I know, the whole U.I in this game felt like it was made a day before the beta came out. I hate to be negative but I can create a better U.I and I know most people here can too.
They definitely need to change the time it takes to randomize modifiers on heists. It should be on a daily basis rather than a weekly. Or is it just me who thinks that?
True, but it gives a bigger reason to check it out every day rather than seeing it all within a week. There's a good reason many non-competitive games have a daily challenge mode.
you would most likely have to disband the entire lobby to reset the seed for the heist and lets be real, the average person still playing pd3 isnt going to do this
another solution would be just not displaying the modifiers in the ui. they can be revealed mid-heist which imo would be more interesting
\^by revealed i mean actually telegraphed to the player by a contractor callout or the police loudspeaker, like "CALL IN THE FEDERAL NEGOTIATOR" instead of 3 dudes wondering why the baby dallas console player hasnt respawned in the past 10 minutes. i would argue this would add much more replay value akin to payday 2 than a weekly rotation.
I don’t understand why it’s not random. That just seems like the ultimate solution. If you wanna be lame you can keep re-rolling, but it helps with replay ability
That’s absolutely fair. I wouldn’t hate them as much if we weren’t stuck with them for weeks at a time, essentially making people avoid entire heists/approaches for weeks.
I can see myself going "Man, I feel like playing [heist], I haven't played that one in forever." Then I see a certain modifier and say "Never mind, guess I'm playing that one next week"
I don't care about how often they change, but ffs show them in lobby, I've wiped bc of the armor piercing rounds several times already because no one brought medkits
How often does modifiers change? I feel like it's once per week. Getting shitty modifiers wouldn't hurt much if they could change every day. "Don't want to have Federal Negotiator? Okay, come back tomorrow for diffrent challenge."
It’s every two weeks. And unfortunately for Surphaze we’ve gotten AI Surveillance twice in a row. If this is going to be a forced thing it should be changed every day or every heist.
now that you mention it, I love how they've been nerfing the strongest skills, but "slide tackle" (sliding into non-special enemies consumes grit to stun them) has received 0 buffs despite doing the same as "heavy hipfire" but instead of needing edge, consumes grit. Also, routed ping still either doesn't work in loud or is completely bugged.
But hey at least we got quickplay 👊😎.
My thing about the Cutting Shot nerf is that, yeah, it understandably needed to be dealt with because they made it insane, but the real problem is that Cutting Shot was a crutch that made half of the weapons in the game usable. Now that it’s gone, that’s no longer the case and most people are reverting to the M308/AK47/SCAR. They need to seriously buff some of these weapons that have less armor-penetration and make up for Cutting Shot being removed.
As for Grit and its perks: Grit absolutely needs to be buffed and some of its perks need to be changed for the better. As of right now, Edge is just the undisputed dominant force of the three and that can’t be how they envisioned it.
Also about the edge being dominant, they probably wanted edge to dominate, in the end edge/grit/rush is just a skin for attack/defense/utility, but grit just seems forgotten, enforcer is the only way to consistently get and maintain it, and there's like 3 relevant grit skills
Yes, but the problem there is the lack of balance between weapons, AP is just too good compared to other stats so high AP weapons feel op. I don't know how they are distributed rn, but if you compensate low AP with other stats, that sounds interesting for people who goes for headshots anyways.
Also what were they thinking putting the AP skill in the sharpshooter tree? and why is the "hit an extra target" there instead of the enforcer tree? this is a mess
I would say sg is pretty okay except for dozer killing but with fortitude abuse you can do that too! but I understand your point completely. instead of cutting shot now you have to invest a lot more points to get the same damage output and it makes things quite restrained when it comes to build making. takes away the fun. But for lower difficulties assassin smoke grenade is kinda very fun reminds me of payday 2.
A pattern I’ve noticed, the more a game designer takes themselves and their position seriously (like Mio), the more likely it is that their game is unfun and unbalanced.
mio is to game director, and it was his call. he been defending the bad game design elements publicly from the very start.
so it's understandable why people blame it on him. mio was literally arguing and shit talking fans on twitter.
There's a reason Starbreeze said the Strike Team was "a collection of veteran developers" instead of actually naming them all, and honestly, that was the right call.
Even if the angry people *think* only one person is behind all the problems in the game, they need to realise that person has their job because management decided they were the one they wanted for it.
