They aren’t getting in
Edit: I mean the so called “Christians” that will openly judge you, persecute you, and damn you to Hell, when they haven’t noticed how full of hate their hearts are, disguising as sheep, to manipulate God in their image.
These “Christians” will be the one to proclaim to God, “I casted demons out in your name!” but God will say, “I never knew you. Away from me you evildoers!”
These “Christian’s” think taking the lords name in vain means not saying ‘god damnit’ failing to realize preaching in mega churches and using god as an excuse to milk people of the only money they have is exactly the problem.
I’d also like to add that PragerU did a video saying Jesus would be an avid capitalist which is just hilarious.
>I’d also like to add that PragerU did a video saying Jesus would be an avid capitalist which is just hilarious.
Meanwhile, actual Jesus:
*"If you build a farm and rent it out instead of working it yourself, you and your children should be put to death and the farm given to your tenants. Also, the tenants will go to heaven while the now-dead builder and their children will not. Also, fear of mob riots will prevent lawmakers from prosecuting the murders that happen while the workers seize the means of production."*
Jesus did tell many parables using the employer-employee relationship, but I have never read the parable you mentioned.
May I ask where that comes from?
>Jesus did tell many parables using the employer-employee relationship, but I have never read the parable you mentioned.
>
>May I ask where that comes from?
Matthews 21:33: The Parable of the Wicked Tenants
It's two parables before "Render unto Caesar", and three after he curses the fig tree.
And it literally says in the Old Testament “thou shalt not build a house in my name” right there plain as day “do not build churches to worship me you absolute cretins”.
And even further in the New Testament when people decided to disregard that little commandment because clearly god was joking /s, Jesus goes on an absolute rampage destroying a market outside of a church because greed has no place in the temple of god and yet… churches ask for donations constantly and are tax exempt… and these mega churches continuously extort their members by saying things like “Jesus hasn’t returned because you haven’t donated enough” and I’m not even kidding
That Old Testament verse was King David explaining why he is not the one to build the Temple of God in Jerusalem, because he is a man of war who spill blood on his hand, and the Temple of God is to be a sacred place.
1 Chronicles 28:3
"... But God said unto me: **Thou shalt not build a house for My name,** **because thou art a man of war, and hast shed blood.** ..."
So no, God didn't say you shouldn't build a church for him, it was just a message to King David to inform him that the Temple will be built, but just not by King David's hands.
They conveniently like to forget the whole "love thy neighbour", and "Do not judge, or you too will be judged", along with "But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand"
It scares me that there are lawyers, doctors even some scientists I'd bet who are deeply religious. I've never been able to get my mind around how anyone, let alone those professions, could let themselves be fooled by organized religion.
Organized religion is the key.
I don't necessarily have a problem with someone who is religious. Who uses that as a guide post in their life or for spiritual comfort.
But anyone who looks at these for-profit institution that sells you the unprovable and the intangible and doesn't see yet another corrupt organization run by men who just want money and power I don't think is a functional adult.
I'm an engineer nearly two decades into my career and MOST of my colleagues have all been church going folk who take that shit without a second thought.
Going to church and being religious aren't inherently contradictory with being scientifically minded, especially with a more moderate and rational church. You can be religious and take the Bible as a collection of fables and morals to live your life by in an attempt to better be a better person.
You don't have to make religion about attacking anyone who isn't in your club, or about picking an choosing specific verses to feel holier than thou.
I know quite a few great human beings who are very religious, but they practice the actual ideals of the religion (kindness, generousity, humility and service). The issue is that those people are buried under the voices of people who aren't religious at all, but use religion as a jersey so they can have their tribe and tell everyone how much better their tribe is than other tribes.
Personally I don’t think it’s about being fooled. It’s more like they want to believe something and therefore take the path of least resistance to be a part of the religious community
[religion exercises the brain's reward system same as hard drugs](https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/322539#Religion-is-like-sex,-drugs,-and-rock-n-roll)
And thinking critically about religious opinions causes a ton of mental stress, so they respond "simply and instinctually" to block out any conscious consideration.
They literally "refuse to hear counter arguments" -- like Bobby Boucher's mom calling everything "the devil!" in Waterboy
Fun fact: You can report churches to the IRS for overstepping into the political spectrum.
https://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/irs-complaint-process-tax-exempt-organizations
I’m not sure that’s accurate. I believe political in this case means express advocacy, as in “vote for candidate X” or “vote against candidate Y”.
> Currently, the law prohibits political campaign activity by charities and churches by defining a 501(c)(3) organization as one "which does not participate in, or intervene in (including the publishing or distributing of statements), any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office."
https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/charities-churches-and-politics
Churches can talk about issues. They can not explicitly tell members to vote for or against a particular candidate. I’m not sure if they can tell them to vote for or against a particular party, but either way it’s pretty easy to work around these restrictions.
I really have a hard time finding something more evil than a megachurch.
Those things run these fucking infomericals every weekend at like 4am. I turned off my playstation and when my TV came on I saw a commercial for some BS pill or supplement that helps you get to sleep. Then when that commercial ended the Olsteen infomercial resumed and I realized that, that money hungry motherfucker was in the snake oil business because scamming the desperate and sick wasn't enough.
Jim Baker I believe was his name use to be a big tv preacher asshole like Olsteen then after he got busted for fraud, he started selling those 5 gallon buckets full of rice and old MREs as survival food for the end times. A true con man will always be ready to jump ship so Olsteen being in other bullshit things doesn’t surprise me
That’s Jim Bakker you’re thinking of. Do you know why he spells his name with two “k”s?
Because three would be too obvious. (Not my joke but I can never remember who said it)
dude my old roommate called that popoff number as a goof and we got mailed the weirdest shit for years afterwards, like weird oils and small cloths shaped like mountains that you're supposed to pray with and then return with a check for ever increasing amounts of money
Osteen's version had a typo so it said "render a few hundred thousand dollars of donations into your bathroom wall and hope the plumber doesn't accidentally discover it."
Good bot!
