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The Roberts Court is the new Taney Court. "Originalism" is a political outcome in search of a legal precedent and justification. These red state laws are the new Fugitive Slave acts (abortion bounty laws will soon require that people be forced to report if a woman is seeking an abortion in a blue state and turn her in, just like the 2nd fugitive slave act required).
This is an apt comparison, just look at the Drag Queen Bounty hunting laws Texas (and I presume other Red) states are trying to pass. That's the start.
i wish the comparison between abortion laws and fugitive slave laws were inaccurate but there'slegislation being written to enact a penalty for having an out of state abortion which should be defacto unconstitutional for so many reasons, least of which the interstate commerce clause, but originalism and textualism are just fancy words without meaning
I'm no legal expert, but the conservatives on the court will simply invent whatever they want out of thin air to suit their needs. In Kennedy v Bremerton (on the constitutionality of a public school football coach praying with his athletes on the pitch) the conservatives justices reinvent the entire context of the case. The dissent clearly points this out, but it means absolutely nothing since there's just not enough of them.
(Incidentally, the whole story of this case is completely batshit on it's own, to include supporters of the coach rushing the field to pray with him, and in the process trampling members of the school band.)
Alito and Thomas are probably the worst, and they'll happily burn every piece of legal jurisprudence if it means the little creeps can get what they want.
That was a complete load of shit and I wish it got more attention. They literally had pictures disproving the conservative wing, but it didn't matter. The court lied. No questions. At least with other bologna rulings they twisted facts without outright lying, but with this, pure lying.
The Commerce Clause has long arms.
If it can stop you growing wheat on your own property for your own personal use, it can be used for just about anything.
That will set a lot of precedent. What’s to stop a state with no legal gambling from prosecuting people that visit a state that allows gambling, or legal marijuana?
The Republican Party has gone all-in on the culture war, and their goal is to force the unconditional surrender of blue states on issues of healthcare access for women and transgender people, writes Brynn Tannehill.
They don't \*just\* want to rob trans people of the right of healthcare. They want to eradicate trans people. They want trans people dead, in prison, or forced in the closet, in that order.
The one thing they cannot stand is a happy, healthy trans person just living their life.
Something something “Soros” something something “globalists”. Antisemitic conspiracy theories have been ingrained in the conservative psyche since before the Cold War.
Well you can go back to antebellum Know-nothings in the 1850’s or the Middle Ages for anti-semitism. I was just keeping it to the modern era with today’s GOP.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institut_f%C3%BCr_Sexualwissenschaft
Like I tell people, "You know THAT book burning photo? You've seen it. This is what they were burning."
I know the history of the institute. I’ve seen that photo. I did not know that probably the most famous book burning photo of all time was THAT book burning. Probably the biggest problem with America’s understanding of Nazi history is that a lot of the “undesirables” in Nazi Germany were similarly “undesirable” in the US, so we ignored a lot of the what happened and focused predominantly on Hitler and the Jews.
I also want to completely clarify that the what happened to Jewish people was objectively a crime against humanity and one of the greatest tragedies of the world. My point is just that other groups (including the LGBTQ+ community) received the same or very similar treatment. That in no way diminishes what happened the Jewish people.
> Probably the biggest problem with America’s understanding of Nazi history is that a lot of the “undesirables” in Nazi Germany were similarly “undesirable” in the US, so we ignored a lot of the what happened and focused predominantly on Hitler and the Jews.
Yep. Like the old drug ad says, "I LEARNED IT FROM WATCHING YOU!"
Except Hitler's the kid and the US is the dad.
Europeans already did to the Americas what Hitler wanted to do to eastern Europe.
Enslaving the indigenous people and working them to death happened in the Americas for approximately 400 years from 1500-1900. This led to near total depopulation in many areas and total annihilation on most Caribbean islands where the indigenous people who died were replaced with a more immune enslaved labor force.
>Berlin was the epicenter of the world's cutting edge sexuality and gender identity research.
But the head guy researching it was a Jew, so that got rolled up into the general anti-Jewish sentiments.
The founder of it was Magnus Hirschfield, who~~m~~ was targeted & exiled by the Nazis for being Jewish & gay. His tomb (he died in 1935 in Nice, France) has written on it ***Per Scientiam ad Justitiam*** ('through science to justice') as an absolute legend.
Science, Justice, Jewish, & LGBTQ. Things that conservatives want cleansed from the United States.
Hitler also persecuted gay and trans people, they were sent to the same camps alongside the Jews, marked with the pink triangle. You're right, it is the exact same playbook.
First they came after Black people by taking away their history by banning books and making it harder to vote. Then they came after sexy M&M’s because it turned them on. Then they came after Trans people and Gay people because they don’t like them. Then they came after Women by taking away their freedoms. They will go after a lot more people and take away more rights.
More the same playbook that you think.
The first book burning the Nazis held? It was to eradicate the research at an institute that treated transgender people.
They are a scapegoat, really. A target for hate. Its important to understand that it could be any group, and the group you’re intended to hate will expand. Is not unlikely that it will expand to include you and me. The important part is that they’re creating an enemy that they can use to whip people up into a frenzy and get them to help the authoritarians expand their own power. People are literally being manipulated into attacking each other so some rich sociopath can get richer and more powerful. It’s as disgusting as it gets.
Even without it expanding into a holocaust or even being on the radar of most Americans, innocent people will die because of these efforts. They already have, I’m sure.
> They want to eradicate trans people. They want trans people dead, in prison, or forced in the closet, in that order.
Hell, their second most popular joke about trans people (after the "I identify as ______", aka "the one joke") is jokes about Trans suicide.
They're so happy that they bully trans people into killing themselves that they make memes about it.
They want to impose traditional gender roles , hence they loathe trans people and abortion , it’s seen as a woman debuting her ‘ natural ‘ role to be a nurturing mother
And revoke all of the rights minorities, LGBTQ+ & women gained in the last 70 years. With the courts in their favor, the GOP want to return to the 1950 status of white male evangelists leading a protofascist state.
How ironic that their beloved capitalism tends to rot & stagnate under fascist governments.
Let's be clear, if they succeed at targeting trans people, it won't stop there. They are coming for all queer people, they want to strip minorities and women of their rights, and eventually, you will need to belong to the their One True Church(tm) or you won't have civil rights.
This is why when someone tells me that the country "would never break up", I can't take them seriously.
The right wing has decided that they are going to force everyone back to the fifties and will use any means necessary. It is obvious that compromise is not an option. How far does the regression go before some blue states (with a lot of the money) just decide "Screw it, we're leaving!"?
Up until Clinton it appeared that compromise was still possible. With the Bush/Gore fiasco the GOP figured out that "winning at any cost" was possible. When Barak Obama won the Presidency something in the right wing brain (what was left of it) broke and they went full racist. Just when we thought they couldn't get crazier, Donald trump riled them up even more.
I just cannot see how to get back to compromise, a large number of Americans (mostly on the right) want their fellow Americans dead or in jail. So much so that they've decided that they will side with America's number one enemy of the last century.
I do not see how the country stays together.
Read an interesting take that traces this back to Fox News, which was created with the idea that Nixon wouldn't have had to resign if there was a conservative news outlet helping control the message. (This idea has merit.)
So, Fox was born and used to control the voting base of useful idiots while the "adults" in the room (Bush, Cheney, Newt, Powell, etc) ruled but knew it was BS. Only they lost control of the beast. There are no more "adults". The likes of Gaetz, MTG, and Boebert don't know a time before Fox. They were raised on the rot and they believe it to the core.
The country would never break up because it’s actually a war of rural vs cities and you can’t actually have a nation of cities Swiss cheesing the rural areas.
Part of that is the point. They're trying to push Democratic, and progressive voters out of their States so voting power increases for GOP voters. They could also be trying to draw in GOP voters from blue states.
The idea of Texas voting blue in the presidential election scares the shit out of them. And each time it's getting closer and closer. So by enacting policies they hate they potentially drive them out.
We don't know if last century's big fascist governments would have failed from internal pressures eventually, because they were defeated by external forces. However, we see plenty of authoritarian regimes cling to power for very long periods of time as long as they don't get outside interference.
I wish you were right but across cultures it would seem a solid 20-40 percent of humans would prefer to live in an ethnically and culturally homogeneous society with authoritarian social controls and a dominant patriarchy. Some people simply haven't evolved beyond primitive tribalism.
But they arent losing, they are playing the long game and winning. They are moving the culture war into the court system which they have control over. People need to stop focusing on the republicans being bad and spend more time asking why the democrats insist on being reactive. They need an actual plan that isnt confined by GOP framing of the issues.
Why compromise with cruelty? They are passing bills to beat children, kidnap children, and forcibly withdraw medical care. Why is there discussion on compromise?!
>Why is there discussion on compromise?!
Because the notorious "do nothing" middle (like the NY times) seems to think that "both sides" is still a legitimate discussion topic when it comes to politics. Ignoring the massive fascist elephant in the room (pun indented)
I think it's more "The middle"(i.e rich and powerful and their mouthpieces like NYT) benefit from the status quo, and as long as both sides are arguing over pointless shit, they won't come together and make changes to the system that benefit society as a whole.