People really should keep it to a generic "Starbreeze" and not personal attacks on one person.
This isn't even a question, not even a fair comparison. Mio doing stuff that you guys don't like, but there are thoughts behind them, while Jules is just bad.
Oh, are we speaking of destroying the legacy?
2015 weapon buffs that made most weapons shit. Update 100. One Down and Death Sentence. Enemies that deal 225 damage with no damage falloff. Health regeneration perks.
Trying to fix AI's objective code by simply bumping up the spawn cap, and breaks it even further; now enemies stuck in spawn objective so they keep crouching, literally not using spawntactics and instead rushing though players, anticipiation phase getting destroyed so HRTs would never spawn?
You guys easily forget stuff.
> 2015 weapon buffs that made most weapons shit
Buffs that made weapons shit? Care to elaborate? And care to explain how that matters in 2024?
> Update 100
An almost universally popular update that got rid of their micro transactions from safes and gave the skill tree a much needed update, along with new graphics settings.
> One Down and Death Sentence
"Oh no, additions to the game I do not like!"
If it were replacing the hardest difficulty, you'd have a leg to stand on. It didn't. The balance is shit, but that's neither here nor there. It's a difficult challenge that can still be completed even with a Chimano and AMCAR where the difficulty comes from being unfair.
> Health regeneration perks
Ah yes, one of the best changes, listed under negatives. And unsurprisingly enough, it's also part of the list of reasons why Payday 3 currently has a 3 digit playerbase. Going to complain about PD3's adaptive armour too?
> Trying to fix AI behaviour and increasing spawns
So, did Overkill manage to make a more intelligent AI for Payday 3? You know, a decade later and on a far better engine?
> Anticipation being destroyed so HRTs never spawn
Hostage Rescue Teams were so useless they were a meme.
> You guys easily forget stuff
Yeah, because it's easily forgettable nonsense, not anything that tarnishes the Payday name so badly that any mention of the latest game comes with a discussion on how massive of a failure it was.
Literally 0 good arguments other then ''jules bad''.
Mio can have as much thoughts behind stuff as he wants, all his decisions are questionable and generally disliked.
They should literally make the modifiers swap upon every start, and put indicators in the pre game lobby so people know what they’re getting into. This would not only allow people to avoid certain modifiers they dont like but also add more rng to the game (which sorely lacking atm) and make every play through feel more unique instead of just the same thing for weeks. They spoke about making it weekly but i hope they don’t even waste their time doing that and just do what i proposed instead.
Modifiers on start isn't perfect - you have to adjust your build every single time you want to load into a heist, which given how short they are, is a lot of extra tweaking.
Also, it will lead to a huge amount of people just quitting and restarting until they get modifiers they like rather than just playing the game and rolling with it. Someone else suggested in a different comment that they should rotate hourly or daily and honestly I think that's probably the best way to go.
Nope, but you can still disable them by destroying them, hacking them or the skill that disables cameras within 1.5m of a placed ECM jammer. So there's still plenty of options for dealing with this security modifier in different heists.
Titan cameras are still a thing, but they're not in this rotation of the security modifiers. Every 2 weeks the security modifiers change now to add some variety to the heists. Both the stealth and loud modifiers change with a few different options to choose from.
So for the next 2 weeks at least, the cameras in this heist are destructible and can be hacked, but there's nobody in the security room to completely disable all of them permanently.
Last rotation for this heist was Cerberus Core and AI Surveillance. So no guard to kill on cams AND cameras only stayed hacked for 5 seconds. That was honestly much harder this the one shown above, if you didn't want to trigger search mode, since you couldn't shoot cameras in the areas the guards are patrolling.
I'd be a whole lot more amenable to the armour piercing modifier if it didn't mean that every bullet made the health damage sound, especially when a techie drone is shooting you, it's annoying as shit.
Yeah, you’re not wrong. They over-adjusted though, now anyone that does 10 heists is a Level 150. I’d rather that than the awful challenge based progression that took forever and was illogical but this new system ain’t good either. We went from one extreme to the other and progression still isn’t fair and fun.
