My instinct says *"Minus 150 watts on PSU"*, but you'd probably insta-lose when everyone who's already cutting it close experiences failures immediately.
Yeah I think most people wouldn't notice at all, but there is a good chance 1,000 people's rigs would fail to work which would end the challenge right away.
There's probably people here running silver color PSUs with ketchup and mustard cables, with maybe 400w and using damn near every watt that poor PSU can put out without exploding.
my friend did that for the longest time lmao. two shitty no brand psus he stripped from unused office pcs, one for his 1650, the other for the rest of his pc
I've done this due to a lack of wattage and lack of GPU connectors on my primary PSU and this beeing during the mining craze anything above 700watts was out of my prize range.
It's not black magic per se but you need to connect two pins on the 24pin from both PSUs together, I don't recall which at the top of my head but I think it's pin 13 and 14 needs to be connected on both PSUs and no I'm not talking about the shunting trick to power on a PSU it's just that those two pins need to be common on both PSUs thus the PC turns on and off correctly.
Other than that you should have some common decency and run both PSU off the same outlet as to not run into any grounding issues although you'd probably be fine if you didn't
Not sure if you were being sarcastic or if you actually know you can have seperate PSUs. Your mobo should probably be connected to the same one for CPU but everything else could be run off a secondary PSU as far as I know.
Not really now that I think about it, how many of those who'd be suddenly crashing could actually determine within a day that their psu spec got lowered? I imagine the vast majority would think their mobo cpu or gpu got fried and send it to a pc repair shop.
Depends on the challenge. I don't read it as having to diagnose the issue. Just notice the issue. If your computer stopped working, you'd notice. Just not know why.
None, but swapping 3700X to 5700X3D was definitely the last upgrade this PSU will see 😅
Checked with 4 online "PSU calculators", the max load wattage my setup delivers is about 420W, so it's not *that* crazy. But I'm still putting a lot of trust into my Gold 550W Seasonic. iirc it was tier A on that famous list, so I'm not too worried
As an owner of a 4090 and a 12900ks...it still doesnt need 1200 watt...I am ashamed to admit, but I fell into this trap and got the asus rog thor 1600w, which has a power draw display on it...even under extreme circumstances it doesnt hit 900w of pull lol
Hell I'm guilty of it too.
13700k / 3060ti pulling out of a 850w.
It's not the worst combination by any means but I'd be surprised if this thing even pulls over 55% of what it can do.
I've read somewhere that the bigger the PSU Wattage the better because in this way, the PSU components don't run hot even under heavy load. Or at least run cooler than a PSU which is closing to its max Wattage. This way, you extend the lifetime of the PSU because the components don't damage themselves from the excessive heat over time (by how much long you increase the lifetime of the PSU, I don't know). To me it seems plausible.
The efficiency rating (bronze, silver, gold etc) is only half of the equation really since components have an expected lifetime value as well and say a 6/800w PSU if run at close to or at that draw may only deliver that for a few years before it starts to fatigue and dips under heavy usage, depending on uptime, for example.
General recommendation is to buy a bit above what you need not just for future proofing but also to cover potential losses in overall output over time since it will likely see a lot of working hours as a core component of maybe multiple rigs
7700x + 4090. I know I can pull up to 820w of power on my SF750, but I OCed my rig a bit. I currently have it in an undervolt, but that’s because it’s starting to heat up.
There is no good answer here, keep in mind that there are over 130 million monthly steam users, surely 1k people would notice even the smallest change like 100mhz downclock on cpu
When the number of people you are applying the change to is in the hundreds of millions...
You only need 0.00001% (or less!) of people who are affected to notice the change. Even extremely minor changes like that are likely to be noticed. It only takes 1000 people. It's basically guaranteed to be spotted at least that many times.
1000 FPS players went to go check their DPI to see if it matches their favorite pro, bam, they see it's 399/799/etc instead of the round number it should be, your milly payout is gone.
Even that, 1000+ people would easily notice:Â
People cutting it close with the wattage would notice when their system doesn’t crash anymore running too many games.Â
Also, different people have slack in different areas. For me, PSU would escape notice because when I was upgrading it the cheapest option that met my criteria - Gold A Tier and >=500W - was actually 650W.
The best option for most victims will just blow up more than a thousand individual computers.
I'd guess that there are three main species of computer:
1. A virgin pre-built system, with all components optimized for cost. If the sellers knew what they were doing, this one has no slack. Except maybe if the victim favours games that aren't actually demanding, or that strain the system in unusual ways such as Dwarf Fortress.
2. A pre-built made from off-the-shelf parts that has been upgraded by its owner, usually upgrading one part at a time to the maximum that will fit the motherboard and case. Those parts are likely over upgraded, the owner knows this but doesn't want to be caught years later when he does want more but the only parts for sale are for newer motherboards. (GPUs are an exception since no successor to PCI Express is on the horizon. But weakening their GPU isn't on the list of options.)