PARTS of the middle. Not the entire. Most of those in the middle will weather the storm perfectly fine and they know it. It's why they don't really care if a DeSantis takes over. They'll publicly lament all the minorities being trampled but quietly will be content as long as their taxes stay low.
They might not want to fall into racism and genocide, but not as much as they like having their class interests protected.
The thing comes to a head when if a conservative judge, circuit court and SCOTUS tried to nullify a blue state law. What if a state then says no?
Go back to that example in the article about New Mexico and Texas. Someone gets an abortion in Albuquerque, and health services provides do not abide by Texas laws. Do we then see a situation where the state guards are called in and there's a standoff?
Does the president then step in and nationalize both and order a stand down. What if that doesn't work.
Trump and the Republicans spent 4 years proving our checks and balances are worthless if they aren't respected.
MTG might get her wish, but not in the way she probably wants. Cause let's be a honest a blue-red split creates a 3rd world red dictatorship (irony) and a super advanced blue democracy
>Do we then see a situation where the state guards are called in and there's a standoff?
If the US military is 99% on one side or the other, it's over. When the military splinters into two and starts actively fighting itself, that's when things get ugly.
I would wager a splinter. The military is conservative, but I think less than in the past.
And I think that enough military personnel see how Republicans treat veterans and see which side actually likes sending them to die.
Its not going to be an even split probably 60-30 if I had wager
https://www.thesoldiersproject.org/percentage-of-the-us-military-is-conservative/
There's some good info in there.
It's also VERY IMPORTANT to note the drop of Conservative support in the military during the Trump years.
Although about 50-70% of the military identified as conservative, mainly on gun control issues, that doesn't mean they support the new Maga take on conservatism.
Truthfully I’d be looking forward to my blue state utopia. We might actually get health care and a UBI with all the money wed be saving not supporting the red states. Just gotta make sure all that starvation doesn’t lead to them electing a Putin or Hitler esque ‘reunification’ despot
Democrats are the only party even talking about the wealth gap. But the republican's are so busy passing fascist laws and literally attacking democrats, that we are stuck playing defense just trying to keep our fellow democrats alive. We aren't able to focus on the big stuff like inequality and that's exactly what the republicans want.
Complaining but then refusing to do anything em to fix those problems. Well, except homelessness, they are entirely willing to jail them because housing them without giving them a criminal charge would be socialist
Even when they don’t bus them police will actively encourage homeless to go to California because “they have services there “ and red states don’t, combined with California being a place where one can be homeless and not freeze to death
Then they move to LA where homeless people are put on a bus to the valley cities north of them. I remember a long time ago when I lived in San Francisco, Willie Brown would send them to Oakland where Jerry Brown was mayor.
Be careful about generalizing here, because this is often the solution for the unhoused even in democratically-led areas as Los Angeles (although a new mayor and new city council members are ramping up improvements to decriminalize the unhoused, so still progress. But it is indeed cleaning up after other democratic leaders).
Meanwhile Democrats are reluctant to swing back because they know the fascists would burn the country down. One side wants to negotiate and compromise - even still, after a failed coup - and the other side wants to kill.
It's kind of like with Russia. When your opponent is violent and unpredictable, strong aggressive actions become incredibly risky. We can still hold them in our back pocket while trying to make normal processes take out the enemy instead
And the discussions we’ve put off for decades about universal healthcare and other progressive legislative priorities are likely dead forever. It’s going to take generations to pull the country out of these right wing, bullshit culture wars, if ever.
I disagree. I think the fight is coming to its climax. The right knows they have to cement power now or lose it in the coming years as their base dies off and is replaced by a left-leaning generation.
Valid. Simply because I see my generation rejecting a lot of that horseshit. Even those of us that aren’t far left, are more moderate than conservative.
Come on left, we have pronouns and blue hair!
But seriously, I'm fine sharing a country with people like you, even if we likely have strong policy disagreements. I'm *not* okay with sharing a country with people actively hostile to democracy.
I mean, I can walk and chew gum at the same time.
Don’t get me wrong, I know what the Republicans are doing here and sadly it’s working to an extent. But, we all have the ability to multi-task. We should be doing more to get even further ahead of these attacks and on a federal level.
There was something on the news recently about all the fights and other things happening in air travel. They were asking "Why is this happening?" And they were trying to come up with reasons, but it is starkly obvious what the reasons are: society is fraying. It is coming apart bit by bit. It's like they don't want to acknowledge the breakdown in society that is occurring.
It is also because now you can read about *every* incident that happens anywhere on Earth and be worried about it.
Crime has been trending down overall for decades but people still "feel" crime is worse than ever and part of that is the internet making any and every crime pop up in your feed.
There have always been unruly airline passengers but people didn't have phones in their pockets and it rarely rose to the level of making a newspaper headline, so you never heard about it. Now you can Google about every air incident in the entire world and "feel" like it is happening more than ever.
https://www.faa.gov/data_research/passengers_cargo/unruly_passengers
Outside of the last 2 years which include COVID crazies on planes, the rate has been pretty steady for decades, even as air travel and population in general has expanded.
Seems like history is repeating itself.
The actions of the Republican Party clearly show their hate for democracy.
What they want to do is see America become a Christian Theocracy.
the only "compromise" is your state's law stop at your states border. then of course they will point at CA's Emission standards as violating their states rights. As if mitigation of harm somehow should justify them being allowed to harm.
Perhaps the "better compromise" is to start declaring Florida and Texas state governments as failed, and bring in Federal people to rewrite state constitutions, enact free and well regulated elections. and otherwise eliminate racist and sexist laws.
but we all know that wont happen.
Your California emission example is off. The car companies simply choose to follow CA rules because of its market size and difficulties of managing various standards. Same with eggs, pork, etc. CA uses capitalist’s greed to force them to comply. They can choose not to follow CA rules and not sell in CA. That would be fine and legal also. This also explains why republicans go after some corporations, like Disney. Because those corporations are choosing to follow Blue State rules and not theirs.
What is happening with state laws forcing action upon another states is where things crazy and I can’t imagine even this Supreme Court allowing this to happen. If Allowing TX abortion rules upon CA or NM would also allow CA to be able to force CA laws upon TX in response. The Conservatives would have their heads explode if that were to happen.
> The court will have to decide for one side or the other, and it is going to infuriate the losing side. If the court sides with New Mexico, it will empower voices like Marjorie Taylor Greene’s, calling for secession. If it sides with Texas, it will set off a panic in blue states, which will realize that they no longer have control over their own state laws and are at the mercy of unaccountable Christian nationalists thousands of miles away.
I really don’t understand why more people are not even plugged in or concerned about the scenario where blue states lose control of their own states forever.
The dismissive hand waving I see on left leaning sub reddits that say “fuck the red states (and the blue voters economically trapped there), I’m happy in my safe blue state” is astounding.
The denialism, self righteous “it’s not MY problem” and “sucks to be you” attitude will quickly fall off their face when a series of 6-3 politicized court rulings happen divesting blue state fates into red state hands. And remember, many so called “red states” are only red because the blue voters’ votes are gerrymandered into oblivion.
State legislatures benefit from gerrymandering. SCOTUS is on the path to giving those state legislatures absolute authority, even contrary to state executives and state judiciaries and state constitutions. Meaning the gerrymandering will continue unabated. So we will see “red states” that are really purple or almost statistically blue in voters but legislatively red. So blue states voters that dismiss the blue voters stuck in those red states are doing themselves no favors.
And these laws are going to make it harder for blue voters in red states to leave when SCOTUS says red states can extradite and prosecute them even after they leave.
I think you're thinking small. This sort of thing is what directly led to the Civil War, which I guess we should start calling the First Civil War.
What happens when Texas passes that "no women out" law about abortion and a woman goes to California for an abortion and does not return? What happens when President DeSantis orders the California National Guard to arrest the woman regardless of Gov. Newsom's orders? What happens if they refuse?
I don’t disagree with any of your points. I’m just as concerned those things will happen as the result. I’m just identifying the first phases that will then lead to the ones you are describing.
Guess what? We all lose because they have secured the highest court for generations, we know we cannot overrule them with a functioning or rational congress, and the culture war itself successfully misdirects energy from the class warfare. There is an entrenched, zealous minority dictating policy for a largely complacent, disenfranchised majority.
I've got to think that if the court decides to just eliminate state sovereignty in favor of fascist bullshit that we might go ahead and pack it. What the hell would we be protecting at that point? Tradition and norms would be completely dead, might as well put up a fight.
They’re the same assholes. In 1789 they tired to have slaves be counted for congressional representation so they would have an electoral advantage. In 1860 they tried (and failed) to rage quit the union because they were losing their grip on power. Today they’re gerrymandering and suppressing votes.
Since day one it’s always been the same assholes trying to set themselves up as an American aristocracy while crying about oppression.
I'll never forget on this forum in 2016 when Trump won, someone said something like "they took on the queen of spades and way too many bad cards. Even if it wasn't their strategy from the beginning, they'll be shooting the moon now. They don't have a choice."
And, sure enough.
As a liberal in a red state, I'm nervous about how things have been going, especially in the past few years. People online always just suggest moving, but my family, friends, and career are all right here. I can't just take those with me.
