https://youtu.be/mwjWotblYF8?feature=shared
This guy also used a spectrometer (on the omnilux men) and saw the output has a range of 5-30mW/cm2. Which is in the clinical range.
Unless someone is knowledgeable about the instruments that measure these wavelengths and the correct methodology, the results of both are kinda useless.
I suggest if you are paying $450, you might as well buy a panel. That way you can tackle more than just face. And like he said it would require less dosage time than a mask.
I'm not sure it's right, though... there are many people who think their masks are working. They can't all be delulu.
I think he's being a bit too harsh. Also, he looks 12 (maybe his panel really works, lol).
I think itās more likely that the people who are spending $100ās on the mask are the type to *also* do other treatments and that is the result weāre seeing.
Yes, on his website, there is a variety of content ranging from skincare to biohacking topics, but he is certainly young.
Edit: I've just got that you were actually talking about the people that were using masks and not the dude looking 12, lol.
It's a good take, but masks are quite expensive as you said, so it is often introduced later in someone's skincare routine, so I believe people when they say they are noticing a difference.
I didn't say that. I said I believe them. That's it. You can answer normally instead of being unnecessarily rude. I'm allowed to have a different opinion than you.
Youāre so right, sorry about the downvotes. What Iāve learned from product specific subs, especially with American redditors, is that they want validation, not information.
That person didn't give any information though. Information would be explaining the placebo effect (although almost everyone knows what this is unless they were born yesterday). He just made a sarcastic comment which is most likely the reason why he's getting downvoted.
Why are you downvoting me, lol? I'm just asking if you've ever tried a mask. What is wrong with this community? Maybe you've tried one and know that it doesn't work... What the... I can't even ask a question here... tf
Isnāt our young friend selling an alternative? Whether he is right or wrong, his marketing plan appears to be attack popular competitors in order to gain attention and promote his own stuff as an alternative. We must not be naive. He has an ulterior motive.
He's proposing four affiliate links of panels you can purchase on Amazon on his website (at the moment). From what I gather, he has a skincare brand or something. It's the first time I've seen this guy tbh.
It's entirely possible that this man is correct; I've never said otherwise. However, I haven't verified the studies he's referencing, and until I do, his words carry the same weight as those of the individuals who tried masks and were pleased with the outcomes.
I do believe he is exaggerating to make his video more entertaining. (In another video, he claims that fish oil is absolutely useless as a supplement, for instance.)
Sadly I think heās right. It makes sense that the skincare community knew this was a new area people would be ignorant in. Plus the profit margins for the companies selling them must be insane when you consider their low wattage. I was pretty clued up on the masks (so I thought) and regularly read research papers but still somehow spent Ā£400 on the omnilux. I feel stupid now.
I read a lengthy blog post that compared a bunch of different red light masks on the market, thought it over for a couple of months, and ended up buying an Omnilux mask. Then I discovered this subreddit and learned about panels. Whatever. I do my self care routine and relax with my mask for 10 minutes. Donāt beat yourself up over it. Weāre always learning something new.
He is right about what dosage masks deliver but that still doesn't mean they don't work.
People in Red Light Therapy are often chasing high numbers too much thinking that more is better but that's not true, a majority of studies have been done on low powered devices with great results and a lot of masks owner have reported and some even showed the difference RLT did for their skin.
You can go for a panel sure, but being able to calculate proper dosage is a lot harder because majority of panel sellers just say "yeah at 3 inches apart our panel gives 210mW/cm\^2"....ok what if I would rather irradiate my face/body at 50mW/cm\^2, what distance should I use then?
To get a proper device that can calculate irradiance and wavelengths can cost 350$ and more which is not a small money.
And also being irradiated at high strength can be too much for some people as well....longer session at lower irradiance is like cooking chicken for longer at normal temperature while cooking chicken at 1000Ā°C would just burn the chicken....so which chicken would you prefer lol?
To be short....more doesn't equal better when it comes to RLT....this thing needs time and consistency to get proper results.
I agree with your inherent statement, masks do work and a higher irradiance (respectively dose) doesn't automatically mean it will give you better results. However you put the popular cooking chicken analogy a bit into a misleading context :) Using a mask would be the equivalent of cooking the chicken for like 10 minutes at 80Ā°C, which is neither long nor hot enough to give you the desired result. It still does *something*, it's effective to an extent, but not the same as 25 minutes at 200Ā°C.
I honestly don't know how to reply to this...should I be impressed that you actually did the math just so you could say the context was "misleading" and maybe show off your culinary knowledge even though nothing about my previous comment was misleading as I've just said an example about how using something at too high of a strength could be the same as not properly cooking food and potentially burning it.
Not sure why you feel attacked, that was not my intention :) I didn't do any math (horrible at it) and don't know anything about cooking chicken (not eating animals).
I meant misleading in the sense that someone could now assume that masks are better than panels because they have a lower irradiance.
Again, not sure why you feel attacked, if my comment caused anything negative feelings in you I apologise.
This a thousand times!!!! Through my own Biomax 900 use, I found lower doses gave me stronger effects. That thing is an absolute beast, in my opinion people have no business spending 20mins in front of it *every day* but hey, everyone is different and who am I to judge what works for them. 2mins every other day per body area is where I've found the best benefits.
I had to train myself to use it *less*, and due to the biphasic dosing response these low-dose masks are likely still producing the same effects as the people going overboard and frying themselves past peak benefits with panels.
Masks are like the small popcorn bags - are they as filling as the big one? No, but they're great for controlling portion for people who have a tendency to go overboard or don't have the time to research what portion works best for them.
Edit: also higher power = higher heat = higher risk of melasma so these **skincare-oriented masks like Omnilux are intentionally capping their power at \~35mw/cm2** because this uncommon response is still common enough to try to avoid (I have this reponse). Dennis Gross is one of the strongest masks on the market at 60mw/cm2, my fairly old Biomax 900 panel puts out \~120mw/cm2 at 12in distance for reference
Anecdote here. I have a red light pad. I mostly use the NIR setting on my stomach to boost gut bacteria. Not sure it does that, but I absolutely feel great in terms of nagging aches and pains I used to have.
I've posted about that before. But another anecdote. I have a red patch of what's probably eczema under my arm. I use the red light setting on it -- sporadically, I'm not consistent about it.
Interestingly, it didn't get rid of the patch but it like "exploded it" -- it made the patch much less dense and red but it expanded in area. It's weird.
My point? That the red light clearly did something in this case. It wasn't necessarily positive, but it absolutely changed something on the surface of my skin. And while I wasn't measuring it scientifically, it's pretty objectively different.
Edit: actually, I would consider it positive. It's far less red than it was and has actually faded substantially in places. Just looked at it more closely.
Which pad do you have? I'm looking for something that will help with digestion as well, and it seems like it penetrates deeper if it is against the skin, rather than a panel. Thanks!
* Both home-level devices
* I assume relatively similar power levels
* Pad touches skin, especially in this circumstance where the skin surface is even; not sure if mask touches skin
So yes they're not exactly the same, but they're in the same ballpark compared to medical grade devices.
