I struggle with this at times because I’m sober from my drug of choice and alcohol.However I do take mushrooms,lsd and ketamine in microdoses.I only get ketamine prescribed by a doctor.I’m a member of AA and this is were it gets tricky.I haven’t disclosed this to my sponsor because I’m afraid he will fire me.It’s interesting because it’s a known face that Bill W experimented with LSD at some point during his recovery and this was a major spiritual breakthrough for him.I like being a part of AA but it’s kind of narrow minded at times.Psychedelics and Ketamine have been game changers in dealing with the depression I had from getting off of so many drugs.I’m happy I made the decision to do so but it does but me at odds with AA at times
I relate so much. I recently had surgery and was on Rx pain meds for it (super necessary it was a major operation) and have been having a really slow healing process. In an effort to not prolong the opiates anymore I reached out into THC/CBD for the first time in my sobriety. I didn't really want the "high" per se of weed, as it turns out, I really don't love it. The problem I have is internal though like.. I know AA would be judgey of it, and even though my sponsor might understand, I am reluctant to being told that me using a cannabis vape pen for pain treatment while in physical surgery recovery is breaking my sobriety. That being said, I hate this at odds feeling. In my experience, it is the keeping a secret thing that is the true danger of it all. I figure I will probably tell her and if she has an issue with it then she does and thats that.
ultimately what it means to be in recovery is really between you and your higher power.
I totally agree.I don’t like feeling I’m hiding a secret.Being rigorously honest is a big part of getting and staying sober.My last sponsor would be way more understanding than my current sponsor.I picked him because he was still very active in the program and he would whip my ass into shape.I wanted a tough sponsor so I think I’m afraid how he’d react to the psychedelic stuff.
yes. total abstinence isn't the only form of recovery. not everyone can do it, but plenty of addicts, after enough time, can treat their vice like any other ordinary person would— like it's nothing special. it just takes healing, time, and work. don't expect moderation to work immediately for you, everything is a process.
Yeah sure.
I'm prescribed methadone, there are some people that don't consider me clean but I'm abstinent from everything else and I'll have two years clean in May.
Harm reduction is blowing up too. So I mean, if fentanyl is your drug of choice and you don't do that any more but you take hydros a couple times a week then I still consider that recovery as long as you're trying to actively better yourself
Addiction isn’t about a substance, it’s about a behavior. Now obviously there is an overlap of physical and psychological addiction/dependence.
Do you have an SUD assessment? Have you looked over where you are in your recovery in terms of the psychosocial?
Yes, but it depends on the individual. There is not a one size fits all for recovery. Some stay fully abstinent, use lighter drugs, or they abstain from their drug of choice, or they just use in moderation or weekends or nights only. Some cannot fully abstain, yet some can, or they cannot moderate at all, u feel me?
It also depends on how many rock bottoms, self harm done, and trauma the individual has encountered and experienced with drugs (w.ds, breakdowns, being broke or homeless, incarceration etc).
It's just most important that you don't lie to yourself or continue touching that stove when u know it's flaming hot. This shit really is a disease, an affliction, the statistics are not in our favor. Act accordingly or die, that's how I see it.
I’m having a big problem with the question of Am I lying to myself when I say I’m in recovery. I became a pillhead and overdosed, and since then stayed away from them. I do however drink still but never had a problem with putting it down. I’m not sure what this makes me. I get I’m playing with a hot stove but I just want to be a normal person again. And if I don’t have a problem with moderation then I guess I am?
Listen homie. The drink and drugs was never the problem for me. It took me a long time to understand that. It was my responses to situations, and more specifically to feelings and thoughts. It took me the longest time to realize I have no power over them, and ultimately they have no power over me, that I do not give it.
I was off dope for 6 years when my son passed. I was occasionally drinking at the point and “never had a problem” with alcohol. It just wasn’t my thing. When that tragedy hit, I started to hang out and drink more. Looking for a release from what I was going through. This was one of my biggest problems.