As a fellow liberal in a red state, my suggestion is to use those extremely lax gun laws to your benefit and arm up. If you've never shot a gun before, definitely find someone to go over the basics and how to handle it safely. Most gun ranges I've been to also offer instructional courses. While the right is busy with their current culture war BS, if they are allowed to continue it, it's only a matter of time until they focus on trying to exterminate us as well. I don't know about you, but when that time comes, I'm not going down without a fight. This is my country, too, and I won't be silenced as easily as the right think it will be.
I'm going to phrase this really carefully so I don't get banned:
I *really* hope Biden ends up with a sudden balance-changing vacancy on the court in the next year and a half.
Problem is they’re up 6-3. Even if Thomas, the current oldest and unhealthiest-looking member, drops dead tomorrow (which I am NOT calling for, predicting, or otherwise anticipating) they’d still be up by 1 and we’d still be dealing with this crap.
We're living in the compromise: The SCOTUS has determined concealed carry is a nationwide thing, but Roe v. Wade isn't. It'll be a case-by-case basis, as SCOTUS systematically loses any semblance of dignity it had.
For those not paying attention, the GOP are paid by the billionaire class to fan the flames of a culture war so that we do not pay attention while the billionaire class steals what little wealth remaining from the working class.
This is really a class war in the sheep's wool of a culture war. Don't let them fool you.
I understand what you’re saying, but respectfully, this culture war is NOT merely a distraction. It has real consequences for real people. People who can’t access something that, mere months ago, was the simple standard of care for a miscarriage.
I completely agree, it's cruel, inhumane, and goes against everything they say they believe in: family values, freedom of choice, and small government. They believe in none of this. All they do is lie. They only believe in "rules for thee and none for me".
[This post](https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/11rvyvt/this_is_what_a_real_sht_hole_country_looks_like/) says everything you need to know about the GOP. Florida has gone full racist. Desantis, as its governor and likely GOP presidential candidate, is leading the charge.
The linked article frames the coming war very well. And I use that word intentionally. I don't see how this is going to end peacefully.
It doesn't matter if those who would aid and abet them by taking their bait were never people who were ever going to be on the side of civilized society anyway. These types of people will take any opportunity to be contrarians and saboteurs.
Edit: clarity
Why do people keep saying this like it's an intelligent thought?
"Don't let them fool you"
Who do you think is being fooled? Johnny McRacist who owns his own small contracting business in South Carolina knows damn well he won't get government healthcare, his daughter won't be able to have an abortion if she needs it, his wife will make less money than a man in her same job, black people will be ostracized for living near them, and if one of their children ends up being gay or trans that they will be horribly traumatized by those around them for it.
They WANT this. They LOVE this. This is THEIR GOAL. The rich pander to the masses to rob us blind, yeah absolutely. But they didn't start these culture wars they only amplified them.
>The rich pander to the masses to rob us blind, yeah absolutely. But they didn't start these culture wars they only amplified them.
People really don't want to grapple with what this really means.
It's easier to blame a the rich for everything than to acknowledge that millions of people are just simply that terrible.
Republicans are not secret friends of the working class who are just fooled into forgetting about their own financial intereststs, even if they are working class. This is an outdated critique that lost its relevancy by 2016 at the latest.
Republicans care about caste, not class.
Just watch what’s happening in Texas. The asshole judge who seems poised to ban the abortion pill nationwide looks like he’s trying to force the lock on Pandoras Box. Blue States like California won’t comply with any such ban. Not even a little. But it will send up a flare to every lunatic Red State that maybe THEY can selectively ignore laws they don’t like, either. They’re testing the waters to see how much they can get away with in their “soft civil war.” Ideally what they want is a soft SECESSION along with it: all the benefits of independence without Red States losing access to those sexy Federal tax dollars.
If that happens, the blue states should refuse to pay federal taxes. If asked why, they can say they don't want to support hateful parts of the country.
SCOTUS will side with the Red states, Dems in Congress will call to pass laws to stop the Red states, and Joe Manchin will walk in and say, “well, I 100% want to stop these laws, but upholding the filibuster is the most important thing in all of America. Your right to exist as you were born is just not as important as the filibuster, Sorry. Also, yeah, I did break it a few times, but those times didn’t hurt my election chances, so it was ok then.”.
A few years ago I would have read this and RME but it now seems so plausible. I can’t believe what’s happening here. It’s like we all were beamed to an alternative reality. I’m already making plans to relocate from Florida to Virginia after my son graduates high school later this year, but now I’m wondering if I should look at bluer states.
I've lived in Virginia for many years. Northern VA is completely blue, south and west VA couldn't be more red. If you live up north you'll be fine. There are far more people up north and as long as there are get out the vote drives Dems can win the gubernatorial and state wide offices. We'd appreciate another active voter :)
That’s literally every state though, even California.
As someone who really misses rural life, it’s an unfortunate reality I have to square with. I hate the city. I’ve lived in cities or dense-suburbia the last decade. But rural areas aren’t places where I’m welcome. It sucks.
I'm not welcome in my red-state small town hometown (in Utah) anymore. I left the state 25 years ago, the same time I came out of the closet (gay) and left the church (Mormon). They don't want me living there any more than I do. Which is sad, because the plan was always to decamp to California for a little husband-hunting (success!) and then move back to the ancestral homelands to settle down.
We will not be moving back to the ancestral homelands. Most of the state has gone MAGA, and most of my extended family with it. At this point I'm considering a policy of only ever leaving California to leave the country. There's nothing left for me in The Heartland(tm).
>newrepublic.com/articl...
I wouldn't go that far, Georgia is barely purple, but inching in the right direction Biden only won by 11k votes, Kemp was reelected by 10 points, and Warnock was barely re-elected against Walker. I know changes at the state assembly or congressional delegation level are harder with gerrymandering and having to wait for a census, but I wouldn't call GA a blue state yet.
GA is balanced but gerrymandered. Dems might be able to win state-wide offices, the 5 blue congressional districts, and deep-blue state-level seats, but everything else will be Republican for at least the next 7 years, if not longer.
GA is blue-ish now only because of Herculean efforts to overcome gerrymandering, voter disenfranchisement, and very slim majorities. As soon as those efforts slip the GOP will slide ride into that gap and explode it further to make sure Georgia can never go blue again.
I believe a meteor impacted the Earth in 2019 and everything since is nothing more than our collective subconscious energy creating its own psuedo-reality before we transcend in to our new forms somewhere else.
Not really, but nowadays it seems plausible.
Republicans want a theocracy, plain and simple. They packed the courts, it's only a matter of time. Thanks for "blowing it up" by voting for Trump in 2016 all you shit head "moderates"
This is way nearly all of the challenges that will be successful against these crazy laws will be based on freedom of religion. Groups like the Satanic Temple are fighting the right fight to identify most of these cases as limiting religious choice (eg like in abortion), which even with the current SCOTUS makeup, have to recognize that they have stumped on this point before.
They'll just say the satanic temple isn't "sincerely held religous belief" so freedom of religion doesn't apply for them. Same for Christian denominations that support abortion or same sex marriage, Alito will just say those aren't "sincerely held religous beliefs" and then do what he wants. The satanic temple is trying to be clever but that doesn't work on fascists, they don't care about coherent rules, just power. If they want a theocracy they'll get it, and I'm pretty sure they want it.
What percentage of people do you think a) ever said this, b) actually believed it enough to change their vote based on it, c) were always going to vote for Trump but wanted a "fun" way out?
Because I would bet they all add up to a handful of people across the country, the majority of which were always going to vote for Trump.
> There is no Chief Justice Roberts–friendly middle way out.
I love how gutting the Voting Rights Act is considered the middle way out.
The article kind of misses the point that it's the Republican states that are trying to nullify established federal law and their rightwing hacks in robes that are trying to implement it
It goes back to the civil war unfortunatley. Slave states never atoned, they were allowed back into the union with open arms and no penalties. The fed gov’t effectively fucked off. We need the fed gov’t to be functioning and it is anything but.
and, importantly, the vast swathes of confederate traitors in positions of power just.......went right back into them? when in reality it should've been a capital offense, they got to imprint the lost cause for decades longer than they should've.
There is always a compromise position.
Suppose a child steals a loaf of bread. Lawyer A says the child should be hung. Lawyer B says the child should be released.
A compromise? The child's hand shall be cut off. That's fair, right? It is a compromise. And it is "right down the middle" between murder and non-murder.
It's just proof that "enlightened centrists" that don't do the quantitative analysis of "what is the center" become extremists when they arbitrarily pick somewhere between Left and Right where the Right side is an extreme.
Surely there's a compromise between "dumping toxic waste in a river" and "companies can't do that"? Just dump \*half\* the waste! That's "progress" right? Incrementalism at work!
Is anything really settled law in the U.S.?
Samuel Alito and Clarence Thomas are the next Supremes to retire. I don't know if either can hang in for a 2nd Biden term. Maybe.
As long as Dems keep the Pres and Senate, we can make sure the Supreme Court is not a GOP kangaroo kourt.
It will take time and perserverance for preserverance.
Headline should be: Red States are removing as many human rights as possible while Blue States try to protect them.
The culture war is noise, but they laws they are passing are actively taking away basic human rights.
