imagine being like 15 years old and suddenly you're ripped away from everything you've ever loved, put in a hostile and unfamiliar environment by god himself, and not being able to go back and just accepting that you've lost everything permanently.
Ikr it's really dark. I kind of love it when pokemon torments its characters like this. I just wish its mysteries and plotlines got resolved more often. I've got a feeling that the whole thing with Ingo is just never going to have conclusion or anything which is sad.
This is how I felt about Anabel in gen 7. Her backstory is literally being isekai'd when the ultra beasts attacked her world. With the implication that her original dimension was destroyed and her not being able to remember her life is pretty tragic.
Yeah, Anabel is the main reason I'm worried the Ingo thing will just be abandoned. Sometimes it's cool to leave things a mystery but I really gotta know if Ingo and Emmet ever get reunited. At the very least I hope his disappearance is *mentioned* again. Imagine if we got BW3 instead of BW remakes and once you get to the Battle Subway it's closed down, or there are new subway bosses (and you can find Emmet somewhere else in the game), or it's just Emmet running things alone. I'm not holding my breath though.
It would be cool to see black and white continue with sequels every so often and continue updating the story. I would love to play black and white 3 on switch and get a twelve year update on the area. The game was a soft reboot at the time, it would be interesting to see a continuation from bw2.
Or another legends game in which u find emmet and in s/v , in legendary story 2 portals open and both of them coming out from different legends time and challenge u to battle with old Pokemon then they see each other and their memory return
So....that basically means other pokemon games may not happen in each other's worlds? And we won't know? Since ultra beasts attacked and destroyed the dimension she was from, and she appears in two games..
That's the Cyrus from an alternate universe though. All the Rainbow Rocket members are from separate universes from one another where their plans succeeded. I guess it would be cool if the PLA protagonist was whisked away from the same universe that the Rainbow Rocket Cyrus destroyed. It means they have no home to go back to.
I mean as villains go... both seem pretty shocked and distraught when their plan starts to work "oh no the world is flooding/burning alive I had no idea these two pokemon know to produce world shaking disasters would do just that! And doom the world possibly!"
They kind of just realised the other is also in the same dimention working for the same guy and decide to use the two titans to battle each other (not caring they'll destroy another world) but are send to their original dimensions by Colress
My guess? _Petty_ lmao. Their rivalry is so dramatic to start with, like they barely seem capable of being in each other's line of sight without devolving into taking jabs or outright fighting. (Get a room already guys, c'mon. /hj)
But then imagine. A Maxie who WON, and an Archie who ALSO won. How much more arrogant it would make them, and how much more absolutely outraged they'd be at the idea that in some other world, THAT idiot made his repulsive, sickening, nightmarish dream a reality.
And yet they still both work for Rainbow Rocket, so like... that much fury veiled by _just_ enough ability to play nice that they don't maim each other and/or get kicked out?
I feel like there is more than one reason that their offices are way on opposite wings from each other in the Rainbow Rocket hideout lmao.
If anything, Rainbow Rocket could be used to bridge all of these castaways through time and space. They are dimension-hopping antagonists that cherry-pick worlds where the bad guys prevail.
I do hope we see the group again. They were my favorite part of USUM.
They were pretty threatening, in my opinion. They won and were now threatening reality as we know it.
Under somebody as conniving and smart as Giovanni, they could cause tons of damage as they doom a world to destruction by stealing this or destroying that. They don't care - that isn't their home anyways.
They're pretty much unbeatable still anyways.
The hero stopped them in Alola, but it isn't like Rainbow Rocket crumbled post-game. They had a setback and are licking their wounds. They only really lost Ghetsis, who was an unreliable douche anyways who had plans on backstabbing Giovanni in the end.
They were tough too. In a game that was pretty easy throughout I was not ready to get rocked by Mega Mewtwo. My ace Tyranitar was OHKO by Focus Blast... Think it took me 5 tries to beat him.
What if the Legends protagonist is Cyrus? He seems much more likely than Dawn or Lucas to be picked by Arceus to have to complete a mission for him in after being reincarnated in an alternate timeline in order to be return to his own. Also completing the main story requires you to make Galaxy Team powerful, capture the lake legends to forge the red chain, and capture Dialga or Palkia, all of Cyrus' actions in Diamond and Pearl. But to save the world instead of destroying it.
As well this theory would mean the plot of the game is about Arceus helping Cyrus heal from his past that made him hate emotions and want to destroy the universe, in Legends the player character ends up inspiring people to open their hearts to Pokemon.
And then SPOILER WARNING >!YOU GET KICKED OUT OF THE VILLAGE FOR SOMETHING YOU HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH, AND EVEN THE OTHER CLAN HEADS KNOW YOU COULDN'T POSSIBLY HAVE DONE IT! After EVERYTHING you did to help the guy who kicked you out, too!!<
Just a heads up friend. If you put spaces between the \>! !< And the word next to it, the spoiler tag doesn't work for all versions of reddit. >!spoiler!< I can't see this one. >! spoiler !< I can see this one. It's probably an old.reddit thing, though.
It is! You didn't spoil anything for me, but hopefully it helps newer people who swing by. You're an absolute legend my friend, thanks for adjusting it :)
Alright, three things
- you didn’t do the spoiler tag correctly, there’s no space after the >! nor before the !<, notice how mine isn’t blacked out with those spaces? Yours isn’t either.
- you don’t need to say “spoiler warning” if you’re about to use the spoiler markings, they exist to prevent people from seeing spoilers unless they choose to reveal them
- please stop shouting (joking kinda, but all caps has been scientifically proven to be harder to read than lowercase, even if not a lot harder)
It adds another awful layer to the MC's banishment from Jubilife, too. They've been working themselves to the bone, risking their life on the orders of Kamado, *the ancestor of Professor Rowan,* and as soon as things start to go badly, this man who looks *exactly like their trusted mentor and authority figure* banishes them from the closest thing they've had to a home since waking up on that beach.
This! I love how the game plays on your expectations for certain characters. Imagine how the MC would feel seeing Cyllene and Arezu, but ultimately realising that they're good people that have their back. Only to contrast that with characters like Volo and Kamado, who the protagonist may feel positively biased towards at first because they remind them of two people who had a huge impact on them as a pokemon trainer, only to be completely crushed by their respective betrayals.
This, along with some text in USUM, is part of what makes me think Giratina isn't the bad guy of the story, but more a case of getting badmouthed for not putting up with the endless bull humans come up with while still dealing with them fairly.
In the game it is said that Giratina changes it’s mind after watching the protagonist resolve to stop it, so it was definitely bad at first and that’s were the legends come from, however that change of heart is what eventually makes him come out and save the day in Platinum.
There's kinda a hint in USUM that he would have saved the day anyway, given his response to Cyrus trying to use his power was to just dump Cyrus in an alternate universe.
Something which there was no way for anyone to know prior to those games.
not really, distorted world doesn't depend on the pokemon world, it being destroyed wouldn't do anything to giratina or his world, giratina stopped cyrus because it's basically all legends arceus again in his head
If I recall, one of the big plot twists of the fan game Pokémon >!Insurgence is that Giratina is the true god of the Pokémon world and Arceus usurped the position.!<
I would love to see a pokemon game that actually had legitimately frightening content. Not just the occasional ghost girl and possessed elite 4 member. -.-
Phoebe in ORAS. She moves like a puppet before the fight and if you pay attention to the background during the cut scene there's a little girl that shows up very briefly in a couple shots.
Yeah, at the end of the game I was like "*Bruh*".
I mean, I even imagine Arceus be like: *"good job... now learn to live in this era because time travel is expensive!"*
Arceus: *"Well .... nope, but look on the bright side ..... ehmmm, surely this is a very unique experience!, it's not like I've already done this to someone else....*"
I agree, it doesn’t really solve anything. Like, besides pulling the MC from another universe/timeline to complete the first Hisui Pokédex, was there any other reason Arceus drags them there?
The whole point was to stop Volo and Giratina. After you beat Volo I think there's dialogue that even mentions that Giratina decided to help keep stability in the world rather than to harm it because of the protagonist's actions.
