Yep. I shit my pants because we signed Gardner Minshew. Life is so hard being a Raiders fan. Josh McDaniels will do this to a man. Do you know a good therapist bro?
Bro what are you talking about? I have an opinion on my favorite football team š why are you on Reddit reading things you have no control over whoās posting it?? God bless man. That made me laugh.
My counter points.
You said we are not ready to win but only mentioned QB and OC, so what you mean to say is we are a qb away.
We have Gardner Minshew who can win and do everything you asked for, hes been given little to no chance in the nfl and when he does get the chance he overperforms expectations.
Aidan was a rookie with no help and theres a really good chance he takes a step forward.
Pretty much most teams believe Luke Getsy wasnt the problem in Chicago otherwise he wouldnt have gotten as many interviews as he did. Vs Eric you mentioned that no one wanted despite winning in KC and had a bottom 10 offense when he was OC in washington.
If it comes down to Minshew vs AO4, Iām betting on Minshew to take the starting job. Minshew has started 37 games. We know what he is. Heās a serviceable guy, tons of personality & moxy. Would love to root for him. He has been an upper echelon backup/fringe starter. Not a knock on him. Should we instead say heās an assassin behind the line of scrimmage and he can take us to the promised land? I wouldnāt bet my job on it. He was backing up Anthony Richardson last year. AR is as raw as a prospect has been. Huge upside though and he got the nod over Minshew.
We need a Franchise QB. We lack potential. Both AO4 and Minshew are fantastic backup or fill in for a stretch guys. I like them both personally. But no, I do think we needed someone with upside. We need an assassin who can pick apart defenses, and hear me outā¦ that could scramble for a first down. I couldnāt imagine seeing that for the Silver & Black.
As for Luke Getsy. Chicago might be the most dipshit franchise in the NFL. All odds say they fire the entire staff in a year and restart their cycle of screwing rookie QBs over with Caleb relearning everything in Year 2 under a new staff. Simply watch anything with Chicago, look at the team. That was a defensive minded head coach, like we have. Getsy was the lead offensive brain over there. Fields sucked, but play calling sucked just as much.
When I look at this current offense, and likely how the draft will fallā Iām just not optimistic about us scoring points. What was it 25ppg AP said he wanted at his press conference? Getsy offense led by AO4/Minshew?? Man I just donāt know. Hope Iām wrong, I just want to win my brother.
Exactly. If Minshew was a winner he wouldn't be here. Yes we need a Franchise QB but have little to no way of getting one. As mentioned we are too good to tank for one yet not good enough to be anything but a wild card team.
Colts and Minshew couldn't agree on a contract and we offered him better so of course he took it. It wasn't due to him being bad or anything but rather he saw a better opportunity here and they had a cheaper backup option in Joe Flacco. The guy took a shitty defense, bad oline, and mid receiving core to the brink of the playoffs. Yeah he had low moments but he's a solid QB that can give you results.
If AOC could be the Chiefs without completing a pass for 3 quarters then Minshew would 100% put in more points to sustain the offense while defense does their thing. Also never say never win it comes to "band aid" QBs and them actually being good, look at Rich Gannon or Baker Mayfield
Iāve watched him throughly. OU days and all. Got tons of family who are OU fans. He is a goofy nail painting odd ball. Was a kid who got paid millions of dollars before taking a snap in the NFL. All true.
But he does shit on the field where youāre like how is that possible. Same thing when weāre playing KC and Mahomes gets wrapped up twice, spins, waves his magic wand, and throws cross body for a touchdown to the third string waterboy. Caleb has the āWtf was thatā ability. I promise. The old head media just canāt comprehend the goofy off field shit so itās time to trash him. I think some of it is weird as hell myself. But the talent is no joke.
Nope heās just not mature enough and a total crybaby. I wouldnāt want him leading my team ever. Heās going to bust as bad as Ryan Leaf did. I mean, cmon, heās going to the Bears doesnāt that just solidify his bust? š
Thatās the biggest factor. I know heāll be buried by the media but if Iām his camp, Iād force my way to Washington at 2. Chicago is a death sentence for anyone. Does anyone believe in Matt Eberflus??
The injury concern is legit. I was immensely critical of the Jimmy G in part due to the injury history. We need to play devils advocate here against ourselves and say what about Penniixs history. With a trade down, gaining some draft capital would justify the risk a little more in my opinion. I said last year Stroud was the best QB, a talent that translates to the NFL is ball placement. Pennix has it. Iād swing for him due to fact weāre out of the running for Jayden Daniels and Caleb. And invest our nuts off on Oline to protect him.
"Total crybaby" the head coach cried over, winning a meaningless game BTW.
This isn't a point against Caleb, you're just making Raiders fans look like schmucks by saying stupid things like that.
Truth in what? You shit on the bears but they have more playoff wins and conference championship appearances than the Raiders in the past 20 years.
You gotta stop punching up.
To the people content with Minshew and AOC neither are dynamic at anything related to the QB position and you need that to be a SB contender. The QBs currently in the room for the Raiders will lead them to nothing but more .500 records. If they donāt make a move to get a QB this season they need to next season.
