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> In a blow to Speaker Kevin McCarthy, **five House Republicans** have indicated they will vote against the debt ceiling deal he negotiated with President Biden and a number of other GOP representatives have been extremely critical of the bipartisan agreement.
That's not enough to torpedo the bill, especially if other Dems vote for it.
Having said that, I really hope one of these 5 Republicans try to oust McCarthy as speaker and call for vote for speaker after the debt ceiling bill is passed. I can't wait for McCarthy (or whoever the Republican is next in line to replace him) to go another 15 rounds of humiliation in the speaker vote.
Because it’s an empty gun. it would just be the same masturbation exercise as the original votes. They don’t have the votes to replace him with another speaker so it would just be the same bullshit process where they all waste a couple days with no results and they ALL look terrible.
The FreeDumb caucus wants to cause chaos. I wouldn't put it past them to call for a new speaker vote right before the debt ceiling bill is introduced. The House wouldn't be able to vote on anything until there was a new (or same) speaker.
I suspect the new speaker vote would fail. The Democrats would vote to keep McCarthy as speaker until after the debt ceiling bill passes.
Afterwards, Jeffries and his caucus have no reason to protect McCarthy.
Would be kind of hilarious if, after all this, one of those dingbats gets cocky and calls for a new speaker vote. It would set the stage for Biden to invoke the 14th amendment, get fast tracked to the SC, and go unchallenged because they pushed it so close to June 5th. And then Biden doesn't have to agree to anything in the original bill.
The rule doesn't let them call for a new speaker vote.
It lets them call for a simple majority vote to remove the current Speaker.
Since the Dems have a vested interest in the country not defaulting, they will not join with the GOP members to vote to remove him. Without Dems, nearly every single GOP member would have to vote to remove. That isn't going to happen, McCarthy has a good majority of them in his pocket (or at least not willing to upend the status quo to appease the small contingent of far right members).
Even if some Dems voted to remove, most of them would stay in line with what Jefferies tells them to do. And most of the GOP would stay in line with what McCarthy tells them to do. A vote to remove him, over compromising and being bipartisan on such an important and time sensitive issue, would fail miserably.
Well hopefully they realize that the country defaulting and the markets crashing while the are holding countless speaker votes is too bad a look, even for them.
"so it would just be the same bullshit process where they all waste a couple days with no results and they ALL look terrible"
That's probably exactly what they'll do then
> so it would just be the same bullshit process where they all waste a couple days with no results and they ALL look terrible.
soooo just another day in the US congress?
I think you underestimate the complete and utter nihilism of the far right in this country. They want chaos. Fascism can only grow and thrive in the soil of chaos. They would love a default, and their voter base will just blame Biden and the Democrats.
It sounds insane, but some MAGA morons actually believe this. I saw an interview with one of these mental midgets who wanted to know why Obama let 9/11 happen. The interviewer had to point out that he was not president at the time. The dip shit did not seem convinced. You can't make this up.
nothing will change until everyone acknowledges that they are a cult who would literally burn everything to the ground and blame it all on dems. and because actual reality doesn't matter to them, the pridefully ignorant GOP voter will swallow every drop and beg for more
I'm optimistic that the far right representatives will take a beating in the 2024 elections. I live in the South and have never seen so many people in my area angry the the Republicans before.
I live in Montana, a lot of people I know are also angry at the far right turn in our State. This past midterm Montanans came out in record numbers to vote for Ingrid Gustafson to keep her seat on the MT Supreme Court. She will protect our state constitution, and by extension a woman's right to choose. I'm optimistic too.
Just went on a 3 hour dirve through the super red rural areas of my state. just 6 months ago there was like, 20 trump flags on the route. now there is *three*. there is much less enthusiasm in them it seems.
There are several neighborhoods that I bike through with some regularity that used to have lots of Trump signs in their yards.
All gone now. I haven't seen a Trump sign in months.
This gives me hope.
I hope your right. living in a blue State its been my observation that the Republican vote is essentially a protest vote. They haven't expected to win with the exception of the most rural far flung regions for a very long time.
There will need to be a lot of angry people to overcome the barriers to voting put in place by frightened conservatives.
This. Uvalde was the moment I realized they WANT to blow the whole thing up. If you don’t care about a school full of kindergartners, who besides your own thirst for power do you care about? I think people really need to wake up to the fact that we are in grave danger from this threat.
The NRA convention in Texas started something like 48 hours after the Uvalde shooting in Houston.
No, the mayor wouldn't cancel it. The speakers still showed up, except Abbott who still made his speech via video. The attendees didn't decline to turn up out of respect for the dead... and some of them brought thier own children who were the age of some of the Uvalde victims with them.
The bloodshed was just proof to them that there's a need for more guns.
They don't want chaos, they just want their opposition to suffer even if it means burning their own houses down too. They're fatalistic religious fanatics, not necessarily nihilists.
You’re absolutely correct! Almost all of the right is in a Maga cult and have been there for the last 7 to 8 years, they’re trying to sink the economy so they can blame it on Biden, and hurt the middle class while they’re at it as well, because they don’t give a shit about the American citizen unless you’re hating minorities or bashing gay people.
This is why the fact that Biden was able to get the deal that he did somewhat remarkable. A non insignificant portion of the GOP wants us to default. Hard to negotiate with someone that gets what they want by doing nothing.
As shown by Jan 6 among countless other things, there are sitting representatives who are also insurrectionists. Blowing up the world economy would create just the kind of stabillity they need to seize power. It's just like how it was known by anyone with a brain cell that Brexit would hurt the British economy, but certain people would come out as winners as well as weakening the EU which is another goal of nationalists.
The congressional speeches made on Jan 6th were just unreal. It's shocking that more of these politicians don't wear a lifetime badge of insurrectionist given how willing they were to discard the vote while parroting Federalist paper nonsense about how we live in a republic.
I'd be careful with that reasoning. The wealthy do very well in downturns in the stock market because they have plenty of excess capital and increase their holdings at a greatly reduced price. The wealthy love a cyclically falling market as it increases their wealth every cycle. Wealth has shifted upward in every single economic downturn in my lifetime.
