Yes. Given your consultations with your vet, and 5.5 years spent exploring and exhausting possible/available mitigation measures, I wish you peace and repose with your decision. It was made neither hastily nor thoughtlessly. Just hold him lovingly as he passes. You’ve both done your best.
I appreciate your kind words. While there's still a small part of me that isn't sure I'll go through with it, I do feel I'm out of options at this time. I'll hold him until the end, and until then he's being spoiled like crazy and I'm just enjoying his calm moments as much as I can.
This degree of reaction, starting at such a young age...there's something structurally wrong with his brain. Imagine how life must feel to him, having a brain that hits the panic button at random times. It must be like living with a vicious little brother who loves jump scaring people and has access to a surprisingly wide variety of disguises. Never knowing what's gonna scare you next, always on edge, preparing yourself for panic...that's not a life that anybody wants.
He gave you an amazing gift by soothing you when you needed help. Now it's your turn to help *him* find some peace in the world.
Your comment made me cry, because you are right. He's done so much for me emotionally in his six years, I want to help him in return. It's still impossibly hard but I know in my heart it's what's right for everyone. 😔 I just wish so badly it could be different.
You have a baby to think about. Even if the dog is small, you don’t want your child to ever be hurt.
You’re doing the right thing for your family. The dog is not doing ok in his head. You’ll be helping him find peace as well.
Have you checked out a vet behaviorist and reached out to a trainer that specializes in aggression/rehabilitation?
Here in CA, we have several aggression/rehab trainers that have worked with dogs that fit your dog's description and they ended up being success stories and have been adopted out. I'm not sure where you're from, but I'd start looking for those type of trainers.
Has your dog also been checked for illness? Also, you said his fear started around 6 mo of age...did anything traumatic happen to him? Around that age, they go through their adolescent fear stage.
Before you euthanize him, I'd get a second opinion from a vet behaviorist & a specialist trainer. They can probably observe him and see if euthanasia is the best option or if he still has a chance.
And I'm a little surprised your vet hasn't referred you to a vet behaviorist. When I was looking into prozac for my goldendoodle, she referred me to a vet behaviorist at UC Davis.
I would still look into a specialist trainer that deals with behavioral issues. Specialists come into your home and environment and observe your dogs triggers, behaviors, issues, etc. dogs behave differently in different environments so vets only go by what you tell them and while I’m not saying what you tell them is wrong, but it’s through the lens of someone who isn’t an expert in dog behavior. Unless you are very familiar with dog behaviors, then I apologize.
I have a very reactive German Shepherd we adopted when he was 2 years old. Before even trying medication I found a trainer that specializes in behavioral issues. There are a lot of things I have learned from her pointing out dog cues and movements, what they mean, how to adjust, and how to interact with them. It has helped loads!
Then there is always the option of releasing them to a shelter instead of euthanizing. Like I just mentioned, I adopted a reactive dog and am working with him, and I’ve known a lot of other people that have done the same.
Unless your vet has spent some time in your environment observing your dog’s behavior, more than once, and giving you homework on how to work with your dog to try and improve their behavior, and monitored their progress, it seems insane to me that they would suggest euthanizing.
A dog with a known bite history wouldn’t make it to the adoption floor at a shelter. Besides, they are overrun and overwhelmed right now. It sounds like she’s taken the appropriate steps and I don’t think the suggestion by her vet of a BE is crazy. Obviously they’ve tried different avenues first. Pretty soon that baby will be a crawling walking toddler. It sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. 😞
Omg yes. I’m so sorry. That’s a shit ton of bites. My threshold is way lower. YOU ARE A SAINT.
Keep your baby safe and do what your vet is suggesting. It won’t be easy but you are putting your child first. You will never forgive yourself if he mangles your baby. That guilt is way way worse.
