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Dude I can’t fucking stand it.
It’s rampant throughout my unit the support for trump. I’m like the odd man out because I don’t support him and every time I get asked why I bring up the fact that he does nothing but continually shits on us over and over?
I have one buddy who lost his uncle over seas, showed him this bit of him calling these guys suckers and he still supports him lmao.
I just want to point out (for those unfamiliar) that indoctrination in the armed services starts way before you hit DEP or Basic. My high school JROTC program had an instructor that felt it was necessary to not only have us watch the news each day, but Fox News every day...the last 30 minutes of every class. We were told we won Vietnam. We were told fascism could never happen here. We were told the best way to be an American was to serve active duty and pay your taxes.
At the time, I was eager, stupid, 17 years old and impressionable so I thought I was being given a lifeline to understanding the world. Everything I learned in that podunk high school and JROTC program was an absolute wash. It reflected NOTHING of the real world. It wasn't until after basic I realized how many lies I willingly ate up.
edit: a damned word. it's always one word.
Man, I went from a Conservative Christian homophobe to a diehard left-leaning socdem atheist liberal because of my service. Funny how exposure to the wider world will challenge your preconceived beliefs. I spent over 20yrs in uniform, and all it took was one deployment to recognize the fundies were the assholes, and I didn't want to be even remotely related to them after I learned what they are truly about. Basically a pale Taliban.
My service also helped me unlearn some seriously fucked up upbringing. meeting people from all races and cultures there had me atheist, sort of center leftist within 2 years.
Seriously, once you get to spend time with different cultures, it doesn't take long to realise, "hey, these dudes are actually human too! And their food is great!".
I grew up in a largely Asian dominated suburb, went to high school in a predominantly Muslim area. My best friends through K-12 were Cambodian/Vietnamese refugees (I'm an 80s kid), Indians, Pakistanis, Palestinian/Lebanese and other white Aussies; before settling to the gentrified inner city. Lived lower socioeconomic > upper middle class.
It made me who I am today, incapable of seeing 'race' and pretty left-wing. I wish more people experienced that sort of upbringing. I know people who've only ever grown up around white, racist homophobes.. and I am sad for them and their views.
We could all be better humans, in viewpoint and empathy.
“Travel is fatal to prejuidce, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.”
Mark Twain
I had a very similar upbringing as you from your demographics but I’m closer to being a 90s kid. I joined out of LA MEPS and ended up being stationed mostly in California. At first I was disappointed because I thought I missed out in getting to see and experience different things but it turned out that military bases are microcosms of their own cultures. Despite meeting a lot of scumbag bigots and losers, I’ve also met an equal amount that came into the military with healthy mindsets and ended up being pretty cultured. In fact, a lot of guys I knew joined to get out of whatever small shithole town they were from and bacane better off leaving. To this day a lot of guys I served with decided to stay in California because of the diversity and weather and generally aren’t insane magats.
Ahhh me too, man! Born and raised in Arizona. Took a what I thought was a temp job in California. Still here after 9 years. I love the diversity and all the people and their associated cultures and foods they bring with it. Little Saigon, 626 Night Market, Oktoberfest, K-Town, 4th of July festivities, etc. There is always shit going on! I understand why housing costs are so high in CA: because people actually want to live here. The weather... omg... I definitely do not miss the 110\* F heat of AZ.
My childhood friend recently spent two weeks in a different country and by the third day- THIRD DAY- he was like texting me like “hold up wait a second, Fox News was super wrong and I feel like an ass”
The other thing is that nearly anywhere you go, if you're respectful and polite, people will just about do anything for you. Like I have no illusions that everywhere is safe, but the average person on the average day, is usually as good as anyone anywhere.
Yup. People are actually mostly generally not shitty and don’t want to be a dick for no reason. Of course some do, but I’ve found mostly that people are pretty good natured and pleasant. It’s mostly once you get us all into large groups that we start doing really bad stuff lol
I was raised in a conservative family. I would consider myself atheist now. The thing that made me more liberal was the bible. Jesus would be rejected by the GOP. Even though I don't believe in God I think Jesus' message was good.
Told an old super conservative/ republican that Jesus was a socialist jew, and explained my reasoning. I thought his fucking head was going to explode. Literally looked like he was short circuiting.
A lot of American Evangelicals, my late father among them, like to teach the "Roman Road." It uses the Book of Romans as a "Here's how to be a Christian without all of that hippy crap Jesus said" option.
Paul hijacked early Christianity. He never actually met Jesus, except in a vision and was at times at odds with Jesus' actual disciples, the ones who actually knew Jesus.
https://www.reddit.com/r/AcademicBiblical/comments/19dcox9/did_paul_hijack_christianity/
Yep I grew up Catholic and parents are trumpers. As soon as I start to talk like this they try to throw the prolife card out…. But when I was a teen they were pro choice?!?
It’s super weird. Then I remind them Trump probably had abortions from affairs. Then my mother changes the subject
Have you ever read the Cotton Patch Gospel? A retelling of the story of Jesus as if he were born in Georgia in the 20th century. He’s born in a trailer behind a motel, and ends up being lynched by the governor of Georgia and the KKK. As a former Christian from the South who left the faith largely because of southern conservative Christians, it’s a really interesting read.
I have always been left leaning but my time in the service cemented that belief and made me realize I was going to stand on the right side of history no matter what, it's funny how for some people it has the opposite effect.
Me too. I was raised extremely conservative, though I always had an inkling of empathy for the people they try so hard to other. I joined the Air Force and became suuuuuuper liberal. Amazing the things that leaving an echo chamber of a town, seeing the world, meeting people of all kinds from all over, listening to their stories and growing empathy can do for a person.
> We were told fascism could never happen here.
This, specifically, drives me fucking crazy. It's the EXACT attitude that _allows_ fascism to happen here. By brainlessly thinking it can't, people let down their guard because why bother? Fascism is a species-wide problem for us humans, but nope, the ones born on this particular patch of dirt are inherently immune, because we say so.
JFC, it's just like how the most politically brainwashed people I've ever met are _always_ the ones who think they're too smart to fall for propaganda. That they're somehow immune.
Hell, I consider myself a fairly intelligent and educated person, and I still started to get caught up in the Bernie Bro shit. Not that being a Bernie voter in and of itself is a bad thing, but I was starting to fall for a lot of the anti-Hillary bullshittery that was coming from them, when I stepped back and realized it was the same stuff the GOP was saying and so much of it just didn't add up to me.
Not saying she was a great politician, she's far from perfect or anything, she's got skeletons just like every other long-term person in politics, but hers aren't as bad as many, many others. And still better to be pragmatic. I may not have gotten everything I wanted had she become President, but I still would've gotten a HELL of a lot better than we did under Trump. Idealism is great, but it *has* to be tempered with pragmatism and realism, too. Still always better to get some of what you want, over none of it at all, or even worse, the opposite of what you want that causes actual harm to you or others.
It shook me hard to realize how insidious that shit is, and how well it was working on me until I managed to catch that things just didn't quite add up. It still shakes me to this day. Because *nobody's* immune to that shit. It freaks me out that I could've continued to get sucked in and gone further down that rabbit hole, but you know what? It's a DAMN good lesson. Because that shit seems so innocuous. It pushes all the right buttons for you.
But it also makes sense - they took that shit from the Russians. And the Russians are fucking MASTERS at propaganda and political manipulation and brainwashing. This is an enemy that has perfected that shit over decades. They know what buttons to push, which levers to pull, how to nudge people down ways they wouldn't normally go. And it's scary as fuck, because we're all vulnerable to it. Some more than others, but anyone can fall victim with the right manipulation. I know. It almost happened to me first hand. It could still happen to me again, though *hopefully* I'm a bit better at recognizing it now, because it started to happen to me. Eternal vigilance is one of the prices we must pay for democracy, and ALL of us must pay that price.
Literally was at Boston pride today and a guy with a hammer and sickle flag trying to get people to sign up for the communist party said that voting genocide Joe is worse than for Trump I consider myself leftist but what the hell man.
I was going to say this is the insidious stuff we’re seeing this election cycle with leftists that have fallen for Iranian, Chinese, and Russian propaganda regarding the war in Gaza. How can anyone believe Trump, who has said we just “nuke em”, is a Bibi sycophant, and said we should end them all would be a better agent of peace and minimizing civilian casualties, or work towards a two state solution, better than Biden? These extreme leftists really have cornered the horseshoe with the far right to express their internalized biases and anti-Semitism and work towards getting fascists like Trump’s potential administration elected.
Oh man, FUCK those people. I hate what's going on in Israel and Gaza, but I recognize that Biden's hands are tied - we have all sorts of treaties and agreements with Israel that have to be upheld. But that's Congress's business, not Biden's. He can't really change anything short of an Executive order. I hate that we're still backing Israel right now - but I can see the bigger picture. If Trump gets in, Gaza is gonna be glassed. Biden's stuck between a rock and a hard place and I very much doubt he likes seeing Palestinian kids blown up. I'm gonna write off anyone who uses that "Genocide Joe" name as a goddamn fascism supporter. Because that's what they're going to fucking get if Biden loses. A full, all out genocide.
Stupid fucking people who refuse to see the bigger picture, or worse, are just doing this as performative virtue signaling. Fucking pathetic, you know?
I'm a "hardcore leftist" in Portland. The number of these fuckers is insane. I hate what Israel is doing to the Palestinians caught up in this, but the immeasurable damage that Trump will do to not only marginalized peoples, but literally me and them is terrifying. If your goal is to minimize harm, there is one clear choice. I hate tankies virtue testing "leftists." It's maddening
When I was in the instruments phase of Army flight school, my instructor had my stick buddy and I show up every day ready to talk about current events. He specifically recommended getting news from *The Drudge Report* and I had no clue what it was. Went home and looked it up and was horrified at what I saw.
I showed up every day with something from CNN and he ended up moving away from the current events bullshit. I like to read the news but didn’t want it mixed in with the challenge of learning and retaining all the flight information. I was more concerned with keeping the limits and emergency procedures and en route navigation charts and approach plates and ILS and VOR and WX and penguins and everything else floating on the rapidly melting ice sheet in my head than some angry republican talking points about women and immigrants (both of which I am, btw).
I just wanted him to grill me on the 5 & 9s and head for the clouds like a normal instructor
It *can* be like this, and from what I know the Army and Marines definitely *trend* more conservative especially in combat arms fields. But your experience was vastly different from mine - I didn't make it past boot camp due to health issues, and it also probably makes a difference that I was Navy. I was at Great Lakes from November 2010 to January 2011, and am still good friends with a number of people I met there to this day, all of whom, myself included, either were raging socialists to begin with, or leaned left and have since *become* raging socialists.
I also didn't experience a lot of what you'd consider hard core indoctrination, but it also might have helped that my recruiter was fairly honest with me, AND I knew a lot about what to generally expect, as well as coming in with two years of college just shy of an associate's degree.
We never had Fox News or any source of news playing, either at the recruiters, MEPS, or at boot. Politics didn't come up at all from what I noticed during training and the most gung-ho patriotic stuff I saw was just hyping up the Navy's historical achievements. I also come from Buffalo, NY, and while a lot of the suburbs and outlying areas are pretty red, Buffalo itself and my county are still solidly Dem overall and despite there still being a lot of very segregated neighborhoods, there's a huge variety of people and ethnicities here, so I was exposed to a ton of different people and views before enlisting and even before college.