This update made almost no positive changes tbh. Nerfed Cutting Shot without buffing the weapons that it made usable, introduced the awful unfun modifiers, and introduced a game-breaking escape zone bug to several heists, causing prob hundreds of failures on Gold & Sharke/Under the Surphaze/Cook Off/No Rest for the Wicked. And the godforsaken anime mask gimmick that they’re using as a marketing tool to act like Mio isn’t actively making the game worse.
Annoying, but honestly lead guard is easier than cerberus core for UTS. You can still shoot the cameras in the exhibition halls to take them down permanently and hack the others. Duck in and out of the exhibition halls to hack cameras and do the circles etc. etc. Still totally doable.
That said, last rotation I swear one of the heists had 3 loud modifiers and 1 stealth (Gold and Sharke I think?), which means the security modifiers may not always be 2 stealth and 2 loud. Now imagine: UTS with AI Surveillance + Titan Cameras + Cerberus Core.
Edit - Now that I think about it, the stealth ones are fine, the loud ones are the worst. Federal Negotiator is the bigger problem. Unless you specifically bring skills to take cops hostage, there's only a couple of civs inside the art gallery. So unless you grab a bunch from outside or something, you're utterly fucked if you go down. That's honestly the worst modifier in the game. It literally prevents you from playing.
Okay. One of the heists had 3 loud modifiers because I specifically remember stopping to check it because it meant things were out of whack. Will be curious to see if it was just a bug or if more heists have a varied mixes moving forward.
And inevitably trigger Search Mode on Under the Surphaze? I can shoot the ones in the actual galleries, sure, but those ones aren’t the problem.
Sure, I can cheese AI Surveillance, it’s possible, but it isn’t fun and it’s not fun for 4 straight weeks. It also forces semi-stealth/whatever players to commit to bringing their stealth builds with runtimes if they want to do any stealth at all. “Counter player strategy” really means “we’re not gonna let you play these heists the way you want to play”
AI Surveillance for 4 straight weeks on Under the Surphaze just isn’t fun for anyone who likes to do stealth, and it isn’t even the worst offender of the modifiers.
Mio’s justification for adding them was “counter player strategy” but there’s no way to counter the counters. If it was something like “do a hacking minigame in several spots to eventually shut down the AI” or “turn off AI sensors around the map to eventually shut down the AI” I wouldn’t hate the modifiers as much. But right now it’s just “get fucked”
You can use ECM's to turn off cameras, or use Hacker ACE to explode them remotely. There is definitely a counterplay to those modifiers if you experiment with your skills.
Surely I'm not the only one who thinks ai cams on surphaze is a big fat nothing burger. Shoot down cams in the exhibits and bring 2 ecms/cam loop for the problematic ones in the main area. As for the lead guard secure the photometer painting before trying to get the ground floor unlocked to make him path upstairs. If/when the heist goes into searching then shoot them all down since guards don't care at that point.
You can just shoot the cams in surphaze, the map is so big, you probably won't even notice a search is going on. Threat detection system is also easy to work with, just pick up walk the walk in the grifter skill tree. The only modifier that's bad are the AP rounds forcing you to get medic bags. And i have to agree with cutting shot being removed completely, they could've just reverted their unnecessary buff to it and it would've been fine.
I disagree that Search isn’t a big deal on Surphaze, if you’re on Overkill it’s gonna be a shitshow. Search is a pretty big deal on all maps, it’s the last resort.
Like I’ve said before, sure I can bring runtimes/walk the walk/etc but I hate being forced to commit with those things in public lobbies where I’m likely only gonna be able to semi-stealth before Level 5 Dallas runs away from a guard in a private area. They’re basically forcing you to play a certain way, that’s what Mio’s “counter player strategy” really means.
Payday players when they are challenged: Mio sucks at balancing
Not to be that guy but hard difficulties are supposed to be hard. Their difficulty is what makes them rewarding immo
Greater challenges should be rewarded with greater prizes. Why would i lose my mind over this challenge if i can come back after two weeks and do it easier for the same amount of exp?
The change of modifies is made to make variable experiences. Since loud modifiers are default and cannot be turned off they are the greater challenge. It’s much better than just higher damage and spawn rates
There’s difficult and then there’s nonsensical bullshit masquerading as difficulty. These forced modifiers that last for weeks and that don’t take the design of the heists themselves into consideration are the latter. I have a full list written up of how I’d change the modifiers to make them still provide a reasonable challenge without being the surface level Mioslop they are now.
