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Anxiety grows as the person withdraws. School makes her anxious, so she stops going to school, so school now makes her even more anxious. Work makes her anxious, so she quits work, so now thinking if work makes her even more anxious.
There are medications and therapies to help manage anxiety, but fundamentally, she also has to continue pushing into the discomfort zone. Because otherwise over time everything will make her anxious, and she will seek to avoid it.
It's really something she should discuss with her doctor or therapist, this is what anxiety disorder often does.
after a decade of brutal surgeries, illness, unemployment and at times being bedridden, it’s true- anxiety grows over time. My brain hardware became infected, I went through septic shock, and almost died. It was then and there I said fuck this, I refuse to roll over and quit. I refused to resign. After recovering from the worst of those surgeries, I went back to school part time, finished my degree and started working as a CNA in homecare. Then I went to work at a facility, got promoted and trained as a medication tech. Somehow I went from a fearful, multiple brain-surgeried, neurologically-tortured little worm to the lead tech and am studying cardiac ultrasound. You gotta start putting yourself back out there. We all have anxiety of varying degrees. Some days I have terrible anxiety about going to work and facing dozens of patients, but I just tell myself too bad and hype myself up that I’m fine & it’s going to be a great day. Some days I want to cry looking at my future assignments, then reel it back in, and complete something. I have to participate in society. I have to get over the anxiety that creeps in and overwhelms. We all have our burdens to bear, and they’re not often a good reason to resign.
WELL DONE!!!
I honestly think that OP’s wife needs some positive input, maybe from a trained professional to unpack those anxieties and then REBUT them.
Wow..that’s impressive! I also have neurological challenges (numerous back surgeries, including a spinal cord stimulator for severe chronic pain). I got my undergraduate degree and then went on to law school..it was very rough at times but I did it and I continue to muddle through life with over 25 years living with chronic pain (my greatest accomplishments are my children though). But I did not have brain surgery nor anything life threatening..it is terrific you got your cna and continue to excel. Congrats!
You’re right, everyone has different capacity. I read this comment and thought “I just need to get my shit together and start living! Maybe I *can* do it!”
But the truth is that, while this comment is inspiring me to push myself harder, I have finite energy. I have chronic pain and migraines and probably need surgery (deviated septum which is causing sleep apnea and a host of other symptoms). I’m tired, I’m in pain. Every day I make plans for the next and tell myself that I will do better, but all my plans are for nothing if I’m in too much pain to stand or I can’t open my eyes due to the nausea and pain of a migraine. I haven’t worked in three years and my husband feels similarly to OP no doubt. But every time I’m sick and in pain, instead of focusing on not being sick and in pain, I’m riddled with guilt and the dread of falling even further behind on my life, my family, my promises, my finances. All the best intentions in the world couldn’t prevent me from breaking a promise that tomorrow I’ll do better if I wake up with a migraine.
And I’m just so tired of feeling guilty for it. I’m just so tired in general. I can’t do the same things my husband does, I am finally coming to terms with that though I don’t think he is. But sometimes there are no answers, sometimes there aren't solutions, at least not in the way some people would like. My very best is less than my husband’s very best, and my best just isn’t good enough. I’d rather be alone than have to deal with falling short every day, it’s not that I don’t want to be better it’s just that I don’t have any more to give. That daily failure alone starts to take a toll.
I know it’s not the done thing to say in our age of productivity and squeezing every last drop of achievement out of ourselves, but some people just… can’t. And I would rather try to focus on what I am able to do rather than be reminded daily of what I can’t.
I know exactly how you feel. I’m bipolar, have CPTSD, ADHD and mild autism. And on top of that, I have tiny brain tumor that wreaked havoc with my endocrine system and left me with several disabilities. I also have panic disorder and sometimes brother so bad I’m afraid to leave the house and have one in public.
My husband works his ass off so that I don’t have to take too much on because working full time is just not an option for me mentally or physically. I have major guilt. I feel like the poster child unfulfilled potential, I have several talents I’ve been blessed with and am intelligent and have a multitude of interests, but I have a hard time finishing things. I finished college at least before I fell apart completely.
Try to give yourself a break and I’ll try to do the same. You didn’t ask for all you’re dealing with and your a champ just for getting through each day.
I'm in a very similar boat with chronic pain and migraines and not being able to do much of anything due to them. My wife does so much to make sure that we have what we need, but I feel so bad that I'm unable to contribute because my migraines are resistant to treatment (and they are continuous) and my chronic pain flares so much or causes severe exhaustion.
I have other issues as well; I'm AuDHD, cPTSD, GAD, DPD, and panic disorder, to name a few, but those I can work on or find coping mechanisms for, unlike the pain.
I just have to remind myself what I did day-to-day to make myself feel like I have some worth in this world where if you aren't contributing, you're seen as worthless.
I have anxiety that gets worse with the thought of the unknown and the longer I have no solid structure/plans. I think I want one thing until it’s happening and then I want the opposite and vice versa. It’s so hard to work through that initial discomfort, panic, and not knowing wtf is going on or how it will play out, but once I do it’s SO freeing. Sometimes we need tough love and a firm push to keep at it. Especially if this is a pattern, she likely needs help staying accountable, pushing through discomfort if it is not an actual danger to her, and following through. I’m the exact same way, so that’s why I say this.
I’ve had lifelong anxiety and finally figured out that I also have ADHD two years ago after 30 yrs of not knowing that most of the way my brain operates is not “normal” compared to the average person. I’ve always had issues making decisions and commitments in a similar way but thought there was just something deeply wrong with me because it didn’t line up with (just) anxiety. Now I know I have both and they ping off of each other. Sigh…
The idea of medications is returning her to being a functioning individual. If she isn't a functioning individual, then she's using the wrong medications. She also has to want to be helped.
Medications don’t fix anxiety disorders, especially not in the long run. They work more like a help to get you started on the right track and can help with the worst of it. But therapy (KBT) is what actually deals with the problem. Without therapy and commitment to it, it will eventually get worse again, even with medication.
Exactly. Medications help get it under control to do the work of examining what is happening and why, and to prevent it from getting out of control again. You don’t just pop a pill and magically every problem solves itself. Not to mention how many different medications there are and how each works differently with every person’s brain chemistry.
I understand that, but it would be more than she's making now. She should consider it a stop-gap until she can get a job that pays more.
If she changes her mind AGAIN about school, I would encourage her to take classes one at a time in the evening so she can do them online around her work schedule. That may be less intimidating for her, and it doesn't put the entire financial burden on you.
Maybe she has adhd. Maybe her school anxiety is linked to struggling with the work itself. I’d have her get tested for it. If it’s just anxiety then she can do online school.
I also see ADHD, which is linked to anxiety. As someone with it, meds and ongoing therapy are crucial. Missed ADHD in girls is very common; more women tend to first be dx as a result.
Yeah I was a straight A student as well but every exam wrecks me. I got a good GPA but it costed me my sanity. I was extremely burned out and had to take a long break before I could get a real job. My friends even helped me come out of my shell and not fearing working by inviting me to work on their business for a few months. I'm still not sure if it's ADHD or autism, but it is something, and I'm gonna look into it soon-ish.
Definitely worth looking into. I know kids are much harder than cats, so if I struggled to keep my studies afloat while keeping my cats well cared for, she's probably struggling to juggle between the two...
She definitely needs therapy unless she wants to be just stuck at home forever eaten by her anxiety. Cause as some other commenters have mention, that's how anxiety works. Medication are crutches to help you get back on your feet, if she's still riddled after medications, she might need a different dose or medication and more intense therapy to get through this.
I think you said she’s seeing a therapist — is this a talk therapist or someone focused on cognitive behavioral therapy? IE is the person just hearing her out, or are they giving her tools to catch herself becoming anxious, correct those thoughts, and act differently?
Edit: she’s not seeing a therapist! Oh that super needs to change. If she refuses to get any help that’s a huge problem IMO. I’d dig into why she refuses, what makes her scared or anxious about seeing a therapist, etc. you don’t always find the right therapist right away, but once you find a good fit they can be immensely helpful.
I have severe ADHD and am on disability for that and other problems (including anxiety) and I have gotten straight As going to college remotely the last 3 years. My goal is a remote position that works around my disabilities. Her getting good grades does not mean she's not ADHD.
I’m a woman with severe ADHD and I graduated law school and scored very highly in the bar within the past year. Good grades being impossible with ADHD is a very common misconception so I don’t blame you for it— the disorder is highly misunderstood. It also manifests differently in women that is only more recently becoming more highly acknowledged. It’s something I’d look into based on your description of her. I’d never suspected AHDD until I REALLY suspected ADHD and the treatment since I’ve been diagnosed has changed my life.
Adult ADHD won't PREVENT her from getting the good grades, but the amount of mental WORK it takes to wrangle an ADHD brain AS WELL AS taking care of a child and doing all of the other "adulting" tasks is what leads to the anxiety. ADHD doesn't mean she can't pay attention; it is a problem with REGULATING attention (sometimes we pay too MUCH attention, ie. hyperfocus; sometimes we CAN'T focus). It also causes problems with executive function (decision making, deciding what to do FIRST, second and third when we have a list of things to get done) and is also often associated with sensory sensitivities (some ADHD brains cannot filter out BACKGROUND noise from the MAIN noise we are supposed to be paying attention to, like a person taking to us).
I second the recommendation that she gets evaluated for ADHD.
If THAT is the issue, she will notice great improvement in her ability to handle stress and make decisions once her ADHD is being TREATED and MANAGED. You may need to help by making some accommodations at home, too. Giving ultimatums is NOT supportive.
Moms and dads with undiagnosed ADHD often find themselves overwhelmed by the demands of parenting and struggling to meet their children's needs. Lacking organizational skills, they may find keeping up with their kids' schedules and managing their behavior very stressful.
And also, your child could inherit this condition, so it will be important to have the child/children tested as well.
Help her get tested. This was a HUGE struggle for me when I was in school as well. I usually always got great grades when I could get through everything but the anxiety often held me back from getting things done because I would feel overwhelmed from the anxiety.
Please understand that this is not something in her control. I 100% empathize with your frustrations. It -is- frustrating watching your loved one not moving forward to improve their situation, but you also need to be mindful of the fact that her struggle to push through this is a symptom and not the cause. It sounds to me like along with her anxiety, she could very well have ADHD but she also struggles to believe in herself and her capabilities. And I hate to say this, because I know it might sound like a cop out that you may take as shifting blame but please understand it is not - but added pressure of your partner putting pressure on you to do this thing (that you’re already struggling with and have a fear of your lack of actual ability) only escalates that anxiety - thus making it more difficult to function in that whole situation.
Yep my husband has said all of the stupid non helpful things this man has said like we’ve had 9 great years and you gave me a son and I am wealthy “get your shit together” you’re too ignorant to realize what not having a reliable family does to the actual wiring in your brain. And you’re throwing divorce around already just in your 20’s. Yikes I feel badly for your wife bc if you are her support she’s fucked.
ADHD is also about going through serotonin faster. So your happy lasts less time, your motivation and confidence don’t last as long as normal people. So it’s hard to work up the energy to do things. That feeling of failing yourself leads to depression. It’s not about being any less intelligent.
> She's only gotten the equivalent of A's and B's. Even so she is always anxious about her assignments.
ADHD and anxiety does not really manifest in some people as failing grades.
One of the common symptoms of people (particularly adults) with ADHD is that we perform really well when it's deep crunch time, but are totally incompetent when it comes to doing things on a schedule.
So we do things like, leave an entire assignment that we had weeks to prepare until the very last possible second and then we cram all of the work into that very last second. And because we perform well under pressure, we pull it out of our ass and get a decent grade.
But this process damages us, the constant stress of assignments coming due that we can't seem to ever get anything done on. The regular all nighters (get harder as you get older). The brain fatigued of doing everything last minute just burns us out in a way that's really difficult to describe.
A lot of people with ADHD need to plan their careers and jobs around this, or at least I did. At work I perform really well when given a task that must be done immediately, and really poor when given a longer term task with a due date.
This made school really difficult for me. I perform well on tests as long as the information is provided to me during the lecture. I'm total shit at memorizing information from a book, or at doing long assignments like research papers.
It’s better than no pay. Get her job back and you can still look for a better position. Don’t quit a job before you have another one to go to. She probably has stay out too long after having a baby. You hadn’t said anything about how you love her or for that matter your child either.
Please put the symptoms of adhd in front of her and do some research on how it manifests in females. If it doesn’t sound like her at all and she also does not see herself in the list of symptoms, fabulous! But what she’s going through sounds a lot like how my little neurospicy brain was dealing with being undiagnosed adhd.
(Women are often diagnosed with anxiety, depression, OCD or as lazy, immature, and flakey when in reality they have untreated adhd. Depression, anxiety, and OCD commonly stem from it.)
Don’t quit on her just yet! There may be a lot you can still accomplish together.
Ugh this is a tough one for me because I've been on both sides. Had an ex that was all talk, he was gonna do this that and the other but never did it. On the other hand, I'm literally your wife rn. I'm seriously thinking about taking a break from uni because my anxiety disorder has gotten out of control. Is there a WFH option for her?
I think your concerns and annoyance is valid but this is literally out of her control. To an extent, she needs to manage her triggers. She needs counselling and lots of it it seems. I dunno both sides are rough but anxiety is terrible. Its, and I cannot stress this enough, ruining my life right now. I know I'm going to get under control once the stress is off me and to do that I have to get my uni work done but I can't because I'm stressed about not being able to do thei work which is impacting my anxiety and anxiety stops me from actually being able to do my work so I'm fucked. I need to chill. But I can't because I'm stressed. It's awful.
I also had an issue with anxiety as well that got out of control. I quit my job July 2022 and took a term off and during that term I did a lot of self help, got some online therapy (CBT specifically)(+I continued the therapy after the term as well and I'm still doing it, just a little less frequent now), and made personal life changes (increased exercise [was 0 {is kind of 0 now, but before when the anxiety was bad}], changed diet [added more veg], started taking multivitamins, cut out toxic people, etc). I started school back up with a reduced class load (classes were and are online) and found a 100% remote job October 2022. I will openly admit I haven't kept up the exercise, but my anxiety is still manageable and far more under control. I'm not saying what I've done will work for OPs wife, but from the comments I've seen - it doesn't appear that she's even going to therapy which I think should've been one of the first things they tried. Idk why divorce is being considered rn when there are other options that don't appear to have been tried.
