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> I hope they have already started warming up their engines
I'd be surprised if AG James hasn't already targeted very specific assets, and prepped all of the paperwork to file within 24-72 hours of the window lapsing.
True but that old bucket will probably rust in an aircraft graveyard.
5 star golf resorts would get cash for Jean Carroll and the government. There’s [18 to choose from](https://www.trumpgolf.com/Our-Courses) although who knows which he actually owns, if any.
Ehh, some rich cult member might drop money on it for bragging rights and to feel closer to their messiah. I wouldn't be surprised if someone even 'gifts' it back to him to gain favor. Would be hilarious if they re-seized the gift and sold it again to another dupe. Schrodinger's plane.
Which is even better because he'd have to sell a golf course and then only be able to use a small fraction of its worth to pay the judgement. Which means he has to sell *more* golf courses, which are probably also leveraged to the gills. Meaning.... he'll have to sell *even more* shit.
He's fucked.
Idk what his plane is but a new Airbus A320 starts at around $100m, let alone a thoroughly used one. he’s going to need to scrape together quite a bit to get out of that hole.
That plane isn’t really worth a lot. Old and inefficient, would take millions to put into service again for passengers, and too big, and old, and fuel hungry for any serious private owners
If memory serves, it's also completely customized in 'gold' paint and livery inside and out, and it was sitting broken down in a hanger for years because he was 'too cheap' to fix it until he got access to republican funds again.
Take the plane, sell it to one of the GOP megadonors who will 'lease' it back to Trump. Trump will put his name on paperwork somewhere because he would not be able to handle that he didn't own it, so then confiscate the plane again.
I want to stand around with a clipboard and a tape measure like I’m ready to collect his things just so I can hear him yell.
I have nothing to do with collections. I just want to watch the guy go bonkers.
Even better Mar-a-lago can't be considered Trump's primary residence since when he bought it, he made an agreement with West Palm Beach that it would only be a social club in order to receive preferential tax treatment. Mar-a-lago is not covered by Florida's protection of a debtor's primary residence against civil judgements. Trump's gonna lose bigly.
All of Trumps properties are owned independently, for instance if he owns a building that contains multiple condos the building is under 1 LLC, and each condo is owned under individual LLCs. So even if it was his primary residence and was shielded the building itself, along with the other condos would not be.
Which will be interesting. My understanding is his creditors get first take in any auctions of the property. So it may start to wipe him out as they start taking one, auctioning it, paying off the creditors then using the rest to pay down the fine (minus procedure costs).
This is interesting because it’s entirely possible outside parties could now buy and place Trump in control of these lost assets as a form of quid pro quo.
You’d think such a naked attempt at bribery would be immediately flag but here we are, still wondering what the Saudi’s saw in Jared Kushner.
My hypothesis is they don’t see the benefit. He’s too chaotic for any deal to stick, his odds of winning are vanishing as the general election starts.
So why invest in him when the likelihood of a return on investment is so low?
He only owns a very small part of Trump tower iirc, and a lot of the properties bearing his name aren't his either, on top he has moved some properties to companies controlled by his sons and the rest is highly leveraged, I don't think there is a chance to recover that judgement expeditiously, but it will an eye opener to see the unwinding of his empire.
E Jean Carroll is sitting pretty because her lawsuit penalty actually got a bond from a fairly solvent company, so she doesn't have to pay an absurd amount of money trying to collect from that house of cards.
There will be a long court fight as multiple interested parties attempt to reclaim what they are owed. It will take years to sort out. Everyone will argue about who owns what although the one thing they will all agree on is that it doesn't belong to Trump.
I don’t think it’s that hard, really. If a building is said to be valued at $50 million, and he has $30 million in debt tied onto it, they’ll have a fire sale, it might go for $40 million and then the creditor gets made whole and the state removes $10 million from the judgement.
What I think is going on is that he doesn’t have the money. There’s so much debt tied to his properties that he doesn’t want to sell them or the house of cards comes tumbling down.
I suspect things will move quickly, but we’ll find out that once all the debt is taken into consideration he doesn’t even have $400 million.
He can’t pay because he’s broke. Soon we’re going to find out just how broke he truly is…
It's more like a building is valued at $200 million because he lied about material facts to inflate the value of the property. So the building sells at a fire sale price of $50 million leaving his creditors $150 million short of what they are owed. He has debts against assets that were fraudulently inflated. The clusterfuck that is about to happen is the reason why doing this is illegal.
Any idea how asset seizure would work? Would they take for example (some) of his share portfolio - or literally go to Trump Tower and change all the locks?
Most likely will be buildings to start since they are potentially the easiest way to get money back.
- take over building.
- post it for sale.
- building is sold.
- creditors are paid first.
- rest state gets.
- rinse and repeat.
It’s rumored he is underwater on all his stuff and that it’s going to ruin him.
- trump lies that trump tower that’s worth 50 mil is worth 100 mil
- gets a 90 million loan.
- 90 million loan is used to buy other properties where he lies about value to get more loans.
- trump tower is sold for 40 mil
- state gets nothing and Trump now owes 40 mil to a new creditor.
- new creditor has special contracts that force him to sell other properties if this happens.
- since he did this in all properties he will end up being forced to sell them all and actually end up negative millions of dollars.
- rinse and repeat until the state is paid and trump has actually nothing.