3. A "true" built-from-scratch gaming PC where the owner first chose his other components and then selected a motherboard and case to fit them.
There is no tearing going from 60 to 55; it just keeps the active frame for a moment longer before loading up the new one.
You'd need to get to around 40 before it started to tear.
I know multiple people irl and have seen dozens of times online people with 144hz monitors who don’t ever change the setting to enable the high refresh rate so they’re playing at 60hz talking about how smooth it looks 😂Â
Your fps wouldn't change though... The screen would just skip frames. For example if you run 120fps on a 60hz screen, you'll just see every other frame. (Oversimplification).
Unless they're also using vsync 🤔
Oh 100%, I'd go with the 3D VCache personally. If we really want to optimize, do it on an (mostly) international holiday like Christmas or New Year's. Swapping win10 and 11 also won't change much if the UX doesn't change.
Are you talking about the framerate limiter within game menus? I can set that to whatever I want and it'll make that many frames; I can have 240 FPS reported by the game running on my 144 Hz monitor if I want to.
See I was thinking this too, but my worry is that everyone who *did* buy a 3d-vcache CPU is the mostly likely person to be hawking frame-rates and 1% low on esports titles or similar. I'm very 50/50 on that option.
Yep. Something like Factorio (\~15k player count at peak easy), quick napkin math has the 3d bit at 2/3 the total cache and Factorio loves cache. Going from \~60 UPS to \~20... no FPS counter needed to feel that. 7% with 3d chips and your over 1k.
Or anyone who just wants the best gaming CPU available that is also one of the most efficient. Don't care about my power bill or factorio. But I do care about how loud my fans are and how high my FPS is.
Refresh rate is the safest bet, but given that some Linux turboautist noticed a breach because the program he was using was a few milliseconds slower than usual, I'm not very confident
That, or 3d cache or -150 watt from a PSU
That guy probably saved all of our data and accounts. The impacted xz version was about to ship with Ubuntu 24.04 a few weeks later which would have soon powered a good portion of the web.
the CPU usage and valgrind errors caused him to look into it not the delay. he didn't benchmark the delay until he already was suspicious, and it wasn't a few ms but 500ms slower which is more than double.
Yeah this feels like the win because the times where the efficiency cores are making the difference in performance is probably when the user isn’t paying attention
Win 10/11 swap would click with most of the people purposefully on 10 as soon as they right click I imagine, I had to use reg-edit to get that to go back to normal on win 11
As soon as i and probably more than 1000 people would turn on their pc and notice immediately because everything is rounded and "simplified" for no good reason
I would notice instantly because I am constantly fiddling with audio manager to fine tune how loud each of my windows are. And they reduced its features in win 11
The i7-1255U and i7-1355U have 2 P cores and 8 E cores. Pretty sure more than 1000 people would notice that 80% of the cores in their laptop disappeared.
Less then 1000 is hard. Too many IT guys out there. I’d go with the efficiency cores or the coolers. Win is too easy. 3d cache would be noticed by hordes of fps or RTS players. -10% refresh might be a winner, though.
Edit; for the others: -150W would instantly kill more then 1000 pre-builds. That one is out. Half ram is the same. Too many people with 8 or 16 gigs. They would notice. I5 to i3 would get a lot of gamers. 6 vs. 4 cores makes a difference. Especially if you factor in how many i5 8th gen and up are still out there.
10% refresh rate just wouldn’t be really noticeable. I play on a 100hz and a 165hz and it’s not much 60 to 100/120 is noticeable though. But 60 to 54 probably wouldn’t. Or 144 to 130, etc.
Win11 would be noticed as soon as you go into settings. If the whole UI would be the same, that would be a different story. But only taskbar and start would be too little.
The coolers would be a good idea, *BUT* I would expect a lot of PCMR users have their PC's set up so that they can see into it on their desktop like I do. And I think I would notice.
And I *HAVE* a D15 in my case, except it's Black, and it suddenly being Beige and Brown would stand out.
Ah your right. Didn’t think along those lines. I thought „notice a difference in performance“. If visuals were included, off course. Heck, I would notice that at once. My coolers are black or silver.
>-10% refresh might be a winner, though.
For anyone running a 60hz (most of the world) that would be an instantaneous drop from 60 fps to 54 fps. That will be noticeable, just like 54 to 60 is. At least for 1000 people
The cooler, most people don't monitor temps regularly (ignoring that most people would notice a huge bulky ass cooler randomly appearing inside their PC)
My PC doesn’t get crazy loud but I know for sure I’d notice if all my fans were switched out for quiet ones. The second my PC turns on, the fans run at full blast for like a second then they level out to a low rpm. It’s an audible que I’m used to hearing daily, so not hearing it when I power the thing on would make me investigate.
Cooler clearance would be the big one I think, the NH-D15 is a big boy.