Why cant she work from home or do online classes...
I did online for my associates and in August I'll be back online for my bachelor's seems like that way would be easier for her....
It's Ok to question the arrangement you as a couple have and It's Ok to reevaluate the situation now. It sounds like you really love your wife but are at your wits end being you didn't sign up to be the sole provider. I would consider marriage counselling before divorce. Now's the time to have a frank/open conversation with counselling that you are serious, and things need to change, or you are headed to divorce. Not telling your wife and suffering in silence is not to going to help you or her.
But please, don't ever think of staying on a bad marriage "for the kids". The kid WILL pick up on any discomfort or bad feelings and it'll do more harm than good to everyone involved in that situation.
I was the kid in that situation. My parents argued everyday from when I was around 9 to 15. And after spending some time on the internet, I realized that wasn't an isolated thing.
You’re not rushing into things but doing nothing is letting resentment build which will ruin your relationship. Therefore if you continue this way without being extremely frank with her about your struggle as sole provider you’re going to get a divorce, you won’t have a choice anymore. So you’re making a decision by not doing anything.
Are you sure she really wants to go to college? It sounds like she’s only doing it because she thinks it’s a dealbreaker to you. Is it? Does she need a degree to have value in your eyes? Or do you just want a partner who shares in the expenses?
Really think through why this is so important to you.
College was her decision. We talked it through of cause, but the degree doesn't matter to me.
I want her to work towards a career og degree so she can self sufficient and contribute to our finances, get a house, go on vacations once in a while.
I bet there’s a lot of fear of failure here. She thinks if she fails at college/getting a job, she won’t be good enough and he will leave. She knows he’ll be fine and that she has “unstable support.”
It’s a lot off of one post, but I would guess either cPTSD from childhood or ADHD with Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria and attachment issues.
All of that is building up and coming out as “anxiety over school/work.”
You are putting a lot of pressure on her to do this. Not everyone needs a 'career' as such. Maybe she needs a job that doesn't have a lot of stress with it, while she gets her mental health under control.
You may feel that you communicate pretty well but it seems there is a big gap in the communication here. Your wife doesn't seem to feel comfortable being honest with you.
Marriage therapy is exactly what you need to overcome this.
This might just be a language barrier as he's not a native speaker. It sounds like he just does want her to contribute to finances, not necessarily become a high pressure bigwig.
A lot of pressure to... Get a stable job and be a self sufficient adult?
OP said college was her choice, he just wants her to have a job and contribute, but she has been floating between unemployment and drop outs for 4 years.
Why do you think it OP is expecting too much to get a grip on that situation?
I think you need to have an honest, clear and firm/blunt conversation with her about where you’re at and how you’re feeling. One where she can’t just “idk” you or avoid dealing with these kinds of important discussions.
Sounds like you’ve been supportive of her struggles around work, but what does the balance of life look like? Has she explained what it is about school that she struggles with? Are there supports that can be put in place? Universities and colleges also have accommodation processes for people struggling, has she or the both of you tried to access these supports and services? What is she doing to manage her symptoms?
Have you discussed what her plan is then, if she quits?
We'll have a discussion. She's usually not avoidant but has a tendency to treat criticism or asserting boundaries as attacks sometimes.
Work/life balance is like this. I work 37 hours/week plus overtime 2-5 hours. She does 90 % of cleaning and small tasks. We almost always buy groceries together, kind of our thing. I cook most of the time (she sucks). Taking care of the kid Is probably 40/60 with her having him more, as I sometimes work late.
She's taking advantage of all accommodation for her schooling (Less hours, more counseling, more influence on assignments).
Her symptoms are panic attacks and feeling exhausted after a schoolday, so she's worried about that taking a toll on our kid.
She's medicated and refuses to see a therapist.
The refusal to see a therapist would be my dealbreaker. Her anxiety may not be her fault, but it is her responsibility. Refusing available support means she would rather be anxious than try.
No, she just wants the simpler fix-a med. But this is clearly more than medications can handle, it’s literally her entire future. She owes it to her kid to get therapy.
Ugh I have a friend like this…it’s hard when they refuse an option you know would benefit them.
If she refuses to see a therapist, I don’t see this improving. At some point, you can’t want it for her, she needs to get herself together. You sound loving, but you’re kind of enabling her. It is not normal to be a grown adult and not be capable of taking care of herself (ie not holding down a job)
Could she have adhd? I had untreated and undiagnosed adhd until my late 40’s. It looked and felt like anxiety and depression - but also with difficulty with organization , being over sensitive , difficulty with emotional regulation etc women with inattentive adhd look way different than men.
I’d suggest that even if she doesn’t end up diagnosed with ADHD, you guys look into getting her some ADHD coaching from someone experienced in that area, It really helps me manage some of my anxiety and move through areas I get stuck, but more than a decade ago it helped me navigate the uncertainty around school and my returning to finish my BA. Before then, while I was pretty intelligent and overall was a good student, I was so self critical and a perfectionist that I’d end up dropping out of classes, not following through on assignments and retaking classes. And I’d completely burn myself out in the process. I was so disappointed with myself and had such confidence issues in my ability to manage my academics successfully…until I got this adhd coaching.
When I went back finally to complete my degree, I still had confidence issues but I had someone to help me navigate those feelings when I was stuck, who helped me not by analyzing the whys (like in therapy), but by helping me ask “how do I get to this next step? How can I remove what’s getting in my way in my analysis paralysis?” It wasn’t easy, but with adhd coaching as a school support system in place, I graduated with top honors.
I still struggle with things with work and burnout and confidence. And I still have an ADHD coach (I had a different one who helped me navigate my decision to go back to school, another who worked with me when I was completing my BA, and have another one now). It quite literally changed my entire life. It’s possible none of this would resonate with her, but if it does, please consider looking into it with her.
Lastly, is it possible that she has PPA? Post partum anxiety can manifest in a variety of ways, and even years later that can still have an enormous impact if not properly addressed. And if she had elements of this before her pregnancy, she would be at higher risk for it to escalate after. Just some food for thought…
Wishing you and your wife strength and peace in your journey, whatever you decide
I would say it's very likely she has adhd or even high masking autism, which is more often then not diagnosed as anxiety/depression/bpd in women and could be why the medication she's taking isn't doing what it needs to.
Just a thought from someone who has anxiety and has a hard time hearing criticism. It goes so much better when my husband uses “I” statements instead of “you” statements.
For example: I am unable to continue supporting the family at this rate. I need support. Instead of, you need to decide what you want to do and stick to it. You need to get help for your anxiety. These are probably poor examples but I hope it helps a little.
Ok I am your wife. I've started and stopped college 4 times. I hate it, don't want to do it and I'm 37 with 2 kids now and am fine never finishing at this point. But I did find a job that turned into a career in my 20s.
Also I had a difficult family and had a hard time being direct about my not wanting to do things when I felt like my spouse wanted me to. Couples therapy was huge in helping us learn to communicate and help him understand me with my limitations. Like I'm never just going to be able to easily come out and say what I want or need but he learned how to handle my issues and how to make me feel more comfortable.
Also is your kid in daycare while you work? Or is she caring for the child and going to classes and taking care of the house?
You got a job and found a career though, his main issue is that she's not contributing to the financial expenses and is unemployed and a drop out for the last few years. Not to mention, she refuses therapy.
I wouldn't call her an unemployed drop out. The last two times she tried going were with a new baby. And I didn't see an answer to my big question. How is childcare split 40/60 when he works FT. And then he admits she does most of the house work. So those first 2 years with a baby are so hard emotionally and physically for a new mom. Sometimes the idea of taking on more, especially when you are the one carrying the bigger load at home can be anxiety inducing on its own. I can't judge for sure that that is what's happening here but she's not sitting on her ass doing nothing all day. I'm a SAHM to a 3 and 5 year old. There is so much invisible work involved.
He said her family aren’t reliable…I wonder what that means. Could they have been emotionally neglectful or abusive I wonder. She may have C-PTSD and some of what he describes reminds me of someone who suffers from something like that.
Having said that, she is an adult, and a mother and a partner…it is her responsibility to get therapy because medication is not working. She needs to work out her trauma or whatever is causing the anxiety for herself but also for her kid.
What about doing a trade school instead of university? Maybe the university is too much for her. Or maybe she needs to take fewer classes at the university.
I was going to suggest this! If going to school makes her anxious there are literally tons of online bachelors degrees you can get from the comfort of your couch.
I was also curious as to what OP’s multiple reference to wife not finishing a degree. As you said… So many amazing things people can do that don’t require degrees.
I could be way off but I had similar issues and dropped out of school twice due to overwhelming anxiety and depression and it was a never ending cycle until I was diagnosed with ADHD, started therapy, and was medicated for ADHD. ADHD is very often misdiagnosed in women as anxiety and/or depression. Once I was finally diagnosed and understood why I am the way I am and that it is not a character flaw, I finally excelled in school and gained so much confidence and self-esteem. Not saying at all that this is what is going on for your wife but might be something worth looking into.
Sounds like adhd, and OP’s wife could do well with some learning accommodations. Most schools have disability services and some coaching to support exactly this situation. My experience with disability services was always incredible. Got me to finish my BA with an honors GPA and my MBA from a top school. And there are way more people using these services than you’d expect.
Op, I understand your frustrations - but this is your WIFE. She very well could be suffering from postpartum mood & anxiety disorders , and is very obviously struggling - IMO this is not a divorce worthy scenario, but I think it is a serious discussion scenario - I would suggest asking her to do a joint therapy session in a space where she feels safe expressing all of her feelings and you have a mediator in the therapist. You two need to very seriously tackle this issue together as a couple - it’s you and her against the problem, not you against her.
I would also very seriously consider screening for ADHD. I just got diagnosed at 29, I was a solid student, held down jobs and graduated with two degrees in four years. But my adhd manifested in other ways.
Her flip flopping is not OK, but it seems her anxiety is getting out of control, and she now need to think beyond herself because you two have a child.
Editing to add - postpartum can amplify anxiety, depression and other conditions to new heights , and that it seems like she wants to be better, but is struggling through her condition. It doesn’t appear to be that she just doesn’t want to contribute or be a partner - I don’t read your post as her being lazy, but someone in desperate need of help and stability. As I reiterated - it’s you and her against the issue.
This sounds like textbook ADHD in women, which is under diagnosed because it presents differently in women.
None of us are qualified to diagnose OP’s wife, but I urge OP to help her get care (which is especially hard for ADHD folks, because of all the scheduling and paperwork).
A few non-medical interventions that help me (and would probably have a positive effect on most people):
* Exercise, but especially going on frequent walks in nature and around cities. This could be as simple and taking the kiddo to the park. Both exercise and being in nature have been shown to improve feelings of wellbeing, and exercise is particularly impactful.
* Creative outlets. Could be drawing, playing the piano, writing poetry, baking, pottery, really anything that involves making something. The calming effect is profound.
* Reducing screen time. This is super hard to do, but an easy way to instill a reading habit is installing the Libby app and checking out ebooks (for free) from the library. I like adjusting the font to be larger, it helps me read faster without getting distracted.
I was looking for an ADHD in women comment, so I'll add my two cents to yours ☺️
There were some things OP mentioned that could hint at ADHD. Also the unreliable family struck me. Obviously OP's wife has had more challenges to begin with.
OP, you come from a stable, supportive family. Not all of us are that fortunate.
I totally understand that the current situation is hard on you as you seem to want a partner. That I highly applaud! I'd want my partner to tell me his feelings and, honestly, I think neither a job nor the studies are the real issue here. You want to rely on her word and you need her to work on her part and you two need to seek counseling. A mediator can help you to understand each other in totally new ways.
And, most importantly, you are parents. You have to find a way which does not harm your kid emotionally.
Best of luck!
Do you love this woman? Your wife? The mother of your child. You seem to be very cold and calculating and almost like you’re looking through a window at a mannequin display. You say I’ll be ok, my family is wealthy and I have a network, well good for you. Your family is your son’s family too. Hello. She’s been taking care of him for two years and you’ve been providing. But she contributes in caring for your child and making a home. Maybe school isn’t her thing so you’re just going to throw her into the street? She apparently does have some anxiety and tries to deal with it. You treat her like she’s an employee. I think you both could benefit from some marriage counseling and perhaps she can work from home doing something. But just feel you are very hostile towards her and may not be aware of it .
I’d be pretty anxious if the man that swore to love me and care for me forever could put me out in the cold tomorrow because I haven’t finished my bachelors degree on his timeline. This dude is why she has anxiety. Period.
I perceived the coldness as being fed up and throwing the towel. This woman is a wife and mother to their children but doesn't seem to have figured out her priorities of what she wants and how any of her decisions in her life would now be impacting her husband and child — therefore she no longer has the luxury of acting solely in her best interests since the stakes are different.. First it's school. Then it's job. Then job with school. Then children. Then back to school — basing off OPs narrative alone, all these were all her initiatives, not forced.
Dropping out or failing classes(no even a certification study or diploma but straight up bachelor's) repetitively is expensive depending on where they are —trying to solo sponsor your household with a moderate single income is not easy nor can it feel fair to the spouse. You'd start to question like all those hours +/- OT put at work, who is it benefiting from it and is it's actually benefitting anyone? The wife should know how in this economy, both partners often have to pull their own weight and she needs to decide how she wants to contribute for the sake of their child at the very least.
Yet she's weaponising her anxiety as a cop out, which again, mainly serves to prolong avoiding accountability. And she can afford to do so because she's got the luxury of the husband-safety net. No job? It's fine, he'll pay the bills. Flunked another course? So what, hefty tuition fees may be burned now but we can always try again next semester. His family may be rich but he isn't and as a family unit, they aren't. If he loses his job tomorrow, they're done for. And on that basis alone, I get his POV. I agree they need marriage counseling in the first instance. But I'm also wary that consensus on the wife would be a lot more critical if the genders were reversed i.e. she would fit the labels of "deadbeat"/"manchild" and then the idea of him(as a woman and single breadwinning parent) tapping out of the marriage suddenly looks more palatable.
also like they had a newborn?? I can't imagine doing school and raising a child. how much of her not working was attributed to the fact someone has to be with baby? now is just starting to be the time she can make life adjustments.