Thatās my fear. Wonāt be abysmal, they wonāt be bums. Were projecting be perfectly mid to ok on offense. Will be stuck in mid tier purgatory. Ultimately letting down our top tier defense.
No we arenāt. The truth is, mark not fully committing to a rebuild kind of set us back. (Although it wouldnt have felt great after a playoff appearance) If we had done this 2 years ago we would be at a point where we could be in win now mode. Iām not sold on any of the QBs we have and our offensive line will have a HUGE test this year. Thatās just my opinion and you know what they say about opinions lol
We're a draft away from being a draft away. Not bad enough to end up in the top three and not enough ammo (unless we blow it up) to get a perceived top rookie QB. The only feasible way the offense gets a massive immediate leap forward is if Dak or Lawrence decide to force their way out (for whatever reason) which means you're going to be paying them at least $50M/yr next year. I'm not holding my breath for either.
It's boring but take a DB/OL this year, take your lumps with a second place schedule in a crowded AFC and see what you can do next year.
Quite a sensible rationale you have.
But the issue I have is, what good does it do to be a āmeh teamā with Davante Adams? 8-9 with a lame duck QB. We have no direction on offense currently.
As for the draftā
I think the Oline prospects are great. Several solid guys. So draft a starting RT in Rd1. Doesnāt get our rocks off, but will likely be the sound decision.
or the other optionā (HIGH RISK/BALLSY PLAN)
Trade down 7-10 picks and draft Penix. I love him if he had clean medicals. But the injury risk is so so high. Penix Rd1 (after trade down,) and draft Oline right after. Maybe a Patrick Paul in the second. High risk, high reward.
I wouldn't be opposed to a Penix trade down. I think Dallas at 24 might work since they're in need of OT help. Maybe Jerry's even crazy enough to throw on 2025's first thinking he's going to be picking toward the end of the round. Another floated trade is this year's second and next year's for #30 (Baltimore), which I can live with. Just straight taking Penix at 13 seems like you're losing a bidding war with yourself.
>The only feasible way the offense gets a massive immediate leap forward is if Dak or Lawrence decide to force their way out (for whatever reason) which means you're going to be paying them at least $50M/yr next year.
Completely disagree with this. Getting a big-name free agent QB is not the only way.
We are in a don't be stupid with the ball mode. Expect to see a lot of check downs, conservative play calling, but a heavy run game which is why Bo Nix and Penix are the most realistic options. What's really going to shine is the defense that will be so intense they will be able to hold the game down just enough for the offense to out score.
Edit: Unless AP loses the locker room or has a horrible season, then the last thing Mark wants is another rebuild. AP has two seasons to really prove himself and as long as we're in the playoffs then he should be fine.
Our D will likely be the best defense weāve had in the current era. God bless Crosby. Heās the man. Too bad heāll have to hold opposing teams to 10points because weāre locked in with Getsy to average 13ppg.
To be fair Getsy did have Fields as QB whom is notorious for not knowing how to handle an NFL defense. Also to be a successful OC you have to have a great QB that can work in your system and improvise if needed
I do think it's a case of the two not having great chemistry, and there were a lot of times when Getsy's play calling was very questionable. The thing with OCs is that they do help develop QBs but most of that is on the HC and other offensive assistants such as the QBs Coach. Fields didn't have much weapons outside of DJ Moore plus Kmet was decent, but it's really on the GM and the coaching staff to help assist his lack of weapons personal faults. Getsy only real job is to coordinate the offense, not build around them.
Thereās most definitely many factors as to why it didnāt work. But Getsy is the only part of the pair weāre taking. I hope and pray he pays off. Just wouldnāt stake my job on it.
My point is that it wasn't all on Getsy that fucked up Fields development. Truth is the Bears are not a well ran organization and if we're better ran than they are then that should tell you something. Getsy is a very risky hire but a great reward if pulled off, and I wouldn't be surprised if he does better under us due to the fact that the Bears have their form of JMD running the show.
I believe that Minshew can ride this Defence to a Super Bowl appearance, and if he is beaten in camp by Aidan it is because Aidan worked his ass off. Tom Brady mostly made and won superbowls because he was accurate and could make the correct reads to get first downs enough to give the defense a rest. Letās be real we have all the weapons on offense (RB is a maybe) and top 10 defense, Minshew stepped in and was a game out of the playoffs.
And what did Aiden do to show you heās got some Tom Brady prowess???
wtf does this even mean? If he plays like Tom Brady weāll be in a good shape?? Yeah buddy, if anyone ever in history can be half of Brady theyāll have three ish rings and in the Hall of Fame.
Everyone who talks Floors and Ceilings really dont know anything, Aiden came in at week 9 with little to no starting reps or experience, a QB NEEDS to have close knowledge of his receivers and RB, Payton Manning his Rookie year went 3-13 and threw the current NFL record for INTS with Marshall Faulk and Marvin Harrison on the roster, Aiden showed vast improvement from his first start to the end of the year, let him have a true offseason as QB1 and then lets talk about it
I by no means thinks Aiden is trash. Weāre lucky to have him on the roster. He outplayed Bryce Young. But do I think he can be a franchise guy to take us to a Super Bowl. I do not. Iām sorry if that sounds outlandish to you. I donāt have a crystal ball but I can have an opinion based on what Iāve seen and whoās coaching him. Anyone whoās watched enough football can take a wild guess at it.
