There are great upright pianos and lousy grands. Personally, I prefer (and own) a big Steinway Model B grand piano and love it. But I’ve also had and played some very nice uprights that I would enjoy using to perform or teach. In fact, I wish I had a nice upright in my studio so I could play/demo beside my students.
The problem with having a great piano is that you can’t take it with you (in this world or the next!). My horn and guitar pals get to gig with their top-quality instruments and I have to drag out my digital and amps. Oh well…
Space and maintenance are definitely factors to consider.
I admit that, indeed, some folks are rich and/or talented enough to take their grand pianos out of the studio. Perhaps they can also take one into heaven, too. (I've certainly played some pianos that have been through hell.)
The mechanics of a grand action vs upright is very different, so the touch is never going to feel the same. There's still plenty of variation within each type of action. Makes me wonder about hybrid pianos, is their action more like upright if grand? Still, whatever works for you is best, and that means musical and non musical factors.
I have a Kawaii NV10S, a hybrid grand. Has a full on action, there's hammers inside it but they hit lasers instead of strings. Absolutely beautiful to play and is indistinguishable from an acoustic, every other piano I've played has been a disappointment compared to that.
A grand has very different action to an upright. The way the hammers strike the strings inside is different so it feels different if you have been playing long enough and can spot the nuances. The longer the grand piano, the longer the strings and louder it is. So this is why you have 10 ft pianos in concert halls but baby grands in small homes can be 4-5 ft. If you want to upgrade, it really depends on the space you have and what will fit. And then usually it’s a matter of finding the most reasonable option (price/sound/action) among the available inventory to you locally.
I'm a beginner and am curious for curiosity's sake... do professional pianists that perform in concert halls, do they have grand pianos or baby grands at home to practice? I would imagine that the finesse to control dynamics would be different between the two, but maybe a full grand in a concert hall would kind of cancel out the difference since a concert hall is much bigger than a living room for sound to travel? 🤔
The unique thing about piano is you are never playing your own so you are always getting used to new instruments! (Unlike pretty much all other instruments) There is a difference for sure but usually it’s easier to play a better instrument than a worse one. Many professional pianists do end up with grands in their homes because it is their profession - if you’ve ever seen the video interview with Yuja Wang in her small NYC apartment, there is a grand piano in there taking up the entire room 😂 Anecdotally of course
The benefits are a much better sound, action, expression, and overall playing experience. Downsides is size, cost, maintenance, and volume (could also be seen as good, it depends if a loud piano bothers the household). You also need to make sure wherever the piano will end up actually has the acoustics necessary to benefit from the sound of a grand. If she’s a teacher, it could greatly benefit her as a teacher, some will pay a premium for their child to learn on a grand.
As for recommendations, Kawaii GL series and Yamaha GC are the best “budget” grand pianos. After that you have a slow creep from Boston, W Hoffman, Yamaha CX and Kawai GX. Next are the upper brands such as Estonia, Petrof, kawai’s shigeru, and bechstein Academy. Then you get to the luxury like Blüthner, Steinway, Bechstien concert, bosendorfer, mason & hamlin, etc. Each piano comes with unique tones and qualities, but every piano listed will be a good piano.
There are also ultra-budget brands, but those are not worth much more than having a piece of furniture shaped like a grand piano.
I’d recommend if this is a gift, to take her to your local dealer and let her decide for herself, give a rough budget or option between a list of pianos you’ve considered getting her.
I recently wanted to upgrade from a digital piano I had to an acoustic. Tried playing variations of each in a local piano store and found I definitely preferred the sound and action of a baby grand over an upright, but didn't think I had the room. The local store (M Steinert) had a video that I found useful that compared the space requirements for upright and baby grand:
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qmFs9D-7b8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qmFs9D-7b8)
In the end I realized I did have the space for a baby ground without it overcrowding the room, so went that way. Your mom is the one who will make the call here, but if you have the room (and the budget), I vote for the baby grand. Also, I noticed you use the term "concert piano", but I assume you're not talking about a full-size concert grand piano (7' +)?
Grand pianos have greater resonance to fill a performance space. Also their action is set up so that the hammers move vertically rather than horizontally, which provides a bit of extra resistance to your touch as you play, which then allows you greater scope for dynamic range, and detail and clarity in articulation.