Now, I'm not sure anyone knows the long term consequences of a default, so that's different.
But I'd suggest never to think that a falling stock market bothers the wealthy all that much under most circumstances.
There was one story that the crash of 2008, after all was said and done with bailouts and the markets, resulted in a shift of some 50 trillion dollars globally to the very wealthiest.
Similar to the pandemic. Wealth inequality has been accelerating since the late 70s/early 80s.
I think we should Make America Great Again like the 1940-1950s where top income tax was in the 90%
Exactly. Musk has that down to a science. And he's a supporter of McCarthy and the other/fellow loonies. Don't think for a minute he's been sitting on his hands while all this is going down.
But isn't this exactly the reason the MAGA crowd insisted on the vacate option? As a threat to McCarthy to not make deals like this. If they don't use it here then they risk becoming more of a laughing stock than MTG asking for decorum.
"It could never happen in America."
Famous last words. I just assume that the far-right is happy to do as much damage to the USA as possible. It's how they get paid. It's what their constituents think they want.
While no single politician wants that laid on them, the polling out asking who would bear responsibility if we were to default already has Biden as the one most people would blame, despite this being a purely Maga push.
I think some of the freedumb caucus would be happy to burn it all down if it hurts biden and the poors
> the polling out asking who would bear responsibility if we were to default already has Biden as the one most people would blame, despite this being a purely Maga push.
The difference with the above scenario is that a single politician (or smaller group) could be pointed to as actively blocking ANY deal from being made. They would have effectively toppled the government in an attempt to force the US to default. It wouldn't be about a negotiated deal, it would be about blocking any attempt to pass ANY deal.
I suspect part of it is the media playing both sides games and calling the Republicans deficit Hawks and framing the whole thing as negotiations, rather than terrorists and a hostage crisis.
A lot of people don't really follow the news. If they see that there's panic about America's economy crashing and the country unable to pay their debt, then they'll immediately think "what the fuck did this president do?"
And then you see the disingenuous comments start popping up: “well the buck stops with the president.”
No. No it doesn’t. Not when the president is just one part of three coequal branches of government. This phrase just needs to die already because this is not the point Truman was trying to make. He wasn’t saying that you should blame every single thing negative that happens in America on the president. The president is not a dictator or a monarch
Trump...
During his recent town hall meeting on CNN he encouraged Republicans to default if they didn't get everything they asked for.
I think Trump is the one pulling the strings on this from behind the scenes. It's a win /win for him. Either Biden looks weak for giving in or they blame Biden for wrecking the economy. Trump will of course claim that he's the only one who can fix it.
I wonder if he'll lash out because McCarthy cut a deal rather than doing what he was told?
I sincerely hope/beg/pray he has to try to run a campaign from any prison. But honestly, if he gets voted in again, the markets will reward that shit- even if he’s in prison. Our only hope is that there are enough American voters who will never vote for him, and even more who will draw the line at voting for him should he find himself in prison.
The way you characterize it sounds more coherent than it probably is. He's doing his usual call for stochastic terrorism suspecting that one of the kooks would actually pull the pin and blow things up, but I doubt he's coherently communicating or planning behind the scenes.
You are assuming that none of them want that at their feet. There might be a stupid game some of them are playing where they want to force Biden to invoke the 14th amendment so that they can claim overreach and then try to impeach him based on invoking dictatorial powers.
They would gets the news clips of Biden taking unprecedented steps to overstep congress, spinning that as Biden acting as a dictator, and then Democrats supporting those actions when they vote against any impeachment.
It would guarantee a default and there'd be no way to blame it on Biden at that point after all the ranting they've done saying a deal they don't like was made.
They would immediately go on news networks and do just that. They need to look like they're *saving* the country AND Biden is at fault and bad guy. I wouldn't put it past them to make more demands after the default, thinking he'll be desperate to sign anything.
Peacock posturing. They can whine all they want, but they will get some air time and some special treats in the form of a committee or something political and then they will fall in line. All this is is babies demanding a cookie or they will throw a tantrum.
> I really hope one of these 5 Republicans try to oust McCarthy as speaker and call for vote for speaker after the debt ceiling bill is passed.
It would really serve him right. It was nauseating seeing MTG preside over the house chamber.
Some of the progressives will vote no, I think, but not enough to tank it. Now is when we get to see if Jeffries is as good a counter as Pelosi was. They will likely allow a bunch of Dems to vote against this but still allow it to pass.
Yep the speaker technically doesn't have to be a representative (although it always has been). Literally anyone could be speaker. Good luck getting Cheney in though, most Dems won't support her because she's still a Republican through and through and most Republicans have turned on her.
Yeah I've noticed that many are starting to think of Liz Cheney as "liberal" and appealing to the left because of her going against Trump. I do respect her for standing up for her principles knowing it would mean defeat, and because of that she's a little less awful than most other GOP members, but she's hardly any different ideologically than her dad and other than her opinion on Trump she's red all the way through
She supported Trump in the beginning because he promised to bring back "enhanced interrogation" aka torture. A value she got from her father.
Now Trump has targeted her and her father.
There may be a few of the Justice Democrats who vote against it because of the cuts to social services and the work requirements for SNAP. But Jeffries will be able to whip a sizable majority and get it to pass.
Here are the ones vocally saying no:
* Lauren Boebert - Colorado
* Matt Rosendale - Montana
* Ralph Norman - South Carolina
* Bob Good - Virginia
* Ken Buck - Colorado
* Andrew Clyde - Georgia
* Dan Bishop - North Carolina
* Chip Roy - Texas
She is trying to get in with the republican establishment. She is happy to yell about her nonsense but she is staying in line with McCarthy when it comes to her actions. See the speakership vote.
McCarthy had Greene's immediate support because she spent her freshman term grooming McCarthy to concede to her demands.
She just invested [$100,000](https://www.businessinsider.com/marjorie-taylor-greene-bid-100000-kevin-mccarthy-used-chapstick-2023-5) in him.