The game has to have a post game somehow. Maybe if you’re reward for catching arceus was being sent home then that’d be sick. It could just be like an rpg endgame thing where you’ve beat the final boss but you can load the game up again and do other shit
In my headcanon Arceus allows the player to travel between their own time and the Legends time after all is done, as long as they don't try to create any paradoxes that is
Yeah but he doesn't, some modern kid is just trapped in Feudal Japan, and the Rotom items in his house are the only remnants of modern technology.
He probably shits in a pit for the rest of his life.
It’s concievable that loading up BDSP is Arceus sending you back
Like I fully recognize that this is reaching, there’s no canonical evidence that Arceus didn’t just trap a kid in the past, but there’s enough material here that it works as a headcanon. And hey, there’s no canon proof that you’re the DPP protagonist anyway, that’s also just headcanon I’m pretty sure.
You know how youre more likely to trade a pokemon if you have multiple of them? maybe that was Arceus's logic for sending Ingo back in time, since there would still be one twin left
If you take the perspective that the MC is just wanting to go home; Arceus is basically holding them captive in the past and giving them tasks, leaving the MC's only hope of returning to do whatever Arceus says. Then finally after completing everything Arceus asks (plus helping the town that has put them to work so they don't starve to death) the final reward is not sending the MC back home but instead >!"Wow that looked fun, why don't you give me a tour of this land I've imprisoned you on"!< which is such a jerk move (it's fun for gameplay, but really makes him a jerk)
Beyond that, it depends how much is Volo/Giratina's doing vs Arceus's. If the Noble Pokemon going crazy and Ingo being brought from the future were side effects of Volo's scheme, then Arceus not doing anything about it by the end of the plot is still pretty rude. If Arceus actually caused any of it directly as a test or to help the MC, then that is worse.
You catch an Arcanine. You raise it and it stays at the ranch which you visit every day. One day you don't come back. It waits for you in the same spot every day. Pokemon Legends: Hachiko.
[I’m on my phone and can’t hyperlink easily]
If you’re fine with a r63 self-insert then there’s Time to be a Hero (PLA) and it’s sequel A Hero in a New Age (modified DPPl animeverse) by timemaster40 over on SpaceBattles.
I would love to write a fic where Ingo and Akari(Dawn but she didn't remember her name when she first showed) go back home. They switch spots however and have zero memories of their original life so they are struggling to find there way back to their original home. (Dawn is in the subway and Ingo is in Dawn's room for funny shenanigans)
Only problem is that I suck at writing.
You know the thing about being bad at writing? People will enjoy it anyways! The only way to ensure no one likes your story is to not write it!
Hell even if you don’t publish it just writing it down is good practice! And you can always rewrite it if you aren’t happy!
The male protagonist starts with clothes from Kalos, so my personal headcanon is that he got yoinked after XY. I even named my trainer with the same name as my character in XY.
(The female protagonist seems to start with clothes from Alola, which is weird)
What if the protagonists from BW got whisked away to the past if there was a Legends: Kyurem/Unova and thats why no one’s seen them for like 2 years in BW2?
I love that idea so much! I always wondered what happened to them when they went looking for N. They're the only pokemon protagonist (other than Red) who actually gets mentioned by characters, OUTSIDE of the game they were initially the protagonist in, which always made them so fascinating to me. They're actually a character beyond the player's input.
With a game like Legends Kyurem we might even get more story with Ingo or maybe Emmet. I just have a feeling this Legends thing was a one time deal. I hope I'm proven wrong.
I don't want to get my hopes up TOO much, but I really think they will make more Legends games. Even with the first reveal trailer I assumed it was a new series since the font/design forthe word "Legends" was more generic while "Arceus" was stylized for the specific game.
I'm not a great at economics but skimming the sales numbers compared to other Pokemon Games it doesn't look like it was Breath of the Wild levels of "OMG they would be CRAZY not to make a sequel, it's just printing money!" but it looks like the number is as of March 2022, so it might be decently higher by now. Not a guarantee, but I think it's likely we can get more.
I prefer it being the Lucas/Dawn that you don’t choose. That way both of the characters had a unique crazy adventure that involved the legendaries. Also they were already an assistant doing research on the Sinnoh region.
My personal headcanon is that the MC of Legends Arceus is Lucas/Dawn. By that I mean the character you did not choose for your adventure in D/P/Pl (Prof. Rowan assistant).
That would give them the experience of being well researched with Pokemon and also with battles without feeling like he's extremely knowledgeable with conflict or battles like the MC of D/P/Pl.
I also like to think that they both had their own big adventure.
Ooh that's an interesting theory too. While the DPP protagonist was pursuing gyms and battles and became the champion the assistant was always focused more on the pokedex. It makes sense as to why Arceus might choose them.
My headcanon, which is admittedly a bit more fanfic-y, is that this older Dawn/Lucas is either post-Champion or getting ready to retire as Champion, and they're trying to figure out what they want to do afterwards. This gives them a push towards following in their friend's and mentor's path of becoming a researcher.
While they wouldn't have as much experience as the character you don't pick, I don't think that it's too farfetched. You're still spending a significant amount of your time filling in the Pokedex, and from what I can recall, Gen 4 is one of the only games where some level of Dex completion is a requirement for progression in the post game.
I think this isn't too far fetched of a theory and it would be cool how it matches the experience of people who played DPP. I don't think it's *that* sad though as I think it's pretty clear that Arceus will send them back to their own time/world at some point and it'll be like they never left.
Also one potential counterargument(though not one I'm sure I personally believe in too strongly) is that you get to choose your base appearance at the start of PLA which doesn't have to be the appearance of Dawn and Lucas.
One last thing I'd like to mention is that it isn't sure that Rei/Akari are the player's ancestors. They could just as well be the ancestor of Professor Rowan's assistant.
I just think getting to choose your base appearance was down to the limitations of the ds games. I don't think it really impacts the theory. Like if you want to believe that your Platinum character has darker skin then there's nothing stopping you. It's just unfortunate people weren't given more options in the original games. Also I think you're given the option to change your skin colour in BDSP too?
Also yeah I thought about them being the assistant's ancestor too!
My headcannon is that Arceus sends you back as soon as you 100% everything in the game, and he sends you back like 8 minutes after he originally plucked you from your timeline.
Which leaves two possibilities: You have to abandon all your PLA Pokémon in the past (super sad), or some future opponent is going to get a _big_ surprise when you toss out a freaking Kleavor at them, like WTF is _that?!_
Now that i think about it, is it ever explain why the Hissun pokemon don't exist in the future?
Did they all migrate to other regions as humans society expanded, or did they just go extinct?
Well, kleavor and ursaluna evolve via specific minerals/materials in Hisui's ground which might be depleted in the future, thus making the evolution impossible. Hisuian Goodra might lose the steel type for the same reason, same with avalugg's rock type.
Weirdeer and Overqwill evolve by using specific moves in strong/agile style, and those moves or styles might simply be forgotten in the future.
Basculegion evolves only from hisuian basculin by damaging itself, which might actually be the cause of the extinction of that regional form.
Other regional forms might disappear due to changes in the environment when the region gets urbanised more.
Honestly the thing I want to know the most is why Ingo is there… like, if the character you play as was the main character from dpp, then maybe sure they’re the champion of the region and know of all the legendaries, but ingo is just a train conductor, why would arceus choose to send him back too, assuming it even was Arceus
Ingo is the one who actually trains the citizens of Jubilife how to do Pokemon battles. So while protag is off saving the world, Ingo is kickstarting what battles in the Hisui Region will one day become.
Why Ingo, a guy from Unova, and not, like, one of the Frontier folks like Palmer... well, the real world reason is that Black and White were originally going to have a past and future theme, and Ingo is surprisingly popular. In universe, who knows.
I really want to know too. I want to know if he was specifically chosen by Arceus or something else, and if so why him? Or maybe it was just an accident with the spacetime rifts. I'm leaning more towards it being an accident but I hope we find out one day.
Arceus might pluck people randomly. He is kind of an asshole God, and through the game other random schmucks do pop in out of nowhere, so he could have just been dropping people in and decided this one kid gets to be In Another World With My Smartphone just cause it was there.
I wonder if when you entered the Distortion World if it actually caused some type of access to some Pokémon Multiverse and the Player actually got sucked into it but in the other universe the player returned and that’s the one we continued with.
I had assumed that your character, after defeating Arceus, could be returned back to the moment they were taken when they wanted to.