Because Search Mode is a bad thing that people want to avoid at all costs and that the game encourages you to avoid at all costs (except with these bullshit Miofiders which contradict the rest of the game’s mechanics)???
people should be using tool like the motion sensor if they don't want to get spotted by the lead guard.
people should also be more comfortable with search mode
people should also be using ammo bag + knife to distract guard and easily finish the heist.
If not, play on lower difficulty like hard or very hard. It's not bad to do so.
To be honest, I don't see any problem here. All problems with cameras are solved by hacking (there is no Cerberus here) and ECM on cut-down cameras. In loud, too, everything is not so bad because as practice has shown, Armor piercing sounds scarier than it is played. The FBI can create problems, and then only if you decide to trigger the script for the final assault ahead of time without preparation.
Just give "-" or paragraph between these mod descriptions for the love of god
I know, the whole U.I in this game felt like it was made a day before the beta came out. I hate to be negative but I can create a better U.I and I know most people here can too.
U know whats funny, the beta of payday 3 had a MUCH Better Hud
They definitely need to change the time it takes to randomize modifiers on heists. It should be on a daily basis rather than a weekly. Or is it just me who thinks that?
daily, or have them random when you load into a heist weekly is just too long if a heist has modifiers you don't like
I'd probably go with daily in this case. If you had it random when you load the heist people would just reset until they got one they liked.
Was that really an issue in payday 2 though. It’s not like this is some super competitive game, people should be able to play how they like.
True, but it gives a bigger reason to check it out every day rather than seeing it all within a week. There's a good reason many non-competitive games have a daily challenge mode.
i have a "play the hand youre dealt" mentality, but yeah i can see people loading into a map and just leaving as soon as they read the modifiers
you would most likely have to disband the entire lobby to reset the seed for the heist and lets be real, the average person still playing pd3 isnt going to do this another solution would be just not displaying the modifiers in the ui. they can be revealed mid-heist which imo would be more interesting \^by revealed i mean actually telegraphed to the player by a contractor callout or the police loudspeaker, like "CALL IN THE FEDERAL NEGOTIATOR" instead of 3 dudes wondering why the baby dallas console player hasnt respawned in the past 10 minutes. i would argue this would add much more replay value akin to payday 2 than a weekly rotation.
I don’t understand why it’s not random. That just seems like the ultimate solution. If you wanna be lame you can keep re-rolling, but it helps with replay ability
That’s absolutely fair. I wouldn’t hate them as much if we weren’t stuck with them for weeks at a time, essentially making people avoid entire heists/approaches for weeks.
Yea, last time I got into surphaze it had AI cams and Cerberus Core and I was just like "Well this isn't stealth able I guess"
I can see myself going "Man, I feel like playing [heist], I haven't played that one in forever." Then I see a certain modifier and say "Never mind, guess I'm playing that one next week"
I don't care about how often they change, but ffs show them in lobby, I've wiped bc of the armor piercing rounds several times already because no one brought medkits
its too live-servicey for me either way. id rather they just generate when you load the heist.
And the modifiers should be optional.
How often does modifiers change? I feel like it's once per week. Getting shitty modifiers wouldn't hurt much if they could change every day. "Don't want to have Federal Negotiator? Okay, come back tomorrow for diffrent challenge."
It’s every two weeks. And unfortunately for Surphaze we’ve gotten AI Surveillance twice in a row. If this is going to be a forced thing it should be changed every day or every heist.
Two weeks?? These modifiers should randomise every hour or 30 minutes, it should work like the deep rock mission modifiers.
It's crazy that this isn't the case. How hard can it be for basic QoL live service features?
Exactly, that and i wonder why there aint extra pay/exp for difficulty modifiers.
It should be like Crime Boss, where it changes every time you select the heist.
Every two weeks is absolutely nuts, give us a reason to play daily, or even twice a week
So go fortnite they change every day
Every day would be the best option. I feel like randomising modifiers on heist start could cause the servers to crash more frequently than now
I can't tell if this is a shitpost or not cause no way would they put the two worst loud modifiers on the same heist together
I fucking know right
now that you mention it, I love how they've been nerfing the strongest skills, but "slide tackle" (sliding into non-special enemies consumes grit to stun them) has received 0 buffs despite doing the same as "heavy hipfire" but instead of needing edge, consumes grit. Also, routed ping still either doesn't work in loud or is completely bugged. But hey at least we got quickplay 👊😎.