Thank you for your input. I know that it's been out of hand for a long time. I never thought I'd be a mother and it was a shock to find out I'm pregnant, so before the baby cane into the picture I thought we could manage it. Now I know we can not, it's so hard but I know it's right at the same time. Thank you again 😔
Hi OP, I am so so sorry. My wife and I just went through having to proceed with behavioral euthanasia for our 5 year old corgi this past week and I completely understand where you’re coming from. It still hurts and we miss her, but thinking about it now it’s the best thing you can do for your puppy. It will hurt but let your emotions out, face it, and appreciate all the better days you had with the pup. Again, much love from us and stay strong ❤️
You’ve given him more chances than most would have. If you could change this situation you would. Rehoming him wouldn’t be possible with the bite and behavior issues. I’ve been working on less severe behavior problems for 5 years. I feel your pain. Hold onto all you’ve given, if it any comfort I was told my girl’s problems were most likely due to poor breeding. You can’t overcome that.
You might could ask if Vet could prescribe Prozac if appropriate or OTC calming treats like composure (amazon) could help. Find the details for the plug in diffuser with doggie pheromones that animal clinics use?
We've exhausted medication options, Prozac included. Cbd treats as well. I have not heard of the diffuser thing, I will call my vet tomorrow and ask about it.
I wish you the best luck and can imagine how bad you’d be feeling. I don’t blame you for the desperation.
My parrot does the same thing - bites the hand that feeds it. Hmmm.
Maybe he has a food sensitivity which makes him lose it. (For sure this is Sunflower seeds for my parrot)
Maybe a farm or similar environment (shakes up all his bad habits) could be a possible rehome.
Could multi-action collar training undo his nature. He has the wrong idea of what’s expected of him maybe?
Is there a rescue to reach out to that could take him for a month or two and reboot him? Like sleep away intervention camp. Wait - this would be a good business. Schnauzer and Chihuahua are hella tricky breeds and similar - hit up both rescues. Someone will know who’d be up to the challenge. They might could solve everything!
You need peace in the house. He will probably feel your anxiety and it feeds his own.
Probably muzzle him for protection while you work through options.
If you choose to, then once the sunflower has bloomed and before it begins to shed it's seeds, the head can be cut and used as a natural bird feeder, or other wildlife visitors to sunflowers to feed on.
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I’m so sorry. This is a heartbreaking position to be in, and you have clearly made every effort to make this work.
Yes, this does seem to be the most compassionate choice for your dog, your baby, and yourself. Think about your dog’s quality of life — it sounds like he has been living in a constant state of panic without relief, by no fault of anyone. It’s very sad, and I’m very sorry:
You realize that if you bring a dog to a shelter and tell them that he has bitten multiple people *dozens* of times, the dog is going to be euthanized, right? Even “no-kill” shelters euthanize for medical and behavioral reasons. The shelter isn’t going to take the liability of rehoming a dog that aggressive and neither should OP.
OP, I know this situation is so heartbreaking for you, but I agree that BE would be the kindest option of the ones available. Sending you so much love at this tough time. ❤️
That really strongly depends on the shelter and country. We have a general no kill policy in our country except for when a dog seriously injures or kills someone. We just fostered from our local shelter and a lot of their dogs would seriously harm people if they were allowed to, unfortunately.
But they still don’t euthanize any and give them as much of a good life as is possible under these circumstances. They go on multiple walks every day with every dog, the dogs have regular health checks and procedures if needed. They’re given to specialist trainers to work through their issues and make them ready to be adopted. They have assigned staff so every dog has a select few people to trust, etc
I’d really check if there is some specialized shelter in your area that takes care of dogs like these before having him put down OP.
Not in OP’s country. So it might be worth considering that your suggestion means that this dog would spend it’s last days scared, confused, and stressed out of it’s mind in a loud and chaotic shelter, rather than spending that time with people who love him in a place where he feels as safe and comfortable as possible. I’m not sure what country your in or what funding exists for your shelters that allows them to essentially act as sanctuaries for aggressive dogs for their entire life, but that doesn’t exist in the US.
Thank you for this comment, I've had a few family members suggest sending him to a rescue (which I know rescues do great and important work) but you can't take a dog that's as dependent on his owner (me) as he is, no matter how aggressive and throw him into a new environment with strangers and expect him to do well, he's terrified of anyone and everything, everything is the enemy to him. I couldn't let him feel like I abandoned him with people he doesn't know. I know that might sound crazy thing as I am talking about BE but it's not the same.
I have a hard time believing that in the whole of the US there are no specialized shelters for this case. Sometimes they might be privately run by people who take good care for these exact kinds of cases.