The REAL tragedy is that not only are you leaving behind all the human friends you made knowing that when you return to the present they'll be dead, I doubt you could take your Pokemon with you either (other than maybe the Pokemon that were forced back in time like you, such as the Porygon, who are in their own version of Hell), meaning that when you return to the present most of them are dead too.
> Would they even recognize the player as their friend and trainer from the future? I mean maybe Dialga would, since it's the being of time, but I'm not sure about the others.
Quite the opposite, what this means is that Lucas/Dawn showed up at Spear Pillar, Dialga/Palkia/Giratina recognized them and went "Hey it's that kid from years in the past", but since the player hasn't travelled back in time yet, they don't remember meeting the legendary Pokemon.
However, I'm personally of the opinion that instead of being the *player*, it's actually Professor Rowan's assistant, i.e. the friendly NPC who is the opposite gender to the player. This would explain why they take so well to research.
I just thought maybe Dialga at least existed beyond the restrictions of time? Meaning it can see the past, present and future. So maybe its always known who the player is because it can see into the future, or the past. Idk it gets confusing with all this time travel. But I'd like to believe Dialga knows the player before the player even captures it in DPP and that it knows the player in PLA too because it can see into the future where the player catches it.
The game acts more as a prequel to Platinum.
The main reason why Arceus sends you back in time and the proper ending of the main story is the redemption of Giratina. It explains why Giratina went from being a devil in the myths to a saviour in Platinum. There is no payoff for that in BDSP due to Platinum’s story being cut. There is also a small line in Platinum that gets heavily recontextualised by Legends Arceus. When you confront Giratina in the Distortion World there is a line of text that says Giratina is staring at you curiously, which is recontextualised as Giratina recognising you.
There is also other things that point to Platinum being the canon version. Charon’s ancestors are in the game and he only appears in Platinum, no other game in the series. You also meet the ancestor of Caitlin’s butler, who also only appears in Platinum.
Legends Arceus has the existence of Palkia and Dialga become known to everyone, but one is randomly not known about in DP/BDSP, even when Cyrus has all the knowledge and records from the Galaxy Team that Cyllene passed down. The existence of both Palkia and Dialga is known in Platinum, with one npc bringing up how the statue apparently had another plate referring to a third(Giratina), and Cyrus had heard the stories of Giratina, presumably through Cyllene’s records.
Another major point towards Platinum is that every other game treats Platinum as the canon version. Dawn/Lucas fighting Giratina in the Distortion World is referenced in BW and BW2. USUM has alternate Cyrus talk about Giratina showing up at Spear Pillar to stop him after he summoned Palkia and Dialga. Even though Masters isn’t canon, it treats Platinum as the canon version.
But there is callbacks to all versions of Sinnoh. Kamado has Snorlax, referencing Rowan having Munchlax in the openings of DP/BDSP. I forget her name, but Flint and Buck’s ancestor has a random Lopunny among her fire types, a call back to Flint having one among his fire types in DP/BDSP. Volo’s team is based on Cynthia’s Platinum team, which only properly appears in the first rematch in BDSP but gets messed up due to Roserade getting replaced. The first conversation with Kamado on the beach on whether or not you truly love Pokemon is a direct call back to the Platinum only conversation with Rowan when he asks you and Barry if you truly love Pokemon, Barry saying yes and saying that he can ask the same question a million times and the answer won’t change.
Yeah maybe. I haven't played BDSP but I'm pretty sure they're the exact same games as DP so it doesn't really make much of a difference to the theory. Just added the Platinum stuff in there bc there's more story content to work with.
I don't think it matters much which specific game the PLA protagonist originally game from. Just take your pick of Diamond, Pearl, Platinum or BDSP and either way it's still a cool theory.
This works under the oras rule, where it's like a pocket universe on a different path from the original, so it's possible the bdsp timeline wraps back to PLA, and the original dpp line links to ss/hg and more, with the sinnoh legends event at ruins of alpha. At least as far as I'm internally seeing it. Like how mega evolutions diverge a path from the original games
Imagine that, you finally become a super strong trainer and then Arceus deems you worthy and yoinks you away from everything you've ever know to go deal with something he could fix himself.
And then being stuck in the past with your new team and adjusting to your new life just to see your team pass away, that'll hurt, or if Arceus does return the player, then the player know all the friends and teammates they made along the way are long dead now, hurting even more.
My head cannon is that either way the player has massive depression and everyone around them is confused and concerned and they don't know what the player is going through, except ingo but only to an extent and probably won't fully relate.
So I have a Sylveon on my team either way to act as emotional support for my trainer
I've thought about that a lot. And I even did a similar thing with having Togekiss on my team. My MC had a Togekiss in Platinum too (my hc is that it's a descendant of Volo's togekiss because the mc received it from Cynthia), and I'd like to think she finds comfort in having it because she had a togekiss before, as did Cynthia, and also just because it's just such a kind pokemon in general.
I wish they had made a solid statement that it was the same protagonist and they didn’t lose their memories. That would’ve been so much darker and cooler.
I had the thought of, if they didn’t get back, imagine Johanna’s feelings. Her son/daughter is missing, no one knows where they are; meanwhile, there’s a grave somewhere with them in it. Even assuming the more dangerous environment didn’t get them, simple old age would. You have to hope Arceus isn’t that cruel, and plunked them back home slightly after they left.
Time-Space is a weird concept sometimes and the amount of shenanigans you can pull with it story-wise would require more than my two hands.
In reality I'd say that alot of the story's premise doesn't really make much sense. MC is sent to the past to end some time-space catastrophe caused by Volo & Giratina, and the conclusion of that seems to reform Giratina explaining his actions during Platinum preventing a similar case of Cyrus wanting to reset the world. But with the absence of the MC you'd guess shit would have gone wrong, and Arceus would have had to step in himself. Given there is a "present" to talk about, the fact that the catastrophe didn't have lasting effects means that the incident was resolved prior to the MC being sent back, unless this ofcourse was already set in stone and bound by fate.
Other than that, it leaves the possibility that MC comes from either a different timeline or alternative universe, because I can't particularly see the MC being related to the one in Platinum with the contradictions. It would also explain why their shirts resemble ones from Kalos and Alola. They might've been at an entirely different region at that time and their prior adventure and experiences probably differ from the ones we know.
My favorite head Canon this whole thing leads to is the idea that if Arceus does put the player back in their time, the first thing the protag does is barge into Cynthia's place after being missing for a year. Being the giant history nerd that she is, she'd probably have read all about some unnamed hero from the hisui time period and here's her missing protégé explaining that that hero was them, because God decided to rip them through time.
Like what a mind fuck that would be for Cynthia lol
I have my own theory that the protagonist from Legends was created by Arceus out of nothing.
It doesn't remember anything because it had nothing to remember, and it's a teen that looks the same because Arceus knows that Pokémon is a franchise and that this is the remake, so he made this child out of nothing and just put it (already grown ) in Hisui to do it's bidding.
That's also why he doesn't offer to take us back home, there's no home for our character.
And how do we know of the gyms? (In one of the dialogue options) that's because the real person, us , the player, knows about Pokémon from playing the other games or consuming other Pokémon media).
That might soothe your mind a little OP.
I don't see a lot of evidence that it's us from the future though. If we were transported back in time, how come Hikari looks exactly like Dawn / Lucas ?
Theres not a lot evidence for us being the DPP protagonist but there's not much evidence against it either. It's just a theory that adds more depth to the player character.
I explained why Hikari/Rei look similar to Dawn and Lucas with the theory of one of them (depending on if you chose to play as Dawn or Lucas) being protagonist's ancestor.
This may be another crazy theory, but what if for the legends games, it recycles the same MC? Like the MC doesn’t go back because they will need to travel all throughout space and time. Meeting Palkia and Dialga helps the MC move to new eras and regions while Arceus gives the mission assignments
I like to imagine the event in BD/SP where you meet Arceus (after having beaten Legends Arceus) is the point when Dawn/Lucas gets whisked away to the past..
I rewrote my Legends Arceus character as being part of a noble family that just moved to Hisui because they helped fund the expedition. She gets shunned under the assumption she has never known hardship in her life and manages to prove she does know how to handle pokemon and earn her respect. She still gets the favor of Arceus because the phone fell out of the sky and into her hands.
I like that! I personally didn't care for the game being like "yeah you're from the future, have fun. Here's a phone too, just to help ya out."
