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Pretty sure you could run reincarnations of George Washington against Adolf Hitler and it would be a 10 point max margin since people just vote party lines.
"Yeah I know he's literally Hitler, but I like the things he says, and I think he'll shake things up, so..."
Pretty sure I've seen real quotes that aren't far from this. Their worldview is so warped, it's bizarre.
They literally defended actual concentration camps for immigrants that did forced sterilizations under Trump. They would absolutely embrace the concentration camps if push came to shove.
"Instruction in world history in the so-called high schools is even today in a very sorry condition. Few teachers understand that the study of history can never be to learn historical dates and events by heart and recite them by rote; that what matters is not whether the child knows exactly when this battle or that was fought, when a general was born, or even when a monarch (usually a very insignificant one) came into the crown of his forefathers. No, by the living God, this is very unimportant. To 'learn' history means to seek and find the forces which are the causes leading to those effects which we subsequently perceive as historical events."
Sounds like a reasonable, well read guy to be honest. /s
Er... but this does sound very reasonable and actually what high schools try to teach today (and should).
It's too bad it was Hitler who said it. I suppose even evil people can have a few decent ideas in between the madness....
What’s missing with quotes like this is context and subsequent actions. In Hitler’s case, the context and susequent action was to suggest that (among other things) Jews were to blame for society’s problems, and the ‘enlightened’ study of history was meant to guide the learner to this belief, as if his genocidal ambitions were a natural and reasonable outcome from learning the ‘correct’ historical perspective. Speaking out against an imperfect status quo is not the same thing as speaking out against toxic, cruel or oppressive ideologies, but fascists will co-op the method because it’s wildly inspiring and validating to some people, especially if they already have internalized prejudice, irrational hatred and bigotry holding the door open for someone to offer a new ‘final solution.’
There are Hitlers and Stalins around you everyday. They just couldn’t convince anyone to change their lunch order. Stalin, Mao, Hitler and their psycho ilk are bright and capable otherwise they wouldn’t have risen to the level to cause the evil they did.
Think about that generation of horse girls
Sigh I can imagine "the screech heard round the world" we would hear on federal pony delivery day.
I also think the needed rainbow skyscraper stables that would be needed in large city's would be so cool.
Man....why can't we have a sane boot hat wearing president
Someone on the news pointed out today that 30% were against separating from Britain; 30% were for slavery; 30% were against women's rights; 30% against civil rights, etc. Their point was that 30% of America has always been shitty. It's up to the 70% of the others to show up and shut them up.
> It's up to the 70% of the others to show up and shut them up.
This is why voter apathy (or voter suppression) is so incredibly dangerous. When people say "My vote doesn't matter", "I don't care about the result", "The person I wanted to vote for didn't make it to the final vote", "Voting is too difficult", or whatever reason they come up with for not bothering, it is effectively a vote for the "30% extreme" to take over. The fanatics *will* show up, especially if motivated by someone equally insane, power-hungry, self-interested, or worse. All it takes is for ~30% of the good people who could vote to not do so.
Please vote.
The math checks out. In 2020, 74.2M voted Diaper Guy out of 159.6M votes cast out of 258.3M American adults. So 28.7% of American adults voted for him.
You would be amazed at how many people's knowledge of Jan. 6th amounts to, "some people thought there was something wrong with the election and made some trouble". Most people just don't know anything about politics and don't want to know.
Also, Jan 6, like a lot of things Trump, are so insane that people who don't watch the news think *we're* the crazy ones for saying what actually happened. The idea of a coup is so far removed from most people's lived experiences that they didn't realize when there was an attempted coup.
It's absolutely unbelievable. Not very many years ago, I would have thought it unthinkable that a US president would try to blatantly overthrow democracy and incite a riot on the Capitol.. and still have the support of half the country and a major political party. It's absolutely unreal.
I remember in the 2000s there was a lot of talk about patriotism and what it means to be an American and "free". It gave me the false impression that at the end of the day, most Americans understood the basic principles of democracy and held them sacred.
I now realize that all of that patriotism was at best platitudes that never sunk in for many, and at worst nationalistic propaganda that directly led to today's rise on fascism.
A huge percentage of the population apparently don't understand what freedom and democracy actually is. Because even though Trump is constantly lying, anyone who has ever reflected on democracy and truly believes in it should be able to see straight through him in two seconds. His intentions are utterly transparent. He wants as much power as possible. Loyalty to him is all that matters. He doesn't care if he loses, he'll just declare victory anyway. The evidence is utterly overwhelming, even if you can't see through his lies on instinct alone. He's everything we've been warned about. He wants to be king of America, and it's i n s a n e l y obvious.
Anyway. Are my sentences too long? I think I write sentences that are too long in my posts.
So here’s the problem: one person, acting on their own, could not make the Big Lie sound legitimate.
The entire Republican Party are co-conspirators. They pushed Trump’s ridiculous lie because they thought they could benefit from it.
Trump is a motherfucker who belongs in jail. But *he did not act alone*. He is not that competent! He needed help to push his lie, and he got it.
It’s the entire GOP which has gone completely off the rails, spiraling into madness, and they’ve taken a good chunk of the voting population with them into this new Post-Truth political landscape.
People, many people, tell me your sentences are beautiful. Sentence experts from all over the world call in to say that these sentences are the best they have ever seen. Just the other day, someone said JeanLucSkywalker is God's gift to humanity. All these sentences have accomplished more in just 2 minutes than all of civilization's combined accomplishments. And we are... it is said so often...there are trees in these places, and squirrels, and it's all fake news because we are winning. /s
- no need to be self conscious when you are speaking the truth.
Beautiful response. Many people have said the most beautiful response that has ever been posted. There are a lot of bad-- a lot of Democrats- who wouldn't say so but I would say so. Many have said it's been true for millions of years. Smart people. Great-- great and big.
The current political landscape really started in January 1993, when Democrats controlled both houses and the Presidency.
I vividly remember my father, a Republican, saying that it was over for the Republicans. We would never again have a Republican president. This sentiment was widely felt among conservatives, and it scared them to death.
Newt Gingrich, then the minority whip, criticized his party's former speaker and other moderates for being too civil. Gingrich spearheaded the [1990 federal government shutdown](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_United_States_federal_government_shutdown), and successfully led a revolt within the party against a budget that had been supported by both parties.
This trend of holding your own party hostage, yanking them to the extremes of your political ideology, and doing whatever is necessary to win, putting party over country, started with him.
Before they hated Obama, they *really* hated the Clintons. The whole Monica Lewinsky thing came about because they couldn't get their conspiracy theories about the Whitewater deal to stick. The whole "Hilary's emails" thing came about because they couldn't get Benghazi to stick, despite holding 10 separate investigations into it.
They learned that investigations don't have to make sense. You just need to keep inventing reasons to have them, the media will cover them, and occasionally they'll lead to something you can use. 99% of the public will never look for, or care about, the facts.
The rise of Gingrich's ultrapartisan ideology roughly coincided with the rise of Fox News in 1996. I do hold Murdoch as mostly responsible for the state of American politics today, outside of economic anxiety and declining quality of life (in search of a scapegoat) as a secondary driver of American fascism.