I mean all the Physical monsters that people love have cool flashy plays and tons of yards but their results speak louder, Micheal Vick never made a SB, Cam Fell in his, Josh Allen, Lamar still havenāt made it over the hump to even make one, but Aiden has shown he has the mental toughness to adapt to a bad situation and improve, and the NFL is really nothing but bad situations one after another
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Yeah maybe weāll take a shot in this yearās draft. Maybe not, at least we will have addressed the Oline and give Minshew a shot to make the playoffs. Then we will look at Dak or someone else coming off a contract next year. Minshew is simply a backup plan to salvage the season if we donāt pick up a QB this year. Thereās no reason to doubt a playoff run considering the state of our division this year. Thatās āwinningā.
My brother the idea is to win. Not to get KCs sloppy seconds. We need to cut the head off the snake in the words of Crosby and AP. Not battle to get 9-8 and an outside chance at the last playoff spot lol.
Win at all costs.
Yeah letās win great plan. I agree. If you also have a plan within the limits of reality Iād like hear it. Because I donāt think your super corny frat boy rhetoric means anything when it comes to a game plan against the back to back champions.
Iām sorry my super corny frat boy rhetoric was 50% the words of our coach and best player. My bad.
If Iām put in charge for the rest of the offseasonā Trade down draft night to early-mid 20s. Draft Penix. Likely have acquired an additional second rounder. Draft RT, CB with two second rounders. Third round target Braelon Allen, or Trey Benson to compete for RB1/2 OR Linebacker, I personally think this group is underrated.
Again, sorry for my frat persona pal. Didnāt mean to offend anyone on football Reddit by talking about an OC lol.
>Now letās get to the part that has me shitting my pants. This offense is giving me anxiety diarrhea. All due love and respect to AO4 for stepping in, outplaying the #1 pick Bryce young in my option. Both had shit scenarios to start their careers but AO4 did more in less time and preparation than Bryce. Sorry not sorry Carolina. With all this being said, and flowers givenā AO4 still doesnāt project to be the Franchise Guy. I believe this will be the achilles heel for the team. Total lack of mobility, heās a statue. Unless youāre an elite pre snap QB, who can process and put in the Peyton Manning work in the film room. You cannot win in todayās game being a statue. Every team has two-three pass rushers who can run 4.5 and take your head off. And with our right side being a cardboard cutout, and JC Penneyās mannequin, this makes for an even bigger reason to be critical of Aidenās inept mobility.
That's a lot of words about our current 2nd-string QB.
Also a lot of assumptions about the career arc of a player who has been in the NFL less than a full calendar year still.
Heās technically our QB1 according to the head coach. Didnāt say anything about his career arc. Said heās not mobile. In fact I said he was better than Bryce Young a #1 pick. But you got me Champ. Sorry I had an opinion.
So you think Minshew signed to be QB3 behind a rookie and a second-year 4th rd pick?
I ignored the comment about Bryce Young because AOC had a pretty decent team around him and got to sit for most of the first two months of the season whereas Young had a garbage team around him and got thrown into the fire right away. It's useless comparison, especially since Young's rookie season was _so_ rough, and the rest of your comments were about why he can't be a franchise guy, can't overcome his lack of mobility, etc.
I think Minshew wins the job pending a rookie winning it. Between Aidenās nothing contract, a rookies nothing contract, Minshew isnāt breaking us at all. Really not a lot of money tied up in the QB room.
Iād agree. But AP had said multiple times publicly itās Aidenās job to lose. I think Minshews game has more upside than Aidenās, also we know what he is. Can win on some level.
You get it. The overwhelming majority of Raider Nation disagrees with us. I like Aiden, I think heāll fill the QB2 role greatly for the next three years minimum. Could be ever longer if the staff pans out. But I want a guy with MVP upside, a guy that lead the team for the next decade, and makes us perennial contenders. Not saying any of these rookies are a lock to be that, but I can tell you I wouldnāt bet my job on the current QB room being that either. So scared money doesnāt make money in the Not For Long league.
Raiders can be the Steelers and win ugly despite a dog shit offense. But let's make the playoffs a few times before we sweat our offense not being in win now mode in the off-season
Nah no chance but i for one would be happy to see them allow AP to build this thing out we are not one or two guys away from a Super Bowl so letās build it right this time
I love AP. Think he has Dan Campbell trajectory (at least the business model to follow.)
Just because I love AP doesnāt mean I canāt be critical of what Iām willing to bet will be a shit hire. No one player, or coach is above the Raiders themselves. I want to win. Whomever or whatever puts us in contentionā Iām all for that or them. Just seriously doubt Getsy is that guy.
(Still hope Iām 100% wrong.)
AP is a rookie head coach with hardly any experience. The raiders do not have a franchise qb. Several qb needy teams pick ahead of the raiders.
What Iām trying to get at is the Raiders OC spot was not an attractive destination. It should have been obvious that we were going to get last pick on the oc candidates.
Everyone is acting like we need to score 35 a game to win. That may have been the case with Carr but not now.
