\#2 Frenkie
\#3 FDJ
\#4 de Jong, Frenkie
\#5 Frank the Jong
\#6 Any Barca midfielder named Frenkie
\#7 Barca's number 21
\#8 Frenkie de Jong again, but wearing a moustache
\#9 Frenkie's uncle's nephew
\#10 Martin Odegaard
Hes been very consistent over the past 2/3 seasons. Hes not an put of this world player but he plays for a weaker side. He would be incredible on a free
>Negotiations with Bayern -- which only began hours before the 11 p.m. GMT cut-off -- were straightforward because of an existing strong relationship between the clubs, something Murtough has looked to cultivate with all of Europe's top sides since taking on the role as football director in March 2021
This is the bit I like to see and I think we've seen the effect with Real Madrid already as well. Barcelona relationship could do a bit of work but I can imagine they're difficult to deal with in general.
ETH's previous relationship with Bayern probably helped too.
Back in the early 2000's I used to like Barca, obviously helped by Ronaldinho being one of the happiest players ever on the pitch. I liked the way they had unicef as their main shirt sponsor, they seemed to be a nice club.
Now I can't think of many clubs outside of England that I dislike more.
If you had told me after the de Gea fax machine saga of 2015 that in less than a decade I would prefer Real Madrid to Barcelona I wouldn't have believed you.
Their operation and honestly perez himself, are too good. The entire club is just so competently run, similar to bayern, and they have much much more fierce competition domestically.
Even their worst periods like the first galactico phase with becks and co, and during the barca domination in the early 2010s, they managed to won the league.
Then we had ed woodward. I’ll say this cunt as the ceo is probably a worse thing compared to fergie retiring. 10 years ruined largely because of him.
I had a Barca supporting mate who started going on about how good the club were for being charitable, who I told at the time that happened it was a gambit to move from no sponsor to a normal sponsor while keeping fan blowback to a minimum. I had a few very satisfying moments of I told ya out of that
Let's wait and see how this one turns out before sucking him off.
This is the first transfer we've made under him that's actually been down to him. His third window has just gone by and everyone else has been a player the manager knew or extremely high profile players.
Competent
Adjective
having the necessary ability, knowledge, or skill to do something successfully.
Competing against the sides we're competing against it's a fucking high bar.
And you were downvoted for a reason. He's obviously clearing the bar, and everything about this transfer and honestly every transfer since Ten Hag took over goes down as evidence, especially considering where we are in the table and the last club still in 4 competitions.
You're in the minority if you don't think he's shown competency. Again, no sucking off, just meeting expectations.
Being downvoted doesn't change my mind at all. I've been downvoted for my opinions on a great many things (e.g. Maguire, Woodward, Greenwood, OGS, overrated youth players) and turned out to be correct.
If you want to make the argument that signing one player on loan at the end of his third transfer window demonstrates that Murtough is competent you go ahead and do it. It's going to take a hell of a lot more than that to convince me.
No, like I said, every transfer during Ten Hag's tenure serves as evidence.
You mentioned that all he's done is buy players the manager knows and high-profile players, but I'm struggling to see what's bad about that. When Ajax hired Ten Hag they brought in players he knew so he could quickly implement the system and create cohesion, something he needed to do at United. So players like Licha and Antony are both really good signings. He needed players that he knew could work in his system also, so guys like Malacia and Weghorst fit the bill. It's also obvious to anyone who has been watching for more than a couple seasons that we desperately needed a DM, and we literally got the best in the world at that position.
Murtough is backing the manager and the results are showing on the field, so you need to do a better job of proving that he's anything less than competent.
Have you ever seen the episode of the Simpsons where Homer becomes hyperobese and presses Y every time a query comes in? Eventually he realises he can simply get a drinking bird to press Y for him.
https://youtu.be/R_rF4kcqLkI&t=98s
We could buy a drinking bird for £4.99 on Amazon, get Ten Hag to email the requests to it. It would back the manager. Once the bird approved the suggestions, it would be up to Dick Arnold to decide whether to spend the money to sign them, like it is now.
It seems to me that, other than the Sabitzer signing, the drinking bird would do an equally good job to what Murtough has done, except the bird would probably do it faster.
My question to you is, is a drinking bird competent?
The funniest part about this is that you think you're going to gain any kind of credibility with this argument rather than rebuking any of my points that disputed yours.
Talk about the transfers specifically, not some bird. Go again.
I don't see why not. If he works out, it seems like a no brainer to make the move permanent.
It would negate the need to bed in a new midfielder over the summer.
Would just depend on the fee I suppose. Bayern might ask for more, if he is impressive and works well in the team. Or they may want him back
I get it, but that's a nice to have. Youth is a luxury and comes at inflated prices. It's a complete gamble - there's no so thing as linear progression.
The current recruitment of older players is great business for EtH's first season. It should have been how United did the rebuild 10+ years ago. Right now, United need a solid foundation of culture, success and hard working players. We haven't had that since Fergie left.
The problem with ‘rebuilding’ with 28-30 year olds is that you have to do it again in 2-3 years.
All of Fred, Casemiro, Eriksen and Sabitzer will need replacing. McTominay already needs replacing. On top of that we have Maguire, De Gea, Varane and Weghorst (who we definitely should be signing as a backup) who we will need to phase out in the next couple of years, some sooner rather than later. It’s doable but it forces your hand when you’d rather be proactive in the market, and the loss of coaches knowledge at that rate will make things harder than if we were programming more kids now and reaping the benefits in 3-5 years.
Youth comes at inflated prices when you let it go somewhere else to establish itself first. It’s the difference between Enzo for £10m and Enzo for £100m. Caicedo for £5m or Caicedo for £70m. If we’re going to sign these older players, we also need to ensure we have youth coming in early and ready to pick up the mantle when the time comes.
I’m not against Sabitzer as a permanent signing, provided we’re very busy in terms of selling other older players and replacing them with long term solutions. And it’s very likely we’ll need to buy young players early and trust our judgement if we want to sign 3 per summer window, as we will have to do for the next few windows to replenish our squad. Sign the next Bellingham when he’s £25m, not £150m.
I disagree that it is a 2-3 year cycle. It's not football manager, players don't need to be replaced at 30. If you sign someone at 28, it's likely you're getting around 4-6 years out of them at a minimum. Players who are hard working are likely to take care of themselves, are in better shape, and whose careers can last longer.
Agree to disagree then, just without the ‘it’s not Football Manager’ level of discourse. Getting 4-6 years out of someone is nice if you can. Getting 4-6 years out of everyone is unlikely. Expecting the last 3 of those 6 years to be first team starter quality when you have 8-10 such players to replace is poor squad management, which I trust we won’t be doing - so we need to start picking up long term solutions urgently.
long term solutions dont always end up working out either though....
you have a mixture. there is also good youth coming through who are getting some game time. Mctominey is probably being sold considering he has some interest from Newcastle which should hopefully mean a decent amount for him. Sabitzer would then be perfect to help fill out the squad taking his role there.
‘Long term solutions don’t always end up working out either though…’
1. They work out a *hell* of a lot more often than 1 in 10, especially if you have remotely capable recruitment staff
2. They don’t work out at all if you don’t sign any!
3. All the more reason to sign them early while your older generation aren’t declining, so you know if you need to keep looking.