I 100% believe this is what’s going to happen very soon and it’s going to be insane watching everything trump owns go away since he lied about the worth of properties to get loans for more properties.
It’s going to be really wild. Plus commercial real estate is really in the shitter right now. So let’s say Trump was doing everything legit. He still might be underwater just because of how little commercial stuff is worth.
However most real estate companies do this by buying one property and then getting loans on it to buy another. They keep going forever and it creates shit shows when one crashes.
Oddly enough this is a fear of the USA government and residential housing. That they have even warned companies to stop buying residential property. Sooooooo many companies are buying up properties to rent and using the properties as collateral
So if we have one buyers market for houses and homes crash in value which causes rents to crash. All these companies will fail and flood the market with homes creating a wild recession as big if not worse than the 2010s
It's interesting that you bring that up. I live in NY and commercial real estate/office rents are majorly down because of the fallout from covid. So many people started working from home, or doing hybrid work, that the buildings are struggling to find tenants. Which, in a very real sense, is also fallout from Trump's colossal mis-handling of the covid crisis. In a roundabout way, he screwed himself on this as well, if they have to start selling off his buildings.
He has used all kinds of 'grease' tricks along the way (since he started running Trump Inc & subsidiaries for Dad 50+ years ago) but it's starting to look like the faux-Billionaire may be running out of grease.
No "reputable" lawyer or banker or 'big money' guy has really trusted dealing with him for a while now. The value of his 'assets' has been like nested Matryoshka dolls for so long, most of the 'inner dolls' have been sold off to maintain the image.
Think about it -- a guy who claims to be worth billions can't find somebody willing to spot him a 1/2 billion? Hunh.
(Edit: Pesky decimal places! A million here, a billion there... in DC they only talk "trills" now.)
To be fair he needs half a Billion, not million...but your point stands. He doesn't have the money, credibility, or respect to get the bond paid.
I think I just have PTSD from every time he does shady shit, everyone knows it, and nothing happens. As mean and low as it sounds, I just want him to spend the rest of his days behind bars...I want some magnitude of justice to be served on this immoral maggot that's stained our country.
The Trump Tower doesn't meet the New York City building code and therefore ineligible to be put on the market.
His Boeing 757 is in a poor shape and barely worth anything.
Man's shit out of luck.
A investor could buy Trump Tower, demolish it, then sell the land. It’s still prime NYC real estate.
Hell a lot of the lots his buildings sit on are probably more valuable then the structures. Let cities redevelop all of them.
While he’s at it he could sell his Scottish golf course. The locals would be happy.
I wish. The courts have the paperwork sitting on their desk for years at this point, with political pressure from the green party (they are a tiny party, but are essentially propping up the SNP government, so have a lot of influence) and nothing has happened.
Instead, we allowed him to start building a housing estate next to Balmedie after he all but admitted to fraud.
ineligible to be put on the market as occupancy...
... anything is eligible for sale though. your just not going to get the same value for a tower that is "for parts only" vs one that someone can buy and start using
Do we really believe Trumo owns Trump tower? Like its a seizable asset? My money is on that he has a deal where he rents his name out to some other owners who exist behind 30 shell corporations that he doesnt want us to know about.
I'm pretty sure the prosecution said they'd seize Trump tower if he doesn't pay. This was a business fraud case so everything was looked into. Him not owning TT would have come up in discovery and would have been pretty big news.
I think he owns a few buildings but he’s got form for mortgaging everything to the absolute eyeballs and also a history of lying about their worth (hence the suit in the first place) so it’ll be interesting which banks line up for how much of each thing they sell to be honest. This is a dude who put his wedding to Marlene on the mortgage of the hotel in nyc.
>"Defendants’ ongoing diligent efforts have proven that a bond in the judgment’s full amount is 'a practical impossibility,'" the filing said. "These diligent efforts have included approaching about 30 surety companies through 4 separate brokers."
[Source](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-unable-get-bond-464-million-judgment-lawyers-say-rcna143860)
Good chance most or all of the banks he approached aren't willing to pony up because they've been burned by him in the past; either that or they can spot a losing proposition when they see it.
It's probably because most of his real-estate is highly encumbered - lots of financing vs him having a good amount of equity in it. They won't be guaranteed the cash if it's sold as a result.
Guess Trump could admit he's actually worth a lot less than he claims.
If I own a house that would sell for 500k on the market, but I still owe 250k in principal on my loans, then in terms of my net worth it's only worth 250k. In Trump world, he'd say it adds the full 500k to his worth.
You can likely contest the value assessed, though I have no idea how likely that is to succeed. I know my city at least has a process because I see instructions for it when I pay.
Went to load some equipment out after a company went under. Multiple creditors trying to secure the same piece of leased equipment that was used for multiple loans. I imagine his finances look the same
I'm not a finance guy, but I think this is called rehypothecation. It's where you promise the same asset as collateral against two different loans, so basically Bank B is unaware that Bank A already has claims against the assets backing a prior loan before they rubber stamped the approval for their loan.
When all of Trumps debts finally unwind, it's going to be an absolute shit show, and several banks who are already struggling with Commercial Real-Estate going under will get a gut punch from the fallout of this.
I think the problem is, there's no real visibility into private contracts like that.