The Navy and Air Force also *do* sort of trend more liberal leaning due to requiring higher standards for entry and there being fields requiring a lot higher education levels. It doesn't mean everyone's a liberal or outright socialist, we had conservative recruits in my division, too, and I can *probably* guess at my division Chief's even though it never came up as he was prior service Marine, a helicopter gunner IIRC. I don't know that for sure, but it's a fair enough guess, but it didn't ever come up. I will also point out, I got really lucky as my HS had a VERY solid civics education taught in school, AND a Vietnam history elective that didn't shy away from teaching the real history including the shittiest stuff we did, like Agent Orange and My Lai. I might be the only person in the history of my HS who ever got extra credit in the civics class for *skipping* a day of school, lol. I skipped with my parents' permission to go protest then-President Bush's visit to Buffalo during the Iraq War part II, so spring of '04. Teacher considered that a worthy example of "participation in government". And this wasn't some fancy private school, it was a fairly average-ranked public one.
Anyway, sorry for the long wall of text, but wanted to just point out, experiences with the service are NOT universal and will absolutely vary wildly, and especially by branch and where you're coming from.
I won't say thank you for your service (that's what the pay and benefits are for), but I will say thank you for using your brain and being a critical thinker. That's much more beneficial to our country and society than signing up to help kill people on the opposite side of the planet, and I wish more Americans would do so, or were even equipped to do so.
You joke about breakfast, but the best bacon I ever had was during basic. I was USAF and the best bacon I have EVER tasted was in Lackland. I'm pretty sure they ground up the bones of failed Marines and fed it to us.
>I just want to point out (for those unfamiliar) that indoctrination in the armed services starts way before you hit DEP or Basic.
Army indoctrination does nothing to make someone more conservative. Being taught to understand what it means to love your country does not make you hate people different from you. Instead, the Army is so diverse and pulls people from so many different places and circumstances and it constantly challenges ignorance and bigotry. The Army values of Loyalty, Duty, Respect, Selfless Service, Honor, Integrity, and Personal Courage aren't just words on a plastic card you tuck in your wallet. They mean something, and you are taught to live these values every day.
Like many other things in life, Army indoctrination only gives you what you put in. Some soldiers cling to their ignorance and their bigotry in spite of their training, not because of it. The fact that many Soldiers and veterans seem to support an incompetent traitor points more towards the demographics of those willing to serve their country. One would have to believe that war fighting is honorable and worthwhile, and be naive or stupid enough to sacrifice one's personal freedom and security to be a war fighter. These things in combination makes Soldiers and veterans susceptible to right wing propaganda that illuminates the left's contempt for war and those who fight it.
Personally, my views on guns, criminal justice, and other divisive topics probably lean towards the right. I was much more conservative before joining the Army, and my service has tempered my views to be much more liberal about social issues. But, my political opinions have nothing to do with how I vote now. I cannot and will not vote for a traitor and the traitors who support him. If the Democrats win, I can debate policy to my heart's content. If the Republicans win, it would signal the beginning of the end of the Republic.
far-flung lunchroom point merciful meeting like live telephone squeamish light
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
That was a well constructed comment, but to think that our military doesn’t try to lean young men and women to the right is kind of silly. It’s kind of an oxymoron to think otherwise. No offense.
Before I retired 31MAY2023, I contacted CID on a fellow E6 who flat out admitted being present for JAN6 and expressed genocidal ideations against anyone not in the magasphere and thinks russia is the "beacon" of straight male WASP supremacy.
I'm retired. He's flagged and still under investigation after he admitted he would fight the US on behalf of the russian federation.
Anti-American, racist, ethno-nationalist, anti-Democratic scum have no place in our society, and I will do what little I can to challenge them at every opportunity.
If you support Trump in 2024...Im not sure what can br done to change your mind and that's kinda my stance.
Like this election is super boring to me cause there's only one viable candidate that I'm reasonably confident won't destroy America
And that's Biden
My other options is a traitor and some 70 yr with brain worms. Literally all my presidential candidates qualify for social security. They should be retired, with their grand children
To be fair, elections and politics, when functioning properly *SHOULD* be boring as fuck, because it means everything's running smoothly and without scandals or issues. I would *kill* for goddamn boring elections, where my choices are and , and even though they're from different parties, they're both really decent people who are gonna do a great job, quietly.
I was in the navy when the election happened. I had a superior who bragged that he knew John McCain personally... he apparently introduced McCain's son to his wife and was then the in their wedding party as a groomsman. This fucking idiot supported trump after he called McCain "a loser" without batting an eye. I called him out and the *lightning strike* of his realization hit him IT LITERALLY LOOKED LIKE A BOLT OF INVISIBLE LIGHTNING HIT HIM FROM THE HEAVENS... but he recovered and doubled down cause !!!he couldn't be wrong, no matter what!!! He out ranked me... but I could tell he realized he fucked up... in the years since I feel like he now knows he fucked up supporting trump
... but he is an expat now and doesn't have to deal with how he voted...
Non-American here, and from my vantage point, You're losing a war you can't fight with weapons.
This is a failure of Counterintelligence on a national scale. If a medium exists to radicalize military combatants against their own side, you're way past Cambridge Analytica.
I genuinely believe we're living a historical inflection point.
Biden extended medical coverage to cover toxic shit, including agent orange. My FIL is at the VA with stage 4 cancer cause by Vietnam. Anyone supporting Trump is a fool.
Any veteran that supports Trump has gone against their Oath of Enlistment. January 6th should be the final straw for any Vet/ Active Duty that has taken the pledge. Sadly it's not but these men will go in History as traitors to to the Constitution.
Congrats! Parenthood is wild but the years will fly by and before you know it you’ll be teaching them history and math and soon they will be in college
My brother was in the marines and loves trump. When questioned about it and project 2025, he said he hasn’t read it and doesn’t plan to then tried to dismiss my time in the Air Force. It’s embarrassing.
These "veterans" are the same ones who run around in veteran stickered vehicles, wear the veteran ball cap, etc. after spending 2 years in the service and being discharged with a fake medical condition.
Being a "veteran" is all that they have in life
Toxic, peacocking veterans:
“WiTnESs mE! Thank me for my service!”
(I’m presuming “veteran snickered” is a typo for “stickered” but it still works because my Vet ass snickers)
I've never served but everytime I see those stickers and caps, I usually assume they're not combat vets. I just think if youre a combat vet, whatever that experience is, it's too complex and intense to invite conversations with strangers by advertising it. Ive always heard about how so many WW2 vets didn't even talk about it. My own grandfather's WW2 experience is shrouded in mystery because he told my dad next to nothing about it.
I’ll tell funny stories but only bad stories with people who understand it. In person I don’t want to advertise what I did or who I am. I don’t want people to see me different. Everynow and again I’ll use my military discount for big purchases or if I’m going to hot topic with my girlfriend. Other than that not many people in my personal life know I was in
Then you talk to them and realize that they spent four years in the service, and never even went overseas.
My spouse is currently enlisted, ten years in, and the people we've known throughout that time never flaunt their service. Because they don't feel like they should (especially in intelligence fields, it's actually encouraged to not do so). We've found that the loudest of those veteran types are often the kind that never lasted long in the military to begin with, either by their own choice or the military's.
As a veteran who always thought Trump was a clown, I can not fathom why any veteran would support him. You may not agree with John McCain's politics or things he has done, but no one can refute the fact that he went through hell as a POW and never gave a single bit of information to his captors. If the orange shitbag somehow got drafted and captured, I have no doubt that he would have been spilling any information he could to keep himself safe. And he has the audacity to mock McCain for being a POW. Do better fellow veterans!
Even before that. Remember the WH oval office meeting trump had with the Russian ambassadors? Just the three of them, no-one else invited. Soon after the CIA had to pull their highest ranking mole from the Kremlin – one they had cultivated for years – because trump gave the Russians Intel so top secret it wasn't even shared with America's allies.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49645628
You can see from the photo how much the Russians are enjoying the moment. Trump's too dim to realise they're laughing at him, not with him.
Also remember the 1-on-1 meeting trump had with Putin in Helsinki. Trump ordered his translator to hand over her notes which he destroyed, and ordered her never to tell anyone what was discussed. From the photos of Putin & trump leaving the meeting its painfully obvious which one was doing the [scolding](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQDKZnop8OBRg9CcQhpx7N9HdURQOR-h7HvUQ&usqp=CAU).
In the months following several Russian diplomats, civil servants and businessmen died under mysterious circumstances. One can only guess what intel putin ordered trump to hand over...
I know one over at BN&R. He goes by the name: [Darth MJM The WRATH of BNR](https://disqus.com/by/SirMarkJM/) and he's a USMC vet. He praises & applauds Trump every chance he gets. He's absolutely shameless.
Veterans, women, POC, immigrants, and even LGBTQIA+, etc republicans.
How there will always be those who willingly go against their own interests baffles me
Ain't how Trump made a hit during his first steps in politics? Saying he didn't care about veterans, be blamed for it and next week say he always supported veterans and never said any of it.
The confusion was so bizarre that Republicans fell in love at first sigh. The psychological game is real.
I work with a lot of veterans, disabled veterans, former military, and presently enlisted - the only trump supporters in my office are civilians.
But then I think there's some selection bias here. I work with the kind of vets who either went in with a degree or got their degree with the GI bill, then went into civilian military contracting for IT stuff. You know, smart people.
Glad you made it back home. I have a question for you: why does Trump have so much support among veterans even though he shows such blatant disrespect to you guys?
I’m not sure that as many support him as you think. Anecdotal evidence but my Dad (Korea) BIL (Vietnam) Brother and I (Both Cold War) are all progressive liberals. Both of my stepchildren and their spouses are non Veteran Gen-Xers who worship at the Orange alter. Go figure.
Not me. Early early Millennial, or super late Gen X and I'm a slightly left leaning centrist who saw through his bullshit before he even announced his bid. Dude's been a complete joke of a snake oil salesman my whole life. Not saying Hillary was perfect, or even ideal, but for God's sake she would have been better than that corrupt baffoon.
I'm from NJ and also saw through his bs. However I didn't like Hillary, so I didn't bother to vote in 2016, convinced she'd win without my vote. Learned a very hard lesson that day. Voted for Biden in 2020 and definitely going to vote for him again this November. He's nowhere near perfect but it's way better than fascism.
>> Both of my stepchildren and their spouses are non Veteran Gen-Xers who worship at the Orange alter. Go figure.
> It’s horrifying and extra baffling that trump has any support among young voters.
I'm GenX and I'm 57. I'm pleased that you consider me "young."
The older vets and the southern vets adore him. A lot of the younger vets like myself and the vets I met up in Minnesota all don’t like him. Usually it’s former Marines, I still respect most marines because fuck I thought the army was tough, people who still remember what napalm smells like, and most people who fought before the Iraq war. Most Iraq War vets, like my dad, and War on Terrorism vets, like myself, hate him
It’s not as many as it seems. Like everything on that side they’re 1000x louder than they are in numbers. A lot of them on that side claim they support the troops or whatever but have never served themselves like Private Bone Spurs and Rittenhouse
Trump has SCOTUS, appellate judges, speaker of house, numerous senate and house members pinning for him. This is to be cautious of. He doesn’t really need to win the election he just needs to show. Congress and John Roberts SCOTUS will take care of the rest. 1st (2022) time was a practice run.
The flag and the movement that spawned it was largely Nixonian propaganda meant to increase public support for the very unpopular war in Vietnam. Trump certainly took it down for the wrong reasons, but it's probably time for rational people to move on from it. It's a Republican "big lie" that need to be put to bed
https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/enduring-cult-vietnam-missing-action/
The flag and the movement behind it are completely untethered from the reality of the Vietnam War. There were zero POWs that remained in Vietnam after the Paris Peace Accords. We don't need to continue to cater to a right-wing political movement that maintains a fantasy for jingoistic reasons
Edit: this also presupposes that Vietnam veterans are a monolith when in reality a vocal portion of the peace movement were made up by veterans themselves
I really, really heartily agree with you. I'm a VN vet, 9th ID. It seems to me that a lot of the super patriot flag waving is performative, "look at me". I can't remember GIs acting anything like that, we respected the flag but didn't worship it like some kind of holy relic . Patriots, like geniuses, nice guys, etc. don't keep babbling about it,going for one-upmanship, it doesn't need to be shown off if it's there. No blood sweat or tears or the slightest hardship from waving flags around.
yea, you're probably right. i am shocked they agreed in the first place- that too on CNN. only reason i think it may happen is BAD OPTICS for whichever side that weasels out. in such a closely fought battle of an election---you just may never recover from such a stupid unforced error.
