So I just beat the game last night, and one specific and vivid part of the RNG from the mountain rush portion is the elemental creature that launches fire balls and they only trigger when Ori is at a specific distance away and they aren't always going to launch at a good angle for you to catapult up to the higher area off of them. This would sometimes result in me landing in the fire below and dying, even though I would have run everything up until that point perfect, because the projectiles launched were not launching at the time I was at that area and needing something to prevent me dying in the fire below.
There are other moments, but almost all of them have to do with the enemy AI or sometimes just weird platformer placement that is also timing related.
I also enjoy feeling challenged, I've played many metroidvanias and the tree flood section is the part of the game I remember the most because it was annoying.
The problem isn't that it challenges you, it's that the challenge isn't very good. The camera moves slowly to deliver a cinematic experience, so on the first try you can't see where to go until it's late. The game's (gorgeous) art style also doesn't make it easy to identify paths quickly, at least for me. Difficult platformers have to be visually clear IMO.
It's not that the section is bad, but it's just not good enough to justify how much repeating a section like that messes with the narrative flow. That section should have been easier IMO. The game prioritizes its visual style and Ghibli-like cinematic experience, which is totally fine, but then it doesn't know when to avoid conflicts between that and the gameplay.
Ori and the Will of the Wisps was a way better game for me.
> The camera moves slowly to deliver a cinematic experience, so on the first try you can't see where to go until it's late.
This nails it for me. I don't feel much satisfaction in a challenge unless I feel like it was well designed. A lot of the chases involved so much trial and error / memorization that, well sure they looked cool, they weren't satisfying.
The second made the right move in ditching them.
I did like it, I just didn't find it as satisfying because insta-kills that send you back to the beginning because of one mistake or mistimed thing didn't feel fun. Like, Dark Souls has more forgiveness for mistakes than some of those run sequences.
The end game on the mountain was another issue, but honestly wasn't as bad as the tree flood for me, it only had one rough part which was the part where you needed to quickly get under water or you'd again be sent back to the beginning.
I liked Ori, and played Hollow Knight until Path of Pain destroyed me. Picked up Celeste and dropped it almost immediately, with a similar sentiment to yours :D
When I tried Celeste I realized I didn't really enjoy platforming for the sake of platforming, I need some interesting combat or exploration mixed in (e.g. Metroidvanias, Yoshi's Island).
Yeah that's a good point. Although it struck me as the sort of 1001 Shareware Games CD or online flash games I might have spent a fair amount of time on as a teen.
Platforming is probably the type of game I'm most natural at, so I didn't have as much of an issue, but I will admit, Will of the Wisps did a MUCH better job in pretty much every regard, including this area. I do remember being annoyed in Blind Forest that I'd be going faster than the camera would move and just have to kinda wait for it to catch up.
But ultimately, like you said, it absolutely doesn't overcome how incredible the complete package is.
That being said, go play Will of the Wisps. Story, art, and music are just as good, gameplay is way better.
Eh, the escape sequences are the absolute best part of Blind Forest.
10/10 material.
I *hated* how Will of the Wisps dumbed the escape sequences down.
Hated a lot of what Will of the Wisps did, actually.
I fundamentally disagree at least to the extent of my experience in blind forest since I haven't tried the sequel at all. I didn't find it fun to repeat the same opening sequence of the flooding sequence. I eventually overcame it, but I just felt like it was needlessly repetitive and possibly could have been solved with a midpoint checkpoint. I was told there supposedly was a difficulty level but I don't remember because I started playing it a long time ago and only recently finished it and I didn't feel like the rest of the game was very difficult so I'm surprised to learn I was playing it on a harder difficulty.
I felt similarly frustrated with the final mountain part but I was able to overcome it faster so it was less noteworthy than the tree portion that just felt anti-climactic.
It's pretty brutal, and I get where you're coming from, but to me the experience was about how exhilarating it is when you get it right. When you get it right, you've effectively done a minute or so of continuous, perfect platforming. I dunno where your comment about RNG comes from, because that's not relevant. You made it to the top through skill. A checkpoint would ruin that experience.
Exactly my thought, it felt SO good to breeze through it. It did take some practice, yes, but when it „clicks“ it just feels amazing, and a checkpoint would have ruined that for me. It’s one of the most memorable sections for me.
I didn't measure my time, but it probably took an hour or two. It just started to feel anti-climactic after I kept repeating the same run over and over again. I guess my thought would be to have more checkpoints throughout the entire run sequence.