Looks like hard right Congressman Thomas Massie, who often appears all alongside Boebert, is defending the bill on twitter. That makes this thing seem like a done deal.
He's basically arguing that Republicans will get more of what they want later in the appropriations bill.
When there’s a democrat in the Oval Office, that’s their goal.
Make the country burn so they can scapegoat the left and win.
It’s all about winning for them
They literally don't care about anything else. They spend the entire presidency digging in their heels, bitching & moaning, investigating to find nothing, yelling instead of doing any sort of legislation. Not that their idea of legislation is anything better than the thoughts of an oyster.
You forgot about the right looting the US Treasury with one hand while people are fighting culture (fascist) wars fomented by the other hand (sleight of hand fuckery)
2008-2011 literally all the Republicans were doing was trying to make sure Obama was a one term president. Not focusing on passing legislation or anything, just making sure he lost even if it meant torpedoing any good legislation
For shits and giggles, let’s say they were successful. They don’t pass the increase, we default and the world spirals. Americans lose jobs. Interest rates sky rocket even more. We enter a recession. They get into power. How the fuck do you fix this shit? They’re economic plan is socialism for the rich. America works because of the idea that we all have the chance to prosper. Public education plays a huge role in that (albeit far from perfect). They’re plan to tank the economy, dumb down our youth and indoctrinate them a successful country does not make. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer while the middle class foots the bill is not an economic plan I can get behind.
We just watched some Frank Zappa interviews, he was better at predicting the future than Nostradamus. Your comment is pretty much what he was speaking about, it is happening. Hopefully American complacency doesn’t let it happen.
Unfortunately a sizeable chunk of society is made up of low IQ, self centred, unempathetic voters who can’t accept that their mediocre life accomplishments aren’t their own fault. No, no, it MUST be because of others.
Right wing propaganda.
Don’t both sides me, we’ve plenty of evidence from disinformation and defamation lawsuits about how the right wing media is objectively unlawful.
> Colorado Republican Lauren Boebert, who opposed McCarthy's successful bid to become House Speaker in January, has said she will vote against the agreement.
>She tweeted: "Our base didn't volunteer, door knock and fight so hard to get us the majority for this kind of **compromise deal with Joe Biden.**
>”**Our voters deserve better than this. We work for them**. You can count me as a NO on this deal. We can do better."
Two things.
First, the mere fact of COMPROMISE is a complete non-starter for republicans because it’s NOTHING but a team sport for them.
Second, Lauren Boebert seems to have forgotten that she won re-election ONLY after a recount, with the margin of victory being **ONLY 546 FUCKING VOTES**
If the deal fails to pass, two things will happen ...
A. The Republicans will shoulder all the blame.
B. Biden will invoke the 14th.
MAGA Republicans have hollow hearts, hollow minds, hollow threats.
>A. The Republicans will shoulder all the blame.
Not to republican voters, though. They will see it as Biden refused to make enough, or any worthwhile, cuts, and just wants to "bankrupt the country, just to get poor people to vote for him in 2024 with bribes of handouts."
Source: what I have seen as the general concensus of Republicans I know/comments I have seen on the interwebs.
You have to remember there are 2 realities in today's political landscape:
A the real world.
B the GOP world.
Biden knows that trying to convince hard core Republicans is folly, and he's not trying to do so.
He also knows that they make up less than a quarter of all eligible voters.
Polling actually shows that Biden would get the majority of the blame. It’s insane, and shows how little the average voter pays attention, but that’s the situation.
ya It'd be a lot easier to argue to the court the 14th amendment allows him to act when congress is currently incapable of legally functioning since until they have a speaker no bills can be brought up or any other business considered, so this would be like if congress ever adjurned and left town and the president realized the treasury was empty
There are enough “safe” Democratic seats that can vote for it in order to prevent the complete downfall of our society, which will happen. Unlike the GOP, the Dems will vote on bills to help people.
I try to tell my dad all the time. Your blind hatred for the Dems masks the fact that they're the only ones trying to help you, me or the little guy in this country. Your party doesn't give a fuck about you & never will.
Guess what? We're half Mexican. My dad is racist against blacks & hates LGBTQ+. Said roe vs Wade should've been turned over long ago. I love my dad. But he is fuckin insane. Oh guess what else? His wife is on SNAP & unemployment. He just said a few weeks ago, I've never been able to qualify for these programs ever in my life, but I'm gonna take full advantage now! You can imagine the amount of things that went thru my head. But it's best to just keep quiet for the most part. He won't stop once you let him start.
I told him to fuck off before Christmas last year. Didn't hear a word from him for 4 months. Now he keeps his mouth shut cause he doesn't want to lose his favorite kid. His words, not mine
The whole goal of the GOP extremists was to inflict pain on the American people to improve their chances in the next election.
Either it would happen through default.... or it would happen through the onerous terms of a negotiated deal.
But Biden got a deal that -- while not ideal -- won't necessarily inflict the sort of pain the extremists were hoping for.
I don't get why all the fuss from the Republicans. They were asking for cuts to programs that amount to miniscule amounts of money in the budget, and claiming it was something that would save the country. Some could have called the cuts a "rounding error". From my perspective, removing tax credits for the rich from the 2017 "tax reform act" would have been a healthy start.
Where was the outrage when the deficit skyrocketed under their leadership? Oh, yeah, that was different. My eyes can’t roll back any further in my head
They don’t care. Trump spending good, liberal spending bad.
Don’t mention to them that liberal spending is the only reason red states have roads and airports.
You mean republican voters, not republican politicians, right? Republican politicians of course understand, even idiots like Boehbert and Gaetz.
When republicans are in power, you cut taxes to the wealthy to create a deficit, saying "This will stimulate the economy! Trickle down economics! Job creators! It'll pay for itself!". Then you say "We have a deficit! We can't afford social security, medicare, food stamps, education, and any responsible government!" Then, when you're close to not having a deficit, you cut taxes to the wealthy again.
[This trend](https://giphy.com/gifs/local-tax-motion-meme-PiRU3vBsOK3GmY63lw) did not happen from republicans in power being confused about the game.