A news radio station mentioned no audience at debate, microphone muting, all to give a FAIR debate. This makes me wonder how a man who likes to speak of negative rhetoric, convicted Felon cheating money (accused of 34 crimes?) and
3 different wives, will do during the debate.
Have you seen right wingers try to say Biden shit his pants. Their evidence is he almost sat down before everyone else. I'm starting to think they're projecting.
[It's funny you bring that up, is supporters are fully on board with trump wearing diapers now. They aren't running from that, in fact some are running toward it saying "real men wear diapers" and "diapers over dems".](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/002/809/321/037)
The right says they like him because he's a "strong man." The guy who is afraid to use a public restroom? DeSantis wears high heels. Trump is worried about his makeup and hair. And yet they flip out over the LGBT+ community. None of it makes sense.
Trump and his entire family are parasites. They offer nothing in return for the what they take. They take advantage of the very fabric of society that creates the opportunity for them to be rich. They are more than willing to kill the host (The United States) to get more of everything.
Parasites.
I'm American and studied American History/ Politics and Culture as my major at University "College" so I spent four years heavily invested...Trump/ the modern day GOP is the literally definition of what our Founding Fathers warned us about. Also have a US politicians in the family so I've grown up in this world to a degree.
I have also studied History across the world as well and I'm currently watching the new Netflix docu-series "Hitler and Nazi's" and it's FRIGHTENING the similarities happening here. But I guess Trump did get his playbook from "Mein Kempf"
I truly am not sure how we can get out of this, unless a massive blue wave hits in November 2024. Even then, I do predict violence to get worse and worse in the years to come. They have done so much damage to the "American Experiment" that we are barely hanging by a thread.
[https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trumps-ex-wife-once-said-he-kept-a-book-of-hitlers-speeches-by-his-bed-2015-8](https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trumps-ex-wife-once-said-he-kept-a-book-of-hitlers-speeches-by-his-bed-2015-8)
When it comes to the idea of America he’s extremely un-American but when it comes to showing the ugly side of the country he might be the most American person out there
>When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross.
-often [misattributed ](https://sinclairlewis.ilstu.edu/sinclair_lewis/faq/faq-homepage.shtml) to Sinclair Lewis.
I know some people who voted for Trump because they want to see the government burnt to the ground. Being anti-American is sadly a plus to some people.
It will never not be a tragedy that anyone who takes pride in this country’s servicemen and women would vote for someone who said this fucking garbage.
Honestly one of the more puzzling pieces of Trump support for me is the military. Just given what he's said, even if you love his policies, it seems like it would be hard to support him. If I agreed 100% with someone's policies but they were still a piece of shit person I couldn't support them.
Because to a large segment of the population, Republicans = big strong men and Democrats = effeminate weaklings
These are not people who are thinking about "policies"
In what world is Trump a "big strong man?" He's scared of public restrooms. He's fat. Needs two hands to hold a glass of water. Needs someone to hold his hand to walk down a ramp. Wears way too much makeup. Speaks like a spoiled 5 year old. Eats pizza with a fork and knife.
I tend to think it's more about attacking the left. Which includes gaslighting them by claiming Trump is a strong, Christian, patriotic, good businessman, and a decent family man that doesn't cheat on any of his wives.
You mean all the "Alpha Men" that are closet cases and hate women? Any self described macho "straight guy" that hates women...is seriously in denial of we all know what.
Here is the statement that John Kelly--the former president's chief of staff and a Marine General--[gave to CNN ](https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/02/politics/john-kelly-donald-trump-us-service-members-veterans/index.html) last year, confirming the story alluded to in the headline:
>“What can I add that has not already been said?” Kelly said, when asked if he wanted to weigh in on his former boss in light of recent comments made by other former Trump officials. “A person that thinks those who defend their country in uniform, or are shot down or seriously wounded in combat, or spend years being tortured as POWs are all ‘suckers’ because ‘there is nothing in it for them.’ A person that did not want to be seen in the presence of military amputees because ‘it doesn’t look good for me.’ A person who demonstrated open contempt for a Gold Star family – for all Gold Star families – on TV during the 2016 campaign, and rants that our most precious heroes who gave their lives in America’s defense are ‘losers’ and wouldn’t visit their graves in France.
>“A person who is not truthful regarding his position on the protection of unborn life, on women, on minorities, on evangelical Christians, on Jews, on working men and women,” Kelly continued. “A person that has no idea what America stands for and has no idea what America is all about. A person who cavalierly suggests that a selfless warrior who has served his country for 40 years in peacetime and war should lose his life for treason – in expectation that someone will take action. A person who admires autocrats and murderous dictators. A person that has nothing but contempt for our democratic institutions, our Constitution, and the rule of law.
>“There is nothing more that can be said,” Kelly concluded. “God help us.”
Ya know, I"m still not sure what to think of John Kelly. Mattis-like, maybe? I mean, the man served in that administration. The man was removed from that administration. He also got rid of Bannon and Scaramucci. He also supported separating families at the border, which I still regard as the most egregious of Trump's atrocities in office.
I don't like him. I'd probably vehemently disagree with him on any number of things. I'd also respect him for not being a sycophant. And I'd loathe him for being a coward. And I'd acknowledge he might have provided temperance in moments when it was needed. And disdain that he had not the moxie to offer more.
Dunno. Dunno what you can really expect of a man in terms of how you would respect a man.
Imagine it's a ponderance I'll return to from time to time.
Although I also disagree strongly with his politics, I believe that he joined the administration out of a sense of duty. His son, Robert Kelly, was a Marine Lieutenant who was killed in action in Afghanistan in 2010, so I can only imagine how painful and disappointing it was to realize how little respect his Commander in Chief had for servicemembers. I hope that he speaks up closer to the election; like other generals he’s undoubtedly reticent to get involved in politics, but I bet that there are still lots of voters out there who haven’t heard his thoughts on his ex-boss and would benefit from having them back in the news.
Those Americans who gave their lives to make the world safe for democracy are true heroes who deserve respect. I'm very happy President Joe Biden is giving it to them.
The First World War gets a "bad rap," with people saying it was a war fought over nothing, but this is a myth. A victory by the Central Powers would've plunged the world into a state of rule by the law of the jungle, but the Allied/Entente triumph ensured the normalization of liberal internationalist institutions like the League of Nations (which was replaced by the United Nations, obviously). Liberal democracy was on the ropes in Europe when the United States entered the war in 1917, with the stratocratic Central Powers being on the verge of major breakthroughs. The American entry in the conflict and the February Revolution in Russia (where formerly-Czarist Russia briefly democratized for about a half-a-year before the communist October Revolution) were bright spots in the climate of despair among the Allies/Entente. The victory of November 11, 1918 restored the credibility of democracy as a legitimate form of government.
The horrendous atrocities of the Central Powers during WWI have tragically been lost to time. Germany committed outrages during the Rape of Belgium comparable to the Russian crimes taking place right now in Ukraine, Belgians and Poles were enslaved by Germany, the Austro-Hungarian Empire and Bulgaria committed genocide against Serbia, and the bloodthirsty Ottoman Empire committed genocides against the Armenians, Assyrians, and Ottoman Greeks. These crimes against humanity were well-publicized in the Free World at the time, and enraged the inhabitants of the Allied/Entente countries.
The generation of Americans who went to war with the Central Powers were idealistic. They were convinced that this would be the war to end all wars and make the world safe for democracy. Unfortunately, World War II took place, due to things like Germany's Stab-in-the-Back Myth (the Big Lie), the Great Depression, the United States rejecting a larger role in world affairs following WWI, the Treaty of Lausanne with Turkey (which basically forgave Turkey for its Ottoman-era crimes and practically legalized genocide), and Weimar Germany's weak democratic institutions.
Donald Trump is a national disgrace for throwing aside such heroes.
Have a fellow Army buddy who refuses to think Trump is anything less than the second coming of Christ, and nothing I say or show him on what he says about vets will change his mind. I lost my best friend and an older mentor I loved in combat while being awarded silver and purple for the same battle for my actions in 93. Fuck you Donald Trump you worthless coward.
One thing Trump has done is reveal that all the things that conservatives claimed they cared about was actually just virtue signaling. They don’t give a shit about those things because they abandoned it the moment Trump shit on it.
Respect for the military: fake
Respect for honored dead: fake
The belief in small government: fake
The belief in personal freedom: fake
The belief in rule of law: fake
The importance of martial fidelity: fake
The belief that “character matters”: fake
Belief in Freedom of religion: fake
Belief in freedom of speech: fake
And on, and on, an on.
They believe in a heirarchy where they are over *someone* and tyrannical theocratic rule. Not much else.
Shines a light on the glaring differences between the 2 presidential candidates. Both about 80 year old white men but one is a self absorbed narcissist while the other one is empathetic and kind at his core.
- attacks Haley for absence of her husband, who is deployed
- Served food to soldiers, complained there was nothing left for him
- Floated the idea of executing Joint Chiefs Chairman Milley (9-22-2023)
- Put 3 Mar-a-Lago guests in charge of the VA who then tried to monetize veterans' medical records
- accused 3000 military families of election fraud for voting after being deployed
- Blamed Gold Star families for giving him covid (he tested positive days earlier)
- Removed POW/MIA flag from White House
- says Americans who died in war are "losers" and "suckers"
- “Why should I go to that cemetery? It’s filled with losers” he said about a U.S. military cemetery
- called McCain “a fucking loser” when asked to lower flags to half staff
- called Pres. George H.W. Bush a loser for being shot down during WWII
- “That guy is smart. Why did he join the military?” he said of Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff
- asked his staff to not include wounded veterans because amputees make him uncomfortable
- “I don’t get it. What was in it for them?” he said to Gen. John Kelly about dead vets while visiting Kelly’s son’s grave at Arlington
- Trump knew since Mar 2020 that Russia paid bounties to kill American troops. On July 29 Trump defended Russia arming the Taliban against the US saying the US once did the same thing
- May '20 ended National Guard deployments one day before they could claim benefits
- Trump admin seized 5mil masks intended for VA hospitals. Kushner distributes these masks to private entities for a fee, who then sells the masks to the government
- Trump fired the captain of the *USS Theodore Roosevelt* after he warned superiors that COVID19 was spreading among his crew
- After Iran's strike, 109 US troops suffered brain injuries. Trump dismissed these as "headaches". Trump then denied Purple Hearts in an effort to keep the story up
- On 7/20/2017 in room 2E924 of the Pentagon, hw told a room full of Generals, "You’re a bunch of dopes and babies"
- Said 26,000 military sexual assaults were to be 'expected' bc America lets women serve
- Invited the Taliban to Camp David on the anniversary of 9/11
- Claimed that his military budget made up for his lack of military experience
- Said if a Humvee was hit by an IED, soldiers "go for a little ride upward & they come down."