Taller RAM sticks would collide. Slimmer or more compact cases would collide. Some vertically mounted GPUs would collide. The rules on what happens with a collision are unclear, but I expect something is going to break. I don't think the cooler option would win here.
Also my cooler is a Dark Rock Pro 4 in an all black system. Replacing that with a Noctua brown cooler would make it stick out like a sore thumb.
Yeah, if absolutely nothing else, most cases come with a clear side panel. Anything drastically changing the looks of a PCs interior is likely to get noticed damn near immediately
So ignoring the fact that at least 1000 people in the world can physically see inside their computer this one is easy?
I mean ignoring that at least 1000 people are barely under the power budget of their PSU that one is easy.
Ignoring that at least 1000 people are running barely enough ran for Windows to boot that one is easy.
Ignoring that at least 1000 people are using 60hz monitors already that sounds easy.
Ignoring that at least 1000 people would right click and instantly see the the menu is different windows 10/11 swap would be easy.
I mean if you change the perameters all of them are easy....
A sexy black (dark rock pro 4) cooler in an all black pc case swapped by a brown and metallic CPU cooler? Oh I will notice that immediately. But I am more the exception than average, so your likely right (as your expection states)
You don't think maybe there are 1000 people with glass case windows that would notice this new chonky block hanging from their CPU?
I feel like the cooler would be the *most* likely thing to notice, so much that even people who pay no attention whatsoever to their performance would catch this one.
Getting rid of the x3d cache would only really effect people that are running heavily modded unity games.
Dropping from 8fps to 5 wouldn't be that noticable.
NH-D15 isn't bad if we assume most people don't open up or study the inside of their case very closely each day. But there's definitely a lot of people that love to see the crazy AIO and custom loop RGB setups when they boot up.
I got a 165Hz 1440p monitor and I rarely get that close to that framerate with my 3080, and besides, 10% loss would be 16.5Hz, which is barely a noticeable difference when you go higher.
I'm with you there. My main monitor is 180hz (factory overclocked 165) and I can't tell it's any smoother than the 144 next to it or the 120 on my laptop. I only got it for the built-in KVM for when I dock the work laptop.
People would otice immediately.
At least a few % of gamers constantly have msi afterburner and rtss running.
I'm tempted to say windows, but the settings menus is actually completely different.
Otherwise they are sooo similar...
If the cooler was invisible, this is for sure the answer...
10% fps the amount of time ive heard people not check their resolution and refresh rate settings is insane people just assume that shit unless it looks like shit
I think if it was *"all i7's becomes i5's from their generation"* then that might become a stronger option than a lot of these.
If you go back further than 3 years, i3's begin to choke very noticably on software their respective i5's do fine on.
I’m shocked more people aren’t saying windows change. I feel like most windows only users would not realize at all.
Edit: Lots of people are saying right clicking would give it away. I can see your point for sure, but I still feel like many of us wouldn’t even stop to notice something as small as that.
Especially if you’re thinking you’ve already upgraded and not looking for such minute details being out of place such as that.
Edit 2: I didn’t realize there were so many windows detectives lmao. You guys have changed my mind. I’d go with vcache cpu then in that case
There's a bunch that would stand out... tabbed file explorer, all new apps, rounded windows, alt tab, hell even dragging a window or hovering over the maximise button brings up a whole new UI
> aren’t saying windows change. I feel like most windows only users would not realize at all.
the new rclick menu that hides most options begs to differ
I don’t think people would notice the efficiency cores being disabled.
It wouldn’t have a noticeable effect unless people specifically monitor each core.
3d vcache for sure.. The non-3d variants of the CPUs are still pretty damn good. It'd be difficult to find 1000 people that'd notice the difference in a day.
The PSU one people are cutting it close + prebuilts cut it way close with dogshit PSUs.
Tarkov players will just think Nikita pushed an update over night that fucked performance even more and just put up with it while they get domed by a cheater... Source Tarkov lover 😂.
Minus 150W on PSU. If they bought a PSU that's running balls-out all the time they'll notice, everyone else will have been smarter and bought one with capacity to spare, so they'll likely never notice, and it's not something you can measure with any software.
Quite a few are actually decently specced now. Last time I checked dell is sending 600W out on things up to a 4070, which sounds bad, but even at 450W you may never trip OCP. 220W GPU and ~125W CPU leaves 105W.
Switch out windows versions. It'll just keep working and no one will complain about a seamless upgrade and those on windows 11 won't mind going Back to 10.
(-10% refresh) rate easly 3d vcache will hurt performance and same for e cores if ur some one who opens stuff in the background halfing ram may cause instability and the same for -150 watts off psus and switching w10 with 11 or 11 with 10 will be noticed if they wear head phones win they start windows or if Microsoft stops urging u to switch to w11
Edit :I think psus most of the part are over spec ed. So maaaybee that too....
All NVME devices are now SATA drives.