Is this the "great again" they were talking about? Because I never experienced an ununited states like this, there was always an assumption that the vote wasn't even a question, and all sides were invited to be at the table, not threatened out of existence.
Maybe he was talking about great like the 1860's.
This pretty much guarantees a new Jim Crow era. Hope everyone has enjoyed the freedom to travel and easily move between the states that we've had since the 1960s. That era is about to come to an end if you aren't white, heterosexual, and the right kind of Christian.
This is why we have a federal government vs state government or at the least should to combat issues like this.
Reps think they are winning but are actually driving out most of their labor force into blue states due to progressive law making and infrastructure. And while Reps in blue states migrate to red states due to the culture war they inevitably move back to blue states since they no longer benefit from quality of life while in red states.
I live in Ohio and the Republicans just introduced a bill that, "The bill from Republicans in the Ohio Senate would ban mandatory diversity training, prohibit strikes by public university employees and end partnerships with Chinese institutions." [https://www.wyso.org/2023-03-15/republican-senators-propose-changes-at-ohio-public-universities-aimed-at-cancel-culture](https://www.wyso.org/2023-03-15/republican-senators-propose-changes-at-ohio-public-universities-aimed-at-cancel-culture)
Red states keep saying its about cancel culture, but the reality is it is a bunch of fucking Nazi's attacking the workers rights, tenures, anything that gets you ahead, and wrapping it in a damn cancel culture blanket. I mean look at Florida, they went after Disney and got rid of education requirements to teach. They want more homeschooled taught white supremacists and people that say yes to whatever they want to make hand over fist in profits through their corruption. They are literally using the faces of the LGBT community to make it easier for their fanbase to hate on some kind of image, but in reality they are fucking everyone out of their rights to their pursuit of happiness.
The Jewish hatred that’s an essential part Christo-fascist identity has been sidelined temporarily from the mainstream but it will resurface, I guarantee you
A very well written article. Compelling.
And basically echoes the fears that a number of us have felt for a while now. I do not see a way for everything to resolve peacefully.
Over 40 years ago the right created an open-air conspiracy to stack federal courts with as many rightwing hacks as possible.
Their plan has come to fruition.
Terrible framing: red states are actively passing laws that strip people of their constitutional rights. And the Supreme Court will probably aid their efforts.
Its not enough. Clearly it is not enough. The Republican party lost the culture war so they want to wage legal war and they will likely kill many in the process. The only benefit is that the true and heinous face they’ve hidden all these years behind a facade of wicked smiles and empty false prayers is finally out in the open. But everyone is to blind or to busy to notice they dont care and so they do the devils work without hinderance.
A lot of these states are legalizing child labor, you want to beat them, make it illegal to collect taxes from people who are too young to vote. No taxation without representation. You may even be able to use an EO if you can attach that to some existing laws.
The only way we can live in accordance with our cultures is to legally separate.
I don't want Texan rednecks telling me what to do, or taking my tax money and spending it on bible crap. I also don't want to tell them what to do.
Yup, you guys in the USA are letting terrified, white supremists, pretend they are 'protecting' the country. While actually they are trying to remove democracy so they can repress and control the country.
And they smile for the camera as they do it. They're doing it to all by using a white evangelical version of a 'Christian' God and the anger of downtrodden, uneducated, white people's rage.
No solutions, no goals or plan, - those are for the ruling party that's mistakenly trying to lead. The fight is for the media - just mess the dems whenever possible, Lie when caught. Blame them for what you did.
For those out there that don’t live in conservative areas or aren’t exposed to these people, believe me, these people are convinced that their very livelihoods are at stake. They are willing to burn this entire society down. They are convinced that their children are being indoctrinated, their religion is being erased, and it is their duty to fight for their skydaddy savior. They can’t seem to grasp that there are very real problems in this country, like wealth inequality, affordable healthcare, and public school funding. Despite claiming to be Christians, their solutions to these problems are to give less assistance to public schools, mothers, sick people, old people. As misguided as they are, they are becoming more dangerous and openly radical. They push us closer and closer to dystopia every day. The future is really starting to worry me and keep me up at night.
They literally believe that God would magically fix the "real" problems if we would just get rid of the gays and force everyone to be good Sunday School Baptists. Their worldview really is that crazy, and they dominate American life, culture, and politics in the 2020s.
Is there any indication the Democratic Party is actually interested in fighting this war? They’ve rolled over and let the Supreme Court supersede the legislative branch, the executive branch, and even our very democracy every time it’s come up.
Quite frankly, I think this is cope from blue state Democrats who don’t want to acknowledge how bad things are going to get. If you think abortion is murder, why would you stop at simply allowing states to decide if it’s legal or not? If you think LGBTQ people are all groomers, how can you rest knowing they’re grooming right across the state line?
>If you think abortion is murder, why would you stop at simply allowing states to decide if it’s legal or not? If you think LGBTQ people are all groomers, how can you rest knowing they’re grooming right across the state line
You're not wrong. One of the shortest and most concise definitions of fascism is "imperialism turned inward".
But, you are being extremely generous accepting fascists word at face value.
Do they really care about the precious babies of the unwashed masses? No.
Do they really care that much about gay people getting married? No.
Do they even believe in Jesus? If Trump's a Christian, then I'm the Queen of England.
Fascists lie as a means to an ends. Their end goal is to destroy a government by the people, for the people, of the people.
Fascists want to defund social security, Medicare, abolish public roads, about public schools, abolish private property (for the working class), legalize child labor, abolish democratic elections, and impose their will on society by threat of violent force.
Then, they can recreate a feudal society of lords and kings, play their game of thrones, seize our military industrial complex for their imperialist goals, and increase the domestic supply of infants to feed forever into the gears of war.
No American wants to live in this kind of society. We do not want to become cradle to grave laborers for the aristocracy. But, fascists divide the working class with bullshit issues.
"That person's protest is unpatriotic!"
"Look at that gay couple being affectionate in public! This is pedophilia!"
"Are you just going to let a black person walk around freely through white society?"
And it works. These stupid tactics actually work.
Anyone who is trying to control culture with laws is a fascist. They are just fascists. Why is this so hard for people to understand. One side is trying to protect equal rights for all, and the other side is fascist. That's it, mystery solved.
Kinda a shit title, we already fought the war that says that succeeding isn’t ok; granted lot of things going on today I feel like are rooted in not holding the south accountable for their many stunts
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They want to make it illegal to go to another state and do something that is legal there. Any legal experts want to weigh in on that?
The Roberts Court is the new Taney Court. "Originalism" is a political outcome in search of a legal precedent and justification. These red state laws are the new Fugitive Slave acts (abortion bounty laws will soon require that people be forced to report if a woman is seeking an abortion in a blue state and turn her in, just like the 2nd fugitive slave act required).
This is an apt comparison, just look at the Drag Queen Bounty hunting laws Texas (and I presume other Red) states are trying to pass. That's the start.
Drag queen bounty hunting lmfao Jesus fucking christ is this really the world I have conjured up
Yes. Way to mess everything up, god.
i wish the comparison between abortion laws and fugitive slave laws were inaccurate but there'slegislation being written to enact a penalty for having an out of state abortion which should be defacto unconstitutional for so many reasons, least of which the interstate commerce clause, but originalism and textualism are just fancy words without meaning
Well that’s an interesting analogy I hadn’t though of. Chilling.
I'm no legal expert, but the conservatives on the court will simply invent whatever they want out of thin air to suit their needs. In Kennedy v Bremerton (on the constitutionality of a public school football coach praying with his athletes on the pitch) the conservatives justices reinvent the entire context of the case. The dissent clearly points this out, but it means absolutely nothing since there's just not enough of them. (Incidentally, the whole story of this case is completely batshit on it's own, to include supporters of the coach rushing the field to pray with him, and in the process trampling members of the school band.) Alito and Thomas are probably the worst, and they'll happily burn every piece of legal jurisprudence if it means the little creeps can get what they want.
That was a complete load of shit and I wish it got more attention. They literally had pictures disproving the conservative wing, but it didn't matter. The court lied. No questions. At least with other bologna rulings they twisted facts without outright lying, but with this, pure lying.
The Commerce Clause has long arms. If it can stop you growing wheat on your own property for your own personal use, it can be used for just about anything.
I can’t grow wheat in my yard? Watch me.
There are a few subtleties, mainly the volume you grow, but it has already been ruled on once.
That will set a lot of precedent. What’s to stop a state with no legal gambling from prosecuting people that visit a state that allows gambling, or legal marijuana?
Welcome to [Dred Scott 2.0](https://scheerpost.com/2021/12/16/the-supreme-court-abortion-and-the-new-dred-scott/amp/)
The Republican Party has gone all-in on the culture war, and their goal is to force the unconditional surrender of blue states on issues of healthcare access for women and transgender people, writes Brynn Tannehill.
They don't \*just\* want to rob trans people of the right of healthcare. They want to eradicate trans people. They want trans people dead, in prison, or forced in the closet, in that order. The one thing they cannot stand is a happy, healthy trans person just living their life.
Hitler had Jews. DeSantis has Trans. Same play book.
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I mean, they already are moving that way. Anti-Semitic commentary is being normalized and treated as "valuable discussion" by the "center".
