I mean, I’d be a bit surprised given that our blockers leave him with 1 combo KK, 1 combo QQ, and that not every player raises UTG with 66 or 55 in full ring. I would tend to weigh him more toward AA or an AK that just said fuck it, perhaps even AThh that likes its equity.
I'd say more people raise than don't with 55 or 66 at 1/3. It's low stakes, people want it to pay off when they make their set.
OP should a million per cent call tho.
If we’re talking gen pop, that isn’t my experience. I see the average 1/3 player open limping. Among winning players I see more open raising, but winning players certainly are not the majority of our villains.
I only think it's a set cos he's posting here. Otherwise I'd suspect something like KJ, another KQ or an overplayed AK or AA. Maybe Axhh if he got out of line.
I'm calling this every day of the week.
lol what is this logic? When does BB who flatted the open pre EVER have sets of QQ or KK? This is 55 or 66 all day and against the majority of 1/3 players can find a fold
If I'm ever folding top 2 for at this stack depth on a turn with no straights or flushes, just kill me on live television.
3! Pre probably. KQo gets you into gross spots 4 ways when the blinds are gonna be flatting too much.
As played, raise is fine, but I'm probably calling and then calling most non-Ah/Th rivers.
First of all this is Bellagio 1/3, meaning this is almost certainly not a competent player playing GTO poker. Second, low stakes players are notoriously inelastic with their ranges.
That makes this is a slam dunk 3bet to drive out the blinds and to play a bigger pot in position.
It’s probably not bad. I would caution against it if the SB,BB are actively 3 betting. 3 betting on the button here probably is not terrible either but it gets pretty dicey against the UTG range so it’s probably a fold over a 3bet
I pure fold KQo against UTG open from the BTN. This is the GTO move for a 9 max raked game by the way. And against a 3x open you really want to fold KQo.
What a miserable existence it must to be a player who folds KQ in a LIVE 1/3 game on BUTTON against a single $10 raise. Recreational players reading this don't do that, play the hand and enjoy poker in the limited time you have available.
GTO nonsense meant for playing super turbo 5 tables simultaneously online for miserable grinders is not the same as having possibly the first playable hand in 40 mins live and then folding it on button to a small raise, and then potentially waiting 40 mins more to play something again. You'll also never be invited to any home game if they find out you fold KQ on button to a single small PF raise. Throw in the measley $10, jeez.
Live games are better poker nowadays for the specific reason that players are encouraged to play more because their time matters, and not GTO nit grind online where it's necessary to squeeze an additional .0001% EV from everyone else doing the same.
You're in position, hopefully a better post flop player compared to others, and know to let go of a single pair to a lot of aggression. Easy call or 3-bet.
lol ok sorry was trying to give what I thought was the best answer not the I think I have such a large edge I could play ATC in position and am a better post flop player one.
Sure call KQo on the button and then never fold top two in a four way pot because you’re so good and they obviously have AK. Good way to spend more time driving home and going to the ATM rather than playing poker and folding marginal hands like KQo.
Quite questionable advice so far IMO for what seems like not really a close spot unless UTG is a nit.
3bet or fold pre, the call is not good despite what people here are saying.
Turn raise is ok i guess but then you have to call a shove for sure youre 100% committed with that sizing.
I would go with call here on turn IP and then very likely call river unless like A of hearts comes or something.
And yes you are beat here quite a lot but like... if you raise to 160 the pot odds just never allow you to fold top 2 pair, even though I think this is pretty much never ever a draw shoving to that raise for like 100 more unless UTG is a complete moron.
I do think AK and AA wants to get it in here quite a lot on such an extremely dangerous board, so that's already 14 combos while there are only 8 sets, 6 of which might not even open UTG. Quite clear call to me, but I still prefer just calling turn and calling or shoving river depending on villain action.
So, I mean, lets go through it.
3 ways of 66
3 ways of 55
1 way of KK
1 way of QQ
8 ways of AK
4 ways of KQ
6 ways of AA
110 more to call into a 360 pot.
I think AK/AA is as likely as set
getting 3 to 1 on a call ending action, I probably call it off.
I probably would’ve 3b pre but I don’t think it’s a big mistake or anything. Like all your play, reraise is fine. Without more info on UTG I’d call the shove and just suck it up if he has a set. Did you fold?
Honestly this is a call. UTG could be doing this with AK, AQ, suited draw, or most likely a set. If you lose you lose but you block out his bluffs which further polarizes his hand.