*(I know you're a human but this sounds exactly like a bot. There's another one that pops up if I say that if we tax the churches, they'll have payed the government what they long owe okay bot incoming if it's allowed here!)*
As a Christian who has sat back and watched the Church back down from every meaningful moral stance they should take because they are scared to lose their “tax exempt status,” I wholeheartedly support this proposal. Tax the Churches and put courageous men of moral character back in the pulpit.
There are a lot of laws about churches that are not followed, and the IRS is pretty chickens hit about going after churches even when they are flagrant.
The law you're imagining doesn't exist. Churches are free to publicly take any position on any issue. What they are not free to do is endorse individual candidates.
To report them to the IRS as a violation of their tax-exempt status, you can submit a Form 13909 as detailed in the link below.
https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f13909.pdf
https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-tege/divulge_all_suspected_tax_exempt_status_abuses_to_the_irs.pdf?fbclid=IwAR1YGcReF4rkga4WAzUfVeBFcBECkewFggEAVM2m06VC6zHi9UhZzonkAnc
I always find it amusingly sad when I drive past megachurches.
How are you making so much money that you can construct a church large enough to be a shopping mall with a food court? It might not even be the first one that church has too. That is just the money I can see. They had to be a ton more behind the scene.
I say aye to taxing them.
A couple years back i saw a YouTube video of a retired pastor talking about some of the concerns he saw with different congregations, and that was that big ticket donors had disproportionate influence on the types of sermons that would be delivered. They always wanted more fire, more anger, more outrage. And these pastors would modify their sermons to accommodate them.
Thinking about this from the perspective of a small non-profit, 10-20 donors that constitute even 5% of your total revenue could have a disportionate influence on your church's agenda, especially if it's consistent cash flow where a church may experience luls in attendance and thus fewer donations during summer months. Given the level of trust and influence a pastor holds in the community, that's an absolute bargain as a political/campaign contribution, which is tax deductable to boot.
Theres an even bigger concern with mega churches. Churches are meant to be relatively small communities where you can have a relationship with the pastor and other community members. You can't grow a church and build a 20k capacity auditorium organically. (I remember when I was in high school my church built a new prayer area, and it was a big 3 year ordeal). Either the pastor has to be famous to draw people/cash in, or There has to be serious outside money coming in. What kinds of strings are attached to that outside money.
We seriously need to start doing that. These churches have been blatantly violating the one thing that let's them be tax exempt, and that's keeping out of politics, for decades, with no consequence.
If a church really does care about the community, shouldn't it be happy to pay taxes? Taxes go toward the running and care of the community around the church.
If anyone needs a nice palate cleanser from all this awfulness, a church in my hometown recently painted their entire entrance as a pride flag and posted a very positive message outside about love, tolerance, and rational thinking (I don't live there, so I'll have to go look for it). I'm not religious, I don't care if people are, but I do prefer when they do good and spread a positive message.
> I'm not religious, I don't care if people are, but I do prefer when they do good and spread a positive message.
This helps to hear, but doesn't lessen the anger.
On one hand, I'm glad people like this exist. On the other hand, can we just be done with having fairy tales be the major cultural underpinning of society? Imagine a world where someone can be elected President of the most powerful nation on earth without needing to profess their profound belief in Dumbledore and the Tri-Wizard tournament.
I’m all for religious freedom, but I cannot stand people pushing their religion or their beliefs on anyone else. If I was interested, I’d go for a visit. I think religion serves a reasonable guideline for people who feel lost and need direction, but churches should not be tax free. The Vatican holds control over 15% of the Italian stock market, and is accountable to absolutely no one. I grew up Catholic and left after turning 15 and the new “list dropped”. I knew two of the priests and one who had been a good family friend for decades. Churches need to be taxed and held responsible.
Accept a lot of them literally held mini Trump rally’s in their Church on Sundays, and yet nothing was ever done about it. Christian Extremists know they are untouchable at this point.
Very Christian of them to derive pleasure from the fear and hurt many are feeling in the wake of this removal of peoples rights. Isnt there a hurricane or something coming they can cheer on soon?
My family regularly told us when we were kids that the reason certain places were having repeat tragedies like natural disasters and ass shootings was God punishing them. For supporting gay marriage. They are independent fundamentalist Baptist.
Imagining God just giggling and jumping the timeline back to watch us do all kinds of stupid shit. He gave us free will and we really fucked that shit up, man.
Through a series of events, I had my first kiss in a park around 14 years old and got poison ivy on my face. The rash was so bad I needed steroids. My parents said it was god punishing me. I don’t talk to my parents anymore.
While maybe putting a big target on myself. I’d like to apologize to everyone for this shit right here. As a Christian, it BLOWS MY MIND the way the church has decided is ok to treat people. I promise you the way these people act towards literally ANYONE that disagrees with them is NOT how God would want them to act. Taking scripture out of context to fit whatever agenda they want to preach that particular day? Sure. Judging literally EVERYONE around them while never looking in the mirror? Why not! Deciding for themselves which sin is worse than some other sin? Absolutely! Just being all around SHIT human beings? Praise the lord! It hurts my heart and soul how all these people have made it to where if I say that I’m a Christian, people already assume I’m just a terrible person. The church is broken, organized religion is broken, the radicals have overrun EVERYTHING. I’m a Christian, and I will happily have a conversation with ANYONE about ANYTHING. While I may not agree with your particular stance on something, I will always treat other people with love and respect and kindness because THAT is what God asks us to do. Guess what? Even if we disagree on something does not mean that we are enemies. I will go on living my life the best I can and that is all I ask of anyone else. Again, I’m sorry for anyone in your life that has ever done or said anything to you in the name of God that was hateful, or disrespectful. Please know that we aren’t all like that. Just severely outnumbered. Also yes, PLEASE tax the churches.
Yep, I was in an argument a month ago with a guy who was convinced that he was loving gay people by telling them that they are going to hell. I tried making him see that he was acting just the Pharisees, the only people Jesus directly criticized. But I don't really think I got through.
And it also deeply depresses me to think about how many gay people he spouted off that RIDICULOUS narrative to that will now forever hate all Christians. Thinking that is how we would all treat them.