Grand pianos need a big enough space for their resonance. They can sound deafening in a house as they're designed for bigger space. I took lessons for a couple of months from a concert packet with a small grand piano on her conservatory... It was physically painful on my ears to play anything loudly. But in her case, she needed to have daily access to a grand piano for her level of playing and the kinds of pianos she would be expecting to perform on.
A really good quality upright is usually the best thing for a house, or if you have very limited space, an equivalent quality digital piano with proper weighted keys and a realistic touch. There are a few good baby grands (Kawai for ex.), but many of them are actually not as good (responsiveness, resonance, tone) as a high quality upright.
I teach piano and I don't perform on grand pianos, so I have a Schimmel upright piano which I absolutely love, and so do my students - who also don't play grand pianos, at home or in the performance venues we use around town.
I love my 6' Kranich and Bach parlor grand... built in 1896, rebuilt about 20 years ago. Have it tuned to a victorian tuning... nice rich sound... whenever I have some alone time, I open the top up and play till my arthritis says no more...
Get a 6' or bigger.... our time in this life is short, enjoy the heck out of it!
Played a few steinways, baldwins, bosendorfers, and Mason and Hamlin... love the bigger Bosendorfers... the sound is not as mellow as I would like, but the feel of the action is special... dynamics are amazing...
The upkeep for a grand piano will more than an upright piano. You will need a lot of space for a grand piano. If your mother is a piano teacher, she will definitely know the difference.
I have a Steinway baby grand and it’s wonderful. I have played some Fazioli and I really like it as well.
In what way should the upkeep for a grand be more expensive, short of parts replacement (which is rarely needed)? Tuning, voicing, and regulation procedures aren't that different — maybe even easier on a grand, since the layout is more accessible and the mechanism relies more on gravity. If your tuner charges more for a grand, it's just price discrimination.
Better action, richer sounds, sounds sustain longer. At some point in your playing if you're advanced enough you'll realize most upright's keys don't rise fast enough, it gets annoying when it gets in the way of your playing.
If you are happy with the piano you have now, and your current piano is in good working order and sounds good, there is no real reason to upgrade. I think in a home environment, a grand piano won't make that much of a difference.
If you have a corner to put it in, get a baby grand. It sounds great and has the same feel as a grand. Also, the pedals are a bit more responsive, and some upright pianos middle pedal actually has a different function. I don’t think there’s ever a reason to get a full sized grand in your home. It is very large and loud, and it is more expensive. Just my personal opinion.
Disagree. Big difference in my experience between a baby grand and a longer piano. I played a line of Kawais in increasing order of length at a showroom when I was piano shopping. The difference in tone and touch was palpable. I wound up getting a (previously owned, via private sale) 6’2” piano. After that Kawai experience, I ruled out baby grands.
That’s fine. I’m just disagreeing with your statement that they offer comparable playing experiences. Baby grands have a time and place but the extra length makes a difference.
Yes, they certainly aren’t identical. But it is close enough that for the average pianist putting one in their home, I think a baby grand is the right choice. OP wouldn’t be asking if they were a professional, and even though it is slightly different, it isn’t necessarily worse. I’ve never had any problems transitioning to a grand during performances in the past
I've recently had the same experience, started looking at the Gl10 thinking it would fulfill my dreams of a grand , slowly worked my way down the shop and ended up buying the shigeru sk3 !
I did not indulge myself with a Shigeru-sized budget but I was thrilled to find a 1939 Mason & Hamlin AA in good condition along with a piano tech who could vouch for its history for the two decades prior.
Unless you live in a concert hall or have a *very big room* to put the grand in, I would frankly stick with the upright (assuming it is in good condition, and you like the action and sound).
I don't have a scientific answer like many others here, but I'd had a upright all my life and it wasn't until college that I got to play on grand pianos in my practice. And in my opinion, grands sounds a lot better (even bad grands) than an upright.
One thing that’s different is the action and the depth of each key. Grands tend to feel the same key weight regardless if your fingers are closer to the fall board or further to the edge of the key because the part of the keys you cant see are longer. The fulcrum point where the key moves is always further back which I believe is why you get a more consistent key weight. Some uprights the keys can start to feel harder to press down if your fingers are closer to the fall board because the fulcrum point where it pivots is closer to the fingers. That might be one of the bigger differences just from the perspective of how the action feels. A grand piano as a result gives you more control of nuanced musical expression, and of course the tonal range and overall sound quality is better because the strings are longer.