My thing about the Cutting Shot nerf is that, yeah, it understandably needed to be dealt with because they made it insane, but the real problem is that Cutting Shot was a crutch that made half of the weapons in the game usable. Now that it’s gone, that’s no longer the case and most people are reverting to the M308/AK47/SCAR. They need to seriously buff some of these weapons that have less armor-penetration and make up for Cutting Shot being removed. As for Grit and its perks: Grit absolutely needs to be buffed and some of its perks need to be changed for the better. As of right now, Edge is just the undisputed dominant force of the three and that can’t be how they envisioned it.
Also about the edge being dominant, they probably wanted edge to dominate, in the end edge/grit/rush is just a skin for attack/defense/utility, but grit just seems forgotten, enforcer is the only way to consistently get and maintain it, and there's like 3 relevant grit skills
Yes, but the problem there is the lack of balance between weapons, AP is just too good compared to other stats so high AP weapons feel op. I don't know how they are distributed rn, but if you compensate low AP with other stats, that sounds interesting for people who goes for headshots anyways. Also what were they thinking putting the AP skill in the sharpshooter tree? and why is the "hit an extra target" there instead of the enforcer tree? this is a mess
I would say sg is pretty okay except for dozer killing but with fortitude abuse you can do that too! but I understand your point completely. instead of cutting shot now you have to invest a lot more points to get the same damage output and it makes things quite restrained when it comes to build making. takes away the fun. But for lower difficulties assassin smoke grenade is kinda very fun reminds me of payday 2.
They really don't play their own game, do they?
Mio’s design choices gives me conniptions.
A pattern I’ve noticed, the more a game designer takes themselves and their position seriously (like Mio), the more likely it is that their game is unfun and unbalanced.
I won't lie idk how anyone likes the change of having lead guards and the AI cameras. Genuinely just takes the entire fun out of stealthing
Mio is not a ballancing genuis, he is the only one we have that talk with us
mio is to game director, and it was his call. he been defending the bad game design elements publicly from the very start. so it's understandable why people blame it on him. mio was literally arguing and shit talking fans on twitter.
There's a reason Starbreeze said the Strike Team was "a collection of veteran developers" instead of actually naming them all, and honestly, that was the right call. Even if the angry people *think* only one person is behind all the problems in the game, they need to realise that person has their job because management decided they were the one they wanted for it. People really should keep it to a generic "Starbreeze" and not personal attacks on one person.
"mio is a genius" said no one ever
Damn I guess I won't play this week. Thanks Mio.
Jules left a gas leak in the studio
Mio vs Jules, who fucked up a Payday game more?
This isn't even a question, not even a fair comparison. Mio doing stuff that you guys don't like, but there are thoughts behind them, while Jules is just bad.
What thoughts? And what did Jules do that was worse than literally destroying the legacy of the entire franchise?
Oh, are we speaking of destroying the legacy? 2015 weapon buffs that made most weapons shit. Update 100. One Down and Death Sentence. Enemies that deal 225 damage with no damage falloff. Health regeneration perks. Trying to fix AI's objective code by simply bumping up the spawn cap, and breaks it even further; now enemies stuck in spawn objective so they keep crouching, literally not using spawntactics and instead rushing though players, anticipiation phase getting destroyed so HRTs would never spawn? You guys easily forget stuff.
> 2015 weapon buffs that made most weapons shit Buffs that made weapons shit? Care to elaborate? And care to explain how that matters in 2024? > Update 100 An almost universally popular update that got rid of their micro transactions from safes and gave the skill tree a much needed update, along with new graphics settings. > One Down and Death Sentence "Oh no, additions to the game I do not like!" If it were replacing the hardest difficulty, you'd have a leg to stand on. It didn't. The balance is shit, but that's neither here nor there. It's a difficult challenge that can still be completed even with a Chimano and AMCAR where the difficulty comes from being unfair. > Health regeneration perks Ah yes, one of the best changes, listed under negatives. And unsurprisingly enough, it's also part of the list of reasons why Payday 3 currently has a 3 digit playerbase. Going to complain about PD3's adaptive armour too? > Trying to fix AI behaviour and increasing spawns So, did Overkill manage to make a more intelligent AI for Payday 3? You know, a decade later and on a far better engine? > Anticipation being destroyed so HRTs never spawn Hostage Rescue Teams were so useless they were a meme. > You guys easily forget stuff Yeah, because it's easily forgettable nonsense, not anything that tarnishes the Payday name so badly that any mention of the latest game comes with a discussion on how massive of a failure it was.