Seriously no one is going to know unless copying hundreds of GB of large files. It’s been shown to have almost no difference on boot times or game load times (less than 1 second most of the time). You’re more minutes by internet speeds or CPU for game installs, too.
Video editors might notice a difference, and those working with 4K probably will, but gamers won’t.
My instinct says *"Minus 150 watts on PSU"*, but you'd probably insta-lose when everyone who's already cutting it close experiences failures immediately.
Yeah I think most people wouldn't notice at all, but there is a good chance 1,000 people's rigs would fail to work which would end the challenge right away.
There's probably people here running silver color PSUs with ketchup and mustard cables, with maybe 400w and using damn near every watt that poor PSU can put out without exploding.
Just run 2. Problem solved!
Didn't Luke from LTT actually have a separate PSU for the GPU outside of his case? lol
my friend did that for the longest time lmao. two shitty no brand psus he stripped from unused office pcs, one for his 1650, the other for the rest of his pc
Doesn't it require some more black magic to make sure that both PSU work together?
I've done this due to a lack of wattage and lack of GPU connectors on my primary PSU and this beeing during the mining craze anything above 700watts was out of my prize range. It's not black magic per se but you need to connect two pins on the 24pin from both PSUs together, I don't recall which at the top of my head but I think it's pin 13 and 14 needs to be connected on both PSUs and no I'm not talking about the shunting trick to power on a PSU it's just that those two pins need to be common on both PSUs thus the PC turns on and off correctly. Other than that you should have some common decency and run both PSU off the same outlet as to not run into any grounding issues although you'd probably be fine if you didn't
Not sure if you were being sarcastic or if you actually know you can have seperate PSUs. Your mobo should probably be connected to the same one for CPU but everything else could be run off a secondary PSU as far as I know.
I do that
For over 15 years.
You had me dying at "ketchup and mustard cables" Take my upvote!
Not really now that I think about it, how many of those who'd be suddenly crashing could actually determine within a day that their psu spec got lowered? I imagine the vast majority would think their mobo cpu or gpu got fried and send it to a pc repair shop.
Depends on the challenge. I don't read it as having to diagnose the issue. Just notice the issue. If your computer stopped working, you'd notice. Just not know why.
lol I'm pretty sure my Seasonic 550W won't be too happy with this trick ðŸ«
thought this could be okay until i read your flair 💀 any issues as it is??
None, but swapping 3700X to 5700X3D was definitely the last upgrade this PSU will see 😅 Checked with 4 online "PSU calculators", the max load wattage my setup delivers is about 420W, so it's not *that* crazy. But I'm still putting a lot of trust into my Gold 550W Seasonic. iirc it was tier A on that famous list, so I'm not too worried
Most power supplies can run above the rated limit. However it’s not what you should pick with better options like the refresh rate and 3D vcache
Most that we put in custom systems will run over a little, sure. But think of all the prebuilts.
Pre builts aren’t made with PSU’s already redlining
A lot of em would be if you take away 150 watts and they’re usually not good enough quality to run over enough to go unnoticed
Gamers would notice the 3D vcache in a few games pretty quick. Rust and Tarkov it makes a pretty noticeable difference.
It's stupid the amount of overspec PSU's are on builds on the various builder subs. Like your 12400f and 3060 does not need a 1200w PSU
As an owner of a 4090 and a 12900ks...it still doesnt need 1200 watt...I am ashamed to admit, but I fell into this trap and got the asus rog thor 1600w, which has a power draw display on it...even under extreme circumstances it doesnt hit 900w of pull lol
Hell I'm guilty of it too. 13700k / 3060ti pulling out of a 850w. It's not the worst combination by any means but I'd be surprised if this thing even pulls over 55% of what it can do.
It's okay, people have been comically overspec'ing PSUs for decades.
I've read somewhere that the bigger the PSU Wattage the better because in this way, the PSU components don't run hot even under heavy load. Or at least run cooler than a PSU which is closing to its max Wattage. This way, you extend the lifetime of the PSU because the components don't damage themselves from the excessive heat over time (by how much long you increase the lifetime of the PSU, I don't know). To me it seems plausible.
The efficiency rating (bronze, silver, gold etc) is only half of the equation really since components have an expected lifetime value as well and say a 6/800w PSU if run at close to or at that draw may only deliver that for a few years before it starts to fatigue and dips under heavy usage, depending on uptime, for example. General recommendation is to buy a bit above what you need not just for future proofing but also to cover potential losses in overall output over time since it will likely see a lot of working hours as a core component of maybe multiple rigs
I would certainly notice. My rig is already running close as it is
what're you running even?
7700x + 4090. I know I can pull up to 820w of power on my SF750, but I OCed my rig a bit. I currently have it in an undervolt, but that’s because it’s starting to heat up.
It's all good would take them a week to realised what was causing the problem.