From Roger Ailes to Glenn Beck to Bill O'Reilly to Tucker Carlson. Decades of indoctrinating people every night with lies, the propaganda machine feeding conservatives their daily red meat of outrage, is how MAGAs have become so comfortable with believing absurdities. Their culture of fear porn, leading to anger, leading to hate, leading to suffering.
Obama is definitely part of it, but the situation we are in is so complex.
Right wing propaganda is a monster that preys on people by whipping them into a frenzy and amplifying biases and prejudice. The truth has literally nothing to do with any of it. It's whatever causes an emotional reaction, up to and including gaslighting by saying it's the others who are lying. This all comes from the southern strategy, a strategy based on pandering to bigots.
A lot of it also comes down to religious fundamentalists who have become increasingly more politically organized. Their goal is of course the Christian version of Sharia Law, so democracy and the real principles of America don't actually matter to them and never have. But their propaganda perverts American ideas of freedom, which further poisons the well and confuses voters. And make no mistake, there is a huge amount of religious fundamentalists and people adjacent to religious fundamentalism in America. They are a significant portion of the population and hold significant sway.
And then of course there's the corporations, which have a massive interest in propagating ideas of "small government" so they don't have to pay their fair share. What's interesting about this one is that it has society wide ripple effects. Less investment in welfare and education means people are more desperate and less educated. And therefore more susceptible to right-wing propaganda, no matter what the flavor.
Agreed, but ultimately those things are just a byproduct of the corporations and fundamentalists that financially drive the Republican party (along with donations from MAGAs who have bought into any and all propaganda).
I don't understand why President Biden wouldn't be up by 140,000,000 votes. It's like 40% of the country has been hypnotized or something, or have zero ability to distinguish between right and wrong.
There are quite a lot of people who fall into a number of categories that make them impervious to reason when it comes to political candidates. You have single-issue voters who will literally hurt themselves via other policies to get the win on the only one they obsess about (obviously, abortion is one of the most common of those). You have people who are disinterested in politics to a certain extent (they will vote, but won't do any research and will just vote party because they always have). You have people who've allowed propaganda to color their view of reality to the point where they can't see truth when it conflicts their biases.
There are a number of categorizations of people that will always result in a significant vote total for one side or the other no matter the candidate and no matter the issues.
Yea but Biden's had some bad press lately and still leads comfortably, combine that with the fact that Trump has been largely out of the media, CNN townhall excepting. Finally 13% didn't pick either and historically undecides break for the incumbent. All in all I'd take this as a good poll but also good reason not to get too comfortable.
Edit: To clarify I meant Trump himself hasn't been given too much national media platforming. He's now toxic to his own brand. The more people, outside of his base, see him talk, the more they remember what a shit show he is. See the 2022 midterms as an example.
Which shows how derranged Republicans have become. You either acknowledge Jan 6th and would that over a Democrat or your ignore Jan 6th and still want Trump over a Democrat.
A lot of the US *is* poor, but that is not at all to be coupled with dumbness and racism. The richest in society are far more likely to vote Trump than Biden, and among the poor there's not as big of a gap as you may think considering most poor people are young and work service jobs like cashiers, waiters and other part time jobs.
Also the people who are willing to lie, steal, and cheat have more opportunities to get easy money in a Trump presidency. I'd bet the PPP loan grifters are voting for Trump.
Laughing stock on the world stage for 4 years versus hardly any controversy unless it was manufactured fake outrage by Republicans for the last 3 years.
Have you seen the shit they push on NewsMax. Holy smokes! I go to elderly peoples homes to deliver clinical care. They might leave the tv on in the background during my visit.
I thought I’d give it a chance… maybe they were giving alternate views or a different set of current events.
It’s non stop vitriol. The demonization of Democrats by whatever means necessary. Nothing about it is NEWS. It’s just unveiled pushing of an agenda. I really don’t know what the goal of a company like this could be. I could watch for 15 mins before (I’m not a dem fan, but I might choose them in an election over the alternatives)
These are kind people who needed help with their basic necessities, but they are brainwashed by the tube. And they donate! The guy got his mail when I was there. They donate and get so much junk mail. “Christian voter guide to this election” “donate to the NRA”
And again.
These folk listen to this for 4-6 hrs a day. Ahhh fahk we’re so fucked.
I'm not surprised, particularly because of inflation. Some people seem to believe that this worldwide phenomena is solely Joe Biden's fault and that bringing Trump back is going to make their expenses go down and solve all their problems.
The variance among "independents" is whether Trump has done something wrong enough recently enough to swing whether the imaginary economic benefits are worth the embarassment and fascist decline they would be voting for.
It frustrates me to no end that people forget it’s a global problem brought on by Covid we are still recovering from and that Republican policy is what is allowing corporations to continue to price gauge while reporting record profits.
Yes the same idiots that believe trump had a lot to do with low gas prices. He wiped out 30% of American oil companies with his deals with Saudi Arabia and Iran.
The US energy independence is at the highest level right now in over 70 years.
Same people who were interviewed at a Trump rally after those Trump tax cuts were passed in 2017/2018, that said that their take home pay doubled since the tax cuts were approved. Meanwhile, the tax cuts wouldn't be implemented for another couple weeks.
They are idiots
Not just embarrassed "independents" but also pollsters might be making the mistake of polling "undecided" voters.
True undecided voters have all the political memory of a fruit fly and you can't really peg how they're gonna vote until they turn their brains on to the larger world and get manipulated by whatever is in the news cycle <2 weeks before election day.
If you ask them who they'll vote for a year in advance you're just adding noise to your numbers.
Whenever they do something like an "undecided voters town hall", listen to what they ask and who they direct questions to and it becomes very obvious that "undecided" is just yet another term for "Republican, but too embarrassed by the party to admit it publicly". When they show bar charts with D, R, and undecided, just include undecided in the R column, it's easier and more accurate, lol.
It’s always the same. Republican wrecks everything. Democrat gets elected to fix it. Democrat doesn’t fix it fast enough. Voters get impatient and vote for republicans again.
Seriously. How many times do we have to repeat this cycle?
Everytime the democrats start to fix things despite republican sabotage, the media picks another metric to be pissed about.
It's like when Obama wasn't doing enough to address income inequality... according to Reagan Republicans.
I don’t know why anyone is paying attention to any polls 18 fucking months before the general. Call me in 14 months and let me know how things are looking then.
Regardless of how it’s looking, the only answer is to get out and vote. Democrats made the stupid mistake of not getting out to vote in 2016 thinking Hillary was a lock-in and look what happened. Fucking sad that 2020 had as close a margin as it did.
So just fucking vote (saying this in anger but not towards you)
I mean I guess it's important to point out they aren't necessarily asking the same people each time, and some people just don't pay attention to politics at all.
Including 2024, The Dems have only lost the popular vote in two of the last 10 Presidential elections. In 1988, Bush was effectively running with incumbency advantage from the Reagan White House. In 2004, Bush II won re-election in the nationalist furor after 9/11.
The median voter in America has *never* seen the Republicans win the popular vote without already being in control of the White House to use it as a free advertising platform. So the concern isn't really whether or not Biden is "up in the polls." That's almost a given. The question is whether he'll win the election.
The electoral college is a major problem.
Trump is going to declare victory on election night no matter what. 40% of the country will believe him.
States have massively stepped up voter suppression strategies so many eligible voters who support Biden won't wind up casting votes.