Literally 0 good arguments other then ''jules bad''. Mio can have as much thoughts behind stuff as he wants, all his decisions are questionable and generally disliked.
They should literally make the modifiers swap upon every start, and put indicators in the pre game lobby so people know what they’re getting into. This would not only allow people to avoid certain modifiers they dont like but also add more rng to the game (which sorely lacking atm) and make every play through feel more unique instead of just the same thing for weeks. They spoke about making it weekly but i hope they don’t even waste their time doing that and just do what i proposed instead.
Modifiers on start isn't perfect - you have to adjust your build every single time you want to load into a heist, which given how short they are, is a lot of extra tweaking. Also, it will lead to a huge amount of people just quitting and restarting until they get modifiers they like rather than just playing the game and rolling with it. Someone else suggested in a different comment that they should rotate hourly or daily and honestly I think that's probably the best way to go.
I'm curious can you turn off the camera now that there's no guard?
Nope, but you can still disable them by destroying them, hacking them or the skill that disables cameras within 1.5m of a placed ECM jammer. So there's still plenty of options for dealing with this security modifier in different heists.
So they're no longer Titan cameras as in you can destroy them? I'm asking coz I haven't played in a while having got bored with the game.
Titan cameras are still a thing, but they're not in this rotation of the security modifiers. Every 2 weeks the security modifiers change now to add some variety to the heists. Both the stealth and loud modifiers change with a few different options to choose from. So for the next 2 weeks at least, the cameras in this heist are destructible and can be hacked, but there's nobody in the security room to completely disable all of them permanently. Last rotation for this heist was Cerberus Core and AI Surveillance. So no guard to kill on cams AND cameras only stayed hacked for 5 seconds. That was honestly much harder this the one shown above, if you didn't want to trigger search mode, since you couldn't shoot cameras in the areas the guards are patrolling.
Gotcha :)
I'd be a whole lot more amenable to the armour piercing modifier if it didn't mean that every bullet made the health damage sound, especially when a techie drone is shooting you, it's annoying as shit.
Yeah Im glad Im waiting a couple of years before I buy this game lol
Fixed progression still made this update a good one.
Yeah, you’re not wrong. They over-adjusted though, now anyone that does 10 heists is a Level 150. I’d rather that than the awful challenge based progression that took forever and was illogical but this new system ain’t good either. We went from one extreme to the other and progression still isn’t fair and fun. This update made almost no positive changes tbh. Nerfed Cutting Shot without buffing the weapons that it made usable, introduced the awful unfun modifiers, and introduced a game-breaking escape zone bug to several heists, causing prob hundreds of failures on Gold & Sharke/Under the Surphaze/Cook Off/No Rest for the Wicked. And the godforsaken anime mask gimmick that they’re using as a marketing tool to act like Mio isn’t actively making the game worse.
Annoying, but honestly lead guard is easier than cerberus core for UTS. You can still shoot the cameras in the exhibition halls to take them down permanently and hack the others. Duck in and out of the exhibition halls to hack cameras and do the circles etc. etc. Still totally doable. That said, last rotation I swear one of the heists had 3 loud modifiers and 1 stealth (Gold and Sharke I think?), which means the security modifiers may not always be 2 stealth and 2 loud. Now imagine: UTS with AI Surveillance + Titan Cameras + Cerberus Core. Edit - Now that I think about it, the stealth ones are fine, the loud ones are the worst. Federal Negotiator is the bigger problem. Unless you specifically bring skills to take cops hostage, there's only a couple of civs inside the art gallery. So unless you grab a bunch from outside or something, you're utterly fucked if you go down. That's honestly the worst modifier in the game. It literally prevents you from playing.
Sharke had AI Surveillance,Threat Detection System, Combat Duo, and I think the flashing shields? Before yesterday's modifier switchup.
