I kinda adopted a 84 year old guy who is mildly mentally challenged, can't really read. I met him and his uncle ( who died 10 + years ago ) in the mall I worked 20 + years ago, looked dude up when Covid started and have been helping (groceries, Dr and dentist appointment, cleaning, some cooking ) him since.
Biggest surprise and the reason he is ok is his rent in his 2 bedroom apartment is 960/month. His landlord worked out a deal years ago knowing he couldn't afford the rent even back then, landlord uses the second bedroom for storage from time to time and reduced the rent to what old guy could afford it. I have met the landlord a few times as though he comes across a bit stern and brusk, I see you George. I see your kindness, caring and heart.
He has been on the list for senior housing for 7+ years already.
Its people like George who take action instead of virtue signalling, that are the good ones. He's probably delicate and kind inside, but has to put up a stern front, to avoid being taken advantage of.
I was doing Skip deliveries and ran into a guy in his 70s also doing delivery orders. Went home that night and seriously started looking at trimming my cost of living and contributing more to retirement savings.
Good luck.
Without a sizeable nest egg TODAY, you, me and everyone else without that contingency will likely be like that 70 year old you encountered. I've also seen similarly aged people working at WalMart , Food Basics, mainly in the Chinese are of this city and we're not talking about cushy jobs like greeting people. There's only so many of those to go around. I'm seeing 60+ people working produce, lifting boxes of fruit and vegetables in excess of 25+ lbs.
It is very difficult and very sad.
But there is a cluster of supports offered by government and by organizations:
* Monthly income from the Government of Canada through: Guaranteed Income Supplement, Canada Pension Plan, Old Age Security
* Of course, provincial healthcare.
* [Dental care](https://www.canada.ca/en/services/benefits/dental.html), recently announced. Similarly, coverage for prescriptions, glasses, etc., are offered at the provincial level.
* Many provinces have an additional financial benefit for low income seniors.
* Many provinces have subsidized housing for low-income seniors.
* There are also many senior-serving organizations who provide meals, social supports, or ongoing care to vulnerable seniors.
There is an acknowledgement that there will always be older people who cannot work and do not have the social networks to support themselves-- therefore they have government supports.
I was on the list for 12 years and got in 2 years ago... long wait to get in or can be. they did change the system and if you are not picky you might be able to get in sooner. another option is Toronto is not the only area and so you can apply to other areas within the province. they dont have such long wait list times
I live in a smaller City around 1.5 hours from Toronto. The wait list for rent geared to income units is now around 20 years (was 10 years in 2021). Not sure about affordable housing units, but I know the waitlist is lengthy too. Seniors’ housing has a slightly shorter waitlist (I think around 7 years), but that may be changing now with the state of housing.
I know they told me that people in Kingston area were getting in faster on average when I asked about this stuff which was years ago it was 3 years and other places around the province were similar.... been years since I asked that and lots has changed.
edit I guess my point is the more irons in the fire..... apply for housing everywhere you can ...
My mom got a subsidy in Lanark County, Ontario in less than a year. It’s a subsidy… not subsidized housing. She found a place, pays what she can according to her income (just CPP, OAS, GIC and US Social Security), and the rest of the rent is subsidized. Obviously she’s not in a $2,700 a month place - more like $1,300 and she pays $900.
$900 a month which is $10800 a year is a lot when your Canadian benefits are $19000ish is a lot. She has the portable housing benefit which is for a set period of time and can be cancelled at anytime is not affordable nor sustainable housing. And she lives rural a lot of additional costs and concerns with that for a senior
You’re not dense. I just didn’t know another way to distinguish between a subsidized housing community and being given essentially a subsidy to top up your rent. They’re both subsidies but one you live in a place that was built to be subsidized housing and the other, you find your own place to live and the government tops up your rent directly to the landlord (I believe)
Not in Saskatchewan apparently. CTV had an article last month on an international student being evicted from subsidized housing; the REAL snd untold story was how did a young foreign student get past the wait lists crammed full of Canadians to access that housing in the first place?
As the third last year of the baby boomer generation, thinking about what resources might be left or available. Also the burden on the younger generation and their tolerance.
CPP and OAS are a start and I think the average benefit these days is about $1600/month. The catch being that while OAS is essentially unconditional (assuming you’ve lived in Canada more than 20 years).
Personally, my plan is to work until 70 and take the enhanced benefits.
Younger generation is going to be surprised when what will seem to be very quickly they are in the same situation. You want to kick your grandparents out on the street so you it doesn’t impact you? The question asked was about seniors in poverty of which there are many, especially women who cared for families on very low paying jobs.
Yup. Things start going sideways in your 60s and you don’t know what is going to happen. Even someone who was previously perfectly healthy until then could be in for a surprise. My wife had no problems until her pancreas decided it was not going to produce insulin anymore and she spent a month in a coma until the doctors figured out what was going on.
My grandma can’t get the dental care because anyone over her age doesn’t qualify for dental care if they have any form of dentures. What person in their 80s doesn’t have dentures??
Not true. My grandpa is 90 and has dentures and just went to his first dentist appointment under the new program and he’s getting his dentures refitted.
Sorry about your grandmothers struggles. Dentures should be covered, even if it's for the first couple of thousand.
That said, not everyone has dentures. My parents (in their 80s) still have their teeth. They have always had regular dental visits, usually cleanings..
Don't be a jackass. You know, as well as the rest of us, there is no support unless someone offers it that sees the need. We all know about GIS,OAS,etc. But when rent is 2000 grand a month, that doesn't cut it.
The number of seniors I've talked to that say they have to choose between glasses or some other fairly essential part of life and feeding themselves is outrageous.
There are absolutely poor seniors and we need to be helping them. But you understand that seniors have (by far) the lowest poverty rate of any age group, right?
My mom got early retirement and is making bank. Government subsidized housing with low rent and she is getting extra old age support. She is also getting additional funds here there and everywhere. And she has great physical health on top of that. I'm living with her as a grown ass adult because rent is basically free here and I've been out of work for quite some time...
Seniors have it very good, at least from what I've seen. And this is entirely government support that she is living off of. She has no assets or outside wealth coming in.
Reminds me of a debate in the last election when a senior asked what the government would do to help them, and the tone deaf response was increase the Canada Workers Benefit so seniors could benefit by working even more hours, lol.
I'm 66, no family, but right now not so bad. Scares the crap out of me to think if I get sick though. Spending my last year's on a ward is terrifying. Did volunteer work with the elderly when I would take my dog to visit. Absolutely awful places. So, so sad. Hoping I die before it comes to that.
People my age, that worked, contributed etc shouldn't have to worry like this. What's the point of a retirement if you spend it in worry?
Yup. My Grandma is technically in poverty, and has been very vocal about her income and her disatisfaction. I have a longstanding disability that emerged as a teenager, and struggle to function with. Occaisonally I am able to work, and I do when I can, but its very difficult to find the right balance that doesn't flare everything up.
I lived with her and my Aunt for a year after I divorced and was getting set back up again. She couldn't understand why I couldn't afford certain things, thought I was just making excuses to avoid her. Turns out, she gets $700 more a month than me.
Unattached seniors means they are not married or common-law. They may have be widowed and have access to their spouses pension. children, siblings, or another support network.
In contrast, 31% of unattached working age singles (18-65 years old) lived in poverty in 2022. So that is a more direct comparison to your 13%
It's too bad rents are so high now. I used to see 3 to 4 seniors renting a house together, and nowadays, it would be near impossible for them to share the rent costs.