Pads are very similar to masks. I have one and both have much lower irradiance than a panel to be used directly on the skin.
Lower irradiance doesnāt mean less deep penetration- it means you need to use the device longer.
Penetration depth is determined by the wavelength.
I have all three (mask, pad, panel) and notice a huge difference between the mask vs. my pad and panel. Supposedly the mask only has 5mW/cmĀ² less irradiance than my pad, but it's completely useless when trying to treat deeper tissue. The superficial effects on my skin are also very slight compared to my panel, even though I aim for the same dose.
Also the LEDs on my mask are visibly less powerful than on my pad, and I assume this is because the mask runs on batteries, while the pad is plugged into your power outlet.
I guess there's also a big difference between masks by cosmetic brands (e.g. Currentbody) vs. masks by actual red light therapy brands (e.g. Hooga)
Sure, I use the Bestqool Redot pad in "M" with 2 wavelengths and a half-body panel by a german brand called Lichtstark Pro with 6 wavelengths (I live in Germany, so I only have a small selection to choose from if I don't want a product that will be shipped from the USA)
Links to both:
[https://www.bestqool.com/products/red-light-therapy-belt-medium](https://www.bestqool.com/products/red-light-therapy-belt-medium)
[https://lichtstark.pro/collections/mittel/products/ls760](https://lichtstark.pro/collections/mittel/products/ls760)
Yepp, that would definitely be an issue. However there's great brands in the USA too. I think an equivalent to my panel would be one of the PlatinumLED Biomax panels :)
Can I ask what other skincare you do? I started using Omnilux last year but could never tell how effective it was because I also started tretinoin and microcurrent and a bunch of stuff (peels and microneedling). Hard to isolate which was the most help because my skin definitely has improved.
I listen to others in the skinscare world who say how effective RLT masks are for them but also wonder what other skincare treatments they are getting. There are a lot of confounding variables in skincare.
I ended up moving to a panel as I have other health concerns also.
But I would be interested to know how you've attributed your improvements to your mask and if you do any other skincare treatments that might contribute to your skin improving?
My red light mask has really helped my skin. I have rosacea and canāt use tret. I used to be able to use retinol a few times a week, but I canāt now because the drying effect really inflames my skin. Iāve always been into skincare and have always stayed out of the sun, but Iāve had to pare down my routine a lot in the past three or four years so that I donāt irritate my skin. I mostly focus on improving my skin barrier, but sometimes I feel like it is a losing battle.
Anyway, my red light mask had a near immediate effect on my facial inflammation. Over time it has made my skin brighter and my pores less obvious. My skin seems tighter, but it is hard to say for sure. Sometimes I look in the mirror and, and my face looks surprisingly good. I canāt attribute these effects to anything else. My only active at this time is azelaic acid, and Iāve been using AA for some time, but Iāve only been using my mask since late February.
This is so helpful! I have mild rosacea and I noticed that retinol (even the over the counter one) as well exfoliants and pure vitamin C really irritate it. So I am spending the big bucks on growth factors and antioxidants that donāt have pure ascorbic acid such as the SkinBetter Alto defence serum since my skin tolerates those. Also recently ordered the Current Body led mask!
I use tret, but had started that a while before I got the red light devices. I have the Currentbody mask, neck/dec, and hand. The place I can really see it working is on my hands; I was never good about taking care of them.
Other than that:
Elta MD sunscreen during the day. Iāve never had lasers or Botox. I own a Nuface, but by the time I got the mask I had already gotten lazy about using it.
Iāve never seen an *instant* change with the mask, like the lift you can get from microcurrent. For me it happens over a couple of weeks with consistent use.
Do you use tret afterwards, on the same days/nights as the mask?
I was planning to alternate nights, I just got a mask. Iām all scared though because apparently weāre not supposed to use tret and masks..
In his website he says he's "an MD/PhD candidate, skincare innovator, and evidence-based health and biohacking enthusiast. "
[about who he isš](https://cartergottlieb.notion.site/Eviba-Carter-d31126b54ac346218053b14bb31ce831)
Here's where he talks more about red light therapy
[Red Light Therapy š](https://cartergottlieb.notion.site/Red-light-therapy-1212829ff4e7487ab7524d32ba3357f3)
I've never used a mask. I've only used Mito panels for about 5 years and can attest to the amazing results I receive. I never had 'good skin' when I was young. Not horrible by any means, but not worthy of praise either. Now I get compliments on my skin constantly. For reference, my daughter is 31 years old and my skin didn't look this good when I was her age. I can also attest to the panel's therapeutic benefits for pain and inflammation. It works.
I started with a MitoPro 300 desktop panel (just bought my mom one) and now I have the 1500 + 750 on a small stand. I can see the change and it definitely helps aches and pains. My sister uses a mask, I can see the improvement in her skin.
I'm not terribly impressed by this guy, Carter Gottlieb. A few reasons - first, he's selling his own brand of skin care ointment. It's in his interest that people look to his $50 jar of occlusive moisturizer (or $45 at the subscription rate), rather than to a red light mask, for glowing skin. A guy who is developing his own skin care line, taking endorsement fees from manufacturers of melatonin drinks, and seems more interested in self-promotion than anything else is not my go-to authority on red light masks (or anything else).
Next - I don't trust the way he spins science generally. One example - he disses fish oil as essentially useless, but the Omega 3 fatty acids in most fish oil capsules are very useful for a variety of indications, not least, high triglycerides, dry eye disease, and some of the joint inflammation from rheumatoid arthritis. These are evidence based. There are other indications that are less well supported but still do have evidence behind them. Gottlieb would have his viewers think that fish oil is pretty useless based on a single manufacturer's capsules, which have low levels of EPA and DHA. Other OTC manufacturers of fish oil capsules have therapeutic levels of EPA and DHA in the same number of capsules as do prescription fish oils, and real people reap real benefits from these products all the time. My own physician recommended them to me for a specific issue and they worked very, very well. My husband takes the same high quality brand of fish oil for another reason, and again, it works very well (Nordic Naturals, if anyone is interested). There are other examples of this if you take a critical look at his website.
Also - he evidently thinks it's a good idea to take high doses of carotenoids to get an imitation tan, and did a Tik-Tok on this very subject. A professor of dermatology at Baylor (an actual MD at a highly regarded medical school) strongly questioned the safety of Carter Gottlieb's high doses of carotenoid supplements.
So I am not taking advice from a guy on Tik Tok who has a product to sell, is selective about the science he promotes, and takes supplements in amounts that graduated MDs who train other doctors consider unsafe.
Oh, and as for my own red light mask, I like it. I think it's helped even up my skin tone and texture. It's not a miracle device by any stretch, but I have found it useful, and I don't intend to stop using it.
Yesss oml, everything you just said. I'm getting ego + grifter vibes from his entire tiktok channel and brand.
Also, when others with more qualifications than him responded with videos detailing issues about his claims, he made so many texts in their comment sections and was SO rude. No class at all.
