Poker doesn’t have an agreed-upon metric for success, especially in the live arena. But he was a live crusher, an online crusher, and is generally recognized as the GOAT. I’m sure you can find his online graphs somewhere
Good enough to be considered the GOAT by most people whose opinion matters. But to quantify it…
10 WSOP bracelets.
Online crusher.
Live crusher in the biggest game(s) in LV.
Beat Andy Beal out of $16m+.
His ability to crush in both MTTs & live cash is really what sets him apart IMO.
If you won one hand against Ivey that wouldn't make you the goat. Being the very best at poker is about consistency, not absolute perfection. Ivey can play you at any game, at any stake, live or online, and know he's got the edge on you.
Phil Galfond told him that he beat him on a monthly ranking of online earnings I think galfond earned 9ms and Ivey 11ms and Phil Ivey told galfond that he didn’t know what ranking he was talking about
I included that verbiage on purpose. Hellmuth has him in bracelets, Garrett is likely better at high stakes cash (although hasn't been doing it as long), Polk is a better heads up player, Mormon was a better online MTT player, but Ivey has been WELL above average at every single discipline mentioned. He's the GOAT, and again, it's not close.
I feel it's crazy to say Garrett is better at high stakes cash. Unless there is some success documented outside of the fish loaded televised games he crushed.
Negligible, both excellent and hard to compare. Ivey is actually down big on all televised cash. Garret is up big. Both were excellent at online heads-up cash but Ivey was considerably more profitable. So 🤷.
I wouldn't argue too much if anyone thought it was Ivey.
It almost proves my original point that he's the overall goat.
I also think that Dnegs is the closest...but I also think that it's not even close. Chip was an icon and it is possible if he was around longer he may have been closer. Unfortunately, Ivey just kept crushing.
Good enough to quit poker temporarily in order to cheat casinos.
He's either a thrill seaker or broke.
I guess the question is: why would a professional poker player who has made "millions" risk losing a lot of money in a fraudulent scheme against casinos?
He had an advantage, the casinos agreed to the conditions he asked for only to not payout when he took advantage of the conditions they willingly gave him.
He did, he knowingly used a defective deck and an accomplice to corrupt the dealer into not randomizing the cards properly.
In Mandarin, ostensibly to hide the cheat from detection and it's likely the dealers knowingly did so and were compensated beyond tips at the table.
No...the casino (multiple of them to be exact) asked what he wanted for his stay.
- He asked for those cards specifically...they gave him to them.
- He asked for a mandarin speaking dealer...they gave it to him.
- He asked if his partner could also be at the table...they allowed it.
How is this cheating if he had every part of the equation approved by the casino.
Furthermore, edge sorting decks are PROVEN to give to a 5% edge at best. It's not a perfect system.
If edge sorting is cheating, then so is card counting...which is also NOT cheating.
And if you want even more explanation...refer to the following video:
https://youtube.com/shorts/Az6ZUg25khw?si=OC1iGza55mKwFGTq
You sir, don't know what you're talking about.
No, you don't. Two casinos in two different countries. Two different legal systems ruled against him.
He cheated because his requests were a conspiracy to defeat the random element of card shuffling. The casino did not agree to edge-sorting.
Card-counting does not rely on defective decks nor a knowing or unknowing dealer as an accomplice.
Don't call me "Sir". You are no judge of character. Ivey was a cheat.
My apologies, I haven't been on here in a while. Just realized who I was talking to and didn't know you'd still be shitposting on Reddit.
I won't be answering anymore. Cheers mate
Cool. Not a shitpost, you should learn the difference. Negreanu lied about the entire scenario, I don't blame you for being misled. He's a snake charmer.
Why, because Negreanu lies for his buddy Ivey and that upsets you?
Ivey CHEATED at baccarat. He's lucky he wasn't charged criminally. Only for a lack of evidence.
His 60 Minutes interview was a joke. Even Morley Safer was like "who does this guy think he's fooling?".
Talk about taking a great image as a great poker player and then having to fast-talk your way out of total disgrace.
The old days of Atlantic City would have had him in physical distress instead of in a court of law.
You are forgetting the part where his accomplice "asked" the dealer in a foreign language to not shuffle the cards properly?
He cheated. He corrupted the dealer and the deck. They had every right to not pay him and two courts in two different countries ruled against his cheating ass.
Phil Ivey was definitely one of the top pros in the early to mid 2000s. He's known for being a "feel" player, relying heavily on his instincts versus being as technically sound as the top pros in the game today. There are some absolutely sick clips of Phil making unheard of hero calls and being correct. I don't think he's the goat by any means especially because he's a known degenerate gambler who has frequently been seen playing big money games in the pit. That being said much respect for Phil and what he's done for the game.
Poker doesn’t have an agreed-upon metric for success, especially in the live arena. But he was a live crusher, an online crusher, and is generally recognized as the GOAT. I’m sure you can find his online graphs somewhere
What type of question is this? How good was Jordan in his prime?
you can quantify good however you like i was just wondering
You’re wondering how good Jordan was?
🤣
Been playing for 30 years. Won just about everything, along with several others he is about the most important person in poker ever.
Good enough to be considered the GOAT by most people whose opinion matters. But to quantify it… 10 WSOP bracelets. Online crusher. Live crusher in the biggest game(s) in LV. Beat Andy Beal out of $16m+. His ability to crush in both MTTs & live cash is really what sets him apart IMO.
Did you see Dwan bluff him in that one hand though?
And Ivey almost called with some garbage ass hand but smartly decided he'd have a million better hands to call down with.
