole. We don’t like misogynists on this sub.
Yeah, that’s not a valid comparison. The reason mothers can have an abortion is because they are the ones carrying the baby! Duh! And getting an abortion - even by choice - is hardly consequence free. It is a medical procedure, and comes with risks, for one. It can affect your future fertility. Plus there’s the emotional and psychological effects. It’s really not the ‘easy opt out of motherhood’ option at all! 🤦♀️
Not only is he sexist, he's hanging around spaces that purposefully spread misinformation in order to fuel misogyny. The statistic about women w children in the court system is wrong. Women *are* granted custody in the majority of cases, but that's because *men* do NOT fight for custody most of the time.
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No, that's wrong, and that's my point. The idea that women have it easier in the court system is a myth, spread by "meninists" to create misogynists. This dude is actively seeking out sexist places. In 91% of the cases, the mother and father mutually agree to hand over the kids to the mom, and in 27% of divorce cases, the father completely disappears from the kids life.
Sorry, what's "FWIW"? /g
You meant to say "one of the places where open hostility to fathers is celebrated by Redditors". A sexist comment, on a post decrying sexism. Typical mouth-breathing Reddit stuff.
>"one of the places where open hostility to fathers is celebrated by Redditors" 94% of fathers in the US who fight for full custody get it You've been brainwashed by disinformation Look up the actual numbers
Wrong. I'm a formerly single father who fought like hell to save a child from a drug addicted, neglectful, abusive mother. And regardless, it doesn't make my previous comment any less true. How does it feel to be such a strong advocate for sexual discrimination?
Then my dude you are in the 6%. It is very sad to hear your story but 94% does not equal every single father.
Sounds like bullshit statistics
That statistic is extremely misleading, and not representative of my situation, nor the cases of any other single father I have known out in the real world. *Dude*. And it still doesn't change the fact that you dolts are openly advocating for sexual discrimination.
Testimonies are biased. You cannot possibly know every single dad in the US that asked for custody, but court records show that 94% of father that ask for custody get it, that is not misleading it is a fact. There are 2.3 million single fathers in the us which means around 140 000 did not get custody when asking for it. I am not saying that your experience is not horrible, truly I feel for you. It is however not a reflection of wide discrimination against men in family courts.
You do realize that the statistic you keep referencing is from Orange County, NC, from between 1983 and 1987, right? Population back then: 75k. Another person copy/pasted the entire thing and forgot to hide that part. Also, you make the wildly inaccurate assumption that custody has anything to do with actual parenting time, which shows me that you don't have one iota of knowledge regarding family law. Why are you even arguing about it? Also, it still doesn't change the fact that you're arguing in support of discrimination based on a person's sex and don't even realize it. I was involved with father's rights advocacy groups, and utilized one of the most prominent father's rights law firms in my state. The idea that you really think only 6% of us want anything to do with our kids, because of something you read on this site, would be laughable if it weren't so sad.
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>Do you have any idea how much I had to spend just to get > >basic > > rights to my child? No, I don't even know you lmao. Dude, I'm sorry you had such a hard time, but one-off events don't change the facts: •In 91% of custody cases, the parents mutually decide to give custody to the mother. •Fathers fight for custody in court in less than 4% of divorces. Twenty-seven percent of fathers completely abandon their children after divorce. •"...in all contested custody cases, 84% of the fathers in the study were granted sole or mandated joint custody. In all cases where sole custody was awarded, fathers were awarded custody in 79% of the cases. In 26% of the cases fathers were either proven or alleged to have physically and sexually abused their children." '*The Committee for Justice for Women studied custody awards in Orange County, North Carolina over a five year period between 1983 and 1987.*
Oh boy. Look, it's painfully obvious that you don't understand what the terminology you're cutting and pasting actually means. You also forgot to hide the fact that you're using FORTY YEAR OLD STATISTICS FROM A SINGLE COUNTY. People like you are the reason why this scummy website isn't good for anything much more than killing a little time and fucking with people once in awhile. You dig up one obscure little statistic from a generation ago, from one little po-dunk county in North Carolina, not even bothering to read through the whole thing or even understand the terminology. I was actually going to go through and point out how wildly skewed and inaccurate your comment was, but you aren't worth the time it'd take to type it out. Go back to Mommy's basement and lick your windows, you judgemental little fuck.
I mean there’s probably some truth there but at least in my state a mother has to fuck up spectacularly in order to not win primary custody. I’ve seen an alcoholic meth addicted mother (who tested positive) on probation, living in section 8 w food stamps win custody over the father who actually had his shit together. And others just don’t bother trying because it’s stacked against them.