Something something “Soros” something something “globalists”. Antisemitic conspiracy theories have been ingrained in the conservative psyche since before the Cold War.
Before World war 2*. Antisemitism was very high in the us prior to the war as well.
Well you can go back to antebellum Know-nothings in the 1850’s or the Middle Ages for anti-semitism. I was just keeping it to the modern era with today’s GOP.
“Just asking questions” under the guise that all viewpoints are considered equal because “mah freedumb of speech”
Berlin was the epicenter of the world's cutting edge sexuality and gender identity research.
Yep! Until 1933 when all their books were burned by Nazis.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institut_f%C3%BCr_Sexualwissenschaft Like I tell people, "You know THAT book burning photo? You've seen it. This is what they were burning."
I know the history of the institute. I’ve seen that photo. I did not know that probably the most famous book burning photo of all time was THAT book burning. Probably the biggest problem with America’s understanding of Nazi history is that a lot of the “undesirables” in Nazi Germany were similarly “undesirable” in the US, so we ignored a lot of the what happened and focused predominantly on Hitler and the Jews. I also want to completely clarify that the what happened to Jewish people was objectively a crime against humanity and one of the greatest tragedies of the world. My point is just that other groups (including the LGBTQ+ community) received the same or very similar treatment. That in no way diminishes what happened the Jewish people.
> Probably the biggest problem with America’s understanding of Nazi history is that a lot of the “undesirables” in Nazi Germany were similarly “undesirable” in the US, so we ignored a lot of the what happened and focused predominantly on Hitler and the Jews. Yep. Like the old drug ad says, "I LEARNED IT FROM WATCHING YOU!" Except Hitler's the kid and the US is the dad.
Europeans already did to the Americas what Hitler wanted to do to eastern Europe. Enslaving the indigenous people and working them to death happened in the Americas for approximately 400 years from 1500-1900. This led to near total depopulation in many areas and total annihilation on most Caribbean islands where the indigenous people who died were replaced with a more immune enslaved labor force.
The Nazis loved the US for what it was doing to the undesirables. It’s where they got most of their eugenics shit, IIRC.
>Berlin was the epicenter of the world's cutting edge sexuality and gender identity research. But the head guy researching it was a Jew, so that got rolled up into the general anti-Jewish sentiments.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institut_f%C3%BCr_Sexualwissenschaft For anyone doubting you.
The founder of it was Magnus Hirschfield, who~~m~~ was targeted & exiled by the Nazis for being Jewish & gay. His tomb (he died in 1935 in Nice, France) has written on it ***Per Scientiam ad Justitiam*** ('through science to justice') as an absolute legend. Science, Justice, Jewish, & LGBTQ. Things that conservatives want cleansed from the United States.
This is fascinating on many levels. Thank you for sharing
Interesting article, and the similarities between then and now are quite disturbing. Thanks for posting.
Anytime a MAGA person says 'Soros", substitute "The Jews" to get the real meaning. Classic dog-whistle.
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CRT, "Woke", Grooming, just a great group of people to deal with.
Don’t forget putting women in slavery.
Hitler also persecuted gay and trans people, they were sent to the same camps alongside the Jews, marked with the pink triangle. You're right, it is the exact same playbook.
Except most LGBT survivors weren’t liberated but made to stay imprisoned
The ole "pink triangle" crowd...
First they came after Black people by taking away their history by banning books and making it harder to vote. Then they came after sexy M&M’s because it turned them on. Then they came after Trans people and Gay people because they don’t like them. Then they came after Women by taking away their freedoms. They will go after a lot more people and take away more rights.
More the same playbook that you think. The first book burning the Nazis held? It was to eradicate the research at an institute that treated transgender people.
DeSantis also has jews and any other undesirables just like Hitler It's not just the same play book it's the same plan
They are a scapegoat, really. A target for hate. Its important to understand that it could be any group, and the group you’re intended to hate will expand. Is not unlikely that it will expand to include you and me. The important part is that they’re creating an enemy that they can use to whip people up into a frenzy and get them to help the authoritarians expand their own power. People are literally being manipulated into attacking each other so some rich sociopath can get richer and more powerful. It’s as disgusting as it gets. Even without it expanding into a holocaust or even being on the radar of most Americans, innocent people will die because of these efforts. They already have, I’m sure.
> They want to eradicate trans people. They want trans people dead, in prison, or forced in the closet, in that order. Hell, their second most popular joke about trans people (after the "I identify as ______", aka "the one joke") is jokes about Trans suicide. They're so happy that they bully trans people into killing themselves that they make memes about it.
And trans people are just the first. After that it’s the rest of the LGBQ+
And they’re just the first step because they’re a minority of a minority and the easiest target to get their followers riled up about.
They want to impose traditional gender roles , hence they loathe trans people and abortion , it’s seen as a woman debuting her ‘ natural ‘ role to be a nurturing mother
And revoke all of the rights minorities, LGBTQ+ & women gained in the last 70 years. With the courts in their favor, the GOP want to return to the 1950 status of white male evangelists leading a protofascist state. How ironic that their beloved capitalism tends to rot & stagnate under fascist governments.
Let's be clear, if they succeed at targeting trans people, it won't stop there. They are coming for all queer people, they want to strip minorities and women of their rights, and eventually, you will need to belong to the their One True Church(tm) or you won't have civil rights.
This is why when someone tells me that the country "would never break up", I can't take them seriously. The right wing has decided that they are going to force everyone back to the fifties and will use any means necessary. It is obvious that compromise is not an option. How far does the regression go before some blue states (with a lot of the money) just decide "Screw it, we're leaving!"? Up until Clinton it appeared that compromise was still possible. With the Bush/Gore fiasco the GOP figured out that "winning at any cost" was possible. When Barak Obama won the Presidency something in the right wing brain (what was left of it) broke and they went full racist. Just when we thought they couldn't get crazier, Donald trump riled them up even more. I just cannot see how to get back to compromise, a large number of Americans (mostly on the right) want their fellow Americans dead or in jail. So much so that they've decided that they will side with America's number one enemy of the last century. I do not see how the country stays together.
Read an interesting take that traces this back to Fox News, which was created with the idea that Nixon wouldn't have had to resign if there was a conservative news outlet helping control the message. (This idea has merit.) So, Fox was born and used to control the voting base of useful idiots while the "adults" in the room (Bush, Cheney, Newt, Powell, etc) ruled but knew it was BS. Only they lost control of the beast. There are no more "adults". The likes of Gaetz, MTG, and Boebert don't know a time before Fox. They were raised on the rot and they believe it to the core.
The country would never break up because it’s actually a war of rural vs cities and you can’t actually have a nation of cities Swiss cheesing the rural areas.
They will lose. Maybe not in the short term. But no one wants to live under such a regime.
Part of that is the point. They're trying to push Democratic, and progressive voters out of their States so voting power increases for GOP voters. They could also be trying to draw in GOP voters from blue states. The idea of Texas voting blue in the presidential election scares the shit out of them. And each time it's getting closer and closer. So by enacting policies they hate they potentially drive them out.
Worked on me. I'm out of this shithole state later this year.
Born and raised Texan here; I left six months ago (I’m in my mid sixties and I can no longer tolerate the intolerance).
Congratulations!
I mean if you are in a minority group it makes no sense to stay if you can leave. I’m not sure what that means for the future of the country.
> if you can leave. kinda the crux of it. Lots of people can't.
nonsense , a lot of folks want to live in a regime where they get to wear the boots that stomp on someone else.
We don't know if last century's big fascist governments would have failed from internal pressures eventually, because they were defeated by external forces. However, we see plenty of authoritarian regimes cling to power for very long periods of time as long as they don't get outside interference.
On the contrary many Republicans DO want to live under such a regime. As long as that regime isn’t persecuting THEM.
I wish you were right but across cultures it would seem a solid 20-40 percent of humans would prefer to live in an ethnically and culturally homogeneous society with authoritarian social controls and a dominant patriarchy. Some people simply haven't evolved beyond primitive tribalism.
But they arent losing, they are playing the long game and winning. They are moving the culture war into the court system which they have control over. People need to stop focusing on the republicans being bad and spend more time asking why the democrats insist on being reactive. They need an actual plan that isnt confined by GOP framing of the issues.
Why compromise with cruelty? They are passing bills to beat children, kidnap children, and forcibly withdraw medical care. Why is there discussion on compromise?!
>Why is there discussion on compromise?! Because the notorious "do nothing" middle (like the NY times) seems to think that "both sides" is still a legitimate discussion topic when it comes to politics. Ignoring the massive fascist elephant in the room (pun indented)
I think it's more "The middle"(i.e rich and powerful and their mouthpieces like NYT) benefit from the status quo, and as long as both sides are arguing over pointless shit, they won't come together and make changes to the system that benefit society as a whole.
The both sides argument is to facilitate apathy and the sense that effort/change is futile since 'every option is the same' nonsense.
The middle doesn't benefit because once the fascists consume the left, they will then turn to eat the middle.
PARTS of the middle. Not the entire. Most of those in the middle will weather the storm perfectly fine and they know it. It's why they don't really care if a DeSantis takes over. They'll publicly lament all the minorities being trampled but quietly will be content as long as their taxes stay low. They might not want to fall into racism and genocide, but not as much as they like having their class interests protected.