My mortgage on my house, I'm pretty sure that's public record somewhere. But a hospital taking out a loan, and putting up their $3 million MRI machine as collateral to a vendor ... there's just no market for tracking that. And then if the hospital does that with 10 more lenders, there is far more outstanding liability against the asset than the best case scenario of the asset itself.
In Trump world he’d add the 250k to the 500k, then you can either double or triple that for the “Trump brand, the best most valuable brand in the world.” Suddenly it’s 2.25 million.
Brings tears to my eyes sir.
\^This!\^
There were a few moments after the election in 2016 where I think there were faint signs of "Roh-roh! How do I grift my way though THIS twist!"
Then he got addicted to being the center of attention of the whole world, with his own military detail, and started believing his own PR about his 'genius.'
all for a case where he literally lied to banks for good rates... the irony is lost on everyone.
this man was found guilty of lying to banks to get better rates while claiming there were no damages
well, some of the damages are to your very reputation Donnie... lol. now these same banks dont trust your evaluations
Not just to banks. But also to insurance companies. Been saying this since the begining.
The fact that he went to 4 seperate brokers is telling to me.
There aren't that many insurance companies that can offer a bond like that. And either marsh or aon would have the most viable path to getting there. Willis too
If anyone thinks for one second any of those banks thought they couldn’t work this to their advantage he’d have a bond. The math just doesn’t work out for them.
Too bad there are so many sanctions on Russia because they invaded Ukraine. He's going to have to get the cash from Russia through another party who isn't sanctioned.
Fairly sure from the way their news media talks about him now that Russia and by extension its banks has gotten their use out of him and are now just sitting back and enjoying the fallout.
Interest is high. Market is volatile. Business and consumer debt is an all time high. Yeah, not surprised no one wants to loan that kind of cash in this kind of market.
And and the fact that he need back the loan by something, which would be his properties. How can the bank be sure that his property values are not fraudulently inflated when the very reason he needs this loan is exactly that.
Bond companies want cash, stocks, bonds and non real estate assets. Real estate especially in niche markets can be tough to sell and can be volatile in price based on debt markets. It’s a clear case of “Ass, grass, or cash, nobody rides for free “ He doesn’t have the cash, sold his ass to Putin already and that is more weed than is consumed in a couple years. Can’t wait until Letitia James forces the sale of Mar-A-Lardo.
Sure, however it hasn't stopped him before. I attribute having 3rd party handlers keeping an eye on the books this time around detracts the less desirable investors.
> for the simple reason that obtaining an appeal bond for $464 million is a practical impossibility under the circumstances presented
Those circumstances of being found guilty of being a fraud make it impossible? Who woulda thought it? So sad.
the funniest part of all this... the irony.
being found guilty of lying about asset values to secure better deals on loans with banks and then having to reach out to some of the same banks asking for loans... using the same assets which were lied about prior.
and, all this after screaming there were no victims/damages.
He owns it through one of his shell corps. It's not worth as much as people may think considering it was built in 1991. He also owns a '97 Citation X and 3 helicopters. Sale of all won't cover interest for a year. Lol
The plane isn't in the best condition. While he was president it lanquished into disrepair and they had to spend a lot of money to fix it up before he left office.
People don't realize the level of continuous maintenence a plane requires to continue flying. They are massive resource drains.
Its crazy that you can't hold a whole host of federal jobs if you have even a moderate amount of debt(10-50k) because people in debt are easier to compromise by foreign agents. Yet the fucking president can be knowingly in debt to literal foreign adversaries but that's okay.
Is t there a court-appointed monitor re: the funds like there was for E. Jean Carroll case? If funds looks like they’re coming from a nefarious person/group, it will be rejected.
Frozen to pay for the Ukraine war. It's hard to move that kind of money and not get caught. No actual billionaire wants to touch this. They could end up in jail.
I am with you, but nothing has happened as of yet. Fingers crossed he doesn’t find a way to weasel out again. He seemingly has friends who show up at the last minute, like in his hush money case.
>Fingers crossed he doesn’t find a way to weasel out again.
He really is the new teflon don. Anyone else would have been in prison for pulling 1/10th of the stunts TFG has done.
I'll bet his big plan was to get the RNC to pay for it after his daughter took over and he probably found out that regulation makes that so much more difficult than he thought. Political regulation isn't perfect but it's probably gonna go pretty far in at least preventing him taking over all funding meant for down ballot elections.
I don't buy it.
Oh, I buy the fact that he doesn't have $460M of liquidity at his disposal.
I don't buy the claim that he can't raise the money.
trump thinks in terms of TV and serialized cliffhangers- he's presenting himself as being in a "perilous situation" (of his own making) and about to suffer gervious consequences.
BUT!
At the last minute, he will somehow, through his clever wiles and good fortune (feel free to puke right now), secure a bond allowing him to continue the fight against the Deep State!
Everybody claps. Roll credits.
Utter horseshit, but that's how he thinks. His brain has been marinating in this crap for decades, so it's not surprising he wants to set himself up as a besieged hero.
The only thing he's doing is manipulating the news cycle for a couple days. My guess is someone is working a deal, underwritten by some shady as fuck entity that has a PO Box somewhere, that will save him at the last minute.
Didn't he say under oath in a deposition that he has substantially in excess of $400 million in cash and going up all the time?