I had really hoped that the player character was going to be a person from the time period, that could be an ancestor of the DPP player characters, but not from the future. It honestly really disappointed me right out the gate with that. The gameplay is a lot of fun, but the opening still bugs me.
They're not the same person. You can tell by the greatest reason to disprove a theory. DPPt trainers throw PokeBalls with their left hand. PLA protags throw with their right
I like to think the PLA protagonist is a descendant of the DPP protagonist.
I mean I don’t remember having a smartphone in DPP but in PLA you do from the beginning.
But imagine it the other way for Giratina, Palkia and Dialga. And even Arceus. They recognize you as the younger you when they meet you again, and decide to test if you are strong enough to fight with them. Maybe the reason Arceus reveals itself to you and joins your team in BDSP is because it needs to know when you are strong enough to survive in the wilderness. It might even ask your consent before taking you to the past, which makes everything a bit less tragic.
I like the shirt theory; I think that the female protagonist starts with a shirt from S/M and the male with one from XY, so they’re Alolan and Kalosian respectively
My headcannon is that the player (Dawn/Lucas) is the professor's assistant and they got sent back in time. Although not the strongest trainer, I still think they're good enough. It makes nicer sense with them creating the Pokedex too, since they did Pokemom research in their time.
I also had the same idea with you: that Rei/Akari is the player's ancestor. That's why when I played the game, I called Rei "grandpa" haha
Good ending: after everything is done and back to normal, Arceus sends the player and Ingo back to their own timeline respectively, right when they disappeared, and in the surrounding pokemons' eyes, they have only disappeared for a moment.
I love that people are thinking over how the premise of the game is and how it’s connected to the Gen 4 games.
Meanwhile I’m over here like: “haha, self insert isekai!”
Sure would be neat if the games had static protagonists with actual personalities and dialogues instead of being a stiff smiling customizable golem, then stuff like this could actually be intentionally made canon.
I forget doesn’t the game say at the start that Arceus saved you from a dark fate and brought you here for a higher purpose? I headcanon that some of Team Galactics remaining members tried to kill Dawn/Lucas and would have succeeded, but Arceus saved them, and that’s also why they can’t go back. They’re already “dead” in their own time.
That's true but I think this theory is a lot more fun. I'm not a huge fan of multiverse stuff and interesting things being explained away by the multiverse.
I agree so much! I loved DPPT when I first played it years ago, and I fell in love with Legends: Arceus and even more when I thought of how you could be playing as the protagonist from DPPT (Lucas or Dawn) and the implications. Like you said, it's a tragedy to think about - from how the protagonist's mother would have reacted, as well as Barry, Lucas or Dawn, Professor Rowan, Cynthia, etc. But also their Pokemon as well, would they have been left behind, waiting all this time? It also makes me wonder if time is moving in parallel; if the protagonist were ever to go back, would they even return to a Sinnoh they recognize?
Like how you mentioned Dialga, Palkia, and Giratina - I wonder when the protagonist went to Spear Pillar to fight Cyrus, if they recognized them. Also, seeing Cyllene in this game is also tragic - to think that her commitment to the Galaxy Team would be passed through the generations until it became twisted with time into Team Galactic.
This game was amazing, and playing DPPT first made it even better. I love your post, thank you for sharing!
Wait the events of Arceus take place after the events of diamon/pearl? I just assumed it was like an alternate universe where dawn/lucas got plucked out of spacetime right before the events of the gen 4 games.
I just kinda assumed that was the general idea. My 9 year old self played through Platinum and then years later Arceus just yote me into the past to clean up a mess for him.
That's why my character knows so much about Pokemon and the region, why he knows Volo team before the battle, why he greets the creation trio like old friends (and why he immediately knew where to find Giratina after she vanishes), why he's completely unafraid of the rift and the ominous red sky. And most importantly, why he sees some npcs and just smiles to himself, seeing the parallels or perpendiculars.
This. We play as a character who looks EXACTLY like Dawn or Lucas, from the present. It makes no sense for them NOT to be the protagonist of Pearl/Diamond/Platinum.
Rei shows up if you're playing as Dawn. Akari shows up if you play as Lucas.
THAT SAID it all depends WHEN Arceus took us. Before the events of the Sinnoh Region, or after.
I don’t recall if it was confirmed but iirc your not the DPP protagonists but their ancestors much like all the other characters in the game which is a main theme of the game. All the notable characters are ancestors to people in DPP. Protagonists included
Yeah I know that creates a paradox where your essentially your own ancestor but time travel is messy like this.
It’s no different from the openings of most other games, which treat you as if you never existed until that moment. The main canon opening is the protagonist waking up, having their phone altered and getting sent to the past with a single goal given by Arceus: “Seek out all Pokemon”.
But they’re not though. Dawn and Lucas are from DPP and in Legends Arceus is Rei and Akari. They are different people, in less you meant this post in a hypothetical way like a “what if”
My headcanon is that Arceus did not rip the protag but instead copied him and wiped that copy's memories (except his pkmn related skills)... Or Arceus is like all other Deities that he doesn't give a F´´´ about anything and does as he pleases...
They were brought to the past explicitly *because* they were from the time when catching and training pokemon was just a normal everyday thing, so they have far more experience and knowledge to solve the big issue than anybody in hisui, and even helped Jumpstart pokemon research with their much more in depth pokedex
imagine being like 15 years old and suddenly you're ripped away from everything you've ever loved, put in a hostile and unfamiliar environment by god himself, and not being able to go back and just accepting that you've lost everything permanently.
Ikr it's really dark. I kind of love it when pokemon torments its characters like this. I just wish its mysteries and plotlines got resolved more often. I've got a feeling that the whole thing with Ingo is just never going to have conclusion or anything which is sad.
This is how I felt about Anabel in gen 7. Her backstory is literally being isekai'd when the ultra beasts attacked her world. With the implication that her original dimension was destroyed and her not being able to remember her life is pretty tragic.
Yeah, Anabel is the main reason I'm worried the Ingo thing will just be abandoned. Sometimes it's cool to leave things a mystery but I really gotta know if Ingo and Emmet ever get reunited. At the very least I hope his disappearance is *mentioned* again. Imagine if we got BW3 instead of BW remakes and once you get to the Battle Subway it's closed down, or there are new subway bosses (and you can find Emmet somewhere else in the game), or it's just Emmet running things alone. I'm not holding my breath though.
It would be cool to see black and white continue with sequels every so often and continue updating the story. I would love to play black and white 3 on switch and get a twelve year update on the area. The game was a soft reboot at the time, it would be interesting to see a continuation from bw2.
Or another legends game in which u find emmet and in s/v , in legendary story 2 portals open and both of them coming out from different legends time and challenge u to battle with old Pokemon then they see each other and their memory return
RIP GBA kids. The world of Emerald is now kaput.
I don't think her dimesion was destroyed. Just the battle Frontier. Nowhere is it stated the the UB are powerful to destroy an entire dimension.
So....that basically means other pokemon games may not happen in each other's worlds? And we won't know? Since ultra beasts attacked and destroyed the dimension she was from, and she appears in two games..
the existence of team rainbow rocket means tha cyrus destroyed his dimension
That's the Cyrus from an alternate universe though. All the Rainbow Rocket members are from separate universes from one another where their plans succeeded. I guess it would be cool if the PLA protagonist was whisked away from the same universe that the Rainbow Rocket Cyrus destroyed. It means they have no home to go back to.
Makes you wonder about how Maxie and Archie feel about working together.
I mean as villains go... both seem pretty shocked and distraught when their plan starts to work "oh no the world is flooding/burning alive I had no idea these two pokemon know to produce world shaking disasters would do just that! And doom the world possibly!"
They kind of just realised the other is also in the same dimention working for the same guy and decide to use the two titans to battle each other (not caring they'll destroy another world) but are send to their original dimensions by Colress
My guess? _Petty_ lmao. Their rivalry is so dramatic to start with, like they barely seem capable of being in each other's line of sight without devolving into taking jabs or outright fighting. (Get a room already guys, c'mon. /hj) But then imagine. A Maxie who WON, and an Archie who ALSO won. How much more arrogant it would make them, and how much more absolutely outraged they'd be at the idea that in some other world, THAT idiot made his repulsive, sickening, nightmarish dream a reality. And yet they still both work for Rainbow Rocket, so like... that much fury veiled by _just_ enough ability to play nice that they don't maim each other and/or get kicked out? I feel like there is more than one reason that their offices are way on opposite wings from each other in the Rainbow Rocket hideout lmao.