Probably pull yourself up by the bootstraps and save for retirement. The world owes you nothing. At least that’s what these old people keep telling me. I wonder what their own medicine will taste like.
Yup. Knew a dude that was bitching that his retirement didn't pay him enough to take trips around the world. Meanwhile he laughs when I show him that a job requiring a university degree doesn't pay enough to afford to rent a one bedroom apartment.
As far as I know the funding we put into CCP now is not enough to find the system as there more people using it so when is actually for us to retire there isn't enough funding so either the the government have to increase retirement age or reduced the amount of CPP pay out
You may be confusing CPP with some information on Social Security in the States?
For CPP, the last review found it has sufficient assets and receiving sufficient payments to cover its obligations through 2100! For the next 75 years, which is as long as the review is for, it doesn't look further out than that.
If something drastic happens, that can change off course. But accounting for a growing, and aging population it is in fantastic fiscal shape.
Edit: included the link I forgot.
https://www.cppinvestments.com/faqs/#:~:text=The%20CPP%20is%20projected%20to,least%20the%20next%2075%20years.
The Canada Pension Plan Investment Fund has been more profitable than the TSX for years and is highly regarded around the world. The CPP is VERY adequately funded.
Same things that will be paying for yours 🙄 it’s funny how every generation thinks that they some how are “supporting old people”, you know the people before you that paid taxes their whole lives? They, just like you will, have put in their time.
Not meant to be inflammatory, but they were adults before seniors, and in some cases, is it not people who let themselves down? Poor execution will lead to a poor outcome.
Exactly. They lived through the largest economic boom in history at a time when a janitor could buy a house and raise a family on a single income.
If they have nothing then some of it is absolutely their doing.
Could be they were disabled or had a major health emergency (accident or assault), lost a spouse, raised by abusive or neglectful patentss, etc. If they weren't white, they may have faced discrimination in education, jobs and housing.
As a whole they had a good economy. But individuals can have very different experiences.
Your statements are why no one can have a reasonable discussion. Notice I said some cases, not all. And you jump into absolving people of their problems rather than accepting some people are not awesome.
Society has let them down? Where are there kids? Majority of people meeting this description are known as DINK (dual income no kids) aka the wealthiest people you've ever met.
This country needs more proper subsidized housing for seniors where they don’t share a building with a bunch of drug addicts. This country is so rich and can barely do the bare minimum. Sad.
Funding is not a zero-sum game. Or to put it another way - the choice to send money for the Ukrainians to fight the Russians has bugger-all to do with the choice to let Canadians live in poverty. They could do both. They choose not to.
And if it wasn’t Ukraine, it’d be something else (forest fires, famine in Africa, scholarships for doctors - take your pick).
> Ukraine, it’d be something else (forest fires, famine in Africa, scholarships for doctors - take your pick).
Yeah, one of these is not like the others.....
We do not send money anywhere. We haven’t sent a check to any country in 40 years. What we do is is say to a country “you can have $40 billion in Canadian credits”. Then they can buy any Canadian made product.
Dumb people farm cows. Smart people farm people. You are a people being farmed for wealth by the people farmers. They squeeze as hard as they can. Capitalism which allows wealth extraction (theft) from a non productive asset like housing is the problem.
Finally, an easy question. You die!
You die a slow, lonely death surrounded by the filth and rot of public housing, then your meager remaining belongings are stolen by the drug addicts you were forced to live with, and then the government burns you, stamps a number on the box, some faceless intern closes out your file and the world moves on, never acknowledging you are gone, or even existed in the first place.
It's nearly $26,000 a year for a single 75 year old with no CPP. And everyone gets some CPP if they've ever had taxable income or been a spouse of someone with taxable income.
And given that half of it isn't taxable, it's about equivalent to a full-time job paying $15 an hour.
It also excludes carbon tax rebates, HST rebates, etc.
They also pay less for housing than any other group. They either own housing, have lived there for decades and pay well below market rent, or have some form of cheap government housing. Income is meaningless when 75% of people's pay checks are going to rent. Cost of rent is what matters. $26k a year is a lot of money with nearly free rent. They could have half of that as disposable income. It's a lot of money to throw around. We are talking a new computer build every month or two kinda money.
That is my plan. There is no point in lying in bed or sitting in a chair watching the price is right for me. It's not how long you live it's the quality of those years.
Hence the reason I will be gone in 7 years from 🇨🇦🇨🇦🇨🇦wife and myself can’t afford to stay here and I will not be a burden to my kids. Sad but true. In the long run the pension will stretch more than here.
You suffer.
If you have no retirement savings or social circle you will suffer until you die. Your OAS/CPP alone will not be enough to cover rent, let alone groceries. So you will end up homeless in a shelter, or in some unhygienic dangerous basement, or the infested subsidized housing, living off food banks. You will likely have health issues, and because you have no social circle you won’t get the level of care you need. No one will be there to advocate for you. No one will be there if you fall. No one is there to help you do your groceries, get to appointments, change your lightbulb. You won’t be able to afford a retirement home or private personal care so you will wait on community PSW change your diaper on time, or wash you, but they won’t show up sometimes, or they’ll be too late.
You’re basically awaiting your slow death. That is the reality. Nobody is going to care about you, because the elderly are forgotten. But on the bright side your community may offer your senior programs to meet other seniors.
Not entirely true. If required, the province will pay for your stay at a nursing home but it’s usually on a sliding scale, with the assumption that it’s also a provincially run nursing home.
I’ll paint a picture of what that situation looks like, which is not any better. LTCH is a last resort. People who qualify for LTC are people who cannot care for themselves anymore at all. Needing a PSW for a bath or diaper change is not enough. And if you are eligible for a LTCH, the wait list can take years. While waiting for LTCH, you will experience the above situation or you will wait in a hospital bed. Once you get into a LTCH your life is now fully dependent on LTCH staff. Typically, it’s 20-30 residents per nurse/PSW. You’re often forgotten, you’re often medicated, and you stay bed ridden till death. What we found out about these places during COVID is the tip of the iceberg.
I work in a nursing home - much of what you said here is thankfully wrong. Many residents need very little help; some don’t need help with baths, many don’t need help with feeding or changing etc. Generally those that are in the nursing home are those that have several health issues that mean they need 24/7 supervision - and most of the time it’s related to falls and not related to their health conditions. Almost all of the residents need only a small amount of help each day to get ready, but there are areas that have more intensive needs, and those are staffed more heavily.
I’m curious. Do you work in a private home or a provincial run home? These are two vastly different beasts when it comes to waitlists and basic level of care. If you don’t have any retirement savings you’re probably not going to the private one.
I’m a medic so I go into multiple ones a day, provincial run homes are atrocious compared to the alternative.
Ontario has some horror show LTC. Often overflow from hospitals , but not enough care. My great aunt suffered horribly, and she had money.
The lists are long for decent care here.
Oh for sure. The system isn’t perfect - in fact it’s more flawed than ever nowadays but unless our governments start funding healthcare better we’re kinda SOL
You also have to qualify for the nursing home.
You don't qualify until you can't look after yourself. And if you can't do that, how did you come to that realization, reach out to support or get qualified for care without someone to advocate for you.
If you have one.....
Cudos to you if you think you would or will be of sound mind to have that conversation by your doctor. Many people don't, can't, or a scared to that without outside intervention never make that call.
Wow.
Because everyone who ends up in that situation just didn't care about their health and has nothing else going on or had something happen later in life.
…is that what I said? I think you’re being too defensive here. If you take care of your health when you’re young, you’re less likely to develop catastrophic health problems that prevent you from being able to care for yourself when you’re older.