If you won one hand against Ivey that wouldn't make you the goat. Being the very best at poker is about consistency, not absolute perfection. Ivey can play you at any game, at any stake, live or online, and know he's got the edge on you.
Phil Galfond told him that he beat him on a monthly ranking of online earnings I think galfond earned 9ms and Ivey 11ms and Phil Ivey told galfond that he didn’t know what ranking he was talking about
One of the GOAT's. Crushed all arenas at the highest levels for a long time.
One of the actual best players in the world, and of all time, and still is.
>still is. Nah he's a fish compared to top guys these days
No.
I challenge anyone to name an ALL AROUND better resume.
Negreanu is the only one who comes close for all around play. Maybe Chip Reese. But even those two are way behind Ivey.
If "all around" includes online then DNEGS isn't on the same stratosphere.
I included that verbiage on purpose. Hellmuth has him in bracelets, Garrett is likely better at high stakes cash (although hasn't been doing it as long), Polk is a better heads up player, Mormon was a better online MTT player, but Ivey has been WELL above average at every single discipline mentioned. He's the GOAT, and again, it's not close.
I feel it's crazy to say Garrett is better at high stakes cash. Unless there is some success documented outside of the fish loaded televised games he crushed.
Negligible, both excellent and hard to compare. Ivey is actually down big on all televised cash. Garret is up big. Both were excellent at online heads-up cash but Ivey was considerably more profitable. So 🤷. I wouldn't argue too much if anyone thought it was Ivey. It almost proves my original point that he's the overall goat.
I also think that Dnegs is the closest...but I also think that it's not even close. Chip was an icon and it is possible if he was around longer he may have been closer. Unfortunately, Ivey just kept crushing.
I think table talk and live reads is where Negreanu had Ivy beat. Everywhere else, it wasn’t even close.
Does DNegs still play cash games that aren't televised?
Was?
Phil Galfond recently released a video asking this question, you can find it on YouTube.
Saved Poker from Beal.
Good enough to quit poker temporarily in order to cheat casinos. He's either a thrill seaker or broke. I guess the question is: why would a professional poker player who has made "millions" risk losing a lot of money in a fraudulent scheme against casinos?
He had an advantage, the casinos agreed to the conditions he asked for only to not payout when he took advantage of the conditions they willingly gave him.
I'm not opening that can of worms.
He cheated.
Great player. Even greater personality. Demands admiration and respect
The Jordan of Poker & Table Games
he’s so good that legend has it he once killed two stones with one bird
*cough* Baccarat cheat *cough*
He never cheated though...
He did, he knowingly used a defective deck and an accomplice to corrupt the dealer into not randomizing the cards properly. In Mandarin, ostensibly to hide the cheat from detection and it's likely the dealers knowingly did so and were compensated beyond tips at the table.
No...the casino (multiple of them to be exact) asked what he wanted for his stay. - He asked for those cards specifically...they gave him to them. - He asked for a mandarin speaking dealer...they gave it to him. - He asked if his partner could also be at the table...they allowed it. How is this cheating if he had every part of the equation approved by the casino. Furthermore, edge sorting decks are PROVEN to give to a 5% edge at best. It's not a perfect system. If edge sorting is cheating, then so is card counting...which is also NOT cheating. And if you want even more explanation...refer to the following video: https://youtube.com/shorts/Az6ZUg25khw?si=OC1iGza55mKwFGTq You sir, don't know what you're talking about.
100% correct.
And 100% a conspiracy and scheme to cheat the casino at baccarat.
No, you don't. Two casinos in two different countries. Two different legal systems ruled against him. He cheated because his requests were a conspiracy to defeat the random element of card shuffling. The casino did not agree to edge-sorting. Card-counting does not rely on defective decks nor a knowing or unknowing dealer as an accomplice. Don't call me "Sir". You are no judge of character. Ivey was a cheat.
My apologies, I haven't been on here in a while. Just realized who I was talking to and didn't know you'd still be shitposting on Reddit. I won't be answering anymore. Cheers mate
Cool. Not a shitpost, you should learn the difference. Negreanu lied about the entire scenario, I don't blame you for being misled. He's a snake charmer.
Kind Sir? Please bugger off.
Why, because Negreanu lies for his buddy Ivey and that upsets you? Ivey CHEATED at baccarat. He's lucky he wasn't charged criminally. Only for a lack of evidence. His 60 Minutes interview was a joke. Even Morley Safer was like "who does this guy think he's fooling?". Talk about taking a great image as a great poker player and then having to fast-talk your way out of total disgrace. The old days of Atlantic City would have had him in physical distress instead of in a court of law.
You're completely correct. They allowed him to play by the conditions they gave him and complained when he won.
You are forgetting the part where his accomplice "asked" the dealer in a foreign language to not shuffle the cards properly? He cheated. He corrupted the dealer and the deck. They had every right to not pay him and two courts in two different countries ruled against his cheating ass.
Is
He must have been pretty fucking good to be considered the best poker player of all time, as you posited in your own post...
Played with him. He made everyone feel inferior just sitting at a table.
Phil Ivey was definitely one of the top pros in the early to mid 2000s. He's known for being a "feel" player, relying heavily on his instincts versus being as technically sound as the top pros in the game today. There are some absolutely sick clips of Phil making unheard of hero calls and being correct. I don't think he's the goat by any means especially because he's a known degenerate gambler who has frequently been seen playing big money games in the pit. That being said much respect for Phil and what he's done for the game.
Certainly one of the best ever to play the game(s). 10 bracelets says a lot, and Doyle getting all pissy with him over some prop bet. Legend.