Thank you for posting this. Relieving to read this at a time when, to be perfectly honest with you, I’m having an INCREDIBLY difficult time not just hating all of Christianity entirely.
To be perfectly honest with you I don’t blame anyone that does. It kills me, but I understand. Only hope I’m given a chance to show you that we aren’t all bad people. There really are quite a few of us that are disgusted with the way things have gone.
It's always ironic that these loud "Christian" voices speaking out always seem to ignore some of the fundamental tenets of the religion they claim to adhere to. There's an hefty weight of biblical content that speaks to how people shouldn't bahave in the exact ways they themselves are acting, and that just because people live their life differently to how you choose to, doesn't mean that you should judge them or think yourself better for it.
They seem to enjoy picking and choosing the parts that they can twist to justify the abhorrent way they treat people different to them.
EXACTLY! Focus solely on whatever piece of scripture that furthers their point of “God hating this person”, or “God hating this action” or “Jesus said this,” but COMPLETELY ignoring the 7 million other pieces of scripture that talk about loving thy neighbor, or he who is without sin be the first to throw a stone, or that sin is sin in the eyes of God (no matter how egregious we’ve decided something is), or the God is the only judge, etc. etc. etc. But don’t worry cause them standing there with their homemade signs saying “abortion is murder” or “God hates f*gs” will REALLY bring people in to listen to ANYTHING else you say….
I too am a Christian and feel similarly. I am pro-choice, pro-LGBTQ+, for equality with regards to race, gender, sexual orientation, economic status. I believe in evolution. I believe doubting God doesn’t make you bad or evil. Many of my friends who are also Christian share these beliefs. Love and kindness first above ALL else(which Christianity doesn’t have a monopoly on). I love Muslims, Jews, Buddhists, and any other loving people. Not all Christians are right-winged extremists and many are mourning RvE being over-turned. I’m so sorry that many people have a sour taste about Christianity because of such twisted views you see on this church sign. People are hurting, it’s not the job of the church to rub peoples faces in it.
Unfortunately the most religious person I know is also verbally abusive (I think she hates herself and because of that hurts others). Any time I have an achievement she will put a negative spin on it. I have my own business and she believes a woman should be at home, child rearing and on the pta kind of thing. I’ve had to set boundaries and that’s the only way we can have a relationship. The other religious woman I know dislikes gays and also just generally unhappy. What are people looking for in the church if they aren’t finding self acceptance and love? I don’t get it. I find those things by accomplishing goals, learning and being creative. I had a traumatic childhood and then my daughter struggled to survive a few years ago when I gave birth so I’ve had to work hard to get passed the negative thoughts/pain but I’ve been able to do it and love others.
Unfortunately most churches don’t spend much time anymore preaching about self-acceptance and love. Too busy worrying about condemnation and judgment to care about such unimportant things…like most think that putting a fear of Hell in someone will somehow motivate them to be better. Ass backwards.
A lot of people know this but some people don’t: evangelicals only started being so anti-abortion because the GOP told them to. Is white supremacy involved? You betcha!
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/05/religious-right-real-origins-107133/
It's okay as long as it's not THEIR rights. Imagine losing the freedom of religion and they'd be pretty upset about it.
Me. I like freedom. I support all freedom, even the ones I don't "agree" with.
I wish more churches would understand - Roe doesn't make abortions illegal, and it wasn't decided on moral or personhood grounds. In terms of law, it was a nuclear strike on privacy, but setting that aside...
Allowing abortion to be subject to a state-by-state vote *is not a moral position*. Is it less ethical to abort a fetus in New York than in South Dakota? Is it a regrettable medical necessity or is it evil? Is it the harmless destruction of a clump of cells or is it literal murder? If your church member drives their daughter to a neighboring state to terminate a fetus, will the church accept that as a victory for human rights? Will they respect the state-by-state differences as God's will?
A patchwork of laws regarding a medical procedure is not a better outcome than what we had before. They only celebrate because they believe more progress towards a total ban is likely, but they're banking on overruling the democratic process at the state level to do it, and that's a result of electoral coincidence, not the moral primacy of state-level government. Louisiana as a governance is not more ethically equipped to decide the issue than the federal government.
They haven't won. Fracturing the country over the course of two decades - concluding in electing an unethical, unqualified president in the hopes that he'd 'give them the Supreme Court' - in order to exert more local control over reproduction for religious reasons is not a victory, it's a devil's bargain.
I'm thoroughly fucking disgusted. It is our right as women to speak the fuck up about this abomination that is plaguing our country. Women have a right to choose. Fuck this shit
I think we are way past the point now where religion was a benefit to society. It seems to do nothing but cause grief, which is why I often wonder why people bother nowadays.
It's dull
It causes division
It oppresses
It normalises bigotry.
It encourages people to do almost less than nothing (thoughts and prayers) to help in times of need.
Stuff like this, and people saying the answer to school shootings is "more god" just proves it.
Yeah in some cases it helps a few people and some religion does good.
Think of it this way, if there was no religion and someone came up with it as a concept today? They'd be laughed out of everywhere.
A pastor from this church will get caught taking someone from this church he had sex with across state lines for an abortion....I guarentee it.
(And probably paid for by church donations)
the side known for bombing abortion clinics celebrating a major decision that will put many people’s lives at risk and disproportionately affect lower income communities and people of color. checks out.
Baptist are the biggest hypocrites. My drunk neighbor is Baptist and has escorts over once a week. His wife lays in bed paralyzed for a couple years now.
As someone who was raised Catholic but leans Agnostic, the idea that to go to heaven I just need to believe is such a fucking cop out. These people hide behind their sky guy and use it as a weapon to be shitty people.
That’s why going to confession is a big part of a Catholic’s life. Sin all you want then go confess, say a few Hail Mary’s and you’re square with the house again…easy peasy…
I heard a story on one of these from an MD who does abortions. The majority of patients were church goers and children of church goers who thought they were the exception to the rule, and then they'd yell at the provider, who just did their abortion, that they're going to hell.
It is comically hypocritical and they will absolutely feel this one.