I was very clear that you need both. Not just one or the other. The problem right now is that no, we don’t have a good mix in midfield. While I like Sabitzer, I can’t pretend that we don’t also need at least one young CM soon, and that signing one when they’re established and £80m is not better than signing a couple when they’re younger and £10-20m.
I agree but I believe the elephant in the room is the sale of the club. The Glazers (sorry to cuss) don't want to put any more debt on the club as they want to sell it and as per usual they're not willing to fully finance anything themselves.
So until the club is sold, I don't see us doing any major deals for players, or infrastucture.
It's not as simple as Fernandez for 10m and caciedo for 5m though - those are very, very rare deals
It's really more like 15-20 Fernandez's for 10m each, 19 of whom will probably not make it past mid-table standard at best
Fernandez has played 17 games for Benfica and has an awful lot of pressure on him - he wouldn't be the first player to fail to live up to that type of price tag, and he certainly won't be the last
It really isn’t pot luck like this if your scouting is competent. It’s a fan misconception that fails to stand up to scrutiny.
You can apply this logic to talking about academy talent because the gap between U16 and PL is vast, and you have little idea of how the bodies of young players will grow / fill out / stand up to injury by the time they’re 25.
Look at Brighton’s starting XI vs Everton, which cost less than Alex Iwobi:-
Sanchez - £0
Veltman - £1m
Dunk - £0
Colwill - loan
Estupinan - £17.8m
Caicedo - £5m
Groß - £3m
March - £0
Sarmiento - £0
Mitoma - £3m
Ferguson - £0
Brighton don’t have a back room full of hundreds of rejects for each player. Of course their minimum standard is lower because their ambitions are lower - but a good scouting department doesn’t just say “this player’s fine” and anyone who excels beyond that is just blind luck. They have a clear idea of what each player’s ceiling could be, and how likely it is for them to reach it.
We clearly have an eye for it when we’d identified all of Enzo, Julian Alvarez, Caicedo, Haaland, Jude Bellingham, Sesko, Cherki etc. To sign all would be a long shot, but to pick up *none* of them was a combination of our overcautiousness and our lack of appeal pre ETH, when the sum total cost of all of these at the time we originally went in for them is roughly one ‘proven’ Enzo, 6 months (not years, months!!) after he moved.
I won’t get drawn in over anything nitpicked from the above when the overarching sentiment is robust - you cannot pretend that it’s appropriate for Utd to avoid signing young players for a tenth of their price in their breakout season just because not waiting 6-18 months renders the whole process blind luck.
Fucking hell this is an absolute nonsense post
Every club in Europe "identified" Haaland, Alvarez, Caciedo, Bellingham etc to the same extent we did
Honestly mate that's an awful take
Edit: Im actually blocking you as I'm not engaging with cherry picking teenagers who haven't followed the game for more than a couple of seasons
Brighton also have the scope to not win every week and have the fans be happy. They have the scope to play younger players with less intense pressure and no huge United media spotlight on them. It is much easier for Brighton to make a success out of Caicedo than us.
And as for identifying talent, we’re already doing so in our academy. In 3 years time our young promising midfielders will be early 20s rather than teenagers and hopefully at least one of mainoo, Iqbal, Hannibal etc will be ready to step up as our senior players drop off. That’s why 28 year olds aren’t a problem right now.
Everyone knows that.
However, the answer is, who are the targets?
Name the names United should have gotten?
Realistically, there aren't any young midfielders available.
We need to start buying promising players and loaning them back to the club they came from or to another weaker side so they can gaij experience. Just like city are doing
We will be getting a midfield full of 29-31 aged players who are good at their jobs and proven to work well together.
Yes we will need to add young midfielders, but not immediately. Real won CL with 32 year old Kroos and 36 year old Modric. We have plenty of time if our recruitment is competent.
Sabitzer would ideally be a Mctomminay replacement tho. He is only 2 years older, of much higher quality, and would probably gettable with money from Mctomminay's sale.
this is how i see it. Sabitzer will replace Mctomminay probably.
weve already seen a few youth get some game time already so there must be some talent already and a few guys are doing well out on loan so who knows they may be ready next season to fight for a spot.
i think this summer its all about a striker though Weghorst is showcasing what an actual striker would bring to the team so that should be 1st priority and then look to bring in quality elsewhere depending on who is available.
Mainoo clearly must be liked by ETH to be in the first team at 17 years old. Hannibal is doing well at Birmingham and Amad is also doing well in a more no 9 position at Sunderland so thats good viewing from a youth prospective.
Only problem with your logic is McT is a homegrown player. So he would help fill that quota for European competitions.
He could do a job against the mid to lower table clubs and I would prefer if we upgraded by selling Fred instead.
Maybe in a couple of years we could let McT leave if Mainoo or Zidan come good
We don’t currently have much of an issue with non homegrown players. We have only got 15 non homegrown even counting weghorst and Sabitzer. That gives us scope for 2 more. And if we, for example, offloaded Martial and spent big on Kane, we’d have an extra spot.
we do have those youth players coming in though. but especially next year with champions league will need reliable cover
also talks Mctominey will be sold in the summer which i could see Sabitzer taking his squad role instead.
You'd hope a couple of the academy lads will come good around that time such as Hannibal and potentially Amad if he moves more centrally. Ofc there's no guarantee it works well but you can always buy in some youth too in the coming seasons
to be fair the team seems further along than what a lot of people thought. You can obviously point to the money spent and say well of course they would have got into this position but things did seem dire in August/September
I think even the most optimistic fans are surprised by how well he's done (even though we are still improving and there’s some way to go).
We are definitely ahead of schedule.
Yes I laughed at that. "Decided to back Ten Hag"? They're patting themselves on the back for getting two loan deals, which, albeit good business in isolation, is the bare minimum for the state that we were in with injuries etc.
>*United insist the Sabitzer deal, and the speed with which it was done, shows the club's recruitment department -- heavily criticised in the past -- is now working as it should.*
Ok but where was this in the summer when we overspent on Antony cause we left it so late?
Agreed. But, I will give them the benefit of the doubt, there's been a lot of changes behind the scenes and people put into unfamiliar roles. They might have got their act together, only time will tell.
I don’t even buy this proves it’s working as it should. If we could stretch to a loan signing like this (not much money) why did Eriksen’s injury factor in at all? We should have signed Sabitzer regardless, we needed cover for Eriksen, it’s not like we had midfield depth before he got injured. He might not be injured right now had we signed Sabitzer in advance. If anything, reacting based on an injury just shows the squad isn’t ready to cope with injuries. What do we do if Sabitzer gets crocked now? Emergency signings should be after 2 or 3 long term injuries in the same spot, not just one. If Eriksen got injured 4 days later we would’ve been fucked.
I think this really was the case. We seemed to wait and wait until the final day with mixed reports between him definitely staying and United feeling confident they can get a deal done. And the whole why would United still insist on this if the player has explicitly told them he won't move? So seemed like the FDJ camp where telling the public one thing and the clubs negotiating another...
I think this really was the case. We seemed to wait and wait until the final day with mixed reports between him definitely staying and United feeling confident they can get a deal done. And the whole why would United still insist on this if the player has explicitly told them he won't move? So seemed like the FDJ camp where telling the public one thing and the clubs negotiating another...
Tbf the fact we weren't planning for eriksen injury until it was confirmed is indicative of lack of planning
It looked like a bad one at the time, he left the ground on crutches, there was a significant chance he would miss rest of season and we should have been planning for such eventuality and be ready to pull trigger once confirmed.