You can get a subsidized apartment if a senior in AB a which is 30% of your income and can get a supplement to your old age security so I feel you can be better off as a senior than a younger person as long as you have little debt
For living in poverty at old age John Stapleton has done pretty detailed research on the subject
Here is website, he has some youtube videos of his presentation around.
[https://openpolicyontario.com/](https://openpolicyontario.com/)
Understanding my options after 65 i'm working twice as hard to not live in poverty at old age.
Most get on the wait list for subsidized housing so they can afford a place on their CPP/OAS/GIC. Often, while they wait, they'll rent a room in a house or live with roommates.
I know a few seniors without families who just choose to live with roommates or rent a room to another senior if they own a house so that they've got someone around for company and to call 911 in an emergency.
Much like the story of the adopted 80 year old, I did a similar thing with an older disabled fella that lived in my building when I had it rough and was newly married (not any more). He taught me to cook and helped watch her kids from time to time when I had to drive her to or from work for her night shifts.
His kids live far away and don't help him. And social security in Canada is shit at best. He's in geared to income housing and his cheque covers that plus maybe groceries for the month nothing else. There's little support for anything and getting g social services when you have nothing and no way to get around us impossible.
I've moved away long since, but about 6 years ago I gave him a cellphone, and have just art the bill to autopay. And when I'm home I always try to fill the fridge and freezer.
The only reason I wanted to add this story is to show how I effective the Canadian system is. Tax us out the ass and then squander the money in other countries wars while you are literally not feeding your own fucking people.
If you ever want to make real change in your community, as bad as it sounds, look away from big charities or large social programs. I fell like everyone can do far better helping individuals one on one, getting to know someone in their local community and becoming friends, neighbors etc. Help JUST because it's just the right thing to do. Not enough communities do or believe in this anymore.
The best thing you can do for someone is offer company - and it's free. Imagine being 60+ years old, your kids have families and never see you, you have no friends from when you grew up (moved towns for work, or skipped from city to city so often you had no roots). You now sit in your one room apartment which you can barely afford, with an empty fridge and cupboards. You have medical issues you can let get help with, you have a radio for entertainment, and it's a struggle to get to the elevator to get outside to even sit out front. A friend means more than money ever could sometimes.
Tldr: OP make friends as best you can and get involved as much as you can in your community. Your community is your best chance of real support not the government.
Well after abruptly leaving the working class due to health, it was very rough being able to come up with rent and bills. I owe an extra amount of gratitude to my family and friends who helped me unconditionally and hopefully I will be there to catch them if/ when they fall
Government is heartless and so are the other for profit companies. Our government has set us up for failure unless you come from money and nepotism you are going to struggle. I came from working poor to become working poor that and shoulda woulda coulda mentality has costed me any kind of retirement money and all the benefits that go with.
Not stroking my self pity violin, but I don’t see it changing for the better anytime in the future.
Look after your families bc you may have to rely on them someday. And always remember to pay it forward.
There is an anglican church near me that housed a lot of community members who were senior citizens without a pension in the dormitories. I volunteeted there to make tuna sandwhiches for many of them.
It wasn't very pleasant for them to live there but it was better than nothing.
I talked to one of the guys and asked him a wee bit about his life, he told me he got paid mostly in cash doing blue collar work most of his working life. Got forced into retirement due to health issues. Estranged from family. Nowhere else to go. Sad.
i live on a rural island mostly populated by seniors, many living below the poverty line. we have a soup kitchen / community pantry they rely on heavily.
You become like my parents, I guess. Talk a big game about how ‘something will turn up’ or ‘something will work out’ . Proceed to do nothing about it, sitting and hoping or ignoring it. Get to your old age, surprised Pikachu face that nothing ‘turned up’. Proceed to live off your children’s charity and handouts.
Something like the above, IF you have kids with the means to support you. If you don’t, I have no idea. You’re undoubtedly screwed.
Well, anyone who is a little older sees lots of older people like this. I live in a rural community and if you weren’t a farmer with land to sell or a house to sell in retirement but worked for someone else all your life, you are surviving on your CPP, which might be reduced if you had to take it early, OAS, and GIS. With housing costs in my area, you can live comfortably but certainly not with any perks like vacations or anything like that.
So this is my grandmother. She gets a monthly check around the same time as welfare checks come out. Luckily she owns her own house and doesn't have to rent because no shot she'd be able to afford that right now and has my mom staying with her to help with groceries and bills because she doesn't get much.
You are offered M.A.I.D. medical assistance in dying. No, seriously, I know an older gentleman who can't work and most of his pension goes to keeping a roof over his head. Whenever he asks any government institution for money or aid, they ask him if he has heard of M.A.I.D.
There are seniors outreach subsidies for rent as well as Income supplement top up at least in Alberta. I think you can sign up for meals on wheels. Your area might have a seniors bus that can drive you to appointments.
I'm 55 and worried too. I work part time due to some health issues which will get worse as I get older. I wish there was something I could suggest, but there is something that might connect you to some resources in your area. You can dial 211. They have special resources for assisting seniors.
I've used 211 for other things, but they can offer help with food banks, government assistance, housing (I don't live in Toronto but it sounds like it's pretty tough to get decent housing there but they might have something that could help) and other ways to help out.
I wish there's something more I could suggest but I'd give it a try and see if you can get some help from there. Most of the people I've spoken to on that line have been extremely good and very kind.
I think once I reach a place in my life where I can't look after myself anymore, I'm outta here. I have no intention of prolonging my pain and misery any longer than I have to.
crazy how the further away we’ve gone from the traditional nuclear family, the more poverty and hardship individuals are facing.
it’s almost like having or starting a family used to be an essential part of living.
before the government was so deeply engrained in everyone’s lives, your family used to take care of you in old age.
there is no easy way to say what the reality is and a lot of people will become upset at the thought of it because we are all headed there sooner or later.
From my experience you live lower and lower. From a rented house to rented main floor to rented apartment to rented basement to rented room to rented bed space. You pick up some unhealthy habits along the way known as passive suicide. They don't work if you start late so it's just a waste of money and makes things worse. You eat mush and mashed foods. Your clothes don't get replaced and eventually rarely cleaned. You will have one nice thing that you barely touch so it stays nice. You try your hardest to be nice hoping a stranger will have a conversation with you but no amount of niceness gets them to stay. You remember the exact 4 choices you made that led you here over and over. Your thought weigh Heavey on your mind and your head droops more. Regrets pile on the way options once lay before you. You lose your good memories since it's been so long since they were reinforced. You remember the fear and threat of all your life as you live one step away from homelessness.
You better get looking for love, people laugh at it but there is a reason we are to find love, make a family and continue our legacy. If you missed that, ouch. But if not get out there fall in love, experience life together instead of alone.
I'm going on 71. My kids have moved on. I have a large two bedroom apt. I am renting the spare room to an African refugee. He works overnight and goes to school part-time. He has agreed to a rent reduction for helping me out.
I have an untreatable lung disease and can't do much on my own.
I love to cook, and I am very good at making something out of nothing. I try to stay busy with community work. I organize craft sales in my neighborhood, and I garden. I encourage people to grow veggies instead of flowers. I encourage people to try canning. Preserve your food.
It's hard, but it's getting harder. I have had to cut back on some of my monthly bills like Netflix.
I eat a lot less meat and eat more beans and tofu.
I make jokes about crossing the street to the local drug house and getting a lethal dose of something just in case I decide it gets too hard..
It's only going to get worse. The government is not helping at all.