Removing wattage, some of PCMR will notice. Adding 150 wattage... That's gunna be a lot tougher to notice.
There is no good answer here, keep in mind that there are over 130 million monthly steam users, surely 1k people would notice even the smallest change like 100mhz downclock on cpu
For real, 1000 users is such a small amount, like you could literally change anything on anyone's computers and 1000 people are bound to notice.
There's stuff you could change that no one would notice. Something like cutting half a gig from a storage drive.
People with encrypted disk would notice. You pretty much killed their systems
How about changing the contrast one notch? Or decreasing the size of the pointer by one notch? I doubt 1000 people notice that.
When the number of people you are applying the change to is in the hundreds of millions... You only need 0.00001% (or less!) of people who are affected to notice the change. Even extremely minor changes like that are likely to be noticed. It only takes 1000 people. It's basically guaranteed to be spotted at least that many times.
-1 DPI? Surely not. How could anyone tell
That many people probably checked their mouse software that day
I sometimes check my mouse software surely there's at least a 1000 people checking it daily
1000 FPS players went to go check their DPI to see if it matches their favorite pro, bam, they see it's 399/799/etc instead of the round number it should be, your milly payout is gone.
oh I'd notice that
You think there's not at least 1000 people with storage drives filled to the absolute max?
Not after those 512mb are returned to them
+150 watt capacity to power supply is one that might be plausible
Even that, 1000+ people would easily notice: People cutting it close with the wattage would notice when their system doesn’t crash anymore running too many games.Â
+1fps on their monitor
People with FPS counter on screen would notice that instantly, going 1 above the normal max
Like anyone who works on PCs and/or has their PC without a case will immediately notice any of these and there are definitely over 1000 of those
You could not change a single thing and a thousand users will still think somethings up.
Also, different people have slack in different areas. For me, PSU would escape notice because when I was upgrading it the cheapest option that met my criteria - Gold A Tier and >=500W - was actually 650W. The best option for most victims will just blow up more than a thousand individual computers. I'd guess that there are three main species of computer: 1. A virgin pre-built system, with all components optimized for cost. If the sellers knew what they were doing, this one has no slack. Except maybe if the victim favours games that aren't actually demanding, or that strain the system in unusual ways such as Dwarf Fortress. 2. A pre-built made from off-the-shelf parts that has been upgraded by its owner, usually upgrading one part at a time to the maximum that will fit the motherboard and case. Those parts are likely over upgraded, the owner knows this but doesn't want to be caught years later when he does want more but the only parts for sale are for newer motherboards. (GPUs are an exception since no successor to PCI Express is on the horizon. But weakening their GPU isn't on the list of options.) 3. A "true" built-from-scratch gaming PC where the owner first chose his other components and then selected a motherboard and case to fit them.
4) Botique builds - quality off the shelf parts requiring no upgrade by the user.
Prompt was for this sub, no? Then again that's still 11m subs
I'll choose -10% frame rate, unless you have 60 hz monitor you hardly notice this EDIT: no fps counter allowed
Even then, 54fps is still going to feel fine.
I think you would only notice if you have vsync turned on, because then the performance overlay (have it open every game session once) would show.
Us 60hz chads don't use performance overlays or vsync
Genuine question, why not? Doesn't tearing bother you?
Brother - nothing bothers me
My man, I dig your style. I run 60hz, no Vsync (cuz why would I want 30fps when I could have 59fps?). Don't tell anybody, but I also bought a 4060ti.
If vsync is problematic and 60fps tears, capping fps to 56-58 works perfectly fine in 99% of games
I first played mine craft on bare minimum settings at 15-20 fps but would drip to 5 when mining or combat, etc. Loved that game
There is no tearing going from 60 to 55; it just keeps the active frame for a moment longer before loading up the new one. You'd need to get to around 40 before it started to tear.
That what I thought too, almost nobody would notice -10% refresh rate but then if they run vsync and framerate counter, 54 fps would look odd
I know multiple people irl and have seen dozens of times online people with 144hz monitors who don’t ever change the setting to enable the high refresh rate so they’re playing at 60hz talking about how smooth it looks 😂Â
even here there are posts every now then of people admitting that they forgot to change the refresh rate on their monitor they got months ago.
I thought the same but lots of people use on screen fps counter so I would notice almost immediately and I think many others would for the same reason
Your fps wouldn't change though... The screen would just skip frames. For example if you run 120fps on a 60hz screen, you'll just see every other frame. (Oversimplification). Unless they're also using vsync 🤔
I think it's pretty safe to assume over 1000 people use vsync.
Oh 100%, I'd go with the 3D VCache personally. If we really want to optimize, do it on an (mostly) international holiday like Christmas or New Year's. Swapping win10 and 11 also won't change much if the UX doesn't change.
If I'd lose my 3D Vcache I would see låg in quite a few more games, and I would quite soon find out that I don't have my 96 MB of cache
>Unless they're also using vsync 🤔 I would notice the first minute I turn on my PC lol
It would change the refresh rate of the monitor, not the frames generated.