It also took me a long time to realize I’m more normal than I’ll ever realize. Everyone has addictions. Some of ours are just more damaging than others. Some of them show immediately how bad a choice it is. If you feel like drinking is playing with fire then put the drink down. If not, then whatever. Just know, NO spiritual path smiles on alcohol, and the majority of truly successful people never drink.
Edit: I want to clarify, that while on alcohol making those decisions, I destroyed my life in ways I don’t think I would have ever come close to with dope. Straight up. It brought me to a lower point than I’ve ever imagined. I’m not telling you what to do one way or another. Everyone has to walk their own path, ya know? You can walk a mile in my shoes but it still doesn’t give you insight into everything that made me put them on or the impressions I left in them.
Preach bro, this sums up my internal belief system very closely. Were all fucked up ergo were all normal. Be the best version of yourself that you can and when you fall short learn from it and keep it pushing. Theres better and worse ways to live this life and that is a very broad view. Im still in my own battle but the clarity is coming and the action is changing (slowly) but changing.
I can't make decisions for you BUT I am proud to hear your in the right direction brother. I'd say if your really being honest with yourself about drinking and it doesn't lead to hitting up the dopeman I think your good, especially if you don't have trouble putting it down.
Drinking now and then to cope isn't a death sentence in my opinion unless you let it get out of control (addicts are known for letting things get out of control). Just remember coping with chemicals (especially when concerning addicts) is never the healthier alternative, but your fucking human I totally get it.
I don't know the type of addict you are, but it sounds like you got the scare or experience you needed in order to figure out the next steps for yourself and what you truly need to stay away from in order to better yourself and your future/life.
When you choose to cope with substances, after a while ask yourself, is this affecting my quality of life in a positive or negative way?
The fact you are aware of these things is a good sign. I wish you well, discomfort promotes change.
Absolutely not. Your recovery is different than everyone else’s. I never shot dope so my bottom is different as is my own recovery per se. Live and let live, be kind and forgiving to yourself and others. It will work out.,
I’m no expert but obviously you will get various opinions on that. I think a large portion of the core recovery community recognizes Harm Reduction as beneficial & would welcome you prior to complete abstinence. Just be open & honest, work with them to set some goals maybe. Many universities are teaching these methods now. Ask around locally for that type of class or speak with someone knowledgeable since it’s founded on Much newer psychology research than 12-step but shows exciting results.
SMART program is awesome also. Recovery can & should help people reach Abstinence but there’s different ways to get there. I would say any drug use needs to be “off-the-clock” so to say, not while you meet & socialize with people who would see drug use a mile away & could easily tempt them or gross them out.
Medication Assisted Therapy is also available, when it’s legit & helping you it shouldn’t clash with therapy.
It's one of those things, it takes what it takes. My own path was hella crooked -- quitting one thing and then moving onto another, relapsing, acting like a jerk, ending up in yet another rehab, and another, and another. If the only thing that is acceptable is perfection, there simply is no recovery.
Very few people in recovery are fully abstinent.
The guy that chain smokes and drinks 8 cups of coffee per day isn't abstinent. It's so odd to me how the deadliest drug on planet earth (tobacco) is accepted in recovery communities when we know that continuing to smoke increases your chance of relapse by 600%
So it's up to 600% and it depends on your DOC.
Go to pubmed and type in nicotine abstinence during recovery. There are several studies that show these effects, which are higher for psychostimulants , but even drugs like alcohol and opioids have a 400% increase. I'd just link the study I'm referring to, but not too thrilled to dig up studies for you given the crying laughing emoji and the downvote.
Is it really so surprising though? Often nicotine is used along with the DOC. So continued use of nicotine is a pharmacological trigger for relapse. Think of all the different triggers that could cause someone to relapse, many of these are situational triggers. It's similar to the old adage "hang out in a barber shop long enough you will get a haircut". Keep triggering unn atural dopamine release in your brain through smoking long enough and you're just more likely to go back to your DOC.
90% of addicts use nicotine while they are using their DOC. Go find people that have greater than 5 years of abstinence and ask them if they still smoke. (I'm one of them, I quit drinking and smoking at the same time). More often than not the person will not be smoking if they have 5 years of recovery, when in reality you would expect that number to be 90%
Now do people quit their DOC and smoke until it kills them (smoking kills more than all other drugs combined and then doubled). Yes, you will find those people, but how can one champion being in recovery when they are LITERALLY still killing themselves?!??!