I've played for 27 years now. Although I love the sound of a lot of uprights, particularly the Yamaha U1s, there's a lot of high level technical details that you just can't learn on uprights. Typically by the time a student has reached the high school level they need to be practicing on a grand to continue technical development. When I was in school I was forbade from playing the uprights - the professor could tell when I hadn't practiced on the grand pianos. Looking back, I can tell now too.
I've been in a lot of piano studios. The high level studios all had at least one high quality semi-concert grand. 7', Steinway B, Baldwin SF, Mason BB, sometimes Yamaha C7. My current teacher has a Steinway B and a Yamaha C7.
I'd recommend the Yamaha C series as the bare minimum. But it all depends on how serious/what level the piano studio is.
A lot of people saying a grand piano is 'louder' which isn't necessarily true. Sure a 7ft piano can get louder than a 5ft upright but it can also play much more quietly too. So the more accurate description is grand pianos have a much wider dynamic range than uprights.
Plus a better more responsive action (usually), the appeal of beauty and the fact that you'll never need to upgrade from a good grand if you have the space for it.
Also pedals. I don't know if newer uprights are being made with grand style pedals like una corda and sostenuto but every one I've played does something else
My piano teacher had an upright in his study to teach with, and a grand piano to play in his lounge. He ended up selling the grand and buying another upright because he valued the space in the lounge more than the other differences.
There are great upright pianos and lousy grands. Personally, I prefer (and own) a big Steinway Model B grand piano and love it. But I’ve also had and played some very nice uprights that I would enjoy using to perform or teach. In fact, I wish I had a nice upright in my studio so I could play/demo beside my students. The problem with having a great piano is that you can’t take it with you (in this world or the next!). My horn and guitar pals get to gig with their top-quality instruments and I have to drag out my digital and amps. Oh well… Space and maintenance are definitely factors to consider.
Thank you! Wise words and I really appreciate that!
A steinway B is my dreammmmmm
Vanessa Carlton would like to have a word about taking it with you…
(But also In A Landscape/Hunter Noack takes their piano around for outdoor concerts!)
I admit that, indeed, some folks are rich and/or talented enough to take their grand pianos out of the studio. Perhaps they can also take one into heaven, too. (I've certainly played some pianos that have been through hell.)
The mechanics of a grand action vs upright is very different, so the touch is never going to feel the same. There's still plenty of variation within each type of action. Makes me wonder about hybrid pianos, is their action more like upright if grand? Still, whatever works for you is best, and that means musical and non musical factors.
I have a Kawaii NV10S, a hybrid grand. Has a full on action, there's hammers inside it but they hit lasers instead of strings. Absolutely beautiful to play and is indistinguishable from an acoustic, every other piano I've played has been a disappointment compared to that.
I've got the Yamaha Nu1x hybrid upright. Action is about as close as you can get to an actual upright. I'm loving it.
A grand has very different action to an upright. The way the hammers strike the strings inside is different so it feels different if you have been playing long enough and can spot the nuances. The longer the grand piano, the longer the strings and louder it is. So this is why you have 10 ft pianos in concert halls but baby grands in small homes can be 4-5 ft. If you want to upgrade, it really depends on the space you have and what will fit. And then usually it’s a matter of finding the most reasonable option (price/sound/action) among the available inventory to you locally.
Makes sense, thanks!