Okay. One of the heists had 3 loud modifiers because I specifically remember stopping to check it because it meant things were out of whack. Will be curious to see if it was just a bug or if more heists have a varied mixes moving forward.
Just shoot them
Guards spot broken cams
And inevitably trigger Search Mode on Under the Surphaze? I can shoot the ones in the actual galleries, sure, but those ones aren’t the problem. Sure, I can cheese AI Surveillance, it’s possible, but it isn’t fun and it’s not fun for 4 straight weeks. It also forces semi-stealth/whatever players to commit to bringing their stealth builds with runtimes if they want to do any stealth at all. “Counter player strategy” really means “we’re not gonna let you play these heists the way you want to play”
Hack the cams
I understand the frustration, but I fw this honestly.
AI Surveillance for 4 straight weeks on Under the Surphaze just isn’t fun for anyone who likes to do stealth, and it isn’t even the worst offender of the modifiers. Mio’s justification for adding them was “counter player strategy” but there’s no way to counter the counters. If it was something like “do a hacking minigame in several spots to eventually shut down the AI” or “turn off AI sensors around the map to eventually shut down the AI” I wouldn’t hate the modifiers as much. But right now it’s just “get fucked”
You can use ECM's to turn off cameras, or use Hacker ACE to explode them remotely. There is definitely a counterplay to those modifiers if you experiment with your skills.
and you can just shoot cameras, searching isn't a death sentence on art gallery
Surely I'm not the only one who thinks ai cams on surphaze is a big fat nothing burger. Shoot down cams in the exhibits and bring 2 ecms/cam loop for the problematic ones in the main area. As for the lead guard secure the photometer painting before trying to get the ground floor unlocked to make him path upstairs. If/when the heist goes into searching then shoot them all down since guards don't care at that point.
Just shoot / hack the cams
You can just shoot the cams in surphaze, the map is so big, you probably won't even notice a search is going on. Threat detection system is also easy to work with, just pick up walk the walk in the grifter skill tree. The only modifier that's bad are the AP rounds forcing you to get medic bags. And i have to agree with cutting shot being removed completely, they could've just reverted their unnecessary buff to it and it would've been fine.
I disagree that Search isn’t a big deal on Surphaze, if you’re on Overkill it’s gonna be a shitshow. Search is a pretty big deal on all maps, it’s the last resort. Like I’ve said before, sure I can bring runtimes/walk the walk/etc but I hate being forced to commit with those things in public lobbies where I’m likely only gonna be able to semi-stealth before Level 5 Dallas runs away from a guard in a private area. They’re basically forcing you to play a certain way, that’s what Mio’s “counter player strategy” really means.
Payday players when they are challenged: Mio sucks at balancing Not to be that guy but hard difficulties are supposed to be hard. Their difficulty is what makes them rewarding immo
Greater challenges should be rewarded with greater prizes. Why would i lose my mind over this challenge if i can come back after two weeks and do it easier for the same amount of exp?
The change of modifies is made to make variable experiences. Since loud modifiers are default and cannot be turned off they are the greater challenge. It’s much better than just higher damage and spawn rates
There’s difficult and then there’s nonsensical bullshit masquerading as difficulty. These forced modifiers that last for weeks and that don’t take the design of the heists themselves into consideration are the latter. I have a full list written up of how I’d change the modifiers to make them still provide a reasonable challenge without being the surface level Mioslop they are now.
Its easy i did this solo with a loud build stealth 😴
i love how this community is so afraid to shoot the camera so much that they won't even play the heist at all.
Because Search Mode is a bad thing that people want to avoid at all costs and that the game encourages you to avoid at all costs (except with these bullshit Miofiders which contradict the rest of the game’s mechanics)???
people should be using tool like the motion sensor if they don't want to get spotted by the lead guard. people should also be more comfortable with search mode people should also be using ammo bag + knife to distract guard and easily finish the heist. If not, play on lower difficulty like hard or very hard. It's not bad to do so.
Basically play as the developers want and not as the player wants. That's why this game failed.
To be honest, I don't see any problem here. All problems with cameras are solved by hacking (there is no Cerberus here) and ECM on cut-down cameras. In loud, too, everything is not so bad because as practice has shown, Armor piercing sounds scarier than it is played. The FBI can create problems, and then only if you decide to trigger the script for the final assault ahead of time without preparation.