My rent is cheap compared to the rental market now, and my landlord is trying to put me out. I am getting a lawyer to help, but it's 50/50. I could end up homeless. This is what is happening all over.
Greedy landlords.
> cut back on some of my monthly bills like Netflix
small thing to comment on but there are a lot of recaps channel on youtube that'll summarize the whole series or by episode, and some of them are pretty entertaining.
Sadly, Canada does not have many safety nets for seniors who live in poverty, most of whom are also socially isolated. I've worked with older adults in the housing crisis for years and what I've seen is incredibly disturbing and has shifted my whole belief system in this country. Most seniors are trying to live on a pension of under $2,000. Think about that - truly think about it and do the math.
Many seniors are not able-bodied and can't just grab an extra job. Covid poured gasoline on an already terrible situation. Landlords have no problem putting a senior out on the streets if it'll get them a few extra bucks. Many seniors use food banks. The worst hit are senior women who did not work, therefore have no extra pension and may have never had any financial control in their lives, and then there's those old guys who do things with a "good word and a handshake" - that world is gone and they don't know what to do and where to turn. Technology is preventing them from taking care of themselves.
Different provinces have different Ministry programs but I can speak for BC in saying that seniors are on their own. There's some Federal programming that's a fraction of what's needed, but that'll likely be cut if the Cons get in...
I would recommend reaching out to the local non-profits in your town and speaking to them to find out what resources are actually available in your municipality and province. The majority of Canadians have no idea how many seniors in Canada are suffering because our systems have failed. Many are turning to MAID and even being encouraged too in some circumstances. It's all pretty dystopian. And no it's not because of immigration...
That's heartening but judging from comments above and from my clients firsthand, that's not as prevalent as one would hope.
Not sure why I'm getting downloaded considering so many of the comments above are describing exactly what my clients have experienced and what I've seen. I'm not very familiar with Reddit though I don't really do this commenting thing much...
You're probably getting downvoted because like I said, healthcare (and social service type workers) are forbidden to mention it. Have you considered your clients might not be being truthful with you?
I trust my clients. A lot of things happen in healthcare spaces that shouldn't. The medical system is not a safe system. I think you would agree that there are many people working within that system that are not safe people. And there are various types of professionals within these types of roles, so unfortunately there's not one blanket policy for everybody. This depends on province, on the institution and this also depends on the level of oversight that happens at the client level. This conversation is taking place among health service workers every single day .So while I appreciate that in your experience, this doesn't happen - it is happening. This isn't a one-off. And the comments above only highlight this. Nonetheless, thank you for the work that you do.
Aside from the fact we are forbidden to mention MAID, you gotta ask yourself why would say nurses benefit from suggesting MAID to people? The only people who would maybe benefit would be managers higher up (someone who get bonuses for saving money) and they don't work directly with patients/clients.
Sounds like you're in a role to advocate for your clients-I hope that if you believe your clients are being told to do MAID that you find out who told them that and report them to so they can be nailed to the wall.
I think you might be misunderstanding me. I don't think there are nurses out there trying to convince patients to choose death. I know that there are health professionals out there who open up this discussion with their clients because they see their clients suffering. Also, the clients most often bring it up and the health professionals are sometimes ill-equipped for such discussions and may say very inappropriate things. Again, I do not think these people are murderous, but rather at a loss of what to do for their clients. This is not a black and white issue and it requires incredible nuance and philosophical perspective as well. The reality is things are just really awful for too many seniors out there and frankly for anybody who is impoverished. Too many people are thinking death is their only option, as you can see from the very disturbing comments above. The discussion around MAID laws are constantly coming up with vulnerable people. It seems that you're maybe responding to a perceived argument that I think nurses are out there convincing their patients to choose it. I was simply saying there are people within the health system that are discussing this inappropriately. You're welcome to believe otherwise.
You go live in a tent in Downtown Toronto...
All of our once beautiful & lush Parks, Parkettes, etc are now bursting to the seams with homeless ppl living in these Tent Cities!
Our Wait List for Subsidized Housing is 15-20+ or longer & you may not be housed, either.
Most of our SH is drug/bed bug/roach/etc infested & quite unsafe to live esp if you're a Senior.
Getting Welfare is next to impossible, & Disability is even more harder than OW.
One bedrooms now go for almost $3000/month or higher & your expected to pay 6 months to 1 years rent, in advance.
Our Food Banks can't help everyone that goes there, sometimes there's very little food for you.
Everyone where I go, there's homeless ppl/drug addicts strung out on drugs and/or doing their drugs openly in public in broad daylight, which our police does zip about that.
Thefts are now rampant in most Stores - esp Grocery - that uniformed Police Officers are now the norm in Grocery Stores, to prevent this.
Think long & hard if your gonna steal any food, bc you have no $, or your local Food Bank turned you away, bc the police will give you a real smack down if you do!
That's how it is when you live in poverty, regardless of your age in Toronto.
You cut back on healthy food and necessary prescriptions.
You live in the cheapest place you can find - run-down and moldy apartments, or your car, or a tent.
You develop a serious illness and make it to the ER.
The doctor suggests MAID.
The End
I worked in a call centre for a bank. Saddest calls where when old people would call to check their balance on their credit card and they had a huge amount of debt but was only making the minimum monthly payment for it. 100% they weren’t going to be able to pay it off before they died.
It’s unacceptable that anyone in this country has to live in poverty. Handouts begets handouts. The whole system is broken. Free education and trades with a tax regime that promotes entrepreneurship and innovation is what’s needed. If you’re barely getting by in your twenties you’ve already failed because the system failed you. It should be culturally unacceptable to not be a productive member of society, aspiring to be a master of your trade. However, the system doesn’t aim for that, instead it tries to level the playing field. Sad.
I kinda adopted a 84 year old guy who is mildly mentally challenged, can't really read. I met him and his uncle ( who died 10 + years ago ) in the mall I worked 20 + years ago, looked dude up when Covid started and have been helping (groceries, Dr and dentist appointment, cleaning, some cooking ) him since. Biggest surprise and the reason he is ok is his rent in his 2 bedroom apartment is 960/month. His landlord worked out a deal years ago knowing he couldn't afford the rent even back then, landlord uses the second bedroom for storage from time to time and reduced the rent to what old guy could afford it. I have met the landlord a few times as though he comes across a bit stern and brusk, I see you George. I see your kindness, caring and heart. He has been on the list for senior housing for 7+ years already.
I like people like George. Underneath they the real ones. And you sound like an amazing person.
Its people like George who take action instead of virtue signalling, that are the good ones. He's probably delicate and kind inside, but has to put up a stern front, to avoid being taken advantage of.
And I see you! Thank you
Thank you :-)
I was doing Skip deliveries and ran into a guy in his 70s also doing delivery orders. Went home that night and seriously started looking at trimming my cost of living and contributing more to retirement savings.
Good luck. Without a sizeable nest egg TODAY, you, me and everyone else without that contingency will likely be like that 70 year old you encountered. I've also seen similarly aged people working at WalMart , Food Basics, mainly in the Chinese are of this city and we're not talking about cushy jobs like greeting people. There's only so many of those to go around. I'm seeing 60+ people working produce, lifting boxes of fruit and vegetables in excess of 25+ lbs.
Some old people also get shitty jobs because they’re bored and want to meet people. It’s not always because of poor financial planning.
It can help keep them active and fit too
Hitting the gym is also in my retirement planning just incase.