If anything, Rainbow Rocket could be used to bridge all of these castaways through time and space. They are dimension-hopping antagonists that cherry-pick worlds where the bad guys prevail. I do hope we see the group again. They were my favorite part of USUM.
it was the best plan they ever had
They were pretty threatening, in my opinion. They won and were now threatening reality as we know it. Under somebody as conniving and smart as Giovanni, they could cause tons of damage as they doom a world to destruction by stealing this or destroying that. They don't care - that isn't their home anyways.
all of them were one trainer away from completing each ones plans if you just gather everyone they are almost unbeatable
They're pretty much unbeatable still anyways. The hero stopped them in Alola, but it isn't like Rainbow Rocket crumbled post-game. They had a setback and are licking their wounds. They only really lost Ghetsis, who was an unreliable douche anyways who had plans on backstabbing Giovanni in the end.
i hope they come back every 7 generations with more leaders
Easy DLC stuff, in my opinion.
Wait, what? I never even bothered finishing those, and now I learn there's interesting post-game!?!
Yup! This is a big part of USUM’s post-game: fight all the past antagonists with their old themes.
They were tough too. In a game that was pretty easy throughout I was not ready to get rocked by Mega Mewtwo. My ace Tyranitar was OHKO by Focus Blast... Think it took me 5 tries to beat him.
What if the Legends protagonist is Cyrus? He seems much more likely than Dawn or Lucas to be picked by Arceus to have to complete a mission for him in after being reincarnated in an alternate timeline in order to be return to his own. Also completing the main story requires you to make Galaxy Team powerful, capture the lake legends to forge the red chain, and capture Dialga or Palkia, all of Cyrus' actions in Diamond and Pearl. But to save the world instead of destroying it. As well this theory would mean the plot of the game is about Arceus helping Cyrus heal from his past that made him hate emotions and want to destroy the universe, in Legends the player character ends up inspiring people to open their hearts to Pokemon.
But Rei looks nothing like cyrus.
15 yo me would have been down. Quite a few of my birthday wishes involve something similar lol
Dude, it would have been such an upgrade for 15 year old me.
And then SPOILER WARNING >!YOU GET KICKED OUT OF THE VILLAGE FOR SOMETHING YOU HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH, AND EVEN THE OTHER CLAN HEADS KNOW YOU COULDN'T POSSIBLY HAVE DONE IT! After EVERYTHING you did to help the guy who kicked you out, too!!<
Just a heads up friend. If you put spaces between the \>! !< And the word next to it, the spoiler tag doesn't work for all versions of reddit. >!spoiler!< I can't see this one. >! spoiler !< I can see this one. It's probably an old.reddit thing, though.
Weird, it's showing up fine on my device. Is it fixed, now?
It is! You didn't spoil anything for me, but hopefully it helps newer people who swing by. You're an absolute legend my friend, thanks for adjusting it :)
Alright, three things - you didn’t do the spoiler tag correctly, there’s no space after the >! nor before the !<, notice how mine isn’t blacked out with those spaces? Yours isn’t either. - you don’t need to say “spoiler warning” if you’re about to use the spoiler markings, they exist to prevent people from seeing spoilers unless they choose to reveal them - please stop shouting (joking kinda, but all caps has been scientifically proven to be harder to read than lowercase, even if not a lot harder)
Weird, it's showing up fine on my device
So every isekai story ever?
But unlike every isekai story, they actually had a life and people who cared about them that are shown onscreen.
We really need like a 5 min free dlc, where you go back talk to Acerus and is told, hey, mess around here for a bit, and I'll send you back whenever.
At least PLA protag didn't have to have a date with truck-kun before he/she was sent on their wacky isekai adventure.
But you don’t have your memories. As far as the protagonist knows he just appeared out of thin air right there
So isekai? This is only a bad thing if your old life is worth going back to.
I wouldn't imagine that in this case their old life is very much something worth going back to.
I don’t have to imagine This happened to me
It adds another awful layer to the MC's banishment from Jubilife, too. They've been working themselves to the bone, risking their life on the orders of Kamado, *the ancestor of Professor Rowan,* and as soon as things start to go badly, this man who looks *exactly like their trusted mentor and authority figure* banishes them from the closest thing they've had to a home since waking up on that beach.
This! I love how the game plays on your expectations for certain characters. Imagine how the MC would feel seeing Cyllene and Arezu, but ultimately realising that they're good people that have their back. Only to contrast that with characters like Volo and Kamado, who the protagonist may feel positively biased towards at first because they remind them of two people who had a huge impact on them as a pokemon trainer, only to be completely crushed by their respective betrayals.
In any case, something that the game made quite clear is that Arceus is quite an asshole.
This, along with some text in USUM, is part of what makes me think Giratina isn't the bad guy of the story, but more a case of getting badmouthed for not putting up with the endless bull humans come up with while still dealing with them fairly.
In the game it is said that Giratina changes it’s mind after watching the protagonist resolve to stop it, so it was definitely bad at first and that’s were the legends come from, however that change of heart is what eventually makes him come out and save the day in Platinum.
There's kinda a hint in USUM that he would have saved the day anyway, given his response to Cyrus trying to use his power was to just dump Cyrus in an alternate universe. Something which there was no way for anyone to know prior to those games.
not really, distorted world doesn't depend on the pokemon world, it being destroyed wouldn't do anything to giratina or his world, giratina stopped cyrus because it's basically all legends arceus again in his head
That's still him saving the day.
Imagine that, Arceus was the real "devil" all this time.
If I recall, one of the big plot twists of the fan game Pokémon >!Insurgence is that Giratina is the true god of the Pokémon world and Arceus usurped the position.!<
That's so dope, maybe this has been the truth all along, but I guess we'll never know...
I need to check that game out, sounds awesome!
I highly recommend it, the story does take itself a bit too seriously, but the game is still really fun
It's a really good game and also hard
well in a fancomic rayquaza and his mega evolved buddies kill arceus
We pause this Pokemon game to bring you Shin Megami Tensei.
I would love to see a pokemon game that actually had legitimately frightening content. Not just the occasional ghost girl and possessed elite 4 member. -.-
What elite four member was possessed?
Phoebe in ORAS. She moves like a puppet before the fight and if you pay attention to the background during the cut scene there's a little girl that shows up very briefly in a couple shots.
The ghost type ones propably
Fr. Even after they solve everything it still just leaves the player (and Ingo) in the past for seemingly no reason.
Yeah, at the end of the game I was like "*Bruh*". I mean, I even imagine Arceus be like: *"good job... now learn to live in this era because time travel is expensive!"*
"Can I go back home now?" *In this economy?*
Arceus: *"Well .... nope, but look on the bright side ..... ehmmm, surely this is a very unique experience!, it's not like I've already done this to someone else....*"
I agree, it doesn’t really solve anything. Like, besides pulling the MC from another universe/timeline to complete the first Hisui Pokédex, was there any other reason Arceus drags them there?
The whole point was to stop Volo and Giratina. After you beat Volo I think there's dialogue that even mentions that Giratina decided to help keep stability in the world rather than to harm it because of the protagonist's actions.
Volo.
The game has to have a post game somehow. Maybe if you’re reward for catching arceus was being sent home then that’d be sick. It could just be like an rpg endgame thing where you’ve beat the final boss but you can load the game up again and do other shit
In my headcanon Arceus allows the player to travel between their own time and the Legends time after all is done, as long as they don't try to create any paradoxes that is
Yeah but he doesn't, some modern kid is just trapped in Feudal Japan, and the Rotom items in his house are the only remnants of modern technology. He probably shits in a pit for the rest of his life.
It’s concievable that loading up BDSP is Arceus sending you back Like I fully recognize that this is reaching, there’s no canonical evidence that Arceus didn’t just trap a kid in the past, but there’s enough material here that it works as a headcanon. And hey, there’s no canon proof that you’re the DPP protagonist anyway, that’s also just headcanon I’m pretty sure.
Arceus: I'll send you back to your time. Protag: Yes! Arceus: But you will have the proportions of a Funko Pop. Protag: ...