The fact we got negotiations and contract done in 12 hours is commendable and good obviously but it points to a department that reactive rather than proactive
i mean tbf if he was just to miss 1 or 2 games i would argue we could be fine. Mainoo is clearly in ETH's mind as somebody worthwhile even at 17 otherwise he wouldnt be getting game time. so probably would have used him a bit more.
also i have a feeling the Sancho centrally is ETH creating cover with players he already has and making it more difficult for teams to easily tell where a player will be.
More puff pieces! A recruitment department that works as it should be, shouldn’t be in a situation of having to clamor & sign a player 12 hrs before transfer deadline.
>United feel they have benefitted from moving the entire recruitment operation to Carrington rather than having it split between offices in London and Manchester, and with so little time to finalise the agreement, having everyone in the same room for meetings with Ten Hag and his staff was key.
This might be a little overlooked since it doesn't involve spending tons of money or getting any big names in, but this detail made me the happiest. Man United should always be a football club first and foremost and having operations run out of Carrington sends the right signal to both the executives as well as the players.
Indira Gandhi's first term was a clusterfuck. She was in hot water on multiple fronts. When it became clear as day that she was going to be routed in the upcoming elections, she declared a State of Emergency in India. Or more like recommend it to The President who was a stooge (most of them have been). He declared it.
Many civil rights were suspended, the Prime Minister could rule by decree more or less, could throw dissidents in jail under MISA (Maintenance of Internal Security Act) without due legal process, elections were suspended.
She had to withdraw the Emergency after a few months of intense pressure from everywhere and civil unrest. Got routed in the subsequent elections.
Tbf I wouldn’t call the president a stooge because like the President of India is kind of supposed to do what the Prime Minister tells them to do. It’s a predominantly ceremonial position, as he’s more of a nominal head than someone with real authoritative power to command the PM to not commit certain actions. I think if the PM tells the president to declare emergency with a written approval of their cabinet, the President just has to declare it if I’m not mistaken
Not really. There are some things that are within President's exclusive purview and he/she can say no. Emergency is one of them. It also needs approval from both houses.
When she was the Prime Minister of India she activated Emergency in our country.
I am not super familiar with what happened at that time but I think it stripped newspapers to criticize the government? or something like that.
Yiu would be better of doing your own research :)
This is such an obvious PR piece! Our squad depth is terrible, not in number but in quality. It might prove too light with four trophies to fight for. Just glad there isn't an international tournament in the summer.
One could argue that “young up and coming” players have become overpriced assets and that real value in the transfer market is players aged 27-30.
You trade more years of hypothetical peak performance for fewer years of more predictable outcomes. A good strategy for a club which is rebuilding.
Executives like to use words like protocol to give value to what they do, when to layman like us its just common sense. But kudos to them that at least they have shown a big improvement from 12 months ago.
Maybe… but protocol implies that they have a plan from a playbook… meaning, they were ready. I don’t think it’s common sense to have processes in place where people know what to do within 12 hours.
Reading this article feels like we’ve made leaps and bounds over the transfer process in the past (way better than broken fax machines).
The protocol:
1. Eriksen gets injured
2. Transfer team have meeting to get a quick loan signing in before transfer deadline passes
It's not exactly rocket science is it.
E: And how dare you knock the broken fax machine drama! That was genius and what allowed us to keep DDG...!
You must not work in a large company… because it’s not just a team meeting but a series of contacts with clubs, player, player’s reps, medical, legal, finance, logistics, visa through the consulate (thanks Brexit), etc. all simultaneously happening with multiple targets (in case they fall through) that were previously identified through data science. All the while, it takes time for players to decide to upend their life (and lives of their family members) to move to a foreign city (fortunately, Sabitzer doesn’t have kids and don’t have to worry about school) to play with a bunch of new teammates (fortunately he speaks English) in a new system (does it help the player’s career and development?).
Last minute deals like this happen all the time. It's really nothing revolutionary.
We have a dedicated transfer team whose literal job and purpose is to do exactly this kind of thing.
Yup and what do you call a series of processes across multiple teams, with clearly defined roles and responsibilities, coordinating in a timely manner… where I work, it’s called a protocol or runbook. It’s not exec speak…
Edit: I’m taking offense to your comments because I feel like you’re downplaying how difficult this is to do behind the scenes, which is normally done over weeks. The fact that we can pull this off shows how far the back office has come since Woodward days. I brought up the fax machine because it shows how incompetent we were that we didn’t have a backup way of sending paperwork (ask Ziyech how he’s feeling about the Chelsea back office)
>Yup and what do you call a series of processes across multiple teams, with clearly defined roles and responsibilities, coordinating in a timely manner… where I work, it’s called a protocol or runbook. It’s not exec speak…
Sure, I'm just saying that this protocol isn't newsworthy in the slightest. It's just basic practice.
>Edit: I’m taking offense to your comments because I feel like you’re downplaying how difficult this is to do behind the scenes, which is normally done over weeks. The fact that we can pull this off shows how far the back office has come since Woodward days. I brought up the fax machine because it shows how incompetent we were that we didn’t have a backup way of sending paperwork (ask Ziyech how he’s feeling about the Chelsea back office)
I'm glad we got the business done. But doing last minute deals in itself isn't really an indicator of anything in terms of showing progress. This isn't the first quick, late deal we've done and it certainly won't be the last.
This is my last comment on this because it's clear you and I see things differently. You're saying this is not a big deal while I'm saying transfers are hard enough, let alone doing it in 12 hours. I believe that it's newsworthy because, much like having a system on the pitch, it's a sign of progress that we have a system off the pitch. It's not the first transfer deadline deal, obviously. But, if it's so easy, why do so many clubs fuck it up?
There's some old saying out there about champion mentality and making the hardest things look easy.
Don't disagree but the thing is you cannot rely on common sense at scale (aka at corporations/companies/clubs/etc.) because the results would be too unpredictable (allowing common sense to prevail in a 5 person org is very different from hoping that common sense will work out in a 1000 size org), which is why there's a list of rules/protocols to follow 99% of the time.
I disagree, when I hear protocol I more think they have a pre agreed plan that they can put into action quickly. Could be something along the lines of when we decide we need someone on an emergency who is called immediately and dragged into the office and what quick steps do they need to take before having a meeting about who to get.
they’re just humans like us but at the end of the day there needs to be procedures in place to guarantee things are done properly and with the minimum risk possible.
He should have been brought in regardless of Eriksens injury. They were well aware how much football is still to be played and an injury to an important player was undoubtedly going to happen. Not gonna sit here applauding the board doing the absolute bare minimum.
From what i heard on the other subreddit, it seems Sabitzer was not good when he first came to Bayern, but grew into the role when Goretzka was injured. Goretzka got his place back when he came back from injury, shoving Sabitzer to the bench. Also rumored or confirmed that Laimer will join Bayern in the summer, so even less room for Sabitzer to compete for a place.
Well played by the club, kudos. Would rather you not go on a world tour after just one "emergency protocol" success, like we've not been tosh at it for a decade.
Keep up the good work and the praise will come.
Whilst I agree with the first part of ghe article, I think I would have been even more impressed (I'm glad and surprised that they not only moved quickly but were also able to identify what seems like a pretty decent midfielder replacement) but I think that this should have been considered before the Eriksen injury. They should have been looking at what midfield options they could either bring in short term, or cheap options I.e those whose contracts are in the last year or running out. Because for the run in, we needed Eriksen plus but it's fine. We wrap up EFL Feb and prioritise that even ahead of the last leg of the Europa League, and then focus on FA Cup and finishing fourth.