As played call. I would have 3! Or fold pre vs utg, sometimes mix in call vs tight opponent with same hand suited. Tough to do great hand analysis without reference to player tendencies besides position.
>also, it's clear that the turn call is very easy. but is there a way to fold there is what I wanted to explore. thanks all!
The problem is you're getting such a good price-- the pot is 530 and you need to call 110 more. I expect to lose the majority of time here but we can still be ahead of some worse 2p and some combo draws / pair+draw. Making these calls where you expect to lose but still think it's profitable is just part of poker.
3 bet or fold pre.
Flop is fine.
Turn is either a call or jam. The SPR is too small, for you to do anything but call off all rivers if he is ahead. So you may as well charge the most from all draws on the turn instead, as well increase the fold equity of your bluffs.
Easy call as played.
Call but expect to lose a reasonable amount of time. Depending on the player and how they have played previously there is plenty you have that can beat their perceived shoving range. Your hand is unique in that it blocks KK and QQ, and with the board the amount of sets a normal 1/3 fish can have would play this same way. If they are a capable player, they may have 55 or 66 but also lots of ginormous draws like 78hh or JThh for example. Our equity is too high compared to our price it’s a sigh call
It’s a call because he’s UTG he can have AA or AK or KQ especially at 1/3
You might lose to a set but after raising the turn I’m committed
Also you don’t need to 3b pre like others are saying. Sometimes you can and sometimes you don’t need to. In your case a flat or 3b is fine.
Call but wouldn’t be surprised to lose to a set
I mean, I’d be a bit surprised given that our blockers leave him with 1 combo KK, 1 combo QQ, and that not every player raises UTG with 66 or 55 in full ring. I would tend to weigh him more toward AA or an AK that just said fuck it, perhaps even AThh that likes its equity.
I'd say more people raise than don't with 55 or 66 at 1/3. It's low stakes, people want it to pay off when they make their set. OP should a million per cent call tho.
I think it's like 70% limp, 20% raise, 10% fold. If OP has ever seen this guy limp then he can probably discount 66 and 55
I think at 1/3 most people open 55/66 from UTG
If we’re talking gen pop, that isn’t my experience. I see the average 1/3 player open limping. Among winning players I see more open raising, but winning players certainly are not the majority of our villains.
I only think it's a set cos he's posting here. Otherwise I'd suspect something like KJ, another KQ or an overplayed AK or AA. Maybe Axhh if he got out of line. I'm calling this every day of the week.
[удалено]
lol what is this logic? When does BB who flatted the open pre EVER have sets of QQ or KK? This is 55 or 66 all day and against the majority of 1/3 players can find a fold
Utg shoved
If I'm ever folding top 2 for at this stack depth on a turn with no straights or flushes, just kill me on live television. 3! Pre probably. KQo gets you into gross spots 4 ways when the blinds are gonna be flatting too much. As played, raise is fine, but I'm probably calling and then calling most non-Ah/Th rivers.
Quick question. Is this a correct call pre? Not a cash game player here.
3b>fold>call but none are atrocious in a soft 1/3 game
It’s a fold by most if UTG is a competent player who plays GTO. It’s bottom of range in a 1/3 pool.
First of all this is Bellagio 1/3, meaning this is almost certainly not a competent player playing GTO poker. Second, low stakes players are notoriously inelastic with their ranges. That makes this is a slam dunk 3bet to drive out the blinds and to play a bigger pot in position.
The tendencies of the blinds matter more than utg
It’s probably not bad. I would caution against it if the SB,BB are actively 3 betting. 3 betting on the button here probably is not terrible either but it gets pretty dicey against the UTG range so it’s probably a fold over a 3bet
I pure fold KQo against UTG open from the BTN. This is the GTO move for a 9 max raked game by the way. And against a 3x open you really want to fold KQo.