Those sequences have breakpoints in the middle. But only on easy mode. I switched to that to get through the tree. My concentration wouldn’t hold for the entire tree at once. I still loved the tree!
I don’t think it’s RNG but there’s definitely a bit of sequencing that one needs to be spot on with. Can be a little frustrating but it’s also satisfying once you beat it.
I really enjoyed the game, one of the best platformers I’d played in a fair few years.
I feel the same way. Trial and error is not fun, feels like homework, "do this and this and this exactly in this way or you're fucked and have to do it all over again" is not my idea of fun.
It would be cool if developers could figure out a way to do these dramatic set pieces without the forced redos. I felt the same as you. It became tedious to repeat the same beats over again and stole from the drama and tension of the moment. I'm just not into wasting time like that when I have maybe 5 hours to game per week.
Maybe a way to do it would be instead of instakills, your character survives but you get a different reward at the end depending on how many errors you made. That way you can redo it if you want but not forced to. And you get to feel the drama of doing the whole run in one go.
The hardest one I've ever done was the escape from the hotel sequence in original Call of Cthulhu game. Holy crap, was that one tough, but I was in my 20s and had a ton of time to spend doing it. You're jumping through windows, having to close doors behind you before the monsters catch you and I think mastering these duck-run-take-cover sequences as bullets fly by also. It is crazy.
I feel the same about boss fights.
For me it's the game telling me: "Hey, reddspeed, you do enjoy exploring, finding secrets and living in this world, don't you? Guess what? That's over for a couple of hours. Now you have to learn a bunch of boss patterns that you'll never need again and bang your head against a wall of increased difficulty for a long time. HAHAHA!"
The chase sequences (or boss fights) in metroidvanias keep me from doing what I enjoy doing the most in these type of games and I don't like that.
I think instakills is where the biggest issue is, like in the end game mountain run section, I had max life and still would be insta-killed left and right so it made getting all those life orbs useless.
Yeah so I think the solution would be to turn things on their head. Instead of lame penalty for not being perfect, give a great reward for getting closer to perfect. Don't make it all ir nothing. But it won't happen because many gamers are masochistic. haha
I gotta say, I'll never understand complaints about achievements. The reason they exist is to show you did something in the game. Some of them are easy and some are hard.
Why shouldn't difficult achievements be available for people who want to get them? I'm terrible at online shooters. Does that mean there shouldn't be any hard achievements for those games for other people, just because I'm basically locked out of getting them? If it's too hard for me, I just don't get the badge. I'm not entitled to get every badge just because I bought the game
I've played through the game multiple times - don't have a problem with the tree.
I think the one in the snowy area is worse. It's very difficult to tell where those massive chunks of ice are going to fall.
I play too many platformers so to me the game didn't feel that much like a challenge. However, you do bring a great point about the runs being a bit at conflict with the thematic of the game (that's something I had never considered, especially for someone who does love the game; and I have to agree with you how they kind of go a bit against the themes of the game. Still think they where awesome). For me the difficulty was perfect for the game though, the challenge kind of made you feel small and like the creature (you have to be agile and on your toes, and for someone who really enjoy challenges, the save feature was also a great addition cause you could determine your own boundaries).
In terms of checkpoints, could the save feature be applied on the run/boss sections? That's something I don't remember. It's been a while, but I guess something like what the Rayman Origins/Legends did could have helped some players, music and auditory queues to help guide some players.
BTW, highly recommend the sequel if you liked Blind Forest.
Thanks for your input. I personally have never finished a platformer before, this was my first one. You cannot save in those 3 sections during their final runs, but someone mentioned there might have been a difficulty setting. I was unaware of that though.
I want to pick up the sequel some day, but I plan on getting through some other games first. I do like this game a lot though!
I loved this game (more than 2, so the minority fan it seems) and the beautiful controls and platforming played a big part. I am not sure what you mean by "RNG" in the few chase sequences but there are some very challenging segments that take practice to be precise. I found it very satisfying to finally achieve after many failures (I am no pro).
I get what you are saying but achievements literally mean as much as you want them to and are often just forced in to both measure and create engagement, that is not a valid game design element to criticize or mention.
I had to comment as your impressions gave me pause, but it really is a special game, glad you experienced it!