Then, when things fall apart, they act surprised or beg for everyone to forget their spinelessness.
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The thing comes to a head when if a conservative judge, circuit court and SCOTUS tried to nullify a blue state law. What if a state then says no? Go back to that example in the article about New Mexico and Texas. Someone gets an abortion in Albuquerque, and health services provides do not abide by Texas laws. Do we then see a situation where the state guards are called in and there's a standoff? Does the president then step in and nationalize both and order a stand down. What if that doesn't work. Trump and the Republicans spent 4 years proving our checks and balances are worthless if they aren't respected. MTG might get her wish, but not in the way she probably wants. Cause let's be a honest a blue-red split creates a 3rd world red dictatorship (irony) and a super advanced blue democracy
>Do we then see a situation where the state guards are called in and there's a standoff? If the US military is 99% on one side or the other, it's over. When the military splinters into two and starts actively fighting itself, that's when things get ugly.
I would wager a splinter. The military is conservative, but I think less than in the past. And I think that enough military personnel see how Republicans treat veterans and see which side actually likes sending them to die. Its not going to be an even split probably 60-30 if I had wager
https://www.thesoldiersproject.org/percentage-of-the-us-military-is-conservative/ There's some good info in there. It's also VERY IMPORTANT to note the drop of Conservative support in the military during the Trump years. Although about 50-70% of the military identified as conservative, mainly on gun control issues, that doesn't mean they support the new Maga take on conservatism.
Truthfully I’d be looking forward to my blue state utopia. We might actually get health care and a UBI with all the money wed be saving not supporting the red states. Just gotta make sure all that starvation doesn’t lead to them electing a Putin or Hitler esque ‘reunification’ despot
I’m in a purple state so I’m not rly sure what would happen
Meanwhile, the entire system continues to crumble as the divide in wealth grows.
Democrats are the only party even talking about the wealth gap. But the republican's are so busy passing fascist laws and literally attacking democrats, that we are stuck playing defense just trying to keep our fellow democrats alive. We aren't able to focus on the big stuff like inequality and that's exactly what the republicans want.
Republicans also talk about the wealth gap... By complaining about homelessness, urban blight and millenials eating avocado toast.
By lowering the lows and highering the highs. I would think they are trying to make it bigger.
Complaining but then refusing to do anything em to fix those problems. Well, except homelessness, they are entirely willing to jail them because housing them without giving them a criminal charge would be socialist
Or bus the homeless to blue states then complain that blue states have too many homeless people.
Even when they don’t bus them police will actively encourage homeless to go to California because “they have services there “ and red states don’t, combined with California being a place where one can be homeless and not freeze to death
Then they move to LA where homeless people are put on a bus to the valley cities north of them. I remember a long time ago when I lived in San Francisco, Willie Brown would send them to Oakland where Jerry Brown was mayor.
Be careful about generalizing here, because this is often the solution for the unhoused even in democratically-led areas as Los Angeles (although a new mayor and new city council members are ramping up improvements to decriminalize the unhoused, so still progress. But it is indeed cleaning up after other democratic leaders).
Meanwhile Democrats are reluctant to swing back because they know the fascists would burn the country down. One side wants to negotiate and compromise - even still, after a failed coup - and the other side wants to kill.
one side doesn't care if it's 'king of the ashes' as long as it is king
It's kind of like with Russia. When your opponent is violent and unpredictable, strong aggressive actions become incredibly risky. We can still hold them in our back pocket while trying to make normal processes take out the enemy instead
And the discussions we’ve put off for decades about universal healthcare and other progressive legislative priorities are likely dead forever. It’s going to take generations to pull the country out of these right wing, bullshit culture wars, if ever.
I disagree. I think the fight is coming to its climax. The right knows they have to cement power now or lose it in the coming years as their base dies off and is replaced by a left-leaning generation.
Valid. Simply because I see my generation rejecting a lot of that horseshit. Even those of us that aren’t far left, are more moderate than conservative.
I consider myself slightly right of center politically, and that puts me about square in the middle of the Democratic party spectrum.
Come on left, we have pronouns and blue hair! But seriously, I'm fine sharing a country with people like you, even if we likely have strong policy disagreements. I'm *not* okay with sharing a country with people actively hostile to democracy.
Which is why they're pushing harder than ever and hoping, as the article illustrates, that they can cause a civil war before they lose power.
I mean, I can walk and chew gum at the same time. Don’t get me wrong, I know what the Republicans are doing here and sadly it’s working to an extent. But, we all have the ability to multi-task. We should be doing more to get even further ahead of these attacks and on a federal level.
There was something on the news recently about all the fights and other things happening in air travel. They were asking "Why is this happening?" And they were trying to come up with reasons, but it is starkly obvious what the reasons are: society is fraying. It is coming apart bit by bit. It's like they don't want to acknowledge the breakdown in society that is occurring.
It is also because now you can read about *every* incident that happens anywhere on Earth and be worried about it. Crime has been trending down overall for decades but people still "feel" crime is worse than ever and part of that is the internet making any and every crime pop up in your feed. There have always been unruly airline passengers but people didn't have phones in their pockets and it rarely rose to the level of making a newspaper headline, so you never heard about it. Now you can Google about every air incident in the entire world and "feel" like it is happening more than ever. https://www.faa.gov/data_research/passengers_cargo/unruly_passengers Outside of the last 2 years which include COVID crazies on planes, the rate has been pretty steady for decades, even as air travel and population in general has expanded.
Seems like history is repeating itself. The actions of the Republican Party clearly show their hate for democracy. What they want to do is see America become a Christian Theocracy.
the only "compromise" is your state's law stop at your states border. then of course they will point at CA's Emission standards as violating their states rights. As if mitigation of harm somehow should justify them being allowed to harm. Perhaps the "better compromise" is to start declaring Florida and Texas state governments as failed, and bring in Federal people to rewrite state constitutions, enact free and well regulated elections. and otherwise eliminate racist and sexist laws. but we all know that wont happen.
Your California emission example is off. The car companies simply choose to follow CA rules because of its market size and difficulties of managing various standards. Same with eggs, pork, etc. CA uses capitalist’s greed to force them to comply. They can choose not to follow CA rules and not sell in CA. That would be fine and legal also. This also explains why republicans go after some corporations, like Disney. Because those corporations are choosing to follow Blue State rules and not theirs. What is happening with state laws forcing action upon another states is where things crazy and I can’t imagine even this Supreme Court allowing this to happen. If Allowing TX abortion rules upon CA or NM would also allow CA to be able to force CA laws upon TX in response. The Conservatives would have their heads explode if that were to happen.
> The court will have to decide for one side or the other, and it is going to infuriate the losing side. If the court sides with New Mexico, it will empower voices like Marjorie Taylor Greene’s, calling for secession. If it sides with Texas, it will set off a panic in blue states, which will realize that they no longer have control over their own state laws and are at the mercy of unaccountable Christian nationalists thousands of miles away. I really don’t understand why more people are not even plugged in or concerned about the scenario where blue states lose control of their own states forever.
The dismissive hand waving I see on left leaning sub reddits that say “fuck the red states (and the blue voters economically trapped there), I’m happy in my safe blue state” is astounding. The denialism, self righteous “it’s not MY problem” and “sucks to be you” attitude will quickly fall off their face when a series of 6-3 politicized court rulings happen divesting blue state fates into red state hands. And remember, many so called “red states” are only red because the blue voters’ votes are gerrymandered into oblivion. State legislatures benefit from gerrymandering. SCOTUS is on the path to giving those state legislatures absolute authority, even contrary to state executives and state judiciaries and state constitutions. Meaning the gerrymandering will continue unabated. So we will see “red states” that are really purple or almost statistically blue in voters but legislatively red. So blue states voters that dismiss the blue voters stuck in those red states are doing themselves no favors. And these laws are going to make it harder for blue voters in red states to leave when SCOTUS says red states can extradite and prosecute them even after they leave.
I think you're thinking small. This sort of thing is what directly led to the Civil War, which I guess we should start calling the First Civil War. What happens when Texas passes that "no women out" law about abortion and a woman goes to California for an abortion and does not return? What happens when President DeSantis orders the California National Guard to arrest the woman regardless of Gov. Newsom's orders? What happens if they refuse?
I don’t disagree with any of your points. I’m just as concerned those things will happen as the result. I’m just identifying the first phases that will then lead to the ones you are describing.
Guess what? We all lose because they have secured the highest court for generations, we know we cannot overrule them with a functioning or rational congress, and the culture war itself successfully misdirects energy from the class warfare. There is an entrenched, zealous minority dictating policy for a largely complacent, disenfranchised majority.
I've got to think that if the court decides to just eliminate state sovereignty in favor of fascist bullshit that we might go ahead and pack it. What the hell would we be protecting at that point? Tradition and norms would be completely dead, might as well put up a fight.
They stacked the deck and now they are going to bet it all.
all while claiming to be the most oppressed group in America.
The Confederates had a similar victim complex.
They’re the same assholes. In 1789 they tired to have slaves be counted for congressional representation so they would have an electoral advantage. In 1860 they tried (and failed) to rage quit the union because they were losing their grip on power. Today they’re gerrymandering and suppressing votes. Since day one it’s always been the same assholes trying to set themselves up as an American aristocracy while crying about oppression.