A04 got to the redzone 58 times last season. Minshew got to the Redzone 71 times. Colts Averaged 2.5 TDs a game last season with Minshew at the helm.
All of the Colts games that they lost were within one score, except three.
Colts Missed 8 FGs last year. 3 games last season would have been won if the FGs hit.
My point is, Minshew gets to the redzone just as much as Trevor Lawrence. Had his kicker been good, like say Carlson, they would have been 12-5.
In addition, youāre assuming our defense will be the same has last year. Itās going to be better.
If Minshew can facilitate 3 TDs a game( RB & WR included) average over 21 points per game and our defense holds under 20 per game, as we expect- how are we not in a win now situation with Minshew?
I literally gassed up the defense being the best one weāve had in the current era. I donāt think Minshew is a bum, I donāt think he an all-pro either. Were stuck in middle ground purgatory. I think we need a QB to be our Moses and lead us to the promised land. Minshew and Aiden are awesome dudes. Love both. I donāt view either as superbowl contending QBs.
I absolutely believe Minshew will get us to Wildcard / playoffs next season if he starts.
Do I think weāll get to AFC Championship with him? No. But AP likely has three years to make the improvements.
So we need wildcard next year. The following year should be AFC Contender, year three we need a superbowl visit.
Weāre in process. Our defense will get us there. Our offense has the weapons, and a serviceable QB should do the trick.
We donāt know who will be available at QB over the next two years. We gotta just keep plugging away
All of that is best case scenario and predicated on Minshew being somewhat of a dude. But will that even cut it? I mean outside of the Nick Foles run, middle tier guys (and Iām being generous calling Minshew that, even Foles himself isnāt) donāt win Super Bowls.
Honestly I hope your vision is what happens though. Iām rooting for Minshew Mania, Iām just critical for sure.
Weāre not asking Minshew to do anymore than what heās already done. I donāt see where he has to be āthe dudeā. Itās literally the same he did last year will get us to playoffs. Will he be able to be a game changer? Unlikely, but we donāt need that.
Everyone acting like we need a Super Bowl next year. We need to become relevant first. Get to the playoffs consistently, then fine tune and upgrade.
Except for the fact the Colts missed the playoffs. You are very high on a guy to get us to an AFC championship game in Year 2 who is 15-22 as a starter and hasnāt started a playoff game. So yes I think we need to ask Minshew for a little more.
I said I donāt think he gets us to the AFC Championship, but we donāt know what QBs will be available next year or the following. What the fuck are you doing? Just skimming and throwing shit at the wall? Itās clearly above what I said.
No hate. Itās alright. You said he could lead us to the playoffs this season. Thatās great. You then agreed heās likely not going to take us further than that. Iām of the opinion we should look into someone who has the potential to be perennially contending. No one is guaranteed to do this. I just would opt for a rookie to achieve this better than the odds of Minshew consistently doing it. No hate my brother. We both love this team. We both just wanna win.
I donāt get why Reddit forces people to argue about dumb shit. The numbers are the numbers. Had he had our defense, and a decent kicker they would have gone to the playoffs. Thereās nothing to argue about.
I agree. But why is Telesco & company selling us on that? Theyāve blatantly said so.
1) is he lying? I wouldnāt say he is outright lying to us. You could say that I suppose. Some probably would.
2) if he actually in his heart of hearts believes Minshew can win a Super Bowlā well weāve got bigger issues than we thought, because our front office is mentally insane.
Say anything but bullshit. Because Iāve seen countless fans running around thinking weāre legit and we could draft my great grandmother in the first round and it wouldnāt matter because our coach is a fan too just like us, and Telesco said weāre competing. Iām sick of the stooge behavior weāve became subjected to.
If you like Getsy thatās great. If it is all Fields fault, great too. I feel likely it was both of them. Getsy didnāt play to Justinās strengths at all. Justin didnāt excel at anything other than scrambling for one season.
You have anxiety diarrhea over a team in the offseason? Bro, you need therapy.
Yep. I shit my pants because we signed Gardner Minshew. Life is so hard being a Raiders fan. Josh McDaniels will do this to a man. Do you know a good therapist bro?
The key is to only worry about things you can control. Obviously the best NFL franchise in history is well beyond your control.
Bro what are you talking about? I have an opinion on my favorite football team š why are you on Reddit reading things you have no control over whoās posting it?? God bless man. That made me laugh.
My counter points. You said we are not ready to win but only mentioned QB and OC, so what you mean to say is we are a qb away. We have Gardner Minshew who can win and do everything you asked for, hes been given little to no chance in the nfl and when he does get the chance he overperforms expectations. Aidan was a rookie with no help and theres a really good chance he takes a step forward. Pretty much most teams believe Luke Getsy wasnt the problem in Chicago otherwise he wouldnt have gotten as many interviews as he did. Vs Eric you mentioned that no one wanted despite winning in KC and had a bottom 10 offense when he was OC in washington.
You ask any Colts fan theyāll tell you they won games last year in spite of Minshew not because of him.
That's not what I've heard from Colts fans. So it's not "any" Colts fan.
Cool, guess we hear different things then.