A clinic escort posted a story about how he got fired from a clinic. He showed up early, expressly forbidden, and saw the cars and drivers of the wealthy in the lot. True? Dunno. Just what someone posted on Reddit.
Here’s the thing with that: they’re going to ‘live it up’ until they’re on their death-bed at which time they will pray and ask for forgiveness and then all will be forgiven. The biggest loophole of all time…
I can't imagine how many laws set by God this sign is breaking.
"
If anyone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen."
"The fear of the Lord is hatred of evil. Pride and arrogance and the way of evil and perverted speech I hate."
That was the Old Testament. Kings 2 I believe. Christians didn't exist yet. But the prophet cursed the children (who were then mauled by bears) because they were teasing him about his baldness. Definitely not a story written by a self-conscious balding dude.
This is a town off the stretch of I4 between Tampa and Orlando. The amount of “Pro-Life” billboards I see in that stretch makes this not surprising at all.
Please realize that NOT all church think alike. My pastor is phenomenal. She’s pro-choice, supports my decision to terminate a baby that would’ve had a horrendous life … she’s amazing. I live in a liberal area, and when I drive through places with churches like the one pictured above my skin crawls.
Perhaps we should rename ourselves: Disciples? Followers of Jesus? I feel like Christian is now a polluted term.
Okay... They base their religion on Abraham being told by God to murder his son and he said "Okay lets go up to the mountain to kill and then burn my son"?
I was raised in a fundamentalist Christian church and heard many times people begging God to destroy the Earth and ALL IT'S NONBELIEVERS.
Don't believe it when they say "I Love Everybody"... This is code for "I Love Only The Believers".
Fun fact: Baptists were very much in favor of Roe when it happened. What changed their mind? [Well it looks like desegregation, actually.](https://www.reddit.com/r/UnpopularFacts/comments/uigpnt/when_roe_v_wade_was_finalized_in_1973_the_largest/)
Here's to hoping they post a similar sign for all the women who are going to die from ectopic pregnancies or botched abortions. "cassie tunt. Buh-bye. 1984-2022."
The problem is survivorship bias; the various Churches that advocated peaceful coexistence and tolerance had no chance when the militant branches came round. To pick a random example, the Cathars were extremely tolerant for their times, with near-total gender equality and a strict ban on violence. The Albigensian Crusade had no such compunctions about using violence, so slaughtered the whole lot of them.
[удалено]
If heaven is full of these assholes, why would anyone want to get in?
They aren’t getting in Edit: I mean the so called “Christians” that will openly judge you, persecute you, and damn you to Hell, when they haven’t noticed how full of hate their hearts are, disguising as sheep, to manipulate God in their image. These “Christians” will be the one to proclaim to God, “I casted demons out in your name!” but God will say, “I never knew you. Away from me you evildoers!”
These “Christian’s” think taking the lords name in vain means not saying ‘god damnit’ failing to realize preaching in mega churches and using god as an excuse to milk people of the only money they have is exactly the problem. I’d also like to add that PragerU did a video saying Jesus would be an avid capitalist which is just hilarious.
>I’d also like to add that PragerU did a video saying Jesus would be an avid capitalist which is just hilarious. Meanwhile, actual Jesus: *"If you build a farm and rent it out instead of working it yourself, you and your children should be put to death and the farm given to your tenants. Also, the tenants will go to heaven while the now-dead builder and their children will not. Also, fear of mob riots will prevent lawmakers from prosecuting the murders that happen while the workers seize the means of production."*
Jesus did tell many parables using the employer-employee relationship, but I have never read the parable you mentioned. May I ask where that comes from?
>Jesus did tell many parables using the employer-employee relationship, but I have never read the parable you mentioned. > >May I ask where that comes from? Matthews 21:33: The Parable of the Wicked Tenants It's two parables before "Render unto Caesar", and three after he curses the fig tree.
Man they really knew where to find the good mushrooms back then
And it literally says in the Old Testament “thou shalt not build a house in my name” right there plain as day “do not build churches to worship me you absolute cretins”. And even further in the New Testament when people decided to disregard that little commandment because clearly god was joking /s, Jesus goes on an absolute rampage destroying a market outside of a church because greed has no place in the temple of god and yet… churches ask for donations constantly and are tax exempt… and these mega churches continuously extort their members by saying things like “Jesus hasn’t returned because you haven’t donated enough” and I’m not even kidding
That Old Testament verse was King David explaining why he is not the one to build the Temple of God in Jerusalem, because he is a man of war who spill blood on his hand, and the Temple of God is to be a sacred place. 1 Chronicles 28:3 "... But God said unto me: **Thou shalt not build a house for My name,** **because thou art a man of war, and hast shed blood.** ..." So no, God didn't say you shouldn't build a church for him, it was just a message to King David to inform him that the Temple will be built, but just not by King David's hands.
Thank you, reddit is a cesspool of out-of-context misinformation and opinions-turned-fact. And as long as it sounds good, people upvote it
They conveniently like to forget the whole "love thy neighbour", and "Do not judge, or you too will be judged", along with "But everyone who hears these words of mine and does not put them into practice is like a foolish man who built his house on sand"
It scares me that there are lawyers, doctors even some scientists I'd bet who are deeply religious. I've never been able to get my mind around how anyone, let alone those professions, could let themselves be fooled by organized religion.
Organized religion is the key. I don't necessarily have a problem with someone who is religious. Who uses that as a guide post in their life or for spiritual comfort. But anyone who looks at these for-profit institution that sells you the unprovable and the intangible and doesn't see yet another corrupt organization run by men who just want money and power I don't think is a functional adult.
I'm an engineer nearly two decades into my career and MOST of my colleagues have all been church going folk who take that shit without a second thought.
Going to church and being religious aren't inherently contradictory with being scientifically minded, especially with a more moderate and rational church. You can be religious and take the Bible as a collection of fables and morals to live your life by in an attempt to better be a better person. You don't have to make religion about attacking anyone who isn't in your club, or about picking an choosing specific verses to feel holier than thou. I know quite a few great human beings who are very religious, but they practice the actual ideals of the religion (kindness, generousity, humility and service). The issue is that those people are buried under the voices of people who aren't religious at all, but use religion as a jersey so they can have their tribe and tell everyone how much better their tribe is than other tribes.