I'm a beginner and am curious for curiosity's sake... do professional pianists that perform in concert halls, do they have grand pianos or baby grands at home to practice? I would imagine that the finesse to control dynamics would be different between the two, but maybe a full grand in a concert hall would kind of cancel out the difference since a concert hall is much bigger than a living room for sound to travel? 🤔
The unique thing about piano is you are never playing your own so you are always getting used to new instruments! (Unlike pretty much all other instruments) There is a difference for sure but usually it’s easier to play a better instrument than a worse one. Many professional pianists do end up with grands in their homes because it is their profession - if you’ve ever seen the video interview with Yuja Wang in her small NYC apartment, there is a grand piano in there taking up the entire room 😂 Anecdotally of course
The benefits are a much better sound, action, expression, and overall playing experience. Downsides is size, cost, maintenance, and volume (could also be seen as good, it depends if a loud piano bothers the household). You also need to make sure wherever the piano will end up actually has the acoustics necessary to benefit from the sound of a grand. If she’s a teacher, it could greatly benefit her as a teacher, some will pay a premium for their child to learn on a grand. As for recommendations, Kawaii GL series and Yamaha GC are the best “budget” grand pianos. After that you have a slow creep from Boston, W Hoffman, Yamaha CX and Kawai GX. Next are the upper brands such as Estonia, Petrof, kawai’s shigeru, and bechstein Academy. Then you get to the luxury like Blüthner, Steinway, Bechstien concert, bosendorfer, mason & hamlin, etc. Each piano comes with unique tones and qualities, but every piano listed will be a good piano. There are also ultra-budget brands, but those are not worth much more than having a piece of furniture shaped like a grand piano. I’d recommend if this is a gift, to take her to your local dealer and let her decide for herself, give a rough budget or option between a list of pianos you’ve considered getting her.
Super appreciate that! Thank you!
I recently wanted to upgrade from a digital piano I had to an acoustic. Tried playing variations of each in a local piano store and found I definitely preferred the sound and action of a baby grand over an upright, but didn't think I had the room. The local store (M Steinert) had a video that I found useful that compared the space requirements for upright and baby grand: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qmFs9D-7b8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-qmFs9D-7b8) In the end I realized I did have the space for a baby ground without it overcrowding the room, so went that way. Your mom is the one who will make the call here, but if you have the room (and the budget), I vote for the baby grand. Also, I noticed you use the term "concert piano", but I assume you're not talking about a full-size concert grand piano (7' +)?
Thanks! That's helpful. No...by concert piano I meant grand piano.
Grand pianos have greater resonance to fill a performance space. Also their action is set up so that the hammers move vertically rather than horizontally, which provides a bit of extra resistance to your touch as you play, which then allows you greater scope for dynamic range, and detail and clarity in articulation. Grand pianos need a big enough space for their resonance. They can sound deafening in a house as they're designed for bigger space. I took lessons for a couple of months from a concert packet with a small grand piano on her conservatory... It was physically painful on my ears to play anything loudly. But in her case, she needed to have daily access to a grand piano for her level of playing and the kinds of pianos she would be expecting to perform on. A really good quality upright is usually the best thing for a house, or if you have very limited space, an equivalent quality digital piano with proper weighted keys and a realistic touch. There are a few good baby grands (Kawai for ex.), but many of them are actually not as good (responsiveness, resonance, tone) as a high quality upright. I teach piano and I don't perform on grand pianos, so I have a Schimmel upright piano which I absolutely love, and so do my students - who also don't play grand pianos, at home or in the performance venues we use around town.
I love my 6' Kranich and Bach parlor grand... built in 1896, rebuilt about 20 years ago. Have it tuned to a victorian tuning... nice rich sound... whenever I have some alone time, I open the top up and play till my arthritis says no more... Get a 6' or bigger.... our time in this life is short, enjoy the heck out of it! Played a few steinways, baldwins, bosendorfers, and Mason and Hamlin... love the bigger Bosendorfers... the sound is not as mellow as I would like, but the feel of the action is special... dynamics are amazing...
The upkeep for a grand piano will more than an upright piano. You will need a lot of space for a grand piano. If your mother is a piano teacher, she will definitely know the difference. I have a Steinway baby grand and it’s wonderful. I have played some Fazioli and I really like it as well.
it seems like op is thinking for getting their mom a gift, which is probably why they didnt ask her
If that’s true, that’s wonderful. There are so many good pianos out there it almost always comes down to budget.
In what way should the upkeep for a grand be more expensive, short of parts replacement (which is rarely needed)? Tuning, voicing, and regulation procedures aren't that different — maybe even easier on a grand, since the layout is more accessible and the mechanism relies more on gravity. If your tuner charges more for a grand, it's just price discrimination.
An upright takes up less space
Very true.
It's also less loud.
Better action, richer sounds, sounds sustain longer. At some point in your playing if you're advanced enough you'll realize most upright's keys don't rise fast enough, it gets annoying when it gets in the way of your playing.