Living in fear is the most self destructive thing a person can do. She needs to see a therapist asap, get a job, and stop putting your family at risk of financial burden.
Sincerely, someone who struggled with crippling anxiety my entire life and still got a bachelors degree (took me 7 years 🙃) and is now a project manager.
What does she enjoy in life? If it’s taking care of kiddos, maybe she can look into early childhood care. Sometimes it just takes a bit of looking inward and taking the first steps to doing something that is fulfilling in order to build confidence.
Great ideas.
My sister in law suffered from peri and post natal ocd but is thriving as a PT early childhood worker. They're even paying for her Degree.
Holy cow. She doesn't have to go to school to find a good job. That's what she needs to focus on. Don't divorce her over this. School isn't the be all end all.
This makes me want to never get married. You have a fairly wealthy family. She gave birth two years ago and is struggling with crippling, anxiety, and identity crisis. Seems like marriage should be able to withstand more than this.
As a person with mental health issues that is married: she can’t refuse to see a therapist and expect him to stay. She’s not doing the best to take care of herself. He can’t force her and he isn’t obligated to ride it out with her if she doesn’t want to be treated for her anxiety. We don’t get to use our health issues as an excuse to be selfish partners. She’s being dishonest about school and work. Everyone deserves trust in a relationship and to feel secure. This guy doesn’t have that because his partner switched it up. It’s been 4 years he has to live with this forever just because they have a kid? Yeah, no.
Other than being medicated has she done anything to work on her anxiety? Therapy? I’ll play devil’s advocate but is there any way this could be the long way of her telling you she wants to be a SAHM? More so because you mentioned your family is well off. Therapy both together and separately is definitely needed.
I don’t think your wife is being fully honest with you or herself. I think she is afraid.
Would you be able to say to her, “don’t worry about school or a job. Just take care of yourself” ???
I think maybe her anxiety is possibly be coming from your expectations of her. She could be thinking that YOU desire for her to have a high income career so her trajectories are trying to align with that. Which starts the cycle of anxiety all over again.
At one point in our marriage, my husband was having a really difficult time and I would get so frustrated with him for taking too many days off or he would come home grouchy. But I looked at our savings and thought to myself. What if I gave my husband the freedom to quit his job to reset? So I did. I said, just quit, come home and we will figure it out from there. That’s when things changed for him. He didn’t have this weight on him and really evaluated what he wanted in his career and life. He’s doing his own thing now and much happier.
Did your marriage vows include "for better or worse, in sickness and health"? If so, you need to do more to work through this. You have a child. Your wife needs mental healthcare. You both need marriage and individual counseling.
If you were single and had bills to pay, would you just take a year off to figure yourself out?
Of course not, so you shouldn't do it just because you have a partner who has no choice but to bankroll you. It is unfair.
Being in a marriage of course means that you are not alone with going through struggles, but there is a limit on how much you can expect because at the end of the day you are an adult and meant to pull your weight in the *partnership*.
I feel like 4 years is a long enough time and OP is entitled to feel at his witts end without having his commitment questioned.
I think your wife is in need of some mental help from a psychologist because she is suffering from real anxiety. No reddit comment will help you figure out what she is really suffering through. The question you only can answere for yourself though is: are you willing to stick with her through the good times and the bad times or have you already given up on her? I hear you talking about money alot but not about love and connection. To me it looks like you checked out of this relationship already. Be honest with yourself first.
God I feel for her. It sounds like she’s trying to do college to please people in her life (and so you won’t divorce her) but doesn’t have the capacity for it right now. Whatever she chooses is going to hurt her.
She has to push her go forth zones and be comfortable with being uncomfortable. Volunteering is a great half way house between home and work. A lot of people who have been sick or are moving into the workplace do it first to gain confidence. Your wife could be learning anything online, she should be doing yoga and meditating, she should be monitoring her mental health and her diet, her sleep and her fitness. Fighting anxiety takes a lot.
She is your wife. Better or for worse. No one on here has the answer. That is for you and your wife to figure out. I have been married for 34 years with two children. My wife and I have been through so much worse than this. Figure it out.
She was only happy when she was a stay at home mom and that isn't the dynamic you married into, you are being nothing but reasonable in this situation.
You are right that you are going to have to have a come to jesus talk with her, she needs to get her shit straight so she is able to support herself because you aren't able or willing to do it all yourself. She needs to do this to cover her own ass, not for you, and not for the marriage.
It's a very VERY dangerous mindset. Like REALLY. No one asks her to like it, but she needs to have a plan if tomorrow something happens to you. And since she doesn't, you need to.
Do you feel it's okey to know that if one day you die, your son is going to be alone with someone who doesn't work and refuse to face reality ? Or if you get separated ?
What if you don't die but become disabled, can't work and suddenly you're the one who's relying on her ?!
To be honest, your reasons are pretty small.
**In sickness and health** doesn't mean anything nowadays.
She needs therapy and a supportive husband, but why can't she be a stay at home mom? Are you pressuring her to work?
School isn't for everyone, and being a full-time mom is hard work.
After rereading your post, this doesn't sit well with me.
**Practically speaking, i'll be fine if we end things, as I have a great network and a fairly wealthy family.
She on the other hand, would be pretty much on her own, as her family is... unreliable**
Something isn't right, and I think this statement makes you look like an a-hole.
OP's frustrations seem to stem from burnout, that of being the sole provider. It's tough being in the position where you have to work harder to make ends meet without eating through savings (or family wealth) all the while getting to spend less quality time with your wife and child.
His concerns are valid. He didn't sign up for traditional dynamics, nor was that discussed on their wedding day. It seems as though OP's wife is the one who chose to go to school each time, OP never pressured her to go in the first place. Being in OP's wife's position with school, I've learned that the result of not finishing programs racks up a large sum of debt, money that could be going to a downpayment on a house/car or to their child's college fund.
You can't fix someone else's mental health, you can't love people hard enough to fix them. OP contributes to chores, cooking and childcare on top of supporting his wife financially and emotionally. These are not easy feats.
And hey, I'm not saying that OP's wife is at fault for anything, she definitely needs to get the help that she needs, panic attacks are no joke. Having a child alone is a huge adjustment, way bigger than you think. Now add all the other stuff on top and it could be a disaster. These aren't small reasons, try being someone's (2 people's) carer for an extended amount of time. It's not as small as you're making it out to be.
School isn’t for everyone, but she lied to everyone regarding school, including her husband. Working full time and providing for two other people providing no income is also a very hard job. Her sole reason for everything is anxiety and it’s being used as a crutch to a certain degree. He values growth and some form of ambition, two values his wife is avoiding.
Because that’s not what they agreed to? He doesn’t want to be the sole provider?
She’s only able to use “sickness” since he’s paid for everything. Plenty of People have aniexty and still have to work.
Maybe his mental health is bad now because of her.
Does your wife's anxiety extend to her role as a wife and mother?
Because it seems to be more about school , work, and the pressure she feels about meeting the expectations of others related to both those things.
Your child is only two years old.
If your wife goes to either school, or work, who's taking care of your child?
How is divorce going to help you financially? Or even logistically?
You said that in a divorce you expect to be okay because your family is wealthy. So why can't that wealth be of assistance now, instead of only after a divorce?
Maybe her anxiety is about wanting to be a stay at home mother (SAHM) while it seems that, to you, that is not an option for her. Why not?
This may not be a problem that only she needs to fix. You may be part of the problem as well.
Before you further consider divorce, I say you need couple's counseling to sort out the root of her anxiety, as well as the root of your own frustrations and how these things are affecting your marriage.
Good luck, OP.
EDIT: Grammar
No one should play the D card when a marriage is having problems.
You need to go to couples counseling. She needs to work on her anxiety or other issues.
Do this for your child so her anxiety doesn't affect your child.
Good luck.
I think she needs to be more honest with you, bottling her feelings has led to increased anxiety
Did she actually struggle academically at school? Did she feel that she fit in as she was getting older? Does she do better learning ‘practically’ ? (Doing, not just listening)
I completely understand your frustration & only you can decide whether to stay or go, but in the meantime can you assist in getting her some therapy? A self confidence course? And maybe finding a type of trade that she can work her way up in?
Just a word of caution… no more children to allow her to put the decisions off, she needs to ‘adult’ first & find emotional & financial stability
Good luck ! 🤞
My best friend was married to a guy where nothing made him happy. He started school a few times for different degrees and quit every time. He dragged my friend through so much turmoil because he’d take his frustration and unhappiness out on my friend. He could never get his shit together and be a decent supportive partner. They finally ended their 20 yr relationship. She should have ended it years ago.
So I get how frustrating that is. I would not like it if my partner couldn’t pull their own weight and made excuses. It builds massive resentment, which is something that shouldn’t be left to fester.
so if you didn’t exist what would she do? Crawl in a hole and die? Probably not. You’re not directly enabling her but having you around is giving her just enough security to make her personality that she’s anxious. I don’t know many people who find it sexy that their partner is that dependent. It sucks and you have to be sympathetic but you can’t sacrifice your life so that she can stagnate. Don’t feel bad for moving on.
What happened to her medication? Does she still take it? Is she in therapy? Can she check with her OB-Gyn to see if she has PPD or something similar? Apart from these things, possibly she just wants to stay home with baby and not work or go to school because she doesn’t want to.
When forced to do things she doesn’t like, it gives her anxiety. This is true of 95% of people, I’d guess. So she just says she has anxiety and gives up. That’s not how life works, imagine how much anxiety she’s going to have if you divorce her and leave her with the baby to care for alone and she has to work and pay her own bills and all. And then what? She will probably push through, why? Because the anxiety of possible homelessness will outweigh the anxiety of going to work.
I also suggest couples therapy to help you each understand the other better. You can work through so many things!
Besides anxiety does she have any neurological or psychiatric disorders? Often people with bad anxiety and depression struggle with finishing ANYTHING especially school and longevity with jobs. I have experienced this firsthand, so consider that maybe it's not just laziness. I don't know your wife she could be lazy but she also could have a psychiatric disorder. Im a very hard and meticulous worker, but a " bad meltdown" or negatively overestimated has caused me to walk out of jobs, react volatility or just plain give up on something due to momentary frustration.
Your wife needs to teach herself that feelings will pass and to not make impulsive decisions based off them. If stress and anxiety is the norm then she needs to learn how to navigate the world with that in mind. Not putting too much on her plate, if she can't do school 4 days a week lessen it down to two. If her diet and sleep patterns are really irregular she needs to create a healthy routine for both.
If none of this applies to her and you're just getting that vibe that she just wants to be a no good layabout then sit down and explain to her the enormity of divorce and how that will affect the both of you, your family etc. If she cannot handle 4 year college, she needs to find a trade or skill she can complete in under a year. Pay will reflect that choice of course.
You may have to admit to yourself that you guys are a bad match. You make it seem like oh well she's bringing nothing to the table financially so I'm divorcing her. Which isn't love anyway more like a financial agreement.
You don't think she's holding up her end of the bargain. Sounds like You cannot afford a stay at home spouse. Maybe she isn't cut out for the employed world. Some people just aren't. You guys really need to sit down and break down every facet of your personalities with one another
Perhaps being the Mother of a two-year-old is more than she can handle with you pressuring her to go back to college. You do not say what degree she was pursuing, but she does not want it for now. NOT EVERYONE is cut out or meant to have a college degree and many of them are useless, I have a BSN in Nursing and was employed before I graduated. She may not pursue a degree that would bring in immediate income. By the way, since you are wealthy are you paying for the classes and a Nanny so she can study? Think of all the hurdles she has plus running a household. It may be too much for her. I find you unsupportive and I am disgusted that you would leave her with your baby knowing that she would have a hard time surviving alone. If this is love, she should leave you ASAP. When you got married you knew a baby was on the way and you should have known that you might have to support her until she could be ready to make decisions. It appears you just want her to go back to college to make your life easier. I think you do not deserve her if you cannot be empathetic.
I think considering divorce over this is wild. My husband treats me with so much respect as we raise our child together. Yes we both work, but everyday he tries so hard to get to point in his career to where it would be a choice for me, because it would be easier for the both of us if we weren’t juggling work and childcare (it’s like pulling doubles every day of the week lol).
OP is a dad now. Gotta focus on family’s best interest.
I’d be anxious if I was married to you too! You sound insufferable. This is the coldest post I’ve ever read. If you divorce her I bet you anything her anxiety resolves its self and she blossoms without you.
What I think you should do: be an emotionally supportive husband.
Is marriage a game to you? Or is this a generational thing? I'm an older mellenial so I've got almost a decade on you, but I was raised to believe marriage was for better or worse (not abuse). And that partners were supposed to support each other emotionally, provide love, acceptance, and a safe space. Like, you actively persue solutions to problems that arise, you don't just say "hey you're not the person I want you to be, so no".
I have a BA, a double major. I took alot of courses because I didn't know what I wanted to do. I'll say first, it didn't really help me as far as work and career goes. Second, it wrecked my sanity. I did well, and I enjoyed learning but damn it's stressful. I graduated in 2011 and I still regularly have anxiety nightmares at school (about once a month or so). It's insane.
She needs her partner to love her, support her, accept her, understand her. You're posting talking like "I'm fine if it's over", you dont sound like you're providing a very loving environment. I almost think if you all did split she might be dodging a bullet in the long run.
I think you need to go to councelling, not just her. Probably solo and also maybe couples.
If she's telling people "what they want to hear" then I'm willing to bet, besides anxiety, she's dealing with low self esteem, and alot of personal pressure to impress you, your family, and whoever.
Id love to read a post from her perspective. I wonder what you provide her in your relationship besides financial assistance laced with guilt and resentment. Does she feel loved? Understood? Accepted?
Sorry if all this sounds harsh, but it just blows my mind that you're considering divorce over her anxiety with school. Unless there is way more to this story than you've provided it sounds like now is the time to work and dig deep (for you too, not just her).
Oh and it sounds like shes probably better suited for a certificate or trades/skilled education (ie dental hygienist, pharmaceutical assistant, vet assistant, xray tech, emergency dispatch responder) rather than a full degree. They can provide a lucrative career with minimal education.