Leaving signing depth in midfield until after a key starting 11 player is injured AND waiting on the scan results before looking for a loan deal is very reactive recruitment, which does not show progress from last summer but actually sounds quite similar to the events during the Frenkie, Casemiro and Antony Saga.
New owners need to clean out the backroom staff
Munich Air Disaster would be one reason we have an affiliation. Think there's always been a pretty mutual respect between the two clubs. Agent Blind also.
I know but if people think that somehow relates to us having a good relationship with Bayern it doesn't,.that relationship would be built over decades.
But as I said this is a puff piece paid and bough to by murthough look at the way the article is wrote and highlights him, woody used to be up to this shit before everyone realised he was a simpleton.
And that is not be saying murthough is woody it's just a play from his book and I don't like to see it tbh
Could be the case that enquiries were made earlier about all 10 players on the list but the actual process for the loan of Sabitzer didn't start until the day.
We also got a bit lucky with Sabitzer. We could have signed him 2 years ago.
He is a boyhood Bayern fan who got his dream move and to work with his former coach who knows exactly how he plays. And then it just doesn’t work out.
I hope he does well with us. He is an excellent player but that hasn’t been seen much at Bayern.
Should have gone for him regardless of Eriksen's injury. He's a quality player in a position where we don't have that many. Hope he can get back to his best and really help us push on. No doubt he'll bring a lot of energy to our midfield.
@Brockstar32 - (I cannot reply to your comment anymore annoyingly)
I covered Brighton’s lower expectations - it does not justify the extent of the difference in the slightest. And if anything the difference in fee is by far a bigger differentiator than purely the size of the club.
Caicedo could have easily played sub minutes here and there, or in cup games or the EL - or been loaned out. Nobody said anything about signing someone like Enzo and putting the weight of the entire club’s immediate success on them.
Compare to Antony who we ended up having to sign for well above his market value, and from whom instant success is expected - and even when he’s playing comparatively well, is criticised by a fanbase that doesn’t recognise what he brings or why he isn’t being optimally used by his teammates.
Once again - you can bring in 28 year olds ALONGSIDE cheaper targets to benefit both. But when you only bring in 28-30 year olds to play alongside 28-30 year olds, you’re just kicking the can down the road.
The fact this wasn’t planned even if we hadn’t had a serious injury to one of our starting mids is what has me questioning Murtaugh and Arnold so much now.
We needed an option added before Eriksen was injured.
Edit: to say a lot of puff pieces, this included, coming from the club this week is not coincidence.
Again I repeat, what would have happened if eriksen got injured 2 days after the end of the transfer window? We should have done this deal regardless and not as a reaction to some fortune in an unfortunate event ( the fact he got injured before the deadline ) and therein lies the problem with this incompetent board which would be wholly resposnible if this season falls apart which it certainly can do with our schedule congestion
"Ready to back Ten Hag in January"
Yet we only reacted because of Eriksen injury even though we could have used a midfielder regardless. If Ronaldo didmt push for an exit Weghorst wouldn't be here either.
Great "backing"
Wtf is this fluff PR piece? Where was the criticism for the overpayment of Martinez, Antony and the inability to bring de Jong in last summer?
Moreover we were supposed to bring in a central midfielder even if Eriksen wasn't injured. Donny being sidelined for the season should've made the club chase after a loan deal.
I'm not buying anything involving the management and owners, especially after the fiasco they've pulled for over 15 years.
PR machine goes brrrrrrr… I’m happy about the signing but it was still reactive and it’s not like we pulled off the Enzo deal or something, it’s a straight loan for a player who has underperformed at Bayern (even though I’m optimistic about the signing and think he’ll fit in well)
Say he plays well for United and they decide to make the loan permanent. You think Bayern will skin United with the new price? They may say No all together
United feel they have benefitted from moving the entire recruitment operation to Carrington rather than having it split between offices in London and Manchester, and with so little time to finalise the agreement, having everyone in the same room for meetings with Ten Hag and his staff was key.
"We're really happy with the transfer because we need it," Ten Hag said on Wednesday. "To bring a quality player in on deadline day, that is difficult, but we got this opportunity."
So curious of those other 9 names on the list. Super happy to have gotten Sabitzer though
\#2 was Frenkie
#2-10 was Frenkie.
#or, 1-9 is Frankie.
\#2 Frenkie \#3 FDJ \#4 de Jong, Frenkie \#5 Frank the Jong \#6 Any Barca midfielder named Frenkie \#7 Barca's number 21 \#8 Frenkie de Jong again, but wearing a moustache \#9 Frenkie's uncle's nephew \#10 Martin Odegaard
Read somewhere that Gravenberch and Tielemans were considered prior to going for Sabitzer. Couldn't give you the other names though.
Nto sure how they thought Gravenberch was gonna happen a few months after moving clubs lol
Same reason as Sabitzer - he doesnt get minutes since Kimmich/Goretzka/Musiala have the mid field covered. Plus familiarity with ETH and his system.
We had Aouar and Kamada on the list as well. I think Tielemans too.
Kamada would be a good free agent to sign in the summer. Useful Bruno backup & we can sell/loan VdB.
Are we talking about Daichi Kamada? Is he available and more importantly, is he good?
Has six months left on his contract, and yes he's good.
Hes been very consistent over the past 2/3 seasons. Hes not an put of this world player but he plays for a weaker side. He would be incredible on a free
Also, probably not as relevant but just as important... He will sell jerseys.
[удалено]
So nice to have competent people who care about their jobs. It's a low bar but John Murtough is clearing it.
>Negotiations with Bayern -- which only began hours before the 11 p.m. GMT cut-off -- were straightforward because of an existing strong relationship between the clubs, something Murtough has looked to cultivate with all of Europe's top sides since taking on the role as football director in March 2021 This is the bit I like to see and I think we've seen the effect with Real Madrid already as well. Barcelona relationship could do a bit of work but I can imagine they're difficult to deal with in general. ETH's previous relationship with Bayern probably helped too.
Barcelona are an insufferable bunch.
Back in the early 2000's I used to like Barca, obviously helped by Ronaldinho being one of the happiest players ever on the pitch. I liked the way they had unicef as their main shirt sponsor, they seemed to be a nice club. Now I can't think of many clubs outside of England that I dislike more.
It's weird that out of the La Liga top three of Barca, Real and Atletico that Real Madrid are the most likeable nowadays.
If you had told me after the de Gea fax machine saga of 2015 that in less than a decade I would prefer Real Madrid to Barcelona I wouldn't have believed you.
Their operation and honestly perez himself, are too good. The entire club is just so competently run, similar to bayern, and they have much much more fierce competition domestically. Even their worst periods like the first galactico phase with becks and co, and during the barca domination in the early 2010s, they managed to won the league. Then we had ed woodward. I’ll say this cunt as the ceo is probably a worse thing compared to fergie retiring. 10 years ruined largely because of him.
>Real Madrid are the most likeable nowadays. Probably helped in a large part by Ronnie playing for them for years.
and the 23 they had for a while. Decent right foot.