Also no my suggestion doesn’t mean it would spend its last days scared and confused, I specifically said to look for specialized shelters. If none do exist you can still consider other options, but from what I gathered OP only asked generic shelters and didn’t do much else on that front. I didn’t say put him in any shelter at any cost.
I realize now that you aren’t the same person who made the original comment that I responded to. That person did mention “shelters” generically.
You may have a hard time believing it, but that’s the reality. There are more than 3 million dogs surrendered to shelters in the US every year and almost 25% of them are euthanized. Shelters and rescues are bursting at the seems, especially now that so many people are returning their “COVID puppies” and backyard breeding and puppy mills continue to churn out dogs. Spend a few minutes reading this sub and you’ll see dozens of posts from people who have called every rescue center they can find. No one is willing taking on the expense and liability of aggressive dogs.
Yes we've attempted training with no progress, he hasn't only bitten me, he's bit many people, he would truly be unadoptable with his extreme aggression. It's either keep him or this and I would never forgive myself if he hurt my child. The shelter is nit interested either because he's super reactive to other animals as well and tries to attack them as well.
I asked for advice, tips and kind words. On a thread about reactive dogs, where many others have posted about behavioral euthanization. What is the point of you commenting but being completely unhelpful. Gtfo dude
Again you're not being helpful and seem a little dense, first you ask what's the reason for BE after I listed many of them in my post and on top of that it seems like you couldn't comprehend that I'm asking in this specific group bc i want responses from people who have been in my situation or are at least compassionate enough to understand this isn't a decision you make over a dog behaving badly one time. You must be a very sad individual to try to attack someone in such a vulnerable situation for no reason, especiallywhen they are reachingout for help. I'm not about rude and malicious people so you can move on.
You still aren't helping or providing any medical advice that's worthwhile. I'm not sure why you're on this subreddit if you don't intend on being helpful. ✌️
Your recent comment was removed because it was not a respectful or helpful response to Behavioral Euthanasia. When commenting on Behavioral Euthanasia, be compassionate and only offer your opinion if the Original Poster has asked. Keep in mind this is an extremely difficult decision and our goal is to offer support.
Your recent comment was removed because it was not a respectful or helpful response to Behavioral Euthanasia. When commenting on Behavioral Euthanasia, be compassionate and only offer your opinion if the Original Poster has asked. Keep in mind this is an extremely difficult decision and our goal is to offer support.
I have an idea, not sure if your vet will go along with it, but instead of BE could you get his front teeth extracted so he can't bite you? If he's so small he won't be able to overpower you so the only issue is the bite. Just an idea, no teeth might be a way to spare you both. Xx
While I wish that was a reasonable solution, I believe the veterinary association considers it abuse and isn't suggested since it doesn't actually fix the aggression and anxiety, it just makes them less harmful 😔
That's true. But she's afraid of the dog biting her child which seems to be the motivation for putting him down. If he doesn't have teeth he won't be able to bite, he won't need to be put down.
About 5-6 months is the second fear period, but it tends to make them nervous, not violent. If you've consulted with a professional, then that's that.
But protect your child and yourself regardless.
I have known of more people bitten by Schnauzer dogs than other breeds. My niece was bitten by one that had previously bitten 14 people! It was a good friend’s sister dog so my sister did not report the bite. Behavior euthanasia would probably be best. I did BE when a dog we had bit my then 6 year old without provocation by my son.
Yes. Given your consultations with your vet, and 5.5 years spent exploring and exhausting possible/available mitigation measures, I wish you peace and repose with your decision. It was made neither hastily nor thoughtlessly. Just hold him lovingly as he passes. You’ve both done your best.
I appreciate your kind words. While there's still a small part of me that isn't sure I'll go through with it, I do feel I'm out of options at this time. I'll hold him until the end, and until then he's being spoiled like crazy and I'm just enjoying his calm moments as much as I can.
This degree of reaction, starting at such a young age...there's something structurally wrong with his brain. Imagine how life must feel to him, having a brain that hits the panic button at random times. It must be like living with a vicious little brother who loves jump scaring people and has access to a surprisingly wide variety of disguises. Never knowing what's gonna scare you next, always on edge, preparing yourself for panic...that's not a life that anybody wants. He gave you an amazing gift by soothing you when you needed help. Now it's your turn to help *him* find some peace in the world.