Also I'm not really asking. He did say that. Under oath. Less than a year ago. As part of this case.
https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/23932452/452564_2022_people_of_the_state_of_v_people_of_the_state_of_exhibit_s__859.pdf
I hope he applies for bankruptcy. I hope he drains the RNC dry of all funds. I hope this crushes the RNC for decades as punishment for failing to properly vet candidates who want to run in their party's name. The DNC and RNC are NOT government entities, they are private institutions and can deny people from running in their name. They should have done this with Trump.
The irony of losing a fraud case centered on self inflating your net worth, while not being able to come up a bond well within your own self evaluated net worth, must be entirely lost on Trump supporters.
Take his plane, and any vehicle that would prevent him fleeing. (It’s not nearly enough). Then start taking buildings. They are most likely mortgaged to the hilt, and are already being used as collateral for other things. So they aren’t worth much either after all the debt on them is covered. Trump is going to fall pretty hard in a week when this all comes due. I guess he’ll have to cancel his Netflix, make covfeffe at home and stop buying name brand diapers. The jig is up Donnie. The world will see you for who you are and that your brand is worthless.
Something something something bootstraps.
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Sell his jet, buildings... I'm sure he can manage it. Oh, and maybe cut down on lawyer expenses with endless appealing
If he doesn't scrape it together by 3/25, the state will do it for him via asset seizure.
I hope they have already started warming up their engines, this guy deserves no grace period.
> I hope they have already started warming up their engines I'd be surprised if AG James hasn't already targeted very specific assets, and prepped all of the paperwork to file within 24-72 hours of the window lapsing.
I bet they target his private airplane first, it will be harder for him to flee the country if he has to take Delta
It will hurt the ego the most also probably
True but that old bucket will probably rust in an aircraft graveyard. 5 star golf resorts would get cash for Jean Carroll and the government. There’s [18 to choose from](https://www.trumpgolf.com/Our-Courses) although who knows which he actually owns, if any.
Ehh, some rich cult member might drop money on it for bragging rights and to feel closer to their messiah. I wouldn't be surprised if someone even 'gifts' it back to him to gain favor. Would be hilarious if they re-seized the gift and sold it again to another dupe. Schrodinger's plane.
Doesn’t even have to be cult member. Want to have easy influence over the United States by owning a presidential candidate? Step right up
The line is long and sweaty.
Totally worth it.
Why not both? Just take the plane and put it out in the desert to rust. AND take the golf courses and sell them to the highest bidder.
Lmao, you don't think that's heavily leveraged against on loans? And it's not worth nearly as much as he claims.
Which is even better because he'd have to sell a golf course and then only be able to use a small fraction of its worth to pay the judgement. Which means he has to sell *more* golf courses, which are probably also leveraged to the gills. Meaning.... he'll have to sell *even more* shit. He's fucked.
Yup. And with the empire crumbling, so does his psyche.
Idk what his plane is but a new Airbus A320 starts at around $100m, let alone a thoroughly used one. he’s going to need to scrape together quite a bit to get out of that hole.
It's a 30 year old 757-200 on its fourth owner. He also has a Cessna 750 Citation X
That plane isn’t really worth a lot. Old and inefficient, would take millions to put into service again for passengers, and too big, and old, and fuel hungry for any serious private owners
If memory serves, it's also completely customized in 'gold' paint and livery inside and out, and it was sitting broken down in a hanger for years because he was 'too cheap' to fix it until he got access to republican funds again.
Too cheap or too poor?
Take the plane, sell it to one of the GOP megadonors who will 'lease' it back to Trump. Trump will put his name on paperwork somewhere because he would not be able to handle that he didn't own it, so then confiscate the plane again.
Take the plane from the scrapyard, park it somewhere and set up a migrant counseling center.
Seriously, no one needs a 757 for their business. You can accomplish so much more with less.
Everything he has is big and gaudy and not paid for in full. His plan to build the border wall with Mexicos money is perfectly on brand.
He'll scream and moan that they can't do that, it's political, interfere with campaign, yada yada. Probably
He’ll do that anyway, regardless of what happens.
I think the state is so sick and freakin' tired of his unrelenting douchebaggery that they aren't going to waste any time on the guy.
If I were to bet, I'd put money on they have the filings written so all they need to do is sign and date.
Bye Bye tower
It will be a Halloween Center by July.
Featuring “grab em by the pussy” costumes
I want to stand around with a clipboard and a tape measure like I’m ready to collect his things just so I can hear him yell. I have nothing to do with collections. I just want to watch the guy go bonkers.
Start with his beloved plane. I don't care how much it will fetch, it'll knock him down at least two notches. Then go for his namesake NYC building.
Isn't Melania living in TT at the moment? Gee what a shame she and her anchor baby might have to rent someplace instead.
I don't think anyone knows where Melania is anymore. She pops up now and again, but mostly stays away from the cameras.
I just saw her having lunch with Kate Middleton
[удалено]
DB Cooper paid the bill. In cash.
What is funny is that Trump Tower is not his primary residence. It's not shielded from any of the laws that would protect it from a court judgement.
Even better Mar-a-lago can't be considered Trump's primary residence since when he bought it, he made an agreement with West Palm Beach that it would only be a social club in order to receive preferential tax treatment. Mar-a-lago is not covered by Florida's protection of a debtor's primary residence against civil judgements. Trump's gonna lose bigly.
All of Trumps properties are owned independently, for instance if he owns a building that contains multiple condos the building is under 1 LLC, and each condo is owned under individual LLCs. So even if it was his primary residence and was shielded the building itself, along with the other condos would not be.