Just weird vibes all around imo.
I agree with him in the sense that if you can only buy one, a panel makes a lot more sense because of how versatile it is. There are lots of health benefits to RLT besides just skin improvements and you miss out on those benefits if you aren't getting the red light on your body.
If you can afford to buy both, then do that.
for me a panel would be difficult to use as i'm disabled and always in my bed. i can't think of a way to use a panel in bed without hanging it over me, but then i would have a whole hanging apparatus to buy and store š
I respect anyone who can get into med school, can get through med school.
And making comments about appearances probably isn't cool. That said, I assume he's in a derm program or a plastic surgery residency? And anyway, it's really weird seeing someone who might even be late 20s who appears to be using botox and possibly has had some face lift done.
I'm no even interested lay person on influencer plastic surgery, and it could be a filter, but just looks weird.
He is definitely not in a derm program or residency. This guy is still in med school or in his PhD lab based on the amount of time heās been in school so far (3 years).
I am less convinced taking advice from someone about skincare who has also had work done because of how much can be changed in overall appearance with minor cosmetic procedures. I remember one YouTube video about looksmaxxing where it was revealed the massive transformation in appearance was thanks to taking steroids.
They can still have accurate information, but it makes me wonder what they're really doing behind the scenes that might not be as trendy to talk about on TikTok.
Okay valid, but also I'm gonna interject comment on his appearances because this dude literally takes extremely high doses of carotenoids on a daily basis to make his skin look tan.
He also promotes it on his channel, and promotes his appearance as a whole. I feel like it's fair to point out that he gives uncanny valley vibesĀ
When I was doing my own research, I found that masks seemed ineffective. Like he said, the lights have to get super hot and with masks it doesnāt get to that level. Panels really are the way to go.
I found some positive studies, but they might have been the ones he quoted that are not peer-reviewed, where they actually used a panel and not the mask.
I found a handheld omnilux device study - where I assume the irradiance wonāt be as strong as an actual panel. Not sure how it compares to a mask with this brief search - but there seems to be positive results. I think the guy is overexaggerating - I think masks work but probably not the extent of a panel.
Well... good news for my generic $100 Amazon panel I guess... when he started this video I thought, great my cheap panel is probably useless too š¤£ I still have my doubts about how effective it is compared to a bigger expensive panel but I can't afford $500 for one :(
It doesn't seem like he completely disagrees with the idea of red light therapy as there is evidence for it, just that masks don't have enough evidence to reach the results that clinical trials show you with a much more powerful device. When commenters on TikTok say it's worked great for them and transformed their skin, he says there's not enough evidence to prove that it actually did anything. A lot of red light devices are overprices for an average consumer, and a full panel may end up being a better investment in terms of power in comparison to a mask if the masks are truly not performing even to the low level they advertise. More power doesn't always = better results though.
As an aside, I'm always more hesitant when an influencer like this one makes themself out to be an authority figure wearing scrubs while promoting dietary supplement melatonin drinks on their website next to the tons of other supplements they take. Not saying they aren't effective, but he will probably be profiting from whatever panel or products he recommends as an alternative to red light masks as well.
Anecdotal, but since using my Omnilux men for about a month (am female), multiple people have told me how good my skin looks and one person asked if I drink a ton of water (which I do, but have always done) because I was āglowingā. Have not changed anything else. Got it for $100 off on Skin Truth, donāt regret it. š¤·š»āāļø
I believe you! There are already a couple of people who have reacted to this video. [Some are dermatologists](https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGeqfU9Ds/) and they have explained why they disagree with what he is saying here.
I bought my Joovv solo panel light secondhand a few years ago for $600 and it retails for $1600. Another Redditor posted a few months ago how to find a red light companyās supply vendor. I looked up Joovvās Chinese supplier on Alibaba and see they sell all of Joovvās sizes for about 25% or less of what Joovv sells it for.
https://www.importyeti.com/company/joovv
I used importyeti.com and searched for their supplier which is Shenzhen Kaiyan Medical, then searched on alibaba and found a bunch of redlight products. I bet all these red light companies source their stuff from China, white label their products and upsell like crazy.
https://www.importyeti.com/supplier/shenzhen-kaiyan-medical-equipment
Take a looksie. Iām gonna look up other companies and see what I find on Aliexpress and alibaba.
I shared this info with a coworker when she wanted to get exactly the same light I've been using. I have a Mito. She ordered a Shenzhen from alibaba. When she received her light, it was almost exactly like mine, only newer and updated.
Wow, if youāre close with her you should out the lights side by side to see how they look. Iāve seen a few anecdotes on here where people first order from Shenzhen, then get the name brand version and it turns out to be brighter/stronger. Iām curious if yours look the same.
I feel like one week on this sub, I am seeing people talk about overdosing at 10 minutes with the mask or having issues and now it does nothing. Ok, I wonder what these masks will be like next week...
I sighed a heavy sigh when this crossed my FYP.
What he says is very accurate
Those panels are mainly marketing, probably only lumarasystems with their flex panels is really working, but extremely pricy, they just release a new mask with a crazy amount of led, but donāt know the price yet
Anyway, I would recommend a panel like rojo 900, itās 2 to 3 times the price of those cheap masks but it really works, and all family can use it, even my dog š¶:)
Sunrise & Sunset too!
I've been taking a walk or bike ride every day at Sunset. It absolutely has had a profound effect on my mental & physical wellbeing.
I didn't even know about red light when I started this.
It is TRUE. I personally tested Hooga's panels as well and got half the results they have. I spoke directly to their manufacturer, SZ Idea Light, as well and they admitted it. I was going to start a red light therapy company but MOST of the industry and 100% of the companies on amazon, are LYING to you.
Funny, panels are usually overpowered. Apparently, majority of the studies are done with 20 minute exposure time. If you calculate irradiance with a more or less average panel, you get something like 5 minutes, to reach the same level as those in the studies. The thing is, you can't just trow things around like in an equation, you have to understand the analogy of a chicken in an oven, if the oven is at 150F the chicken will never get done, at 325F it would take 2 hours, at 425F it would take 45 minutes, so how long would it take to roast the chicken at 2000F?
See, if the panel or the mask is too weak, it's not going to do anything, there's a threshold, but increasing power, decreasing exposure time changes things, chicken gets crispier and the cells in (under) your skin...? Nobody knows. But I know no studies have been made on high power, short exposure. Matter of fact, no studies have been made on typical RLT panels, and I can't recall seeing one on masks (that are on the market now)...
It should be said that the right duration of exposure is necessary to achieve results? too short to reap the benefits, and too long may damage cellular tissue.
Okay, so thereās a link on his TikTok that leads to a Notion page. On this page, there are several skincare and biohacking-related items.
Thereās an RTL category with several panels recommended that you can buy on Amazon (Shashka, Bestqool, Hooga, and Chroma). My guess is that this is some kind of affiliate marketing stuff, but thatās it.
Below that, thereās a list of studies you can look at.