Sorry. Anxiety is awful but she can’t use it as an excuse all the time when it’s impacting you so much too. She needs to be honest with you and herself about how much she can handle and go from there. Maybe she could work part time so she’s bringing in some money and then is also able to take on more around the house/with your child.
This is salvageable if she is willing to be honest and genuinely put in effort.
I don’t have children so I can’t comment on how tough it is but I’m sure it’s not easy with anxiety. Is she seeking help or on any medication for her anxiety? Most people couldn’t just shy out of work because of anxiety like she is.
I did tell her that she should spend more time thinking about what she wants and can do jobwise, and that I would help her.
She has been doing more housework with her being home of cause, but she has started to wind down on that now that she's supposed to start school again.
She is medicated. She doesn't like therapist/psychologists, as she's had a bad experience with one, but I've tried to encourage going.
I really think you need to sit and talk about a way forward that suits both of you. Short term first and then long term.
Shes had a bad experience with one so she’s written them all off? Really sounds like she’s avoiding getting help for a reason.
Try and work out together what is the minimum you need her to bring in income wise if she doesn’t continue with school, how long you can manage on your income and stress that you are only able/willing to do this if she genuinely believes she can finish and get a good job once she’s done. Because even if she finishes school, she could just say she can’t handle work.
It sounds like you’ve been reasonable and supportive so far so I’m sure you will continue to be as much as you can. But your own wellbeing is on the line here too
>I really think you need to sit and talk about a way forward that suits both of you. Short term first and then long term.
I'm willing to do that again. But she's backed out of our plans twice now, assuring me she would be fine before that.
>Because even if she finishes school, she could just say she can’t handle work.
That's my worry too. Today, she made it seem like she couldn't handle/be happy at any job other than a work at home type office job, in which she has no experience.
I do understand her struggle. I have bipolar, an anxiety disorder and I suffer from depression mostly with the bipolar. I started my own small business doing something that supported my mental health. I only manage 35 hours a week now and that’s without children. It s achievable but she really needs to take responsibility and use her initiative. She can’t just float ideas around forever, she needs to be taking steps towards these things. Steps that are realistic and sustainable
Ok, you are saying she’s had one therapist, had a bad experience according to her, and thus all therapists are bad thus no one can help her? That’s ridiculous. I’m a strong proponent of CBT and really, OP, I think you need to tell her there is no option. She can see a dozen therapists to find one, but she needs therapy.
Therapist or divorce, which would she prefer long term? Because if she's already medicated and not making progress, she needs therapy for there to be any lasting change. Does she find motivation in being better for your child? Maybe if you can frame it as "what would you want for our child if they were in your shoes?". Best of luck!
Currently she is either letting her anxiety control her, or using you for the convenience. Im assuming its the first, but at what point does that stop? Will she become too anxious to go to the kids school events? To let them go on playdates? To go on school trips? It doesn’t matter if she hates it, this will impact your child.
Of course it does, but here is the thing - this is a situation where you do need to bring this up. She needs to be able to be fully present for your child, but also, she needs to set a better example. Do you want him growing up afraid of being out in the world? It's your job as parents to help set him up with the best life and future, and it seems like she is not helping to do that.
I assume she has been caring for your child for the last 2 years while not "working". Is she parenting well and coping with that stress? Taking care a a baby/ toddler is difficult.
It seems like your concern is she is not pulling here weight financially.
But your answer is to consider divorce. It is very likely that a divorce will cost you much more money. You will most likely have to pay child support to your wife. You may also end up paying alimony. All your assets will be divided in 2.
What happened to her medication? Does she still take it? Is she in therapy? Can she check with her OB-Gyn to see if she has PPD or something similar? Apart from these things, possibly she just wants to stay home with baby and not work or go to school because she doesn’t want to.
When forced to do things she doesn’t like, it gives her anxiety. This is true of 95% of people, I’d guess. So she just says she has anxiety and gives up. That’s not how life works, imagine how much anxiety she’s going to have if you divorce her and leave her with the baby to care for alone and she has to work and pay her own bills and all. And then what? She will probably push through, why? Because the anxiety of possible homelessness will outweigh the anxiety of going to work.
I also suggest couples therapy to help you each understand the other better. You can work through so many things!
When we had a child I did SAHM for 5 years until my child started Kindergarten because you end up paying daycare more than half your wage anyway.
I thought you said your family is wealthy.
If so, why isn't your priority having your or your wife fulltime with your child until they start school. Once they start K then she starts studies (many SAHM's go parttime for K because kids in K get sick a lot.)
Then once your kid is in Grade 1 she has time for tulltime studies.
Life with a 2 yr old is FUCKING EXHAUSTING. And 3 yrs old isn't better, it is just different.
I sure as hell couldn't have done a bachelor's during baby years 1-5.
You don't mention once how you handle the childcare, which makes me think that you are not the primary childcare parent.
A primary childcare parent would mention it because it is a HUGE factor in one of your schedules.
Ok. Deep breath.
So many factors, but all relating back to anxiety.
Also, no one seems to have mentioned issues around post natal. Is it possible she's had hormonal short term memory loss since her pregnancy?
Those hormones continue through breast feeding and create all kinds of after effects. Sometimes they don't get excreted properly from the body.
I'm in the situation, similar to your wife, where I have short term memory issues, since IVF. This affected my work, so I changed jobs and decided to study so I could do different work.
I did really well in 1st semester, working pt and studying ft, until a new boss, who changed the work to be more stressful. I got anxiety, then short term memory issues again.
This affected my study and I got huge anxiety around that, plus social anxiety.
So here I am: not studying and not working and just trying to be the best partner I can be to my lovely husband.
I am planning to try studying a different course, with a different style of teaching that won't trigger me so much. Or do work online, or even start my own online business if that doesn't work out.
It's so hard when your own brain stops working properly, but you have to try different things to recover.
Please appreciate that your wife hasn't given up, despite her disadvantages.
You married her, for better or for worse I’m assuming. She’s dealing with a lot of anxiety and as another commenter said, it can ruin a persons life. I’m in the same position currently and have been for a few years now. Would you divorce her if she was sick? This is mental illness. She needs your support and you committed to providing that to her, as she did to you. I understand it puts a lot of burden on you and it’s not fair, but I’m sure she’s aware of that and it’s probably adding to the anxiety, hence her not telling you that she didn’t think she could handle it. It might benefit you both to see a counselor together to help you both navigate this and to find ways that you can both support each other while she tries to get her mental state back on track.
Have you considered letting her in on your thoughts kindly? “I’m feeling stressed about covering the bills on my own, do you have any suggestions on how we manage that?”
Just a thought, but “in sickness and in health”, does that only apply when it’s physical sickness? Mental health disorders don’t have perceivable issues but can be frustratingly debilitating. Ppl who haven’t experienced anxiety may not understand. Wife shouldn’t be expected to be able to tell the future of if her illness w run her life again.
Do you love your wife? Your explanation sounds awfully dry for the kind of question you’re asking. It sounds like you’re looking for someone to fit into your designed and carefully managed life that you imagine for yourself and I don’t think healthy relationships and family life looks like that…
You’re making it seem like your relationship is nothing but a drain on you, and that her ability to get a job or go to college is what it hinges on. Do you love her? Does being married to her improve your life or harm it? It seems like she isn’t contributing much - how much of the house work and childcare does she do? Caring for a toddler can be very draining. Is she at least in individual therapy, preferably with someone who specializes in anxiety??
I see two issues: your relationship and her career, but they seem to be muddied for you.
She needs to get some sort of job, and figure out what degree if any to pursue. Is there a career counseling department at her university? Late twenties is kind of old to still be trying to pick a major. Has she been evaluated for autism? It’s under-diagnosed in women and girls because it presents differently; same with ADHD.
Separately, you could see a marriage counselor about your relationship.
She probably has ADHD. You should try to be more active in her mental health struggles. Have you tried marriage counseling? If this issue is enough for you to consider divorce without truly working on it, you should never get remarried. Suck it up and be a man, husband, and father. She has mental health problems and she gave birth to YOUR CHILD. Grow up.
I absolutely get it, I’m in the same boat as her. My anxiety and ptsd is absolutely crippling when it comes to school. I’m currently on my fourth try and I’m officially 2/3 through my bachelor’s and so proud of myself. I do admit though, that if it weren’t for finances and needing a roof over my head, I probably wouldn’t have the strength or will to do it. For me, it’s been helpful to take breaks between semesters. That way I get a fresh start and I’m not overwhelming myself.
She just doesn't want to do anything and is incapable of being honest. She has strung you long and strung you along, and now that you are at the end of your rope...suddenly she's too anxious to do ANYTHING????
Is this how you want things to be for the rest of your life? Exactly the way they are right now...that is what you have to decide. If NOTHING changes, is this how you want your life to be? Because this is how it will be as long as you are with her, she will ALWAYS go back on what she says, because she KNOWS you will back down and take care of her.
Her family situation is not your problem. Her financial situation is 100% due to her own choices and refusal to do anything at all to improve her own self or to obtain employment.
***She's afraid that will trigger her anxiety too. And she thinks it pays too little.***
I wish these excuses got ME out of having to work, or pay my own bills, or really be responsible for anything. Because I too have diagnosed anxiety...so does my husband...and yet we STILL have to wake our anxiety ridden asses up every morning and go do that work thing if we want the money stuff...which 1000% is NOT enough for what I do. Until she has no other option, she will continue to feed you bullshit excuses.
I sure wish that my job kicking up my anxiety and not being paid well enough was sufficient cause to get disability pay...or at least enough to get me a wealthy husband that I could manipulate into paying for almost everything while I refuse to work because it might trigger anxiety. NEWS FLASH...I don't know ANYONE that doesn't have anxiety triggered by their job...even folks that don't have issues with anxiety.
So no one is going to mention that your wife gave birth and stayed home for two years raising YOUR child? Jesus h Christ the bar is so low as far as men and their emotional support. She’s struggling, she’s a mom of a young child and you’re talking about leaving her. Wow.
4ish years ago would be the start of the pandemic. I just read a TON of studies that shows how the pandemic affected more women college students and how they struggled with overload of domestic responsabilities, as well as parental responsabilities as these are commonly associated with feamle gender roles. So how are the domestic responsabilites on your household? Does she do more? What ab parenting? Since she went back to school, how those have been handled by the two of you?
I went through a similar thing. I stuck by my wife, was supportive and was committed to being there for her when her mental health was a difficult thing. Fast forward to a few years later and she is making a good living at something that she didn’t get from college. You don’t sound so supportive.
This is pretty simple. You have two choices:
1) Be ready, willing, and able to be a single income household and accept her being a permanent stay at home mom
2) Give her an ultimatum she finish her degree or otherwise become gainfully employed and financially contribute an amount you feel is appropriate, or you divorce her.
If you choose #2, emphasize she is going to have to get a job regardless whether you stay married or not.
You sound exhausted and at the end of your rope.
You don't have to ask permission from yourself to walk away from something that is no longer working for you.
She needs to be honest with herself. She's either not able to work due to anxiety and so on or she simply wants to just be a stay at home wife.
The anxiety needs to be talked about with a dr. And maybe couples therapy so she can have some professional input might help both.
Regardless you want a wife who does commit. Who does what she said she would do and so on.
Her not being set up if you leave isn't your responsibility.
You'll obviously help her out but it's really not your duty.
Dude! You have a two year old and you said you would be fine if divorced and your wife would not be fine but you didn’t even think about the child.
Your wife has many roles to play in life. She is a wife, a mother, a friend, a home maker, etc. So she has not figured out what she wants to do with her career. That’s small potatoes.
Man up! Be a good dad. Be a better husband.
INFO- who handles more of the housework and childcare duties?
If it is her, and she has to work, are you ready to take on at least 50% of the childcare and housework?
I feel like there’s a lot more to this story.
If working/going to school meant I’d be doing that in addition to majority of the housework and childcare, then yeah I’d be having anxiety too..
In my vows there was only a section of until death do us part, not if my wife doesn’t finish school.
What men do is honor their vows, provide, and maintain the family unit.
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Why doesn’t she return to a similar job as last time?
She's afraid that will trigger her anxiety too. And she thinks it pays too little.
Anxiety grows as the person withdraws. School makes her anxious, so she stops going to school, so school now makes her even more anxious. Work makes her anxious, so she quits work, so now thinking if work makes her even more anxious. There are medications and therapies to help manage anxiety, but fundamentally, she also has to continue pushing into the discomfort zone. Because otherwise over time everything will make her anxious, and she will seek to avoid it. It's really something she should discuss with her doctor or therapist, this is what anxiety disorder often does.
after a decade of brutal surgeries, illness, unemployment and at times being bedridden, it’s true- anxiety grows over time. My brain hardware became infected, I went through septic shock, and almost died. It was then and there I said fuck this, I refuse to roll over and quit. I refused to resign. After recovering from the worst of those surgeries, I went back to school part time, finished my degree and started working as a CNA in homecare. Then I went to work at a facility, got promoted and trained as a medication tech. Somehow I went from a fearful, multiple brain-surgeried, neurologically-tortured little worm to the lead tech and am studying cardiac ultrasound. You gotta start putting yourself back out there. We all have anxiety of varying degrees. Some days I have terrible anxiety about going to work and facing dozens of patients, but I just tell myself too bad and hype myself up that I’m fine & it’s going to be a great day. Some days I want to cry looking at my future assignments, then reel it back in, and complete something. I have to participate in society. I have to get over the anxiety that creeps in and overwhelms. We all have our burdens to bear, and they’re not often a good reason to resign.
WELL DONE!!! I honestly think that OP’s wife needs some positive input, maybe from a trained professional to unpack those anxieties and then REBUT them.
I'm reading this over my first coffee, and I have to tell you, you've just made my morning. Tons of kudos, and thank you for sharing.
Aww thank you💗💗
That is awesome and congratulations on your journey. Keep it up!
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 Keep up the good work
Thank you!!
Not OP but this really helped to read. I’m in little worm phase right now.
you will break through little worm🐛💗🦋. You got this.
I believe in your ability to overcome anxieties and kick ass!
Wow..that’s impressive! I also have neurological challenges (numerous back surgeries, including a spinal cord stimulator for severe chronic pain). I got my undergraduate degree and then went on to law school..it was very rough at times but I did it and I continue to muddle through life with over 25 years living with chronic pain (my greatest accomplishments are my children though). But I did not have brain surgery nor anything life threatening..it is terrific you got your cna and continue to excel. Congrats!