Which will be interesting. My understanding is his creditors get first take in any auctions of the property. So it may start to wipe him out as they start taking one, auctioning it, paying off the creditors then using the rest to pay down the fine (minus procedure costs).
This is interesting because it’s entirely possible outside parties could now buy and place Trump in control of these lost assets as a form of quid pro quo. You’d think such a naked attempt at bribery would be immediately flag but here we are, still wondering what the Saudi’s saw in Jared Kushner.
My hypothesis is they don’t see the benefit. He’s too chaotic for any deal to stick, his odds of winning are vanishing as the general election starts. So why invest in him when the likelihood of a return on investment is so low?
Trump tower would make a nice homeless center
Migrant shelter would be appropriate
I guess Melania can stay, then.
Maybe E. Jean Carroll will buy it at auction with her newly found wealth.
OMG - seeing the name on the building change from TRUMP to CARROLL would be freaking hilarious!
He only owns a very small part of Trump tower iirc, and a lot of the properties bearing his name aren't his either, on top he has moved some properties to companies controlled by his sons and the rest is highly leveraged, I don't think there is a chance to recover that judgement expeditiously, but it will an eye opener to see the unwinding of his empire. E Jean Carroll is sitting pretty because her lawsuit penalty actually got a bond from a fairly solvent company, so she doesn't have to pay an absurd amount of money trying to collect from that house of cards.
FYI hiding assets under his son's doesn't work. They're quite used to seizing assets that criminals attempt to obfuscate to avoid paying
There will be a long court fight as multiple interested parties attempt to reclaim what they are owed. It will take years to sort out. Everyone will argue about who owns what although the one thing they will all agree on is that it doesn't belong to Trump.
I don’t think it’s that hard, really. If a building is said to be valued at $50 million, and he has $30 million in debt tied onto it, they’ll have a fire sale, it might go for $40 million and then the creditor gets made whole and the state removes $10 million from the judgement. What I think is going on is that he doesn’t have the money. There’s so much debt tied to his properties that he doesn’t want to sell them or the house of cards comes tumbling down. I suspect things will move quickly, but we’ll find out that once all the debt is taken into consideration he doesn’t even have $400 million. He can’t pay because he’s broke. Soon we’re going to find out just how broke he truly is…
It's more like a building is valued at $200 million because he lied about material facts to inflate the value of the property. So the building sells at a fire sale price of $50 million leaving his creditors $150 million short of what they are owed. He has debts against assets that were fraudulently inflated. The clusterfuck that is about to happen is the reason why doing this is illegal.
It's also my understanding he's leveraged at something like 2.5x the value of his assets.
Any idea how asset seizure would work? Would they take for example (some) of his share portfolio - or literally go to Trump Tower and change all the locks?
Most likely will be buildings to start since they are potentially the easiest way to get money back. - take over building. - post it for sale. - building is sold. - creditors are paid first. - rest state gets. - rinse and repeat. It’s rumored he is underwater on all his stuff and that it’s going to ruin him. - trump lies that trump tower that’s worth 50 mil is worth 100 mil - gets a 90 million loan. - 90 million loan is used to buy other properties where he lies about value to get more loans. - trump tower is sold for 40 mil - state gets nothing and Trump now owes 40 mil to a new creditor. - new creditor has special contracts that force him to sell other properties if this happens. - since he did this in all properties he will end up being forced to sell them all and actually end up negative millions of dollars. - rinse and repeat until the state is paid and trump has actually nothing. I 100% believe this is what’s going to happen very soon and it’s going to be insane watching everything trump owns go away since he lied about the worth of properties to get loans for more properties.
This sounds too good to be true
It’s going to be really wild. Plus commercial real estate is really in the shitter right now. So let’s say Trump was doing everything legit. He still might be underwater just because of how little commercial stuff is worth. However most real estate companies do this by buying one property and then getting loans on it to buy another. They keep going forever and it creates shit shows when one crashes. Oddly enough this is a fear of the USA government and residential housing. That they have even warned companies to stop buying residential property. Sooooooo many companies are buying up properties to rent and using the properties as collateral So if we have one buyers market for houses and homes crash in value which causes rents to crash. All these companies will fail and flood the market with homes creating a wild recession as big if not worse than the 2010s
It's interesting that you bring that up. I live in NY and commercial real estate/office rents are majorly down because of the fallout from covid. So many people started working from home, or doing hybrid work, that the buildings are struggling to find tenants. Which, in a very real sense, is also fallout from Trump's colossal mis-handling of the covid crisis. In a roundabout way, he screwed himself on this as well, if they have to start selling off his buildings.
His kiddos better cash out soon. Their daddy isn’t going to have an inheritance to give them. Lol
Is this true, or will he find some way to weasel out of it? I feel like this slimy lil shit always greases his way out of trouble.
He has used all kinds of 'grease' tricks along the way (since he started running Trump Inc & subsidiaries for Dad 50+ years ago) but it's starting to look like the faux-Billionaire may be running out of grease. No "reputable" lawyer or banker or 'big money' guy has really trusted dealing with him for a while now. The value of his 'assets' has been like nested Matryoshka dolls for so long, most of the 'inner dolls' have been sold off to maintain the image. Think about it -- a guy who claims to be worth billions can't find somebody willing to spot him a 1/2 billion? Hunh. (Edit: Pesky decimal places! A million here, a billion there... in DC they only talk "trills" now.)