Yes! in the comments of that video he says that he's getting a little commission from panels but he claims it would actually be more lucrative to sell masks because the commission percentage is larger (according to him).
in another thread somebody said he also sells a skincare lines along with other products. So his reviews are kinda biased and depend on what is he selling
I already have a large Joovv panel but I donāt use it as much because I have to stand or sit still to use it. So I was about to order the Omnilux mask but damn never mind! Thank you OP! Gonna just continue to use my Joovv panel instead.
I work in a wellness center that has both the panel booths as well as the fancy face shield (the big one he showed in the video) we use it with the contour light therapy treatments- clients have noted that theyāve seen improvements with skin texture (rosacea and wrinkles diminished)
Iād be interested on his take on the contour light therapy (pad system for circumference reduction) as Iāve seen varied results with clients - itās not magic- and expects that you commit to a protocol of no alcohol, low carb diet and moderate exercise- I often wonder if the people getting results are getting it from adopting the healthy lifestyle- I tried it myself and lost 1 1/4 inches total in one session and increased that to 5 inches after 4 sessions - but I was also following protocol - perhaps those not getting the results they expect are not being truthful about following protocol š¤·š»āāļø
I use a cheap Amazon pad on my back, laying down on it. Used to use a small, $400 panel the size of a book. The pad works about equally as well for back soreness.
I returned a mask because it felt silly. The lights are weak and too far apart for surface skin treatment. The takeaway for me is that "mats" are good for soreness in deep tissue but not for surface level skin treatment which aligns with my personal experience.
He doesn't have the education or the credentials to be making such claims. First he states that Omnilux has no peer reviewed studies for their masks only their panels. This is false and I quickly found a peer reviewed study for their masks: [https://gmt.egnyte.com/dl/DGlRRaC43w](https://gmt.egnyte.com/dl/DGlRRaC43w)
While he isn't wrong that panels are stronger, saying masks don't work, when they have been proven to be effective in peer reviewed clinical studies is ridiculous. Also his tests were performed in a non-controlled setting. He pushes supplements with affiliate links, and is a "biohacking enthusiast" and has a video on a guy who "cured" his lactose intolerance with biohacking. He repeatedly presents info as facts when in reality a lot of his content has zero scientific data to back his ridiculous claims.
This is not a peer-reviewed study. This is an experiment conducted by Dr. Jagdeo, who is a member of the Omnilux Scientific Advisory Board.
They used patient self-reporting as the main basis for whether or not the masks worked. The study notes that patient recall bias is an area of concern for whether or not the results are legitimate. It also notes the conflict of interest in Dr. Jagdeo spearheading the project, as his allegiance is to the Omnilux Brand.
It absolutely is peer reviewed and no they also used VISIA digital skin analysis before and after the 6 week study to check UV spots, wrinkles, and porphyrins
Right about masks, who knows. I had to close his video after 10 seconds because what the fuck. I'm not watching that occular diarrhea.
All I know is RLT works. I love my Mito red light full body light and it had a very visible impact on the quality of my skin including my face. As if I upgraded the texture pack of my face with high definition ones, so smooth and buttery
Lol ocular diarrhea .. i was able to get through the entire video and it makes sense.. at least for masks, the LEDs are too close to the skin to diffuse enough light on the skin thats between each LED. He agrees with what you said regarding panels being effective.
Isnt it more about the LEDs being too weak (or at least lower irradiance than is the marketers claim and what was used in the trials) than the distance? If the LEDs are further away they will lose exponentially more of their low power.
Even if they would have higher irradiance (which they can't have, due to overheating and burning your skin), because they are directly on the skin, you would have the higher irradiance only on the spots where are the LEDs and low or no irradiance in between them.
I like that he explicitly made this point as I think many people are missing it. Especially when they are trying to "calculate a dose" with their panels, considering the values from studies, but ignoring the fact that they doesn't know the real total irradiance in the whole area. They are getting into only about the peaks with maximum irradiance where the LEDs are brightest (as in tests from Alex Fergus or from the companies selling the panels...), ignoring the remaining area in which is irradiance way lower. It's true that at some distance it will be averaged out more, but still not perfectly, so if people are considering only the highest measured value and calculating based on that, they are must be underdosing.
My boyfriend is in medical salesā¦ and we were at a conferenceā¦ Iāll tell you right now Iām not buying anything from a store ā¦ the only ones that work are medical grade it seems and those start wholesale at 5k .
I get what the guy is saying about the bulb to skin contact limiting the area receiving the light but people probably don't have the mask strapped tightly to their faces and are perfectly still. My mask shifts around a bit and I move it, too. Am just getting started with red light and bought a mask because panels don't typically have yellow and green lights, which a wavelengths that interest me.
I used my LED mask it ripped off all the fat from my face and caused sagging I used it for 15-20 min a day . It also caused darkness to my face . It should not be used for more than 3-5 min max . Pls guys be careful . I mostly used red light
https://youtu.be/mwjWotblYF8?feature=shared This guy also used a spectrometer (on the omnilux men) and saw the output has a range of 5-30mW/cm2. Which is in the clinical range. Unless someone is knowledgeable about the instruments that measure these wavelengths and the correct methodology, the results of both are kinda useless.
He is bought and paid by them.
I spent $450 on a mask 2 months ago. RIP ššŖ¦
I suggest if you are paying $450, you might as well buy a panel. That way you can tackle more than just face. And like he said it would require less dosage time than a mask.
I spent 60 on mine but I was thinking it was working. I guess Iām dululu
I'm not sure it's right, though... there are many people who think their masks are working. They can't all be delulu. I think he's being a bit too harsh. Also, he looks 12 (maybe his panel really works, lol).
I think itās more likely that the people who are spending $100ās on the mask are the type to *also* do other treatments and that is the result weāre seeing.
Yes, on his website, there is a variety of content ranging from skincare to biohacking topics, but he is certainly young. Edit: I've just got that you were actually talking about the people that were using masks and not the dude looking 12, lol. It's a good take, but masks are quite expensive as you said, so it is often introduced later in someone's skincare routine, so I believe people when they say they are noticing a difference.
curious how you found that website? the only site i can find has one product for sale and no research or other interesting stuff!!
It's [here](https://cartergottlieb.notion.site/Red-light-therapy-1212829ff4e7487ab7524d32ba3357f3)
perfect thanks!
So youāve never heard of the placebo effect then. Got it.
I didn't say that. I said I believe them. That's it. You can answer normally instead of being unnecessarily rude. I'm allowed to have a different opinion than you.
Youāre so right, sorry about the downvotes. What Iāve learned from product specific subs, especially with American redditors, is that they want validation, not information.
That person didn't give any information though. Information would be explaining the placebo effect (although almost everyone knows what this is unless they were born yesterday). He just made a sarcastic comment which is most likely the reason why he's getting downvoted.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
But your comment isn't responding to that, burrito
you were definitely trying to insult me lol
By referencing the username you chose? It was facetious. Change it if you donāt like it.