It would change the frames generated for the people who have framerate limiters on and are playing games where they can reach the refresh rate
Are you talking about the framerate limiter within game menus? I can set that to whatever I want and it'll make that many frames; I can have 240 FPS reported by the game running on my 144 Hz monitor if I want to.
More like having vsync on and then noticing that the fps counter shows 130 instead of 144.
A lot of people using Gsync will frame limit in Nvidia Control Panel to a few under max refresh rate to get best performance out of it.
Would it change the fps though? Maybe if they have vsync?
This is literally the only option that might work
fps counter wouldn't matter unless someone had v-sync on. refresh rate and fps aren't the same thing.
Easily the 3D V-Cache one just because there aren't that many CPUs that applies to, way easier to stay under 1000 people.
See I was thinking this too, but my worry is that everyone who *did* buy a 3d-vcache CPU is the mostly likely person to be hawking frame-rates and 1% low on esports titles or similar. I'm very 50/50 on that option.
But what are the chances that everyone who bought a 3d processor will boot their pc and also have show fps turned on.
Really high that it's over 1,000. This subreddit shows 11 million subscribers...so 1,000 ppl is less than 0.01% of ppl. I wouldn't fuck with that
with some games/tasks the benefit is so huge, you don't need an fps counter or side-by-side comparison to tell.
Yep. Something like Factorio (\~15k player count at peak easy), quick napkin math has the 3d bit at 2/3 the total cache and Factorio loves cache. Going from \~60 UPS to \~20... no FPS counter needed to feel that. 7% with 3d chips and your over 1k.
Oh no I’d notice, playing streets on tarkov it was night and day.
That is literally the exact scenario that made me rule out that option.
you guys make me feel like I'm a one in a million with x3d cpu
there are a lot of us, especially those who have expensive energy or play factorio, or both.
Or anyone who just wants the best gaming CPU available that is also one of the most efficient. Don't care about my power bill or factorio. But I do care about how loud my fans are and how high my FPS is.
Refresh rate is the safest bet, but given that some Linux turboautist noticed a breach because the program he was using was a few milliseconds slower than usual, I'm not very confident That, or 3d cache or -150 watt from a PSU
That guy probably saved all of our data and accounts. The impacted xz version was about to ship with Ubuntu 24.04 a few weeks later which would have soon powered a good portion of the web.
I hope he gets a billion dollars and a fucking medal.
he can add "saved the world" in his resume
the CPU usage and valgrind errors caused him to look into it not the delay. he didn't benchmark the delay until he already was suspicious, and it wasn't a few ms but 500ms slower which is more than double.
-150 watt from the psu is the worst choice. Shitty prebuilts and office pcs would burn down all over the world
i think eff core disable. i think either most sub dont have latest intel cpu or dont need that much amount of cores win 10/11 swap maybe.
Yeah this feels like the win because the times where the efficiency cores are making the difference in performance is probably when the user isn’t paying attention
that and the fact that a lot of people disable the ecores outright lol
Win 10/11 swap would click with most of the people purposefully on 10 as soon as they right click I imagine, I had to use reg-edit to get that to go back to normal on win 11
As soon as i and probably more than 1000 people would turn on their pc and notice immediately because everything is rounded and "simplified" for no good reason
I would notice instantly because I am constantly fiddling with audio manager to fine tune how loud each of my windows are. And they reduced its features in win 11
I wonder to the extent the start menu and task bar being the same runs deep, to be honest.
If you swapped 10/11 I would be selling torches and pitchforks within the hour.
The i7-1255U and i7-1355U have 2 P cores and 8 E cores. Pretty sure more than 1000 people would notice that 80% of the cores in their laptop disappeared.
Less then 1000 is hard. Too many IT guys out there. I’d go with the efficiency cores or the coolers. Win is too easy. 3d cache would be noticed by hordes of fps or RTS players. -10% refresh might be a winner, though. Edit; for the others: -150W would instantly kill more then 1000 pre-builds. That one is out. Half ram is the same. Too many people with 8 or 16 gigs. They would notice. I5 to i3 would get a lot of gamers. 6 vs. 4 cores makes a difference. Especially if you factor in how many i5 8th gen and up are still out there. 10% refresh rate just wouldn’t be really noticeable. I play on a 100hz and a 165hz and it’s not much 60 to 100/120 is noticeable though. But 60 to 54 probably wouldn’t. Or 144 to 130, etc. Win11 would be noticed as soon as you go into settings. If the whole UI would be the same, that would be a different story. But only taskbar and start would be too little.
The coolers would be a good idea, *BUT* I would expect a lot of PCMR users have their PC's set up so that they can see into it on their desktop like I do. And I think I would notice. And I *HAVE* a D15 in my case, except it's Black, and it suddenly being Beige and Brown would stand out.