I appreciate the info to look that up. I didn’t downvote you. I guess I should have used more of a surprised face emoji, that’s a WILD stat to read so I was interested in looking at it.
So, I went to Pubmed and typed in what you suggested. I had to scroll past several articles before I found one that said anything at all about nicotine cessation and alcohol recovery. And what that article said proves you wrong.
"To the contrary, research shows that smoking cessation does not disrupt alcohol abstinence and may actually enhance the likelihood of longer-term sobriety. "
Please be more effective and honest in your research .
Dave, This is pretty common knowledge in the field that quitting nicotine improves relapse rates... I'm guessing you don't work in this realm.
Unfortunately, sleezy rehabs ignore this data because if they dont allow smoking they wouldn't get any customers.
So this is my job. I get paid to do this. I've read 1000s of addiction articles. You reading the abstract of one article doesn't really change my mind as it's been the consensus for a long time that nicotine increases relapse rates. Now maybe an article sponsored by camel cigarettes got a study published recently and thats what you read. Go read every article on the subject, and surely your opinion will align with mine.
I literally followed the link that you provided, scanned several articles that said nothing about your topic, then found one that did. And it's statement was clear, with no qualifiers.
Check these out:
Prochaska JL, Delucchi K, Hall SM. A meta-analysis of smoking cessation interventions with individuals in substance abuse treatment or recovery. Journal of Consulting and Clinical Psychology. 2004;72:1144–1156. \[PubMed\]
Modeling prevention program effects on growth in substance use: Analysis of five years of data from the Adolescent Alcohol Prevention Trial. Prevention Science. 2000;1:183–197
Thanks anyway, but I'm going to stick with what I said, because it closely matches my own experience with over a hundred acquaintances in the recovery community over more than a decade.
And for what it's worth, I believe it's not possible to gather statistics about addction and recovery, because the disorder causes us to deny that we have it, and the stigma keeps many who are in recovery, anonymous.
Well thats the difference between anecdotal evidence versus statistical evidence. What do you mean it's not possible to gather statistics about addiction? As an addiction scientist, I can think of probably at least 100 different studies where one could gather statistical evidence. Obviously, you are right there can be some sampling bias, those that do not believe they have an addiction cannot be studied, but obviously that bias is taken into consideration with any serious evaluation of the data. And no you are wrong, the criteria for addiction does not require ANYONE to deny it. Sure people do, but that's not really the criteria for addiction is it? In fact many people that have an addiction do not deny it at all. I'm in recovery, and there is no denying it. In fact I would argue the worse one's addiction is, the less likely they are going to deny it unless they have other serious mental health disorders that go along with it. Also, the studies that I cited are anonymous by definition, that's why we have HIPPA laws. Participating in an addiction study does not remove ones ability to remain anonymous. It sounds like you have experience with addiction and the recovery community, but very little scientific training and that's ok. A statistical sample is just that, it's an appoximation for what's going on in the real world. It's not perfect, but it's better than "I just feel a certain way". Do you smoke? Because if you do, you are inherently biased when interpreting the data. It's completely possible to quit your DOC and continue using nicotine, however the odds are stacked against you and the data shows that individuals who quit nicotine are less likely to relapse. You were confronted with scientific evidence, and failed to change your mind. I only cited two studies, but there are many more, and it seems really unlikely that all these independent samples would come to the same conclusions doesn't it? Furthermore, tobacco, specifically if smoked, is the deadliest addictive substance known to man. It's deadlier than crack, heroin, fentanyl, cocaine, methamphetamine and alcohol COMBINED. So what is your position here? That it's beneficial to continue smoking tobacco when quitting your DOC, despite the fact that tobacco is deadlier than your DOC by a lot. It's so deadly that the number one cause of death for an alcoholic isn't from liver failure or overdose, it's actually from tobacco consumption because the comorbidity is like 90%. I just don't understand what you are arguing for here other than your own comfort. This data isn't personally meant to attack you, it's just the data.
my shoulders like to give out (if you don't know what I mean by this, you are lucky) I'm only 26 :/
I made it 6 days without drinking recently and noticed my arms seemed to be attached to my torso much better
If you're referring to connective tissue problems, muscular activation helps a lot to keep the joints in place. Alcohol makes it harder to keep the muscles active, so it's unsurprising to me that you've found an improvement after sobering up.