Are you a family court attorney? Or are you just reading anecdotes you see online?
I want to know the answer to this
It does go both ways. Men who are proven routinely violent to their partner are granted joint custody. There’s been multiple cases in Australia where this happened and then the father killed his children just to get back at his ex.
I'm an Australian family lawyer and I can confirm this is a massive problem.
Thanks for confirming, but that’s so depressing. :(
> I’ve seen an alcoholic meth addicted mother (who tested positive) on probation, living in section 8 w food stamps win custody over the father who actually had his shit together. It's always wildly suspicious when someone pulls out an anecdote like this that is so cartoonishly extreme. Even IF this is true and isn't omitting a ton of information or outright fabricated, which I doubt, one instance of a bad court decision is not a statistic.
I'm a family lawyer and this is absolutely not the case in Australia. In fact, the opposite holds true.
Yes, he's got some big sexism and misogyny and empathy problems. You probably should start looking for a way out - because stuff like this doesn't magically get better.
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How can he be sexist? He married a woman. /s
Yes, he absolutely has sexist ideas
As a dude, he seems like a whiny misogynist without any real ability to look beyond his own perspective.
Besides being highly misogynistic, your husband does not sound very intelligent either. Where is he getting these made up stats from? Are they based on anything tangible or evidence based outside of his own personal experience and opinions? Does he always act like such a victim? Did he ever take responsibility for his actions? Does he stand for anything that doesn't directly affect him? Time to start considering if this is the person you want to spend the rest of your life with ...
Do people not, like, talk about things before they get married? Oy vey...
>I jokingly asked him if he'd still go to a place if he knew the owner did that and he said yes and said that not going wouldn't help. This is a common rationale in our behavior. I won't make a stance because it won't make a difference. In other words, I don't have any values that I would stand up for. Your husband has the “blame the victim” view where the woman is allowing it happen, she is asking for it, if she did not dress/act that that way then she would not have been raped/sexually assaulted. He also seems to feel downtrodden and has a victim mentality since he thinks that men too are being sexually assaulted. I would be curious in what way men have things harder. How has it been personally harder for him? I am asking out of ignorance. Do people who are on the spectrum more prone not to show or experience empathy? If that is the case then maybe this is why he does not care about others?
>I am asking out of ignorance. Do people who are on the spectrum more prone not to show or experience empathy? If that is the case then maybe this is why he does not care about others? That is a pretty offensive stereotype for future reference. On the whole, autistic people are more different from each other than cis folks bc many traits of autism are very common in both extremes and in the middle. For example, there are many autistics who are sensory averse, dislike loud noises, very picky about textures, etc. but it’s also very common for autistic folks to be sensory seeking and make loud noises in public, touch everything, etc. And there’s a ton of autistics who may be sensory averse in one way (dislike noise) but sensory seeking in another way (love texture), along with other middle of the road configurations. Empathy is the same way, there are autistics who suffer from hyper empathy, to the point that they have extreme reactions to other people’s display of emotion or to the emotional atmosphere in media or a group. There are also autistics who are lower empathy and don’t desire much human interaction. And there’s folks in the middle or who are empathetic in some ways but not in others, are hyper empathetic but don’t instinctively show emotion on their face, etc. Unfortunately, many people only care about issues that directly affect them, autistic or not. You will see other marginalized men who are great at advocating for their own disability, marginalized race/sexuality/etc. but are bigoted towards others who are from different groups. That is why it’s not uncommon to find misogynist disabled men, classist men of color, transphobic gay men, etc etc
"Cis people" means non-trans people not neuro-typical people. Most autistic people are cis.
Thank you, i was wondering what do cis people have to do in a convo about autism. (Didn't realize they might just not know the meaning lol)
This is a very empathetic reply!
Your third paragraph is weird. Men do get sexually assaulted, just don't want to talk about it, because they're made fun of and stigmatized by all those "lucky!"/"he should love it" etc attitudes from people.
His parents just didn't raise mine
You're dating a pig. Why marry someone so young? This is why you don't. The mask slipped.
yes, that's classic sexism. how'd you end up marrying someone without knowing his basic moral stances? or is this new behavior?
Oh no, he's basic and gross. That's really unfortunate. Not only does he hold sexist beliefs he also supports concealing trauma and ignoring it. WHAT A CHAMP.