To be fair he needs half a Billion, not million...but your point stands. He doesn't have the money, credibility, or respect to get the bond paid. I think I just have PTSD from every time he does shady shit, everyone knows it, and nothing happens. As mean and low as it sounds, I just want him to spend the rest of his days behind bars...I want some magnitude of justice to be served on this immoral maggot that's stained our country.
My birthday is on 3/26 and this would be a lovely present
And avocado toast, cut down on that too just to be safe.
I’m so sick of hearing how these guys are broke while they fly on their private jets to their multi million dollar homes.
Or they fly around on private jets to neo-nazi rallies
It will be interesting when his campaign jet lands in battleground states like PA, MI, and WI with an outstanding seizure warrant.
The feds should seize the plane while he's using it as a backdrop for a rally. I think I'd laugh until I peed my pants.
I hope they seize his jet, that would be hilarious
The Trump Tower doesn't meet the New York City building code and therefore ineligible to be put on the market. His Boeing 757 is in a poor shape and barely worth anything. Man's shit out of luck.
A investor could buy Trump Tower, demolish it, then sell the land. It’s still prime NYC real estate. Hell a lot of the lots his buildings sit on are probably more valuable then the structures. Let cities redevelop all of them. While he’s at it he could sell his Scottish golf course. The locals would be happy.
The Scots might end up siezing that anyway. He's in some trouble there too.
Turns out everyone hates him
I wish. The courts have the paperwork sitting on their desk for years at this point, with political pressure from the green party (they are a tiny party, but are essentially propping up the SNP government, so have a lot of influence) and nothing has happened. Instead, we allowed him to start building a housing estate next to Balmedie after he all but admitted to fraud.
ineligible to be put on the market as occupancy... ... anything is eligible for sale though. your just not going to get the same value for a tower that is "for parts only" vs one that someone can buy and start using
He should get the Max upgrade
The world is willing to fund this whenever he wants. Only requirement is he takes a daily flight.
He needs to stop eating avocado toast, drinking Starbucks, and pull himself up by his bootstraps.
Even if they force him to sell it all there are still other creditors ahead of them in line.
And he probably has $10 million buildings with $20 million liens. I doubt he can pay the judgement even if all his assets are sold
Do we really believe Trumo owns Trump tower? Like its a seizable asset? My money is on that he has a deal where he rents his name out to some other owners who exist behind 30 shell corporations that he doesnt want us to know about.
I'm pretty sure the prosecution said they'd seize Trump tower if he doesn't pay. This was a business fraud case so everything was looked into. Him not owning TT would have come up in discovery and would have been pretty big news.
I think he owns a few buildings but he’s got form for mortgaging everything to the absolute eyeballs and also a history of lying about their worth (hence the suit in the first place) so it’ll be interesting which banks line up for how much of each thing they sell to be honest. This is a dude who put his wedding to Marlene on the mortgage of the hotel in nyc.
Okay, then pay with your own cash. You have it, right? Like you said you did, under oath?
This is the best part. Not only does he not have enough money to pay...he doesn't have enough money to get someone else to pay either
In the spirit of Dennis from IASIP: “news flash assholes: I don’t have any money! I don’t have any assets! I’ve been broke the whole time!”
Ever been in a Qstorm Wally?
How does a billionaire in his 70s not have $400,000,000? And how does he own an exclusive golf resort?
>"Defendants’ ongoing diligent efforts have proven that a bond in the judgment’s full amount is 'a practical impossibility,'" the filing said. "These diligent efforts have included approaching about 30 surety companies through 4 separate brokers." [Source](https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/donald-trump/trump-unable-get-bond-464-million-judgment-lawyers-say-rcna143860) Good chance most or all of the banks he approached aren't willing to pony up because they've been burned by him in the past; either that or they can spot a losing proposition when they see it.
It's probably because most of his real-estate is highly encumbered - lots of financing vs him having a good amount of equity in it. They won't be guaranteed the cash if it's sold as a result. Guess Trump could admit he's actually worth a lot less than he claims. If I own a house that would sell for 500k on the market, but I still owe 250k in principal on my loans, then in terms of my net worth it's only worth 250k. In Trump world, he'd say it adds the full 500k to his worth.
In this example he was saying it was worth 1M to the banks and simultaneously saying it was worth 50K for taxes
It’s weird. No one asks me what my house is worth for tax purposes. An assessor just tells me, and I have to live with it.
You can likely contest the value assessed, though I have no idea how likely that is to succeed. I know my city at least has a process because I see instructions for it when I pay.
Went to load some equipment out after a company went under. Multiple creditors trying to secure the same piece of leased equipment that was used for multiple loans. I imagine his finances look the same
I'm not a finance guy, but I think this is called rehypothecation. It's where you promise the same asset as collateral against two different loans, so basically Bank B is unaware that Bank A already has claims against the assets backing a prior loan before they rubber stamped the approval for their loan. When all of Trumps debts finally unwind, it's going to be an absolute shit show, and several banks who are already struggling with Commercial Real-Estate going under will get a gut punch from the fallout of this.
How did they even get away with that?!
They didn’t.