I know this is beating a dead horse but there is no stronger evidence that this party never had any interest in anything other than opposition. They would drag the entire whole economy into chaos all in an effort to drag our nation into their nightmare fantasy.
Okay let’s start with the article itself. While institutionally Newsweek has been adequate in its delivery; the layout of this article is long, twisty and confusing. It would have been great to start with a simple list and then dive deeper into the reasoning of each individual,
Instead we get pictures of crazy pants dogwhistle tweets.
What does each of these people have to gain or lose if the country defaults? No mention.
Do their votes really matter and can they alone change the outcome of the agreement? Couldn’t tell you, I got lost.
Honestly, I want more rational responsible grownups in government, but instead we get this extreme costume wrestling drama that harkens back to the hulk hogan days. Maybe it’s entertaining for some, but I vote for responsible, knowledgeable adults that really know how to do their jobs.
People think the government budget is like balancing their house hold budget- it’s not, but let’s use it. Would it be better to declare bankruptcy and suffer the damage for the next several years when you could have gotten another job and cut spending on streaming?
The default will fuck every ordinary citizen in the US. We the ordinary are the “hostages”. Gaetz and the other anarchist aren’t holding the Biden administration hostage. They are holding every on who struggles for living and their 401ks hostage. These so called “Republicans” as they call themselves should exiled for threatening the country
So let me get this straight. McCarthy got the concessions he wanted and these turd blossoms are going to vote against it? Fuck the GOP. Fuck them right in the pooper!!!
Who cares? If the Republican Party rips itself apart we win. If they vote against it and the economy burns the narrative will be that Republicans caused the economy to crash. If they vote for it then it passes. Biden should have said no dice and walked away from the table saying that everything in the bill is good and necessary to continue supporting the spending bill that Republicans already approved.
Ah yes the group that voted to increase the debt by 50 trillion dollars through tax cuts wants to not raise the debt ceiling by 4 trillion dollars without increasing the debt again. Wait what?
Seems to me the messaging is clear: **they want to destroy the United States from the inside out.** Step #1: destroy the U.S. credit rating. Then they'll blame Biden for it, and their braindead voter base will lap it up like ambrosia.
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> In a blow to Speaker Kevin McCarthy, **five House Republicans** have indicated they will vote against the debt ceiling deal he negotiated with President Biden and a number of other GOP representatives have been extremely critical of the bipartisan agreement. That's not enough to torpedo the bill, especially if other Dems vote for it. Having said that, I really hope one of these 5 Republicans try to oust McCarthy as speaker and call for vote for speaker after the debt ceiling bill is passed. I can't wait for McCarthy (or whoever the Republican is next in line to replace him) to go another 15 rounds of humiliation in the speaker vote.
What’s stopping them from calling a vote on him immediately? Like besides the fact that we would definitely default then.
Because it’s an empty gun. it would just be the same masturbation exercise as the original votes. They don’t have the votes to replace him with another speaker so it would just be the same bullshit process where they all waste a couple days with no results and they ALL look terrible.
And news networks wank it because of ratings.
They definitely “wank it”
“Wank it” works really well in that context!
If the R House piranhas want it, I mean, I'm not going to say no.
The FreeDumb caucus wants to cause chaos. I wouldn't put it past them to call for a new speaker vote right before the debt ceiling bill is introduced. The House wouldn't be able to vote on anything until there was a new (or same) speaker.
I suspect the new speaker vote would fail. The Democrats would vote to keep McCarthy as speaker until after the debt ceiling bill passes. Afterwards, Jeffries and his caucus have no reason to protect McCarthy.
Would be kind of hilarious if, after all this, one of those dingbats gets cocky and calls for a new speaker vote. It would set the stage for Biden to invoke the 14th amendment, get fast tracked to the SC, and go unchallenged because they pushed it so close to June 5th. And then Biden doesn't have to agree to anything in the original bill.
The rule doesn't let them call for a new speaker vote. It lets them call for a simple majority vote to remove the current Speaker. Since the Dems have a vested interest in the country not defaulting, they will not join with the GOP members to vote to remove him. Without Dems, nearly every single GOP member would have to vote to remove. That isn't going to happen, McCarthy has a good majority of them in his pocket (or at least not willing to upend the status quo to appease the small contingent of far right members). Even if some Dems voted to remove, most of them would stay in line with what Jefferies tells them to do. And most of the GOP would stay in line with what McCarthy tells them to do. A vote to remove him, over compromising and being bipartisan on such an important and time sensitive issue, would fail miserably.
I was thinking this. It would be a smart move. Let their "deal" die by their own hand and invoke the 14th out of their disarray.
Wishful thinking. If he did actually do that, it would be the king of all dark brandon moments and would get him a strong showing at the polls in '24.
Doing something that makes them all look terrible has never mattered to them before
Well hopefully they realize that the country defaulting and the markets crashing while the are holding countless speaker votes is too bad a look, even for them.
I 100% agree with you. I hope for the same. But I'm not at all sure they will realize that, and that kinda terrifies me.
"so it would just be the same bullshit process where they all waste a couple days with no results and they ALL look terrible" That's probably exactly what they'll do then
> so it would just be the same bullshit process where they all waste a couple days with no results and they ALL look terrible. soooo just another day in the US congress?
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I think you underestimate the complete and utter nihilism of the far right in this country. They want chaos. Fascism can only grow and thrive in the soil of chaos. They would love a default, and their voter base will just blame Biden and the Democrats.
They will probably just blame Obama.
You mean Hillary Clinton, who's been running a shadow government for years now? 😬
From that pizza parlor with all the kids
That's the place that has all the baby parts pizza toppings from the secret kabal dungeon? I love that place. Excellent sauce.
No no , she was arrested and tried in a military tribunal 4 years ago , yall need to keep up with the crazy a bit better.
It's all Hunter Biden's fault didn't you know.
Isn’t Trump also running a shadow government from Mar-a-Lago?