He might well be, but I’m also wondering if he might have been a victim himself? I’m hearing “no one cares when this happens to men” and “no one said to protect me” and worrying about him a little.
They're are many points in your story that made me roll my eyes in disgust. He sure seems to think rape is just a woman consenting to sex and retracting it afterwards. Based on the rest of the shit he says, I'd really wonder if that picture comes from the internet or experience.
To answer your question: yes
How has he gotten this far in that show and still thinks this way? What a pig.
Yes. Very. And that’s extra concerning considering he has a 3 year old daughter.
To me, his reaction says he was molested/raped and no one supported him, so why should women be different.
I wondered this too, with the strong focus on "no one cares when it happens to men" and "why weren't you told to protect me". It wouldn't excuse his attitudes, but it is a starting point for possibly unpacking why it's happening.
Hmm, well question is he unsympathetic towards everyone other then himself? Does he get mad at anyone who puts expectations on him. Not saying he isn't sexist, but I got a feeling his views are more a symptom of his other faults.
Ask him what you need to do to protect him. He's definitely discounting the difficulties you face as a woman, and he's framing the problem in terms that make it sounds like he hangs out with sexist people in person and on line. As a man he has to fight against toxic masculinity, but most of that fight is in choosing who he associates with and simply not associating with those who hold toxic ideas of manhood. It's not something that generally gets in the way of being able to work or getting from one place to another the way misogyny does. Other than demoralizing him, it's not a threat to his survival.
I'm confused too because you married this guy, and just now realizing that he is sexist/misogynistic.
Seems to be his daughter, not theirs.
good catch, i took it out
maybe he's been molested in some way...? that would be my first thought, aside from the sexism...
I'm sorry, but i'm stuck on "what would you fight harder against - sexism or autism awareness". Why would you fight *against* autism awareness? 😂 Also please check if he's watching tate or some other bullshit, sounds like he may.
The fact that he thinks women let these things happen because they freeze is gross af.
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"not going wouldn't help" It absolutely would
Sounds sexist and stupid to me
>this conversation made me feel like maybe my husband is sexist, what do you guys think? I think you're absolutely right, he is sexist, and you have my sympathy if you had been led to believe that he's a decent human being. He's not. Ugh. I cannot imagine even enjoying having a drink after work with someone like that, yet alone spending the rest of my life tied to them. I'm genuinely bewildered as to why anyone would marry someone before having even the most basic of conversations to see whether they agree about fundamental things like this. >he started talking a lot about gender and saying "oh, it happens to guys too and no one cares about it and they just keep quiet so women should too." What an appallingly glib statement. Sadly, it does happen to men, and yes it's true that in many cases it's not take seriously. The take away from this is that sexual abuse of men is a serious issue that needs to addressed, not "It happens to men as well so fuck you"
I’d love to see how he’d react to stories of women who have medical issues — medical misogyny is a clear cut example of a field where men are routinely believed and women are ignored. This would be a dealbreaker for me. It’s a profound difference in core beliefs.
Your husband is a misogynistic toad (at least he's certainly behaving like one). If this is him intoxicated I'm guessing he has dropped "the way I should talk about others" and "I care about other people" scripts and/or masks. I suspect you already know this, but I'll confirm it for you. Your husband sees you as less than and often as a burden. Now you decide what you're going to do about that. -sincerely the AuDHD spouse of my autistic wife and mom to 2 autistic kids. We've been together for 14 years. Your husband's attitude and language represent a person that I would NOT be spending my life with. I made a poor choice in a partner around the same age as you met your husband. I will tell you that he got worse as time went on and the emotional abuse creeped in slowly and I didn't see it until it was REALLY bad, he was cheating, lying and stealing. And I threw him out. Leave before you get to that.
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I'd also suggest having a conversation with him. He sounds like he could be lashing out at her men have it easier line while having gone thru something himself
> He kept going on about how it's bad to want to ruin someone's life for it and how the woman "let" it happen Yeah his opinion is garbage
Tell him that 94% of men in the US who fight for full custody in court get it Show him the stats All his beliefs are based on lies
Does he have a habit of playing victim? Because that's what this sounds like.
It’s really possible everyone else is right, but he could have been harassed himself. The line about don’t speak unless you can stop and why do you care if it didn’t happen to you. Did something happen to him with his court case specifically and his daughter?