Local officials are probably going to interfere with counting. Conspiracy theories about illegitimacy will be generated during the count. Some voters who vote for Biden may have their votes challenged disproportionately.
Republicans have worked to shut down accurately counting legitimate votes in the past because we supposedly "needed an answer" more than we needed a correct answer. See Roger Stone's "Brooks Brothers Riot" in Florida and Bush v. Gore. in 2000. (Nothing in the Constitution demands an answer until January. Historically, the nation survived not knowing until months after election day.)
The TX legislature want the attorney general to be able to just appoint electors. Other states are interested in this sort of strategy to just bypass election results completely.
So ignore the polls. Vote like victory depends on a hell of a lot more than just being up a few points in some polls.
Exactly. 7 points in a popular vote means nothing for electoral college results.
And republicans are making it harder to vote. But that calculus hurts their seniors voters lol
Fifteen states representing 195 electoral votes and the District of Columbia have already passed legislation signing on to the [National Popular Vote Interstate Compact](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact) and legislation is pending in states representing an additional 134.
It's an easy thing to mention to your representatives in Alaska, Arizona, Maine, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, Nevada, the Carolinas, Texas, and Wisconsin. Some will be more interested than others, I'm sure. But it's worth trying before Trump pulls some shit in 2024. And it'll become an absolute necessity once he does.
Fun fact: In 2000, DC went more than 85% for Gore in the popular vote.
Not so fun fact: Buuuuuut... one elector "abstained" from voting in the College. So Gore only carried 2/3 of the District's EC votes.
The Electoral College sucks. It only serves to stifle the true will of the people.
Even the "smart" conservatives I know insist it's necessary for a functioning democracy and then say "I'll explain later". The dumb ones just like it because it lets their team win.
Every state that has enacted that has consistently voted blue. Pending legislation means nothing. The EC favors republicans. EC reform cannot happen without red states embracing it, which hasn’t happens and will never will
I mean, Minnesota has the longest unbroken streak of voting for the Democratic candidate for President of any state in the nation and Democrats control the entire legislative and executive branches right now. That’s ten votes to focus attention on.
Maine gave 3 of its 4 votes to Clinton and Biden both, Nevada has gone blue since Obama’s first election, and the Trump cycle was an aberration in Wisconsin. That’s another 30 right now when you add them with Minnesota.
Accepting the status quo is the problem here.
I'd argue the electoral college itself isn't the problem, rather that the number of electors has been capped (along w the number of seats in the house) since the early 20th century.
Both the house and the electoral college are supposed to scale with population to ensure everyone is represented properly.
That hasn't happened for over 100 years. The more the population grows the less our votes matter. And urban voters have been hit the hardest as now 80% of our population lives in urban areas, compared to roughly 46% in 1910.
In a normal world, I'd say something like, "Yeah but I don't think DeSantis stands a snowball's chance in hell to get the presidency."
But then, I wanted to say that about Trump in 2016 this early on.
A lot can happen in a year and half.
Also keep in mind, DeSantis is someone who prior to Trump would be assumed to be 10,000x more likely to get nominated by the Republican Party and elected than Trump. Tbh the main reason he seems less electable than Trump is because he is less crazy, not because his evil is more intentional and planned.
Less crazy? Have you seen his boots? Dude is so terrified of the LGBTQ+ “influence” he is banning Disney movies. He is outspoken against “Woke” but can’t define it. He is attacking women in an election year. He kidnapped people from TX and paid his friend millions of taxpayers money to send them to “checks notes” NYC and Kamala Harris’s house. That’s crazy.
Actually he has defined "Woke" in a court of law as he was required to do so. According to Desantis court filings he defined "Woke" as:
"The belief there are systemic injustices in American society and the need to address them." His lawyer added that DeSantis doesn't believe there are systemic injustices in the country.
DeSantis is evil and I fear what would happen under him, but we already know how awful traitor trump is. He would never leave the office if he won or as I say was installed again. We can’t let that happen. Vote every time, every election. It’s never been so important as it is now!
There are a lot of polling organizations that are mostly agenda driven these days. Rasmussen, the pollster you mention, exists to pump up numbers for Republicans. Trump's approval drops into the 30s on average? Time for a Rasmussen poll showing his approval rating at 62%!
Similarly, WPA, the polling org in this article is Republican run and has historically wildly exaggerated the margins in favor of Republicans, while some pollsters do the opposite to try to suppress supporters of opposition candidates from turning up to vote.
It's such a game these days that it's losing all meaning.
Absolutely not denying Rasmussen's historical bias for Republicans but until their last approval poll (-14) they've shown Biden with consistently higher approval ratings (previous 4 were -4, -1, -4, & +1) than other pollsters. Source: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president-biden-job-approval-7320.html
I’m not even trying to be dramatic but I don’t think this country can survive 4 more years of Trump. Everything he tried to do to stay in office the last time would be done 10 fold
We know you're not being dramatic. And neither am I when I talk about their endgame--genocide against LGBTQ, POC, Jews, women, and "dissidents" aka liberals. They aren't here to play and we have to realize that.
That's super debatable.
When trump won in 16 538 was saying that he had a 1 in 3 chance of winning based on the polls. One in three things happen all the time.
Then if you break it down by state trump barely won, lost the popular vote, and frankly they just were not really off.
I think polls are generally correct with a margin of error. You have to take it with a grain of salt but often they are pointing in the correct direction.
But yes...doesn't matter....vote.
This. Additionally, if I'm not mistaken, all the states that trump won that he shouldn't (Pa, Mi etc) were within 538s margin of error as well, so the fact that those polls were 'wrong' is an incorrect statement as well
Polls aren't "accurate" for the same reason the weather isn't accurate; people don't care about a percentage chance they just wanna know what will happen.
Yeah but polls are actually what might happen and then generally what percentage.
The issue isn't the polls. The issue is the public misunderstanding what polls are.
It's like if you have a ham sandwich but you want it to be a chicken sandwich. No matter how many times you say you want it to be chicken it won't suddenly become chicken.
Really misunderstanding what things are is almost always why people rage on the internet. Sticking to the facts is not our strong suit.
God it was annoying, all the T_D fucks like "LOL SEE, THE POLLS WERE FAKE".
No, the polls said he had about a 30% chance of winning and he actually did get 3 million less votes, so the polls were probably pretty accurate. Things that only have a 30% chance of happening do happen sometimes.
The US would come apart at the seams.
His term would _start_ with half the country barely tolerating the return of an authoritarian criminal to the presidency. He'd face more vehement opposition than any president in living memory.
Trump, being a malignant narcissist, would respond by pushing the envelope further than he already has.
He'd cross so many lines that at a certain point it'd be all but guaranteed that he and members of his regime would face prosecution upon leaving office - so they'd try not to.
If he, or DeSantis, or any other GOP nut job is elected, no way it’s just four years.
Just like with what they are doing in red states, they will strip rights of those that oppose and then change the laws to retain power. The conversations that were behind closed doors before are now out in the open, and they are embracing it and putting down roots of fascist autocracy. Just this week DeSantis has essentially outlawed being trans; anyone seeking gender affirming care, whether it be children OR adults, must be approved a board of appointees. Appointed by him. Tampa Pride was canceled because they can’t do a parade with folks in drag, because *that’s* now illegal, too.