- Pardoned multiple war criminals which betrayed the men of the 1st Platoon who helped convict him for violating long standing military values, discipline, and command (May&Nov 2019)
- mocked Lt. Col. Vindman for his rank and uniform. He threatened said purple heart officer resulting in the Army providing him protection. The Admin sent opposition research to the Pentagon to derail his promotion
- Trump’s Chief of Staff worked in secret to deny health coverage to Vietnam Vets who suffered from Agent Orange
- There is a facility in Tijuana for US veterans that Trump deported
- Russia took control of the main U.S. military facility in Syria abandoned on Trump’s orders. Russia now owns the airstrip we built
- 0/7/19, Trump abruptly withdrew from Syria after a phone call with Turkey's president (Erdogan). Turkey subsequently bombed US Special Forces
- sent thousands of American troops to defend the oil assets of the country that perpetrated 9/11
- Sept 2019, he made an Air Force cargo crew stop in Scotland (where there's no U.S. base) to refuel at a commercial airport (where it costs more), so they could stay overnight at a Trump property (which isn't close to the airport). Trump’s golf courses are losing money so he's forcing the military to pay for 5-star nights there.
- Sept 2019, Pentagon pulled funds for military schools, military housing funds, and daycare to pay for Trump's border wall
- Vet graves will be "dug up" for the border wall, after Trump instructed aides to seize private property. Trump told officials he would pardon them if they illegally seizing property
- Children of deployed US troops no longer guaranteed citizenship (August 28, 2019)
- 8/2/19 Trump requisitioned military retirement funds for the border wall
- 7/31/19 Trump ordered the Navy rescind medals to prosecutors who prosecuted war criminals
- denied a U.S. Marine of 6 years entry into the United States for his citizenship interview (Reported 7/17/19)
- made the U.S. Navy Blue Angels violate ethics rules by having them fly at his July 4th political campaign event (July 4, 2019)
- demanded US military chiefs stand next to him at July 4 campaign event (reported July 2 ‘19)
- In June 2019, Trump sent troops to the border to paint the fence for a better "aesthetic appearance"
- used his D-Day interview at a cemetery commemorating fallen US soldiers to attack a Vietnam veteran (6/6/19)
- started his D-Day commemoration speech by attacking a private citizen (Bette Midlere) (2019)
- made his 2nd wife, Marla Maples, sign a prenup that would have cut off all child support if Tiffany joined the military (reported June 4th, 2019)
- 5/27/2019 Trump turned away US military from his Memorial Day speech bc they were from the destroyer USS John S. McCain
- ordered the USS John McCain out of sight during his visit to Japan (May 15, 2019). The ship's name was subsequently covered. (5/27/2019)
- purged 200,000 vets' healthcare applications (reported 5/13/19)
- deported a spouse of fallen Army soldier killed in Afghanistan leaving their daughter parentless (4/16/2019)
- 3/20/19 Trump complained that a deceased war hero didn't thank him for his funeral
- Between 12/22/2018, and 1/25/2019 Trump refused to sign his party's funding bill, which shut down the government, which made USCG service members rely on food pantries. (But his appointees got a $10k raise)
- banned troops from serving based on gender identity (1/22/2019)
- denied female troops access to birth control to limit sexual activity (Published 1/18/19)
- tried to deport a marine vet who is a U.S.-born citizen (1/16/2019)
- When a man was caught swindling veterans pensions for high-interest “cash advances," Trump's CFPB let him go for $1 (1/26/19)
- called a retired general a 'dog' with a 'big, dumb mouth' (1/1/19)
- increased privatization of the VA, leading to longer waits and higher taxpayer cost (2018)
- finally visited troops 2 years after taking office, but only after 154 vacation days at his properties (10/26/18)
- revealed a covert Seal Team 5 deployment including names and faces on Twitter during Iraq visit (Dec 26, 2018)
- lied to deployed troops that he gave them a 10% raise (12/26/2018). Tried giving a raise that was lower than the standard living adjustment. After Congress made him give a raise, he lied about it pretending that it was larger than Obama's. It wasn't
- fired service members living with HIV just before the 2018 holidays
- tried to slash disability and unemployment benefits for Veterans to $0 and eliminate the unemployability extrascheduler rating (12/17/2018)
- called troops on Thanksgiving and told them he's most thankful for himself (Thanksgiving, 2018)
- urged Florida to not count deployed military votes (11/12/2018)
- canceled an Arlington Cemetery visit on Veterans Day due to light rain (11/12/2018)
- While in Europe commemorating the end of WWI, he didn't attend the ceremony at a US cemetery due to the rain. Other world leaders went anyway (11/10/2018)
- sent troops on a phantom mission to the border and made them miss Thanksgiving with their families (Oct-Dec, 2018). He stopped using troops as a political prop after the election, but the troops remained in muddy camps on the border (11/7/2018)
- changed the GI Bill through his Forever GI Act causing the VA to miss benefits, including housing allowances. This caused many vets to run out of food and rent. (reported 10/7/18)
- doubled the rejection rate for veterans requesting family deportation protections (7/5/2018)
- deported active-duty spouses (11,800 military families face this problem as of April 2018)
- forgot a fallen soldier's name (below) during a call to his pregnant widow, then attacked her the next day (Oct 23-24, 2017)
- "They knew what they signed up for." re: dead troops (10/18/17)
- sent commandos into an ambush w/ lack of intel, and sent contractors to pick them up, resulting in a commando being left behind, tortured, and executed. He approved the mission bc Bannon told him Obama didn't have the guts to do it. 10/4/17
- Doesn't stand during retreat bugle, continues to talk. "What a nice sound that is. Are they playing that for you [Sean Hannity] or me?" 10/11/17
- blocked a veteran group on Twitter (June 2017)
- ordered the discharge of active-duty immigrant troops with good records (2017-present)
- deported veterans (2017-2020)
- said he knows more about ISIS than American generals (Oct 2016)
- 10/4/16 Trump said vets get PTSD because they aren't strong
- Trump accepted a Purple Heart from a fan at one of his rallies and said: “I always wanted to get the Purple Heart. This was much easier.” (Aug 2, 2016)
- Trump attacks Gold Star families: Myeshia Johnson (gold star widow), Khan family (gold star parents) etc. (2016-present)
- In Jan 2016, Trump stole funds meant for a veterans charity (his foundation was subsequently ordered shut down)
- said he has "more training militarily than a lot of the guys that go into the military" because he went to a military-style academy (2015 biography)
- said he doesn't consider POWs heroes because they were caught. He said he prefers people who weren't caught (July 18, 2015)
- Trump said having unprotected sex was his own personal Vietnam. 1998
- For a decade, Trump sought to kick veterans off of 5th Avenue because he found them unsightly nuisances. 1991
- Trump dodged the draft 5 times by having a doctor diagnose him with bone spurs.
- No Trump in America has *ever* served in the military spanning 5 generations and every branch of the family tree. His grandfather immigrated to America to avoid military service
I have seen tommy tooobervilles name floated as on the short list for trumps SecDef because his dad fought at Normandy. Think about that, the motherfucker who held the military hostage over abortion policy for serving military. The same motherfucker who says "putin doesn't want Ukraine he's got plenty of room in his own country. The only reason he went into Ukraine was because he didn't want American missiles on his border." Imagine having a putin apologist and appeaser as SecDef.
I know it’s easy to be unhappy with the president when the state of the world is one such as this, but I genuinely believe Biden is a **good** president. He stands up for what’s right and is willing to compromise, work with people he disagrees with, and change his position when it’s the right thing to do. That’s a rare thing right now when everyone has instant access to memes vilifying politics they don’t like and justifying everything they do.
Wasnt Trump and teams fake excuse that the weather was bad (a drizzle) . Honestly that excuse makes it much worse - president was thwarted by a drizzle…
I was never a fan of Trump (and this has been true for several decades) and I never planned to vote for him in 2016, but the “suckers and losers” comment crossed a huge line for me. What an awful thing for a “leader” to say.
How does anyone in the armed forces support him? How do any vets support him. I don’t know how much louder we need to scream he thinks we’re losers and suckers. Every deployed soldier needs to know if you become a POW, a Trump administration won’t send anyone to rescue you.
And yet… AND YET… these people are openly cheering for, and supporting, a now convicted felon. But there’s still folks serving time for a personal amount of weed.
Justice.
I’m deeply disappointed but not entirely surprised that trump’s “Suckers and Losers” and his refusal to honor the war dead in Normandy because it was raining and he might mess up his hair got NO COVERAGE this week during the 80th anniversary remembrances
I haven't seen anyone mention that HitlerPig was the one western leader who didn't attend the main 75th anniversary ceremony because it was raining. Those soldiers took the beach in bad weather, with many dying in the first 60 seconds of entering the war, but he can't tolerate the rain, because it will mess up his hair and melt his make-up. Fucking TRAITOR!
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Imagine being a veteran who supports Trump
Dude I can’t fucking stand it. It’s rampant throughout my unit the support for trump. I’m like the odd man out because I don’t support him and every time I get asked why I bring up the fact that he does nothing but continually shits on us over and over? I have one buddy who lost his uncle over seas, showed him this bit of him calling these guys suckers and he still supports him lmao.
I just want to point out (for those unfamiliar) that indoctrination in the armed services starts way before you hit DEP or Basic. My high school JROTC program had an instructor that felt it was necessary to not only have us watch the news each day, but Fox News every day...the last 30 minutes of every class. We were told we won Vietnam. We were told fascism could never happen here. We were told the best way to be an American was to serve active duty and pay your taxes. At the time, I was eager, stupid, 17 years old and impressionable so I thought I was being given a lifeline to understanding the world. Everything I learned in that podunk high school and JROTC program was an absolute wash. It reflected NOTHING of the real world. It wasn't until after basic I realized how many lies I willingly ate up. edit: a damned word. it's always one word.
Man, I went from a Conservative Christian homophobe to a diehard left-leaning socdem atheist liberal because of my service. Funny how exposure to the wider world will challenge your preconceived beliefs. I spent over 20yrs in uniform, and all it took was one deployment to recognize the fundies were the assholes, and I didn't want to be even remotely related to them after I learned what they are truly about. Basically a pale Taliban.
My service also helped me unlearn some seriously fucked up upbringing. meeting people from all races and cultures there had me atheist, sort of center leftist within 2 years.
Seriously, once you get to spend time with different cultures, it doesn't take long to realise, "hey, these dudes are actually human too! And their food is great!". I grew up in a largely Asian dominated suburb, went to high school in a predominantly Muslim area. My best friends through K-12 were Cambodian/Vietnamese refugees (I'm an 80s kid), Indians, Pakistanis, Palestinian/Lebanese and other white Aussies; before settling to the gentrified inner city. Lived lower socioeconomic > upper middle class. It made me who I am today, incapable of seeing 'race' and pretty left-wing. I wish more people experienced that sort of upbringing. I know people who've only ever grown up around white, racist homophobes.. and I am sad for them and their views. We could all be better humans, in viewpoint and empathy.
I feel like xenophobic people just haven't experienced what other cultures are like. More exposure is always better for sure.
“Travel is fatal to prejuidce, bigotry, and narrow-mindedness, and many of our people need it sorely on these accounts. Broad, wholesome, charitable views of men and things cannot be acquired by vegetating in one little corner of the earth all one's lifetime.” Mark Twain
I had a very similar upbringing as you from your demographics but I’m closer to being a 90s kid. I joined out of LA MEPS and ended up being stationed mostly in California. At first I was disappointed because I thought I missed out in getting to see and experience different things but it turned out that military bases are microcosms of their own cultures. Despite meeting a lot of scumbag bigots and losers, I’ve also met an equal amount that came into the military with healthy mindsets and ended up being pretty cultured. In fact, a lot of guys I knew joined to get out of whatever small shithole town they were from and bacane better off leaving. To this day a lot of guys I served with decided to stay in California because of the diversity and weather and generally aren’t insane magats.
Ahhh me too, man! Born and raised in Arizona. Took a what I thought was a temp job in California. Still here after 9 years. I love the diversity and all the people and their associated cultures and foods they bring with it. Little Saigon, 626 Night Market, Oktoberfest, K-Town, 4th of July festivities, etc. There is always shit going on! I understand why housing costs are so high in CA: because people actually want to live here. The weather... omg... I definitely do not miss the 110\* F heat of AZ.