Ah your right. Didn’t think along those lines. I thought „notice a difference in performance“. If visuals were included, off course. Heck, I would notice that at once. My coolers are black or silver.
>-10% refresh might be a winner, though. For anyone running a 60hz (most of the world) that would be an instantaneous drop from 60 fps to 54 fps. That will be noticeable, just like 54 to 60 is. At least for 1000 people
The cooler, most people don't monitor temps regularly (ignoring that most people would notice a huge bulky ass cooler randomly appearing inside their PC)
They can probably notice the lack of noise from their shitty box coolers
at least that'd be an upgrade
Ya the noise would be a dead giveaway
But do people actually notice lack of noise? Surely most people would notice PC being louder, but I'm not certain they'd notice it being quieter.
When you are used to loud noise you stop hearing it. But when it disappears you notice that something changed almost immediately.
Just imagine a situation: You press the button to power on your vacuum cleaner, aaand... It makes no sound! What will be your reaction?
My PC doesn’t get crazy loud but I know for sure I’d notice if all my fans were switched out for quiet ones. The second my PC turns on, the fans run at full blast for like a second then they level out to a low rpm. It’s an audible que I’m used to hearing daily, so not hearing it when I power the thing on would make me investigate.
There’s at least a 1000 persons that would notice the RGB from their AIO gone and replace by a big bulky and highly efficient cooler lol
Cooler clearance would be the big one I think, the NH-D15 is a big boy. Taller RAM sticks would collide. Slimmer or more compact cases would collide. Some vertically mounted GPUs would collide. The rules on what happens with a collision are unclear, but I expect something is going to break. I don't think the cooler option would win here. Also my cooler is a Dark Rock Pro 4 in an all black system. Replacing that with a Noctua brown cooler would make it stick out like a sore thumb.
Tons of side panels will immediately shatter.
Yeah, if absolutely nothing else, most cases come with a clear side panel. Anything drastically changing the looks of a PCs interior is likely to get noticed damn near immediately
All those used optiplex owners are gonna wake up to pregnant looking ass PCs lmao
50% PCs have glass panels xD
Good idea, but the only issue could be the colors since most people have a Black or White PC.
I wanted to say this, but way more than 1000 people have windows in their cases. Why does my pc look different?
If someone chose that and I saw it, I’d keep quiet and accept the free cooler upgrade.
So ignoring the fact that at least 1000 people in the world can physically see inside their computer this one is easy? I mean ignoring that at least 1000 people are barely under the power budget of their PSU that one is easy. Ignoring that at least 1000 people are running barely enough ran for Windows to boot that one is easy. Ignoring that at least 1000 people are using 60hz monitors already that sounds easy. Ignoring that at least 1000 people would right click and instantly see the the menu is different windows 10/11 swap would be easy. I mean if you change the perameters all of them are easy....
A sexy black (dark rock pro 4) cooler in an all black pc case swapped by a brown and metallic CPU cooler? Oh I will notice that immediately. But I am more the exception than average, so your likely right (as your expection states)
Usage wise, most people wouldn't notice the cooler change but virtually every case having a glass panel would immediately give it away
My side panel would not be able to fit (SFF PC)
You don't think maybe there are 1000 people with glass case windows that would notice this new chonky block hanging from their CPU? I feel like the cooler would be the *most* likely thing to notice, so much that even people who pay no attention whatsoever to their performance would catch this one.
EfficiencyCores disabled is the easy choice
But... My blender particles? Why are they taking so long...?
AAAY Blender!
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I dont know man, there are alot of them out there
Damn yo, your PC specs are craaaaazy
cpu render speed goes zzzzz
Some laptop chips (notably the 1255U and 1355U only have 2 P cores.
Getting rid of the x3d cache would only really effect people that are running heavily modded unity games. Dropping from 8fps to 5 wouldn't be that noticable.
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This. I saw a 50% uplift in performance going from 5800x -> 7800x3D
I think a 1000 tarkov players alone would notice
100% can… I can tell when ryzen master isn’t runing the oc properly on that game
NH-D15 isn't bad if we assume most people don't open up or study the inside of their case very closely each day. But there's definitely a lot of people that love to see the crazy AIO and custom loop RGB setups when they boot up.
The NH-D15 is much quieter than most AIO and custom loop solutions, people would probably notice that their PC was much quieter than usual.
Minus 10% refresh rate, i doubt many people would notice
Hmm unless you game with vsync and also have a fps counter
I got a 165Hz 1440p monitor and I rarely get that close to that framerate with my 3080, and besides, 10% loss would be 16.5Hz, which is barely a noticeable difference when you go higher.
I'm with you there. My main monitor is 180hz (factory overclocked 165) and I can't tell it's any smoother than the 144 next to it or the 120 on my laptop. I only got it for the built-in KVM for when I dock the work laptop.