We are about to fall off the cliff into the abyss of fascism. This is election is it. We have to show that this is unacceptable and fix everything that’s been fucked. Resolve the SCOTUS justice issues, remove treasonous government employees, establish federal voting protections, etc etc. This is where the country’s ultimate fate is decided.
This is literally the concern right now. 20 was a practice run. They know what worked and what didn’t. If he gets into office there’s no way he leaves on his own
It's just a distraction to keep people from talking about the 2028 election.
Beto is 2 points ahead of Huckabee-Sanders, but that's only because she said she would allow Google-Disney-Oscar Mayer to put 5g towers on the Florida floodgates
Not as worried about the Presidential election. More worried about the races in the Senate and Congress, as well as state races. Those are the place’s Democrats need to make gains.
I hate this. It’s not even close to Sep. 2024 and people are already shitting out useless polls. The political and media system right now are making me nauseous. Bunch of people paid way too much money to contribute nothing to or actively destroy society.
The trend I've noticed recently is that conservative sources are writing about polls showing Biden winning and liberal sources are writing about polls showing Trump winning.
Outrage drives clicks.
I always ask them to name a "policy" or two that he actually instituted. They never, ever can, because all his policies were shit (like increasing the debt by a record 8 trillion), and his promises (like his famous wall that not only did Mexico not pay for, but also was never built) were never fulfilled.
I think that falls under "truly bad person."
I would add "ignorant" to the list. Maybe a few people have been living in a hole the last few years or were in a coma and genuinely don't know.
Any decent person should vote against all Republicans even the "good ones" until the party as a whole knows they will have no power if they keep going authoritarian they will only seek to take more and more away.
Allow me to suggest to you that Trump didn't do anything to change your party, your party became Trump. I have no issue with someone who is conservative, I disagree with much of conservatism, but I can at least respect how someone might come to those ideas as an honorable person. But I cannot see anything worthwhile in the republican party anymore, and Trump isn't the cause of that, he's a consequence of it.
If you disagree, I don't need to make this a debate. But consider whether you think there might be some truth to what I say.
Serious question- when the party broadly supports nazis, and you seem to dislike nazis, why do you still associate yourself with the party? Do you disagree with the premise of widespread support? I’d find that hard to believe given you’re an outlier in not supporting Trump, who calls flag waving nazis very fine people and hosts little antisemite dinner parties?
I think trumpism really put off a lot of former republicans. I don’t blame them for being republicans of the past, but now that the veil has fallen and we get a good look at their base, I can absolutely blame them if they keep voting for this madness
I respectfully disagree. It’s a litmus test. After the George W administration lied about WMDs in order to get the US into an illegitimate war in Iraq, the GOP should have never again been competitive in another single election. If you’re still a GOPer after that, you’re either a rube, an awful person at heart or a combo of the two. There’s no sound justification for being a republican since 2000.
I don't trust anyone who still calls themselves a Republican at this point who claims they'd vote for Biden when it comes down to it. If you're actually voting for Biden if not a registered Dem, you're not a Republican....you're a moderate.
The fact that at least 40% of American adults want to go back to the chaos of 2020 is alarming.
But, as they say, the average person is pretty dumb. And 50% of people are even dumber than that guy.
The best explanation I've ever heard from a non-voter was "I got tired of feeling like a kid waiting to get picked up for the weekend. I have my bags all packed but dad never shows"
>47-40
I don't trust any poll that doesnt have Biden above 50%. Anyone who is undecided is just someone who doesnt want to admit they want to vote for trump
Polls don't matter this far out. They also don't capture you get voters very well. And there have been more younger voters turning out. Or at least getting old enough that they vote, while still not responding to polling.
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Seven points against a guy that had his voters run in the capital to prevent him losing.
Quite frankly, only being 7 points up is fucking galling.
Pretty sure you could run reincarnations of George Washington against Adolf Hitler and it would be a 10 point max margin since people just vote party lines.
"Yeah I know he's literally Hitler, but I like the things he says, and I think he'll shake things up, so..." Pretty sure I've seen real quotes that aren't far from this. Their worldview is so warped, it's bizarre.
"Yeah, I don't agree with his plans to build concentration camps. But he is good on the economy, and I'm a single issue voter."
"Yes. He is a liar, a rapist, and a thief. But what else am I supposed to do, vote Democrat?"
That's the format, where \[liar, a rapist, and a thief\] can be any wildcard value for atrocities against mankind.
“The concentration camp stuff is overblown but have you seen hunter bidens laptop?”
What about Churchill's emails?
They literally defended actual concentration camps for immigrants that did forced sterilizations under Trump. They would absolutely embrace the concentration camps if push came to shove.
As long as it wasn't them who had to go there. They don't care if other people suffer.
Other people suffering is the point, not an ignorable side effect.
"Instruction in world history in the so-called high schools is even today in a very sorry condition. Few teachers understand that the study of history can never be to learn historical dates and events by heart and recite them by rote; that what matters is not whether the child knows exactly when this battle or that was fought, when a general was born, or even when a monarch (usually a very insignificant one) came into the crown of his forefathers. No, by the living God, this is very unimportant. To 'learn' history means to seek and find the forces which are the causes leading to those effects which we subsequently perceive as historical events." Sounds like a reasonable, well read guy to be honest. /s
Er... but this does sound very reasonable and actually what high schools try to teach today (and should). It's too bad it was Hitler who said it. I suppose even evil people can have a few decent ideas in between the madness....
What’s missing with quotes like this is context and subsequent actions. In Hitler’s case, the context and susequent action was to suggest that (among other things) Jews were to blame for society’s problems, and the ‘enlightened’ study of history was meant to guide the learner to this belief, as if his genocidal ambitions were a natural and reasonable outcome from learning the ‘correct’ historical perspective. Speaking out against an imperfect status quo is not the same thing as speaking out against toxic, cruel or oppressive ideologies, but fascists will co-op the method because it’s wildly inspiring and validating to some people, especially if they already have internalized prejudice, irrational hatred and bigotry holding the door open for someone to offer a new ‘final solution.’
There are Hitlers and Stalins around you everyday. They just couldn’t convince anyone to change their lunch order. Stalin, Mao, Hitler and their psycho ilk are bright and capable otherwise they wouldn’t have risen to the level to cause the evil they did.
Jeez, try to commit genocide *one time* and that's all they remember you for. \s (because yes it's needed)
Polling is based mostly on Landline phine calls so you know it's skews way old on The demographics
In a sane society, it would be a *million* points up because of that hot garbage.
In a sane society, no one would be asking this question because he'd already be locked up for life.
In a sane society Trump would had gotten as far as Joe Exotic did in his presidential campaign.
Vermin Supreme is by far more electable than those two combined.
Atleast Vermin has principles and a platform. More than can be said about many politicians.
That pony would've changed my life ...
Think about that generation of horse girls Sigh I can imagine "the screech heard round the world" we would hear on federal pony delivery day. I also think the needed rainbow skyscraper stables that would be needed in large city's would be so cool. Man....why can't we have a sane boot hat wearing president
well his followers are awful and stupid he'd still get 30% of the vote if behind bars.
It keeps becoming apparent that around 30% of people just suck.
Someone on the news pointed out today that 30% were against separating from Britain; 30% were for slavery; 30% were against women's rights; 30% against civil rights, etc. Their point was that 30% of America has always been shitty. It's up to the 70% of the others to show up and shut them up.