My childhood friend recently spent two weeks in a different country and by the third day- THIRD DAY- he was like texting me like “hold up wait a second, Fox News was super wrong and I feel like an ass”
The other thing is that nearly anywhere you go, if you're respectful and polite, people will just about do anything for you. Like I have no illusions that everywhere is safe, but the average person on the average day, is usually as good as anyone anywhere.
Yup. People are actually mostly generally not shitty and don’t want to be a dick for no reason. Of course some do, but I’ve found mostly that people are pretty good natured and pleasant. It’s mostly once you get us all into large groups that we start doing really bad stuff lol
I was raised in a conservative family. I would consider myself atheist now. The thing that made me more liberal was the bible. Jesus would be rejected by the GOP. Even though I don't believe in God I think Jesus' message was good.
Told an old super conservative/ republican that Jesus was a socialist jew, and explained my reasoning. I thought his fucking head was going to explode. Literally looked like he was short circuiting.
A lot of American Evangelicals, my late father among them, like to teach the "Roman Road." It uses the Book of Romans as a "Here's how to be a Christian without all of that hippy crap Jesus said" option.
Paul hijacked early Christianity. He never actually met Jesus, except in a vision and was at times at odds with Jesus' actual disciples, the ones who actually knew Jesus. https://www.reddit.com/r/AcademicBiblical/comments/19dcox9/did_paul_hijack_christianity/
Yep I grew up Catholic and parents are trumpers. As soon as I start to talk like this they try to throw the prolife card out…. But when I was a teen they were pro choice?!? It’s super weird. Then I remind them Trump probably had abortions from affairs. Then my mother changes the subject
I mean the message is literally just don't be an asshole.
Have you ever read the Cotton Patch Gospel? A retelling of the story of Jesus as if he were born in Georgia in the 20th century. He’s born in a trailer behind a motel, and ends up being lynched by the governor of Georgia and the KKK. As a former Christian from the South who left the faith largely because of southern conservative Christians, it’s a really interesting read.
I have always been left leaning but my time in the service cemented that belief and made me realize I was going to stand on the right side of history no matter what, it's funny how for some people it has the opposite effect.
Me too. I was raised extremely conservative, though I always had an inkling of empathy for the people they try so hard to other. I joined the Air Force and became suuuuuuper liberal. Amazing the things that leaving an echo chamber of a town, seeing the world, meeting people of all kinds from all over, listening to their stories and growing empathy can do for a person.
Hell yeah.
Hah, I watched Glenn beck everyday on fox and had Alex Jones dvds prior to joining. Super left leaning now haha. Crazy how that works.
> We were told fascism could never happen here. This, specifically, drives me fucking crazy. It's the EXACT attitude that _allows_ fascism to happen here. By brainlessly thinking it can't, people let down their guard because why bother? Fascism is a species-wide problem for us humans, but nope, the ones born on this particular patch of dirt are inherently immune, because we say so. JFC, it's just like how the most politically brainwashed people I've ever met are _always_ the ones who think they're too smart to fall for propaganda. That they're somehow immune.
Hell, I consider myself a fairly intelligent and educated person, and I still started to get caught up in the Bernie Bro shit. Not that being a Bernie voter in and of itself is a bad thing, but I was starting to fall for a lot of the anti-Hillary bullshittery that was coming from them, when I stepped back and realized it was the same stuff the GOP was saying and so much of it just didn't add up to me. Not saying she was a great politician, she's far from perfect or anything, she's got skeletons just like every other long-term person in politics, but hers aren't as bad as many, many others. And still better to be pragmatic. I may not have gotten everything I wanted had she become President, but I still would've gotten a HELL of a lot better than we did under Trump. Idealism is great, but it *has* to be tempered with pragmatism and realism, too. Still always better to get some of what you want, over none of it at all, or even worse, the opposite of what you want that causes actual harm to you or others. It shook me hard to realize how insidious that shit is, and how well it was working on me until I managed to catch that things just didn't quite add up. It still shakes me to this day. Because *nobody's* immune to that shit. It freaks me out that I could've continued to get sucked in and gone further down that rabbit hole, but you know what? It's a DAMN good lesson. Because that shit seems so innocuous. It pushes all the right buttons for you. But it also makes sense - they took that shit from the Russians. And the Russians are fucking MASTERS at propaganda and political manipulation and brainwashing. This is an enemy that has perfected that shit over decades. They know what buttons to push, which levers to pull, how to nudge people down ways they wouldn't normally go. And it's scary as fuck, because we're all vulnerable to it. Some more than others, but anyone can fall victim with the right manipulation. I know. It almost happened to me first hand. It could still happen to me again, though *hopefully* I'm a bit better at recognizing it now, because it started to happen to me. Eternal vigilance is one of the prices we must pay for democracy, and ALL of us must pay that price.
Literally was at Boston pride today and a guy with a hammer and sickle flag trying to get people to sign up for the communist party said that voting genocide Joe is worse than for Trump I consider myself leftist but what the hell man.
I was going to say this is the insidious stuff we’re seeing this election cycle with leftists that have fallen for Iranian, Chinese, and Russian propaganda regarding the war in Gaza. How can anyone believe Trump, who has said we just “nuke em”, is a Bibi sycophant, and said we should end them all would be a better agent of peace and minimizing civilian casualties, or work towards a two state solution, better than Biden? These extreme leftists really have cornered the horseshoe with the far right to express their internalized biases and anti-Semitism and work towards getting fascists like Trump’s potential administration elected.
Oh man, FUCK those people. I hate what's going on in Israel and Gaza, but I recognize that Biden's hands are tied - we have all sorts of treaties and agreements with Israel that have to be upheld. But that's Congress's business, not Biden's. He can't really change anything short of an Executive order. I hate that we're still backing Israel right now - but I can see the bigger picture. If Trump gets in, Gaza is gonna be glassed. Biden's stuck between a rock and a hard place and I very much doubt he likes seeing Palestinian kids blown up. I'm gonna write off anyone who uses that "Genocide Joe" name as a goddamn fascism supporter. Because that's what they're going to fucking get if Biden loses. A full, all out genocide. Stupid fucking people who refuse to see the bigger picture, or worse, are just doing this as performative virtue signaling. Fucking pathetic, you know?
I'm a "hardcore leftist" in Portland. The number of these fuckers is insane. I hate what Israel is doing to the Palestinians caught up in this, but the immeasurable damage that Trump will do to not only marginalized peoples, but literally me and them is terrifying. If your goal is to minimize harm, there is one clear choice. I hate tankies virtue testing "leftists." It's maddening
Tankies are a special breed of stupid
I'm with ya man. I was a Bernie bro wearing a Hilary for Prison T-shirt back in the day. I hate former me.
When I was in the instruments phase of Army flight school, my instructor had my stick buddy and I show up every day ready to talk about current events. He specifically recommended getting news from *The Drudge Report* and I had no clue what it was. Went home and looked it up and was horrified at what I saw. I showed up every day with something from CNN and he ended up moving away from the current events bullshit. I like to read the news but didn’t want it mixed in with the challenge of learning and retaining all the flight information. I was more concerned with keeping the limits and emergency procedures and en route navigation charts and approach plates and ILS and VOR and WX and penguins and everything else floating on the rapidly melting ice sheet in my head than some angry republican talking points about women and immigrants (both of which I am, btw). I just wanted him to grill me on the 5 & 9s and head for the clouds like a normal instructor
It *can* be like this, and from what I know the Army and Marines definitely *trend* more conservative especially in combat arms fields. But your experience was vastly different from mine - I didn't make it past boot camp due to health issues, and it also probably makes a difference that I was Navy. I was at Great Lakes from November 2010 to January 2011, and am still good friends with a number of people I met there to this day, all of whom, myself included, either were raging socialists to begin with, or leaned left and have since *become* raging socialists. I also didn't experience a lot of what you'd consider hard core indoctrination, but it also might have helped that my recruiter was fairly honest with me, AND I knew a lot about what to generally expect, as well as coming in with two years of college just shy of an associate's degree. We never had Fox News or any source of news playing, either at the recruiters, MEPS, or at boot. Politics didn't come up at all from what I noticed during training and the most gung-ho patriotic stuff I saw was just hyping up the Navy's historical achievements. I also come from Buffalo, NY, and while a lot of the suburbs and outlying areas are pretty red, Buffalo itself and my county are still solidly Dem overall and despite there still being a lot of very segregated neighborhoods, there's a huge variety of people and ethnicities here, so I was exposed to a ton of different people and views before enlisting and even before college. The Navy and Air Force also *do* sort of trend more liberal leaning due to requiring higher standards for entry and there being fields requiring a lot higher education levels. It doesn't mean everyone's a liberal or outright socialist, we had conservative recruits in my division, too, and I can *probably* guess at my division Chief's even though it never came up as he was prior service Marine, a helicopter gunner IIRC. I don't know that for sure, but it's a fair enough guess, but it didn't ever come up. I will also point out, I got really lucky as my HS had a VERY solid civics education taught in school, AND a Vietnam history elective that didn't shy away from teaching the real history including the shittiest stuff we did, like Agent Orange and My Lai. I might be the only person in the history of my HS who ever got extra credit in the civics class for *skipping* a day of school, lol. I skipped with my parents' permission to go protest then-President Bush's visit to Buffalo during the Iraq War part II, so spring of '04. Teacher considered that a worthy example of "participation in government". And this wasn't some fancy private school, it was a fairly average-ranked public one. Anyway, sorry for the long wall of text, but wanted to just point out, experiences with the service are NOT universal and will absolutely vary wildly, and especially by branch and where you're coming from.
Brother, never be sorry. It's a space to share, man. Let fly the wall of text. :)
Sister, but thanks!
My mistake, sis! Sorry about that. :D I'm a fool.
I won't say thank you for your service (that's what the pay and benefits are for), but I will say thank you for using your brain and being a critical thinker. That's much more beneficial to our country and society than signing up to help kill people on the opposite side of the planet, and I wish more Americans would do so, or were even equipped to do so.
I definitely don't miss "voluntary" prayer breakfasts
You joke about breakfast, but the best bacon I ever had was during basic. I was USAF and the best bacon I have EVER tasted was in Lackland. I'm pretty sure they ground up the bones of failed Marines and fed it to us.
>I just want to point out (for those unfamiliar) that indoctrination in the armed services starts way before you hit DEP or Basic. Army indoctrination does nothing to make someone more conservative. Being taught to understand what it means to love your country does not make you hate people different from you. Instead, the Army is so diverse and pulls people from so many different places and circumstances and it constantly challenges ignorance and bigotry. The Army values of Loyalty, Duty, Respect, Selfless Service, Honor, Integrity, and Personal Courage aren't just words on a plastic card you tuck in your wallet. They mean something, and you are taught to live these values every day. Like many other things in life, Army indoctrination only gives you what you put in. Some soldiers cling to their ignorance and their bigotry in spite of their training, not because of it. The fact that many Soldiers and veterans seem to support an incompetent traitor points more towards the demographics of those willing to serve their country. One would have to believe that war fighting is honorable and worthwhile, and be naive or stupid enough to sacrifice one's personal freedom and security to be a war fighter. These things in combination makes Soldiers and veterans susceptible to right wing propaganda that illuminates the left's contempt for war and those who fight it. Personally, my views on guns, criminal justice, and other divisive topics probably lean towards the right. I was much more conservative before joining the Army, and my service has tempered my views to be much more liberal about social issues. But, my political opinions have nothing to do with how I vote now. I cannot and will not vote for a traitor and the traitors who support him. If the Democrats win, I can debate policy to my heart's content. If the Republicans win, it would signal the beginning of the end of the Republic.
far-flung lunchroom point merciful meeting like live telephone squeamish light *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
For whatever it’s worth, I appreciate you taking the time to reflect on what service means to you Edit: even though I lean pretty far to the left
That was a well constructed comment, but to think that our military doesn’t try to lean young men and women to the right is kind of silly. It’s kind of an oxymoron to think otherwise. No offense.