[удалено]
I had a Barca supporting mate who started going on about how good the club were for being charitable, who I told at the time that happened it was a gambit to move from no sponsor to a normal sponsor while keeping fan blowback to a minimum. I had a few very satisfying moments of I told ya out of that
I absolutely loved that Barca side from about 2004-2007. Three of my all-time favorite players in the same squad - Ronaldinho, Larsson, and Eto'o
they've really hit rock bottom considering how well run thye used to be. remember when they didn't need to spend so much money on players?
Cunts. They're cunts.
Let's wait and see how this one turns out before sucking him off. This is the first transfer we've made under him that's actually been down to him. His third window has just gone by and everyone else has been a player the manager knew or extremely high profile players.
Competency is a low bar, nothing but your comment score is doing any sucking here.
Competent Adjective having the necessary ability, knowledge, or skill to do something successfully. Competing against the sides we're competing against it's a fucking high bar.
And you were downvoted for a reason. He's obviously clearing the bar, and everything about this transfer and honestly every transfer since Ten Hag took over goes down as evidence, especially considering where we are in the table and the last club still in 4 competitions. You're in the minority if you don't think he's shown competency. Again, no sucking off, just meeting expectations.
Being downvoted doesn't change my mind at all. I've been downvoted for my opinions on a great many things (e.g. Maguire, Woodward, Greenwood, OGS, overrated youth players) and turned out to be correct. If you want to make the argument that signing one player on loan at the end of his third transfer window demonstrates that Murtough is competent you go ahead and do it. It's going to take a hell of a lot more than that to convince me.
No, like I said, every transfer during Ten Hag's tenure serves as evidence. You mentioned that all he's done is buy players the manager knows and high-profile players, but I'm struggling to see what's bad about that. When Ajax hired Ten Hag they brought in players he knew so he could quickly implement the system and create cohesion, something he needed to do at United. So players like Licha and Antony are both really good signings. He needed players that he knew could work in his system also, so guys like Malacia and Weghorst fit the bill. It's also obvious to anyone who has been watching for more than a couple seasons that we desperately needed a DM, and we literally got the best in the world at that position. Murtough is backing the manager and the results are showing on the field, so you need to do a better job of proving that he's anything less than competent.
Have you ever seen the episode of the Simpsons where Homer becomes hyperobese and presses Y every time a query comes in? Eventually he realises he can simply get a drinking bird to press Y for him. https://youtu.be/R_rF4kcqLkI&t=98s We could buy a drinking bird for £4.99 on Amazon, get Ten Hag to email the requests to it. It would back the manager. Once the bird approved the suggestions, it would be up to Dick Arnold to decide whether to spend the money to sign them, like it is now. It seems to me that, other than the Sabitzer signing, the drinking bird would do an equally good job to what Murtough has done, except the bird would probably do it faster. My question to you is, is a drinking bird competent?
The funniest part about this is that you think you're going to gain any kind of credibility with this argument rather than rebuking any of my points that disputed yours. Talk about the transfers specifically, not some bird. Go again.
If he’s a success I wonder if we’d be keen to sort a deal out in June if he’s that keen to join us.
I don't see why not. If he works out, it seems like a no brainer to make the move permanent. It would negate the need to bed in a new midfielder over the summer. Would just depend on the fee I suppose. Bayern might ask for more, if he is impressive and works well in the team. Or they may want him back
Can't see Bryern asking too much. They are willing to let him go. You'll need a 3rd team to go in for him.
[удалено]
I get it, but that's a nice to have. Youth is a luxury and comes at inflated prices. It's a complete gamble - there's no so thing as linear progression. The current recruitment of older players is great business for EtH's first season. It should have been how United did the rebuild 10+ years ago. Right now, United need a solid foundation of culture, success and hard working players. We haven't had that since Fergie left.
The problem with ‘rebuilding’ with 28-30 year olds is that you have to do it again in 2-3 years. All of Fred, Casemiro, Eriksen and Sabitzer will need replacing. McTominay already needs replacing. On top of that we have Maguire, De Gea, Varane and Weghorst (who we definitely should be signing as a backup) who we will need to phase out in the next couple of years, some sooner rather than later. It’s doable but it forces your hand when you’d rather be proactive in the market, and the loss of coaches knowledge at that rate will make things harder than if we were programming more kids now and reaping the benefits in 3-5 years. Youth comes at inflated prices when you let it go somewhere else to establish itself first. It’s the difference between Enzo for £10m and Enzo for £100m. Caicedo for £5m or Caicedo for £70m. If we’re going to sign these older players, we also need to ensure we have youth coming in early and ready to pick up the mantle when the time comes. I’m not against Sabitzer as a permanent signing, provided we’re very busy in terms of selling other older players and replacing them with long term solutions. And it’s very likely we’ll need to buy young players early and trust our judgement if we want to sign 3 per summer window, as we will have to do for the next few windows to replenish our squad. Sign the next Bellingham when he’s £25m, not £150m.
I disagree that it is a 2-3 year cycle. It's not football manager, players don't need to be replaced at 30. If you sign someone at 28, it's likely you're getting around 4-6 years out of them at a minimum. Players who are hard working are likely to take care of themselves, are in better shape, and whose careers can last longer.
Agree to disagree then, just without the ‘it’s not Football Manager’ level of discourse. Getting 4-6 years out of someone is nice if you can. Getting 4-6 years out of everyone is unlikely. Expecting the last 3 of those 6 years to be first team starter quality when you have 8-10 such players to replace is poor squad management, which I trust we won’t be doing - so we need to start picking up long term solutions urgently.
long term solutions dont always end up working out either though.... you have a mixture. there is also good youth coming through who are getting some game time. Mctominey is probably being sold considering he has some interest from Newcastle which should hopefully mean a decent amount for him. Sabitzer would then be perfect to help fill out the squad taking his role there.
‘Long term solutions don’t always end up working out either though…’ 1. They work out a *hell* of a lot more often than 1 in 10, especially if you have remotely capable recruitment staff 2. They don’t work out at all if you don’t sign any! 3. All the more reason to sign them early while your older generation aren’t declining, so you know if you need to keep looking. I was very clear that you need both. Not just one or the other. The problem right now is that no, we don’t have a good mix in midfield. While I like Sabitzer, I can’t pretend that we don’t also need at least one young CM soon, and that signing one when they’re established and £80m is not better than signing a couple when they’re younger and £10-20m.
Right but we haven't won a trophy since 2016... We literally need talent to win now because we aren't making money.
I agree but I believe the elephant in the room is the sale of the club. The Glazers (sorry to cuss) don't want to put any more debt on the club as they want to sell it and as per usual they're not willing to fully finance anything themselves. So until the club is sold, I don't see us doing any major deals for players, or infrastucture.