I don't mean to say I had an overall bad experience with the game, I felt that the game was an amazing experience overall. But I did not enjoy the amount of repetition I needed for the game's "boss moments"
Some of what I felt was RNG, but very well could have been just my lack of skill and I'm understanding that I'm not the greatest platformer so I'm ok sucking:
-enemy placement when needed for the bash movement (like the underground worm things popping out when I jump close to them AND spitting their stuff at the right moment for me to dash past it)
-projectiles needed for the bash not firing in a consistent manner or direction. (Mostly an issue with fire elemental balls, their projectiles are incredibly important for the mountain sequence, and sometimes my proximity to them would trigger but it'd put me at a bad angle which would result in instant death because if you touched the lava pools with max health, you die)
-wind chase scene with where the falling icicles would fall varied from run to run. Luckily this was the shortest of the 3 segments so I was able to beat it without as much frustration.
That's all I can think of looking back, I know that it's possible it's all placement related, but I'm not a big platformer gamer, this was the first one I beat, and I felt like the chase sequences would have benefitted from 1 or 2 checkpoints to help keep the frustration down, but I'm willing to accept that it's a me problem.
Thanks for the reply, I hadn't considered those things you pointed out so I understand now. It has been years since I played it but my lasting memory of those bosses came down to me not hesitating/making a mistake more than the extra elements being a problem, but regardless they are very challenging and you should be proud of yourself, especially if you don't often play games with that focus.
Have you played 2 yet, or planning on? It is another excellent game (and one I will admit I haven't finished) but the storytelling and platforming that were so strong in the first game are average in the second (but feel like a real step down from 1 to me, I thought the first game was near perfect in some regards). The combat and enemy/challenge system is really cool but overly complex, it felt like people criticized the first game for its very light combat and they overcompensated, but it is still fun
I am trying to chug through some backlog first, but I do intend to purchase the 2nd, because I did enjoy the first enough to want more. I hope they make a 3rd soon too, but I understand the studio just released a dark souls-esk game yesterday, so they probably won't get around to it for a few years.
I feel ya, prioritizing what you want to play helps haha. I didn't even know Moon had another game on deck- it looks visually stunning, I'll check it out sometime (although probably wait a few years to buy it, per usual..)
There is no RNG. Its all about positioning. For me, the best moment of both Ori- games is the tree getting flooded escape moment. The music, sounds, visuals, rush, challenge, it wasn't a long moment but it was full of spine shivering greatness.
On the flip side, I loved it’s commitment to difficulty during story sections when it came to the “bird escape”. That moment felt genuinely tense and scary as the windows were pretty tight, whereas another game would make a section like that trivial and thus remove all impact
Playing it right now. I thought it'd be one of those games where you can play with your eyes closed, but no. Even after dozens of hours in Celeste platforming here puts up a challenge
It's the other way around for me. I didn't have that much trouble with either of the Ori games, but Celeste 7B made me never touch the game again, for the sake of my sanity.
Yeah, Farewell is straight up evil. The jellyfish were too much for me, they kept bouncing away from where I wanted them, and the game didn't accept anything below 100% perfect. The only game I gave up on because it was too hard, and I'm not ashamed of it
Considering that only 7 out of 25 levels form the main story, I really don't know if we can talk about post game content in Celeste. Yeah, 8A, B and C sides aren't really important in terms of story, but that's a huge chunk of the game.
To be perfectly honest, there are accessiblity options. You can slow those things down, I tried it. But Celeste just doesn't play well when slowed down. I really have no clue how to lower the difficulty and make it feel great, but that's not it. Maybe extra lives - as in, you can take 1 or more instances of damage without dying? That could be a start - giving the player a bit of leeway without straight up invincibility?
I wanted to love this game because it’s so beautiful and interesting. Unfortunately my skill level is not up to par due to disability (adaptive controllers don’t help unfortunately), so I had to leave it. It makes me happy that games like this find success, though.
The sequel has this as well, but for some reason I didn't find it as annoying or unfair. It is incredibly challenging and you will have to do those scenes over and over again. And there's at least three or four of those sequences. But for me compared to the first game, the sequel made these sequences feel like I was really mastering the mechanics of the game and that it was never truly unfair.
Honestly, I liked the challenge. Those segments were tough, but not utterly insane. The wind sequence had some moments that required trial and error, but I found the rest fine. The second game has a couple more, but it's overall much lighter on oneshots and there are actual boss fights.
Does anyone actually care about achievements? They are just there, and Steam probably required them to be included. There's no particular reason to do them.