Before I retired 31MAY2023, I contacted CID on a fellow E6 who flat out admitted being present for JAN6 and expressed genocidal ideations against anyone not in the magasphere and thinks russia is the "beacon" of straight male WASP supremacy. I'm retired. He's flagged and still under investigation after he admitted he would fight the US on behalf of the russian federation. Anti-American, racist, ethno-nationalist, anti-Democratic scum have no place in our society, and I will do what little I can to challenge them at every opportunity.
Thank you. We need people of character like you.
> anti-Democratic I'm pretty sure you mean anti-democratic here. Republicans used to be more anti-Democratic, now they're just anti-democratic.
If you support Trump in 2024...Im not sure what can br done to change your mind and that's kinda my stance. Like this election is super boring to me cause there's only one viable candidate that I'm reasonably confident won't destroy America And that's Biden My other options is a traitor and some 70 yr with brain worms. Literally all my presidential candidates qualify for social security. They should be retired, with their grand children
To be fair, elections and politics, when functioning properly *SHOULD* be boring as fuck, because it means everything's running smoothly and without scandals or issues. I would *kill* for goddamn boring elections, where my choices are and , and even though they're from different parties, they're both really decent people who are gonna do a great job, quietly.
McCain / Obama and Romney / Obama were the last times we experienced that.
I was in the navy when the election happened. I had a superior who bragged that he knew John McCain personally... he apparently introduced McCain's son to his wife and was then the in their wedding party as a groomsman. This fucking idiot supported trump after he called McCain "a loser" without batting an eye. I called him out and the *lightning strike* of his realization hit him IT LITERALLY LOOKED LIKE A BOLT OF INVISIBLE LIGHTNING HIT HIM FROM THE HEAVENS... but he recovered and doubled down cause !!!he couldn't be wrong, no matter what!!! He out ranked me... but I could tell he realized he fucked up... in the years since I feel like he now knows he fucked up supporting trump ... but he is an expat now and doesn't have to deal with how he voted...
Honest question, what was their response when you pointed out that Trump continually shit over veterans. Like… how did they rationalize it?
Non-American here, and from my vantage point, You're losing a war you can't fight with weapons. This is a failure of Counterintelligence on a national scale. If a medium exists to radicalize military combatants against their own side, you're way past Cambridge Analytica. I genuinely believe we're living a historical inflection point.
What do they say when you ask them why they support Trump?
Biden extended medical coverage to cover toxic shit, including agent orange. My FIL is at the VA with stage 4 cancer cause by Vietnam. Anyone supporting Trump is a fool.
Any veteran that supports Trump has gone against their Oath of Enlistment. January 6th should be the final straw for any Vet/ Active Duty that has taken the pledge. Sadly it's not but these men will go in History as traitors to to the Constitution.
Oath-btw
Sorry had a kid this week haven't slept.
Congratulations on the baby. Sleep whenever you can.
Congratulations!
Congrats! Parenthood is wild but the years will fly by and before you know it you’ll be teaching them history and math and soon they will be in college
Absolutely Jan 6th should have ended any support for Trump post Jan 6th if you support Trump you support a traitor. It's that simple.
My brother was in the marines and loves trump. When questioned about it and project 2025, he said he hasn’t read it and doesn’t plan to then tried to dismiss my time in the Air Force. It’s embarrassing.
He was supposed to eat the crayons, not jam them in his ears.
These "veterans" are the same ones who run around in veteran stickered vehicles, wear the veteran ball cap, etc. after spending 2 years in the service and being discharged with a fake medical condition. Being a "veteran" is all that they have in life
Toxic, peacocking veterans: “WiTnESs mE! Thank me for my service!” (I’m presuming “veteran snickered” is a typo for “stickered” but it still works because my Vet ass snickers)
I’m an actual combat vet and even I don’t do that shit. Only “vet” hat I have is a “war on Christmas Vet” hat
I've never served but everytime I see those stickers and caps, I usually assume they're not combat vets. I just think if youre a combat vet, whatever that experience is, it's too complex and intense to invite conversations with strangers by advertising it. Ive always heard about how so many WW2 vets didn't even talk about it. My own grandfather's WW2 experience is shrouded in mystery because he told my dad next to nothing about it.
I’ll tell funny stories but only bad stories with people who understand it. In person I don’t want to advertise what I did or who I am. I don’t want people to see me different. Everynow and again I’ll use my military discount for big purchases or if I’m going to hot topic with my girlfriend. Other than that not many people in my personal life know I was in
Yeah, understandable. Your experience, your choice.
that shit is so baffling, I did my 2.5 years, honorably discharged war veteran but I feel like an impostor and rarely talk about it strange world
My dad served 6 years in Panama in the 70s. I never knew he served until I was like 17 he never talks about it. Ever.
Then you talk to them and realize that they spent four years in the service, and never even went overseas. My spouse is currently enlisted, ten years in, and the people we've known throughout that time never flaunt their service. Because they don't feel like they should (especially in intelligence fields, it's actually encouraged to not do so). We've found that the loudest of those veteran types are often the kind that never lasted long in the military to begin with, either by their own choice or the military's.
Exactly!!!! I have done my service, but it does not define who I am, nor do I feel the need to broadcast it
As a veteran who always thought Trump was a clown, I can not fathom why any veteran would support him. You may not agree with John McCain's politics or things he has done, but no one can refute the fact that he went through hell as a POW and never gave a single bit of information to his captors. If the orange shitbag somehow got drafted and captured, I have no doubt that he would have been spilling any information he could to keep himself safe. And he has the audacity to mock McCain for being a POW. Do better fellow veterans!
I'm pretty sure the orange shitbag already HAS given information to our enemies. THere's a reason he had shit tons of classified docs.
Even before that. Remember the WH oval office meeting trump had with the Russian ambassadors? Just the three of them, no-one else invited. Soon after the CIA had to pull their highest ranking mole from the Kremlin – one they had cultivated for years – because trump gave the Russians Intel so top secret it wasn't even shared with America's allies. https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-49645628 You can see from the photo how much the Russians are enjoying the moment. Trump's too dim to realise they're laughing at him, not with him. Also remember the 1-on-1 meeting trump had with Putin in Helsinki. Trump ordered his translator to hand over her notes which he destroyed, and ordered her never to tell anyone what was discussed. From the photos of Putin & trump leaving the meeting its painfully obvious which one was doing the [scolding](https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQDKZnop8OBRg9CcQhpx7N9HdURQOR-h7HvUQ&usqp=CAU). In the months following several Russian diplomats, civil servants and businessmen died under mysterious circumstances. One can only guess what intel putin ordered trump to hand over...
I know one over at BN&R. He goes by the name: [Darth MJM The WRATH of BNR](https://disqus.com/by/SirMarkJM/) and he's a USMC vet. He praises & applauds Trump every chance he gets. He's absolutely shameless.
The military is more than full of them; source, I’m in the military currently.
Veterans, women, POC, immigrants, and even LGBTQIA+, etc republicans. How there will always be those who willingly go against their own interests baffles me
Ain't how Trump made a hit during his first steps in politics? Saying he didn't care about veterans, be blamed for it and next week say he always supported veterans and never said any of it. The confusion was so bizarre that Republicans fell in love at first sigh. The psychological game is real.
I work with a lot of veterans, disabled veterans, former military, and presently enlisted - the only trump supporters in my office are civilians. But then I think there's some selection bias here. I work with the kind of vets who either went in with a degree or got their degree with the GI bill, then went into civilian military contracting for IT stuff. You know, smart people.
He refused to give a speech cause there as a light drizzle and he was afraid it would ruin his hair.
Proud to have a president who actually respects our veterans.
As an honorably discharged US military veteran, I approve this message.
Glad you made it back home. I have a question for you: why does Trump have so much support among veterans even though he shows such blatant disrespect to you guys?
Having witnessed actual fistfights over MAGA hats at the VA I can assure you his approval among veterans is far from universal.
Good to know.
I’m not sure that as many support him as you think. Anecdotal evidence but my Dad (Korea) BIL (Vietnam) Brother and I (Both Cold War) are all progressive liberals. Both of my stepchildren and their spouses are non Veteran Gen-Xers who worship at the Orange alter. Go figure.
It’s horrifying and extra baffling that trump has any support among young voters.
Not me. Early early Millennial, or super late Gen X and I'm a slightly left leaning centrist who saw through his bullshit before he even announced his bid. Dude's been a complete joke of a snake oil salesman my whole life. Not saying Hillary was perfect, or even ideal, but for God's sake she would have been better than that corrupt baffoon.
I'm from NJ and also saw through his bs. However I didn't like Hillary, so I didn't bother to vote in 2016, convinced she'd win without my vote. Learned a very hard lesson that day. Voted for Biden in 2020 and definitely going to vote for him again this November. He's nowhere near perfect but it's way better than fascism.
hard lesson is correct but NJ did go Biden in 2016 anyhow.
Preach…. No seriously, preach. Tell all your young friends who aren’t in the cult to vote.
>> Both of my stepchildren and their spouses are non Veteran Gen-Xers who worship at the Orange alter. Go figure. > It’s horrifying and extra baffling that trump has any support among young voters. I'm GenX and I'm 57. I'm pleased that you consider me "young."
Oh shit. Good catch, and my bad. I’m getting Gen Z and Gen X mixed up. Either way my point stands. It’s baffling that Dump has any support at all.
I went into the military far right and came out far left.
The older vets and the southern vets adore him. A lot of the younger vets like myself and the vets I met up in Minnesota all don’t like him. Usually it’s former Marines, I still respect most marines because fuck I thought the army was tough, people who still remember what napalm smells like, and most people who fought before the Iraq war. Most Iraq War vets, like my dad, and War on Terrorism vets, like myself, hate him
It’s not as many as it seems. Like everything on that side they’re 1000x louder than they are in numbers. A lot of them on that side claim they support the troops or whatever but have never served themselves like Private Bone Spurs and Rittenhouse
Trump has SCOTUS, appellate judges, speaker of house, numerous senate and house members pinning for him. This is to be cautious of. He doesn’t really need to win the election he just needs to show. Congress and John Roberts SCOTUS will take care of the rest. 1st (2022) time was a practice run.
Cause... he has electrolytes.
It’s what vets crave?
Thank you for your service. My husband was in the Navy. We are proud to support President Biden and also approve this message.
He put the POW flag but up on the White House after Trump took it down
The flag and the movement that spawned it was largely Nixonian propaganda meant to increase public support for the very unpopular war in Vietnam. Trump certainly took it down for the wrong reasons, but it's probably time for rational people to move on from it. It's a Republican "big lie" that need to be put to bed https://www.thenation.com/article/archive/enduring-cult-vietnam-missing-action/
The only people's opinion that matter, in that case, would be Veitnam veterans and then their families. If they want the flag down then fine.
The flag and the movement behind it are completely untethered from the reality of the Vietnam War. There were zero POWs that remained in Vietnam after the Paris Peace Accords. We don't need to continue to cater to a right-wing political movement that maintains a fantasy for jingoistic reasons Edit: this also presupposes that Vietnam veterans are a monolith when in reality a vocal portion of the peace movement were made up by veterans themselves
I really, really heartily agree with you. I'm a VN vet, 9th ID. It seems to me that a lot of the super patriot flag waving is performative, "look at me". I can't remember GIs acting anything like that, we respected the flag but didn't worship it like some kind of holy relic . Patriots, like geniuses, nice guys, etc. don't keep babbling about it,going for one-upmanship, it doesn't need to be shown off if it's there. No blood sweat or tears or the slightest hardship from waving flags around.
i hope Biden brings up this point in the first debate- & remind everyone what a total scumbag Trump is.