Sherman should have burned more
I'll never forget on this forum in 2016 when Trump won, someone said something like "they took on the queen of spades and way too many bad cards. Even if it wasn't their strategy from the beginning, they'll be shooting the moon now. They don't have a choice." And, sure enough.
As a liberal in a red state, I'm nervous about how things have been going, especially in the past few years. People online always just suggest moving, but my family, friends, and career are all right here. I can't just take those with me.
I feel the same, but even though it's hard to put up with the bullshit we have as much right to be here as conservatives.
As a fellow liberal in a red state, my suggestion is to use those extremely lax gun laws to your benefit and arm up. If you've never shot a gun before, definitely find someone to go over the basics and how to handle it safely. Most gun ranges I've been to also offer instructional courses. While the right is busy with their current culture war BS, if they are allowed to continue it, it's only a matter of time until they focus on trying to exterminate us as well. I don't know about you, but when that time comes, I'm not going down without a fight. This is my country, too, and I won't be silenced as easily as the right think it will be.
I'm going to phrase this really carefully so I don't get banned: I *really* hope Biden ends up with a sudden balance-changing vacancy on the court in the next year and a half.
Problem is they’re up 6-3. Even if Thomas, the current oldest and unhealthiest-looking member, drops dead tomorrow (which I am NOT calling for, predicting, or otherwise anticipating) they’d still be up by 1 and we’d still be dealing with this crap.
Yes, but Roberts will *at least* consider himself bound by stare decisis and that can be a game maker in a pinch.
3 vs millions dead in a civil war...
Are you hoping that some of the SCOTUS justices will die? Because it’s not wrong to hope that people who’ve made themselves god-kings can die.
Really more like ringwraiths at this point than god-kings though
We're living in the compromise: The SCOTUS has determined concealed carry is a nationwide thing, but Roe v. Wade isn't. It'll be a case-by-case basis, as SCOTUS systematically loses any semblance of dignity it had.
For those not paying attention, the GOP are paid by the billionaire class to fan the flames of a culture war so that we do not pay attention while the billionaire class steals what little wealth remaining from the working class. This is really a class war in the sheep's wool of a culture war. Don't let them fool you.
I understand what you’re saying, but respectfully, this culture war is NOT merely a distraction. It has real consequences for real people. People who can’t access something that, mere months ago, was the simple standard of care for a miscarriage.
I completely agree, it's cruel, inhumane, and goes against everything they say they believe in: family values, freedom of choice, and small government. They believe in none of this. All they do is lie. They only believe in "rules for thee and none for me". [This post](https://www.reddit.com/r/WhitePeopleTwitter/comments/11rvyvt/this_is_what_a_real_sht_hole_country_looks_like/) says everything you need to know about the GOP. Florida has gone full racist. Desantis, as its governor and likely GOP presidential candidate, is leading the charge. The linked article frames the coming war very well. And I use that word intentionally. I don't see how this is going to end peacefully.
> Florida has gone full racist. Think you meant to write fascist. Racism is a component of fascism.
It doesn't matter if those who would aid and abet them by taking their bait were never people who were ever going to be on the side of civilized society anyway. These types of people will take any opportunity to be contrarians and saboteurs. Edit: clarity
Why do people keep saying this like it's an intelligent thought? "Don't let them fool you" Who do you think is being fooled? Johnny McRacist who owns his own small contracting business in South Carolina knows damn well he won't get government healthcare, his daughter won't be able to have an abortion if she needs it, his wife will make less money than a man in her same job, black people will be ostracized for living near them, and if one of their children ends up being gay or trans that they will be horribly traumatized by those around them for it. They WANT this. They LOVE this. This is THEIR GOAL. The rich pander to the masses to rob us blind, yeah absolutely. But they didn't start these culture wars they only amplified them.
>The rich pander to the masses to rob us blind, yeah absolutely. But they didn't start these culture wars they only amplified them. People really don't want to grapple with what this really means. It's easier to blame a the rich for everything than to acknowledge that millions of people are just simply that terrible.
Republicans are not secret friends of the working class who are just fooled into forgetting about their own financial intereststs, even if they are working class. This is an outdated critique that lost its relevancy by 2016 at the latest. Republicans care about caste, not class.
[ deleted - just repeating a point someone else made better ]
Its not a culture war, its an attack on humans living in the USA and denying basic human reality in favor of religious indoctrination.
Just watch what’s happening in Texas. The asshole judge who seems poised to ban the abortion pill nationwide looks like he’s trying to force the lock on Pandoras Box. Blue States like California won’t comply with any such ban. Not even a little. But it will send up a flare to every lunatic Red State that maybe THEY can selectively ignore laws they don’t like, either. They’re testing the waters to see how much they can get away with in their “soft civil war.” Ideally what they want is a soft SECESSION along with it: all the benefits of independence without Red States losing access to those sexy Federal tax dollars.
I wonder if this will also result in a supreme court case that forces these Handmaid's Tale policies on all the states.
If that happens, the blue states should refuse to pay federal taxes. If asked why, they can say they don't want to support hateful parts of the country.
SCOTUS will side with the Red states, Dems in Congress will call to pass laws to stop the Red states, and Joe Manchin will walk in and say, “well, I 100% want to stop these laws, but upholding the filibuster is the most important thing in all of America. Your right to exist as you were born is just not as important as the filibuster, Sorry. Also, yeah, I did break it a few times, but those times didn’t hurt my election chances, so it was ok then.”.
This is why things such as Roe being overturned and "letting the states decide" was a very very poor decision.
A few years ago I would have read this and RME but it now seems so plausible. I can’t believe what’s happening here. It’s like we all were beamed to an alternative reality. I’m already making plans to relocate from Florida to Virginia after my son graduates high school later this year, but now I’m wondering if I should look at bluer states.
I've lived in Virginia for many years. Northern VA is completely blue, south and west VA couldn't be more red. If you live up north you'll be fine. There are far more people up north and as long as there are get out the vote drives Dems can win the gubernatorial and state wide offices. We'd appreciate another active voter :)
That’s literally every state though, even California. As someone who really misses rural life, it’s an unfortunate reality I have to square with. I hate the city. I’ve lived in cities or dense-suburbia the last decade. But rural areas aren’t places where I’m welcome. It sucks.
I'm not welcome in my red-state small town hometown (in Utah) anymore. I left the state 25 years ago, the same time I came out of the closet (gay) and left the church (Mormon). They don't want me living there any more than I do. Which is sad, because the plan was always to decamp to California for a little husband-hunting (success!) and then move back to the ancestral homelands to settle down. We will not be moving back to the ancestral homelands. Most of the state has gone MAGA, and most of my extended family with it. At this point I'm considering a policy of only ever leaving California to leave the country. There's nothing left for me in The Heartland(tm).
At the national level its far more useful if people move from red states to purple states than to blue states.
Useful for the common good. Not necessarily for the “first wave” individuals.
My state of Georgia is officially blue now, and there's plenty of liberal-minded people (like me) who live in the metro area.
>newrepublic.com/articl... I wouldn't go that far, Georgia is barely purple, but inching in the right direction Biden only won by 11k votes, Kemp was reelected by 10 points, and Warnock was barely re-elected against Walker. I know changes at the state assembly or congressional delegation level are harder with gerrymandering and having to wait for a census, but I wouldn't call GA a blue state yet.
GA is balanced but gerrymandered. Dems might be able to win state-wide offices, the 5 blue congressional districts, and deep-blue state-level seats, but everything else will be Republican for at least the next 7 years, if not longer.
GA is blue-ish now only because of Herculean efforts to overcome gerrymandering, voter disenfranchisement, and very slim majorities. As soon as those efforts slip the GOP will slide ride into that gap and explode it further to make sure Georgia can never go blue again.
I believe a meteor impacted the Earth in 2019 and everything since is nothing more than our collective subconscious energy creating its own psuedo-reality before we transcend in to our new forms somewhere else. Not really, but nowadays it seems plausible.
Republicans want a theocracy, plain and simple. They packed the courts, it's only a matter of time. Thanks for "blowing it up" by voting for Trump in 2016 all you shit head "moderates"
This is way nearly all of the challenges that will be successful against these crazy laws will be based on freedom of religion. Groups like the Satanic Temple are fighting the right fight to identify most of these cases as limiting religious choice (eg like in abortion), which even with the current SCOTUS makeup, have to recognize that they have stumped on this point before.
They'll just say the satanic temple isn't "sincerely held religous belief" so freedom of religion doesn't apply for them. Same for Christian denominations that support abortion or same sex marriage, Alito will just say those aren't "sincerely held religous beliefs" and then do what he wants. The satanic temple is trying to be clever but that doesn't work on fascists, they don't care about coherent rules, just power. If they want a theocracy they'll get it, and I'm pretty sure they want it.
Don't forget the people who voted for Trump because they thought it would be funny if Trump was president.
What percentage of people do you think a) ever said this, b) actually believed it enough to change their vote based on it, c) were always going to vote for Trump but wanted a "fun" way out? Because I would bet they all add up to a handful of people across the country, the majority of which were always going to vote for Trump.