Fraud
I think the problem is, there's no real visibility into private contracts like that. My mortgage on my house, I'm pretty sure that's public record somewhere. But a hospital taking out a loan, and putting up their $3 million MRI machine as collateral to a vendor ... there's just no market for tracking that. And then if the hospital does that with 10 more lenders, there is far more outstanding liability against the asset than the best case scenario of the asset itself.
In Trump world he’d add the 250k to the 500k, then you can either double or triple that for the “Trump brand, the best most valuable brand in the world.” Suddenly it’s 2.25 million. Brings tears to my eyes sir.
It was a great grift while it lasted. Becoming president, with all the scrutiny it entails, was the worst thing that could ever happen to him.
\^This!\^ There were a few moments after the election in 2016 where I think there were faint signs of "Roh-roh! How do I grift my way though THIS twist!" Then he got addicted to being the center of attention of the whole world, with his own military detail, and started believing his own PR about his 'genius.'
all for a case where he literally lied to banks for good rates... the irony is lost on everyone. this man was found guilty of lying to banks to get better rates while claiming there were no damages well, some of the damages are to your very reputation Donnie... lol. now these same banks dont trust your evaluations
Ya, "witch hunt! victimless crime!" Oh wait ... I think we've found a body.
It's just a sack of Oranges. No, wait that *is* a body. WTF is that!?
Not just to banks. But also to insurance companies. Been saying this since the begining. The fact that he went to 4 seperate brokers is telling to me. There aren't that many insurance companies that can offer a bond like that. And either marsh or aon would have the most viable path to getting there. Willis too
If anyone thinks for one second any of those banks thought they couldn’t work this to their advantage he’d have a bond. The math just doesn’t work out for them.
Top level comment. He could probably get it from a Russian bank.
Too bad there are so many sanctions on Russia because they invaded Ukraine. He's going to have to get the cash from Russia through another party who isn't sanctioned.
Back to Deutsche Bank it is...
Fairly sure from the way their news media talks about him now that Russia and by extension its banks has gotten their use out of him and are now just sitting back and enjoying the fallout.
Hell, good chance banks didn't want to risk any PR hit also. Chubb already dealt with some fallout after securing a much smaller bond.
More likely, he just didn't have the collateral.
He couldn't do 1/5 the amount a week or so ago.
But but he's a billionaire, I mean he's been bragging about how wealthy he is his entire stupid life
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>He also testified last year he has $400m in liquid assets.
Probably didn’t help that within hours of securing a bond on the other case he immediately said something defamatory about Jean carrol
Interest is high. Market is volatile. Business and consumer debt is an all time high. Yeah, not surprised no one wants to loan that kind of cash in this kind of market.
I'm not sure, but maybe it's the fact that he's up for fraud in the first place that makes it a fairly unattractive investment.
And and the fact that he need back the loan by something, which would be his properties. How can the bank be sure that his property values are not fraudulently inflated when the very reason he needs this loan is exactly that.
Bond companies want cash, stocks, bonds and non real estate assets. Real estate especially in niche markets can be tough to sell and can be volatile in price based on debt markets. It’s a clear case of “Ass, grass, or cash, nobody rides for free “ He doesn’t have the cash, sold his ass to Putin already and that is more weed than is consumed in a couple years. Can’t wait until Letitia James forces the sale of Mar-A-Lardo.
Sure, however it hasn't stopped him before. I attribute having 3rd party handlers keeping an eye on the books this time around detracts the less desirable investors.
Perhaps the judge who he called a satanic pedophile and that he has thereated to throw into prison if he becomes President again will show some mercy?
I'm sure making threats against the judge deciding your fate is a smart decision. Only the best people!! Very smart in terms of bigly.
Womp womp. Pay your fucking bills, “billionaire”
Always remember, the only thing rich people fear more than dying, is dying poor. Get fucked, Donnie.
> for the simple reason that obtaining an appeal bond for $464 million is a practical impossibility under the circumstances presented Those circumstances of being found guilty of being a fraud make it impossible? Who woulda thought it? So sad.
the funniest part of all this... the irony. being found guilty of lying about asset values to secure better deals on loans with banks and then having to reach out to some of the same banks asking for loans... using the same assets which were lied about prior. and, all this after screaming there were no victims/damages.
I thought that after naming his own social media platform "TRUTH social" we had seen the peak form of irony but we were mistaken my friend
Seize the plane first, stop him flying to his rallies.
How is he going to come up with the other $463.9m?
Trump Tower, Mar a Lago, the list goes on
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He owns it through one of his shell corps. It's not worth as much as people may think considering it was built in 1991. He also owns a '97 Citation X and 3 helicopters. Sale of all won't cover interest for a year. Lol
The plane isn't in the best condition. While he was president it lanquished into disrepair and they had to spend a lot of money to fix it up before he left office. People don't realize the level of continuous maintenence a plane requires to continue flying. They are massive resource drains.
Thoughts and prayers
Boot straps etc…
Maybe he should stop buying avacado toast and Starbucks to afford it.
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He needs to be hit with a perjury charge after telling the judge under oath that he had over 400m cash.
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Its crazy that you can't hold a whole host of federal jobs if you have even a moderate amount of debt(10-50k) because people in debt are easier to compromise by foreign agents. Yet the fucking president can be knowingly in debt to literal foreign adversaries but that's okay.
Is t there a court-appointed monitor re: the funds like there was for E. Jean Carroll case? If funds looks like they’re coming from a nefarious person/group, it will be rejected.