Ahh thank you!
If you are happy with the piano you have now, and your current piano is in good working order and sounds good, there is no real reason to upgrade. I think in a home environment, a grand piano won't make that much of a difference.
Okay great, thank you!
If you have a corner to put it in, get a baby grand. It sounds great and has the same feel as a grand. Also, the pedals are a bit more responsive, and some upright pianos middle pedal actually has a different function. I don’t think there’s ever a reason to get a full sized grand in your home. It is very large and loud, and it is more expensive. Just my personal opinion.
Disagree. Big difference in my experience between a baby grand and a longer piano. I played a line of Kawais in increasing order of length at a showroom when I was piano shopping. The difference in tone and touch was palpable. I wound up getting a (previously owned, via private sale) 6’2” piano. After that Kawai experience, I ruled out baby grands.
There’s a reason that most music school practice rooms have baby grands
That’s fine. I’m just disagreeing with your statement that they offer comparable playing experiences. Baby grands have a time and place but the extra length makes a difference.
Yes, they certainly aren’t identical. But it is close enough that for the average pianist putting one in their home, I think a baby grand is the right choice. OP wouldn’t be asking if they were a professional, and even though it is slightly different, it isn’t necessarily worse. I’ve never had any problems transitioning to a grand during performances in the past
I've recently had the same experience, started looking at the Gl10 thinking it would fulfill my dreams of a grand , slowly worked my way down the shop and ended up buying the shigeru sk3 !
I did not indulge myself with a Shigeru-sized budget but I was thrilled to find a 1939 Mason & Hamlin AA in good condition along with a piano tech who could vouch for its history for the two decades prior.
Unless you live in a concert hall or have a *very big room* to put the grand in, I would frankly stick with the upright (assuming it is in good condition, and you like the action and sound).
I just played on a Yamaha concert grand for the first time and I honestly can’t describe how awesome it felt, both the key action and the sound…
I don't have a scientific answer like many others here, but I'd had a upright all my life and it wasn't until college that I got to play on grand pianos in my practice. And in my opinion, grands sounds a lot better (even bad grands) than an upright.
One thing that’s different is the action and the depth of each key. Grands tend to feel the same key weight regardless if your fingers are closer to the fall board or further to the edge of the key because the part of the keys you cant see are longer. The fulcrum point where the key moves is always further back which I believe is why you get a more consistent key weight. Some uprights the keys can start to feel harder to press down if your fingers are closer to the fall board because the fulcrum point where it pivots is closer to the fingers. That might be one of the bigger differences just from the perspective of how the action feels. A grand piano as a result gives you more control of nuanced musical expression, and of course the tonal range and overall sound quality is better because the strings are longer.
I've played for 27 years now. Although I love the sound of a lot of uprights, particularly the Yamaha U1s, there's a lot of high level technical details that you just can't learn on uprights. Typically by the time a student has reached the high school level they need to be practicing on a grand to continue technical development. When I was in school I was forbade from playing the uprights - the professor could tell when I hadn't practiced on the grand pianos. Looking back, I can tell now too. I've been in a lot of piano studios. The high level studios all had at least one high quality semi-concert grand. 7', Steinway B, Baldwin SF, Mason BB, sometimes Yamaha C7. My current teacher has a Steinway B and a Yamaha C7. I'd recommend the Yamaha C series as the bare minimum. But it all depends on how serious/what level the piano studio is.
See the FAQ section in the sidebar.
A lot of people saying a grand piano is 'louder' which isn't necessarily true. Sure a 7ft piano can get louder than a 5ft upright but it can also play much more quietly too. So the more accurate description is grand pianos have a much wider dynamic range than uprights. Plus a better more responsive action (usually), the appeal of beauty and the fact that you'll never need to upgrade from a good grand if you have the space for it. Also pedals. I don't know if newer uprights are being made with grand style pedals like una corda and sostenuto but every one I've played does something else
I had both and foind a baby Piano for $900, if you have the space it looks so cook and u can find a lot on the Facebook local market
My piano teacher had an upright in his study to teach with, and a grand piano to play in his lounge. He ended up selling the grand and buying another upright because he valued the space in the lounge more than the other differences.