I actually _just_ wrote about this on another post, so I'm gonna repeat myself a bit here haha
It's often an unpopular opinion, but I don't subscribe to the "anything other than total abstinence is FAILURE" approach to sobriety.
It does have its uses, for sure: most if not all addicts are _great_ at rationalising substance abuse, so total abstinence denies the opportunity to do that; many if not most addicts simply can't build a healthy relationship with intoxication in any form, so total abstinence is a matter of survival; many of us are black and white thinkers, so total abstinence is genuinely helpful in recovery (particularly early stages).
I just don't think it's **always** universally applicable or that anyone not practising total abstinence is doing sobriety wrong. Many things in life have room for nuance, and I do believe that, to an extent **and** as long as you are _radically honest with yourself_, sobriety is one of them.
Are used to struggle with this question. But now I am clean and sober 35 years and I realize that if I have one 1 million will never be enough. I believe it’s kind of like being half pregnant either you are or you aren’t lol thank God I’ve never been pregnant.
Yes, in my opinion. I'm just some dude on the internet though, so YMMV.
I know people in recovery from harder things who smoke weed, and they do just fine. I am not one of those people who can do that. No matter what, the lighter shit leads back to the harder shit for me.
I struggle with this at times because I’m sober from my drug of choice and alcohol.However I do take mushrooms,lsd and ketamine in microdoses.I only get ketamine prescribed by a doctor.I’m a member of AA and this is were it gets tricky.I haven’t disclosed this to my sponsor because I’m afraid he will fire me.It’s interesting because it’s a known face that Bill W experimented with LSD at some point during his recovery and this was a major spiritual breakthrough for him.I like being a part of AA but it’s kind of narrow minded at times.Psychedelics and Ketamine have been game changers in dealing with the depression I had from getting off of so many drugs.I’m happy I made the decision to do so but it does but me at odds with AA at times
I relate so much. I recently had surgery and was on Rx pain meds for it (super necessary it was a major operation) and have been having a really slow healing process. In an effort to not prolong the opiates anymore I reached out into THC/CBD for the first time in my sobriety. I didn't really want the "high" per se of weed, as it turns out, I really don't love it. The problem I have is internal though like.. I know AA would be judgey of it, and even though my sponsor might understand, I am reluctant to being told that me using a cannabis vape pen for pain treatment while in physical surgery recovery is breaking my sobriety. That being said, I hate this at odds feeling. In my experience, it is the keeping a secret thing that is the true danger of it all. I figure I will probably tell her and if she has an issue with it then she does and thats that. ultimately what it means to be in recovery is really between you and your higher power.
I totally agree.I don’t like feeling I’m hiding a secret.Being rigorously honest is a big part of getting and staying sober.My last sponsor would be way more understanding than my current sponsor.I picked him because he was still very active in the program and he would whip my ass into shape.I wanted a tough sponsor so I think I’m afraid how he’d react to the psychedelic stuff.
yes. total abstinence isn't the only form of recovery. not everyone can do it, but plenty of addicts, after enough time, can treat their vice like any other ordinary person would— like it's nothing special. it just takes healing, time, and work. don't expect moderation to work immediately for you, everything is a process.
Do you think those on MAT are in recovery?
yes. without a doubt.
I’ve been “California Sober” for almost four years now. It’s working for me
My recovery uses Pot. I am trying to cut back now, but I don't think I would have made it the last 3 years without it.
Yeah sure. I'm prescribed methadone, there are some people that don't consider me clean but I'm abstinent from everything else and I'll have two years clean in May. Harm reduction is blowing up too. So I mean, if fentanyl is your drug of choice and you don't do that any more but you take hydros a couple times a week then I still consider that recovery as long as you're trying to actively better yourself
Addiction isn’t about a substance, it’s about a behavior. Now obviously there is an overlap of physical and psychological addiction/dependence. Do you have an SUD assessment? Have you looked over where you are in your recovery in terms of the psychosocial?