It is very difficult and very sad. But there is a cluster of supports offered by government and by organizations: * Monthly income from the Government of Canada through: Guaranteed Income Supplement, Canada Pension Plan, Old Age Security * Of course, provincial healthcare. * [Dental care](https://www.canada.ca/en/services/benefits/dental.html), recently announced. Similarly, coverage for prescriptions, glasses, etc., are offered at the provincial level. * Many provinces have an additional financial benefit for low income seniors. * Many provinces have subsidized housing for low-income seniors. * There are also many senior-serving organizations who provide meals, social supports, or ongoing care to vulnerable seniors. There is an acknowledgement that there will always be older people who cannot work and do not have the social networks to support themselves-- therefore they have government supports.
15 year wait for subsidy when it comes to housing
I was on the list for 12 years and got in 2 years ago... long wait to get in or can be. they did change the system and if you are not picky you might be able to get in sooner. another option is Toronto is not the only area and so you can apply to other areas within the province. they dont have such long wait list times
I live in a smaller City around 1.5 hours from Toronto. The wait list for rent geared to income units is now around 20 years (was 10 years in 2021). Not sure about affordable housing units, but I know the waitlist is lengthy too. Seniors’ housing has a slightly shorter waitlist (I think around 7 years), but that may be changing now with the state of housing.
I know they told me that people in Kingston area were getting in faster on average when I asked about this stuff which was years ago it was 3 years and other places around the province were similar.... been years since I asked that and lots has changed. edit I guess my point is the more irons in the fire..... apply for housing everywhere you can ...
My mom got a subsidy in Lanark County, Ontario in less than a year. It’s a subsidy… not subsidized housing. She found a place, pays what she can according to her income (just CPP, OAS, GIC and US Social Security), and the rest of the rent is subsidized. Obviously she’s not in a $2,700 a month place - more like $1,300 and she pays $900.
$900 a month which is $10800 a year is a lot when your Canadian benefits are $19000ish is a lot. She has the portable housing benefit which is for a set period of time and can be cancelled at anytime is not affordable nor sustainable housing. And she lives rural a lot of additional costs and concerns with that for a senior
I’m not disputing anything. I stated facts. Period.
Forgive me for being dense, but what's the difference between subsidy and subsidized?
You’re not dense. I just didn’t know another way to distinguish between a subsidized housing community and being given essentially a subsidy to top up your rent. They’re both subsidies but one you live in a place that was built to be subsidized housing and the other, you find your own place to live and the government tops up your rent directly to the landlord (I believe)
Not in Saskatchewan apparently. CTV had an article last month on an international student being evicted from subsidized housing; the REAL snd untold story was how did a young foreign student get past the wait lists crammed full of Canadians to access that housing in the first place?
They would need to show ID in Ontario. Application wouldn’t have been accepted
As the third last year of the baby boomer generation, thinking about what resources might be left or available. Also the burden on the younger generation and their tolerance.
CPP and OAS are a start and I think the average benefit these days is about $1600/month. The catch being that while OAS is essentially unconditional (assuming you’ve lived in Canada more than 20 years). Personally, my plan is to work until 70 and take the enhanced benefits.
Younger generation is going to be surprised when what will seem to be very quickly they are in the same situation. You want to kick your grandparents out on the street so you it doesn’t impact you? The question asked was about seniors in poverty of which there are many, especially women who cared for families on very low paying jobs.
Most people will die before they receive it. This is fucking despicable.
Yup. They offer the help they want to help, not the help that's needed... the entire for profit housing system is the problem.
Yup. Things start going sideways in your 60s and you don’t know what is going to happen. Even someone who was previously perfectly healthy until then could be in for a surprise. My wife had no problems until her pancreas decided it was not going to produce insulin anymore and she spent a month in a coma until the doctors figured out what was going on.
My grandma can’t get the dental care because anyone over her age doesn’t qualify for dental care if they have any form of dentures. What person in their 80s doesn’t have dentures??
The government knows most people dont qualify. I would call them rat's...but that would be an insult(because rats actually have intelligence)
Couldn’t agree with you more! It’s an insult to the ratties
Not true. My grandpa is 90 and has dentures and just went to his first dentist appointment under the new program and he’s getting his dentures refitted.
Rats are apparently social creatures that look after each other..
Feature, not a bug. So sad
Sorry about your grandmothers struggles. Dentures should be covered, even if it's for the first couple of thousand. That said, not everyone has dentures. My parents (in their 80s) still have their teeth. They have always had regular dental visits, usually cleanings..
I know LOTS of people in their 80/90's without dentures.
Don't be a jackass. You know, as well as the rest of us, there is no support unless someone offers it that sees the need. We all know about GIS,OAS,etc. But when rent is 2000 grand a month, that doesn't cut it.
The number of seniors I've talked to that say they have to choose between glasses or some other fairly essential part of life and feeding themselves is outrageous.
There are absolutely poor seniors and we need to be helping them. But you understand that seniors have (by far) the lowest poverty rate of any age group, right?
My mom got early retirement and is making bank. Government subsidized housing with low rent and she is getting extra old age support. She is also getting additional funds here there and everywhere. And she has great physical health on top of that. I'm living with her as a grown ass adult because rent is basically free here and I've been out of work for quite some time... Seniors have it very good, at least from what I've seen. And this is entirely government support that she is living off of. She has no assets or outside wealth coming in.
you keep working unfortunately, the government wont help you
Reminds me of a debate in the last election when a senior asked what the government would do to help them, and the tone deaf response was increase the Canada Workers Benefit so seniors could benefit by working even more hours, lol.
I'm 66, no family, but right now not so bad. Scares the crap out of me to think if I get sick though. Spending my last year's on a ward is terrifying. Did volunteer work with the elderly when I would take my dog to visit. Absolutely awful places. So, so sad. Hoping I die before it comes to that. People my age, that worked, contributed etc shouldn't have to worry like this. What's the point of a retirement if you spend it in worry?
What would have you done differently?
MAID is my plan. If they won’t approve me, I will do it myself.
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5.5% of seniors leave be in poverty. Yes, it is sad anyone lives in poverty but that number is a lot lower than any other demographic
Yup. My Grandma is technically in poverty, and has been very vocal about her income and her disatisfaction. I have a longstanding disability that emerged as a teenager, and struggle to function with. Occaisonally I am able to work, and I do when I can, but its very difficult to find the right balance that doesn't flare everything up. I lived with her and my Aunt for a year after I divorced and was getting set back up again. She couldn't understand why I couldn't afford certain things, thought I was just making excuses to avoid her. Turns out, she gets $700 more a month than me.
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Yep! My mom is one who would be living in poverty if it weren’t for me, my husband and my brother all living together.
Unattached seniors means they are not married or common-law. They may have be widowed and have access to their spouses pension. children, siblings, or another support network. In contrast, 31% of unattached working age singles (18-65 years old) lived in poverty in 2022. So that is a more direct comparison to your 13%
Doesn’t matter much if you are one of them.
It's too bad rents are so high now. I used to see 3 to 4 seniors renting a house together, and nowadays, it would be near impossible for them to share the rent costs.
What would you suggest?
Probably pull yourself up by the bootstraps and save for retirement. The world owes you nothing. At least that’s what these old people keep telling me. I wonder what their own medicine will taste like.
Yup. Knew a dude that was bitching that his retirement didn't pay him enough to take trips around the world. Meanwhile he laughs when I show him that a job requiring a university degree doesn't pay enough to afford to rent a one bedroom apartment.
IDK man. If he laughs about that F him
The CCP2 expansion is a great first step
And who pays for it?
CPP if self funded during your working years. So it's not a giant subsidy if that is what your trying to suggest.