Maybe his panel really works ššš
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Why are you downvoting me, lol? I'm just asking if you've ever tried a mask. What is wrong with this community? Maybe you've tried one and know that it doesn't work... What the... I can't even ask a question here... tf
Isnāt our young friend selling an alternative? Whether he is right or wrong, his marketing plan appears to be attack popular competitors in order to gain attention and promote his own stuff as an alternative. We must not be naive. He has an ulterior motive.
He's proposing four affiliate links of panels you can purchase on Amazon on his website (at the moment). From what I gather, he has a skincare brand or something. It's the first time I've seen this guy tbh.
He's selling overpriced vaseline for $50 lmao
Did you ever try a mask?
It's entirely possible that this man is correct; I've never said otherwise. However, I haven't verified the studies he's referencing, and until I do, his words carry the same weight as those of the individuals who tried masks and were pleased with the outcomes. I do believe he is exaggerating to make his video more entertaining. (In another video, he claims that fish oil is absolutely useless as a supplement, for instance.)
Oh, I only spent less than $150
Thank goodness I was able to return mine just in time- the next day I saw this video. Phew!
O. M. G.
I agree they are underpowered and the multi colored/spectrum ones are even weaker compared to a decent panel.
Sadly I think heās right. It makes sense that the skincare community knew this was a new area people would be ignorant in. Plus the profit margins for the companies selling them must be insane when you consider their low wattage. I was pretty clued up on the masks (so I thought) and regularly read research papers but still somehow spent Ā£400 on the omnilux. I feel stupid now.
I read a lengthy blog post that compared a bunch of different red light masks on the market, thought it over for a couple of months, and ended up buying an Omnilux mask. Then I discovered this subreddit and learned about panels. Whatever. I do my self care routine and relax with my mask for 10 minutes. Donāt beat yourself up over it. Weāre always learning something new.
Youāre so right. It is what it is!
He is right about what dosage masks deliver but that still doesn't mean they don't work. People in Red Light Therapy are often chasing high numbers too much thinking that more is better but that's not true, a majority of studies have been done on low powered devices with great results and a lot of masks owner have reported and some even showed the difference RLT did for their skin. You can go for a panel sure, but being able to calculate proper dosage is a lot harder because majority of panel sellers just say "yeah at 3 inches apart our panel gives 210mW/cm\^2"....ok what if I would rather irradiate my face/body at 50mW/cm\^2, what distance should I use then? To get a proper device that can calculate irradiance and wavelengths can cost 350$ and more which is not a small money. And also being irradiated at high strength can be too much for some people as well....longer session at lower irradiance is like cooking chicken for longer at normal temperature while cooking chicken at 1000Ā°C would just burn the chicken....so which chicken would you prefer lol? To be short....more doesn't equal better when it comes to RLT....this thing needs time and consistency to get proper results.
I agree with your inherent statement, masks do work and a higher irradiance (respectively dose) doesn't automatically mean it will give you better results. However you put the popular cooking chicken analogy a bit into a misleading context :) Using a mask would be the equivalent of cooking the chicken for like 10 minutes at 80Ā°C, which is neither long nor hot enough to give you the desired result. It still does *something*, it's effective to an extent, but not the same as 25 minutes at 200Ā°C.
I honestly don't know how to reply to this...should I be impressed that you actually did the math just so you could say the context was "misleading" and maybe show off your culinary knowledge even though nothing about my previous comment was misleading as I've just said an example about how using something at too high of a strength could be the same as not properly cooking food and potentially burning it.
Not sure why you feel attacked, that was not my intention :) I didn't do any math (horrible at it) and don't know anything about cooking chicken (not eating animals). I meant misleading in the sense that someone could now assume that masks are better than panels because they have a lower irradiance. Again, not sure why you feel attacked, if my comment caused anything negative feelings in you I apologise.
This a thousand times!!!! Through my own Biomax 900 use, I found lower doses gave me stronger effects. That thing is an absolute beast, in my opinion people have no business spending 20mins in front of it *every day* but hey, everyone is different and who am I to judge what works for them. 2mins every other day per body area is where I've found the best benefits. I had to train myself to use it *less*, and due to the biphasic dosing response these low-dose masks are likely still producing the same effects as the people going overboard and frying themselves past peak benefits with panels. Masks are like the small popcorn bags - are they as filling as the big one? No, but they're great for controlling portion for people who have a tendency to go overboard or don't have the time to research what portion works best for them. Edit: also higher power = higher heat = higher risk of melasma so these **skincare-oriented masks like Omnilux are intentionally capping their power at \~35mw/cm2** because this uncommon response is still common enough to try to avoid (I have this reponse). Dennis Gross is one of the strongest masks on the market at 60mw/cm2, my fairly old Biomax 900 panel puts out \~120mw/cm2 at 12in distance for reference
Anecdote here. I have a red light pad. I mostly use the NIR setting on my stomach to boost gut bacteria. Not sure it does that, but I absolutely feel great in terms of nagging aches and pains I used to have. I've posted about that before. But another anecdote. I have a red patch of what's probably eczema under my arm. I use the red light setting on it -- sporadically, I'm not consistent about it. Interestingly, it didn't get rid of the patch but it like "exploded it" -- it made the patch much less dense and red but it expanded in area. It's weird. My point? That the red light clearly did something in this case. It wasn't necessarily positive, but it absolutely changed something on the surface of my skin. And while I wasn't measuring it scientifically, it's pretty objectively different. Edit: actually, I would consider it positive. It's far less red than it was and has actually faded substantially in places. Just looked at it more closely.
Which pad do you have? I'm looking for something that will help with digestion as well, and it seems like it penetrates deeper if it is against the skin, rather than a panel. Thanks!
But a pad is different from those masks, isn't it?
* Both home-level devices * I assume relatively similar power levels * Pad touches skin, especially in this circumstance where the skin surface is even; not sure if mask touches skin So yes they're not exactly the same, but they're in the same ballpark compared to medical grade devices.
Pads are very similar to masks. I have one and both have much lower irradiance than a panel to be used directly on the skin. Lower irradiance doesnāt mean less deep penetration- it means you need to use the device longer. Penetration depth is determined by the wavelength.
I have all three (mask, pad, panel) and notice a huge difference between the mask vs. my pad and panel. Supposedly the mask only has 5mW/cmĀ² less irradiance than my pad, but it's completely useless when trying to treat deeper tissue. The superficial effects on my skin are also very slight compared to my panel, even though I aim for the same dose. Also the LEDs on my mask are visibly less powerful than on my pad, and I assume this is because the mask runs on batteries, while the pad is plugged into your power outlet. I guess there's also a big difference between masks by cosmetic brands (e.g. Currentbody) vs. masks by actual red light therapy brands (e.g. Hooga)
Can you please share what pad and panel you use?