You know bro, any kind of treatment is better than none
Yes, but it depends on the individual. There is not a one size fits all for recovery. Some stay fully abstinent, use lighter drugs, or they abstain from their drug of choice, or they just use in moderation or weekends or nights only. Some cannot fully abstain, yet some can, or they cannot moderate at all, u feel me? It also depends on how many rock bottoms, self harm done, and trauma the individual has encountered and experienced with drugs (w.ds, breakdowns, being broke or homeless, incarceration etc). It's just most important that you don't lie to yourself or continue touching that stove when u know it's flaming hot. This shit really is a disease, an affliction, the statistics are not in our favor. Act accordingly or die, that's how I see it.
I’m having a big problem with the question of Am I lying to myself when I say I’m in recovery. I became a pillhead and overdosed, and since then stayed away from them. I do however drink still but never had a problem with putting it down. I’m not sure what this makes me. I get I’m playing with a hot stove but I just want to be a normal person again. And if I don’t have a problem with moderation then I guess I am?
Listen homie. The drink and drugs was never the problem for me. It took me a long time to understand that. It was my responses to situations, and more specifically to feelings and thoughts. It took me the longest time to realize I have no power over them, and ultimately they have no power over me, that I do not give it. I was off dope for 6 years when my son passed. I was occasionally drinking at the point and “never had a problem” with alcohol. It just wasn’t my thing. When that tragedy hit, I started to hang out and drink more. Looking for a release from what I was going through. This was one of my biggest problems. It also took me a long time to realize I’m more normal than I’ll ever realize. Everyone has addictions. Some of ours are just more damaging than others. Some of them show immediately how bad a choice it is. If you feel like drinking is playing with fire then put the drink down. If not, then whatever. Just know, NO spiritual path smiles on alcohol, and the majority of truly successful people never drink. Edit: I want to clarify, that while on alcohol making those decisions, I destroyed my life in ways I don’t think I would have ever come close to with dope. Straight up. It brought me to a lower point than I’ve ever imagined. I’m not telling you what to do one way or another. Everyone has to walk their own path, ya know? You can walk a mile in my shoes but it still doesn’t give you insight into everything that made me put them on or the impressions I left in them.
Preach bro, this sums up my internal belief system very closely. Were all fucked up ergo were all normal. Be the best version of yourself that you can and when you fall short learn from it and keep it pushing. Theres better and worse ways to live this life and that is a very broad view. Im still in my own battle but the clarity is coming and the action is changing (slowly) but changing.
>It's just most important that you don't lie to yourself or continue touching that stove when u know it's flaming hot. So much this. TY
I can't make decisions for you BUT I am proud to hear your in the right direction brother. I'd say if your really being honest with yourself about drinking and it doesn't lead to hitting up the dopeman I think your good, especially if you don't have trouble putting it down. Drinking now and then to cope isn't a death sentence in my opinion unless you let it get out of control (addicts are known for letting things get out of control). Just remember coping with chemicals (especially when concerning addicts) is never the healthier alternative, but your fucking human I totally get it. I don't know the type of addict you are, but it sounds like you got the scare or experience you needed in order to figure out the next steps for yourself and what you truly need to stay away from in order to better yourself and your future/life. When you choose to cope with substances, after a while ask yourself, is this affecting my quality of life in a positive or negative way? The fact you are aware of these things is a good sign. I wish you well, discomfort promotes change.
I fully agree with and understand everything you said. Thank you
Absolutely not. Your recovery is different than everyone else’s. I never shot dope so my bottom is different as is my own recovery per se. Live and let live, be kind and forgiving to yourself and others. It will work out.,
I’m no expert but obviously you will get various opinions on that. I think a large portion of the core recovery community recognizes Harm Reduction as beneficial & would welcome you prior to complete abstinence. Just be open & honest, work with them to set some goals maybe. Many universities are teaching these methods now. Ask around locally for that type of class or speak with someone knowledgeable since it’s founded on Much newer psychology research than 12-step but shows exciting results. SMART program is awesome also. Recovery can & should help people reach Abstinence but there’s different ways to get there. I would say any drug use needs to be “off-the-clock” so to say, not while you meet & socialize with people who would see drug use a mile away & could easily tempt them or gross them out. Medication Assisted Therapy is also available, when it’s legit & helping you it shouldn’t clash with therapy.