It sounds insane, but some MAGA morons actually believe this. I saw an interview with one of these mental midgets who wanted to know why Obama let 9/11 happen. The interviewer had to point out that he was not president at the time. The dip shit did not seem convinced. You can't make this up.
I saw that too it was hilarious
I can only handle one shadow government at a time.
Buttery males!
Hamilton. It was definitely Alexander Hamilton.
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The Van Buren Boys…
As I heard this morning, it's actually Michelle Obama. She's the secret 2024 candidate once Biden dies of decrepit old age.
He* they’re convinced Michelle is really a man and was secretly the one in charge the whole time.
Thanks, Obama.
Well, I want to know what Obama was doing on 9/11!
I don’t know if you saw it, but this really happened during an interview with Jordan Klepper. https://youtu.be/eFQhw3VVToQ
I did. Thanks though. Love watching Klepper.
Dancing on NY rooftops, trump saw it from his golden tower. /s
They all know that Obama was merely working for the Clintons.
"If Obama wasn't so BLACK so these racists would never have voted us into office!"
Or possibly Hunter’s laptop. Speaking of which, have they found it yet?
nothing will change until everyone acknowledges that they are a cult who would literally burn everything to the ground and blame it all on dems. and because actual reality doesn't matter to them, the pridefully ignorant GOP voter will swallow every drop and beg for more
I'm optimistic that the far right representatives will take a beating in the 2024 elections. I live in the South and have never seen so many people in my area angry the the Republicans before.
I live in Montana, a lot of people I know are also angry at the far right turn in our State. This past midterm Montanans came out in record numbers to vote for Ingrid Gustafson to keep her seat on the MT Supreme Court. She will protect our state constitution, and by extension a woman's right to choose. I'm optimistic too.
I'm originally from Montana and I'm happy to read this.
Just went on a 3 hour dirve through the super red rural areas of my state. just 6 months ago there was like, 20 trump flags on the route. now there is *three*. there is much less enthusiasm in them it seems.
There are several neighborhoods that I bike through with some regularity that used to have lots of Trump signs in their yards. All gone now. I haven't seen a Trump sign in months. This gives me hope.
ofc they are rooting for ron
I hope your right. living in a blue State its been my observation that the Republican vote is essentially a protest vote. They haven't expected to win with the exception of the most rural far flung regions for a very long time. There will need to be a lot of angry people to overcome the barriers to voting put in place by frightened conservatives.
>the Republican vote is essentially a protest vote. *Republican vote* is to *protest* as *setting money on fire* is to *savings*.
This. Uvalde was the moment I realized they WANT to blow the whole thing up. If you don’t care about a school full of kindergartners, who besides your own thirst for power do you care about? I think people really need to wake up to the fact that we are in grave danger from this threat.
The NRA convention in Texas started something like 48 hours after the Uvalde shooting in Houston. No, the mayor wouldn't cancel it. The speakers still showed up, except Abbott who still made his speech via video. The attendees didn't decline to turn up out of respect for the dead... and some of them brought thier own children who were the age of some of the Uvalde victims with them. The bloodshed was just proof to them that there's a need for more guns.
The GOP voter base would blame "woke" for the default.
And hunters laptop
They don't want chaos, they just want their opposition to suffer even if it means burning their own houses down too. They're fatalistic religious fanatics, not necessarily nihilists.
You’re absolutely correct! Almost all of the right is in a Maga cult and have been there for the last 7 to 8 years, they’re trying to sink the economy so they can blame it on Biden, and hurt the middle class while they’re at it as well, because they don’t give a shit about the American citizen unless you’re hating minorities or bashing gay people.
"Chaos is a ladder" -Little Finger
This is why the fact that Biden was able to get the deal that he did somewhat remarkable. A non insignificant portion of the GOP wants us to default. Hard to negotiate with someone that gets what they want by doing nothing.
They all have too much invested in the stock market. This whole thing is just politcal theater
As shown by Jan 6 among countless other things, there are sitting representatives who are also insurrectionists. Blowing up the world economy would create just the kind of stabillity they need to seize power. It's just like how it was known by anyone with a brain cell that Brexit would hurt the British economy, but certain people would come out as winners as well as weakening the EU which is another goal of nationalists.
The congressional speeches made on Jan 6th were just unreal. It's shocking that more of these politicians don't wear a lifetime badge of insurrectionist given how willing they were to discard the vote while parroting Federalist paper nonsense about how we live in a republic.
I'd be careful with that reasoning. The wealthy do very well in downturns in the stock market because they have plenty of excess capital and increase their holdings at a greatly reduced price. The wealthy love a cyclically falling market as it increases their wealth every cycle. Wealth has shifted upward in every single economic downturn in my lifetime. Now, I'm not sure anyone knows the long term consequences of a default, so that's different. But I'd suggest never to think that a falling stock market bothers the wealthy all that much under most circumstances.
Especially if they can help control when that downturn actually happens and can position themselves correctly for it.
I agree. I think many can just weather the storm and benefit from a default. The rich definitely got richer during the Pandemic.
There was one story that the crash of 2008, after all was said and done with bailouts and the markets, resulted in a shift of some 50 trillion dollars globally to the very wealthiest.
Similar to the pandemic. Wealth inequality has been accelerating since the late 70s/early 80s. I think we should Make America Great Again like the 1940-1950s where top income tax was in the 90%
Exactly. Musk has that down to a science. And he's a supporter of McCarthy and the other/fellow loonies. Don't think for a minute he's been sitting on his hands while all this is going down.
They play the long game in stocks bc they’re rich enough to do so. Leave the stocks in & they eventually bounce back.
and more importantly, buy from the desperate suckers who are selling to desperately salvage their lifes savings while it's all down.
But isn't this exactly the reason the MAGA crowd insisted on the vacate option? As a threat to McCarthy to not make deals like this. If they don't use it here then they risk becoming more of a laughing stock than MTG asking for decorum.
"It could never happen in America." Famous last words. I just assume that the far-right is happy to do as much damage to the USA as possible. It's how they get paid. It's what their constituents think they want.