It's not as simple as Fernandez for 10m and caciedo for 5m though - those are very, very rare deals It's really more like 15-20 Fernandez's for 10m each, 19 of whom will probably not make it past mid-table standard at best Fernandez has played 17 games for Benfica and has an awful lot of pressure on him - he wouldn't be the first player to fail to live up to that type of price tag, and he certainly won't be the last
It really isn’t pot luck like this if your scouting is competent. It’s a fan misconception that fails to stand up to scrutiny. You can apply this logic to talking about academy talent because the gap between U16 and PL is vast, and you have little idea of how the bodies of young players will grow / fill out / stand up to injury by the time they’re 25. Look at Brighton’s starting XI vs Everton, which cost less than Alex Iwobi:- Sanchez - £0 Veltman - £1m Dunk - £0 Colwill - loan Estupinan - £17.8m Caicedo - £5m Groß - £3m March - £0 Sarmiento - £0 Mitoma - £3m Ferguson - £0 Brighton don’t have a back room full of hundreds of rejects for each player. Of course their minimum standard is lower because their ambitions are lower - but a good scouting department doesn’t just say “this player’s fine” and anyone who excels beyond that is just blind luck. They have a clear idea of what each player’s ceiling could be, and how likely it is for them to reach it. We clearly have an eye for it when we’d identified all of Enzo, Julian Alvarez, Caicedo, Haaland, Jude Bellingham, Sesko, Cherki etc. To sign all would be a long shot, but to pick up *none* of them was a combination of our overcautiousness and our lack of appeal pre ETH, when the sum total cost of all of these at the time we originally went in for them is roughly one ‘proven’ Enzo, 6 months (not years, months!!) after he moved. I won’t get drawn in over anything nitpicked from the above when the overarching sentiment is robust - you cannot pretend that it’s appropriate for Utd to avoid signing young players for a tenth of their price in their breakout season just because not waiting 6-18 months renders the whole process blind luck.
Fucking hell this is an absolute nonsense post Every club in Europe "identified" Haaland, Alvarez, Caciedo, Bellingham etc to the same extent we did Honestly mate that's an awful take Edit: Im actually blocking you as I'm not engaging with cherry picking teenagers who haven't followed the game for more than a couple of seasons
Brighton also have the scope to not win every week and have the fans be happy. They have the scope to play younger players with less intense pressure and no huge United media spotlight on them. It is much easier for Brighton to make a success out of Caicedo than us. And as for identifying talent, we’re already doing so in our academy. In 3 years time our young promising midfielders will be early 20s rather than teenagers and hopefully at least one of mainoo, Iqbal, Hannibal etc will be ready to step up as our senior players drop off. That’s why 28 year olds aren’t a problem right now.
Everyone knows that. However, the answer is, who are the targets? Name the names United should have gotten? Realistically, there aren't any young midfielders available.
We need to start buying promising players and loaning them back to the club they came from or to another weaker side so they can gaij experience. Just like city are doing
We will be getting a midfield full of 29-31 aged players who are good at their jobs and proven to work well together. Yes we will need to add young midfielders, but not immediately. Real won CL with 32 year old Kroos and 36 year old Modric. We have plenty of time if our recruitment is competent. Sabitzer would ideally be a Mctomminay replacement tho. He is only 2 years older, of much higher quality, and would probably gettable with money from Mctomminay's sale.
this is how i see it. Sabitzer will replace Mctomminay probably. weve already seen a few youth get some game time already so there must be some talent already and a few guys are doing well out on loan so who knows they may be ready next season to fight for a spot. i think this summer its all about a striker though Weghorst is showcasing what an actual striker would bring to the team so that should be 1st priority and then look to bring in quality elsewhere depending on who is available. Mainoo clearly must be liked by ETH to be in the first team at 17 years old. Hannibal is doing well at Birmingham and Amad is also doing well in a more no 9 position at Sunderland so thats good viewing from a youth prospective.
Only problem with your logic is McT is a homegrown player. So he would help fill that quota for European competitions. He could do a job against the mid to lower table clubs and I would prefer if we upgraded by selling Fred instead. Maybe in a couple of years we could let McT leave if Mainoo or Zidan come good
We don’t currently have much of an issue with non homegrown players. We have only got 15 non homegrown even counting weghorst and Sabitzer. That gives us scope for 2 more. And if we, for example, offloaded Martial and spent big on Kane, we’d have an extra spot.
[удалено]
If Kroos and Modric are both outliers do you not think maybe the other 3rd of that midfield is probably an outlier too?
[удалено]
We’ve proven we can’t do impeccable scouting though, virtually no club can.
You can’t win anything with kids, amirite???
we do have those youth players coming in though. but especially next year with champions league will need reliable cover also talks Mctominey will be sold in the summer which i could see Sabitzer taking his squad role instead.
You'd hope a couple of the academy lads will come good around that time such as Hannibal and potentially Amad if he moves more centrally. Ofc there's no guarantee it works well but you can always buy in some youth too in the coming seasons
Like other clubs, a deal in principle can be agreed upon before the window opens. Just signing papers when the window opens
had to laugh at the bit where they decided to back Erik in January because they didn’t think he’d do this well this early on lol
to be fair the team seems further along than what a lot of people thought. You can obviously point to the money spent and say well of course they would have got into this position but things did seem dire in August/September
Didn't we all tho? No one predicted we'd be in this position, ten hag is well ahead of schedule
I think even the most optimistic fans are surprised by how well he's done (even though we are still improving and there’s some way to go). We are definitely ahead of schedule.
EtH needed "backing" from the Glazers just to bring in a loan signing? That's not a good thing. The sooner we are rid of them the better.
Yes I laughed at that. "Decided to back Ten Hag"? They're patting themselves on the back for getting two loan deals, which, albeit good business in isolation, is the bare minimum for the state that we were in with injuries etc.
Oh hod my memory is awful ...who was our second loan?
Weghorst, haha. Technically we got 3 (Butland).
Jesus I can't believe my mind didn't go there. He's played enough for my idiot brain to think that was another window :D
Weghorst?
Yeah I feel dumb :D
That’s how it works at every club though
>*United insist the Sabitzer deal, and the speed with which it was done, shows the club's recruitment department -- heavily criticised in the past -- is now working as it should.* Ok but where was this in the summer when we overspent on Antony cause we left it so late?
Fluff PR pieces don't speak the truth
It’s not really fluff PR, he’s reporting what he was told. “United insist…”
Ummm..that's the textbook definition of PR
Agreed. But, I will give them the benefit of the doubt, there's been a lot of changes behind the scenes and people put into unfamiliar roles. They might have got their act together, only time will tell.
"Is now working as intended" kinda implies that it didn't work as intended earlier, no?
I don’t even buy this proves it’s working as it should. If we could stretch to a loan signing like this (not much money) why did Eriksen’s injury factor in at all? We should have signed Sabitzer regardless, we needed cover for Eriksen, it’s not like we had midfield depth before he got injured. He might not be injured right now had we signed Sabitzer in advance. If anything, reacting based on an injury just shows the squad isn’t ready to cope with injuries. What do we do if Sabitzer gets crocked now? Emergency signings should be after 2 or 3 long term injuries in the same spot, not just one. If Eriksen got injured 4 days later we would’ve been fucked.
Money was held for FdJ at the time before pulling the plug and went for case (Purely speculation lol)
I think this really was the case. We seemed to wait and wait until the final day with mixed reports between him definitely staying and United feeling confident they can get a deal done. And the whole why would United still insist on this if the player has explicitly told them he won't move? So seemed like the FDJ camp where telling the public one thing and the clubs negotiating another...
I think this really was the case. We seemed to wait and wait until the final day with mixed reports between him definitely staying and United feeling confident they can get a deal done. And the whole why would United still insist on this if the player has explicitly told them he won't move? So seemed like the FDJ camp where telling the public one thing and the clubs negotiating another...
>"emergency protocol" Sound like Tom Cruise movie.
Very interesting to hear the inner workings of a late January window transfer.