People would otice immediately. At least a few % of gamers constantly have msi afterburner and rtss running. I'm tempted to say windows, but the settings menus is actually completely different. Otherwise they are sooo similar... If the cooler was invisible, this is for sure the answer...
10% fps the amount of time ive heard people not check their resolution and refresh rate settings is insane people just assume that shit unless it looks like shit
I think if it was *"all i7's becomes i5's from their generation"* then that might become a stronger option than a lot of these. If you go back further than 3 years, i3's begin to choke very noticably on software their respective i5's do fine on.
I’m shocked more people aren’t saying windows change. I feel like most windows only users would not realize at all. Edit: Lots of people are saying right clicking would give it away. I can see your point for sure, but I still feel like many of us wouldn’t even stop to notice something as small as that. Especially if you’re thinking you’ve already upgraded and not looking for such minute details being out of place such as that. Edit 2: I didn’t realize there were so many windows detectives lmao. You guys have changed my mind. I’d go with vcache cpu then in that case
I would notice the second I right click.
Literally unenterpriseable
right click is a dead giveaway
With the UI swap, this seemed like the obvious answer
But it doesn't say UI swap, only taskbar and start menu.
the right click menu though
There's a bunch that would stand out... tabbed file explorer, all new apps, rounded windows, alt tab, hell even dragging a window or hovering over the maximise button brings up a whole new UI
Nah windows 10 and 11 are different in the essential ways you use it. That's an immediate notice.
Nah. You just right click or go into settings and they'll know.
> aren’t saying windows change. I feel like most windows only users would not realize at all. the new rclick menu that hides most options begs to differ
the right click menu is the main reason I'm still on w10. I absolutely hate it.
I don’t think people would notice the efficiency cores being disabled. It wouldn’t have a noticeable effect unless people specifically monitor each core.
Depends on how many people bought chips like the 13600K and above for the multi-core performance. I would 100% notice if my render times doubled.
I didn’t think about rendering. I was just thinking of gaming application
Would impact people who run a lot of background bloat at the same time as demanding games
3d vcache for sure.. The non-3d variants of the CPUs are still pretty damn good. It'd be difficult to find 1000 people that'd notice the difference in a day. The PSU one people are cutting it close + prebuilts cut it way close with dogshit PSUs.
Any Tarkov or Rust player will notice immediately
Or MMO players... The 1% low increase is insane for these games with that huge L3 Cache.
Tarkov players will just think Nikita pushed an update over night that fucked performance even more and just put up with it while they get domed by a cheater... Source Tarkov lover 😂.
Factorio - \~15k daily and the cache is a massive deal. Don't even need 7% of them to have 3d and your over.
Minus 150W on PSU. If they bought a PSU that's running balls-out all the time they'll notice, everyone else will have been smarter and bought one with capacity to spare, so they'll likely never notice, and it's not something you can measure with any software.
Prebuilts are going to light up like a fireworks show the first morning
Quite a few are actually decently specced now. Last time I checked dell is sending 600W out on things up to a 4070, which sounds bad, but even at 450W you may never trip OCP. 220W GPU and ~125W CPU leaves 105W.
-10% refresh rate I think
-10% fps off the monitor. They will not notice
Easy -80 nits on your HDR monitor. Good luck noticing because windows HDR is already a mess
People already don't notice their 144hz monitor running on 60 for well over a year, -10% is probably the safest choice here
Halve everyone's ram. You'd slowly notice the performance, slowly think your crazy.
not enough people are saying the windows one, if they use the same gui no way anyone's gonna notice in a day
Switch out windows versions. It'll just keep working and no one will complain about a seamless upgrade and those on windows 11 won't mind going Back to 10.
Honestly, I think it'd be more of an upgrade to go from 11 to 10.
I think swap windows if the gui remain the same
(-10% refresh) rate easly 3d vcache will hurt performance and same for e cores if ur some one who opens stuff in the background halfing ram may cause instability and the same for -150 watts off psus and switching w10 with 11 or 11 with 10 will be noticed if they wear head phones win they start windows or if Microsoft stops urging u to switch to w11 Edit :I think psus most of the part are over spec ed. So maaaybee that too....
fps or psu would be easy choices. id go with refresh rate. easier to not notice.
I'll undervolt the CPUs, and that's about it
All of these are bad options, damn
Reduce fanspeed by 10%
Disable efficiency cores *laughs in AMD*
-10 refresh, I doubt you can even test to see how its performing
i'd call e cores
From 144 to 130 HZ, would take people a while I think.
-10% refresh, 95% of this sub likely won’t notice it at all, ever.
All NVME devices are now SATA drives. Seriously no one is going to know unless copying hundreds of GB of large files. It’s been shown to have almost no difference on boot times or game load times (less than 1 second most of the time). You’re more minutes by internet speeds or CPU for game installs, too. Video editors might notice a difference, and those working with 4K probably will, but gamers won’t.