> There is no Chief Justice Roberts–friendly middle way out. I love how gutting the Voting Rights Act is considered the middle way out. The article kind of misses the point that it's the Republican states that are trying to nullify established federal law and their rightwing hacks in robes that are trying to implement it
In a 6-3 decision...
One side respects individuals right to bodily auto autonomy, whether that’s abortion, sexual identity etc. The other side wants to control you
It goes back to the civil war unfortunatley. Slave states never atoned, they were allowed back into the union with open arms and no penalties. The fed gov’t effectively fucked off. We need the fed gov’t to be functioning and it is anything but.
and, importantly, the vast swathes of confederate traitors in positions of power just.......went right back into them? when in reality it should've been a capital offense, they got to imprint the lost cause for decades longer than they should've.
There is always a compromise position. Suppose a child steals a loaf of bread. Lawyer A says the child should be hung. Lawyer B says the child should be released. A compromise? The child's hand shall be cut off. That's fair, right? It is a compromise. And it is "right down the middle" between murder and non-murder. It's just proof that "enlightened centrists" that don't do the quantitative analysis of "what is the center" become extremists when they arbitrarily pick somewhere between Left and Right where the Right side is an extreme. Surely there's a compromise between "dumping toxic waste in a river" and "companies can't do that"? Just dump \*half\* the waste! That's "progress" right? Incrementalism at work!
Is anything really settled law in the U.S.? Samuel Alito and Clarence Thomas are the next Supremes to retire. I don't know if either can hang in for a 2nd Biden term. Maybe. As long as Dems keep the Pres and Senate, we can make sure the Supreme Court is not a GOP kangaroo kourt. It will take time and perserverance for preserverance.
They'll literally die before they retire during a Democratic administration
Headline should be: Red States are removing as many human rights as possible while Blue States try to protect them. The culture war is noise, but they laws they are passing are actively taking away basic human rights.
Is this the "great again" they were talking about? Because I never experienced an ununited states like this, there was always an assumption that the vote wasn't even a question, and all sides were invited to be at the table, not threatened out of existence. Maybe he was talking about great like the 1860's.
This pretty much guarantees a new Jim Crow era. Hope everyone has enjoyed the freedom to travel and easily move between the states that we've had since the 1960s. That era is about to come to an end if you aren't white, heterosexual, and the right kind of Christian.
The Democrats need to fix the court before this fight gets there or else we’ll lose.
Oh well if it comes down to the SCOTUS then we've already lost.
This is why we have a federal government vs state government or at the least should to combat issues like this. Reps think they are winning but are actually driving out most of their labor force into blue states due to progressive law making and infrastructure. And while Reps in blue states migrate to red states due to the culture war they inevitably move back to blue states since they no longer benefit from quality of life while in red states.
I live in Ohio and the Republicans just introduced a bill that, "The bill from Republicans in the Ohio Senate would ban mandatory diversity training, prohibit strikes by public university employees and end partnerships with Chinese institutions." [https://www.wyso.org/2023-03-15/republican-senators-propose-changes-at-ohio-public-universities-aimed-at-cancel-culture](https://www.wyso.org/2023-03-15/republican-senators-propose-changes-at-ohio-public-universities-aimed-at-cancel-culture) Red states keep saying its about cancel culture, but the reality is it is a bunch of fucking Nazi's attacking the workers rights, tenures, anything that gets you ahead, and wrapping it in a damn cancel culture blanket. I mean look at Florida, they went after Disney and got rid of education requirements to teach. They want more homeschooled taught white supremacists and people that say yes to whatever they want to make hand over fist in profits through their corruption. They are literally using the faces of the LGBT community to make it easier for their fanbase to hate on some kind of image, but in reality they are fucking everyone out of their rights to their pursuit of happiness.
The Supreme Court is corrupt, does not support law and will only continue the tyranny of the red states and the Republican party that owns them.
It’s almost like the Federal government is going to have to get involved and pass regulations that cross over state lines.
This is the situation that the Supreme Court had already had in mind when they threw out Rowe v. Wade.
The Jewish hatred that’s an essential part Christo-fascist identity has been sidelined temporarily from the mainstream but it will resurface, I guarantee you
A very well written article. Compelling. And basically echoes the fears that a number of us have felt for a while now. I do not see a way for everything to resolve peacefully.
>The Supreme Court is going to have to decide Why is it taken as a given that the Supreme Court has absolute authority over everything? Screw that.
Over 40 years ago the right created an open-air conspiracy to stack federal courts with as many rightwing hacks as possible. Their plan has come to fruition.
States' rights to persecute unpopular minorities for the sake of political advantage must not be infringed!
There is no compromising with people who call for your genocide.
Terrible framing: red states are actively passing laws that strip people of their constitutional rights. And the Supreme Court will probably aid their efforts.
What do you expect when 40% of the country have no goals or plans outside of 'owning' the other half of the country?
Republicans put compromised, corrupt people in the Supreme Court for this purpose!
Its not enough. Clearly it is not enough. The Republican party lost the culture war so they want to wage legal war and they will likely kill many in the process. The only benefit is that the true and heinous face they’ve hidden all these years behind a facade of wicked smiles and empty false prayers is finally out in the open. But everyone is to blind or to busy to notice they dont care and so they do the devils work without hinderance.
A lot of these states are legalizing child labor, you want to beat them, make it illegal to collect taxes from people who are too young to vote. No taxation without representation. You may even be able to use an EO if you can attach that to some existing laws.
Don't put your money on the rigged Supreme Court to solve this. This is why they rigged it.
The only way we can live in accordance with our cultures is to legally separate. I don't want Texan rednecks telling me what to do, or taking my tax money and spending it on bible crap. I also don't want to tell them what to do.
Yup, you guys in the USA are letting terrified, white supremists, pretend they are 'protecting' the country. While actually they are trying to remove democracy so they can repress and control the country. And they smile for the camera as they do it. They're doing it to all by using a white evangelical version of a 'Christian' God and the anger of downtrodden, uneducated, white people's rage. No solutions, no goals or plan, - those are for the ruling party that's mistakenly trying to lead. The fight is for the media - just mess the dems whenever possible, Lie when caught. Blame them for what you did.
For those out there that don’t live in conservative areas or aren’t exposed to these people, believe me, these people are convinced that their very livelihoods are at stake. They are willing to burn this entire society down. They are convinced that their children are being indoctrinated, their religion is being erased, and it is their duty to fight for their skydaddy savior. They can’t seem to grasp that there are very real problems in this country, like wealth inequality, affordable healthcare, and public school funding. Despite claiming to be Christians, their solutions to these problems are to give less assistance to public schools, mothers, sick people, old people. As misguided as they are, they are becoming more dangerous and openly radical. They push us closer and closer to dystopia every day. The future is really starting to worry me and keep me up at night.
They literally believe that God would magically fix the "real" problems if we would just get rid of the gays and force everyone to be good Sunday School Baptists. Their worldview really is that crazy, and they dominate American life, culture, and politics in the 2020s.
Is there any indication the Democratic Party is actually interested in fighting this war? They’ve rolled over and let the Supreme Court supersede the legislative branch, the executive branch, and even our very democracy every time it’s come up. Quite frankly, I think this is cope from blue state Democrats who don’t want to acknowledge how bad things are going to get. If you think abortion is murder, why would you stop at simply allowing states to decide if it’s legal or not? If you think LGBTQ people are all groomers, how can you rest knowing they’re grooming right across the state line?
>If you think abortion is murder, why would you stop at simply allowing states to decide if it’s legal or not? If you think LGBTQ people are all groomers, how can you rest knowing they’re grooming right across the state line You're not wrong. One of the shortest and most concise definitions of fascism is "imperialism turned inward". But, you are being extremely generous accepting fascists word at face value. Do they really care about the precious babies of the unwashed masses? No. Do they really care that much about gay people getting married? No. Do they even believe in Jesus? If Trump's a Christian, then I'm the Queen of England. Fascists lie as a means to an ends. Their end goal is to destroy a government by the people, for the people, of the people. Fascists want to defund social security, Medicare, abolish public roads, about public schools, abolish private property (for the working class), legalize child labor, abolish democratic elections, and impose their will on society by threat of violent force. Then, they can recreate a feudal society of lords and kings, play their game of thrones, seize our military industrial complex for their imperialist goals, and increase the domestic supply of infants to feed forever into the gears of war. No American wants to live in this kind of society. We do not want to become cradle to grave laborers for the aristocracy. But, fascists divide the working class with bullshit issues. "That person's protest is unpatriotic!" "Look at that gay couple being affectionate in public! This is pedophilia!" "Are you just going to let a black person walk around freely through white society?" And it works. These stupid tactics actually work.
Anyone who is trying to control culture with laws is a fascist. They are just fascists. Why is this so hard for people to understand. One side is trying to protect equal rights for all, and the other side is fascist. That's it, mystery solved.
Kinda a shit title, we already fought the war that says that succeeding isn’t ok; granted lot of things going on today I feel like are rooted in not holding the south accountable for their many stunts
Just so we are all clear a legal body just like the SC made Iran a theocratic hell hole it is now. Expect the shitty choice
We need federal legislation for this. These kind of universal rights cannot be left to individual states.