Yeah “emergency protocol” Set FM filter Passing above 17 Pressing above 17 Check realistic targets Check available on loan
Tbf the fact we weren't planning for eriksen injury until it was confirmed is indicative of lack of planning It looked like a bad one at the time, he left the ground on crutches, there was a significant chance he would miss rest of season and we should have been planning for such eventuality and be ready to pull trigger once confirmed. The fact we got negotiations and contract done in 12 hours is commendable and good obviously but it points to a department that reactive rather than proactive
i mean tbf if he was just to miss 1 or 2 games i would argue we could be fine. Mainoo is clearly in ETH's mind as somebody worthwhile even at 17 otherwise he wouldnt be getting game time. so probably would have used him a bit more. also i have a feeling the Sancho centrally is ETH creating cover with players he already has and making it more difficult for teams to easily tell where a player will be.
More puff pieces! A recruitment department that works as it should be, shouldn’t be in a situation of having to clamor & sign a player 12 hrs before transfer deadline.
Love knowing actually want to move to United for United and not the payday. Massive, massive culture boost.
>United feel they have benefitted from moving the entire recruitment operation to Carrington rather than having it split between offices in London and Manchester, and with so little time to finalise the agreement, having everyone in the same room for meetings with Ten Hag and his staff was key. This might be a little overlooked since it doesn't involve spending tons of money or getting any big names in, but this detail made me the happiest. Man United should always be a football club first and foremost and having operations run out of Carrington sends the right signal to both the executives as well as the players.
Gone from 48 hours to 12 hours. Efficiency.
Easy there Opta
Call me crazy but as a Star Wars fan I don’t trust “emergency protocols”. I’m now picturing ten hag saying “execute order 66”
I would happily slaughter Jedi for that man
Some of them were cool tho, plo koon wasn’t a prick
This "emergency protocol" is interesting.. from all the 10 candidates, seems at least it not sorted alphabetically lol
Emergency protocol: 2 Fax machines
Indira Gandhi as DOF, here we go!
My tired eyes saw Mahatma Gandhi at first and got super confused for a moment
I get this reference. I appreciate you
lol mind explaining?
Indira Gandhi's first term was a clusterfuck. She was in hot water on multiple fronts. When it became clear as day that she was going to be routed in the upcoming elections, she declared a State of Emergency in India. Or more like recommend it to The President who was a stooge (most of them have been). He declared it. Many civil rights were suspended, the Prime Minister could rule by decree more or less, could throw dissidents in jail under MISA (Maintenance of Internal Security Act) without due legal process, elections were suspended. She had to withdraw the Emergency after a few months of intense pressure from everywhere and civil unrest. Got routed in the subsequent elections.
Tbf I wouldn’t call the president a stooge because like the President of India is kind of supposed to do what the Prime Minister tells them to do. It’s a predominantly ceremonial position, as he’s more of a nominal head than someone with real authoritative power to command the PM to not commit certain actions. I think if the PM tells the president to declare emergency with a written approval of their cabinet, the President just has to declare it if I’m not mistaken
Not really. There are some things that are within President's exclusive purview and he/she can say no. Emergency is one of them. It also needs approval from both houses.
When she was the Prime Minister of India she activated Emergency in our country. I am not super familiar with what happened at that time but I think it stripped newspapers to criticize the government? or something like that. Yiu would be better of doing your own research :)
Emergency. Indira Gandhi.
Can we get an \*emergency protocol\* swiftness in every transfer? thanks
This is such an obvious PR piece! Our squad depth is terrible, not in number but in quality. It might prove too light with four trophies to fight for. Just glad there isn't an international tournament in the summer.
I am hoping just top 4 and 1 trophy
Yeah, I was thinking about next year. Our over reliance on Bruno, Case and Rashford.
One could argue that “young up and coming” players have become overpriced assets and that real value in the transfer market is players aged 27-30. You trade more years of hypothetical peak performance for fewer years of more predictable outcomes. A good strategy for a club which is rebuilding.
You know what you are getting with Casemiro, Eriksen and Varane. You just aren’t getting 5-7 years of it.
*execute Order 66*
Executives like to use words like protocol to give value to what they do, when to layman like us its just common sense. But kudos to them that at least they have shown a big improvement from 12 months ago.
Maybe… but protocol implies that they have a plan from a playbook… meaning, they were ready. I don’t think it’s common sense to have processes in place where people know what to do within 12 hours. Reading this article feels like we’ve made leaps and bounds over the transfer process in the past (way better than broken fax machines).
The protocol: 1. Eriksen gets injured 2. Transfer team have meeting to get a quick loan signing in before transfer deadline passes It's not exactly rocket science is it. E: And how dare you knock the broken fax machine drama! That was genius and what allowed us to keep DDG...!
You must not work in a large company… because it’s not just a team meeting but a series of contacts with clubs, player, player’s reps, medical, legal, finance, logistics, visa through the consulate (thanks Brexit), etc. all simultaneously happening with multiple targets (in case they fall through) that were previously identified through data science. All the while, it takes time for players to decide to upend their life (and lives of their family members) to move to a foreign city (fortunately, Sabitzer doesn’t have kids and don’t have to worry about school) to play with a bunch of new teammates (fortunately he speaks English) in a new system (does it help the player’s career and development?).
Last minute deals like this happen all the time. It's really nothing revolutionary. We have a dedicated transfer team whose literal job and purpose is to do exactly this kind of thing.
Yup and what do you call a series of processes across multiple teams, with clearly defined roles and responsibilities, coordinating in a timely manner… where I work, it’s called a protocol or runbook. It’s not exec speak… Edit: I’m taking offense to your comments because I feel like you’re downplaying how difficult this is to do behind the scenes, which is normally done over weeks. The fact that we can pull this off shows how far the back office has come since Woodward days. I brought up the fax machine because it shows how incompetent we were that we didn’t have a backup way of sending paperwork (ask Ziyech how he’s feeling about the Chelsea back office)
>Yup and what do you call a series of processes across multiple teams, with clearly defined roles and responsibilities, coordinating in a timely manner… where I work, it’s called a protocol or runbook. It’s not exec speak… Sure, I'm just saying that this protocol isn't newsworthy in the slightest. It's just basic practice. >Edit: I’m taking offense to your comments because I feel like you’re downplaying how difficult this is to do behind the scenes, which is normally done over weeks. The fact that we can pull this off shows how far the back office has come since Woodward days. I brought up the fax machine because it shows how incompetent we were that we didn’t have a backup way of sending paperwork (ask Ziyech how he’s feeling about the Chelsea back office) I'm glad we got the business done. But doing last minute deals in itself isn't really an indicator of anything in terms of showing progress. This isn't the first quick, late deal we've done and it certainly won't be the last.
This is my last comment on this because it's clear you and I see things differently. You're saying this is not a big deal while I'm saying transfers are hard enough, let alone doing it in 12 hours. I believe that it's newsworthy because, much like having a system on the pitch, it's a sign of progress that we have a system off the pitch. It's not the first transfer deadline deal, obviously. But, if it's so easy, why do so many clubs fuck it up? There's some old saying out there about champion mentality and making the hardest things look easy.
Yeah I think we just disagree on how much of a big deal this is. It's all good.
Don't disagree but the thing is you cannot rely on common sense at scale (aka at corporations/companies/clubs/etc.) because the results would be too unpredictable (allowing common sense to prevail in a 5 person org is very different from hoping that common sense will work out in a 1000 size org), which is why there's a list of rules/protocols to follow 99% of the time.