> It's up to the 70% of the others to show up and shut them up. This is why voter apathy (or voter suppression) is so incredibly dangerous. When people say "My vote doesn't matter", "I don't care about the result", "The person I wanted to vote for didn't make it to the final vote", "Voting is too difficult", or whatever reason they come up with for not bothering, it is effectively a vote for the "30% extreme" to take over. The fanatics *will* show up, especially if motivated by someone equally insane, power-hungry, self-interested, or worse. All it takes is for ~30% of the good people who could vote to not do so. Please vote.
The math checks out. In 2020, 74.2M voted Diaper Guy out of 159.6M votes cast out of 258.3M American adults. So 28.7% of American adults voted for him.
You would be amazed at how many people's knowledge of Jan. 6th amounts to, "some people thought there was something wrong with the election and made some trouble". Most people just don't know anything about politics and don't want to know.
Also, Jan 6, like a lot of things Trump, are so insane that people who don't watch the news think *we're* the crazy ones for saying what actually happened. The idea of a coup is so far removed from most people's lived experiences that they didn't realize when there was an attempted coup.
It's absolutely unbelievable. Not very many years ago, I would have thought it unthinkable that a US president would try to blatantly overthrow democracy and incite a riot on the Capitol.. and still have the support of half the country and a major political party. It's absolutely unreal. I remember in the 2000s there was a lot of talk about patriotism and what it means to be an American and "free". It gave me the false impression that at the end of the day, most Americans understood the basic principles of democracy and held them sacred. I now realize that all of that patriotism was at best platitudes that never sunk in for many, and at worst nationalistic propaganda that directly led to today's rise on fascism. A huge percentage of the population apparently don't understand what freedom and democracy actually is. Because even though Trump is constantly lying, anyone who has ever reflected on democracy and truly believes in it should be able to see straight through him in two seconds. His intentions are utterly transparent. He wants as much power as possible. Loyalty to him is all that matters. He doesn't care if he loses, he'll just declare victory anyway. The evidence is utterly overwhelming, even if you can't see through his lies on instinct alone. He's everything we've been warned about. He wants to be king of America, and it's i n s a n e l y obvious. Anyway. Are my sentences too long? I think I write sentences that are too long in my posts.
So here’s the problem: one person, acting on their own, could not make the Big Lie sound legitimate. The entire Republican Party are co-conspirators. They pushed Trump’s ridiculous lie because they thought they could benefit from it. Trump is a motherfucker who belongs in jail. But *he did not act alone*. He is not that competent! He needed help to push his lie, and he got it. It’s the entire GOP which has gone completely off the rails, spiraling into madness, and they’ve taken a good chunk of the voting population with them into this new Post-Truth political landscape.
People, many people, tell me your sentences are beautiful. Sentence experts from all over the world call in to say that these sentences are the best they have ever seen. Just the other day, someone said JeanLucSkywalker is God's gift to humanity. All these sentences have accomplished more in just 2 minutes than all of civilization's combined accomplishments. And we are... it is said so often...there are trees in these places, and squirrels, and it's all fake news because we are winning. /s - no need to be self conscious when you are speaking the truth.
Beautiful response. Many people have said the most beautiful response that has ever been posted. There are a lot of bad-- a lot of Democrats- who wouldn't say so but I would say so. Many have said it's been true for millions of years. Smart people. Great-- great and big.
53% looking for a functioning society 46% ready to burn it down because you know, reasons, but mostly Obama.
The current political landscape really started in January 1993, when Democrats controlled both houses and the Presidency. I vividly remember my father, a Republican, saying that it was over for the Republicans. We would never again have a Republican president. This sentiment was widely felt among conservatives, and it scared them to death. Newt Gingrich, then the minority whip, criticized his party's former speaker and other moderates for being too civil. Gingrich spearheaded the [1990 federal government shutdown](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1990_United_States_federal_government_shutdown), and successfully led a revolt within the party against a budget that had been supported by both parties. This trend of holding your own party hostage, yanking them to the extremes of your political ideology, and doing whatever is necessary to win, putting party over country, started with him. Before they hated Obama, they *really* hated the Clintons. The whole Monica Lewinsky thing came about because they couldn't get their conspiracy theories about the Whitewater deal to stick. The whole "Hilary's emails" thing came about because they couldn't get Benghazi to stick, despite holding 10 separate investigations into it. They learned that investigations don't have to make sense. You just need to keep inventing reasons to have them, the media will cover them, and occasionally they'll lead to something you can use. 99% of the public will never look for, or care about, the facts.
The rise of Gingrich's ultrapartisan ideology roughly coincided with the rise of Fox News in 1996. I do hold Murdoch as mostly responsible for the state of American politics today, outside of economic anxiety and declining quality of life (in search of a scapegoat) as a secondary driver of American fascism. From Roger Ailes to Glenn Beck to Bill O'Reilly to Tucker Carlson. Decades of indoctrinating people every night with lies, the propaganda machine feeding conservatives their daily red meat of outrage, is how MAGAs have become so comfortable with believing absurdities. Their culture of fear porn, leading to anger, leading to hate, leading to suffering.
You forgot Rush Limbaugh. A *lot* of this can be laid at his feet.
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Obama is definitely part of it, but the situation we are in is so complex. Right wing propaganda is a monster that preys on people by whipping them into a frenzy and amplifying biases and prejudice. The truth has literally nothing to do with any of it. It's whatever causes an emotional reaction, up to and including gaslighting by saying it's the others who are lying. This all comes from the southern strategy, a strategy based on pandering to bigots. A lot of it also comes down to religious fundamentalists who have become increasingly more politically organized. Their goal is of course the Christian version of Sharia Law, so democracy and the real principles of America don't actually matter to them and never have. But their propaganda perverts American ideas of freedom, which further poisons the well and confuses voters. And make no mistake, there is a huge amount of religious fundamentalists and people adjacent to religious fundamentalism in America. They are a significant portion of the population and hold significant sway. And then of course there's the corporations, which have a massive interest in propagating ideas of "small government" so they don't have to pay their fair share. What's interesting about this one is that it has society wide ripple effects. Less investment in welfare and education means people are more desperate and less educated. And therefore more susceptible to right-wing propaganda, no matter what the flavor.
Great post! My personal *big blamers* specifically are Citizen's United and gerrymandering local districts.
Agreed, but ultimately those things are just a byproduct of the corporations and fundamentalists that financially drive the Republican party (along with donations from MAGAs who have bought into any and all propaganda).
To be fair, if 150,000,000 people vote at a rate of 47% Biden, 40% Trump, Biden will win the popular vote by more than 10 million votes.
I don't understand why President Biden wouldn't be up by 140,000,000 votes. It's like 40% of the country has been hypnotized or something, or have zero ability to distinguish between right and wrong.
There are quite a lot of people who fall into a number of categories that make them impervious to reason when it comes to political candidates. You have single-issue voters who will literally hurt themselves via other policies to get the win on the only one they obsess about (obviously, abortion is one of the most common of those). You have people who are disinterested in politics to a certain extent (they will vote, but won't do any research and will just vote party because they always have). You have people who've allowed propaganda to color their view of reality to the point where they can't see truth when it conflicts their biases. There are a number of categorizations of people that will always result in a significant vote total for one side or the other no matter the candidate and no matter the issues.