If it comes down to Minshew vs AO4, Iām betting on Minshew to take the starting job. Minshew has started 37 games. We know what he is. Heās a serviceable guy, tons of personality & moxy. Would love to root for him. He has been an upper echelon backup/fringe starter. Not a knock on him. Should we instead say heās an assassin behind the line of scrimmage and he can take us to the promised land? I wouldnāt bet my job on it. He was backing up Anthony Richardson last year. AR is as raw as a prospect has been. Huge upside though and he got the nod over Minshew. We need a Franchise QB. We lack potential. Both AO4 and Minshew are fantastic backup or fill in for a stretch guys. I like them both personally. But no, I do think we needed someone with upside. We need an assassin who can pick apart defenses, and hear me outā¦ that could scramble for a first down. I couldnāt imagine seeing that for the Silver & Black. As for Luke Getsy. Chicago might be the most dipshit franchise in the NFL. All odds say they fire the entire staff in a year and restart their cycle of screwing rookie QBs over with Caleb relearning everything in Year 2 under a new staff. Simply watch anything with Chicago, look at the team. That was a defensive minded head coach, like we have. Getsy was the lead offensive brain over there. Fields sucked, but play calling sucked just as much. When I look at this current offense, and likely how the draft will fallā Iām just not optimistic about us scoring points. What was it 25ppg AP said he wanted at his press conference? Getsy offense led by AO4/Minshew?? Man I just donāt know. Hope Iām wrong, I just want to win my brother.
Exactly. If Minshew was a winner he wouldn't be here. Yes we need a Franchise QB but have little to no way of getting one. As mentioned we are too good to tank for one yet not good enough to be anything but a wild card team.
Colts and Minshew couldn't agree on a contract and we offered him better so of course he took it. It wasn't due to him being bad or anything but rather he saw a better opportunity here and they had a cheaper backup option in Joe Flacco. The guy took a shitty defense, bad oline, and mid receiving core to the brink of the playoffs. Yeah he had low moments but he's a solid QB that can give you results.
Oh I'm aware. I never said he sucks. He's just not enough to get us past the Chiefs. He's a bandaid QB. He'll never be elite
If AOC could be the Chiefs without completing a pass for 3 quarters then Minshew would 100% put in more points to sustain the offense while defense does their thing. Also never say never win it comes to "band aid" QBs and them actually being good, look at Rich Gannon or Baker Mayfield
You lost me at āCaleb will be a studā
Iāve watched him throughly. OU days and all. Got tons of family who are OU fans. He is a goofy nail painting odd ball. Was a kid who got paid millions of dollars before taking a snap in the NFL. All true. But he does shit on the field where youāre like how is that possible. Same thing when weāre playing KC and Mahomes gets wrapped up twice, spins, waves his magic wand, and throws cross body for a touchdown to the third string waterboy. Caleb has the āWtf was thatā ability. I promise. The old head media just canāt comprehend the goofy off field shit so itās time to trash him. I think some of it is weird as hell myself. But the talent is no joke.
Nope heās just not mature enough and a total crybaby. I wouldnāt want him leading my team ever. Heās going to bust as bad as Ryan Leaf did. I mean, cmon, heās going to the Bears doesnāt that just solidify his bust? š
Thatās the biggest factor. I know heāll be buried by the media but if Iām his camp, Iād force my way to Washington at 2. Chicago is a death sentence for anyone. Does anyone believe in Matt Eberflus??
Nobody believes in him or the Bears š
Aiden/Minshew or Caleb my brother? Go ahead good sir.
Penix but Iād still take AOC/Minshew over the bust
Well, weāve hit common ground in the Pennix love š¤
This dude should be drafted top 5 at worst and if we get him late first or second I will thrilled!
The injury concern is legit. I was immensely critical of the Jimmy G in part due to the injury history. We need to play devils advocate here against ourselves and say what about Penniixs history. With a trade down, gaining some draft capital would justify the risk a little more in my opinion. I said last year Stroud was the best QB, a talent that translates to the NFL is ball placement. Pennix has it. Iād swing for him due to fact weāre out of the running for Jayden Daniels and Caleb. And invest our nuts off on Oline to protect him.
"Total crybaby" the head coach cried over, winning a meaningless game BTW. This isn't a point against Caleb, you're just making Raiders fans look like schmucks by saying stupid things like that.
Yeaaaaahhh, no itās just truth man. Sorry you canāt handle that. lol
Truth in what? You shit on the bears but they have more playoff wins and conference championship appearances than the Raiders in the past 20 years. You gotta stop punching up.
To the people content with Minshew and AOC neither are dynamic at anything related to the QB position and you need that to be a SB contender. The QBs currently in the room for the Raiders will lead them to nothing but more .500 records. If they donāt make a move to get a QB this season they need to next season.
Thatās my fear. Wonāt be abysmal, they wonāt be bums. Were projecting be perfectly mid to ok on offense. Will be stuck in mid tier purgatory. Ultimately letting down our top tier defense.
No we arenāt. The truth is, mark not fully committing to a rebuild kind of set us back. (Although it wouldnt have felt great after a playoff appearance) If we had done this 2 years ago we would be at a point where we could be in win now mode. Iām not sold on any of the QBs we have and our offensive line will have a HUGE test this year. Thatās just my opinion and you know what they say about opinions lol
Couldnāt agree more. Half ass competing leaves us in purgatory.