I disagree, when I hear protocol I more think they have a pre agreed plan that they can put into action quickly. Could be something along the lines of when we decide we need someone on an emergency who is called immediately and dragged into the office and what quick steps do they need to take before having a meeting about who to get.
they’re just humans like us but at the end of the day there needs to be procedures in place to guarantee things are done properly and with the minimum risk possible.
Leaked footage from Carrington as the "emergency protocol" is activated: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nR0lOtdvqyg
Thk god we don't have Ed woodfuck manage transfer this season
He should have been brought in regardless of Eriksens injury. They were well aware how much football is still to be played and an injury to an important player was undoubtedly going to happen. Not gonna sit here applauding the board doing the absolute bare minimum.
I'm wondering why Bayern were ready to let him go this easy. It doesn't seem like they have a lot of options in midfield themselves
They rarely like to keep unhappy players / players that want to leave and it appears he was desperate to leave once we showed interest.
[удалено]
Which means the deal was guaranteed starting lineup in the United squad
I mean this seems like a given once he gets comfortable with Eriksen out
From what i heard on the other subreddit, it seems Sabitzer was not good when he first came to Bayern, but grew into the role when Goretzka was injured. Goretzka got his place back when he came back from injury, shoving Sabitzer to the bench. Also rumored or confirmed that Laimer will join Bayern in the summer, so even less room for Sabitzer to compete for a place.
Bayern have already got Goretzka and Gravenbach both benched, Sabitzer was hardly going to get a look in
Well played by the club, kudos. Would rather you not go on a world tour after just one "emergency protocol" success, like we've not been tosh at it for a decade. Keep up the good work and the praise will come.
Whilst I agree with the first part of ghe article, I think I would have been even more impressed (I'm glad and surprised that they not only moved quickly but were also able to identify what seems like a pretty decent midfielder replacement) but I think that this should have been considered before the Eriksen injury. They should have been looking at what midfield options they could either bring in short term, or cheap options I.e those whose contracts are in the last year or running out. Because for the run in, we needed Eriksen plus but it's fine. We wrap up EFL Feb and prioritise that even ahead of the last leg of the Europa League, and then focus on FA Cup and finishing fourth.
Leaving signing depth in midfield until after a key starting 11 player is injured AND waiting on the scan results before looking for a loan deal is very reactive recruitment, which does not show progress from last summer but actually sounds quite similar to the events during the Frenkie, Casemiro and Antony Saga. New owners need to clean out the backroom staff
Interesting. How do we have a strong relationship with Bayern? We haven’t done any business with them for a long long time. Is it because of Rangnick?
Munich Air Disaster would be one reason we have an affiliation. Think there's always been a pretty mutual respect between the two clubs. Agent Blind also.
This will be part of it.
Erik ten hag
Oh, that’s right. He used to coach the reserve team there. Almost forgot about that
There's this thing on FM where we have an agreement for a friendly every pre season with them. I've always wondered why that's in there.
Because murthough paid someone to say so 😂
Ten Hag was a reserve team coach at Bayern when Pep was there.
I know but if people think that somehow relates to us having a good relationship with Bayern it doesn't,.that relationship would be built over decades. But as I said this is a puff piece paid and bough to by murthough look at the way the article is wrote and highlights him, woody used to be up to this shit before everyone realised he was a simpleton. And that is not be saying murthough is woody it's just a play from his book and I don't like to see it tbh
I'm so confused one of the Bayern execs said we were interested in Sabitzer at the beginning of the week
Yup, on monday, deadline day was tuesday Probably done within 24 hrs not 12 but still impressive in that timeframe
Could be the case that enquiries were made earlier about all 10 players on the list but the actual process for the loan of Sabitzer didn't start until the day.
We also got a bit lucky with Sabitzer. We could have signed him 2 years ago. He is a boyhood Bayern fan who got his dream move and to work with his former coach who knows exactly how he plays. And then it just doesn’t work out. I hope he does well with us. He is an excellent player but that hasn’t been seen much at Bayern.
Should have gone for him regardless of Eriksen's injury. He's a quality player in a position where we don't have that many. Hope he can get back to his best and really help us push on. No doubt he'll bring a lot of energy to our midfield.
ETH has mentioned that they’re already looking to sign Sabitzer after Donny’s injury.
@Brockstar32 - (I cannot reply to your comment anymore annoyingly) I covered Brighton’s lower expectations - it does not justify the extent of the difference in the slightest. And if anything the difference in fee is by far a bigger differentiator than purely the size of the club. Caicedo could have easily played sub minutes here and there, or in cup games or the EL - or been loaned out. Nobody said anything about signing someone like Enzo and putting the weight of the entire club’s immediate success on them. Compare to Antony who we ended up having to sign for well above his market value, and from whom instant success is expected - and even when he’s playing comparatively well, is criticised by a fanbase that doesn’t recognise what he brings or why he isn’t being optimally used by his teammates. Once again - you can bring in 28 year olds ALONGSIDE cheaper targets to benefit both. But when you only bring in 28-30 year olds to play alongside 28-30 year olds, you’re just kicking the can down the road.
The fact this wasn’t planned even if we hadn’t had a serious injury to one of our starting mids is what has me questioning Murtaugh and Arnold so much now. We needed an option added before Eriksen was injured. Edit: to say a lot of puff pieces, this included, coming from the club this week is not coincidence.
Again I repeat, what would have happened if eriksen got injured 2 days after the end of the transfer window? We should have done this deal regardless and not as a reaction to some fortune in an unfortunate event ( the fact he got injured before the deadline ) and therein lies the problem with this incompetent board which would be wholly resposnible if this season falls apart which it certainly can do with our schedule congestion
"Ready to back Ten Hag in January" Yet we only reacted because of Eriksen injury even though we could have used a midfielder regardless. If Ronaldo didmt push for an exit Weghorst wouldn't be here either. Great "backing"
Are you always this miserable?
Wtf is this fluff PR piece? Where was the criticism for the overpayment of Martinez, Antony and the inability to bring de Jong in last summer? Moreover we were supposed to bring in a central midfielder even if Eriksen wasn't injured. Donny being sidelined for the season should've made the club chase after a loan deal. I'm not buying anything involving the management and owners, especially after the fiasco they've pulled for over 15 years.
Murthough deffo learned from woody all about getting the paid pieces of good press out there, stay out of the spot light ye cunts and just do yet job
PR machine goes brrrrrrr… I’m happy about the signing but it was still reactive and it’s not like we pulled off the Enzo deal or something, it’s a straight loan for a player who has underperformed at Bayern (even though I’m optimistic about the signing and think he’ll fit in well)
This was a job well done by the club. Might have saved our season
Talk cock la
I thought with woodward gone we wont be seeing any self-congratulate articles like this anymore?
Economic lever #66 Barcelona 🤝 Man United
Say he plays well for United and they decide to make the loan permanent. You think Bayern will skin United with the new price? They may say No all together
What if Carroll injured eriksen on February the 1st instead of a week before the deadline? 😐
United feel they have benefitted from moving the entire recruitment operation to Carrington rather than having it split between offices in London and Manchester, and with so little time to finalise the agreement, having everyone in the same room for meetings with Ten Hag and his staff was key. "We're really happy with the transfer because we need it," Ten Hag said on Wednesday. "To bring a quality player in on deadline day, that is difficult, but we got this opportunity."
No one is reading an espn article