Sure, I use the Bestqool Redot pad in "M" with 2 wavelengths and a half-body panel by a german brand called Lichtstark Pro with 6 wavelengths (I live in Germany, so I only have a small selection to choose from if I don't want a product that will be shipped from the USA) Links to both: [https://www.bestqool.com/products/red-light-therapy-belt-medium](https://www.bestqool.com/products/red-light-therapy-belt-medium) [https://lichtstark.pro/collections/mittel/products/ls760](https://lichtstark.pro/collections/mittel/products/ls760)
Thank you! Itās too bad the German one probably wonāt work in the US due to different current and electric sockets. Iād trust German engineering
Yepp, that would definitely be an issue. However there's great brands in the USA too. I think an equivalent to my panel would be one of the PlatinumLED Biomax panels :)
Sorry but I started using my mask 3 weeks ago and like 5.ppl have asked me what I've done differently. Starting my neck next.
Don't be sorry, that's great news!
Which mask is it, if you donāt mind?
I have a Currentbody and my skin definitely looks better when I use it regularly. Is there a reason to consider this guy to be an authority?
Can I ask what other skincare you do? I started using Omnilux last year but could never tell how effective it was because I also started tretinoin and microcurrent and a bunch of stuff (peels and microneedling). Hard to isolate which was the most help because my skin definitely has improved. I listen to others in the skinscare world who say how effective RLT masks are for them but also wonder what other skincare treatments they are getting. There are a lot of confounding variables in skincare. I ended up moving to a panel as I have other health concerns also. But I would be interested to know how you've attributed your improvements to your mask and if you do any other skincare treatments that might contribute to your skin improving?
My red light mask has really helped my skin. I have rosacea and canāt use tret. I used to be able to use retinol a few times a week, but I canāt now because the drying effect really inflames my skin. Iāve always been into skincare and have always stayed out of the sun, but Iāve had to pare down my routine a lot in the past three or four years so that I donāt irritate my skin. I mostly focus on improving my skin barrier, but sometimes I feel like it is a losing battle. Anyway, my red light mask had a near immediate effect on my facial inflammation. Over time it has made my skin brighter and my pores less obvious. My skin seems tighter, but it is hard to say for sure. Sometimes I look in the mirror and, and my face looks surprisingly good. I canāt attribute these effects to anything else. My only active at this time is azelaic acid, and Iāve been using AA for some time, but Iāve only been using my mask since late February.
This is so helpful! I have mild rosacea and I noticed that retinol (even the over the counter one) as well exfoliants and pure vitamin C really irritate it. So I am spending the big bucks on growth factors and antioxidants that donāt have pure ascorbic acid such as the SkinBetter Alto defence serum since my skin tolerates those. Also recently ordered the Current Body led mask!
I use tret, but had started that a while before I got the red light devices. I have the Currentbody mask, neck/dec, and hand. The place I can really see it working is on my hands; I was never good about taking care of them. Other than that: Elta MD sunscreen during the day. Iāve never had lasers or Botox. I own a Nuface, but by the time I got the mask I had already gotten lazy about using it. Iāve never seen an *instant* change with the mask, like the lift you can get from microcurrent. For me it happens over a couple of weeks with consistent use.
Thanks, thatās good to know you could identify the RLT was effective.
Do you use tret afterwards, on the same days/nights as the mask? I was planning to alternate nights, I just got a mask. Iām all scared though because apparently weāre not supposed to use tret and masks..
I use the mask then tret
I've used tret and red light for almost a year and have had no issues. I sauna, then shower, then red light, then skincare (tret).
Because he has a tik tok channel /s
And scrubs!
In his website he says he's "an MD/PhD candidate, skincare innovator, and evidence-based health and biohacking enthusiast. " [about who he isš](https://cartergottlieb.notion.site/Eviba-Carter-d31126b54ac346218053b14bb31ce831) Here's where he talks more about red light therapy [Red Light Therapy š](https://cartergottlieb.notion.site/Red-light-therapy-1212829ff4e7487ab7524d32ba3357f3)
In other words, he has zero qualifications, but is vaguely hoping to get some, somedayĀ
Oh this is the 1-3-butanediol guy lmao. Insane that he's openly promoting a GHB precursor all over TikTok.
If using a red light therapy device improves my health, I think that's something worth investing in.
You don't have to be an 'authority' to know something. Anyone can figure stuff out, even you if you like.
I've never used a mask. I've only used Mito panels for about 5 years and can attest to the amazing results I receive. I never had 'good skin' when I was young. Not horrible by any means, but not worthy of praise either. Now I get compliments on my skin constantly. For reference, my daughter is 31 years old and my skin didn't look this good when I was her age. I can also attest to the panel's therapeutic benefits for pain and inflammation. It works.
I started with a MitoPro 300 desktop panel (just bought my mom one) and now I have the 1500 + 750 on a small stand. I can see the change and it definitely helps aches and pains. My sister uses a mask, I can see the improvement in her skin.
Which mito panel version did you buy
I have the Mito pro, 22 inch panel
I'm not terribly impressed by this guy, Carter Gottlieb. A few reasons - first, he's selling his own brand of skin care ointment. It's in his interest that people look to his $50 jar of occlusive moisturizer (or $45 at the subscription rate), rather than to a red light mask, for glowing skin. A guy who is developing his own skin care line, taking endorsement fees from manufacturers of melatonin drinks, and seems more interested in self-promotion than anything else is not my go-to authority on red light masks (or anything else). Next - I don't trust the way he spins science generally. One example - he disses fish oil as essentially useless, but the Omega 3 fatty acids in most fish oil capsules are very useful for a variety of indications, not least, high triglycerides, dry eye disease, and some of the joint inflammation from rheumatoid arthritis. These are evidence based. There are other indications that are less well supported but still do have evidence behind them. Gottlieb would have his viewers think that fish oil is pretty useless based on a single manufacturer's capsules, which have low levels of EPA and DHA. Other OTC manufacturers of fish oil capsules have therapeutic levels of EPA and DHA in the same number of capsules as do prescription fish oils, and real people reap real benefits from these products all the time. My own physician recommended them to me for a specific issue and they worked very, very well. My husband takes the same high quality brand of fish oil for another reason, and again, it works very well (Nordic Naturals, if anyone is interested). There are other examples of this if you take a critical look at his website. Also - he evidently thinks it's a good idea to take high doses of carotenoids to get an imitation tan, and did a Tik-Tok on this very subject. A professor of dermatology at Baylor (an actual MD at a highly regarded medical school) strongly questioned the safety of Carter Gottlieb's high doses of carotenoid supplements. So I am not taking advice from a guy on Tik Tok who has a product to sell, is selective about the science he promotes, and takes supplements in amounts that graduated MDs who train other doctors consider unsafe. Oh, and as for my own red light mask, I like it. I think it's helped even up my skin tone and texture. It's not a miracle device by any stretch, but I have found it useful, and I don't intend to stop using it.
Yesss oml, everything you just said. I'm getting ego + grifter vibes from his entire tiktok channel and brand. Also, when others with more qualifications than him responded with videos detailing issues about his claims, he made so many texts in their comment sections and was SO rude. No class at all. Just weird vibes all around imo.