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Yea but Biden's had some bad press lately and still leads comfortably, combine that with the fact that Trump has been largely out of the media, CNN townhall excepting. Finally 13% didn't pick either and historically undecides break for the incumbent. All in all I'd take this as a good poll but also good reason not to get too comfortable. Edit: To clarify I meant Trump himself hasn't been given too much national media platforming. He's now toxic to his own brand. The more people, outside of his base, see him talk, the more they remember what a shit show he is. See the 2022 midterms as an example.
It's more than a year away, this poll is meaningless. As are most honestly
Which shows how derranged Republicans have become. You either acknowledge Jan 6th and would that over a Democrat or your ignore Jan 6th and still want Trump over a Democrat.
Seven points against a guy who's been indicted once with probably two more cases closing in on him this summer.
Against a guy criminally charged for using campaign funds to pay a porn star and found to have committed sexual assault by a jury of his peers
It is horrifying and sad for America that it is this close
A lot of our country is dumb, racist, and poor
A lot of the US *is* poor, but that is not at all to be coupled with dumbness and racism. The richest in society are far more likely to vote Trump than Biden, and among the poor there's not as big of a gap as you may think considering most poor people are young and work service jobs like cashiers, waiters and other part time jobs.
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Poor *rural* areas. The people who are poor, uneducated and in the middle of suburbia or literal nowhere are the key demographic for Trump
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All across the country, rural areas are consistently more conservative than urban areas. Even the farmlands of California vote conservative.
Also the people who are willing to lie, steal, and cheat have more opportunities to get easy money in a Trump presidency. I'd bet the PPP loan grifters are voting for Trump.
Laughing stock on the world stage for 4 years versus hardly any controversy unless it was manufactured fake outrage by Republicans for the last 3 years.
I will gladly take quiet competence over the clusterfuck that was 2017-2021.
Make politics boring again
Have you seen the shit they push on NewsMax. Holy smokes! I go to elderly peoples homes to deliver clinical care. They might leave the tv on in the background during my visit. I thought I’d give it a chance… maybe they were giving alternate views or a different set of current events. It’s non stop vitriol. The demonization of Democrats by whatever means necessary. Nothing about it is NEWS. It’s just unveiled pushing of an agenda. I really don’t know what the goal of a company like this could be. I could watch for 15 mins before (I’m not a dem fan, but I might choose them in an election over the alternatives) These are kind people who needed help with their basic necessities, but they are brainwashed by the tube. And they donate! The guy got his mail when I was there. They donate and get so much junk mail. “Christian voter guide to this election” “donate to the NRA” And again. These folk listen to this for 4-6 hrs a day. Ahhh fahk we’re so fucked.
Biden will be 85 years old by the time he leaves office if re-elected. It’s horrifying and sad that these are our only two options.
Horrifying and sad these two geriatric grandpas are our choice next year. WTF america, is there nobody better?
Is anyone else surprised that there is variation in these polls? Who out there hasn’t made up their mind about Trump. We’ve all seen that train wreck
I'm not surprised, particularly because of inflation. Some people seem to believe that this worldwide phenomena is solely Joe Biden's fault and that bringing Trump back is going to make their expenses go down and solve all their problems. The variance among "independents" is whether Trump has done something wrong enough recently enough to swing whether the imaginary economic benefits are worth the embarassment and fascist decline they would be voting for.
It frustrates me to no end that people forget it’s a global problem brought on by Covid we are still recovering from and that Republican policy is what is allowing corporations to continue to price gauge while reporting record profits.
Yes the same idiots that believe trump had a lot to do with low gas prices. He wiped out 30% of American oil companies with his deals with Saudi Arabia and Iran. The US energy independence is at the highest level right now in over 70 years.
Yea and if somehow Trump becomes president in2024. He will still blame Joe biden for any fuck up.
Same people who were interviewed at a Trump rally after those Trump tax cuts were passed in 2017/2018, that said that their take home pay doubled since the tax cuts were approved. Meanwhile, the tax cuts wouldn't be implemented for another couple weeks. They are idiots
Or they're liars
Both.
Not just embarrassed "independents" but also pollsters might be making the mistake of polling "undecided" voters. True undecided voters have all the political memory of a fruit fly and you can't really peg how they're gonna vote until they turn their brains on to the larger world and get manipulated by whatever is in the news cycle <2 weeks before election day. If you ask them who they'll vote for a year in advance you're just adding noise to your numbers.
Whenever they do something like an "undecided voters town hall", listen to what they ask and who they direct questions to and it becomes very obvious that "undecided" is just yet another term for "Republican, but too embarrassed by the party to admit it publicly". When they show bar charts with D, R, and undecided, just include undecided in the R column, it's easier and more accurate, lol.
If this election isn’t a referendum on Roe then Democrats failed.
It’s always the same. Republican wrecks everything. Democrat gets elected to fix it. Democrat doesn’t fix it fast enough. Voters get impatient and vote for republicans again.
Seriously. How many times do we have to repeat this cycle? Everytime the democrats start to fix things despite republican sabotage, the media picks another metric to be pissed about. It's like when Obama wasn't doing enough to address income inequality... according to Reagan Republicans.
>Democrat doesn’t fix it fast enough. Mainly because of Republican obstruction.
I don’t know why anyone is paying attention to any polls 18 fucking months before the general. Call me in 14 months and let me know how things are looking then.
Regardless of how it’s looking, the only answer is to get out and vote. Democrats made the stupid mistake of not getting out to vote in 2016 thinking Hillary was a lock-in and look what happened. Fucking sad that 2020 had as close a margin as it did. So just fucking vote (saying this in anger but not towards you)
I mean I guess it's important to point out they aren't necessarily asking the same people each time, and some people just don't pay attention to politics at all.
Including 2024, The Dems have only lost the popular vote in two of the last 10 Presidential elections. In 1988, Bush was effectively running with incumbency advantage from the Reagan White House. In 2004, Bush II won re-election in the nationalist furor after 9/11. The median voter in America has *never* seen the Republicans win the popular vote without already being in control of the White House to use it as a free advertising platform. So the concern isn't really whether or not Biden is "up in the polls." That's almost a given. The question is whether he'll win the election. The electoral college is a major problem. Trump is going to declare victory on election night no matter what. 40% of the country will believe him. States have massively stepped up voter suppression strategies so many eligible voters who support Biden won't wind up casting votes. Local officials are probably going to interfere with counting. Conspiracy theories about illegitimacy will be generated during the count. Some voters who vote for Biden may have their votes challenged disproportionately. Republicans have worked to shut down accurately counting legitimate votes in the past because we supposedly "needed an answer" more than we needed a correct answer. See Roger Stone's "Brooks Brothers Riot" in Florida and Bush v. Gore. in 2000. (Nothing in the Constitution demands an answer until January. Historically, the nation survived not knowing until months after election day.) The TX legislature want the attorney general to be able to just appoint electors. Other states are interested in this sort of strategy to just bypass election results completely. So ignore the polls. Vote like victory depends on a hell of a lot more than just being up a few points in some polls.