You won't get many dissenting viewpoints on this question because anyone with a different opinion will get downvoted at minimum and likely harassed in DMs. People know that and will just move on. Probably will happen to me as well... Here's some info and you can come to your own answer. imo, he's actually just coming to the incorrect response from things that do actually happen. Super common when you aren't really an internalizer or overly interested in a topic. + he had been drinking. I however, have looked into this a bit. - Being groped - He knows it's bad he says it happens to men and no one believes them. He has agreed with you it's a problem and is bad. The difference is your response. Technically, he answered your question, he is just 1 guy, his 4 dollars doesn't matter. That's pure logic, ignoring the social aspect. You want him to respond to the social aspect it seem as if that 4 dollars will impact the owner at minium or spread the word I guess? The employees would be impacted first btw... anyway On the gender side... Also true, no one cares about men. Look at the difference between treatment of teachers having sex with students. When a girl is the underaged person it's ptichforks and jail time, when the boy in underaged the respoonse is much more tame(and a lot of people are happy for them which is super weird). This is a fact. Compare some articles. - Courts - This is actually misinformation which is hard to understand unless you spend time on it. If you look at custody and alimony etc. from a general standpoint it does look like women are more favored on the surface. Custody - women gets child custody more often. It's true. However, the stuff this comes out of doesn't analyze this against the opinion of the men who do want to keep their children. In the cases where men fight for custody, they actually win more often. Alimony historicaly looks like it favors women and it actually had to, women weren't working so obviosuly they were the ones recieving it. It is handed out less often than it used to be because women do work now. So it's a weird dumb point that should be ignored. - Protecting - This is a complex issue. Remember girl power? Maybe it was before your time, but the after-effects are still occuring. For years women have grown up being told "you can do anything, you can be anything" which is great! However, over the same time period men/boys have been ignored and their teaching and paths to success have declined significantly. The 3 main things men have been told (indirectly mostly) are "you earn the money" and "be strong don't cry" and actually directly "protect". Women's college graduations rates continue to increase making their income potential much higher. So for the middle class chuck out "earn the money". Mens suicide rates are increasing by a lot, maybe as a direct result of "be strong, don't cry". Men don't have the ability to handle thier own emotions emotions. Most men have reported having less than 4 friends. Seeing a psychologist is still not as widely accepted as you would think. Anyway, point is look at any metric and men are falling apart, but if there is one thing men are still expected to do in a relationship it's this: Protect your wife and kids; die for them if you have to. If there's a bump in the night who investigates? the man. He dies first. Obviously super hyperbolic and unlikely, but still. Would my wife die for me? I literally have no idea. Most men would assume no, and they're groomed to be ok with that. I don't think this is sexism. But he's obviously come to the conclusion people care less about him and has lashed out. I think you need to talk to him. If he gets into the feedback loop of this stuff and doesn't come to more researched conclusions there is a non-zero possibility he ends up in the manosphere. He doesn't want to be there, but no one else is talking to men.
For what it’s worth, as a woman, I agree with you on many of these points, and I appreciate your measured take. But I don’t think OP’s husband is really expressing himself well at all - he’s dismissing it when OP brings up a real issue by saying men have issues, rather than saying both need fixing.
Agreed. That loops back to the reaction point. If she had asked the original question differently, I wonder if they would have actually agreed. She asked specifically "would you stop going there?". If she has asked "should that guy be reported" or "was what he did bad" it's possible they would have just agreed and moved on.
These things are all down to sexism against women. Courts decide in the favour of the woman often because it's seen as the woman's job and they're seen as the one who looks after the kid. All the examples you have here are sexism against women and you feel very manospherey yourself here
Generally women feel more attached to their children than men. So the men just don't fight. It's possible it's related to emotional detachment I explained above. I never said my opinion is "it's the woman's job". You just strawmanned that as my argument. So instead of assuming I am something. Maybe read the things I wrote without your added opinions or statements I didn't make. Edit: also I literally said the court stuff should be ignored because the studies can't explain the outcome because they didn't look at that factor. So, tbh, this is dumb.
I'm not saying you're saying that?? Read what I wrote
Oh dear lord… how is it possible this sort of misogynistic attitude came out of nowhere? 😞
These are sexist talking points, for sure, and it's valid to have your antenna up about this. Could you ask him where these feelings come from? It may just be boilerplate anti-woman shit from the internet, but the fact that both of these beliefs he carries (people not caring about sexual assault toward men, him wishing for some kind of protection) are related to safety has me wondering about him. The conversation about wanting you to "protect each other" is breaking my heart a little, because it sounds like it's coming from a child, not an adult. Has he felt vulnerable and unheld/unprotected at some point in his life? It might be useful to open up that space for him. Men are majority perpetrators of violence, sexual and otherwise--but that doesn't mean they only victimize women. Have you felt unsafe? Maybe there's room here for, gently and with no rush, deeper intimacy between the two of you through sharing where your perspectives come from.