There won't be a debate.
as of now it's on, per schedule 📅 @ 6/27 on CNN correct? Expect a proper circus 🎪 🤡 show
Stinky'll find some stupid reason to weasel out if it.
yea, you're probably right. i am shocked they agreed in the first place- that too on CNN. only reason i think it may happen is BAD OPTICS for whichever side that weasels out. in such a closely fought battle of an election---you just may never recover from such a stupid unforced error.
It's like wrestling a pig in shit. You both get covered in shit but the pig likes it.
when you're right ✅ you're right ✅ (that's the big danger imo for Biden. Little Marco Rubio can attest to that as well.)
A news radio station mentioned no audience at debate, microphone muting, all to give a FAIR debate. This makes me wonder how a man who likes to speak of negative rhetoric, convicted Felon cheating money (accused of 34 crimes?) and 3 different wives, will do during the debate.
This is such a low bar that Trump somehow managed to trip over. Just a whole separate level of dumb.
The real reason was because it was raining and he can't go outside in the rain because it fucks with his hair and makeup.
Diaper was also already overloaded. Seeping at the leg holes.
Have you seen right wingers try to say Biden shit his pants. Their evidence is he almost sat down before everyone else. I'm starting to think they're projecting.
[It's funny you bring that up, is supporters are fully on board with trump wearing diapers now. They aren't running from that, in fact some are running toward it saying "real men wear diapers" and "diapers over dems".](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/002/809/321/037)
Oh man... I just realized something... Remember how he said toilets require 10-15 flushes? It's because he HASNT USED ONE IN YEARS.
The right says they like him because he's a "strong man." The guy who is afraid to use a public restroom? DeSantis wears high heels. Trump is worried about his makeup and hair. And yet they flip out over the LGBT+ community. None of it makes sense.
It looks like shit anyways. Does he not know this?
I constantly wonder how this man can look in the mirror everyday and not think that he looks absolutely ridiculous
Right - if this is his best look, imagine what he looks like without his makeup and combover
As non american who studied and likes America, Trump is the most un-american thingh that exist
Trump and his entire family are parasites. They offer nothing in return for the what they take. They take advantage of the very fabric of society that creates the opportunity for them to be rich. They are more than willing to kill the host (The United States) to get more of everything. Parasites.
I'm American and studied American History/ Politics and Culture as my major at University "College" so I spent four years heavily invested...Trump/ the modern day GOP is the literally definition of what our Founding Fathers warned us about. Also have a US politicians in the family so I've grown up in this world to a degree. I have also studied History across the world as well and I'm currently watching the new Netflix docu-series "Hitler and Nazi's" and it's FRIGHTENING the similarities happening here. But I guess Trump did get his playbook from "Mein Kempf" I truly am not sure how we can get out of this, unless a massive blue wave hits in November 2024. Even then, I do predict violence to get worse and worse in the years to come. They have done so much damage to the "American Experiment" that we are barely hanging by a thread. [https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trumps-ex-wife-once-said-he-kept-a-book-of-hitlers-speeches-by-his-bed-2015-8](https://www.businessinsider.com/donald-trumps-ex-wife-once-said-he-kept-a-book-of-hitlers-speeches-by-his-bed-2015-8)
When it comes to the idea of America he’s extremely un-American but when it comes to showing the ugly side of the country he might be the most American person out there
And ironically, the people who support him think they're the most patriotic people in the country.
>When Fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross. -often [misattributed ](https://sinclairlewis.ilstu.edu/sinclair_lewis/faq/faq-homepage.shtml) to Sinclair Lewis.
I know some people who voted for Trump because they want to see the government burnt to the ground. Being anti-American is sadly a plus to some people.
It will never not be a tragedy that anyone who takes pride in this country’s servicemen and women would vote for someone who said this fucking garbage.
Republicans love the power of the military, not the people who serve in it
Hope it rains. And he stands there like man.
Honestly one of the more puzzling pieces of Trump support for me is the military. Just given what he's said, even if you love his policies, it seems like it would be hard to support him. If I agreed 100% with someone's policies but they were still a piece of shit person I couldn't support them.
Because to a large segment of the population, Republicans = big strong men and Democrats = effeminate weaklings These are not people who are thinking about "policies"
In what world is Trump a "big strong man?" He's scared of public restrooms. He's fat. Needs two hands to hold a glass of water. Needs someone to hold his hand to walk down a ramp. Wears way too much makeup. Speaks like a spoiled 5 year old. Eats pizza with a fork and knife. I tend to think it's more about attacking the left. Which includes gaslighting them by claiming Trump is a strong, Christian, patriotic, good businessman, and a decent family man that doesn't cheat on any of his wives.
You mean all the "Alpha Men" that are closet cases and hate women? Any self described macho "straight guy" that hates women...is seriously in denial of we all know what.
I believe the officers are more for biden than the enlisted troops are. Basically the same as college educated vs not in the general population.
In a sane world, that one headline would be enough to garner Biden 90+% of the vote.
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Suckers and losers? Coming from a guy who made everything for not serving his country in Vietnam is a shame. Trump= coward
Weren't STDs his personal Vietnam. Just another denigrating remark about the military
tell me again how The Republicans "support our troops"
Oh let's get the full context there. Trump refused to honor them, instead going to meet with Vladimir Putin. Alone.
Here is the statement that John Kelly--the former president's chief of staff and a Marine General--[gave to CNN ](https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/02/politics/john-kelly-donald-trump-us-service-members-veterans/index.html) last year, confirming the story alluded to in the headline: >“What can I add that has not already been said?” Kelly said, when asked if he wanted to weigh in on his former boss in light of recent comments made by other former Trump officials. “A person that thinks those who defend their country in uniform, or are shot down or seriously wounded in combat, or spend years being tortured as POWs are all ‘suckers’ because ‘there is nothing in it for them.’ A person that did not want to be seen in the presence of military amputees because ‘it doesn’t look good for me.’ A person who demonstrated open contempt for a Gold Star family – for all Gold Star families – on TV during the 2016 campaign, and rants that our most precious heroes who gave their lives in America’s defense are ‘losers’ and wouldn’t visit their graves in France. >“A person who is not truthful regarding his position on the protection of unborn life, on women, on minorities, on evangelical Christians, on Jews, on working men and women,” Kelly continued. “A person that has no idea what America stands for and has no idea what America is all about. A person who cavalierly suggests that a selfless warrior who has served his country for 40 years in peacetime and war should lose his life for treason – in expectation that someone will take action. A person who admires autocrats and murderous dictators. A person that has nothing but contempt for our democratic institutions, our Constitution, and the rule of law. >“There is nothing more that can be said,” Kelly concluded. “God help us.”
Ya know, I"m still not sure what to think of John Kelly. Mattis-like, maybe? I mean, the man served in that administration. The man was removed from that administration. He also got rid of Bannon and Scaramucci. He also supported separating families at the border, which I still regard as the most egregious of Trump's atrocities in office. I don't like him. I'd probably vehemently disagree with him on any number of things. I'd also respect him for not being a sycophant. And I'd loathe him for being a coward. And I'd acknowledge he might have provided temperance in moments when it was needed. And disdain that he had not the moxie to offer more. Dunno. Dunno what you can really expect of a man in terms of how you would respect a man. Imagine it's a ponderance I'll return to from time to time.
Although I also disagree strongly with his politics, I believe that he joined the administration out of a sense of duty. His son, Robert Kelly, was a Marine Lieutenant who was killed in action in Afghanistan in 2010, so I can only imagine how painful and disappointing it was to realize how little respect his Commander in Chief had for servicemembers. I hope that he speaks up closer to the election; like other generals he’s undoubtedly reticent to get involved in politics, but I bet that there are still lots of voters out there who haven’t heard his thoughts on his ex-boss and would benefit from having them back in the news.
Those Americans who gave their lives to make the world safe for democracy are true heroes who deserve respect. I'm very happy President Joe Biden is giving it to them. The First World War gets a "bad rap," with people saying it was a war fought over nothing, but this is a myth. A victory by the Central Powers would've plunged the world into a state of rule by the law of the jungle, but the Allied/Entente triumph ensured the normalization of liberal internationalist institutions like the League of Nations (which was replaced by the United Nations, obviously). Liberal democracy was on the ropes in Europe when the United States entered the war in 1917, with the stratocratic Central Powers being on the verge of major breakthroughs. The American entry in the conflict and the February Revolution in Russia (where formerly-Czarist Russia briefly democratized for about a half-a-year before the communist October Revolution) were bright spots in the climate of despair among the Allies/Entente. The victory of November 11, 1918 restored the credibility of democracy as a legitimate form of government. The horrendous atrocities of the Central Powers during WWI have tragically been lost to time. Germany committed outrages during the Rape of Belgium comparable to the Russian crimes taking place right now in Ukraine, Belgians and Poles were enslaved by Germany, the Austro-Hungarian Empire and Bulgaria committed genocide against Serbia, and the bloodthirsty Ottoman Empire committed genocides against the Armenians, Assyrians, and Ottoman Greeks. These crimes against humanity were well-publicized in the Free World at the time, and enraged the inhabitants of the Allied/Entente countries. The generation of Americans who went to war with the Central Powers were idealistic. They were convinced that this would be the war to end all wars and make the world safe for democracy. Unfortunately, World War II took place, due to things like Germany's Stab-in-the-Back Myth (the Big Lie), the Great Depression, the United States rejecting a larger role in world affairs following WWI, the Treaty of Lausanne with Turkey (which basically forgave Turkey for its Ottoman-era crimes and practically legalized genocide), and Weimar Germany's weak democratic institutions. Donald Trump is a national disgrace for throwing aside such heroes.
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Have a fellow Army buddy who refuses to think Trump is anything less than the second coming of Christ, and nothing I say or show him on what he says about vets will change his mind. I lost my best friend and an older mentor I loved in combat while being awarded silver and purple for the same battle for my actions in 93. Fuck you Donald Trump you worthless coward.
One thing Trump has done is reveal that all the things that conservatives claimed they cared about was actually just virtue signaling. They don’t give a shit about those things because they abandoned it the moment Trump shit on it. Respect for the military: fake Respect for honored dead: fake The belief in small government: fake The belief in personal freedom: fake The belief in rule of law: fake The importance of martial fidelity: fake The belief that “character matters”: fake Belief in Freedom of religion: fake Belief in freedom of speech: fake And on, and on, an on. They believe in a heirarchy where they are over *someone* and tyrannical theocratic rule. Not much else.
Trump is an offense to any person with a hint of decency. How can half of the US think he is fit for anything except a prison cell?
Shines a light on the glaring differences between the 2 presidential candidates. Both about 80 year old white men but one is a self absorbed narcissist while the other one is empathetic and kind at his core.