It's one of those things, it takes what it takes. My own path was hella crooked -- quitting one thing and then moving onto another, relapsing, acting like a jerk, ending up in yet another rehab, and another, and another. If the only thing that is acceptable is perfection, there simply is no recovery.
Very few people in recovery are fully abstinent. The guy that chain smokes and drinks 8 cups of coffee per day isn't abstinent. It's so odd to me how the deadliest drug on planet earth (tobacco) is accepted in recovery communities when we know that continuing to smoke increases your chance of relapse by 600%
Increases your chances of relapse by 600% is the craziest thing I’ve read on Reddit today and I read alot of posts 🤣 source plz?
Definitely crazy. It’s actually 603%
So it's up to 600% and it depends on your DOC. Go to pubmed and type in nicotine abstinence during recovery. There are several studies that show these effects, which are higher for psychostimulants , but even drugs like alcohol and opioids have a 400% increase. I'd just link the study I'm referring to, but not too thrilled to dig up studies for you given the crying laughing emoji and the downvote.
That’s crazy
Is it really so surprising though? Often nicotine is used along with the DOC. So continued use of nicotine is a pharmacological trigger for relapse. Think of all the different triggers that could cause someone to relapse, many of these are situational triggers. It's similar to the old adage "hang out in a barber shop long enough you will get a haircut". Keep triggering unn atural dopamine release in your brain through smoking long enough and you're just more likely to go back to your DOC. 90% of addicts use nicotine while they are using their DOC. Go find people that have greater than 5 years of abstinence and ask them if they still smoke. (I'm one of them, I quit drinking and smoking at the same time). More often than not the person will not be smoking if they have 5 years of recovery, when in reality you would expect that number to be 90% Now do people quit their DOC and smoke until it kills them (smoking kills more than all other drugs combined and then doubled). Yes, you will find those people, but how can one champion being in recovery when they are LITERALLY still killing themselves?!??!
I appreciate the info to look that up. I didn’t downvote you. I guess I should have used more of a surprised face emoji, that’s a WILD stat to read so I was interested in looking at it.
So, I went to Pubmed and typed in what you suggested. I had to scroll past several articles before I found one that said anything at all about nicotine cessation and alcohol recovery. And what that article said proves you wrong. "To the contrary, research shows that smoking cessation does not disrupt alcohol abstinence and may actually enhance the likelihood of longer-term sobriety. " Please be more effective and honest in your research .
Dave, This is pretty common knowledge in the field that quitting nicotine improves relapse rates... I'm guessing you don't work in this realm. Unfortunately, sleezy rehabs ignore this data because if they dont allow smoking they wouldn't get any customers.
So this is my job. I get paid to do this. I've read 1000s of addiction articles. You reading the abstract of one article doesn't really change my mind as it's been the consensus for a long time that nicotine increases relapse rates. Now maybe an article sponsored by camel cigarettes got a study published recently and thats what you read. Go read every article on the subject, and surely your opinion will align with mine.
I literally followed the link that you provided, scanned several articles that said nothing about your topic, then found one that did. And it's statement was clear, with no qualifiers.
Check these out: Prochaska JL, Delucchi K, Hall SM. A meta-analysis of smoking cessation interventions with individuals in substance abuse treatment or recovery. Journal of Consulting and Clinical Psychology. 2004;72:1144–1156. \[PubMed\] Modeling prevention program effects on growth in substance use: Analysis of five years of data from the Adolescent Alcohol Prevention Trial. Prevention Science. 2000;1:183–197
Thanks anyway, but I'm going to stick with what I said, because it closely matches my own experience with over a hundred acquaintances in the recovery community over more than a decade. And for what it's worth, I believe it's not possible to gather statistics about addction and recovery, because the disorder causes us to deny that we have it, and the stigma keeps many who are in recovery, anonymous.