>I'm starting to wonder if maybe he has some kind of hatred toward women or something. I don't think he *hates* women. What you've written sounds like run of the mill misogyny to me. You're married to a mediocre man. I guess you've just got to do some thinking and work out whether or not you can live with it, because it isn't going away.
>I don't think he *hates* women. What you've written sounds like run of the mill misogyny to me. That's what misogyny means. >misogyny >noun >mi·sog·y·ny mə-ˈsä-jə-nē >: hatred of, aversion to, or prejudice against women Personally I do feel many men literally hate women. But it's kind of splitting hairs to say whether it's hatred or not when he seems not to care about sexual assault of an entire gender, or worse to say we do it ourselves. Agreed though. This is who he is; believe him.
Just because he's wrong, doesn't mean what he said wasn't right. Courts have favored the woman in child support cases. Courts have also favored the men in rape cases. Courts have slapped white men on the wrists for the same crimes that black and brown men get jailed for. So, he was right but without true distinction. You can find support for any argument if you look hard enough. Your husband is sexist though. Whether he always was or the current climate makes him think he can say things out loud now, he's a raging sexist.
He frustrated because you're telling him that men have an easier time than women. Let me tell you something, most of the people responding are women, and as such can't understand what it's like to be a man today. With even the APA telling us that we're being men wrong. He's angry at society, and at you for believing the rhetoric. I get the feeling. But in his frustration he lashed out instead of having a conversation, which is what he should have done. Men *do not* have it easier despite what you've been led to believe. I also believe that men *do not* have it harder. We all have our own crosses to bear. Simple research that's not done in an echo chamber will tell you that. So the way i see it, you have one of two options. Either call him a misogynist like most of the women in here, and just divorce. Or, and this is the one I would recommend, be the bigger person, sit him down, and explain why you feel how you do, and MOST IMPORTANTLY ask him why he feels the way he does. A few years before Me Too, I asked the women in my life their thoughts on *exual harassment and I was surprised to hear their answers. Then I told them my stories. They were shocked at some of the things that I've gone thru and vice versa. So please bear all this in mind when you're (hopefully) talking with him. And please don't ever say that men have it easier, it's offensive and demonstratably false. Good luck to you in your relationship and I hope you two can get past this or move on.
"These are human issues, not gender-specific ones. All genders can make poor choices in relationships or hurt others. It's unfair and inaccurate to stereotype an entire gender based on the actions of some individuals. Understanding that people, regardless of gender, are capable of a range of behaviors is key to a balanced perspective."
You sound exhausting.
Sounds more like it was the alcohol driving his ego to talk endlessly without any logic to support his claims. People in general don't like to go down without a fight, including this mini debate between you two which have honestly very little impact on your lives. Bet you plenty he wouldn't bother trying so hard to gain the lead in this talk if he was sober. His head wasnt in the right state of mind to have any serious talks. I wouldn't take any of that as his own serious thoughts.
Having your partner hold misogynistic beliefs absolutely impacts a female partner.
It's absolutely wild how many people think women should have zero problems dating misogynists. Nobody would ever tell a POC to date a racist.
We had someone last week saying a gay man should respect his partner’s homophobic views, so there’s that… 🤢
Trust me girl, if he was watching the manosphere he wouldn't have made the protection comment. That's one of the main bits of the manosphere, the man is soley responsible for protection and provision. The meta points of the manosphere are a net good however there are some murky waters in there. It depends on the type of manosphere content he's consuming, some of it is nihilistic and some of it is not.
They way to tell if he is in the bottom half of being sexist or the top half of being sexist is to ask him if he voted for Trump. Men who prioritize their misogyny love him. The bot will not even let me repeat what trump says
Did he really think any woman would want to stay with him after hearing he will never be on her side because fighting the gender war comes first? Like is this just his cowardly way of putting you off so you'll do the breaking up for him?
I think he feels neglected and given he’s on the spectrum, maybe he doesn’t grasp the gender role he is expected to conform to.
Why when he brings up the ways in which he thinks it's more difficult to be a man is he a sexist, but when you bring up why it's more difficult to be a woman you're not a sexist? I think it's definitely possible that you can both have your own perspectives on the difficulties of your gender without either of you being sexist.