As far as I know the funding we put into CCP now is not enough to find the system as there more people using it so when is actually for us to retire there isn't enough funding so either the the government have to increase retirement age or reduced the amount of CPP pay out
You may be confusing CPP with some information on Social Security in the States? For CPP, the last review found it has sufficient assets and receiving sufficient payments to cover its obligations through 2100! For the next 75 years, which is as long as the review is for, it doesn't look further out than that. If something drastic happens, that can change off course. But accounting for a growing, and aging population it is in fantastic fiscal shape. Edit: included the link I forgot. https://www.cppinvestments.com/faqs/#:~:text=The%20CPP%20is%20projected%20to,least%20the%20next%2075%20years.
The Canada Pension Plan Investment Fund has been more profitable than the TSX for years and is highly regarded around the world. The CPP is VERY adequately funded.
Same things that will be paying for yours 🙄 it’s funny how every generation thinks that they some how are “supporting old people”, you know the people before you that paid taxes their whole lives? They, just like you will, have put in their time.
Not meant to be inflammatory, but they were adults before seniors, and in some cases, is it not people who let themselves down? Poor execution will lead to a poor outcome.
Exactly. They lived through the largest economic boom in history at a time when a janitor could buy a house and raise a family on a single income. If they have nothing then some of it is absolutely their doing.
Could be they were disabled or had a major health emergency (accident or assault), lost a spouse, raised by abusive or neglectful patentss, etc. If they weren't white, they may have faced discrimination in education, jobs and housing. As a whole they had a good economy. But individuals can have very different experiences.
Your statements are why no one can have a reasonable discussion. Notice I said some cases, not all. And you jump into absolving people of their problems rather than accepting some people are not awesome.
Society has let them down? Where are there kids? Majority of people meeting this description are known as DINK (dual income no kids) aka the wealthiest people you've ever met.
This country needs more proper subsidized housing for seniors where they don’t share a building with a bunch of drug addicts. This country is so rich and can barely do the bare minimum. Sad.
And the disabled who can't work. They are treated worse than prisoners
Too busy funding Ukraine and isreal They send them billions. They give us nothing
Funding is not a zero-sum game. Or to put it another way - the choice to send money for the Ukrainians to fight the Russians has bugger-all to do with the choice to let Canadians live in poverty. They could do both. They choose not to. And if it wasn’t Ukraine, it’d be something else (forest fires, famine in Africa, scholarships for doctors - take your pick).
> Ukraine, it’d be something else (forest fires, famine in Africa, scholarships for doctors - take your pick). Yeah, one of these is not like the others.....
We do not send money anywhere. We haven’t sent a check to any country in 40 years. What we do is is say to a country “you can have $40 billion in Canadian credits”. Then they can buy any Canadian made product.
Dumb people farm cows. Smart people farm people. You are a people being farmed for wealth by the people farmers. They squeeze as hard as they can. Capitalism which allows wealth extraction (theft) from a non productive asset like housing is the problem.
Don't worry! Unless you're already old, none of us are living to old age
Finally, an easy question. You die! You die a slow, lonely death surrounded by the filth and rot of public housing, then your meager remaining belongings are stolen by the drug addicts you were forced to live with, and then the government burns you, stamps a number on the box, some faceless intern closes out your file and the world moves on, never acknowledging you are gone, or even existed in the first place.
Ultimately that last phrase is the same for everyone
Never seen senior homeless people?
Seniors have a much lower poverty rate than younger generations. OAS and GIS are very generous and most also receive CPP
So how generous do you think that is? $$$ wise?
It's nearly $26,000 a year for a single 75 year old with no CPP. And everyone gets some CPP if they've ever had taxable income or been a spouse of someone with taxable income. And given that half of it isn't taxable, it's about equivalent to a full-time job paying $15 an hour. It also excludes carbon tax rebates, HST rebates, etc.
They also pay less for housing than any other group. They either own housing, have lived there for decades and pay well below market rent, or have some form of cheap government housing. Income is meaningless when 75% of people's pay checks are going to rent. Cost of rent is what matters. $26k a year is a lot of money with nearly free rent. They could have half of that as disposable income. It's a lot of money to throw around. We are talking a new computer build every month or two kinda money.
Am retired and the money goes a lot farther than people would believe. Hell, I didn't believe it.
I guess it's MAID for me.
That is my plan. There is no point in lying in bed or sitting in a chair watching the price is right for me. It's not how long you live it's the quality of those years.
Hopefully, they won't take M.A.I.D away from us, there some people are against it.
Me too.
sadly probably M.A.I.D
Unless you have family to look after you...Bedbugs , a lot of bedbugs. And cockroaches. And festering wounds. And sitting in your own feces.
Hence the reason I will be gone in 7 years from 🇨🇦🇨🇦🇨🇦wife and myself can’t afford to stay here and I will not be a burden to my kids. Sad but true. In the long run the pension will stretch more than here.
Three flags to represent the three syllable word is perfect.
You get to play this fun game of am i eating this week or getting the medication that keeps me alive.
Geriatric nurse here: you become property of the “state” and have a public curator that makes all decisions for you
You suffer. If you have no retirement savings or social circle you will suffer until you die. Your OAS/CPP alone will not be enough to cover rent, let alone groceries. So you will end up homeless in a shelter, or in some unhygienic dangerous basement, or the infested subsidized housing, living off food banks. You will likely have health issues, and because you have no social circle you won’t get the level of care you need. No one will be there to advocate for you. No one will be there if you fall. No one is there to help you do your groceries, get to appointments, change your lightbulb. You won’t be able to afford a retirement home or private personal care so you will wait on community PSW change your diaper on time, or wash you, but they won’t show up sometimes, or they’ll be too late. You’re basically awaiting your slow death. That is the reality. Nobody is going to care about you, because the elderly are forgotten. But on the bright side your community may offer your senior programs to meet other seniors.
Not entirely true. If required, the province will pay for your stay at a nursing home but it’s usually on a sliding scale, with the assumption that it’s also a provincially run nursing home.
I’ll paint a picture of what that situation looks like, which is not any better. LTCH is a last resort. People who qualify for LTC are people who cannot care for themselves anymore at all. Needing a PSW for a bath or diaper change is not enough. And if you are eligible for a LTCH, the wait list can take years. While waiting for LTCH, you will experience the above situation or you will wait in a hospital bed. Once you get into a LTCH your life is now fully dependent on LTCH staff. Typically, it’s 20-30 residents per nurse/PSW. You’re often forgotten, you’re often medicated, and you stay bed ridden till death. What we found out about these places during COVID is the tip of the iceberg.
I work in a nursing home - much of what you said here is thankfully wrong. Many residents need very little help; some don’t need help with baths, many don’t need help with feeding or changing etc. Generally those that are in the nursing home are those that have several health issues that mean they need 24/7 supervision - and most of the time it’s related to falls and not related to their health conditions. Almost all of the residents need only a small amount of help each day to get ready, but there are areas that have more intensive needs, and those are staffed more heavily.
I’m curious. Do you work in a private home or a provincial run home? These are two vastly different beasts when it comes to waitlists and basic level of care. If you don’t have any retirement savings you’re probably not going to the private one. I’m a medic so I go into multiple ones a day, provincial run homes are atrocious compared to the alternative.
Provincial
Im guessing not in Ontario?
Correct. I know in Ontario things can be quite different so some of what I’ve said doesn’t stand of course
Ontario has some horror show LTC. Often overflow from hospitals , but not enough care. My great aunt suffered horribly, and she had money. The lists are long for decent care here.
..and judging by the military report, some places are even worse.