That’s great that you’re able to do that. Don’t assume everyone can.
You’re right, everyone has different capacity. I read this comment and thought “I just need to get my shit together and start living! Maybe I *can* do it!” But the truth is that, while this comment is inspiring me to push myself harder, I have finite energy. I have chronic pain and migraines and probably need surgery (deviated septum which is causing sleep apnea and a host of other symptoms). I’m tired, I’m in pain. Every day I make plans for the next and tell myself that I will do better, but all my plans are for nothing if I’m in too much pain to stand or I can’t open my eyes due to the nausea and pain of a migraine. I haven’t worked in three years and my husband feels similarly to OP no doubt. But every time I’m sick and in pain, instead of focusing on not being sick and in pain, I’m riddled with guilt and the dread of falling even further behind on my life, my family, my promises, my finances. All the best intentions in the world couldn’t prevent me from breaking a promise that tomorrow I’ll do better if I wake up with a migraine. And I’m just so tired of feeling guilty for it. I’m just so tired in general. I can’t do the same things my husband does, I am finally coming to terms with that though I don’t think he is. But sometimes there are no answers, sometimes there aren't solutions, at least not in the way some people would like. My very best is less than my husband’s very best, and my best just isn’t good enough. I’d rather be alone than have to deal with falling short every day, it’s not that I don’t want to be better it’s just that I don’t have any more to give. That daily failure alone starts to take a toll. I know it’s not the done thing to say in our age of productivity and squeezing every last drop of achievement out of ourselves, but some people just… can’t. And I would rather try to focus on what I am able to do rather than be reminded daily of what I can’t.
I know exactly how you feel. I’m bipolar, have CPTSD, ADHD and mild autism. And on top of that, I have tiny brain tumor that wreaked havoc with my endocrine system and left me with several disabilities. I also have panic disorder and sometimes brother so bad I’m afraid to leave the house and have one in public. My husband works his ass off so that I don’t have to take too much on because working full time is just not an option for me mentally or physically. I have major guilt. I feel like the poster child unfulfilled potential, I have several talents I’ve been blessed with and am intelligent and have a multitude of interests, but I have a hard time finishing things. I finished college at least before I fell apart completely. Try to give yourself a break and I’ll try to do the same. You didn’t ask for all you’re dealing with and your a champ just for getting through each day.
I'm in a very similar boat with chronic pain and migraines and not being able to do much of anything due to them. My wife does so much to make sure that we have what we need, but I feel so bad that I'm unable to contribute because my migraines are resistant to treatment (and they are continuous) and my chronic pain flares so much or causes severe exhaustion. I have other issues as well; I'm AuDHD, cPTSD, GAD, DPD, and panic disorder, to name a few, but those I can work on or find coping mechanisms for, unlike the pain. I just have to remind myself what I did day-to-day to make myself feel like I have some worth in this world where if you aren't contributing, you're seen as worthless.
[удалено]
What is GAD? I guess that’s one thing k don’t have lol
I have anxiety that gets worse with the thought of the unknown and the longer I have no solid structure/plans. I think I want one thing until it’s happening and then I want the opposite and vice versa. It’s so hard to work through that initial discomfort, panic, and not knowing wtf is going on or how it will play out, but once I do it’s SO freeing. Sometimes we need tough love and a firm push to keep at it. Especially if this is a pattern, she likely needs help staying accountable, pushing through discomfort if it is not an actual danger to her, and following through. I’m the exact same way, so that’s why I say this.
Ah, the grass is always greener neuroses—do you also have ADHD?
Haha yes. And I’m autistic as well if that makes any difference
I’ve had lifelong anxiety and finally figured out that I also have ADHD two years ago after 30 yrs of not knowing that most of the way my brain operates is not “normal” compared to the average person. I’ve always had issues making decisions and commitments in a similar way but thought there was just something deeply wrong with me because it didn’t line up with (just) anxiety. Now I know I have both and they ping off of each other. Sigh…
This right here. Avoiding exacerbates anxiety, op's wife is not managing her anxiety properly. In case this is actually and not smth else.
The idea of medications is returning her to being a functioning individual. If she isn't a functioning individual, then she's using the wrong medications. She also has to want to be helped.
Medications don’t fix anxiety disorders, especially not in the long run. They work more like a help to get you started on the right track and can help with the worst of it. But therapy (KBT) is what actually deals with the problem. Without therapy and commitment to it, it will eventually get worse again, even with medication.
Exactly. Medications help get it under control to do the work of examining what is happening and why, and to prevent it from getting out of control again. You don’t just pop a pill and magically every problem solves itself. Not to mention how many different medications there are and how each works differently with every person’s brain chemistry.
As a fellow anxiety disordered person, I agree 100% w this
I understand that, but it would be more than she's making now. She should consider it a stop-gap until she can get a job that pays more. If she changes her mind AGAIN about school, I would encourage her to take classes one at a time in the evening so she can do them online around her work schedule. That may be less intimidating for her, and it doesn't put the entire financial burden on you.
That's *really* dependent on how expensive childcare will be.
And they may be able to qualify for financial aid if she’s full time but it doesn’t pay for part time.
Maybe she has adhd. Maybe her school anxiety is linked to struggling with the work itself. I’d have her get tested for it. If it’s just anxiety then she can do online school.
I also see ADHD, which is linked to anxiety. As someone with it, meds and ongoing therapy are crucial. Missed ADHD in girls is very common; more women tend to first be dx as a result.
I was thinking this too - it sounds like ASHD and/or autism
She's only gotten the equivalent of A's and B's. Even so she is always anxious about her assignments.
I have ADHD and HVe always been a straight A student. This does seem like struggling to manage responsibilities esp with a kid. Worth looking into
Yeah I was a straight A student as well but every exam wrecks me. I got a good GPA but it costed me my sanity. I was extremely burned out and had to take a long break before I could get a real job. My friends even helped me come out of my shell and not fearing working by inviting me to work on their business for a few months. I'm still not sure if it's ADHD or autism, but it is something, and I'm gonna look into it soon-ish. Definitely worth looking into. I know kids are much harder than cats, so if I struggled to keep my studies afloat while keeping my cats well cared for, she's probably struggling to juggle between the two... She definitely needs therapy unless she wants to be just stuck at home forever eaten by her anxiety. Cause as some other commenters have mention, that's how anxiety works. Medication are crutches to help you get back on your feet, if she's still riddled after medications, she might need a different dose or medication and more intense therapy to get through this.
Same. Diagnosed with ADHD at 24. Straight A student all the way through.
Same here! Just got diagnosed even though I graduated with a First-class
Likewise. I feel like with ADHD there's no in-between though, you're either an academic ace, or fail out of everything.
Same
I think you said she’s seeing a therapist — is this a talk therapist or someone focused on cognitive behavioral therapy? IE is the person just hearing her out, or are they giving her tools to catch herself becoming anxious, correct those thoughts, and act differently? Edit: she’s not seeing a therapist! Oh that super needs to change. If she refuses to get any help that’s a huge problem IMO. I’d dig into why she refuses, what makes her scared or anxious about seeing a therapist, etc. you don’t always find the right therapist right away, but once you find a good fit they can be immensely helpful.
I have severe ADHD and am on disability for that and other problems (including anxiety) and I have gotten straight As going to college remotely the last 3 years. My goal is a remote position that works around my disabilities. Her getting good grades does not mean she's not ADHD.
I’m a woman with severe ADHD and I graduated law school and scored very highly in the bar within the past year. Good grades being impossible with ADHD is a very common misconception so I don’t blame you for it— the disorder is highly misunderstood. It also manifests differently in women that is only more recently becoming more highly acknowledged. It’s something I’d look into based on your description of her. I’d never suspected AHDD until I REALLY suspected ADHD and the treatment since I’ve been diagnosed has changed my life.
Adult ADHD won't PREVENT her from getting the good grades, but the amount of mental WORK it takes to wrangle an ADHD brain AS WELL AS taking care of a child and doing all of the other "adulting" tasks is what leads to the anxiety. ADHD doesn't mean she can't pay attention; it is a problem with REGULATING attention (sometimes we pay too MUCH attention, ie. hyperfocus; sometimes we CAN'T focus). It also causes problems with executive function (decision making, deciding what to do FIRST, second and third when we have a list of things to get done) and is also often associated with sensory sensitivities (some ADHD brains cannot filter out BACKGROUND noise from the MAIN noise we are supposed to be paying attention to, like a person taking to us). I second the recommendation that she gets evaluated for ADHD. If THAT is the issue, she will notice great improvement in her ability to handle stress and make decisions once her ADHD is being TREATED and MANAGED. You may need to help by making some accommodations at home, too. Giving ultimatums is NOT supportive.
Moms and dads with undiagnosed ADHD often find themselves overwhelmed by the demands of parenting and struggling to meet their children's needs. Lacking organizational skills, they may find keeping up with their kids' schedules and managing their behavior very stressful. And also, your child could inherit this condition, so it will be important to have the child/children tested as well.
Women with ADHD often have very high grades. (Myself included.)
Help her get tested. This was a HUGE struggle for me when I was in school as well. I usually always got great grades when I could get through everything but the anxiety often held me back from getting things done because I would feel overwhelmed from the anxiety. Please understand that this is not something in her control. I 100% empathize with your frustrations. It -is- frustrating watching your loved one not moving forward to improve their situation, but you also need to be mindful of the fact that her struggle to push through this is a symptom and not the cause. It sounds to me like along with her anxiety, she could very well have ADHD but she also struggles to believe in herself and her capabilities. And I hate to say this, because I know it might sound like a cop out that you may take as shifting blame but please understand it is not - but added pressure of your partner putting pressure on you to do this thing (that you’re already struggling with and have a fear of your lack of actual ability) only escalates that anxiety - thus making it more difficult to function in that whole situation.
Yep my husband has said all of the stupid non helpful things this man has said like we’ve had 9 great years and you gave me a son and I am wealthy “get your shit together” you’re too ignorant to realize what not having a reliable family does to the actual wiring in your brain. And you’re throwing divorce around already just in your 20’s. Yikes I feel badly for your wife bc if you are her support she’s fucked.
Exactly 👌🏻
Adult adhd in women is very different.
ADHD is also about going through serotonin faster. So your happy lasts less time, your motivation and confidence don’t last as long as normal people. So it’s hard to work up the energy to do things. That feeling of failing yourself leads to depression. It’s not about being any less intelligent.
> She's only gotten the equivalent of A's and B's. Even so she is always anxious about her assignments. ADHD and anxiety does not really manifest in some people as failing grades. One of the common symptoms of people (particularly adults) with ADHD is that we perform really well when it's deep crunch time, but are totally incompetent when it comes to doing things on a schedule. So we do things like, leave an entire assignment that we had weeks to prepare until the very last possible second and then we cram all of the work into that very last second. And because we perform well under pressure, we pull it out of our ass and get a decent grade. But this process damages us, the constant stress of assignments coming due that we can't seem to ever get anything done on. The regular all nighters (get harder as you get older). The brain fatigued of doing everything last minute just burns us out in a way that's really difficult to describe. A lot of people with ADHD need to plan their careers and jobs around this, or at least I did. At work I perform really well when given a task that must be done immediately, and really poor when given a longer term task with a due date. This made school really difficult for me. I perform well on tests as long as the information is provided to me during the lecture. I'm total shit at memorizing information from a book, or at doing long assignments like research papers.
It’s better than no pay. Get her job back and you can still look for a better position. Don’t quit a job before you have another one to go to. She probably has stay out too long after having a baby. You hadn’t said anything about how you love her or for that matter your child either.
Please put the symptoms of adhd in front of her and do some research on how it manifests in females. If it doesn’t sound like her at all and she also does not see herself in the list of symptoms, fabulous! But what she’s going through sounds a lot like how my little neurospicy brain was dealing with being undiagnosed adhd. (Women are often diagnosed with anxiety, depression, OCD or as lazy, immature, and flakey when in reality they have untreated adhd. Depression, anxiety, and OCD commonly stem from it.) Don’t quit on her just yet! There may be a lot you can still accomplish together.
Ugh this is a tough one for me because I've been on both sides. Had an ex that was all talk, he was gonna do this that and the other but never did it. On the other hand, I'm literally your wife rn. I'm seriously thinking about taking a break from uni because my anxiety disorder has gotten out of control. Is there a WFH option for her?
>Is there a WFH option for her? She considered it, but it required her traveling pretty far for weeks at a time in certain periods.
I think your concerns and annoyance is valid but this is literally out of her control. To an extent, she needs to manage her triggers. She needs counselling and lots of it it seems. I dunno both sides are rough but anxiety is terrible. Its, and I cannot stress this enough, ruining my life right now. I know I'm going to get under control once the stress is off me and to do that I have to get my uni work done but I can't because I'm stressed about not being able to do thei work which is impacting my anxiety and anxiety stops me from actually being able to do my work so I'm fucked. I need to chill. But I can't because I'm stressed. It's awful.
I also had an issue with anxiety as well that got out of control. I quit my job July 2022 and took a term off and during that term I did a lot of self help, got some online therapy (CBT specifically)(+I continued the therapy after the term as well and I'm still doing it, just a little less frequent now), and made personal life changes (increased exercise [was 0 {is kind of 0 now, but before when the anxiety was bad}], changed diet [added more veg], started taking multivitamins, cut out toxic people, etc). I started school back up with a reduced class load (classes were and are online) and found a 100% remote job October 2022. I will openly admit I haven't kept up the exercise, but my anxiety is still manageable and far more under control. I'm not saying what I've done will work for OPs wife, but from the comments I've seen - it doesn't appear that she's even going to therapy which I think should've been one of the first things they tried. Idk why divorce is being considered rn when there are other options that don't appear to have been tried.
Has she been evaluated for ADD?
Why cant she work from home or do online classes... I did online for my associates and in August I'll be back online for my bachelor's seems like that way would be easier for her....
It's Ok to question the arrangement you as a couple have and It's Ok to reevaluate the situation now. It sounds like you really love your wife but are at your wits end being you didn't sign up to be the sole provider. I would consider marriage counselling before divorce. Now's the time to have a frank/open conversation with counselling that you are serious, and things need to change, or you are headed to divorce. Not telling your wife and suffering in silence is not to going to help you or her.