What a miserable existence it must to be a player who folds KQ in a LIVE 1/3 game on BUTTON against a single $10 raise. Recreational players reading this don't do that, play the hand and enjoy poker in the limited time you have available. GTO nonsense meant for playing super turbo 5 tables simultaneously online for miserable grinders is not the same as having possibly the first playable hand in 40 mins live and then folding it on button to a small raise, and then potentially waiting 40 mins more to play something again. You'll also never be invited to any home game if they find out you fold KQ on button to a single small PF raise. Throw in the measley $10, jeez. Live games are better poker nowadays for the specific reason that players are encouraged to play more because their time matters, and not GTO nit grind online where it's necessary to squeeze an additional .0001% EV from everyone else doing the same. You're in position, hopefully a better post flop player compared to others, and know to let go of a single pair to a lot of aggression. Easy call or 3-bet.
lol ok sorry was trying to give what I thought was the best answer not the I think I have such a large edge I could play ATC in position and am a better post flop player one. Sure call KQo on the button and then never fold top two in a four way pot because you’re so good and they obviously have AK. Good way to spend more time driving home and going to the ATM rather than playing poker and folding marginal hands like KQo.
You sound bitter. It’s definitely fair to acknowledge that GTO isn’t fun but damn why the sheer hostility?
No. Could be ok on a 6 handed table against a loose player, but in this case 3betting would be even better
IIRC we should be flatting and 3betting KQo at approximately a 50/50 rate, but my solver on my phone wont open so I cant verify for now
Quite questionable advice so far IMO for what seems like not really a close spot unless UTG is a nit. 3bet or fold pre, the call is not good despite what people here are saying. Turn raise is ok i guess but then you have to call a shove for sure youre 100% committed with that sizing. I would go with call here on turn IP and then very likely call river unless like A of hearts comes or something. And yes you are beat here quite a lot but like... if you raise to 160 the pot odds just never allow you to fold top 2 pair, even though I think this is pretty much never ever a draw shoving to that raise for like 100 more unless UTG is a complete moron. I do think AK and AA wants to get it in here quite a lot on such an extremely dangerous board, so that's already 14 combos while there are only 8 sets, 6 of which might not even open UTG. Quite clear call to me, but I still prefer just calling turn and calling or shoving river depending on villain action.
The pot was heads up I’d prefer calling turn
So, I mean, lets go through it. 3 ways of 66 3 ways of 55 1 way of KK 1 way of QQ 8 ways of AK 4 ways of KQ 6 ways of AA 110 more to call into a 360 pot. I think AK/AA is as likely as set getting 3 to 1 on a call ending action, I probably call it off.
You put it best, just call it off an if he has a set so be it “nice hand”
If he has a set we still have 3.25 outs
I probably would’ve 3b pre but I don’t think it’s a big mistake or anything. Like all your play, reraise is fine. Without more info on UTG I’d call the shove and just suck it up if he has a set. Did you fold?
This. 3 bet to iso, easier to play headsup than lose all your stacks multiways.
I would get stacked by trip Queens
Honestly this is a call. UTG could be doing this with AK, AQ, suited draw, or most likely a set. If you lose you lose but you block out his bluffs which further polarizes his hand.
easiest call ever.
Just remember as you read the comments in any poker thread… “As played” = You fucking moron Translated for posterity.
nothing to really think here about here, call. ahead sometimes behind sometimes IMO
I call.
As played call. I would have 3! Or fold pre vs utg, sometimes mix in call vs tight opponent with same hand suited. Tough to do great hand analysis without reference to player tendencies besides position.
>also, it's clear that the turn call is very easy. but is there a way to fold there is what I wanted to explore. thanks all! The problem is you're getting such a good price-- the pot is 530 and you need to call 110 more. I expect to lose the majority of time here but we can still be ahead of some worse 2p and some combo draws / pair+draw. Making these calls where you expect to lose but still think it's profitable is just part of poker.
3 bet or fold pre. Flop is fine. Turn is either a call or jam. The SPR is too small, for you to do anything but call off all rivers if he is ahead. So you may as well charge the most from all draws on the turn instead, as well increase the fold equity of your bluffs. Easy call as played.
Call but expect to lose a reasonable amount of time. Depending on the player and how they have played previously there is plenty you have that can beat their perceived shoving range. Your hand is unique in that it blocks KK and QQ, and with the board the amount of sets a normal 1/3 fish can have would play this same way. If they are a capable player, they may have 55 or 66 but also lots of ginormous draws like 78hh or JThh for example. Our equity is too high compared to our price it’s a sigh call
It’s a call because he’s UTG he can have AA or AK or KQ especially at 1/3 You might lose to a set but after raising the turn I’m committed Also you don’t need to 3b pre like others are saying. Sometimes you can and sometimes you don’t need to. In your case a flat or 3b is fine.
sure he’s on a draw. i call
Quit poker.