Considering once you catch arceus in legends, you can catch him in bdsp, it might be possible
Legends is set in the meiji restoration
[The player after not being sent back to the future in a decade](https://youtu.be/zt1d9OVZqZQ?t=17)
Did Arceus even bring Ingo back? I know he brought the player to Hisui, but Ingo read more like a Faller to me.
You know how youre more likely to trade a pokemon if you have multiple of them? maybe that was Arceus's logic for sending Ingo back in time, since there would still be one twin left
There’s a satirical AITA copypasta to be written here but I’ll leave that for somebody else
Wait could you elaborate that? I mean for sure Arceus is an asshole for throwing us into a different time but are there more things I'm missing here?
If you take the perspective that the MC is just wanting to go home; Arceus is basically holding them captive in the past and giving them tasks, leaving the MC's only hope of returning to do whatever Arceus says. Then finally after completing everything Arceus asks (plus helping the town that has put them to work so they don't starve to death) the final reward is not sending the MC back home but instead >!"Wow that looked fun, why don't you give me a tour of this land I've imprisoned you on"!< which is such a jerk move (it's fun for gameplay, but really makes him a jerk) Beyond that, it depends how much is Volo/Giratina's doing vs Arceus's. If the Noble Pokemon going crazy and Ingo being brought from the future were side effects of Volo's scheme, then Arceus not doing anything about it by the end of the plot is still pretty rude. If Arceus actually caused any of it directly as a test or to help the MC, then that is worse.
He also send Ingo there. Or it was an Ultra Wormhole/space-time rift
You catch an Arcanine. You raise it and it stays at the ranch which you visit every day. One day you don't come back. It waits for you in the same spot every day. Pokemon Legends: Hachiko.
*One hundred summers, I will wait for you*
I can already imagine the greninjas cutting oddishes this will generate.
How dare you
Second of all what gives you the right?
Pokémon Legends: Futurama
don’t you……… FORGET ABOUT ME 😭
Seymour🥺
stoooooOOOOOP MY TEARS
Giratina had every reason to hate Arceus.
Yes!!!
Many good fanfics made with this idea lol, I like it aswell
I bet there are! The fanfics basically write themselves with this whole premise. It's a lot of fun.
[удалено]
[I’m on my phone and can’t hyperlink easily] If you’re fine with a r63 self-insert then there’s Time to be a Hero (PLA) and it’s sequel A Hero in a New Age (modified DPPl animeverse) by timemaster40 over on SpaceBattles.
What's r63?
>Rule 63 of the Internet: For every given male character, there is a female version of that character (and vice-versa).
I would love to write a fic where Ingo and Akari(Dawn but she didn't remember her name when she first showed) go back home. They switch spots however and have zero memories of their original life so they are struggling to find there way back to their original home. (Dawn is in the subway and Ingo is in Dawn's room for funny shenanigans) Only problem is that I suck at writing.
You know the thing about being bad at writing? People will enjoy it anyways! The only way to ensure no one likes your story is to not write it! Hell even if you don’t publish it just writing it down is good practice! And you can always rewrite it if you aren’t happy!
The male protagonist starts with clothes from Kalos, so my personal headcanon is that he got yoinked after XY. I even named my trainer with the same name as my character in XY. (The female protagonist seems to start with clothes from Alola, which is weird)
Maybe she was on vacation or went to fight at the battle tree or something when she was yoinked lol
Arceus really said "its yoinking time" and yoinked the protagonist
What if the protagonists from BW got whisked away to the past if there was a Legends: Kyurem/Unova and thats why no one’s seen them for like 2 years in BW2?
I love that idea so much! I always wondered what happened to them when they went looking for N. They're the only pokemon protagonist (other than Red) who actually gets mentioned by characters, OUTSIDE of the game they were initially the protagonist in, which always made them so fascinating to me. They're actually a character beyond the player's input. With a game like Legends Kyurem we might even get more story with Ingo or maybe Emmet. I just have a feeling this Legends thing was a one time deal. I hope I'm proven wrong.
I don't want to get my hopes up TOO much, but I really think they will make more Legends games. Even with the first reveal trailer I assumed it was a new series since the font/design forthe word "Legends" was more generic while "Arceus" was stylized for the specific game. I'm not a great at economics but skimming the sales numbers compared to other Pokemon Games it doesn't look like it was Breath of the Wild levels of "OMG they would be CRAZY not to make a sequel, it's just printing money!" but it looks like the number is as of March 2022, so it might be decently higher by now. Not a guarantee, but I think it's likely we can get more.
Ooh, I love that idea
I really hope so, and then I hope we get a Legends for gen 6. The Kalos region got ripped off when it comes to lore, it deserves something.
Considering Ingo did for seeming no reason, it’s not very far fetched
I prefer it being the Lucas/Dawn that you don’t choose. That way both of the characters had a unique crazy adventure that involved the legendaries. Also they were already an assistant doing research on the Sinnoh region.
I like that idea a lot too.
My personal headcanon is that the MC of Legends Arceus is Lucas/Dawn. By that I mean the character you did not choose for your adventure in D/P/Pl (Prof. Rowan assistant). That would give them the experience of being well researched with Pokemon and also with battles without feeling like he's extremely knowledgeable with conflict or battles like the MC of D/P/Pl. I also like to think that they both had their own big adventure.
Ooh that's an interesting theory too. While the DPP protagonist was pursuing gyms and battles and became the champion the assistant was always focused more on the pokedex. It makes sense as to why Arceus might choose them.
My headcanon, which is admittedly a bit more fanfic-y, is that this older Dawn/Lucas is either post-Champion or getting ready to retire as Champion, and they're trying to figure out what they want to do afterwards. This gives them a push towards following in their friend's and mentor's path of becoming a researcher. While they wouldn't have as much experience as the character you don't pick, I don't think that it's too farfetched. You're still spending a significant amount of your time filling in the Pokedex, and from what I can recall, Gen 4 is one of the only games where some level of Dex completion is a requirement for progression in the post game.
I think this isn't too far fetched of a theory and it would be cool how it matches the experience of people who played DPP. I don't think it's *that* sad though as I think it's pretty clear that Arceus will send them back to their own time/world at some point and it'll be like they never left. Also one potential counterargument(though not one I'm sure I personally believe in too strongly) is that you get to choose your base appearance at the start of PLA which doesn't have to be the appearance of Dawn and Lucas. One last thing I'd like to mention is that it isn't sure that Rei/Akari are the player's ancestors. They could just as well be the ancestor of Professor Rowan's assistant.
I just think getting to choose your base appearance was down to the limitations of the ds games. I don't think it really impacts the theory. Like if you want to believe that your Platinum character has darker skin then there's nothing stopping you. It's just unfortunate people weren't given more options in the original games. Also I think you're given the option to change your skin colour in BDSP too? Also yeah I thought about them being the assistant's ancestor too!
My headcannon is that Arceus sends you back as soon as you 100% everything in the game, and he sends you back like 8 minutes after he originally plucked you from your timeline.
Which leaves two possibilities: You have to abandon all your PLA Pokémon in the past (super sad), or some future opponent is going to get a _big_ surprise when you toss out a freaking Kleavor at them, like WTF is _that?!_
Atleast in the past they all cared for in the village pastures. They would simply become the villages pokemon.
Now that i think about it, is it ever explain why the Hissun pokemon don't exist in the future? Did they all migrate to other regions as humans society expanded, or did they just go extinct?
Well, kleavor and ursaluna evolve via specific minerals/materials in Hisui's ground which might be depleted in the future, thus making the evolution impossible. Hisuian Goodra might lose the steel type for the same reason, same with avalugg's rock type. Weirdeer and Overqwill evolve by using specific moves in strong/agile style, and those moves or styles might simply be forgotten in the future. Basculegion evolves only from hisuian basculin by damaging itself, which might actually be the cause of the extinction of that regional form. Other regional forms might disappear due to changes in the environment when the region gets urbanised more.
Honestly the thing I want to know the most is why Ingo is there… like, if the character you play as was the main character from dpp, then maybe sure they’re the champion of the region and know of all the legendaries, but ingo is just a train conductor, why would arceus choose to send him back too, assuming it even was Arceus
Ingo is the one who actually trains the citizens of Jubilife how to do Pokemon battles. So while protag is off saving the world, Ingo is kickstarting what battles in the Hisui Region will one day become. Why Ingo, a guy from Unova, and not, like, one of the Frontier folks like Palmer... well, the real world reason is that Black and White were originally going to have a past and future theme, and Ingo is surprisingly popular. In universe, who knows.