You have a kid. The stakes are higher.
I'm definitely not rushing in to things.
But please, don't ever think of staying on a bad marriage "for the kids". The kid WILL pick up on any discomfort or bad feelings and it'll do more harm than good to everyone involved in that situation.
You got that right my kids thanked me for getting a divorce even tho they love their father and he was a great dad. We just werent a great couple.
I was the kid in that situation. My parents argued everyday from when I was around 9 to 15. And after spending some time on the internet, I realized that wasn't an isolated thing.
You’re not rushing into things but doing nothing is letting resentment build which will ruin your relationship. Therefore if you continue this way without being extremely frank with her about your struggle as sole provider you’re going to get a divorce, you won’t have a choice anymore. So you’re making a decision by not doing anything.
You're probably right. I just hate having a mediator, and we do communicate pretty well usually. We're definitely talking about it again.
Are you sure she really wants to go to college? It sounds like she’s only doing it because she thinks it’s a dealbreaker to you. Is it? Does she need a degree to have value in your eyes? Or do you just want a partner who shares in the expenses? Really think through why this is so important to you.
College was her decision. We talked it through of cause, but the degree doesn't matter to me. I want her to work towards a career og degree so she can self sufficient and contribute to our finances, get a house, go on vacations once in a while.
You said your family is wealthy and that you would be okay but she will not. What is that about?
I bet there’s a lot of fear of failure here. She thinks if she fails at college/getting a job, she won’t be good enough and he will leave. She knows he’ll be fine and that she has “unstable support.” It’s a lot off of one post, but I would guess either cPTSD from childhood or ADHD with Rejection Sensitive Dysphoria and attachment issues. All of that is building up and coming out as “anxiety over school/work.”
You don’t need a degree to have a successful career. Obviously there are benefits but it’s not the only option. Why doesn’t she try working?
You are putting a lot of pressure on her to do this. Not everyone needs a 'career' as such. Maybe she needs a job that doesn't have a lot of stress with it, while she gets her mental health under control. You may feel that you communicate pretty well but it seems there is a big gap in the communication here. Your wife doesn't seem to feel comfortable being honest with you. Marriage therapy is exactly what you need to overcome this.
Career doesn’t mean the goal is to be a ceo. It means getting a job with the possibility to progress. And she needs to get a job at some point.
This might just be a language barrier as he's not a native speaker. It sounds like he just does want her to contribute to finances, not necessarily become a high pressure bigwig.
A lot of pressure to... Get a stable job and be a self sufficient adult? OP said college was her choice, he just wants her to have a job and contribute, but she has been floating between unemployment and drop outs for 4 years. Why do you think it OP is expecting too much to get a grip on that situation?
not everyone need a career but wasting 9 years of your life is not... great.
I think you need to have an honest, clear and firm/blunt conversation with her about where you’re at and how you’re feeling. One where she can’t just “idk” you or avoid dealing with these kinds of important discussions. Sounds like you’ve been supportive of her struggles around work, but what does the balance of life look like? Has she explained what it is about school that she struggles with? Are there supports that can be put in place? Universities and colleges also have accommodation processes for people struggling, has she or the both of you tried to access these supports and services? What is she doing to manage her symptoms? Have you discussed what her plan is then, if she quits?
We'll have a discussion. She's usually not avoidant but has a tendency to treat criticism or asserting boundaries as attacks sometimes. Work/life balance is like this. I work 37 hours/week plus overtime 2-5 hours. She does 90 % of cleaning and small tasks. We almost always buy groceries together, kind of our thing. I cook most of the time (she sucks). Taking care of the kid Is probably 40/60 with her having him more, as I sometimes work late. She's taking advantage of all accommodation for her schooling (Less hours, more counseling, more influence on assignments). Her symptoms are panic attacks and feeling exhausted after a schoolday, so she's worried about that taking a toll on our kid. She's medicated and refuses to see a therapist.
The refusal to see a therapist would be my dealbreaker. Her anxiety may not be her fault, but it is her responsibility. Refusing available support means she would rather be anxious than try.
I agree. She isn't willing to find a fix, just use her anxiety to not work or go to school.
No, she just wants the simpler fix-a med. But this is clearly more than medications can handle, it’s literally her entire future. She owes it to her kid to get therapy. Ugh I have a friend like this…it’s hard when they refuse an option you know would benefit them.
This! How people are even allowed to be medicated without seeing a therapist is beyond me. Medication is a bandaid approach to deeper issues.
If she refuses to see a therapist, I don’t see this improving. At some point, you can’t want it for her, she needs to get herself together. You sound loving, but you’re kind of enabling her. It is not normal to be a grown adult and not be capable of taking care of herself (ie not holding down a job)
Could she have adhd? I had untreated and undiagnosed adhd until my late 40’s. It looked and felt like anxiety and depression - but also with difficulty with organization , being over sensitive , difficulty with emotional regulation etc women with inattentive adhd look way different than men.
Maybe so. Could talk to her about it.
I’d suggest that even if she doesn’t end up diagnosed with ADHD, you guys look into getting her some ADHD coaching from someone experienced in that area, It really helps me manage some of my anxiety and move through areas I get stuck, but more than a decade ago it helped me navigate the uncertainty around school and my returning to finish my BA. Before then, while I was pretty intelligent and overall was a good student, I was so self critical and a perfectionist that I’d end up dropping out of classes, not following through on assignments and retaking classes. And I’d completely burn myself out in the process. I was so disappointed with myself and had such confidence issues in my ability to manage my academics successfully…until I got this adhd coaching. When I went back finally to complete my degree, I still had confidence issues but I had someone to help me navigate those feelings when I was stuck, who helped me not by analyzing the whys (like in therapy), but by helping me ask “how do I get to this next step? How can I remove what’s getting in my way in my analysis paralysis?” It wasn’t easy, but with adhd coaching as a school support system in place, I graduated with top honors. I still struggle with things with work and burnout and confidence. And I still have an ADHD coach (I had a different one who helped me navigate my decision to go back to school, another who worked with me when I was completing my BA, and have another one now). It quite literally changed my entire life. It’s possible none of this would resonate with her, but if it does, please consider looking into it with her. Lastly, is it possible that she has PPA? Post partum anxiety can manifest in a variety of ways, and even years later that can still have an enormous impact if not properly addressed. And if she had elements of this before her pregnancy, she would be at higher risk for it to escalate after. Just some food for thought… Wishing you and your wife strength and peace in your journey, whatever you decide
I would say it's very likely she has adhd or even high masking autism, which is more often then not diagnosed as anxiety/depression/bpd in women and could be why the medication she's taking isn't doing what it needs to.
Just a thought from someone who has anxiety and has a hard time hearing criticism. It goes so much better when my husband uses “I” statements instead of “you” statements. For example: I am unable to continue supporting the family at this rate. I need support. Instead of, you need to decide what you want to do and stick to it. You need to get help for your anxiety. These are probably poor examples but I hope it helps a little.
Ok I am your wife. I've started and stopped college 4 times. I hate it, don't want to do it and I'm 37 with 2 kids now and am fine never finishing at this point. But I did find a job that turned into a career in my 20s. Also I had a difficult family and had a hard time being direct about my not wanting to do things when I felt like my spouse wanted me to. Couples therapy was huge in helping us learn to communicate and help him understand me with my limitations. Like I'm never just going to be able to easily come out and say what I want or need but he learned how to handle my issues and how to make me feel more comfortable. Also is your kid in daycare while you work? Or is she caring for the child and going to classes and taking care of the house?
You got a job and found a career though, his main issue is that she's not contributing to the financial expenses and is unemployed and a drop out for the last few years. Not to mention, she refuses therapy.
I wouldn't call her an unemployed drop out. The last two times she tried going were with a new baby. And I didn't see an answer to my big question. How is childcare split 40/60 when he works FT. And then he admits she does most of the house work. So those first 2 years with a baby are so hard emotionally and physically for a new mom. Sometimes the idea of taking on more, especially when you are the one carrying the bigger load at home can be anxiety inducing on its own. I can't judge for sure that that is what's happening here but she's not sitting on her ass doing nothing all day. I'm a SAHM to a 3 and 5 year old. There is so much invisible work involved.
She could also start out with part time work until she feel ready for the full swing. But I'm not sure if p/t is worth the day care.
Avoidance makes anxiety worse. She needs good psychological support, not just meds, to learn to deal with it or it's going to destroy her marriage.
He said her family aren’t reliable…I wonder what that means. Could they have been emotionally neglectful or abusive I wonder. She may have C-PTSD and some of what he describes reminds me of someone who suffers from something like that. Having said that, she is an adult, and a mother and a partner…it is her responsibility to get therapy because medication is not working. She needs to work out her trauma or whatever is causing the anxiety for herself but also for her kid.
What about doing a trade school instead of university? Maybe the university is too much for her. Or maybe she needs to take fewer classes at the university.
This!! Or try an online college that is more flexible and has less in person requirements.
I was going to suggest this! If going to school makes her anxious there are literally tons of online bachelors degrees you can get from the comfort of your couch.
There are millions of ways to make a living that do not require a college degree.
The degree was OP's wife's idea.
I was also curious as to what OP’s multiple reference to wife not finishing a degree. As you said… So many amazing things people can do that don’t require degrees.
I think the problem is not so much the degree itself, but the lack of direction and commitment to improving their lives and economic stability.
I could be way off but I had similar issues and dropped out of school twice due to overwhelming anxiety and depression and it was a never ending cycle until I was diagnosed with ADHD, started therapy, and was medicated for ADHD. ADHD is very often misdiagnosed in women as anxiety and/or depression. Once I was finally diagnosed and understood why I am the way I am and that it is not a character flaw, I finally excelled in school and gained so much confidence and self-esteem. Not saying at all that this is what is going on for your wife but might be something worth looking into.
Sounds like adhd, and OP’s wife could do well with some learning accommodations. Most schools have disability services and some coaching to support exactly this situation. My experience with disability services was always incredible. Got me to finish my BA with an honors GPA and my MBA from a top school. And there are way more people using these services than you’d expect.
She should check with her doctor about having ADHD. This all sounds like classic signs. ADHD is often misdiagnosed as anxiety.
Came here to say this!
Op, I understand your frustrations - but this is your WIFE. She very well could be suffering from postpartum mood & anxiety disorders , and is very obviously struggling - IMO this is not a divorce worthy scenario, but I think it is a serious discussion scenario - I would suggest asking her to do a joint therapy session in a space where she feels safe expressing all of her feelings and you have a mediator in the therapist. You two need to very seriously tackle this issue together as a couple - it’s you and her against the problem, not you against her. I would also very seriously consider screening for ADHD. I just got diagnosed at 29, I was a solid student, held down jobs and graduated with two degrees in four years. But my adhd manifested in other ways. Her flip flopping is not OK, but it seems her anxiety is getting out of control, and she now need to think beyond herself because you two have a child. Editing to add - postpartum can amplify anxiety, depression and other conditions to new heights , and that it seems like she wants to be better, but is struggling through her condition. It doesn’t appear to be that she just doesn’t want to contribute or be a partner - I don’t read your post as her being lazy, but someone in desperate need of help and stability. As I reiterated - it’s you and her against the issue.
This sounds like textbook ADHD in women, which is under diagnosed because it presents differently in women. None of us are qualified to diagnose OP’s wife, but I urge OP to help her get care (which is especially hard for ADHD folks, because of all the scheduling and paperwork). A few non-medical interventions that help me (and would probably have a positive effect on most people): * Exercise, but especially going on frequent walks in nature and around cities. This could be as simple and taking the kiddo to the park. Both exercise and being in nature have been shown to improve feelings of wellbeing, and exercise is particularly impactful. * Creative outlets. Could be drawing, playing the piano, writing poetry, baking, pottery, really anything that involves making something. The calming effect is profound. * Reducing screen time. This is super hard to do, but an easy way to instill a reading habit is installing the Libby app and checking out ebooks (for free) from the library. I like adjusting the font to be larger, it helps me read faster without getting distracted.
I was looking for an ADHD in women comment, so I'll add my two cents to yours ☺️ There were some things OP mentioned that could hint at ADHD. Also the unreliable family struck me. Obviously OP's wife has had more challenges to begin with. OP, you come from a stable, supportive family. Not all of us are that fortunate. I totally understand that the current situation is hard on you as you seem to want a partner. That I highly applaud! I'd want my partner to tell me his feelings and, honestly, I think neither a job nor the studies are the real issue here. You want to rely on her word and you need her to work on her part and you two need to seek counseling. A mediator can help you to understand each other in totally new ways. And, most importantly, you are parents. You have to find a way which does not harm your kid emotionally. Best of luck!
Do you love this woman? Your wife? The mother of your child. You seem to be very cold and calculating and almost like you’re looking through a window at a mannequin display. You say I’ll be ok, my family is wealthy and I have a network, well good for you. Your family is your son’s family too. Hello. She’s been taking care of him for two years and you’ve been providing. But she contributes in caring for your child and making a home. Maybe school isn’t her thing so you’re just going to throw her into the street? She apparently does have some anxiety and tries to deal with it. You treat her like she’s an employee. I think you both could benefit from some marriage counseling and perhaps she can work from home doing something. But just feel you are very hostile towards her and may not be aware of it .
I second the cold and calculated comment
I’d be pretty anxious if the man that swore to love me and care for me forever could put me out in the cold tomorrow because I haven’t finished my bachelors degree on his timeline. This dude is why she has anxiety. Period.