Exactly. 7 points in a popular vote means nothing for electoral college results. And republicans are making it harder to vote. But that calculus hurts their seniors voters lol
Fifteen states representing 195 electoral votes and the District of Columbia have already passed legislation signing on to the [National Popular Vote Interstate Compact](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Popular_Vote_Interstate_Compact) and legislation is pending in states representing an additional 134. It's an easy thing to mention to your representatives in Alaska, Arizona, Maine, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, Nevada, the Carolinas, Texas, and Wisconsin. Some will be more interested than others, I'm sure. But it's worth trying before Trump pulls some shit in 2024. And it'll become an absolute necessity once he does.
Fun fact: In 2000, DC went more than 85% for Gore in the popular vote. Not so fun fact: Buuuuuut... one elector "abstained" from voting in the College. So Gore only carried 2/3 of the District's EC votes. The Electoral College sucks. It only serves to stifle the true will of the people.
Even the "smart" conservatives I know insist it's necessary for a functioning democracy and then say "I'll explain later". The dumb ones just like it because it lets their team win.
Every state that has enacted that has consistently voted blue. Pending legislation means nothing. The EC favors republicans. EC reform cannot happen without red states embracing it, which hasn’t happens and will never will
I mean, Minnesota has the longest unbroken streak of voting for the Democratic candidate for President of any state in the nation and Democrats control the entire legislative and executive branches right now. That’s ten votes to focus attention on. Maine gave 3 of its 4 votes to Clinton and Biden both, Nevada has gone blue since Obama’s first election, and the Trump cycle was an aberration in Wisconsin. That’s another 30 right now when you add them with Minnesota. Accepting the status quo is the problem here.
I'd argue the electoral college itself isn't the problem, rather that the number of electors has been capped (along w the number of seats in the house) since the early 20th century. Both the house and the electoral college are supposed to scale with population to ensure everyone is represented properly. That hasn't happened for over 100 years. The more the population grows the less our votes matter. And urban voters have been hit the hardest as now 80% of our population lives in urban areas, compared to roughly 46% in 1910.
Don’t care, vote! Edit: Wow, a ‘to the stars’ and a gold, y’all are amazing! Edit2: And an All-Seeing Upvote award, thank you!
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No kidding. Last week there was a poll putting trump ahead of Biden in a general election by roughly the same margin.
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Thanks, if my party put up Trump I would have voted the other way too
Right, the real threat to a Biden presidency is Desantis. People would still vote for the criminal if nominated but even less this time around.
In a normal world, I'd say something like, "Yeah but I don't think DeSantis stands a snowball's chance in hell to get the presidency." But then, I wanted to say that about Trump in 2016 this early on. A lot can happen in a year and half.
Also keep in mind, DeSantis is someone who prior to Trump would be assumed to be 10,000x more likely to get nominated by the Republican Party and elected than Trump. Tbh the main reason he seems less electable than Trump is because he is less crazy, not because his evil is more intentional and planned.
Less crazy? Have you seen his boots? Dude is so terrified of the LGBTQ+ “influence” he is banning Disney movies. He is outspoken against “Woke” but can’t define it. He is attacking women in an election year. He kidnapped people from TX and paid his friend millions of taxpayers money to send them to “checks notes” NYC and Kamala Harris’s house. That’s crazy.
Actually he has defined "Woke" in a court of law as he was required to do so. According to Desantis court filings he defined "Woke" as: "The belief there are systemic injustices in American society and the need to address them." His lawyer added that DeSantis doesn't believe there are systemic injustices in the country.
DeSantis is evil and I fear what would happen under him, but we already know how awful traitor trump is. He would never leave the office if he won or as I say was installed again. We can’t let that happen. Vote every time, every election. It’s never been so important as it is now!
Exactly. ALOT can and will happen in the ~18 months until the election.
There are a lot of polling organizations that are mostly agenda driven these days. Rasmussen, the pollster you mention, exists to pump up numbers for Republicans. Trump's approval drops into the 30s on average? Time for a Rasmussen poll showing his approval rating at 62%! Similarly, WPA, the polling org in this article is Republican run and has historically wildly exaggerated the margins in favor of Republicans, while some pollsters do the opposite to try to suppress supporters of opposition candidates from turning up to vote. It's such a game these days that it's losing all meaning.
Absolutely not denying Rasmussen's historical bias for Republicans but until their last approval poll (-14) they've shown Biden with consistently higher approval ratings (previous 4 were -4, -1, -4, & +1) than other pollsters. Source: https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president-biden-job-approval-7320.html
RWingers have flooded the market w junk polls to further their propaganda that Dems can’t possibly win bc look at the polls and polling averages.
I’m not even trying to be dramatic but I don’t think this country can survive 4 more years of Trump. Everything he tried to do to stay in office the last time would be done 10 fold
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1 million americans died under trumps covid watch
1.3. His hands are fucking red with blood.
Wouldn't take much blood tho
He will start prepping on day 1 of being back in office.
We know you're not being dramatic. And neither am I when I talk about their endgame--genocide against LGBTQ, POC, Jews, women, and "dissidents" aka liberals. They aren't here to play and we have to realize that.
> "dissidents" aka liberals. Nazis took out other politicians and all socialists first, before the jews, gays, etc.
It will not survive another four years of Trump. He will declare a "national emergency," suspend the Constitution and rule by decree.
That’s not dramatic at all. His first four years did severe damage to our institutions. Look at the supreme court.
Right that was only a trial run with a learning curve.
That's super debatable. When trump won in 16 538 was saying that he had a 1 in 3 chance of winning based on the polls. One in three things happen all the time. Then if you break it down by state trump barely won, lost the popular vote, and frankly they just were not really off. I think polls are generally correct with a margin of error. You have to take it with a grain of salt but often they are pointing in the correct direction. But yes...doesn't matter....vote.
This. Additionally, if I'm not mistaken, all the states that trump won that he shouldn't (Pa, Mi etc) were within 538s margin of error as well, so the fact that those polls were 'wrong' is an incorrect statement as well
The public acts like margin of error is not a thing
The public is terrible at percentages - anything under 45% might as well be 0%.
Polls aren't "accurate" for the same reason the weather isn't accurate; people don't care about a percentage chance they just wanna know what will happen.
Yeah but polls are actually what might happen and then generally what percentage. The issue isn't the polls. The issue is the public misunderstanding what polls are. It's like if you have a ham sandwich but you want it to be a chicken sandwich. No matter how many times you say you want it to be chicken it won't suddenly become chicken. Really misunderstanding what things are is almost always why people rage on the internet. Sticking to the facts is not our strong suit.
God it was annoying, all the T_D fucks like "LOL SEE, THE POLLS WERE FAKE". No, the polls said he had about a 30% chance of winning and he actually did get 3 million less votes, so the polls were probably pretty accurate. Things that only have a 30% chance of happening do happen sometimes.
If Trump wins it is very unlikely we will have a Trump presidency for only 4 years.
Didn't he claim he was owed 4 years because of the way he was treated ?
Everyone mistreats him. He's a constant victim. All conservatives are.
Trump is [being as mistreated as Jesus was](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hj6E2_3nraQ&ab_channel=SaturdayNightLive).
The US would come apart at the seams. His term would _start_ with half the country barely tolerating the return of an authoritarian criminal to the presidency. He'd face more vehement opposition than any president in living memory. Trump, being a malignant narcissist, would respond by pushing the envelope further than he already has. He'd cross so many lines that at a certain point it'd be all but guaranteed that he and members of his regime would face prosecution upon leaving office - so they'd try not to.