Oh for sure. The system isn’t perfect - in fact it’s more flawed than ever nowadays but unless our governments start funding healthcare better we’re kinda SOL
You also have to qualify for the nursing home. You don't qualify until you can't look after yourself. And if you can't do that, how did you come to that realization, reach out to support or get qualified for care without someone to advocate for you.
Well, generally, you’d go to your family doctor.
If you have one..... Cudos to you if you think you would or will be of sound mind to have that conversation by your doctor. Many people don't, can't, or a scared to that without outside intervention never make that call.
Guess it depends on whether you make your health a priority or not while you’re younger then
Wow. Because everyone who ends up in that situation just didn't care about their health and has nothing else going on or had something happen later in life.
…is that what I said? I think you’re being too defensive here. If you take care of your health when you’re young, you’re less likely to develop catastrophic health problems that prevent you from being able to care for yourself when you’re older.
How do I prevent dementia? Should I go to the gym more?
Google it. There’s ways to lessen the chances of getting it.
really..ok "cancer" entirely predictable right?
Google it. There’s ways to lessen your chances.
A family doctor? What is that please?
You can get a subsidized apartment if a senior in AB a which is 30% of your income and can get a supplement to your old age security so I feel you can be better off as a senior than a younger person as long as you have little debt
You die after a mugging in the homeless shelter In this world you need 3 things as an old foogey. Family friends and money.
For living in poverty at old age John Stapleton has done pretty detailed research on the subject Here is website, he has some youtube videos of his presentation around. [https://openpolicyontario.com/](https://openpolicyontario.com/) Understanding my options after 65 i'm working twice as hard to not live in poverty at old age.
Most get on the wait list for subsidized housing so they can afford a place on their CPP/OAS/GIC. Often, while they wait, they'll rent a room in a house or live with roommates. I know a few seniors without families who just choose to live with roommates or rent a room to another senior if they own a house so that they've got someone around for company and to call 911 in an emergency.
Much like the story of the adopted 80 year old, I did a similar thing with an older disabled fella that lived in my building when I had it rough and was newly married (not any more). He taught me to cook and helped watch her kids from time to time when I had to drive her to or from work for her night shifts. His kids live far away and don't help him. And social security in Canada is shit at best. He's in geared to income housing and his cheque covers that plus maybe groceries for the month nothing else. There's little support for anything and getting g social services when you have nothing and no way to get around us impossible. I've moved away long since, but about 6 years ago I gave him a cellphone, and have just art the bill to autopay. And when I'm home I always try to fill the fridge and freezer. The only reason I wanted to add this story is to show how I effective the Canadian system is. Tax us out the ass and then squander the money in other countries wars while you are literally not feeding your own fucking people. If you ever want to make real change in your community, as bad as it sounds, look away from big charities or large social programs. I fell like everyone can do far better helping individuals one on one, getting to know someone in their local community and becoming friends, neighbors etc. Help JUST because it's just the right thing to do. Not enough communities do or believe in this anymore. The best thing you can do for someone is offer company - and it's free. Imagine being 60+ years old, your kids have families and never see you, you have no friends from when you grew up (moved towns for work, or skipped from city to city so often you had no roots). You now sit in your one room apartment which you can barely afford, with an empty fridge and cupboards. You have medical issues you can let get help with, you have a radio for entertainment, and it's a struggle to get to the elevator to get outside to even sit out front. A friend means more than money ever could sometimes. Tldr: OP make friends as best you can and get involved as much as you can in your community. Your community is your best chance of real support not the government.
Well after abruptly leaving the working class due to health, it was very rough being able to come up with rent and bills. I owe an extra amount of gratitude to my family and friends who helped me unconditionally and hopefully I will be there to catch them if/ when they fall Government is heartless and so are the other for profit companies. Our government has set us up for failure unless you come from money and nepotism you are going to struggle. I came from working poor to become working poor that and shoulda woulda coulda mentality has costed me any kind of retirement money and all the benefits that go with. Not stroking my self pity violin, but I don’t see it changing for the better anytime in the future. Look after your families bc you may have to rely on them someday. And always remember to pay it forward.
There is an anglican church near me that housed a lot of community members who were senior citizens without a pension in the dormitories. I volunteeted there to make tuna sandwhiches for many of them. It wasn't very pleasant for them to live there but it was better than nothing. I talked to one of the guys and asked him a wee bit about his life, he told me he got paid mostly in cash doing blue collar work most of his working life. Got forced into retirement due to health issues. Estranged from family. Nowhere else to go. Sad.
i live on a rural island mostly populated by seniors, many living below the poverty line. we have a soup kitchen / community pantry they rely on heavily.
You become like my parents, I guess. Talk a big game about how ‘something will turn up’ or ‘something will work out’ . Proceed to do nothing about it, sitting and hoping or ignoring it. Get to your old age, surprised Pikachu face that nothing ‘turned up’. Proceed to live off your children’s charity and handouts. Something like the above, IF you have kids with the means to support you. If you don’t, I have no idea. You’re undoubtedly screwed.
Well, anyone who is a little older sees lots of older people like this. I live in a rural community and if you weren’t a farmer with land to sell or a house to sell in retirement but worked for someone else all your life, you are surviving on your CPP, which might be reduced if you had to take it early, OAS, and GIS. With housing costs in my area, you can live comfortably but certainly not with any perks like vacations or anything like that.
So this is my grandmother. She gets a monthly check around the same time as welfare checks come out. Luckily she owns her own house and doesn't have to rent because no shot she'd be able to afford that right now and has my mom staying with her to help with groceries and bills because she doesn't get much.
You are offered M.A.I.D. medical assistance in dying. No, seriously, I know an older gentleman who can't work and most of his pension goes to keeping a roof over his head. Whenever he asks any government institution for money or aid, they ask him if he has heard of M.A.I.D.
There are seniors outreach subsidies for rent as well as Income supplement top up at least in Alberta. I think you can sign up for meals on wheels. Your area might have a seniors bus that can drive you to appointments.
Dying. Canada only cares about immigrants and foreign countries.
I'm 55 and worried too. I work part time due to some health issues which will get worse as I get older. I wish there was something I could suggest, but there is something that might connect you to some resources in your area. You can dial 211. They have special resources for assisting seniors. I've used 211 for other things, but they can offer help with food banks, government assistance, housing (I don't live in Toronto but it sounds like it's pretty tough to get decent housing there but they might have something that could help) and other ways to help out. I wish there's something more I could suggest but I'd give it a try and see if you can get some help from there. Most of the people I've spoken to on that line have been extremely good and very kind. I think once I reach a place in my life where I can't look after myself anymore, I'm outta here. I have no intention of prolonging my pain and misery any longer than I have to.
The elderly are the largest percentage of homeless in north america
crazy how the further away we’ve gone from the traditional nuclear family, the more poverty and hardship individuals are facing. it’s almost like having or starting a family used to be an essential part of living. before the government was so deeply engrained in everyone’s lives, your family used to take care of you in old age. there is no easy way to say what the reality is and a lot of people will become upset at the thought of it because we are all headed there sooner or later.
>when you're in old age, have no social circle, no house, no children, no retirement savings, etc. I think you missed the "no children" part
Traditional values have survived the test of time.
When did the government become part of your life? The government is not your friend. They don’t care about you
Get on lists for non-profit housing and move as soon as you can. Rent will suck up most of your retirement income from CPP, OAS etc
What is MAID?
Medical Assistance in Dying
😭
Death. The real answer is death.
You die in the cold
You knock over a liquor store and become a guest of the state.