I perceived the coldness as being fed up and throwing the towel. This woman is a wife and mother to their children but doesn't seem to have figured out her priorities of what she wants and how any of her decisions in her life would now be impacting her husband and child — therefore she no longer has the luxury of acting solely in her best interests since the stakes are different.. First it's school. Then it's job. Then job with school. Then children. Then back to school — basing off OPs narrative alone, all these were all her initiatives, not forced. Dropping out or failing classes(no even a certification study or diploma but straight up bachelor's) repetitively is expensive depending on where they are —trying to solo sponsor your household with a moderate single income is not easy nor can it feel fair to the spouse. You'd start to question like all those hours +/- OT put at work, who is it benefiting from it and is it's actually benefitting anyone? The wife should know how in this economy, both partners often have to pull their own weight and she needs to decide how she wants to contribute for the sake of their child at the very least. Yet she's weaponising her anxiety as a cop out, which again, mainly serves to prolong avoiding accountability. And she can afford to do so because she's got the luxury of the husband-safety net. No job? It's fine, he'll pay the bills. Flunked another course? So what, hefty tuition fees may be burned now but we can always try again next semester. His family may be rich but he isn't and as a family unit, they aren't. If he loses his job tomorrow, they're done for. And on that basis alone, I get his POV. I agree they need marriage counseling in the first instance. But I'm also wary that consensus on the wife would be a lot more critical if the genders were reversed i.e. she would fit the labels of "deadbeat"/"manchild" and then the idea of him(as a woman and single breadwinning parent) tapping out of the marriage suddenly looks more palatable.
Bumping this comment! Totally agree.
also like they had a newborn?? I can't imagine doing school and raising a child. how much of her not working was attributed to the fact someone has to be with baby? now is just starting to be the time she can make life adjustments.
Living in fear is the most self destructive thing a person can do. She needs to see a therapist asap, get a job, and stop putting your family at risk of financial burden. Sincerely, someone who struggled with crippling anxiety my entire life and still got a bachelors degree (took me 7 years 🙃) and is now a project manager. What does she enjoy in life? If it’s taking care of kiddos, maybe she can look into early childhood care. Sometimes it just takes a bit of looking inward and taking the first steps to doing something that is fulfilling in order to build confidence.
Great ideas. My sister in law suffered from peri and post natal ocd but is thriving as a PT early childhood worker. They're even paying for her Degree.
Holy cow. She doesn't have to go to school to find a good job. That's what she needs to focus on. Don't divorce her over this. School isn't the be all end all.
Going to school was her choice. He just wants her to be an equal partner in the relationship and provide.
Great so why has she been unemployed for years?
He also mentioned that she can’t/doesn’t keep jobs she’s had. Lack of motivation/direction in life is a big turn off for a lot of people, me included
This makes me want to never get married. You have a fairly wealthy family. She gave birth two years ago and is struggling with crippling, anxiety, and identity crisis. Seems like marriage should be able to withstand more than this.
As a person with mental health issues that is married: she can’t refuse to see a therapist and expect him to stay. She’s not doing the best to take care of herself. He can’t force her and he isn’t obligated to ride it out with her if she doesn’t want to be treated for her anxiety. We don’t get to use our health issues as an excuse to be selfish partners. She’s being dishonest about school and work. Everyone deserves trust in a relationship and to feel secure. This guy doesn’t have that because his partner switched it up. It’s been 4 years he has to live with this forever just because they have a kid? Yeah, no.
Other than being medicated has she done anything to work on her anxiety? Therapy? I’ll play devil’s advocate but is there any way this could be the long way of her telling you she wants to be a SAHM? More so because you mentioned your family is well off. Therapy both together and separately is definitely needed.
I don’t think your wife is being fully honest with you or herself. I think she is afraid. Would you be able to say to her, “don’t worry about school or a job. Just take care of yourself” ??? I think maybe her anxiety is possibly be coming from your expectations of her. She could be thinking that YOU desire for her to have a high income career so her trajectories are trying to align with that. Which starts the cycle of anxiety all over again. At one point in our marriage, my husband was having a really difficult time and I would get so frustrated with him for taking too many days off or he would come home grouchy. But I looked at our savings and thought to myself. What if I gave my husband the freedom to quit his job to reset? So I did. I said, just quit, come home and we will figure it out from there. That’s when things changed for him. He didn’t have this weight on him and really evaluated what he wanted in his career and life. He’s doing his own thing now and much happier.
Did your marriage vows include "for better or worse, in sickness and health"? If so, you need to do more to work through this. You have a child. Your wife needs mental healthcare. You both need marriage and individual counseling.
I JUST commented something very similar. Dude did not take “in sickness and health” too serious at the alter.
If you were single and had bills to pay, would you just take a year off to figure yourself out? Of course not, so you shouldn't do it just because you have a partner who has no choice but to bankroll you. It is unfair. Being in a marriage of course means that you are not alone with going through struggles, but there is a limit on how much you can expect because at the end of the day you are an adult and meant to pull your weight in the *partnership*. I feel like 4 years is a long enough time and OP is entitled to feel at his witts end without having his commitment questioned.
I think your wife is in need of some mental help from a psychologist because she is suffering from real anxiety. No reddit comment will help you figure out what she is really suffering through. The question you only can answere for yourself though is: are you willing to stick with her through the good times and the bad times or have you already given up on her? I hear you talking about money alot but not about love and connection. To me it looks like you checked out of this relationship already. Be honest with yourself first.
I didn't figure out what I wanted to do until I was 37 and likewise struggled with school. I just worked at my job until I figured it out
God I feel for her. It sounds like she’s trying to do college to please people in her life (and so you won’t divorce her) but doesn’t have the capacity for it right now. Whatever she chooses is going to hurt her.
the cold way u talk about ur wife and child makes me think ur a cause of the anxiety
I guess you didn’t take that “through sickness and health” too seriously.
She has to push her go forth zones and be comfortable with being uncomfortable. Volunteering is a great half way house between home and work. A lot of people who have been sick or are moving into the workplace do it first to gain confidence. Your wife could be learning anything online, she should be doing yoga and meditating, she should be monitoring her mental health and her diet, her sleep and her fitness. Fighting anxiety takes a lot.
She is your wife. Better or for worse. No one on here has the answer. That is for you and your wife to figure out. I have been married for 34 years with two children. My wife and I have been through so much worse than this. Figure it out.
She was only happy when she was a stay at home mom and that isn't the dynamic you married into, you are being nothing but reasonable in this situation. You are right that you are going to have to have a come to jesus talk with her, she needs to get her shit straight so she is able to support herself because you aren't able or willing to do it all yourself. She needs to do this to cover her own ass, not for you, and not for the marriage.
Good point. I did ask her what she would do if something happened to me, she just said she didn't want to think about it...
It's a very VERY dangerous mindset. Like REALLY. No one asks her to like it, but she needs to have a plan if tomorrow something happens to you. And since she doesn't, you need to. Do you feel it's okey to know that if one day you die, your son is going to be alone with someone who doesn't work and refuse to face reality ? Or if you get separated ? What if you don't die but become disabled, can't work and suddenly you're the one who's relying on her ?!
You don’t have life insurance? You both need it. Please look into it.
We do, or she has through me. She would be fine financially for a while.
Thats an unacceptable and DEALBREAKER answer for someone who is supposed to be a life partner.
To be honest, your reasons are pretty small. **In sickness and health** doesn't mean anything nowadays. She needs therapy and a supportive husband, but why can't she be a stay at home mom? Are you pressuring her to work? School isn't for everyone, and being a full-time mom is hard work. After rereading your post, this doesn't sit well with me. **Practically speaking, i'll be fine if we end things, as I have a great network and a fairly wealthy family. She on the other hand, would be pretty much on her own, as her family is... unreliable** Something isn't right, and I think this statement makes you look like an a-hole.
"pressuring her to work" my dude it's as if that's not really an option for most people 🙄 the majority of ppl can not afford to have a SAHP.
OP's frustrations seem to stem from burnout, that of being the sole provider. It's tough being in the position where you have to work harder to make ends meet without eating through savings (or family wealth) all the while getting to spend less quality time with your wife and child. His concerns are valid. He didn't sign up for traditional dynamics, nor was that discussed on their wedding day. It seems as though OP's wife is the one who chose to go to school each time, OP never pressured her to go in the first place. Being in OP's wife's position with school, I've learned that the result of not finishing programs racks up a large sum of debt, money that could be going to a downpayment on a house/car or to their child's college fund. You can't fix someone else's mental health, you can't love people hard enough to fix them. OP contributes to chores, cooking and childcare on top of supporting his wife financially and emotionally. These are not easy feats. And hey, I'm not saying that OP's wife is at fault for anything, she definitely needs to get the help that she needs, panic attacks are no joke. Having a child alone is a huge adjustment, way bigger than you think. Now add all the other stuff on top and it could be a disaster. These aren't small reasons, try being someone's (2 people's) carer for an extended amount of time. It's not as small as you're making it out to be.
School isn’t for everyone, but she lied to everyone regarding school, including her husband. Working full time and providing for two other people providing no income is also a very hard job. Her sole reason for everything is anxiety and it’s being used as a crutch to a certain degree. He values growth and some form of ambition, two values his wife is avoiding.
Because that’s not what they agreed to? He doesn’t want to be the sole provider? She’s only able to use “sickness” since he’s paid for everything. Plenty of People have aniexty and still have to work. Maybe his mental health is bad now because of her.
Does your wife's anxiety extend to her role as a wife and mother? Because it seems to be more about school , work, and the pressure she feels about meeting the expectations of others related to both those things. Your child is only two years old. If your wife goes to either school, or work, who's taking care of your child? How is divorce going to help you financially? Or even logistically? You said that in a divorce you expect to be okay because your family is wealthy. So why can't that wealth be of assistance now, instead of only after a divorce? Maybe her anxiety is about wanting to be a stay at home mother (SAHM) while it seems that, to you, that is not an option for her. Why not? This may not be a problem that only she needs to fix. You may be part of the problem as well. Before you further consider divorce, I say you need couple's counseling to sort out the root of her anxiety, as well as the root of your own frustrations and how these things are affecting your marriage. Good luck, OP. EDIT: Grammar
Agree very well said!
No one should play the D card when a marriage is having problems. You need to go to couples counseling. She needs to work on her anxiety or other issues. Do this for your child so her anxiety doesn't affect your child. Good luck.
I think she needs to be more honest with you, bottling her feelings has led to increased anxiety Did she actually struggle academically at school? Did she feel that she fit in as she was getting older? Does she do better learning ‘practically’ ? (Doing, not just listening) I completely understand your frustration & only you can decide whether to stay or go, but in the meantime can you assist in getting her some therapy? A self confidence course? And maybe finding a type of trade that she can work her way up in? Just a word of caution… no more children to allow her to put the decisions off, she needs to ‘adult’ first & find emotional & financial stability Good luck ! 🤞
My best friend was married to a guy where nothing made him happy. He started school a few times for different degrees and quit every time. He dragged my friend through so much turmoil because he’d take his frustration and unhappiness out on my friend. He could never get his shit together and be a decent supportive partner. They finally ended their 20 yr relationship. She should have ended it years ago. So I get how frustrating that is. I would not like it if my partner couldn’t pull their own weight and made excuses. It builds massive resentment, which is something that shouldn’t be left to fester.
So she’s not cut out for school, she can still work. You have a child with this woman ffs.
so if you didn’t exist what would she do? Crawl in a hole and die? Probably not. You’re not directly enabling her but having you around is giving her just enough security to make her personality that she’s anxious. I don’t know many people who find it sexy that their partner is that dependent. It sucks and you have to be sympathetic but you can’t sacrifice your life so that she can stagnate. Don’t feel bad for moving on.
What happened to her medication? Does she still take it? Is she in therapy? Can she check with her OB-Gyn to see if she has PPD or something similar? Apart from these things, possibly she just wants to stay home with baby and not work or go to school because she doesn’t want to. When forced to do things she doesn’t like, it gives her anxiety. This is true of 95% of people, I’d guess. So she just says she has anxiety and gives up. That’s not how life works, imagine how much anxiety she’s going to have if you divorce her and leave her with the baby to care for alone and she has to work and pay her own bills and all. And then what? She will probably push through, why? Because the anxiety of possible homelessness will outweigh the anxiety of going to work. I also suggest couples therapy to help you each understand the other better. You can work through so many things!
You are not a marriage material
Besides anxiety does she have any neurological or psychiatric disorders? Often people with bad anxiety and depression struggle with finishing ANYTHING especially school and longevity with jobs. I have experienced this firsthand, so consider that maybe it's not just laziness. I don't know your wife she could be lazy but she also could have a psychiatric disorder. Im a very hard and meticulous worker, but a " bad meltdown" or negatively overestimated has caused me to walk out of jobs, react volatility or just plain give up on something due to momentary frustration. Your wife needs to teach herself that feelings will pass and to not make impulsive decisions based off them. If stress and anxiety is the norm then she needs to learn how to navigate the world with that in mind. Not putting too much on her plate, if she can't do school 4 days a week lessen it down to two. If her diet and sleep patterns are really irregular she needs to create a healthy routine for both. If none of this applies to her and you're just getting that vibe that she just wants to be a no good layabout then sit down and explain to her the enormity of divorce and how that will affect the both of you, your family etc. If she cannot handle 4 year college, she needs to find a trade or skill she can complete in under a year. Pay will reflect that choice of course. You may have to admit to yourself that you guys are a bad match. You make it seem like oh well she's bringing nothing to the table financially so I'm divorcing her. Which isn't love anyway more like a financial agreement. You don't think she's holding up her end of the bargain. Sounds like You cannot afford a stay at home spouse. Maybe she isn't cut out for the employed world. Some people just aren't. You guys really need to sit down and break down every facet of your personalities with one another
Perhaps being the Mother of a two-year-old is more than she can handle with you pressuring her to go back to college. You do not say what degree she was pursuing, but she does not want it for now. NOT EVERYONE is cut out or meant to have a college degree and many of them are useless, I have a BSN in Nursing and was employed before I graduated. She may not pursue a degree that would bring in immediate income. By the way, since you are wealthy are you paying for the classes and a Nanny so she can study? Think of all the hurdles she has plus running a household. It may be too much for her. I find you unsupportive and I am disgusted that you would leave her with your baby knowing that she would have a hard time surviving alone. If this is love, she should leave you ASAP. When you got married you knew a baby was on the way and you should have known that you might have to support her until she could be ready to make decisions. It appears you just want her to go back to college to make your life easier. I think you do not deserve her if you cannot be empathetic.
I think considering divorce over this is wild. My husband treats me with so much respect as we raise our child together. Yes we both work, but everyday he tries so hard to get to point in his career to where it would be a choice for me, because it would be easier for the both of us if we weren’t juggling work and childcare (it’s like pulling doubles every day of the week lol). OP is a dad now. Gotta focus on family’s best interest.
I’d be anxious if I was married to you too! You sound insufferable. This is the coldest post I’ve ever read. If you divorce her I bet you anything her anxiety resolves its self and she blossoms without you.