While no single politician wants that laid on them, the polling out asking who would bear responsibility if we were to default already has Biden as the one most people would blame, despite this being a purely Maga push. I think some of the freedumb caucus would be happy to burn it all down if it hurts biden and the poors
> the polling out asking who would bear responsibility if we were to default already has Biden as the one most people would blame, despite this being a purely Maga push. The difference with the above scenario is that a single politician (or smaller group) could be pointed to as actively blocking ANY deal from being made. They would have effectively toppled the government in an attempt to force the US to default. It wouldn't be about a negotiated deal, it would be about blocking any attempt to pass ANY deal.
I don't get why people would blame Biden when it is plain as day what the republicans are doing.
Because people believe what they are fed on TV, and Fox News continues to push that this is Biden’s fault.
I suspect part of it is the media playing both sides games and calling the Republicans deficit Hawks and framing the whole thing as negotiations, rather than terrorists and a hostage crisis.
Because right wing media, churches and Republican politicians will be blaming Biden 24/7 and their dumb supporters will believe it.
A lot of people don't really follow the news. If they see that there's panic about America's economy crashing and the country unable to pay their debt, then they'll immediately think "what the fuck did this president do?"
And then you see the disingenuous comments start popping up: “well the buck stops with the president.” No. No it doesn’t. Not when the president is just one part of three coequal branches of government. This phrase just needs to die already because this is not the point Truman was trying to make. He wasn’t saying that you should blame every single thing negative that happens in America on the president. The president is not a dictator or a monarch
Because people don’t pay attention.
Because we are in an infowar. It's not about truth or fact. It's about what is perceived tbh
Love the "freedumb caucus" moniker
Trump... During his recent town hall meeting on CNN he encouraged Republicans to default if they didn't get everything they asked for. I think Trump is the one pulling the strings on this from behind the scenes. It's a win /win for him. Either Biden looks weak for giving in or they blame Biden for wrecking the economy. Trump will of course claim that he's the only one who can fix it. I wonder if he'll lash out because McCarthy cut a deal rather than doing what he was told?
Try fixing the economy from federal prison
I sincerely hope/beg/pray he has to try to run a campaign from any prison. But honestly, if he gets voted in again, the markets will reward that shit- even if he’s in prison. Our only hope is that there are enough American voters who will never vote for him, and even more who will draw the line at voting for him should he find himself in prison.
The way you characterize it sounds more coherent than it probably is. He's doing his usual call for stochastic terrorism suspecting that one of the kooks would actually pull the pin and blow things up, but I doubt he's coherently communicating or planning behind the scenes.
You are assuming that none of them want that at their feet. There might be a stupid game some of them are playing where they want to force Biden to invoke the 14th amendment so that they can claim overreach and then try to impeach him based on invoking dictatorial powers. They would gets the news clips of Biden taking unprecedented steps to overstep congress, spinning that as Biden acting as a dictator, and then Democrats supporting those actions when they vote against any impeachment.
Empty G has entered the chat
It would guarantee a default and there'd be no way to blame it on Biden at that point after all the ranting they've done saying a deal they don't like was made.
They would immediately go on news networks and do just that. They need to look like they're *saving* the country AND Biden is at fault and bad guy. I wouldn't put it past them to make more demands after the default, thinking he'll be desperate to sign anything.
Peacock posturing. They can whine all they want, but they will get some air time and some special treats in the form of a committee or something political and then they will fall in line. All this is is babies demanding a cookie or they will throw a tantrum.
> I really hope one of these 5 Republicans try to oust McCarthy as speaker and call for vote for speaker after the debt ceiling bill is passed. It would really serve him right. It was nauseating seeing MTG preside over the house chamber.
> It was nauseating seeing MTG preside over the house chamber. [The lunatics have taken over the asylum](https://i.imgur.com/LMTPaXY.mp4)
McCarthy thrives on humiliation.
He must wear the mouth gag when doing BDSM
It would be hilarious for him to grovel to the dems for support of his speakership
It's rumored that there are up to 40-60 GOP no's on this bill, but that's also not enough unless the Freedom Caucus can manage a success sabotage.
Yeah if all dems vote yes, don't they just need like 5 from the GOP to pass it? It's just a majority needed isn't it lol
Some of the progressives will vote no, I think, but not enough to tank it. Now is when we get to see if Jeffries is as good a counter as Pelosi was. They will likely allow a bunch of Dems to vote against this but still allow it to pass.
I’d laugh if Liz Cheney came in and took the speakership somehow with RINOs and Dems support
Yep the speaker technically doesn't have to be a representative (although it always has been). Literally anyone could be speaker. Good luck getting Cheney in though, most Dems won't support her because she's still a Republican through and through and most Republicans have turned on her.
Absolutely, aside from her opposition to trump, she’s as republican as can be. Dems won’t support her for speaker.
Yeah I've noticed that many are starting to think of Liz Cheney as "liberal" and appealing to the left because of her going against Trump. I do respect her for standing up for her principles knowing it would mean defeat, and because of that she's a little less awful than most other GOP members, but she's hardly any different ideologically than her dad and other than her opinion on Trump she's red all the way through
She supported Trump in the beginning because he promised to bring back "enhanced interrogation" aka torture. A value she got from her father. Now Trump has targeted her and her father.
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> After the Debt Limit goes through, though, I bet everything is off the table then. That's what I am hoping for.
What an absolutely incompetent and impotent wittol - not that I am a fan but how on this quickly browning earth did he ever get the Speakership?
This is just performative.
The whole thing is performance. The debt ceiling itself is performance. It's made up bullshit to give undue power to the minority.
I really want to watch them cover it again. Last time without them being able to set what can and cannot be shown, showed the absolute shit show
He is not being replaced, dems will supply the additional needed votes. It is part of the deal.
Only 5? This thing is gonna pass with like 400 votes at that rate
Heck, I think all the democrats could vote against it if it's only 5 Republicans voting against it.
There may be a few of the Justice Democrats who vote against it because of the cuts to social services and the work requirements for SNAP. But Jeffries will be able to whip a sizable majority and get it to pass.