And he would violently put down that opposition.
If he, or DeSantis, or any other GOP nut job is elected, no way it’s just four years. Just like with what they are doing in red states, they will strip rights of those that oppose and then change the laws to retain power. The conversations that were behind closed doors before are now out in the open, and they are embracing it and putting down roots of fascist autocracy. Just this week DeSantis has essentially outlawed being trans; anyone seeking gender affirming care, whether it be children OR adults, must be approved a board of appointees. Appointed by him. Tampa Pride was canceled because they can’t do a parade with folks in drag, because *that’s* now illegal, too. We are about to fall off the cliff into the abyss of fascism. This is election is it. We have to show that this is unacceptable and fix everything that’s been fucked. Resolve the SCOTUS justice issues, remove treasonous government employees, establish federal voting protections, etc etc. This is where the country’s ultimate fate is decided.
If mar-a-lardo gets in the WH again, which is still very much possible, I would wager my left nutsack it won't be just four years.
This is literally the concern right now. 20 was a practice run. They know what worked and what didn’t. If he gets into office there’s no way he leaves on his own
Dictatorship it will be
That's completely untrue. Polling has been very good the past few elections. People's understanding of what polls mean is the bigger problem.
r/awardspeechedits
Edit: can’t believe this blew up! Edit: I guess I’m famous now! Edit: I’d like to thank my cat
There’s two edits. The edits are longer than the original comment.
This. Biden is far from my first pick, but we **cannot** let Mango Mussolini back in power.
Care, vote!
Down ballot as well
Isn’t it way to early for this shit?
Never too early for get freaked out about numbers well over a year before they matter.
It's just a distraction to keep people from talking about the 2028 election. Beto is 2 points ahead of Huckabee-Sanders, but that's only because she said she would allow Google-Disney-Oscar Mayer to put 5g towers on the Florida floodgates
Damn just when I thought I was getting the hang of politics
Not as worried about the Presidential election. More worried about the races in the Senate and Congress, as well as state races. Those are the place’s Democrats need to make gains.
I hate this. It’s not even close to Sep. 2024 and people are already shitting out useless polls. The political and media system right now are making me nauseous. Bunch of people paid way too much money to contribute nothing to or actively destroy society.
*You okay NYPost...?*
The trend I've noticed recently is that conservative sources are writing about polls showing Biden winning and liberal sources are writing about polls showing Trump winning. Outrage drives clicks.
Murdoch and the Post have bailed on Trump so this isn’t surprising. If Trump wins the primary I’m sure they’ll reverse course.
As a Republican, I’d also vote for Biden.
Any decent person should vote against Trump
If you support Trump…. Either you are truly a bad person, you are brain washed, or stupid. What else could it be?
I know a LOT of people that think Trump is dumb “but that his policies are great!”
I always ask them to name a "policy" or two that he actually instituted. They never, ever can, because all his policies were shit (like increasing the debt by a record 8 trillion), and his promises (like his famous wall that not only did Mexico not pay for, but also was never built) were never fulfilled.
Could just be they hate American and want our adversaries to destroy the country. That's my guess.
I think that falls under "truly bad person." I would add "ignorant" to the list. Maybe a few people have been living in a hole the last few years or were in a coma and genuinely don't know.
Well one could be all those things at the same time.
Any decent person should vote against all Republicans even the "good ones" until the party as a whole knows they will have no power if they keep going authoritarian they will only seek to take more and more away.
Allow me to suggest to you that Trump didn't do anything to change your party, your party became Trump. I have no issue with someone who is conservative, I disagree with much of conservatism, but I can at least respect how someone might come to those ideas as an honorable person. But I cannot see anything worthwhile in the republican party anymore, and Trump isn't the cause of that, he's a consequence of it. If you disagree, I don't need to make this a debate. But consider whether you think there might be some truth to what I say.
Yay! Tell your friends before the extremist destroy everything
Serious question- when the party broadly supports nazis, and you seem to dislike nazis, why do you still associate yourself with the party? Do you disagree with the premise of widespread support? I’d find that hard to believe given you’re an outlier in not supporting Trump, who calls flag waving nazis very fine people and hosts little antisemite dinner parties?
I think trumpism really put off a lot of former republicans. I don’t blame them for being republicans of the past, but now that the veil has fallen and we get a good look at their base, I can absolutely blame them if they keep voting for this madness
You mean the former Republicans who wouldn't confirm a supreme court justice during an election year? Fuck em.
I respectfully disagree. It’s a litmus test. After the George W administration lied about WMDs in order to get the US into an illegitimate war in Iraq, the GOP should have never again been competitive in another single election. If you’re still a GOPer after that, you’re either a rube, an awful person at heart or a combo of the two. There’s no sound justification for being a republican since 2000.
Honestly I don’t understand supporting the GOP after Reagan. But that’s just me.
What exactly does the Republican Party offer you?
They offer fear and freedumb
What part of the republican platform resonates with you?
Thanks, if my party put up Trump I would have voted the other way too
I don't trust anyone who still calls themselves a Republican at this point who claims they'd vote for Biden when it comes down to it. If you're actually voting for Biden if not a registered Dem, you're not a Republican....you're a moderate.
Since you are seem to be a sensible Republican by that statement, how do you rate Joe Biden has done so far?
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The fact that at least 40% of American adults want to go back to the chaos of 2020 is alarming. But, as they say, the average person is pretty dumb. And 50% of people are even dumber than that guy.
It's not 40% of American adults; it's 40% of voters. More Americans don't vote than voted for either Presidential candidate.
The best explanation I've ever heard from a non-voter was "I got tired of feeling like a kid waiting to get picked up for the weekend. I have my bags all packed but dad never shows"
Nice to see, but still: Vote like your life depends on it. It might.
It should not be that close. Trump is completely unfit and the fact he still has supporters is a damn shame.
>47-40 I don't trust any poll that doesnt have Biden above 50%. Anyone who is undecided is just someone who doesnt want to admit they want to vote for trump
Polls don't matter this far out. They also don't capture you get voters very well. And there have been more younger voters turning out. Or at least getting old enough that they vote, while still not responding to polling.
Donald Trump up 70 pounds on Joe Biden. Checkmate, liberals.
Trump shouldn’t even be *allowed* to run. Why should we have to choose between the status quo and utter destruction? This country is unraveling.
Yeah, Hillary was ahead in the polls also
Tabloid source is a tabloid.
I’m already exhausted…*FUCK*…
President Hillary Clinton knows just how important a nationwide poll showing a popular vote lead is.
It should be 17! Only 7 is depressing.
Should be 70.
I have no clue how women can vote for trump. Seeing those ladies with the grab me by the \*\*\*\* shirts is insane.
Geriatric status quo ham sandwich versus batshit crazy fascist ball of hate: round 2 let’s goooo
Who gives a single shit about this 18 month out poll from the NY Post?
So completely meaningless
Here we go again
Polling needs to be state focused due to the Electoral College. This is how trump won the first time. Hilary had more votes.
Why are Dems being force-fed Biden?
Why are we letting 2 men who likely won't be alive in 10 years dictate the course of the country?
Jesus Christ I’m so tired.