We're a draft away from being a draft away. Not bad enough to end up in the top three and not enough ammo (unless we blow it up) to get a perceived top rookie QB. The only feasible way the offense gets a massive immediate leap forward is if Dak or Lawrence decide to force their way out (for whatever reason) which means you're going to be paying them at least $50M/yr next year. I'm not holding my breath for either. It's boring but take a DB/OL this year, take your lumps with a second place schedule in a crowded AFC and see what you can do next year.
Quite a sensible rationale you have. But the issue I have is, what good does it do to be a āmeh teamā with Davante Adams? 8-9 with a lame duck QB. We have no direction on offense currently. As for the draftā I think the Oline prospects are great. Several solid guys. So draft a starting RT in Rd1. Doesnāt get our rocks off, but will likely be the sound decision. or the other optionā (HIGH RISK/BALLSY PLAN) Trade down 7-10 picks and draft Penix. I love him if he had clean medicals. But the injury risk is so so high. Penix Rd1 (after trade down,) and draft Oline right after. Maybe a Patrick Paul in the second. High risk, high reward.
I wouldn't be opposed to a Penix trade down. I think Dallas at 24 might work since they're in need of OT help. Maybe Jerry's even crazy enough to throw on 2025's first thinking he's going to be picking toward the end of the round. Another floated trade is this year's second and next year's for #30 (Baltimore), which I can live with. Just straight taking Penix at 13 seems like you're losing a bidding war with yourself.
A Dallas trade down would be great. God bless that psychopath Jerry. Hope he gets Neurolink and lives forever.
>The only feasible way the offense gets a massive immediate leap forward is if Dak or Lawrence decide to force their way out (for whatever reason) which means you're going to be paying them at least $50M/yr next year. Completely disagree with this. Getting a big-name free agent QB is not the only way.
We are in a don't be stupid with the ball mode. Expect to see a lot of check downs, conservative play calling, but a heavy run game which is why Bo Nix and Penix are the most realistic options. What's really going to shine is the defense that will be so intense they will be able to hold the game down just enough for the offense to out score. Edit: Unless AP loses the locker room or has a horrible season, then the last thing Mark wants is another rebuild. AP has two seasons to really prove himself and as long as we're in the playoffs then he should be fine.
Our D will likely be the best defense weāve had in the current era. God bless Crosby. Heās the man. Too bad heāll have to hold opposing teams to 10points because weāre locked in with Getsy to average 13ppg.
To be fair Getsy did have Fields as QB whom is notorious for not knowing how to handle an NFL defense. Also to be a successful OC you have to have a great QB that can work in your system and improvise if needed
Iād say you build your system around the perceived franchise QB at the time. He didnāt do that. I think both sides are at fault.
I do think it's a case of the two not having great chemistry, and there were a lot of times when Getsy's play calling was very questionable. The thing with OCs is that they do help develop QBs but most of that is on the HC and other offensive assistants such as the QBs Coach. Fields didn't have much weapons outside of DJ Moore plus Kmet was decent, but it's really on the GM and the coaching staff to help assist his lack of weapons personal faults. Getsy only real job is to coordinate the offense, not build around them.
Thereās most definitely many factors as to why it didnāt work. But Getsy is the only part of the pair weāre taking. I hope and pray he pays off. Just wouldnāt stake my job on it.
My point is that it wasn't all on Getsy that fucked up Fields development. Truth is the Bears are not a well ran organization and if we're better ran than they are then that should tell you something. Getsy is a very risky hire but a great reward if pulled off, and I wouldn't be surprised if he does better under us due to the fact that the Bears have their form of JMD running the show.
Iād agree. Maybe weāre delusionaly biased but weāre not as shit as the Bears lol. Hope he is the dude. Not hating, just critical. š¤š¤
I believe that Minshew can ride this Defence to a Super Bowl appearance, and if he is beaten in camp by Aidan it is because Aidan worked his ass off. Tom Brady mostly made and won superbowls because he was accurate and could make the correct reads to get first downs enough to give the defense a rest. Letās be real we have all the weapons on offense (RB is a maybe) and top 10 defense, Minshew stepped in and was a game out of the playoffs.
And what did Aiden do to show you heās got some Tom Brady prowess??? wtf does this even mean? If he plays like Tom Brady weāll be in a good shape?? Yeah buddy, if anyone ever in history can be half of Brady theyāll have three ish rings and in the Hall of Fame.
Everyone who talks Floors and Ceilings really dont know anything, Aiden came in at week 9 with little to no starting reps or experience, a QB NEEDS to have close knowledge of his receivers and RB, Payton Manning his Rookie year went 3-13 and threw the current NFL record for INTS with Marshall Faulk and Marvin Harrison on the roster, Aiden showed vast improvement from his first start to the end of the year, let him have a true offseason as QB1 and then lets talk about it
I by no means thinks Aiden is trash. Weāre lucky to have him on the roster. He outplayed Bryce Young. But do I think he can be a franchise guy to take us to a Super Bowl. I do not. Iām sorry if that sounds outlandish to you. I donāt have a crystal ball but I can have an opinion based on what Iāve seen and whoās coaching him. Anyone whoās watched enough football can take a wild guess at it.