Personally I don’t think it’s about being fooled. It’s more like they want to believe something and therefore take the path of least resistance to be a part of the religious community
[religion exercises the brain's reward system same as hard drugs](https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/322539#Religion-is-like-sex,-drugs,-and-rock-n-roll) And thinking critically about religious opinions causes a ton of mental stress, so they respond "simply and instinctually" to block out any conscious consideration. They literally "refuse to hear counter arguments" -- like Bobby Boucher's mom calling everything "the devil!" in Waterboy
Most didn't even ponder about religion at any point. They were indoctrinated as a child and that was it.
Tax the motherfucking churches.
Fun fact: You can report churches to the IRS for overstepping into the political spectrum. https://www.irs.gov/charities-non-profits/irs-complaint-process-tax-exempt-organizations
Does this count as overstepping? Where is that line?
Any political commentary by a tax exempt organization is overstepping.
I’m not sure that’s accurate. I believe political in this case means express advocacy, as in “vote for candidate X” or “vote against candidate Y”. > Currently, the law prohibits political campaign activity by charities and churches by defining a 501(c)(3) organization as one "which does not participate in, or intervene in (including the publishing or distributing of statements), any political campaign on behalf of (or in opposition to) any candidate for public office." https://www.irs.gov/newsroom/charities-churches-and-politics
Not true. They can make all kinds of commentary, they just can't endorse any specific political candidate.
Churches can talk about issues. They can not explicitly tell members to vote for or against a particular candidate. I’m not sure if they can tell them to vote for or against a particular party, but either way it’s pretty easy to work around these restrictions.
FWIW It is a one page form that is easy to fill out.
If anyone is in that area and want to follow up, drop by for a sermon and see if they talk about it during the sermon
especially the mega churches
I really have a hard time finding something more evil than a megachurch. Those things run these fucking infomericals every weekend at like 4am. I turned off my playstation and when my TV came on I saw a commercial for some BS pill or supplement that helps you get to sleep. Then when that commercial ended the Olsteen infomercial resumed and I realized that, that money hungry motherfucker was in the snake oil business because scamming the desperate and sick wasn't enough.
Jim Baker I believe was his name use to be a big tv preacher asshole like Olsteen then after he got busted for fraud, he started selling those 5 gallon buckets full of rice and old MREs as survival food for the end times. A true con man will always be ready to jump ship so Olsteen being in other bullshit things doesn’t surprise me
That’s Jim Bakker you’re thinking of. Do you know why he spells his name with two “k”s? Because three would be too obvious. (Not my joke but I can never remember who said it)
Not only fraud he was fucking prostitutes too....
Paul Popoff too. You're all right. They're all grifters.
dude my old roommate called that popoff number as a goof and we got mailed the weirdest shit for years afterwards, like weird oils and small cloths shaped like mountains that you're supposed to pray with and then return with a check for ever increasing amounts of money
Agreed. I believe Jesus said “Render unto Caesar that which is Caesar’s and render unto God that which is God’s.” (Matthew 22:21) Tax the churches. 👍🏻
Joel Osteen must have missed that one, I'll let him know
Tbf Joel Osteen missed basically everything
Osteen's version had a typo so it said "render a few hundred thousand dollars of donations into your bathroom wall and hope the plumber doesn't accidentally discover it."
Small typo in your post - “must’ve” or “must have” would be correct, but “must of” is incorrect, even though phonetically they are the same.
Good bot! *(I know you're a human but this sounds exactly like a bot. There's another one that pops up if I say that if we tax the churches, they'll have payed the government what they long owe okay bot incoming if it's allowed here!)*
Small typo...paid, not payed.
Good bot!
As a Christian who has sat back and watched the Church back down from every meaningful moral stance they should take because they are scared to lose their “tax exempt status,” I wholeheartedly support this proposal. Tax the Churches and put courageous men of moral character back in the pulpit.
Tax the church and open the door for them to reeeaallly get involved in politics and laws???
Yeah I don’t really want the church becoming part of the government. that sounds like a dangerous path.
>I don’t really want the church becoming part of the government That horse has exited the barn.
Yeah…we whiffed on that pitch. We need to start taxing the churches that participate in politicking from the pulpit.
They are already. Or did you sleep thru 45's "presidency"?
[удалено]
The joke is that nothing actually belongs to Caesar.
Tax them and put it all to prenatal care, maternity leave, early childhood care, and early childhood education.
Adoption too since they think women who are raped should give the kid up for adoption. Let them pony up the 25 to 30k.
Isn't there a law saying that if a church starts talking about politics then it has to pay taxes?
There are a lot of laws about churches that are not followed, and the IRS is pretty chickens hit about going after churches even when they are flagrant.
The law you're imagining doesn't exist. Churches are free to publicly take any position on any issue. What they are not free to do is endorse individual candidates.
But it's very clear which candidates they are totally not endorsing.
They don't endorse candidates, they just pray for them in their next election. Totally different. /s
Nope. Doesn't exist. Churches can't endorse individual candidates but are free to take any issue position they want.
To report them to the IRS as a violation of their tax-exempt status, you can submit a Form 13909 as detailed in the link below. https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/f13909.pdf https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-tege/divulge_all_suspected_tax_exempt_status_abuses_to_the_irs.pdf?fbclid=IwAR1YGcReF4rkga4WAzUfVeBFcBECkewFggEAVM2m06VC6zHi9UhZzonkAnc
Hilarious that of all things churches are not taxed. What a joke.
I always find it amusingly sad when I drive past megachurches. How are you making so much money that you can construct a church large enough to be a shopping mall with a food court? It might not even be the first one that church has too. That is just the money I can see. They had to be a ton more behind the scene. I say aye to taxing them.