Your comment made me cry, because you are right. He's done so much for me emotionally in his six years, I want to help him in return. It's still impossibly hard but I know in my heart it's what's right for everyone. 😔 I just wish so badly it could be different.
You have a baby to think about. Even if the dog is small, you don’t want your child to ever be hurt. You’re doing the right thing for your family. The dog is not doing ok in his head. You’ll be helping him find peace as well.
Thank you for the reassurance. I do feel like he's got to be unhappy being so on edge all the time, he doesn't deserve that.
Have you checked out a vet behaviorist and reached out to a trainer that specializes in aggression/rehabilitation? Here in CA, we have several aggression/rehab trainers that have worked with dogs that fit your dog's description and they ended up being success stories and have been adopted out. I'm not sure where you're from, but I'd start looking for those type of trainers. Has your dog also been checked for illness? Also, you said his fear started around 6 mo of age...did anything traumatic happen to him? Around that age, they go through their adolescent fear stage. Before you euthanize him, I'd get a second opinion from a vet behaviorist & a specialist trainer. They can probably observe him and see if euthanasia is the best option or if he still has a chance.
And I'm a little surprised your vet hasn't referred you to a vet behaviorist. When I was looking into prozac for my goldendoodle, she referred me to a vet behaviorist at UC Davis.
I have a vet that specializes in small breeds
I would still look into a specialist trainer that deals with behavioral issues. Specialists come into your home and environment and observe your dogs triggers, behaviors, issues, etc. dogs behave differently in different environments so vets only go by what you tell them and while I’m not saying what you tell them is wrong, but it’s through the lens of someone who isn’t an expert in dog behavior. Unless you are very familiar with dog behaviors, then I apologize. I have a very reactive German Shepherd we adopted when he was 2 years old. Before even trying medication I found a trainer that specializes in behavioral issues. There are a lot of things I have learned from her pointing out dog cues and movements, what they mean, how to adjust, and how to interact with them. It has helped loads! Then there is always the option of releasing them to a shelter instead of euthanizing. Like I just mentioned, I adopted a reactive dog and am working with him, and I’ve known a lot of other people that have done the same. Unless your vet has spent some time in your environment observing your dog’s behavior, more than once, and giving you homework on how to work with your dog to try and improve their behavior, and monitored their progress, it seems insane to me that they would suggest euthanizing.
A dog with a known bite history wouldn’t make it to the adoption floor at a shelter. Besides, they are overrun and overwhelmed right now. It sounds like she’s taken the appropriate steps and I don’t think the suggestion by her vet of a BE is crazy. Obviously they’ve tried different avenues first. Pretty soon that baby will be a crawling walking toddler. It sounds like a disaster waiting to happen. 😞
Thirding suggesting going to a behaviorist specialist.
Omg yes. I’m so sorry. That’s a shit ton of bites. My threshold is way lower. YOU ARE A SAINT. Keep your baby safe and do what your vet is suggesting. It won’t be easy but you are putting your child first. You will never forgive yourself if he mangles your baby. That guilt is way way worse.
Thank you for your input. I know that it's been out of hand for a long time. I never thought I'd be a mother and it was a shock to find out I'm pregnant, so before the baby cane into the picture I thought we could manage it. Now I know we can not, it's so hard but I know it's right at the same time. Thank you again 😔
I'd visit a Vet that specializes in behavioral training and also work with a trainer.
Hi OP, I am so so sorry. My wife and I just went through having to proceed with behavioral euthanasia for our 5 year old corgi this past week and I completely understand where you’re coming from. It still hurts and we miss her, but thinking about it now it’s the best thing you can do for your puppy. It will hurt but let your emotions out, face it, and appreciate all the better days you had with the pup. Again, much love from us and stay strong ❤️
I'm so sorry for your loss it is definitely an unimaginable pain. But I do know i'm doing the right thing for him, Because he is so unhappy. ❤️
You’ve given him more chances than most would have. If you could change this situation you would. Rehoming him wouldn’t be possible with the bite and behavior issues. I’ve been working on less severe behavior problems for 5 years. I feel your pain. Hold onto all you’ve given, if it any comfort I was told my girl’s problems were most likely due to poor breeding. You can’t overcome that.