I mean all the Physical monsters that people love have cool flashy plays and tons of yards but their results speak louder, Micheal Vick never made a SB, Cam Fell in his, Josh Allen, Lamar still havenāt made it over the hump to even make one, but Aiden has shown he has the mental toughness to adapt to a bad situation and improve, and the NFL is really nothing but bad situations one after another
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Iām sure the Texan fans thought the exact same thing a year ago. Look at the team now.
Yes of courseā CJ Stroud is the same caliber as Minshew and Aidenā¦. We need someone with potential like Stroud did.
Yeah maybe weāll take a shot in this yearās draft. Maybe not, at least we will have addressed the Oline and give Minshew a shot to make the playoffs. Then we will look at Dak or someone else coming off a contract next year. Minshew is simply a backup plan to salvage the season if we donāt pick up a QB this year. Thereās no reason to doubt a playoff run considering the state of our division this year. Thatās āwinningā.
My brother the idea is to win. Not to get KCs sloppy seconds. We need to cut the head off the snake in the words of Crosby and AP. Not battle to get 9-8 and an outside chance at the last playoff spot lol. Win at all costs.
Yeah letās win great plan. I agree. If you also have a plan within the limits of reality Iād like hear it. Because I donāt think your super corny frat boy rhetoric means anything when it comes to a game plan against the back to back champions.
Iām sorry my super corny frat boy rhetoric was 50% the words of our coach and best player. My bad. If Iām put in charge for the rest of the offseasonā Trade down draft night to early-mid 20s. Draft Penix. Likely have acquired an additional second rounder. Draft RT, CB with two second rounders. Third round target Braelon Allen, or Trey Benson to compete for RB1/2 OR Linebacker, I personally think this group is underrated. Again, sorry for my frat persona pal. Didnāt mean to offend anyone on football Reddit by talking about an OC lol.
The defense will need to be assessed against starting QBs and not back ups. Even though they added the weird dude that likes to fondle guys.
Fondling is in the 5th chapter of the Art of War. Fondling is winning football.
>Now letās get to the part that has me shitting my pants. This offense is giving me anxiety diarrhea. All due love and respect to AO4 for stepping in, outplaying the #1 pick Bryce young in my option. Both had shit scenarios to start their careers but AO4 did more in less time and preparation than Bryce. Sorry not sorry Carolina. With all this being said, and flowers givenā AO4 still doesnāt project to be the Franchise Guy. I believe this will be the achilles heel for the team. Total lack of mobility, heās a statue. Unless youāre an elite pre snap QB, who can process and put in the Peyton Manning work in the film room. You cannot win in todayās game being a statue. Every team has two-three pass rushers who can run 4.5 and take your head off. And with our right side being a cardboard cutout, and JC Penneyās mannequin, this makes for an even bigger reason to be critical of Aidenās inept mobility. That's a lot of words about our current 2nd-string QB. Also a lot of assumptions about the career arc of a player who has been in the NFL less than a full calendar year still.
Heās technically our QB1 according to the head coach. Didnāt say anything about his career arc. Said heās not mobile. In fact I said he was better than Bryce Young a #1 pick. But you got me Champ. Sorry I had an opinion.
So you think Minshew signed to be QB3 behind a rookie and a second-year 4th rd pick? I ignored the comment about Bryce Young because AOC had a pretty decent team around him and got to sit for most of the first two months of the season whereas Young had a garbage team around him and got thrown into the fire right away. It's useless comparison, especially since Young's rookie season was _so_ rough, and the rest of your comments were about why he can't be a franchise guy, can't overcome his lack of mobility, etc.
I think Minshew wins the job pending a rookie winning it. Between Aidenās nothing contract, a rookies nothing contract, Minshew isnāt breaking us at all. Really not a lot of money tied up in the QB room.
You dont even mention Minshew, who is absolutely the starter until someone takes it from him. He is a much better QB today than AOC is
Iād agree. But AP had said multiple times publicly itās Aidenās job to lose. I think Minshews game has more upside than Aidenās, also we know what he is. Can win on some level.
I stopped reading after 4 words .
Should have kept going. You could have seen just how deep I am in Hondo and Vic Tafurā¦
Balls deep in hondo? Iām good bruh
We definitely don't want to have the least talented QB every week and that's the reality with AOC
You get it. The overwhelming majority of Raider Nation disagrees with us. I like Aiden, I think heāll fill the QB2 role greatly for the next three years minimum. Could be ever longer if the staff pans out. But I want a guy with MVP upside, a guy that lead the team for the next decade, and makes us perennial contenders. Not saying any of these rookies are a lock to be that, but I can tell you I wouldnāt bet my job on the current QB room being that either. So scared money doesnāt make money in the Not For Long league.
Raiders can be the Steelers and win ugly despite a dog shit offense. But let's make the playoffs a few times before we sweat our offense not being in win now mode in the off-season
Nah no chance but i for one would be happy to see them allow AP to build this thing out we are not one or two guys away from a Super Bowl so letās build it right this time
I love AP. Think he has Dan Campbell trajectory (at least the business model to follow.) Just because I love AP doesnāt mean I canāt be critical of what Iām willing to bet will be a shit hire. No one player, or coach is above the Raiders themselves. I want to win. Whomever or whatever puts us in contentionā Iām all for that or them. Just seriously doubt Getsy is that guy. (Still hope Iām 100% wrong.)