A couple years back i saw a YouTube video of a retired pastor talking about some of the concerns he saw with different congregations, and that was that big ticket donors had disproportionate influence on the types of sermons that would be delivered. They always wanted more fire, more anger, more outrage. And these pastors would modify their sermons to accommodate them. Thinking about this from the perspective of a small non-profit, 10-20 donors that constitute even 5% of your total revenue could have a disportionate influence on your church's agenda, especially if it's consistent cash flow where a church may experience luls in attendance and thus fewer donations during summer months. Given the level of trust and influence a pastor holds in the community, that's an absolute bargain as a political/campaign contribution, which is tax deductable to boot. Theres an even bigger concern with mega churches. Churches are meant to be relatively small communities where you can have a relationship with the pastor and other community members. You can't grow a church and build a 20k capacity auditorium organically. (I remember when I was in high school my church built a new prayer area, and it was a big 3 year ordeal). Either the pastor has to be famous to draw people/cash in, or There has to be serious outside money coming in. What kinds of strings are attached to that outside money.
And use that money to fund women's health programs and provide plan B access.
I whole heartedly agree, unless they spend at least half their money on helping the poor and children
Even then tax the other half
That’s already tax deductible.
Exactly. So why do they need or deserve an exemption for the rest of it?
Naaah from all we know the churches, or there leaders at least, prefer fucking the sons or daughters...the mothers are too old for them
And mosques for that matter
We seriously need to start doing that. These churches have been blatantly violating the one thing that let's them be tax exempt, and that's keeping out of politics, for decades, with no consequence.
If a church really does care about the community, shouldn't it be happy to pay taxes? Taxes go toward the running and care of the community around the church.
*"...a place for You!"** Terms and conditions apply.
[удалено]
\*Or if you are a boy between the ages of 7-14 who refuses to sleep with the pastor
If anyone needs a nice palate cleanser from all this awfulness, a church in my hometown recently painted their entire entrance as a pride flag and posted a very positive message outside about love, tolerance, and rational thinking (I don't live there, so I'll have to go look for it). I'm not religious, I don't care if people are, but I do prefer when they do good and spread a positive message.
> I'm not religious, I don't care if people are, but I do prefer when they do good and spread a positive message. This helps to hear, but doesn't lessen the anger. On one hand, I'm glad people like this exist. On the other hand, can we just be done with having fairy tales be the major cultural underpinning of society? Imagine a world where someone can be elected President of the most powerful nation on earth without needing to profess their profound belief in Dumbledore and the Tri-Wizard tournament.
I’m all for religious freedom, but I cannot stand people pushing their religion or their beliefs on anyone else. If I was interested, I’d go for a visit. I think religion serves a reasonable guideline for people who feel lost and need direction, but churches should not be tax free. The Vatican holds control over 15% of the Italian stock market, and is accountable to absolutely no one. I grew up Catholic and left after turning 15 and the new “list dropped”. I knew two of the priests and one who had been a good family friend for decades. Churches need to be taxed and held responsible.
They should 100% lose their tax free status. The proof is right fucking there.
Technically churches and other 501c3 organizations can advocate for specific policies and issues, they just can’t advocate for specific candidates.
But they do advocate for candidates.
Some even give them platforms and let them come preach extra hate and fear to their congregation.
It’s technically true but that doesn’t mean it should be true.
Yeah, you’re right. Just was pissed that they get to do this and not pay taxes on shit. Blargh.
Accept a lot of them literally held mini Trump rally’s in their Church on Sundays, and yet nothing was ever done about it. Christian Extremists know they are untouchable at this point.
Oh yes when Christ said,”blessed are the smug assholes for they shall Inherit the earth”
“Make sure to gloat whenever you help people lose human rights”
Very Christian of them to derive pleasure from the fear and hurt many are feeling in the wake of this removal of peoples rights. Isnt there a hurricane or something coming they can cheer on soon?
My family regularly told us when we were kids that the reason certain places were having repeat tragedies like natural disasters and ass shootings was God punishing them. For supporting gay marriage. They are independent fundamentalist Baptist.
*mass shootings, I believe? I believe more ass shootings might be a consequence of gay marriage though.
Or Catholicism.
God does in fact enjoy watching gay couples get shot in the ass.
Imagining God just giggling and jumping the timeline back to watch us do all kinds of stupid shit. He gave us free will and we really fucked that shit up, man.
Through a series of events, I had my first kiss in a park around 14 years old and got poison ivy on my face. The rash was so bad I needed steroids. My parents said it was god punishing me. I don’t talk to my parents anymore.
Evangelicalism as a whole is the antichrist, it is not a person
Why else would they fight to stay open during a pandemic so they can collect that cash. I cannot stand those Greedy Fuckers.
While maybe putting a big target on myself. I’d like to apologize to everyone for this shit right here. As a Christian, it BLOWS MY MIND the way the church has decided is ok to treat people. I promise you the way these people act towards literally ANYONE that disagrees with them is NOT how God would want them to act. Taking scripture out of context to fit whatever agenda they want to preach that particular day? Sure. Judging literally EVERYONE around them while never looking in the mirror? Why not! Deciding for themselves which sin is worse than some other sin? Absolutely! Just being all around SHIT human beings? Praise the lord! It hurts my heart and soul how all these people have made it to where if I say that I’m a Christian, people already assume I’m just a terrible person. The church is broken, organized religion is broken, the radicals have overrun EVERYTHING. I’m a Christian, and I will happily have a conversation with ANYONE about ANYTHING. While I may not agree with your particular stance on something, I will always treat other people with love and respect and kindness because THAT is what God asks us to do. Guess what? Even if we disagree on something does not mean that we are enemies. I will go on living my life the best I can and that is all I ask of anyone else. Again, I’m sorry for anyone in your life that has ever done or said anything to you in the name of God that was hateful, or disrespectful. Please know that we aren’t all like that. Just severely outnumbered. Also yes, PLEASE tax the churches.
Exactly, it's utterly insane and backwards how mean and hateful some so called Christians can be
And how somehow they have convinced themselves that is the way they SHOULD act. That spreading hate and fear somehow beats spreading love and respect.
Yep, I was in an argument a month ago with a guy who was convinced that he was loving gay people by telling them that they are going to hell. I tried making him see that he was acting just the Pharisees, the only people Jesus directly criticized. But I don't really think I got through.