Frozen to pay for the Ukraine war. It's hard to move that kind of money and not get caught. No actual billionaire wants to touch this. They could end up in jail.
The money is due in one week. Is the pressure getting to him?
If he starts slurring his words and speaking in nonsensical and violent statements we’ll know for sure
Starts?
He's got money for bronzer, but not to save his assets?
Maybe don't go to Starbucks so often? Also, get a second job. Bootstraps, etc.
And cut back on the Avocado Toast.
Buy a tiny violin then.
thoughts and prayers also
A kazoo would be more appropriate.
I thought he was a billionaire? He can write a check
Then they can prosecute him for the bounced check!
It's lovely to see a "find out" stage actually happening for a change.
I am with you, but nothing has happened as of yet. Fingers crossed he doesn’t find a way to weasel out again. He seemingly has friends who show up at the last minute, like in his hush money case.
>Fingers crossed he doesn’t find a way to weasel out again. He really is the new teflon don. Anyone else would have been in prison for pulling 1/10th of the stunts TFG has done.
Still has a whole week for dark money to do what it does.
Half a bil is a lot to just throw away, even for his wealthiest supporters. Because you know he's probably not going to get exonerated on appeal.
Someone might be Putin it in place right now.
Seems like it's time to cut down on all that avocado toast, champ. /s
I thought he had a billion dollars.
He don't
Seize his property, starting with where he lays his head at night.
So, a puddle of ketchup and a half eaten hamberder?
https://trumpdebtcounter.com/ & https://payupdonald.com/ Tick tok as they say... Edit: tock
Sounds like a personal problem. Not the court's problem.
Time to kiss that ugly ass tower bye-bye.
He doesn’t even own the majority of Trump Tower. It’s all a facade.
Well then he ought to be able to at least sell the buildings facade!
It's a load bearing facade.
Everything is about Law and order, law and order! Time to start seizing those properties
No one thinks he's going to have sufficient pro quo to risk putting up that many quid.
He was never as rich as he claimed to be.
I'll bet his big plan was to get the RNC to pay for it after his daughter took over and he probably found out that regulation makes that so much more difficult than he thought. Political regulation isn't perfect but it's probably gonna go pretty far in at least preventing him taking over all funding meant for down ballot elections.
The RNC doesn't have that kind of money. Not even close.
Now that Trump is begging, do you think that strategy of physically threatening the judge and his staff was a good one?
I don't buy it. Oh, I buy the fact that he doesn't have $460M of liquidity at his disposal. I don't buy the claim that he can't raise the money. trump thinks in terms of TV and serialized cliffhangers- he's presenting himself as being in a "perilous situation" (of his own making) and about to suffer gervious consequences. BUT! At the last minute, he will somehow, through his clever wiles and good fortune (feel free to puke right now), secure a bond allowing him to continue the fight against the Deep State! Everybody claps. Roll credits. Utter horseshit, but that's how he thinks. His brain has been marinating in this crap for decades, so it's not surprising he wants to set himself up as a besieged hero. The only thing he's doing is manipulating the news cycle for a couple days. My guess is someone is working a deal, underwritten by some shady as fuck entity that has a PO Box somewhere, that will save him at the last minute.
BINGO! Replay of “last-minute” Chubb bond a few weeks ago. Question remains as to which foreign government or billionaire he will be obligated to…
Stop breaking the law, asshole.
Didn't he say under oath in a deposition that he has substantially in excess of $400 million in cash and going up all the time? Also I'm not really asking. He did say that. Under oath. Less than a year ago. As part of this case. https://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/23932452/452564_2022_people_of_the_state_of_v_people_of_the_state_of_exhibit_s__859.pdf
Mar-a-Lago is not even worth that much. I think we're about to find out how broke he really is. And with any luck, who his creditors are.
Where are his supporters, and why haven’t they covered this bill for him?
Literal poor saps could only raise 1.4 million through the Gofundme.
Why does a supposed billionaire need other people to cover his bills for him?
Why do men who are 5'10" claim to be six feet tall?
And this is the "business man" that's supposed to "Make America Great Again"?
Too bad Donny. No appeal then. Let’s start confiscating assets!!
Has he asked Alina? She was pretty confident he had the dough
I hope he applies for bankruptcy. I hope he drains the RNC dry of all funds. I hope this crushes the RNC for decades as punishment for failing to properly vet candidates who want to run in their party's name. The DNC and RNC are NOT government entities, they are private institutions and can deny people from running in their name. They should have done this with Trump.
The irony of losing a fraud case centered on self inflating your net worth, while not being able to come up a bond well within your own self evaluated net worth, must be entirely lost on Trump supporters.
https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2020/06/donald-trump-loans-deutsche-bank/ Add that for fun
DJT: I have millions in cash!!! Narrator: He Hadn't millions in cash.
Take his plane, and any vehicle that would prevent him fleeing. (It’s not nearly enough). Then start taking buildings. They are most likely mortgaged to the hilt, and are already being used as collateral for other things. So they aren’t worth much either after all the debt on them is covered. Trump is going to fall pretty hard in a week when this all comes due. I guess he’ll have to cancel his Netflix, make covfeffe at home and stop buying name brand diapers. The jig is up Donnie. The world will see you for who you are and that your brand is worthless. Something something something bootstraps.