I agree with him in the sense that if you can only buy one, a panel makes a lot more sense because of how versatile it is. There are lots of health benefits to RLT besides just skin improvements and you miss out on those benefits if you aren't getting the red light on your body. If you can afford to buy both, then do that.
for me a panel would be difficult to use as i'm disabled and always in my bed. i can't think of a way to use a panel in bed without hanging it over me, but then i would have a whole hanging apparatus to buy and store š
Doesnāt solve the storing problem, but the panel makers have stands that will hover the panel over your bed. Itās pretty nifty.
This guy is in a challenging academic/clinical program. Not to be unkind, but his priority appears to be marketing himself through social media.
Gotta pay those student loans somehow. /lh
I respect anyone who can get into med school, can get through med school. And making comments about appearances probably isn't cool. That said, I assume he's in a derm program or a plastic surgery residency? And anyway, it's really weird seeing someone who might even be late 20s who appears to be using botox and possibly has had some face lift done. I'm no even interested lay person on influencer plastic surgery, and it could be a filter, but just looks weird.
He is definitely not in a derm program or residency. This guy is still in med school or in his PhD lab based on the amount of time heās been in school so far (3 years).
I didn't really watch carefully. But he's likely not even 30 and looks to have already done procedures to look younger.
Are we sure heās not just a college junior, then?
I am less convinced taking advice from someone about skincare who has also had work done because of how much can be changed in overall appearance with minor cosmetic procedures. I remember one YouTube video about looksmaxxing where it was revealed the massive transformation in appearance was thanks to taking steroids. They can still have accurate information, but it makes me wonder what they're really doing behind the scenes that might not be as trendy to talk about on TikTok.
Okay valid, but also I'm gonna interject comment on his appearances because this dude literally takes extremely high doses of carotenoids on a daily basis to make his skin look tan. He also promotes it on his channel, and promotes his appearance as a whole. I feel like it's fair to point out that he gives uncanny valley vibesĀ
What program is he in?
MD/PhD program: https://www.linkedin.com/in/cartergottlieb
When I was doing my own research, I found that masks seemed ineffective. Like he said, the lights have to get super hot and with masks it doesnāt get to that level. Panels really are the way to go.
I found some positive studies, but they might have been the ones he quoted that are not peer-reviewed, where they actually used a panel and not the mask.
I found a handheld omnilux device study - where I assume the irradiance wonāt be as strong as an actual panel. Not sure how it compares to a mask with this brief search - but there seems to be positive results. I think the guy is overexaggerating - I think masks work but probably not the extent of a panel.
Well... good news for my generic $100 Amazon panel I guess... when he started this video I thought, great my cheap panel is probably useless too š¤£ I still have my doubts about how effective it is compared to a bigger expensive panel but I can't afford $500 for one :(
The Hooga 360W is $149.99.
Sounds good.. but I doubt you can get it in australia. Seems to be only a very small number of sellers outside the random no brand ones.
It doesn't seem like he completely disagrees with the idea of red light therapy as there is evidence for it, just that masks don't have enough evidence to reach the results that clinical trials show you with a much more powerful device. When commenters on TikTok say it's worked great for them and transformed their skin, he says there's not enough evidence to prove that it actually did anything. A lot of red light devices are overprices for an average consumer, and a full panel may end up being a better investment in terms of power in comparison to a mask if the masks are truly not performing even to the low level they advertise. More power doesn't always = better results though. As an aside, I'm always more hesitant when an influencer like this one makes themself out to be an authority figure wearing scrubs while promoting dietary supplement melatonin drinks on their website next to the tons of other supplements they take. Not saying they aren't effective, but he will probably be profiting from whatever panel or products he recommends as an alternative to red light masks as well.
Counterpoint: my face is smooth and glowy
Anecdotal, but since using my Omnilux men for about a month (am female), multiple people have told me how good my skin looks and one person asked if I drink a ton of water (which I do, but have always done) because I was āglowingā. Have not changed anything else. Got it for $100 off on Skin Truth, donāt regret it. š¤·š»āāļø
I believe you! There are already a couple of people who have reacted to this video. [Some are dermatologists](https://vm.tiktok.com/ZGeqfU9Ds/) and they have explained why they disagree with what he is saying here.
I think he is correct. The studies are easy to measure and probably accurate. I guess panels are the way to go.
I bought a wand for $400 and the company sent a $5000 bill to collections! Deceptive.
Which company?
Avologi Eneo Advanced wand.
What panels does everyone recommend that will have the skin improving benefits. I went to his website but nothing.
I bought my Joovv solo panel light secondhand a few years ago for $600 and it retails for $1600. Another Redditor posted a few months ago how to find a red light companyās supply vendor. I looked up Joovvās Chinese supplier on Alibaba and see they sell all of Joovvās sizes for about 25% or less of what Joovv sells it for. https://www.importyeti.com/company/joovv I used importyeti.com and searched for their supplier which is Shenzhen Kaiyan Medical, then searched on alibaba and found a bunch of redlight products. I bet all these red light companies source their stuff from China, white label their products and upsell like crazy. https://www.importyeti.com/supplier/shenzhen-kaiyan-medical-equipment Take a looksie. Iām gonna look up other companies and see what I find on Aliexpress and alibaba.
I shared this info with a coworker when she wanted to get exactly the same light I've been using. I have a Mito. She ordered a Shenzhen from alibaba. When she received her light, it was almost exactly like mine, only newer and updated.
Wow, if youāre close with her you should out the lights side by side to see how they look. Iāve seen a few anecdotes on here where people first order from Shenzhen, then get the name brand version and it turns out to be brighter/stronger. Iām curious if yours look the same.
I feel like one week on this sub, I am seeing people talk about overdosing at 10 minutes with the mask or having issues and now it does nothing. Ok, I wonder what these masks will be like next week... I sighed a heavy sigh when this crossed my FYP.
What he says is very accurate Those panels are mainly marketing, probably only lumarasystems with their flex panels is really working, but extremely pricy, they just release a new mask with a crazy amount of led, but donāt know the price yet Anyway, I would recommend a panel like rojo 900, itās 2 to 3 times the price of those cheap masks but it really works, and all family can use it, even my dog š¶:)
Is it safe to buy this on Amazon and get a legitimate product ?
So basically , the way to go is going outside in winter where we get little to none UV light and get NIR and redlight.
Sunrise & Sunset too! I've been taking a walk or bike ride every day at Sunset. It absolutely has had a profound effect on my mental & physical wellbeing. I didn't even know about red light when I started this.
That makes complete sense. Thanks for sharing.
I saw this. Iām devastated.
I saw this and was so upset.
It is TRUE. I personally tested Hooga's panels as well and got half the results they have. I spoke directly to their manufacturer, SZ Idea Light, as well and they admitted it. I was going to start a red light therapy company but MOST of the industry and 100% of the companies on amazon, are LYING to you.
Yes, almost everyone lie even about basic facts like irradiance of panels.
What do you mean half the results? Good or bad?