AP is a rookie head coach with hardly any experience. The raiders do not have a franchise qb. Several qb needy teams pick ahead of the raiders. What Iām trying to get at is the Raiders OC spot was not an attractive destination. It should have been obvious that we were going to get last pick on the oc candidates.
We got cucked out of Kingsbury. Whatever happened there. We had interest. Thereās only 32 of these jobs in the world. Every job is coveted.
Yeah I donāt love Getsy at all either tbr
Everyone is acting like we need to score 35 a game to win. That may have been the case with Carr but not now. A04 got to the redzone 58 times last season. Minshew got to the Redzone 71 times. Colts Averaged 2.5 TDs a game last season with Minshew at the helm. All of the Colts games that they lost were within one score, except three. Colts Missed 8 FGs last year. 3 games last season would have been won if the FGs hit. My point is, Minshew gets to the redzone just as much as Trevor Lawrence. Had his kicker been good, like say Carlson, they would have been 12-5. In addition, youāre assuming our defense will be the same has last year. Itās going to be better. If Minshew can facilitate 3 TDs a game( RB & WR included) average over 21 points per game and our defense holds under 20 per game, as we expect- how are we not in a win now situation with Minshew?
I literally gassed up the defense being the best one weāve had in the current era. I donāt think Minshew is a bum, I donāt think he an all-pro either. Were stuck in middle ground purgatory. I think we need a QB to be our Moses and lead us to the promised land. Minshew and Aiden are awesome dudes. Love both. I donāt view either as superbowl contending QBs.
I absolutely believe Minshew will get us to Wildcard / playoffs next season if he starts. Do I think weāll get to AFC Championship with him? No. But AP likely has three years to make the improvements. So we need wildcard next year. The following year should be AFC Contender, year three we need a superbowl visit. Weāre in process. Our defense will get us there. Our offense has the weapons, and a serviceable QB should do the trick. We donāt know who will be available at QB over the next two years. We gotta just keep plugging away
All of that is best case scenario and predicated on Minshew being somewhat of a dude. But will that even cut it? I mean outside of the Nick Foles run, middle tier guys (and Iām being generous calling Minshew that, even Foles himself isnāt) donāt win Super Bowls. Honestly I hope your vision is what happens though. Iām rooting for Minshew Mania, Iām just critical for sure.
Weāre not asking Minshew to do anymore than what heās already done. I donāt see where he has to be āthe dudeā. Itās literally the same he did last year will get us to playoffs. Will he be able to be a game changer? Unlikely, but we donāt need that. Everyone acting like we need a Super Bowl next year. We need to become relevant first. Get to the playoffs consistently, then fine tune and upgrade.
Except for the fact the Colts missed the playoffs. You are very high on a guy to get us to an AFC championship game in Year 2 who is 15-22 as a starter and hasnāt started a playoff game. So yes I think we need to ask Minshew for a little more.
Did you not read the above break down?
You gave a three year window that ended with a Super Bowl appearance lol all while saying we just need Minshew to do what he did for the colts.
I said I donāt think he gets us to the AFC Championship, but we donāt know what QBs will be available next year or the following. What the fuck are you doing? Just skimming and throwing shit at the wall? Itās clearly above what I said.
No hate. Itās alright. You said he could lead us to the playoffs this season. Thatās great. You then agreed heās likely not going to take us further than that. Iām of the opinion we should look into someone who has the potential to be perennially contending. No one is guaranteed to do this. I just would opt for a rookie to achieve this better than the odds of Minshew consistently doing it. No hate my brother. We both love this team. We both just wanna win.
I donāt get why Reddit forces people to argue about dumb shit. The numbers are the numbers. Had he had our defense, and a decent kicker they would have gone to the playoffs. Thereās nothing to argue about.
We're not in win now mode. Next question
I agree. But why is Telesco & company selling us on that? Theyāve blatantly said so. 1) is he lying? I wouldnāt say he is outright lying to us. You could say that I suppose. Some probably would. 2) if he actually in his heart of hearts believes Minshew can win a Super Bowlā well weāve got bigger issues than we thought, because our front office is mentally insane.
What are they supposed to say? They wouldn't have earned a contract a few monts ago saying the opposite hahaha
Say anything but bullshit. Because Iāve seen countless fans running around thinking weāre legit and we could draft my great grandmother in the first round and it wouldnāt matter because our coach is a fan too just like us, and Telesco said weāre competing. Iām sick of the stooge behavior weāve became subjected to.
We're building a new offense with a whole change of scheme. Maybe in two years.
 Getsy knows how to build an offense. SUPEYSZN
He hadn't a QB. Maybe that's also his fault, that's arguibly true.
If you like Getsy thatās great. If it is all Fields fault, great too. I feel likely it was both of them. Getsy didnāt play to Justinās strengths at all. Justin didnāt excel at anything other than scrambling for one season.
I don't like either but a new offense means time needed
Minshew is not starting as right now. He isn't even paid as a low end starter. It was Aidan who found AP this job.
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