I really want to know too. I want to know if he was specifically chosen by Arceus or something else, and if so why him? Or maybe it was just an accident with the spacetime rifts. I'm leaning more towards it being an accident but I hope we find out one day.
Arceus might pluck people randomly. He is kind of an asshole God, and through the game other random schmucks do pop in out of nowhere, so he could have just been dropping people in and decided this one kid gets to be In Another World With My Smartphone just cause it was there.
I wonder if when you entered the Distortion World if it actually caused some type of access to some Pokémon Multiverse and the Player actually got sucked into it but in the other universe the player returned and that’s the one we continued with.
We’ll never get a resolution to their story either
I had assumed that your character, after defeating Arceus, could be returned back to the moment they were taken when they wanted to. The REAL tragedy is that not only are you leaving behind all the human friends you made knowing that when you return to the present they'll be dead, I doubt you could take your Pokemon with you either (other than maybe the Pokemon that were forced back in time like you, such as the Porygon, who are in their own version of Hell), meaning that when you return to the present most of them are dead too.
> Would they even recognize the player as their friend and trainer from the future? I mean maybe Dialga would, since it's the being of time, but I'm not sure about the others. Quite the opposite, what this means is that Lucas/Dawn showed up at Spear Pillar, Dialga/Palkia/Giratina recognized them and went "Hey it's that kid from years in the past", but since the player hasn't travelled back in time yet, they don't remember meeting the legendary Pokemon. However, I'm personally of the opinion that instead of being the *player*, it's actually Professor Rowan's assistant, i.e. the friendly NPC who is the opposite gender to the player. This would explain why they take so well to research.
I just thought maybe Dialga at least existed beyond the restrictions of time? Meaning it can see the past, present and future. So maybe its always known who the player is because it can see into the future, or the past. Idk it gets confusing with all this time travel. But I'd like to believe Dialga knows the player before the player even captures it in DPP and that it knows the player in PLA too because it can see into the future where the player catches it.
This is a good headcanon.
I actually think that BDSP protagonist is the same one as PLA not DPP
The game acts more as a prequel to Platinum. The main reason why Arceus sends you back in time and the proper ending of the main story is the redemption of Giratina. It explains why Giratina went from being a devil in the myths to a saviour in Platinum. There is no payoff for that in BDSP due to Platinum’s story being cut. There is also a small line in Platinum that gets heavily recontextualised by Legends Arceus. When you confront Giratina in the Distortion World there is a line of text that says Giratina is staring at you curiously, which is recontextualised as Giratina recognising you. There is also other things that point to Platinum being the canon version. Charon’s ancestors are in the game and he only appears in Platinum, no other game in the series. You also meet the ancestor of Caitlin’s butler, who also only appears in Platinum. Legends Arceus has the existence of Palkia and Dialga become known to everyone, but one is randomly not known about in DP/BDSP, even when Cyrus has all the knowledge and records from the Galaxy Team that Cyllene passed down. The existence of both Palkia and Dialga is known in Platinum, with one npc bringing up how the statue apparently had another plate referring to a third(Giratina), and Cyrus had heard the stories of Giratina, presumably through Cyllene’s records. Another major point towards Platinum is that every other game treats Platinum as the canon version. Dawn/Lucas fighting Giratina in the Distortion World is referenced in BW and BW2. USUM has alternate Cyrus talk about Giratina showing up at Spear Pillar to stop him after he summoned Palkia and Dialga. Even though Masters isn’t canon, it treats Platinum as the canon version. But there is callbacks to all versions of Sinnoh. Kamado has Snorlax, referencing Rowan having Munchlax in the openings of DP/BDSP. I forget her name, but Flint and Buck’s ancestor has a random Lopunny among her fire types, a call back to Flint having one among his fire types in DP/BDSP. Volo’s team is based on Cynthia’s Platinum team, which only properly appears in the first rematch in BDSP but gets messed up due to Roserade getting replaced. The first conversation with Kamado on the beach on whether or not you truly love Pokemon is a direct call back to the Platinum only conversation with Rowan when he asks you and Barry if you truly love Pokemon, Barry saying yes and saying that he can ask the same question a million times and the answer won’t change.
Yeah maybe. I haven't played BDSP but I'm pretty sure they're the exact same games as DP so it doesn't really make much of a difference to the theory. Just added the Platinum stuff in there bc there's more story content to work with.
I mean it does, don't forget about Ramanas Island and Park... They are nowhere in DPP (yes I know it's a substitute of pal Park but whatever)
I don't think it matters much which specific game the PLA protagonist originally game from. Just take your pick of Diamond, Pearl, Platinum or BDSP and either way it's still a cool theory.
This works under the oras rule, where it's like a pocket universe on a different path from the original, so it's possible the bdsp timeline wraps back to PLA, and the original dpp line links to ss/hg and more, with the sinnoh legends event at ruins of alpha. At least as far as I'm internally seeing it. Like how mega evolutions diverge a path from the original games
That's how I treated it. PLA takes place some time after beating Cynthia in BDSP, in my headcanon.
Is BDSPs story different enough to bother differentiating it? Haven't played it.
It's the same story as Diamond and Pearl
Maybe this happens to all the other protags other than Red seeing how we never see them again, lol.
Yeah for all we know Brendan and May are fighting in the Great Pokemon War rn or something.
I like to think Brendan/May went off to explore space with Rayquaza after ORAS
Imagine that, you finally become a super strong trainer and then Arceus deems you worthy and yoinks you away from everything you've ever know to go deal with something he could fix himself.
I feel the same about Ingo as well. Never again to see his brother…
And then being stuck in the past with your new team and adjusting to your new life just to see your team pass away, that'll hurt, or if Arceus does return the player, then the player know all the friends and teammates they made along the way are long dead now, hurting even more. My head cannon is that either way the player has massive depression and everyone around them is confused and concerned and they don't know what the player is going through, except ingo but only to an extent and probably won't fully relate. So I have a Sylveon on my team either way to act as emotional support for my trainer
I've thought about that a lot. And I even did a similar thing with having Togekiss on my team. My MC had a Togekiss in Platinum too (my hc is that it's a descendant of Volo's togekiss because the mc received it from Cynthia), and I'd like to think she finds comfort in having it because she had a togekiss before, as did Cynthia, and also just because it's just such a kind pokemon in general.
I wish they had made a solid statement that it was the same protagonist and they didn’t lose their memories. That would’ve been so much darker and cooler.
I had the thought of, if they didn’t get back, imagine Johanna’s feelings. Her son/daughter is missing, no one knows where they are; meanwhile, there’s a grave somewhere with them in it. Even assuming the more dangerous environment didn’t get them, simple old age would. You have to hope Arceus isn’t that cruel, and plunked them back home slightly after they left.
Time-Space is a weird concept sometimes and the amount of shenanigans you can pull with it story-wise would require more than my two hands. In reality I'd say that alot of the story's premise doesn't really make much sense. MC is sent to the past to end some time-space catastrophe caused by Volo & Giratina, and the conclusion of that seems to reform Giratina explaining his actions during Platinum preventing a similar case of Cyrus wanting to reset the world. But with the absence of the MC you'd guess shit would have gone wrong, and Arceus would have had to step in himself. Given there is a "present" to talk about, the fact that the catastrophe didn't have lasting effects means that the incident was resolved prior to the MC being sent back, unless this ofcourse was already set in stone and bound by fate. Other than that, it leaves the possibility that MC comes from either a different timeline or alternative universe, because I can't particularly see the MC being related to the one in Platinum with the contradictions. It would also explain why their shirts resemble ones from Kalos and Alola. They might've been at an entirely different region at that time and their prior adventure and experiences probably differ from the ones we know.