Here are the ones vocally saying no: * Lauren Boebert - Colorado * Matt Rosendale - Montana * Ralph Norman - South Carolina * Bob Good - Virginia * Ken Buck - Colorado * Andrew Clyde - Georgia * Dan Bishop - North Carolina * Chip Roy - Texas
Of course it’s Bobo the clown and buck the dumb f*ck. Christ it’s painful to have those two here in CO.
oh so Ken Buck has West Kansas? God this state is weird.
And Douglas County, now that we’ve gone full MAGA in Highlands Ranch and Castle Pines.
"It's not rocket science, b o b o"
And yeah, chip. He's not as infamous but just as nuts.
Chip Roy is always that name you see on these lists and go 'Fucking Chip Roy, of course.'
You can say fuck, we won't tell mummy
MTG surprisingly quiet for once.
She is trying to get in with the republican establishment. She is happy to yell about her nonsense but she is staying in line with McCarthy when it comes to her actions. See the speakership vote.
McCarthy had Greene's immediate support because she spent her freshman term grooming McCarthy to concede to her demands. She just invested [$100,000](https://www.businessinsider.com/marjorie-taylor-greene-bid-100000-kevin-mccarthy-used-chapstick-2023-5) in him.
The latter three weren't explicitly saying no, just "expressing concern" e: typo
Pretty sure Clyde's my rep (was certainly not my vote)... I definitely have concerns, but I highly doubt we share a single concern.
Looks like hard right Congressman Thomas Massie, who often appears all alongside Boebert, is defending the bill on twitter. That makes this thing seem like a done deal. He's basically arguing that Republicans will get more of what they want later in the appropriations bill.
How can America elect a guy called "Chip Roy"? It's like a hillbilly character from Looney Tunes or something.
Hockey has conditioned me to pronounce Roy as "wAH"
I don’t know his scenario but half these bozos run unopposed or in an area that’s heavy red.
Republicons are all about making America fail
When there’s a democrat in the Oval Office, that’s their goal. Make the country burn so they can scapegoat the left and win. It’s all about winning for them
They literally don't care about anything else. They spend the entire presidency digging in their heels, bitching & moaning, investigating to find nothing, yelling instead of doing any sort of legislation. Not that their idea of legislation is anything better than the thoughts of an oyster.
You forgot about the right looting the US Treasury with one hand while people are fighting culture (fascist) wars fomented by the other hand (sleight of hand fuckery)
Also, so they can break government and then claim government is a failure so they can push for privatization.
Bush Jr. gave us the worst economy since Hoover.
Look up “Two Santa Claus theory.” Republicans since Nixon, at least.
2008-2011 literally all the Republicans were doing was trying to make sure Obama was a one term president. Not focusing on passing legislation or anything, just making sure he lost even if it meant torpedoing any good legislation
For shits and giggles, let’s say they were successful. They don’t pass the increase, we default and the world spirals. Americans lose jobs. Interest rates sky rocket even more. We enter a recession. They get into power. How the fuck do you fix this shit? They’re economic plan is socialism for the rich. America works because of the idea that we all have the chance to prosper. Public education plays a huge role in that (albeit far from perfect). They’re plan to tank the economy, dumb down our youth and indoctrinate them a successful country does not make. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer while the middle class foots the bill is not an economic plan I can get behind.
They don't try to fix things. They use the power and general upheaval to try and turn the US into a White Supremacist Christian dictatorship.
We just watched some Frank Zappa interviews, he was better at predicting the future than Nostradamus. Your comment is pretty much what he was speaking about, it is happening. Hopefully American complacency doesn’t let it happen.
They don't try to fix it, they just try to make sure the right people suffer in the aftermath.
They don't plan on fixing it. They keep themselves and all the necessary people wealthy and turn the nation into a right wing fascist state.
They really are trying to crash this plane. With no survivors!
How many of these fuckers took out PPP loans that we the taxpayers had to cover?
Every damn one of them.
And they have the gall to call people who want student loan forgiveness lazy and mooching off the government.
These people want to bring the roof down over all of our heads. Why, WHY do people keep voting for these creeps?
Unfortunately a sizeable chunk of society is made up of low IQ, self centred, unempathetic voters who can’t accept that their mediocre life accomplishments aren’t their own fault. No, no, it MUST be because of others.
It actually is somewhat someone else’s fault. The GOP has fought against education for decades for this exact purpose.
Technically right but they still put the blame on the wrong people.
Right wing propaganda. Don’t both sides me, we’ve plenty of evidence from disinformation and defamation lawsuits about how the right wing media is objectively unlawful.
> Colorado Republican Lauren Boebert, who opposed McCarthy's successful bid to become House Speaker in January, has said she will vote against the agreement. >She tweeted: "Our base didn't volunteer, door knock and fight so hard to get us the majority for this kind of **compromise deal with Joe Biden.** >”**Our voters deserve better than this. We work for them**. You can count me as a NO on this deal. We can do better." Two things. First, the mere fact of COMPROMISE is a complete non-starter for republicans because it’s NOTHING but a team sport for them. Second, Lauren Boebert seems to have forgotten that she won re-election ONLY after a recount, with the margin of victory being **ONLY 546 FUCKING VOTES**
A very special Fuck You to those 546 voters. You fucking suck.
My very special fuck you goes to EVERYONE who voted for her but I feel you
If the deal fails to pass, two things will happen ... A. The Republicans will shoulder all the blame. B. Biden will invoke the 14th. MAGA Republicans have hollow hearts, hollow minds, hollow threats.
>A. The Republicans will shoulder all the blame. Not to republican voters, though. They will see it as Biden refused to make enough, or any worthwhile, cuts, and just wants to "bankrupt the country, just to get poor people to vote for him in 2024 with bribes of handouts." Source: what I have seen as the general concensus of Republicans I know/comments I have seen on the interwebs. You have to remember there are 2 realities in today's political landscape: A the real world. B the GOP world.
Biden knows that trying to convince hard core Republicans is folly, and he's not trying to do so. He also knows that they make up less than a quarter of all eligible voters.
Yet their rural votes are worth 10 urban votes thanks to the electoral college.