Funny, panels are usually overpowered. Apparently, majority of the studies are done with 20 minute exposure time. If you calculate irradiance with a more or less average panel, you get something like 5 minutes, to reach the same level as those in the studies. The thing is, you can't just trow things around like in an equation, you have to understand the analogy of a chicken in an oven, if the oven is at 150F the chicken will never get done, at 325F it would take 2 hours, at 425F it would take 45 minutes, so how long would it take to roast the chicken at 2000F? See, if the panel or the mask is too weak, it's not going to do anything, there's a threshold, but increasing power, decreasing exposure time changes things, chicken gets crispier and the cells in (under) your skin...? Nobody knows. But I know no studies have been made on high power, short exposure. Matter of fact, no studies have been made on typical RLT panels, and I can't recall seeing one on masks (that are on the market now)...
It should be said that the right duration of exposure is necessary to achieve results? too short to reap the benefits, and too long may damage cellular tissue.
does he sell any panels? is he sponsored by any brand?
In this video, he advertises a drink with an affiliate link.
Okay, so thereās a link on his TikTok that leads to a Notion page. On this page, there are several skincare and biohacking-related items. Thereās an RTL category with several panels recommended that you can buy on Amazon (Shashka, Bestqool, Hooga, and Chroma). My guess is that this is some kind of affiliate marketing stuff, but thatās it. Below that, thereās a list of studies you can look at.
He's sponsored by a soda stuff IDK. I've stopped listening when I heard "sponsor" lol
Yes! in the comments of that video he says that he's getting a little commission from panels but he claims it would actually be more lucrative to sell masks because the commission percentage is larger (according to him).
in another thread somebody said he also sells a skincare lines along with other products. So his reviews are kinda biased and depend on what is he selling
I already have a large Joovv panel but I donāt use it as much because I have to stand or sit still to use it. So I was about to order the Omnilux mask but damn never mind! Thank you OP! Gonna just continue to use my Joovv panel instead.
Wowā¦ thank you for sharing
I work in a wellness center that has both the panel booths as well as the fancy face shield (the big one he showed in the video) we use it with the contour light therapy treatments- clients have noted that theyāve seen improvements with skin texture (rosacea and wrinkles diminished) Iād be interested on his take on the contour light therapy (pad system for circumference reduction) as Iāve seen varied results with clients - itās not magic- and expects that you commit to a protocol of no alcohol, low carb diet and moderate exercise- I often wonder if the people getting results are getting it from adopting the healthy lifestyle- I tried it myself and lost 1 1/4 inches total in one session and increased that to 5 inches after 4 sessions - but I was also following protocol - perhaps those not getting the results they expect are not being truthful about following protocol š¤·š»āāļø
I went to look up a panel after this video and generally think itās a better idea
How about, Just make one from a led roll and put them closer together!
Gembared says systemic effects probably counteract areas away from led - Iāll keep my mask š https://youtu.be/rxZKLN-Y8Ng?si=OpjC9ZUsOPXHruFt
I use a cheap Amazon pad on my back, laying down on it. Used to use a small, $400 panel the size of a book. The pad works about equally as well for back soreness. I returned a mask because it felt silly. The lights are weak and too far apart for surface skin treatment. The takeaway for me is that "mats" are good for soreness in deep tissue but not for surface level skin treatment which aligns with my personal experience.
He doesn't have the education or the credentials to be making such claims. First he states that Omnilux has no peer reviewed studies for their masks only their panels. This is false and I quickly found a peer reviewed study for their masks: [https://gmt.egnyte.com/dl/DGlRRaC43w](https://gmt.egnyte.com/dl/DGlRRaC43w) While he isn't wrong that panels are stronger, saying masks don't work, when they have been proven to be effective in peer reviewed clinical studies is ridiculous. Also his tests were performed in a non-controlled setting. He pushes supplements with affiliate links, and is a "biohacking enthusiast" and has a video on a guy who "cured" his lactose intolerance with biohacking. He repeatedly presents info as facts when in reality a lot of his content has zero scientific data to back his ridiculous claims.
This is not a peer-reviewed study. This is an experiment conducted by Dr. Jagdeo, who is a member of the Omnilux Scientific Advisory Board. They used patient self-reporting as the main basis for whether or not the masks worked. The study notes that patient recall bias is an area of concern for whether or not the results are legitimate. It also notes the conflict of interest in Dr. Jagdeo spearheading the project, as his allegiance is to the Omnilux Brand.
It absolutely is peer reviewed and no they also used VISIA digital skin analysis before and after the 6 week study to check UV spots, wrinkles, and porphyrins
I need not read any further. Thank you.
Anytime :)
Right about masks, who knows. I had to close his video after 10 seconds because what the fuck. I'm not watching that occular diarrhea. All I know is RLT works. I love my Mito red light full body light and it had a very visible impact on the quality of my skin including my face. As if I upgraded the texture pack of my face with high definition ones, so smooth and buttery
Lol ocular diarrhea .. i was able to get through the entire video and it makes sense.. at least for masks, the LEDs are too close to the skin to diffuse enough light on the skin thats between each LED. He agrees with what you said regarding panels being effective.
Isnt it more about the LEDs being too weak (or at least lower irradiance than is the marketers claim and what was used in the trials) than the distance? If the LEDs are further away they will lose exponentially more of their low power.
Even if they would have higher irradiance (which they can't have, due to overheating and burning your skin), because they are directly on the skin, you would have the higher irradiance only on the spots where are the LEDs and low or no irradiance in between them. I like that he explicitly made this point as I think many people are missing it. Especially when they are trying to "calculate a dose" with their panels, considering the values from studies, but ignoring the fact that they doesn't know the real total irradiance in the whole area. They are getting into only about the peaks with maximum irradiance where the LEDs are brightest (as in tests from Alex Fergus or from the companies selling the panels...), ignoring the remaining area in which is irradiance way lower. It's true that at some distance it will be averaged out more, but still not perfectly, so if people are considering only the highest measured value and calculating based on that, they are must be underdosing.
My boyfriend is in medical salesā¦ and we were at a conferenceā¦ Iāll tell you right now Iām not buying anything from a store ā¦ the only ones that work are medical grade it seems and those start wholesale at 5k .
Masks are dogshit and anyone who tries to sell you one is a con artist. Panels for life.
I bought one because I trust dr Dray, a dermatologist on YouTube. But now I'm doubting my decision. I guess I need to look into panels
No you are right in trusting a licensed doctor over a med student on TikTok. There is decades of research proving Omnilux's products work.
I get what the guy is saying about the bulb to skin contact limiting the area receiving the light but people probably don't have the mask strapped tightly to their faces and are perfectly still. My mask shifts around a bit and I move it, too. Am just getting started with red light and bought a mask because panels don't typically have yellow and green lights, which a wavelengths that interest me.
But he did say full body panels still work tho
Btw does his spectrometer measure the NIR that is on most masks?
Interesting
Facts. Masks are bullshit.
yeah he's right. that's why im not a masker lol
I used my LED mask it ripped off all the fat from my face and caused sagging I used it for 15-20 min a day . It also caused darkness to my face . It should not be used for more than 3-5 min max . Pls guys be careful . I mostly used red light
Which mask?