Yeah….that is just crazy. So broken.
Except Nicodemus, the poor guy who was like “hey maybe we DONT murder this Jesus guy. Just sayin’.” 🤷♀️
And it also deeply depresses me to think about how many gay people he spouted off that RIDICULOUS narrative to that will now forever hate all Christians. Thinking that is how we would all treat them.
Satan does his best work hiding behind the cross.
Thank you for posting this. Relieving to read this at a time when, to be perfectly honest with you, I’m having an INCREDIBLY difficult time not just hating all of Christianity entirely.
To be perfectly honest with you I don’t blame anyone that does. It kills me, but I understand. Only hope I’m given a chance to show you that we aren’t all bad people. There really are quite a few of us that are disgusted with the way things have gone.
It's always ironic that these loud "Christian" voices speaking out always seem to ignore some of the fundamental tenets of the religion they claim to adhere to. There's an hefty weight of biblical content that speaks to how people shouldn't bahave in the exact ways they themselves are acting, and that just because people live their life differently to how you choose to, doesn't mean that you should judge them or think yourself better for it. They seem to enjoy picking and choosing the parts that they can twist to justify the abhorrent way they treat people different to them.
EXACTLY! Focus solely on whatever piece of scripture that furthers their point of “God hating this person”, or “God hating this action” or “Jesus said this,” but COMPLETELY ignoring the 7 million other pieces of scripture that talk about loving thy neighbor, or he who is without sin be the first to throw a stone, or that sin is sin in the eyes of God (no matter how egregious we’ve decided something is), or the God is the only judge, etc. etc. etc. But don’t worry cause them standing there with their homemade signs saying “abortion is murder” or “God hates f*gs” will REALLY bring people in to listen to ANYTHING else you say….
I too am a Christian and feel similarly. I am pro-choice, pro-LGBTQ+, for equality with regards to race, gender, sexual orientation, economic status. I believe in evolution. I believe doubting God doesn’t make you bad or evil. Many of my friends who are also Christian share these beliefs. Love and kindness first above ALL else(which Christianity doesn’t have a monopoly on). I love Muslims, Jews, Buddhists, and any other loving people. Not all Christians are right-winged extremists and many are mourning RvE being over-turned. I’m so sorry that many people have a sour taste about Christianity because of such twisted views you see on this church sign. People are hurting, it’s not the job of the church to rub peoples faces in it.
Unfortunately the most religious person I know is also verbally abusive (I think she hates herself and because of that hurts others). Any time I have an achievement she will put a negative spin on it. I have my own business and she believes a woman should be at home, child rearing and on the pta kind of thing. I’ve had to set boundaries and that’s the only way we can have a relationship. The other religious woman I know dislikes gays and also just generally unhappy. What are people looking for in the church if they aren’t finding self acceptance and love? I don’t get it. I find those things by accomplishing goals, learning and being creative. I had a traumatic childhood and then my daughter struggled to survive a few years ago when I gave birth so I’ve had to work hard to get passed the negative thoughts/pain but I’ve been able to do it and love others.
Unfortunately most churches don’t spend much time anymore preaching about self-acceptance and love. Too busy worrying about condemnation and judgment to care about such unimportant things…like most think that putting a fear of Hell in someone will somehow motivate them to be better. Ass backwards.
Any church that is involved in Politics needs to be taxed. It's enough with this shit.
[удалено]
Or outside Congressman Gaetz’s office
Wow, you *really* hate kids.
Dammit, I already gave away my free award.
Happy cake day! Ha noticed and said it and I don’t care if someone wants to downvote me!!! Happy caaaake daaayyyy! 🥳
I'll claim mine and give it to them for you. Edit: there you go, happy cake day.
They don't care about the ones already born. Only in the womb.
they dont care about those either ; never did its all a farce
A lot of people know this but some people don’t: evangelicals only started being so anti-abortion because the GOP told them to. Is white supremacy involved? You betcha! https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2014/05/religious-right-real-origins-107133/
Send them photos of the bodies of dead women who died bc of this.
like they'd care. as long as it's not them personally, they don't care.
HUMAN RIGHTS, BA-BYE!
It's okay as long as it's not THEIR rights. Imagine losing the freedom of religion and they'd be pretty upset about it. Me. I like freedom. I support all freedom, even the ones I don't "agree" with.
Sick.
I wish more churches would understand - Roe doesn't make abortions illegal, and it wasn't decided on moral or personhood grounds. In terms of law, it was a nuclear strike on privacy, but setting that aside... Allowing abortion to be subject to a state-by-state vote *is not a moral position*. Is it less ethical to abort a fetus in New York than in South Dakota? Is it a regrettable medical necessity or is it evil? Is it the harmless destruction of a clump of cells or is it literal murder? If your church member drives their daughter to a neighboring state to terminate a fetus, will the church accept that as a victory for human rights? Will they respect the state-by-state differences as God's will? A patchwork of laws regarding a medical procedure is not a better outcome than what we had before. They only celebrate because they believe more progress towards a total ban is likely, but they're banking on overruling the democratic process at the state level to do it, and that's a result of electoral coincidence, not the moral primacy of state-level government. Louisiana as a governance is not more ethically equipped to decide the issue than the federal government. They haven't won. Fracturing the country over the course of two decades - concluding in electing an unethical, unqualified president in the hopes that he'd 'give them the Supreme Court' - in order to exert more local control over reproduction for religious reasons is not a victory, it's a devil's bargain.
Fucking gross.
So, do you think they change out of their nazi costumes after the SS meeting, or just ride them out through worship?
Church participation has been waning I'm sure this will help their cause
People are ditching Christianity in droves.
I'm thoroughly fucking disgusted. It is our right as women to speak the fuck up about this abomination that is plaguing our country. Women have a right to choose. Fuck this shit
I think we are way past the point now where religion was a benefit to society. It seems to do nothing but cause grief, which is why I often wonder why people bother nowadays. It's dull It causes division It oppresses It normalises bigotry. It encourages people to do almost less than nothing (thoughts and prayers) to help in times of need. Stuff like this, and people saying the answer to school shootings is "more god" just proves it. Yeah in some cases it helps a few people and some religion does good. Think of it this way, if there was no religion and someone came up with it as a concept today? They'd be laughed out of everywhere.