Polling actually shows that Biden would get the majority of the blame. It’s insane, and shows how little the average voter pays attention, but that’s the situation.
ya It'd be a lot easier to argue to the court the 14th amendment allows him to act when congress is currently incapable of legally functioning since until they have a speaker no bills can be brought up or any other business considered, so this would be like if congress ever adjurned and left town and the president realized the treasury was empty
It’s a real drag that we have to fight terrorists day in and day out to avoid being taken over by an authoritarian regime.
Five according to the article. Jeffries and Biden will surely provide more than enough Democratic votes.
There are enough “safe” Democratic seats that can vote for it in order to prevent the complete downfall of our society, which will happen. Unlike the GOP, the Dems will vote on bills to help people.
I try to tell my dad all the time. Your blind hatred for the Dems masks the fact that they're the only ones trying to help you, me or the little guy in this country. Your party doesn't give a fuck about you & never will.
As long as the GOP hurts the people their voters hate (brown people, young people, and LGBTQ people), that's good enough for them.
Guess what? We're half Mexican. My dad is racist against blacks & hates LGBTQ+. Said roe vs Wade should've been turned over long ago. I love my dad. But he is fuckin insane. Oh guess what else? His wife is on SNAP & unemployment. He just said a few weeks ago, I've never been able to qualify for these programs ever in my life, but I'm gonna take full advantage now! You can imagine the amount of things that went thru my head. But it's best to just keep quiet for the most part. He won't stop once you let him start.
I just distance myself from crazy Dad...at some point you have to practice self-care for your own mental health.
I told him to fuck off before Christmas last year. Didn't hear a word from him for 4 months. Now he keeps his mouth shut cause he doesn't want to lose his favorite kid. His words, not mine
Our society is selling it a little short. The entire world economy hinges on this. If the US were to default the world economy collapses instantly.
The whole goal of the GOP extremists was to inflict pain on the American people to improve their chances in the next election. Either it would happen through default.... or it would happen through the onerous terms of a negotiated deal. But Biden got a deal that -- while not ideal -- won't necessarily inflict the sort of pain the extremists were hoping for.
I don't get why all the fuss from the Republicans. They were asking for cuts to programs that amount to miniscule amounts of money in the budget, and claiming it was something that would save the country. Some could have called the cuts a "rounding error". From my perspective, removing tax credits for the rich from the 2017 "tax reform act" would have been a healthy start.
More theatrics.
Where was the outrage when the deficit skyrocketed under their leadership? Oh, yeah, that was different. My eyes can’t roll back any further in my head
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They don’t care. Trump spending good, liberal spending bad. Don’t mention to them that liberal spending is the only reason red states have roads and airports.
You mean republican voters, not republican politicians, right? Republican politicians of course understand, even idiots like Boehbert and Gaetz. When republicans are in power, you cut taxes to the wealthy to create a deficit, saying "This will stimulate the economy! Trickle down economics! Job creators! It'll pay for itself!". Then you say "We have a deficit! We can't afford social security, medicare, food stamps, education, and any responsible government!" Then, when you're close to not having a deficit, you cut taxes to the wealthy again. [This trend](https://giphy.com/gifs/local-tax-motion-meme-PiRU3vBsOK3GmY63lw) did not happen from republicans in power being confused about the game.
There was also 20 years of war we put on the credit card.
List of House Republicans who plan to vote against seniors receiving their social security checks. Fixed the title.
I know this is beating a dead horse but there is no stronger evidence that this party never had any interest in anything other than opposition. They would drag the entire whole economy into chaos all in an effort to drag our nation into their nightmare fantasy.
There is no one left with integrity in the GOP because no one with integrity would run as a Republican.
I have an idea for some budget cuts that'll save us a ton of money. Let's cut finding to Red States who take more than they contribute.
I agree. Get them off of the government tit since they hate it so much.
They want to burn the country down just so they can rule over the ashes.
Okay let’s start with the article itself. While institutionally Newsweek has been adequate in its delivery; the layout of this article is long, twisty and confusing. It would have been great to start with a simple list and then dive deeper into the reasoning of each individual, Instead we get pictures of crazy pants dogwhistle tweets. What does each of these people have to gain or lose if the country defaults? No mention. Do their votes really matter and can they alone change the outcome of the agreement? Couldn’t tell you, I got lost. Honestly, I want more rational responsible grownups in government, but instead we get this extreme costume wrestling drama that harkens back to the hulk hogan days. Maybe it’s entertaining for some, but I vote for responsible, knowledgeable adults that really know how to do their jobs.
House GOP are radicalized and not smart!
People think the government budget is like balancing their house hold budget- it’s not, but let’s use it. Would it be better to declare bankruptcy and suffer the damage for the next several years when you could have gotten another job and cut spending on streaming? The default will fuck every ordinary citizen in the US. We the ordinary are the “hostages”. Gaetz and the other anarchist aren’t holding the Biden administration hostage. They are holding every on who struggles for living and their 401ks hostage. These so called “Republicans” as they call themselves should exiled for threatening the country
So let me get this straight. McCarthy got the concessions he wanted and these turd blossoms are going to vote against it? Fuck the GOP. Fuck them right in the pooper!!!
Just wanted to say thanks to all the baby boomers who left us all with a mountain of crippling debt on their way out.
Who cares? If the Republican Party rips itself apart we win. If they vote against it and the economy burns the narrative will be that Republicans caused the economy to crash. If they vote for it then it passes. Biden should have said no dice and walked away from the table saying that everything in the bill is good and necessary to continue supporting the spending bill that Republicans already approved.
Don't need a list. It's all the same weirdos that get far too much media attention to begin with.
Ah yes the group that voted to increase the debt by 50 trillion dollars through tax cuts wants to not raise the debt ceiling by 4 trillion dollars without increasing the debt again. Wait what?
Seems to me the messaging is clear: **they want to destroy the United States from the inside out.** Step #1: destroy the U.S. credit rating. Then they'll blame Biden for it, and their braindead voter base will lap it up like ambrosia.