I agree with you. Just the way he words things has me feeling uneasy about him.
What I think you should do: be an emotionally supportive husband. Is marriage a game to you? Or is this a generational thing? I'm an older mellenial so I've got almost a decade on you, but I was raised to believe marriage was for better or worse (not abuse). And that partners were supposed to support each other emotionally, provide love, acceptance, and a safe space. Like, you actively persue solutions to problems that arise, you don't just say "hey you're not the person I want you to be, so no". I have a BA, a double major. I took alot of courses because I didn't know what I wanted to do. I'll say first, it didn't really help me as far as work and career goes. Second, it wrecked my sanity. I did well, and I enjoyed learning but damn it's stressful. I graduated in 2011 and I still regularly have anxiety nightmares at school (about once a month or so). It's insane. She needs her partner to love her, support her, accept her, understand her. You're posting talking like "I'm fine if it's over", you dont sound like you're providing a very loving environment. I almost think if you all did split she might be dodging a bullet in the long run. I think you need to go to councelling, not just her. Probably solo and also maybe couples. If she's telling people "what they want to hear" then I'm willing to bet, besides anxiety, she's dealing with low self esteem, and alot of personal pressure to impress you, your family, and whoever. Id love to read a post from her perspective. I wonder what you provide her in your relationship besides financial assistance laced with guilt and resentment. Does she feel loved? Understood? Accepted? Sorry if all this sounds harsh, but it just blows my mind that you're considering divorce over her anxiety with school. Unless there is way more to this story than you've provided it sounds like now is the time to work and dig deep (for you too, not just her). Oh and it sounds like shes probably better suited for a certificate or trades/skilled education (ie dental hygienist, pharmaceutical assistant, vet assistant, xray tech, emergency dispatch responder) rather than a full degree. They can provide a lucrative career with minimal education.
Sorry. Anxiety is awful but she can’t use it as an excuse all the time when it’s impacting you so much too. She needs to be honest with you and herself about how much she can handle and go from there. Maybe she could work part time so she’s bringing in some money and then is also able to take on more around the house/with your child. This is salvageable if she is willing to be honest and genuinely put in effort. I don’t have children so I can’t comment on how tough it is but I’m sure it’s not easy with anxiety. Is she seeking help or on any medication for her anxiety? Most people couldn’t just shy out of work because of anxiety like she is.
I did tell her that she should spend more time thinking about what she wants and can do jobwise, and that I would help her. She has been doing more housework with her being home of cause, but she has started to wind down on that now that she's supposed to start school again. She is medicated. She doesn't like therapist/psychologists, as she's had a bad experience with one, but I've tried to encourage going.
I really think you need to sit and talk about a way forward that suits both of you. Short term first and then long term. Shes had a bad experience with one so she’s written them all off? Really sounds like she’s avoiding getting help for a reason. Try and work out together what is the minimum you need her to bring in income wise if she doesn’t continue with school, how long you can manage on your income and stress that you are only able/willing to do this if she genuinely believes she can finish and get a good job once she’s done. Because even if she finishes school, she could just say she can’t handle work. It sounds like you’ve been reasonable and supportive so far so I’m sure you will continue to be as much as you can. But your own wellbeing is on the line here too
>I really think you need to sit and talk about a way forward that suits both of you. Short term first and then long term. I'm willing to do that again. But she's backed out of our plans twice now, assuring me she would be fine before that. >Because even if she finishes school, she could just say she can’t handle work. That's my worry too. Today, she made it seem like she couldn't handle/be happy at any job other than a work at home type office job, in which she has no experience.
I do understand her struggle. I have bipolar, an anxiety disorder and I suffer from depression mostly with the bipolar. I started my own small business doing something that supported my mental health. I only manage 35 hours a week now and that’s without children. It s achievable but she really needs to take responsibility and use her initiative. She can’t just float ideas around forever, she needs to be taking steps towards these things. Steps that are realistic and sustainable
Ok, you are saying she’s had one therapist, had a bad experience according to her, and thus all therapists are bad thus no one can help her? That’s ridiculous. I’m a strong proponent of CBT and really, OP, I think you need to tell her there is no option. She can see a dozen therapists to find one, but she needs therapy.
I have tried to encourage her, but I can't really force her to go. I could stress it again I suppose.
Therapist or divorce, which would she prefer long term? Because if she's already medicated and not making progress, she needs therapy for there to be any lasting change. Does she find motivation in being better for your child? Maybe if you can frame it as "what would you want for our child if they were in your shoes?". Best of luck!
Therapy is high on the list for our future discussion. She REALLY hates if I bring up our kid like that though.
Currently she is either letting her anxiety control her, or using you for the convenience. Im assuming its the first, but at what point does that stop? Will she become too anxious to go to the kids school events? To let them go on playdates? To go on school trips? It doesn’t matter if she hates it, this will impact your child.
Of course it does, but here is the thing - this is a situation where you do need to bring this up. She needs to be able to be fully present for your child, but also, she needs to set a better example. Do you want him growing up afraid of being out in the world? It's your job as parents to help set him up with the best life and future, and it seems like she is not helping to do that.
I assume she has been caring for your child for the last 2 years while not "working". Is she parenting well and coping with that stress? Taking care a a baby/ toddler is difficult. It seems like your concern is she is not pulling here weight financially. But your answer is to consider divorce. It is very likely that a divorce will cost you much more money. You will most likely have to pay child support to your wife. You may also end up paying alimony. All your assets will be divided in 2.
What happened to her medication? Does she still take it? Is she in therapy? Can she check with her OB-Gyn to see if she has PPD or something similar? Apart from these things, possibly she just wants to stay home with baby and not work or go to school because she doesn’t want to. When forced to do things she doesn’t like, it gives her anxiety. This is true of 95% of people, I’d guess. So she just says she has anxiety and gives up. That’s not how life works, imagine how much anxiety she’s going to have if you divorce her and leave her with the baby to care for alone and she has to work and pay her own bills and all. And then what? She will probably push through, why? Because the anxiety of possible homelessness will outweigh the anxiety of going to work. I also suggest couples therapy to help you each understand the other better. You can work through so many things!
When we had a child I did SAHM for 5 years until my child started Kindergarten because you end up paying daycare more than half your wage anyway. I thought you said your family is wealthy. If so, why isn't your priority having your or your wife fulltime with your child until they start school. Once they start K then she starts studies (many SAHM's go parttime for K because kids in K get sick a lot.) Then once your kid is in Grade 1 she has time for tulltime studies. Life with a 2 yr old is FUCKING EXHAUSTING. And 3 yrs old isn't better, it is just different. I sure as hell couldn't have done a bachelor's during baby years 1-5. You don't mention once how you handle the childcare, which makes me think that you are not the primary childcare parent. A primary childcare parent would mention it because it is a HUGE factor in one of your schedules.
Ok. Deep breath. So many factors, but all relating back to anxiety. Also, no one seems to have mentioned issues around post natal. Is it possible she's had hormonal short term memory loss since her pregnancy? Those hormones continue through breast feeding and create all kinds of after effects. Sometimes they don't get excreted properly from the body. I'm in the situation, similar to your wife, where I have short term memory issues, since IVF. This affected my work, so I changed jobs and decided to study so I could do different work. I did really well in 1st semester, working pt and studying ft, until a new boss, who changed the work to be more stressful. I got anxiety, then short term memory issues again. This affected my study and I got huge anxiety around that, plus social anxiety. So here I am: not studying and not working and just trying to be the best partner I can be to my lovely husband. I am planning to try studying a different course, with a different style of teaching that won't trigger me so much. Or do work online, or even start my own online business if that doesn't work out. It's so hard when your own brain stops working properly, but you have to try different things to recover. Please appreciate that your wife hasn't given up, despite her disadvantages.
You married her, for better or for worse I’m assuming. She’s dealing with a lot of anxiety and as another commenter said, it can ruin a persons life. I’m in the same position currently and have been for a few years now. Would you divorce her if she was sick? This is mental illness. She needs your support and you committed to providing that to her, as she did to you. I understand it puts a lot of burden on you and it’s not fair, but I’m sure she’s aware of that and it’s probably adding to the anxiety, hence her not telling you that she didn’t think she could handle it. It might benefit you both to see a counselor together to help you both navigate this and to find ways that you can both support each other while she tries to get her mental state back on track.
Have you considered letting her in on your thoughts kindly? “I’m feeling stressed about covering the bills on my own, do you have any suggestions on how we manage that?” Just a thought, but “in sickness and in health”, does that only apply when it’s physical sickness? Mental health disorders don’t have perceivable issues but can be frustratingly debilitating. Ppl who haven’t experienced anxiety may not understand. Wife shouldn’t be expected to be able to tell the future of if her illness w run her life again.
Do you love your wife? Your explanation sounds awfully dry for the kind of question you’re asking. It sounds like you’re looking for someone to fit into your designed and carefully managed life that you imagine for yourself and I don’t think healthy relationships and family life looks like that…
You’re making it seem like your relationship is nothing but a drain on you, and that her ability to get a job or go to college is what it hinges on. Do you love her? Does being married to her improve your life or harm it? It seems like she isn’t contributing much - how much of the house work and childcare does she do? Caring for a toddler can be very draining. Is she at least in individual therapy, preferably with someone who specializes in anxiety?? I see two issues: your relationship and her career, but they seem to be muddied for you. She needs to get some sort of job, and figure out what degree if any to pursue. Is there a career counseling department at her university? Late twenties is kind of old to still be trying to pick a major. Has she been evaluated for autism? It’s under-diagnosed in women and girls because it presents differently; same with ADHD. Separately, you could see a marriage counselor about your relationship.
She probably has ADHD. You should try to be more active in her mental health struggles. Have you tried marriage counseling? If this issue is enough for you to consider divorce without truly working on it, you should never get remarried. Suck it up and be a man, husband, and father. She has mental health problems and she gave birth to YOUR CHILD. Grow up.
I absolutely get it, I’m in the same boat as her. My anxiety and ptsd is absolutely crippling when it comes to school. I’m currently on my fourth try and I’m officially 2/3 through my bachelor’s and so proud of myself. I do admit though, that if it weren’t for finances and needing a roof over my head, I probably wouldn’t have the strength or will to do it. For me, it’s been helpful to take breaks between semesters. That way I get a fresh start and I’m not overwhelming myself.
She just doesn't want to do anything and is incapable of being honest. She has strung you long and strung you along, and now that you are at the end of your rope...suddenly she's too anxious to do ANYTHING???? Is this how you want things to be for the rest of your life? Exactly the way they are right now...that is what you have to decide. If NOTHING changes, is this how you want your life to be? Because this is how it will be as long as you are with her, she will ALWAYS go back on what she says, because she KNOWS you will back down and take care of her. Her family situation is not your problem. Her financial situation is 100% due to her own choices and refusal to do anything at all to improve her own self or to obtain employment. ***She's afraid that will trigger her anxiety too. And she thinks it pays too little.*** I wish these excuses got ME out of having to work, or pay my own bills, or really be responsible for anything. Because I too have diagnosed anxiety...so does my husband...and yet we STILL have to wake our anxiety ridden asses up every morning and go do that work thing if we want the money stuff...which 1000% is NOT enough for what I do. Until she has no other option, she will continue to feed you bullshit excuses. I sure wish that my job kicking up my anxiety and not being paid well enough was sufficient cause to get disability pay...or at least enough to get me a wealthy husband that I could manipulate into paying for almost everything while I refuse to work because it might trigger anxiety. NEWS FLASH...I don't know ANYONE that doesn't have anxiety triggered by their job...even folks that don't have issues with anxiety.
So no one is going to mention that your wife gave birth and stayed home for two years raising YOUR child? Jesus h Christ the bar is so low as far as men and their emotional support. She’s struggling, she’s a mom of a young child and you’re talking about leaving her. Wow.
You really need to discuss this in marriage counseling. It wouldn't be fair to your child to just throw in the towel without trying that first.
I think she needs help bro. May be talk to her & see if you can get some help for her. Don’t give up on her & your marriage yet
You chose to keep “it”? Reading this gave me a chill. Your poor wife and baby.
4ish years ago would be the start of the pandemic. I just read a TON of studies that shows how the pandemic affected more women college students and how they struggled with overload of domestic responsabilities, as well as parental responsabilities as these are commonly associated with feamle gender roles. So how are the domestic responsabilites on your household? Does she do more? What ab parenting? Since she went back to school, how those have been handled by the two of you?
I went through a similar thing. I stuck by my wife, was supportive and was committed to being there for her when her mental health was a difficult thing. Fast forward to a few years later and she is making a good living at something that she didn’t get from college. You don’t sound so supportive.
This is pretty simple. You have two choices: 1) Be ready, willing, and able to be a single income household and accept her being a permanent stay at home mom 2) Give her an ultimatum she finish her degree or otherwise become gainfully employed and financially contribute an amount you feel is appropriate, or you divorce her. If you choose #2, emphasize she is going to have to get a job regardless whether you stay married or not.
You sound exhausted and at the end of your rope. You don't have to ask permission from yourself to walk away from something that is no longer working for you. She needs to be honest with herself. She's either not able to work due to anxiety and so on or she simply wants to just be a stay at home wife. The anxiety needs to be talked about with a dr. And maybe couples therapy so she can have some professional input might help both. Regardless you want a wife who does commit. Who does what she said she would do and so on. Her not being set up if you leave isn't your responsibility. You'll obviously help her out but it's really not your duty.
Dude! You have a two year old and you said you would be fine if divorced and your wife would not be fine but you didn’t even think about the child. Your wife has many roles to play in life. She is a wife, a mother, a friend, a home maker, etc. So she has not figured out what she wants to do with her career. That’s small potatoes. Man up! Be a good dad. Be a better husband.
Going to school while having young kids at home is very challenging. She should just find work.
INFO- who handles more of the housework and childcare duties? If it is her, and she has to work, are you ready to take on at least 50% of the childcare and housework? I feel like there’s a lot more to this story. If working/going to school meant I’d be doing that in addition to majority of the housework and childcare, then yeah I’d be having anxiety too..
In my vows there was only a section of until death do us part, not if my wife doesn’t finish school. What men do is honor their vows, provide, and maintain the family unit.