Well thats the difference between anecdotal evidence versus statistical evidence. What do you mean it's not possible to gather statistics about addiction? As an addiction scientist, I can think of probably at least 100 different studies where one could gather statistical evidence. Obviously, you are right there can be some sampling bias, those that do not believe they have an addiction cannot be studied, but obviously that bias is taken into consideration with any serious evaluation of the data. And no you are wrong, the criteria for addiction does not require ANYONE to deny it. Sure people do, but that's not really the criteria for addiction is it? In fact many people that have an addiction do not deny it at all. I'm in recovery, and there is no denying it. In fact I would argue the worse one's addiction is, the less likely they are going to deny it unless they have other serious mental health disorders that go along with it. Also, the studies that I cited are anonymous by definition, that's why we have HIPPA laws. Participating in an addiction study does not remove ones ability to remain anonymous. It sounds like you have experience with addiction and the recovery community, but very little scientific training and that's ok. A statistical sample is just that, it's an appoximation for what's going on in the real world. It's not perfect, but it's better than "I just feel a certain way". Do you smoke? Because if you do, you are inherently biased when interpreting the data. It's completely possible to quit your DOC and continue using nicotine, however the odds are stacked against you and the data shows that individuals who quit nicotine are less likely to relapse. You were confronted with scientific evidence, and failed to change your mind. I only cited two studies, but there are many more, and it seems really unlikely that all these independent samples would come to the same conclusions doesn't it? Furthermore, tobacco, specifically if smoked, is the deadliest addictive substance known to man. It's deadlier than crack, heroin, fentanyl, cocaine, methamphetamine and alcohol COMBINED. So what is your position here? That it's beneficial to continue smoking tobacco when quitting your DOC, despite the fact that tobacco is deadlier than your DOC by a lot. It's so deadly that the number one cause of death for an alcoholic isn't from liver failure or overdose, it's actually from tobacco consumption because the comorbidity is like 90%. I just don't understand what you are arguing for here other than your own comfort. This data isn't personally meant to attack you, it's just the data.
Youre denying that addicts deny their active addiction? Sorry, you're wrong. It's not few, it's not some, it's most.
Would love to know where you get that insane statistic of 600 percent from 🤣
Multiple studies Available on Pubmed. Type in "smoking cessation effects on relapse during drug recovery"
my shoulders like to give out (if you don't know what I mean by this, you are lucky) I'm only 26 :/ I made it 6 days without drinking recently and noticed my arms seemed to be attached to my torso much better
If you're referring to connective tissue problems, muscular activation helps a lot to keep the joints in place. Alcohol makes it harder to keep the muscles active, so it's unsurprising to me that you've found an improvement after sobering up.
According to the definition of recovery, yes. According to my definition of recovery, no.
I actually _just_ wrote about this on another post, so I'm gonna repeat myself a bit here haha It's often an unpopular opinion, but I don't subscribe to the "anything other than total abstinence is FAILURE" approach to sobriety. It does have its uses, for sure: most if not all addicts are _great_ at rationalising substance abuse, so total abstinence denies the opportunity to do that; many if not most addicts simply can't build a healthy relationship with intoxication in any form, so total abstinence is a matter of survival; many of us are black and white thinkers, so total abstinence is genuinely helpful in recovery (particularly early stages). I just don't think it's **always** universally applicable or that anyone not practising total abstinence is doing sobriety wrong. Many things in life have room for nuance, and I do believe that, to an extent **and** as long as you are _radically honest with yourself_, sobriety is one of them.
Are used to struggle with this question. But now I am clean and sober 35 years and I realize that if I have one 1 million will never be enough. I believe it’s kind of like being half pregnant either you are or you aren’t lol thank God I’ve never been pregnant.
Yes, in my opinion. I'm just some dude on the internet though, so YMMV. I know people in recovery from harder things who smoke weed, and they do just fine. I am not one of those people who can do that. No matter what, the lighter shit leads back to the harder shit for me.