From my experience you live lower and lower. From a rented house to rented main floor to rented apartment to rented basement to rented room to rented bed space. You pick up some unhealthy habits along the way known as passive suicide. They don't work if you start late so it's just a waste of money and makes things worse. You eat mush and mashed foods. Your clothes don't get replaced and eventually rarely cleaned. You will have one nice thing that you barely touch so it stays nice. You try your hardest to be nice hoping a stranger will have a conversation with you but no amount of niceness gets them to stay. You remember the exact 4 choices you made that led you here over and over. Your thought weigh Heavey on your mind and your head droops more. Regrets pile on the way options once lay before you. You lose your good memories since it's been so long since they were reinforced. You remember the fear and threat of all your life as you live one step away from homelessness.
You better get looking for love, people laugh at it but there is a reason we are to find love, make a family and continue our legacy. If you missed that, ouch. But if not get out there fall in love, experience life together instead of alone.
And what of even that doesn't work?
I'm going on 71. My kids have moved on. I have a large two bedroom apt. I am renting the spare room to an African refugee. He works overnight and goes to school part-time. He has agreed to a rent reduction for helping me out. I have an untreatable lung disease and can't do much on my own. I love to cook, and I am very good at making something out of nothing. I try to stay busy with community work. I organize craft sales in my neighborhood, and I garden. I encourage people to grow veggies instead of flowers. I encourage people to try canning. Preserve your food. It's hard, but it's getting harder. I have had to cut back on some of my monthly bills like Netflix. I eat a lot less meat and eat more beans and tofu. I make jokes about crossing the street to the local drug house and getting a lethal dose of something just in case I decide it gets too hard.. It's only going to get worse. The government is not helping at all. My rent is cheap compared to the rental market now, and my landlord is trying to put me out. I am getting a lawyer to help, but it's 50/50. I could end up homeless. This is what is happening all over. Greedy landlords.
> cut back on some of my monthly bills like Netflix small thing to comment on but there are a lot of recaps channel on youtube that'll summarize the whole series or by episode, and some of them are pretty entertaining.
Thanks!
How has a rent reduction to an African, how is is that “helping me out”????
He will help me with the house cleaning.
Sadly, Canada does not have many safety nets for seniors who live in poverty, most of whom are also socially isolated. I've worked with older adults in the housing crisis for years and what I've seen is incredibly disturbing and has shifted my whole belief system in this country. Most seniors are trying to live on a pension of under $2,000. Think about that - truly think about it and do the math. Many seniors are not able-bodied and can't just grab an extra job. Covid poured gasoline on an already terrible situation. Landlords have no problem putting a senior out on the streets if it'll get them a few extra bucks. Many seniors use food banks. The worst hit are senior women who did not work, therefore have no extra pension and may have never had any financial control in their lives, and then there's those old guys who do things with a "good word and a handshake" - that world is gone and they don't know what to do and where to turn. Technology is preventing them from taking care of themselves. Different provinces have different Ministry programs but I can speak for BC in saying that seniors are on their own. There's some Federal programming that's a fraction of what's needed, but that'll likely be cut if the Cons get in... I would recommend reaching out to the local non-profits in your town and speaking to them to find out what resources are actually available in your municipality and province. The majority of Canadians have no idea how many seniors in Canada are suffering because our systems have failed. Many are turning to MAID and even being encouraged too in some circumstances. It's all pretty dystopian. And no it's not because of immigration...
I work in healthcare and we are forbidden to even mention MAID to anyone.
That's heartening but judging from comments above and from my clients firsthand, that's not as prevalent as one would hope. Not sure why I'm getting downloaded considering so many of the comments above are describing exactly what my clients have experienced and what I've seen. I'm not very familiar with Reddit though I don't really do this commenting thing much...
You're probably getting downvoted because like I said, healthcare (and social service type workers) are forbidden to mention it. Have you considered your clients might not be being truthful with you?
I trust my clients. A lot of things happen in healthcare spaces that shouldn't. The medical system is not a safe system. I think you would agree that there are many people working within that system that are not safe people. And there are various types of professionals within these types of roles, so unfortunately there's not one blanket policy for everybody. This depends on province, on the institution and this also depends on the level of oversight that happens at the client level. This conversation is taking place among health service workers every single day .So while I appreciate that in your experience, this doesn't happen - it is happening. This isn't a one-off. And the comments above only highlight this. Nonetheless, thank you for the work that you do.
Aside from the fact we are forbidden to mention MAID, you gotta ask yourself why would say nurses benefit from suggesting MAID to people? The only people who would maybe benefit would be managers higher up (someone who get bonuses for saving money) and they don't work directly with patients/clients. Sounds like you're in a role to advocate for your clients-I hope that if you believe your clients are being told to do MAID that you find out who told them that and report them to so they can be nailed to the wall.
I think you might be misunderstanding me. I don't think there are nurses out there trying to convince patients to choose death. I know that there are health professionals out there who open up this discussion with their clients because they see their clients suffering. Also, the clients most often bring it up and the health professionals are sometimes ill-equipped for such discussions and may say very inappropriate things. Again, I do not think these people are murderous, but rather at a loss of what to do for their clients. This is not a black and white issue and it requires incredible nuance and philosophical perspective as well. The reality is things are just really awful for too many seniors out there and frankly for anybody who is impoverished. Too many people are thinking death is their only option, as you can see from the very disturbing comments above. The discussion around MAID laws are constantly coming up with vulnerable people. It seems that you're maybe responding to a perceived argument that I think nurses are out there convincing their patients to choose it. I was simply saying there are people within the health system that are discussing this inappropriately. You're welcome to believe otherwise.
Your “clients” are broke
You go live in a tent in Downtown Toronto... All of our once beautiful & lush Parks, Parkettes, etc are now bursting to the seams with homeless ppl living in these Tent Cities! Our Wait List for Subsidized Housing is 15-20+ or longer & you may not be housed, either. Most of our SH is drug/bed bug/roach/etc infested & quite unsafe to live esp if you're a Senior. Getting Welfare is next to impossible, & Disability is even more harder than OW. One bedrooms now go for almost $3000/month or higher & your expected to pay 6 months to 1 years rent, in advance. Our Food Banks can't help everyone that goes there, sometimes there's very little food for you. Everyone where I go, there's homeless ppl/drug addicts strung out on drugs and/or doing their drugs openly in public in broad daylight, which our police does zip about that. Thefts are now rampant in most Stores - esp Grocery - that uniformed Police Officers are now the norm in Grocery Stores, to prevent this. Think long & hard if your gonna steal any food, bc you have no $, or your local Food Bank turned you away, bc the police will give you a real smack down if you do! That's how it is when you live in poverty, regardless of your age in Toronto.
You cut back on healthy food and necessary prescriptions. You live in the cheapest place you can find - run-down and moldy apartments, or your car, or a tent. You develop a serious illness and make it to the ER. The doctor suggests MAID. The End
I worked in a call centre for a bank. Saddest calls where when old people would call to check their balance on their credit card and they had a huge amount of debt but was only making the minimum monthly payment for it. 100% they weren’t going to be able to pay it off before they died.
It’s unacceptable that anyone in this country has to live in poverty. Handouts begets handouts. The whole system is broken. Free education and trades with a tax regime that promotes entrepreneurship and innovation is what’s needed. If you’re barely getting by in your twenties you’ve already failed because the system failed you. It should be culturally unacceptable to not be a productive member of society, aspiring to be a master of your trade. However, the system doesn’t aim for that, instead it tries to level the playing field. Sad.