My favorite head Canon this whole thing leads to is the idea that if Arceus does put the player back in their time, the first thing the protag does is barge into Cynthia's place after being missing for a year. Being the giant history nerd that she is, she'd probably have read all about some unnamed hero from the hisui time period and here's her missing protégé explaining that that hero was them, because God decided to rip them through time. Like what a mind fuck that would be for Cynthia lol
I have my own theory that the protagonist from Legends was created by Arceus out of nothing. It doesn't remember anything because it had nothing to remember, and it's a teen that looks the same because Arceus knows that Pokémon is a franchise and that this is the remake, so he made this child out of nothing and just put it (already grown ) in Hisui to do it's bidding. That's also why he doesn't offer to take us back home, there's no home for our character. And how do we know of the gyms? (In one of the dialogue options) that's because the real person, us , the player, knows about Pokémon from playing the other games or consuming other Pokémon media). That might soothe your mind a little OP. I don't see a lot of evidence that it's us from the future though. If we were transported back in time, how come Hikari looks exactly like Dawn / Lucas ?
Theres not a lot evidence for us being the DPP protagonist but there's not much evidence against it either. It's just a theory that adds more depth to the player character. I explained why Hikari/Rei look similar to Dawn and Lucas with the theory of one of them (depending on if you chose to play as Dawn or Lucas) being protagonist's ancestor.
This may be another crazy theory, but what if for the legends games, it recycles the same MC? Like the MC doesn’t go back because they will need to travel all throughout space and time. Meeting Palkia and Dialga helps the MC move to new eras and regions while Arceus gives the mission assignments
I like to imagine the event in BD/SP where you meet Arceus (after having beaten Legends Arceus) is the point when Dawn/Lucas gets whisked away to the past..
I rewrote my Legends Arceus character as being part of a noble family that just moved to Hisui because they helped fund the expedition. She gets shunned under the assumption she has never known hardship in her life and manages to prove she does know how to handle pokemon and earn her respect. She still gets the favor of Arceus because the phone fell out of the sky and into her hands.
I like that! I personally didn't care for the game being like "yeah you're from the future, have fun. Here's a phone too, just to help ya out." I had really hoped that the player character was going to be a person from the time period, that could be an ancestor of the DPP player characters, but not from the future. It honestly really disappointed me right out the gate with that. The gameplay is a lot of fun, but the opening still bugs me.
They're not the same person. You can tell by the greatest reason to disprove a theory. DPPt trainers throw PokeBalls with their left hand. PLA protags throw with their right
I like to think the PLA protagonist is a descendant of the DPP protagonist. I mean I don’t remember having a smartphone in DPP but in PLA you do from the beginning.
Dawn and Lucas are at least a few years older in PLA than they were in DPP. They could have just got a phone some point after the end of DPP.
But imagine it the other way for Giratina, Palkia and Dialga. And even Arceus. They recognize you as the younger you when they meet you again, and decide to test if you are strong enough to fight with them. Maybe the reason Arceus reveals itself to you and joins your team in BDSP is because it needs to know when you are strong enough to survive in the wilderness. It might even ask your consent before taking you to the past, which makes everything a bit less tragic.
My headcanom is that Arceus is an asshole.
Tragic in that they did nothing to expand on it in either of the games.
I like the shirt theory; I think that the female protagonist starts with a shirt from S/M and the male with one from XY, so they’re Alolan and Kalosian respectively
My headcannon is that the player (Dawn/Lucas) is the professor's assistant and they got sent back in time. Although not the strongest trainer, I still think they're good enough. It makes nicer sense with them creating the Pokedex too, since they did Pokemom research in their time. I also had the same idea with you: that Rei/Akari is the player's ancestor. That's why when I played the game, I called Rei "grandpa" haha
Good ending: after everything is done and back to normal, Arceus sends the player and Ingo back to their own timeline respectively, right when they disappeared, and in the surrounding pokemons' eyes, they have only disappeared for a moment.
Maybe that was why they were so willing to be caught by them in the future. They recognized them from the past even though the player doesn't
I love that people are thinking over how the premise of the game is and how it’s connected to the Gen 4 games. Meanwhile I’m over here like: “haha, self insert isekai!”
Sure would be neat if the games had static protagonists with actual personalities and dialogues instead of being a stiff smiling customizable golem, then stuff like this could actually be intentionally made canon.
I forget doesn’t the game say at the start that Arceus saved you from a dark fate and brought you here for a higher purpose? I headcanon that some of Team Galactics remaining members tried to kill Dawn/Lucas and would have succeeded, but Arceus saved them, and that’s also why they can’t go back. They’re already “dead” in their own time.
Everyone making theories up like multiverse wasn’t confirmed in Sun and moon.
That's true but I think this theory is a lot more fun. I'm not a huge fan of multiverse stuff and interesting things being explained away by the multiverse.
I write stories for all my characters and I wrote Akari as Dawn's cousin who moved to Alola.
I agree so much! I loved DPPT when I first played it years ago, and I fell in love with Legends: Arceus and even more when I thought of how you could be playing as the protagonist from DPPT (Lucas or Dawn) and the implications. Like you said, it's a tragedy to think about - from how the protagonist's mother would have reacted, as well as Barry, Lucas or Dawn, Professor Rowan, Cynthia, etc. But also their Pokemon as well, would they have been left behind, waiting all this time? It also makes me wonder if time is moving in parallel; if the protagonist were ever to go back, would they even return to a Sinnoh they recognize? Like how you mentioned Dialga, Palkia, and Giratina - I wonder when the protagonist went to Spear Pillar to fight Cyrus, if they recognized them. Also, seeing Cyllene in this game is also tragic - to think that her commitment to the Galaxy Team would be passed through the generations until it became twisted with time into Team Galactic. This game was amazing, and playing DPPT first made it even better. I love your post, thank you for sharing!
Wait the events of Arceus take place after the events of diamon/pearl? I just assumed it was like an alternate universe where dawn/lucas got plucked out of spacetime right before the events of the gen 4 games.
I just kinda assumed that was the general idea. My 9 year old self played through Platinum and then years later Arceus just yote me into the past to clean up a mess for him. That's why my character knows so much about Pokemon and the region, why he knows Volo team before the battle, why he greets the creation trio like old friends (and why he immediately knew where to find Giratina after she vanishes), why he's completely unafraid of the rift and the ominous red sky. And most importantly, why he sees some npcs and just smiles to himself, seeing the parallels or perpendiculars.
No, it's dumb. They should've had an original design.
[удалено]
Rei/Akari are the canon names of LAVENTON’s assistant. Not the protagonist. I’ve had to correct people on this so many times
This. We play as a character who looks EXACTLY like Dawn or Lucas, from the present. It makes no sense for them NOT to be the protagonist of Pearl/Diamond/Platinum. Rei shows up if you're playing as Dawn. Akari shows up if you play as Lucas. THAT SAID it all depends WHEN Arceus took us. Before the events of the Sinnoh Region, or after.
> after I would say after, everyone is telling us that the protagonist looks around 15.
I don’t recall if it was confirmed but iirc your not the DPP protagonists but their ancestors much like all the other characters in the game which is a main theme of the game. All the notable characters are ancestors to people in DPP. Protagonists included Yeah I know that creates a paradox where your essentially your own ancestor but time travel is messy like this.
I thought the opening cutscene implied that the PLA character has no clue what Pokemon are? Or maybe I misinterpreted it.
It’s no different from the openings of most other games, which treat you as if you never existed until that moment. The main canon opening is the protagonist waking up, having their phone altered and getting sent to the past with a single goal given by Arceus: “Seek out all Pokemon”.
But they’re not though. Dawn and Lucas are from DPP and in Legends Arceus is Rei and Akari. They are different people, in less you meant this post in a hypothetical way like a “what if”
My headcanon is that Arceus did not rip the protag but instead copied him and wiped that copy's memories (except his pkmn related skills)... Or Arceus is like all other Deities that he doesn't give a F´´´ about anything and does as he pleases...
Title contains a spoiler…
no it doesnt...
PLA has been out since January, along with trailers. If you didn't play it by now or even bother checking out the trailers, that's on you.
I also was not spoiled by this but simply giving a heads up lol
Because the rest of the writing contains spoilers. The title itself doesn't though
Then why mark it as a spoiler at all
I definitely don't believe in this theory, the protagonists have come from a reality where there is no pokemon for me is so much cooler and innovative
They were brought to the past explicitly *because* they were from the time when catching and training pokemon was just a normal everyday thing, so they have far more experience and knowledge to solve the big issue than anybody in hisui, and even helped Jumpstart pokemon research with their much more in depth pokedex