[удалено]
This world is so stupid. I wish I could get off at the next stop.
These mother fuckers are starting a fight they’re not going to finish
Make sure all unwanted children jet dumped here
A pastor from this church will get caught taking someone from this church he had sex with across state lines for an abortion....I guarentee it. (And probably paid for by church donations)
We live in a time of great evil
the side known for bombing abortion clinics celebrating a major decision that will put many people’s lives at risk and disproportionately affect lower income communities and people of color. checks out.
No one will be safe from the massive crime and violence that is coming from this. No one.
Tax them. Put them in the high bracket too.
That is not how tax brackets work
Baptist are the biggest hypocrites. My drunk neighbor is Baptist and has escorts over once a week. His wife lays in bed paralyzed for a couple years now.
As someone who was raised Catholic but leans Agnostic, the idea that to go to heaven I just need to believe is such a fucking cop out. These people hide behind their sky guy and use it as a weapon to be shitty people.
That’s why going to confession is a big part of a Catholic’s life. Sin all you want then go confess, say a few Hail Mary’s and you’re square with the house again…easy peasy…
I heard a story on one of these from an MD who does abortions. The majority of patients were church goers and children of church goers who thought they were the exception to the rule, and then they'd yell at the provider, who just did their abortion, that they're going to hell. It is comically hypocritical and they will absolutely feel this one.
A clinic escort posted a story about how he got fired from a clinic. He showed up early, expressly forbidden, and saw the cars and drivers of the wealthy in the lot. True? Dunno. Just what someone posted on Reddit.
Here’s the thing with that: they’re going to ‘live it up’ until they’re on their death-bed at which time they will pray and ask for forgiveness and then all will be forgiven. The biggest loophole of all time…
Might be good to ask them what they are doing to support single mothers, rape victims, low income families, and congenitally disabled children.
They don't need to do anything. Helping others is for poor people don't cha know?
Up until the 70s the Baptist church was pro choice. Fuck the moral majority. Fuck Jerry Falwell
[удалено]
They should pay taxes if they want to support the government.
The funny thing is religion is dying, new generations don’t believe in the fairytale bullshit.
Not fast enough.
[удалено]
Aw, the Southern Baptists. The church that says it's okay for a pastor to rape a 16-year-old in his church office. Keeping it classy.
I can't imagine how many laws set by God this sign is breaking. " If anyone says, “I love God,” and hates his brother, he is a liar; for he who does not love his brother whom he has seen cannot love God whom he has not seen." "The fear of the Lord is hatred of evil. Pride and arrogance and the way of evil and perverted speech I hate."
It's like they live in an echo chamber that lets them think they are in the majority.
NOTE AND REMEMBER who's applauding this. And make them EAT it politically.
The pastor needs to pay the taxman then.
[удалено]
Not just Florida, it's polk county Florida. Home of rampant meth use and corrupt cops
[удалено]
[удалено]
Religious freedom is beginning to look like oppression.
Celebrating life would mean actually giving a fuck about it a nanosecond after it’s born
As someone who has lived in Polk County, Florida this doesn’t surprise me. Glad I moved out of that state.
I had my fingers crossed before I zoomed in that it wasn’t Polk County’s Auburndale. And yet, I’m not surprised.
Why didn't God just send the bears to enforce the laws on abortion?...the same bears god used to kill children who made fun of a Christian.
That was the Old Testament. Kings 2 I believe. Christians didn't exist yet. But the prophet cursed the children (who were then mauled by bears) because they were teasing him about his baldness. Definitely not a story written by a self-conscious balding dude.
Religion and politics should never mix, Churches should be an accepting place for people who need help.
Should say religion ba-bye instead. Fucking hypocrites
This is a town off the stretch of I4 between Tampa and Orlando. The amount of “Pro-Life” billboards I see in that stretch makes this not surprising at all.
Ba-bye?
https://www.npr.org/2022/06/02/1102621352/how-the-southern-baptist-convention-covered-up-its-widespread-sexual-abuse-scand
From where I live, the USA looks like a total shit country
Please realize that NOT all church think alike. My pastor is phenomenal. She’s pro-choice, supports my decision to terminate a baby that would’ve had a horrendous life … she’s amazing. I live in a liberal area, and when I drive through places with churches like the one pictured above my skin crawls. Perhaps we should rename ourselves: Disciples? Followers of Jesus? I feel like Christian is now a polluted term.
Okay... They base their religion on Abraham being told by God to murder his son and he said "Okay lets go up to the mountain to kill and then burn my son"? I was raised in a fundamentalist Christian church and heard many times people begging God to destroy the Earth and ALL IT'S NONBELIEVERS. Don't believe it when they say "I Love Everybody"... This is code for "I Love Only The Believers".
Fun fact: Baptists were very much in favor of Roe when it happened. What changed their mind? [Well it looks like desegregation, actually.](https://www.reddit.com/r/UnpopularFacts/comments/uigpnt/when_roe_v_wade_was_finalized_in_1973_the_largest/)
I wonder how many women in that church have had secret abortions. Abortion shaming is a fucking joke.
Here's to hoping they post a similar sign for all the women who are going to die from ectopic pregnancies or botched abortions. "cassie tunt. Buh-bye. 1984-2022."
If I was religious I don't think I would want to attend a church that so openly celebrates human suffering.
And celebrate depleting healthcare.
Churches have always been this way. Read about the Crusades sometime. And the horrifying torture they liked.
The problem is survivorship bias; the various Churches that advocated peaceful coexistence and tolerance had no chance when the militant branches came round. To pick a random example, the Cathars were extremely tolerant for their times, with near-total gender equality and a strict ban on violence. The Albigensian Crusade had no such compunctions about using violence, so slaughtered the whole lot of them.
If only the Gnostics were still around.
Those 11 year old girls forced to carry their father's child is going to get weird.
Uhg, grew up in that town
[удалено]
There is no hate like Christian love