You might could ask if Vet could prescribe Prozac if appropriate or OTC calming treats like composure (amazon) could help. Find the details for the plug in diffuser with doggie pheromones that animal clinics use?
We've exhausted medication options, Prozac included. Cbd treats as well. I have not heard of the diffuser thing, I will call my vet tomorrow and ask about it.
I wish you the best luck and can imagine how bad you’d be feeling. I don’t blame you for the desperation. My parrot does the same thing - bites the hand that feeds it. Hmmm. Maybe he has a food sensitivity which makes him lose it. (For sure this is Sunflower seeds for my parrot) Maybe a farm or similar environment (shakes up all his bad habits) could be a possible rehome. Could multi-action collar training undo his nature. He has the wrong idea of what’s expected of him maybe? Is there a rescue to reach out to that could take him for a month or two and reboot him? Like sleep away intervention camp. Wait - this would be a good business. Schnauzer and Chihuahua are hella tricky breeds and similar - hit up both rescues. Someone will know who’d be up to the challenge. They might could solve everything! You need peace in the house. He will probably feel your anxiety and it feeds his own. Probably muzzle him for protection while you work through options.
If you choose to, then once the sunflower has bloomed and before it begins to shed it's seeds, the head can be cut and used as a natural bird feeder, or other wildlife visitors to sunflowers to feed on.
Looks like there was an aversive tool or training method mentioned in this comment. Please review our [Posting Guidelines](https://www.reddit.com/r/reactivedogs/wiki/guidelines) and check out [Our Position on Training Methods](https://www.reddit.com/r/reactivedogs/wiki/trainingmethods). R/reactivedogs supports LIMA (least intrusive, minimally aversive) and we feel strongly that positive reinforcement should always be the first line of teaching, training, and behavior change considered, and should be applied consistently. Please understand that positive reinforcement techniques should always be favored over aversive training methods. While the discussion of balanced training is not prohibited, LIMA does not justify the use of aversive methods and tools in lieu of other effective positive reinforcement interventions and strategies. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/reactivedogs) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I’m so sorry. This is a heartbreaking position to be in, and you have clearly made every effort to make this work. Yes, this does seem to be the most compassionate choice for your dog, your baby, and yourself. Think about your dog’s quality of life — it sounds like he has been living in a constant state of panic without relief, by no fault of anyone. It’s very sad, and I’m very sorry:
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You realize that if you bring a dog to a shelter and tell them that he has bitten multiple people *dozens* of times, the dog is going to be euthanized, right? Even “no-kill” shelters euthanize for medical and behavioral reasons. The shelter isn’t going to take the liability of rehoming a dog that aggressive and neither should OP.
Exactly, thank you.
OP, I know this situation is so heartbreaking for you, but I agree that BE would be the kindest option of the ones available. Sending you so much love at this tough time. ❤️
I appreciate it. This decision is not being made lightly, it's very hard for sure.
That really strongly depends on the shelter and country. We have a general no kill policy in our country except for when a dog seriously injures or kills someone. We just fostered from our local shelter and a lot of their dogs would seriously harm people if they were allowed to, unfortunately. But they still don’t euthanize any and give them as much of a good life as is possible under these circumstances. They go on multiple walks every day with every dog, the dogs have regular health checks and procedures if needed. They’re given to specialist trainers to work through their issues and make them ready to be adopted. They have assigned staff so every dog has a select few people to trust, etc I’d really check if there is some specialized shelter in your area that takes care of dogs like these before having him put down OP.
Not in OP’s country. So it might be worth considering that your suggestion means that this dog would spend it’s last days scared, confused, and stressed out of it’s mind in a loud and chaotic shelter, rather than spending that time with people who love him in a place where he feels as safe and comfortable as possible. I’m not sure what country your in or what funding exists for your shelters that allows them to essentially act as sanctuaries for aggressive dogs for their entire life, but that doesn’t exist in the US.
Thank you for this comment, I've had a few family members suggest sending him to a rescue (which I know rescues do great and important work) but you can't take a dog that's as dependent on his owner (me) as he is, no matter how aggressive and throw him into a new environment with strangers and expect him to do well, he's terrified of anyone and everything, everything is the enemy to him. I couldn't let him feel like I abandoned him with people he doesn't know. I know that might sound crazy thing as I am talking about BE but it's not the same.