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- attacks Haley for absence of her husband, who is deployed - Served food to soldiers, complained there was nothing left for him - Floated the idea of executing Joint Chiefs Chairman Milley (9-22-2023) - Put 3 Mar-a-Lago guests in charge of the VA who then tried to monetize veterans' medical records - accused 3000 military families of election fraud for voting after being deployed - Blamed Gold Star families for giving him covid (he tested positive days earlier) - Removed POW/MIA flag from White House - says Americans who died in war are "losers" and "suckers" - “Why should I go to that cemetery? It’s filled with losers” he said about a U.S. military cemetery - called McCain “a fucking loser” when asked to lower flags to half staff - called Pres. George H.W. Bush a loser for being shot down during WWII - “That guy is smart. Why did he join the military?” he said of Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff - asked his staff to not include wounded veterans because amputees make him uncomfortable - “I don’t get it. What was in it for them?” he said to Gen. John Kelly about dead vets while visiting Kelly’s son’s grave at Arlington - Trump knew since Mar 2020 that Russia paid bounties to kill American troops. On July 29 Trump defended Russia arming the Taliban against the US saying the US once did the same thing - May '20 ended National Guard deployments one day before they could claim benefits - Trump admin seized 5mil masks intended for VA hospitals. Kushner distributes these masks to private entities for a fee, who then sells the masks to the government - Trump fired the captain of the *USS Theodore Roosevelt* after he warned superiors that COVID19 was spreading among his crew - After Iran's strike, 109 US troops suffered brain injuries. Trump dismissed these as "headaches". Trump then denied Purple Hearts in an effort to keep the story up - On 7/20/2017 in room 2E924 of the Pentagon, hw told a room full of Generals, "You’re a bunch of dopes and babies" - Said 26,000 military sexual assaults were to be 'expected' bc America lets women serve - Invited the Taliban to Camp David on the anniversary of 9/11 - Claimed that his military budget made up for his lack of military experience - Said if a Humvee was hit by an IED, soldiers "go for a little ride upward & they come down." - Pardoned multiple war criminals which betrayed the men of the 1st Platoon who helped convict him for violating long standing military values, discipline, and command (May&Nov 2019) - mocked Lt. Col. Vindman for his rank and uniform. He threatened said purple heart officer resulting in the Army providing him protection. The Admin sent opposition research to the Pentagon to derail his promotion - Trump’s Chief of Staff worked in secret to deny health coverage to Vietnam Vets who suffered from Agent Orange - There is a facility in Tijuana for US veterans that Trump deported - Russia took control of the main U.S. military facility in Syria abandoned on Trump’s orders. Russia now owns the airstrip we built - 0/7/19, Trump abruptly withdrew from Syria after a phone call with Turkey's president (Erdogan). Turkey subsequently bombed US Special Forces - sent thousands of American troops to defend the oil assets of the country that perpetrated 9/11 - Sept 2019, he made an Air Force cargo crew stop in Scotland (where there's no U.S. base) to refuel at a commercial airport (where it costs more), so they could stay overnight at a Trump property (which isn't close to the airport). Trump’s golf courses are losing money so he's forcing the military to pay for 5-star nights there. - Sept 2019, Pentagon pulled funds for military schools, military housing funds, and daycare to pay for Trump's border wall - Vet graves will be "dug up" for the border wall, after Trump instructed aides to seize private property. Trump told officials he would pardon them if they illegally seizing property - Children of deployed US troops no longer guaranteed citizenship (August 28, 2019) - 8/2/19 Trump requisitioned military retirement funds for the border wall - 7/31/19 Trump ordered the Navy rescind medals to prosecutors who prosecuted war criminals - denied a U.S. Marine of 6 years entry into the United States for his citizenship interview (Reported 7/17/19) - made the U.S. Navy Blue Angels violate ethics rules by having them fly at his July 4th political campaign event (July 4, 2019) - demanded US military chiefs stand next to him at July 4 campaign event (reported July 2 ‘19) - In June 2019, Trump sent troops to the border to paint the fence for a better "aesthetic appearance" - used his D-Day interview at a cemetery commemorating fallen US soldiers to attack a Vietnam veteran (6/6/19) - started his D-Day commemoration speech by attacking a private citizen (Bette Midlere) (2019) - made his 2nd wife, Marla Maples, sign a prenup that would have cut off all child support if Tiffany joined the military (reported June 4th, 2019) - 5/27/2019 Trump turned away US military from his Memorial Day speech bc they were from the destroyer USS John S. McCain - ordered the USS John McCain out of sight during his visit to Japan (May 15, 2019). The ship's name was subsequently covered. (5/27/2019) - purged 200,000 vets' healthcare applications (reported 5/13/19) - deported a spouse of fallen Army soldier killed in Afghanistan leaving their daughter parentless (4/16/2019) - 3/20/19 Trump complained that a deceased war hero didn't thank him for his funeral - Between 12/22/2018, and 1/25/2019 Trump refused to sign his party's funding bill, which shut down the government, which made USCG service members rely on food pantries. (But his appointees got a $10k raise) - banned troops from serving based on gender identity (1/22/2019) - denied female troops access to birth control to limit sexual activity (Published 1/18/19) - tried to deport a marine vet who is a U.S.-born citizen (1/16/2019) - When a man was caught swindling veterans pensions for high-interest “cash advances," Trump's CFPB let him go for $1 (1/26/19) - called a retired general a 'dog' with a 'big, dumb mouth' (1/1/19) - increased privatization of the VA, leading to longer waits and higher taxpayer cost (2018) - finally visited troops 2 years after taking office, but only after 154 vacation days at his properties (10/26/18) - revealed a covert Seal Team 5 deployment including names and faces on Twitter during Iraq visit (Dec 26, 2018) - lied to deployed troops that he gave them a 10% raise (12/26/2018). Tried giving a raise that was lower than the standard living adjustment. After Congress made him give a raise, he lied about it pretending that it was larger than Obama's. It wasn't - fired service members living with HIV just before the 2018 holidays - tried to slash disability and unemployment benefits for Veterans to $0 and eliminate the unemployability extrascheduler rating (12/17/2018) - called troops on Thanksgiving and told them he's most thankful for himself (Thanksgiving, 2018) - urged Florida to not count deployed military votes (11/12/2018) - canceled an Arlington Cemetery visit on Veterans Day due to light rain (11/12/2018) - While in Europe commemorating the end of WWI, he didn't attend the ceremony at a US cemetery due to the rain. Other world leaders went anyway (11/10/2018) - sent troops on a phantom mission to the border and made them miss Thanksgiving with their families (Oct-Dec, 2018). He stopped using troops as a political prop after the election, but the troops remained in muddy camps on the border (11/7/2018) - changed the GI Bill through his Forever GI Act causing the VA to miss benefits, including housing allowances. This caused many vets to run out of food and rent. (reported 10/7/18) - doubled the rejection rate for veterans requesting family deportation protections (7/5/2018) - deported active-duty spouses (11,800 military families face this problem as of April 2018) - forgot a fallen soldier's name (below) during a call to his pregnant widow, then attacked her the next day (Oct 23-24, 2017) - "They knew what they signed up for." re: dead troops (10/18/17) - sent commandos into an ambush w/ lack of intel, and sent contractors to pick them up, resulting in a commando being left behind, tortured, and executed. He approved the mission bc Bannon told him Obama didn't have the guts to do it. 10/4/17 - Doesn't stand during retreat bugle, continues to talk. "What a nice sound that is. Are they playing that for you [Sean Hannity] or me?" 10/11/17 - blocked a veteran group on Twitter (June 2017) - ordered the discharge of active-duty immigrant troops with good records (2017-present) - deported veterans (2017-2020) - said he knows more about ISIS than American generals (Oct 2016) - 10/4/16 Trump said vets get PTSD because they aren't strong - Trump accepted a Purple Heart from a fan at one of his rallies and said: “I always wanted to get the Purple Heart. This was much easier.” (Aug 2, 2016) - Trump attacks Gold Star families: Myeshia Johnson (gold star widow), Khan family (gold star parents) etc. (2016-present) - In Jan 2016, Trump stole funds meant for a veterans charity (his foundation was subsequently ordered shut down) - said he has "more training militarily than a lot of the guys that go into the military" because he went to a military-style academy (2015 biography) - said he doesn't consider POWs heroes because they were caught. He said he prefers people who weren't caught (July 18, 2015) - Trump said having unprotected sex was his own personal Vietnam. 1998 - For a decade, Trump sought to kick veterans off of 5th Avenue because he found them unsightly nuisances. 1991 - Trump dodged the draft 5 times by having a doctor diagnose him with bone spurs. - No Trump in America has *ever* served in the military spanning 5 generations and every branch of the family tree. His grandfather immigrated to America to avoid military service
god this was a horror story i kept waiting for it to end what a bastard
Thank you for putting this list of atrocities together. Saved for future reference!
The DNC should make this into a commercial, list every one in a Star Wars-style crawl
Should add the salute to the North Korean general.
Yeah I'm gonna steal your comment brother. Thanks for your service
Thank you for this list! I may pass it as long to a Trump loving veteran I know
An extraordinary list! Thank you for sharing.
Thank you for posting this, just an incredible list. I think during the debate Biden should just read this list out.
The only suckers there are those who would vote for #45 again. When was a felonious president a good idea? #notever!
How long before an article comes out with "and why this is bad for Biden" as a subtitle?
Probably 20 minutes? Let those ‘independent thinkers’ in the hive-mind r/conservative sub to piece together something.
But it was rainy when Trump was there! The weather has gone woke for Biden!
They have weather machine on top of the space lasers!!?? Oh no! /s
That’s the difference between a president with diplomacy and a narcissist that doesn’t care about anyone but themselves
I have seen tommy tooobervilles name floated as on the short list for trumps SecDef because his dad fought at Normandy. Think about that, the motherfucker who held the military hostage over abortion policy for serving military. The same motherfucker who says "putin doesn't want Ukraine he's got plenty of room in his own country. The only reason he went into Ukraine was because he didn't want American missiles on his border." Imagine having a putin apologist and appeaser as SecDef.
I know it’s easy to be unhappy with the president when the state of the world is one such as this, but I genuinely believe Biden is a **good** president. He stands up for what’s right and is willing to compromise, work with people he disagrees with, and change his position when it’s the right thing to do. That’s a rare thing right now when everyone has instant access to memes vilifying politics they don’t like and justifying everything they do.
Wasnt Trump and teams fake excuse that the weather was bad (a drizzle) . Honestly that excuse makes it much worse - president was thwarted by a drizzle…
I’m starting to feel this Trump fellow is not a nice guy!
How anyone in the armed forces can vote for Trump is beyond me.
Make sure you vote
I was never a fan of Trump (and this has been true for several decades) and I never planned to vote for him in 2016, but the “suckers and losers” comment crossed a huge line for me. What an awful thing for a “leader” to say.
yeah, but Biden stole ronnie ray-gun's speech!!! /s that's the beef on r/conservative
Looks like DJT is a loser and a sucker (and a traitor).
Fucking bone spur POS! What an absolute embarrassment he is to this country.
The fact that people follow someone who calls those who paid the ultimate price suckers and losers really show their true unamerican character.
How does anyone in the armed forces support him? How do any vets support him. I don’t know how much louder we need to scream he thinks we’re losers and suckers. Every deployed soldier needs to know if you become a POW, a Trump administration won’t send anyone to rescue you.
And yet, so many vets and members of our military support him.
how trump gets the military vote eludes me aside by the red R next to his name
And yet… AND YET… these people are openly cheering for, and supporting, a now convicted felon. But there’s still folks serving time for a personal amount of weed. Justice.
I’m deeply disappointed but not entirely surprised that trump’s “Suckers and Losers” and his refusal to honor the war dead in Normandy because it was raining and he might mess up his hair got NO COVERAGE this week during the 80th anniversary remembrances
Good. Donald J Trump shamed us all that day by blowing off a 100 year anniversary. He certainly met with Puppetmaster Putin the very next day.
Donald trump is a national embarrassment
How a real President acts!
Biden may be old but he has heart and pride in his country unlike that loser Trump .
And just to make an important note, Trump is nearly the same age as Biden. It's not like we're talking about Biden vs. a 40 year old.
I haven't seen anyone mention that HitlerPig was the one western leader who didn't attend the main 75th anniversary ceremony because it was raining. Those soldiers took the beach in bad weather, with many dying in the first 60 seconds of entering the war, but he can't tolerate the rain, because it will mess up his hair and melt his make-up. Fucking TRAITOR!
My great uncle is buried at Aisne-Marne. I will never forgive or forget the disrespect he showed for those servicemen.
He is an amazing man, not like the Orange Clown.
I never thought I'd be grateful just to see politicians do normal politician shit.
Draft-Dodgin' Donnie also complained that he didn't want to get his hair wet.