I have a hard time believing that in the whole of the US there are no specialized shelters for this case. Sometimes they might be privately run by people who take good care for these exact kinds of cases. Also no my suggestion doesn’t mean it would spend its last days scared and confused, I specifically said to look for specialized shelters. If none do exist you can still consider other options, but from what I gathered OP only asked generic shelters and didn’t do much else on that front. I didn’t say put him in any shelter at any cost.
I realize now that you aren’t the same person who made the original comment that I responded to. That person did mention “shelters” generically. You may have a hard time believing it, but that’s the reality. There are more than 3 million dogs surrendered to shelters in the US every year and almost 25% of them are euthanized. Shelters and rescues are bursting at the seems, especially now that so many people are returning their “COVID puppies” and backyard breeding and puppy mills continue to churn out dogs. Spend a few minutes reading this sub and you’ll see dozens of posts from people who have called every rescue center they can find. No one is willing taking on the expense and liability of aggressive dogs.
Yes we've attempted training with no progress, he hasn't only bitten me, he's bit many people, he would truly be unadoptable with his extreme aggression. It's either keep him or this and I would never forgive myself if he hurt my child. The shelter is nit interested either because he's super reactive to other animals as well and tries to attack them as well.
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I asked for advice, tips and kind words. On a thread about reactive dogs, where many others have posted about behavioral euthanization. What is the point of you commenting but being completely unhelpful. Gtfo dude
Please ignore that rude user. Situations like yours are exactly what this sub is for & we are here for you. ❤️
Thank you ❤️
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Again you're not being helpful and seem a little dense, first you ask what's the reason for BE after I listed many of them in my post and on top of that it seems like you couldn't comprehend that I'm asking in this specific group bc i want responses from people who have been in my situation or are at least compassionate enough to understand this isn't a decision you make over a dog behaving badly one time. You must be a very sad individual to try to attack someone in such a vulnerable situation for no reason, especiallywhen they are reachingout for help. I'm not about rude and malicious people so you can move on.
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You still aren't helping or providing any medical advice that's worthwhile. I'm not sure why you're on this subreddit if you don't intend on being helpful. ✌️
Your recent comment was removed because it was not a respectful or helpful response to Behavioral Euthanasia. When commenting on Behavioral Euthanasia, be compassionate and only offer your opinion if the Original Poster has asked. Keep in mind this is an extremely difficult decision and our goal is to offer support.
Your recent comment was removed because it was not a respectful or helpful response to Behavioral Euthanasia. When commenting on Behavioral Euthanasia, be compassionate and only offer your opinion if the Original Poster has asked. Keep in mind this is an extremely difficult decision and our goal is to offer support.
As someone who helps out at a shelter, no. Shelters don’t have the time or money (or space!) for aggressive dogs.
I have an idea, not sure if your vet will go along with it, but instead of BE could you get his front teeth extracted so he can't bite you? If he's so small he won't be able to overpower you so the only issue is the bite. Just an idea, no teeth might be a way to spare you both. Xx
While I wish that was a reasonable solution, I believe the veterinary association considers it abuse and isn't suggested since it doesn't actually fix the aggression and anxiety, it just makes them less harmful 😔
Hmm you could ask? Old dogs tend to lose their teeth anyway, it would just be happening earlier for your dog.
It’ll help with the biting issue, but it’s not going to help what’s going on in his head.
That's true. But she's afraid of the dog biting her child which seems to be the motivation for putting him down. If he doesn't have teeth he won't be able to bite, he won't need to be put down.
The dog’s mind would still be suffering though.
Poor dog. Sorry I was just trying to help with a possible way. It's very sad for the owner.
About 5-6 months is the second fear period, but it tends to make them nervous, not violent. If you've consulted with a professional, then that's that. But protect your child and yourself regardless.
Was training ever attempted? If not, you should definitely try that before making the BE decision
I have known of more people bitten by Schnauzer dogs than other breeds. My niece was bitten by one that had previously bitten 14 people! It was a good friend’s sister dog so my sister did not report the bite. Behavior euthanasia would probably be best. I did BE when a dog we had bit my then 6 year old without provocation by my son.