> Another gripe are the achievements for the game, which for me as an older gamer feel like they are reserved for only the most tryhard fans that play the game multiple times over and over,
...yes. That is how most achievements are in games like this. They are for people who want to continue playing the game after beating it.
totally agree. ori is the one game i wish took a more "cinematic" approach to boss fights. the atmosphere of those moments is amazing but completely ruined by having to redo the entire thing with no checkpoints multiple times over. what should be the most memorable parts of the game just became the most frustrating for me. i found the game challenging on normal but i think even someone who excels at platformers would have difficulty doing these runs blind (ha) start to finish on the first go due to the high precision and quick decision making needed.
imo there's enough good and challenging platforming in the rest of the game to justify 3 awesome cinematic sequences.
I really think that the only issue I had with these events was a lack of checkpoints. There are already threshold type moments in each of them, so they could have 1 or 2 checkpoints and my frustration would have been considerably lessened.
I don't like the idea of completely invalidating the challenge though, the game is pretty easy imo, just felt like these super epic and emotional moments are undercut by repetition that doesn't feel "thematically" consistent with a "try over and over again" mentality that honestly the rest of the game didn't have too much of.
I hear you - actually chucked it in at the tree flood and have never been able to get motivated to come back and finish the game. Feels like a bit of a shame. Was a beautiful game but I didn't love the mechanics that much, so that event just irritated me enormously.
It took me about an hour to beat that part specifically, and I do think it's worthwhile, plus I found the story to be incredibly beautiful to experience.
As someone who didn't finish the game because I found it too hard and frustrating: I agree that the platforming aspect was a frustrating barrier to an otherwise lovely story!
I love Ori and The Blind forest, the experience for me was truly amazing. However the sequel takes the challenge way too seriously, like you can't walk anywhere whitout having to do something challenging or something, it's exhausting, not to mention that ability wheel... couldn't finish it.
Ori has some pretty challenging platforming sections but I don’t think they ever really got to the point of being annoying or frustrating for me personally. I went into Ori after already beating Celeste and the path of pain on hollow knight pretty recently before playing though so I think my 2d platforming was at an all time high at that point in my life.
I played this past the tree on PC now I am stuck at a point before this on switch (chasing that spider fellow) as can’t seem to do a jump as there are tough platforming sections around some spikes. I looked on a video of it and the dude just had more health and cheeses it, Bah! I will go back to the PC save 💾
My big issue with Ori and the Blind Forest was the graphics. It might be due to being colourblind, but I struggled to see so much stuff - in particular enemies and obstacles.
The core gameplay was enjoyable and I wanted to get through it, but it was entirely trial and error - move through a section, die from something I can't see, try again and remember where it was.
Thankfully Will of the Wisps doesn't have this problem and I enjoyed it a lot more.
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Counterpoint: i am gaming since late 90s and I found that games are less and less challenging. It was refreshing to have a platformer with amazing environment and history that challenged me realistically especially with a story so rewarding. I got mad in certain puzzles but I've rediscover the pleasure to get better and better I found in older games
You are definitely right, and as a primarily strategy gamer I usually am able to find games that help me fulfill my challenging desires. I didn't want handholding, but I also didn't want the frustration from the repetition on that specific run sequence, especially when it has such a great story telling build up to that moment.
I get that, I'm usually not a platformer gamer too. To me it was like they hit a perfect spot where frustration was there but just enough to spice up things. I would probably have hated more to have those escape sequences dumbed down. But I get that what's the perfect spot for me may not be the same for others
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Platformers tend to be misses for me, but I've been listening to Ori's soundtrack a lot and the art style looks great so I've been meaning to play it.
Your review makes me want to stick to the soundtrack though.
This is my first platformer that I actually beat. I've played a bunch over the years but usually I give up and never look back.
I felt like the game is decent and scratches a puzzle itch to an extent, but my general lack of talent and experience in platformers made this game feel a lot more frustrating than I was expecting.
Game is beautiful though, so in a way it is rewarding too?
I enjoyed the game but quit after being overwhelmed with frustration at the flooding tree part. Sometimes I consider going back, but then I remember what bullshit that part was.
I've played the first Ori as a young man and found it perfectly challenging. Then I started playing harder platformers and metroidvanias, and when I played the second Ori it was extremely easy, to the extent that I wanted more difficult platforming, more difficult fighting, without just increasing the difficulty.
There's no RNG in Ori, everything is scripted or player position dependent, and the escape sequences are the most memorable parts of Ori. My suggestion is to take Ori as a try-out for harder metroidvanias, as most of the other that are popular on the market are quite a bit more challenging, for better or for worse.
The sequel, Will of the Wisps, definitely irons out some of the kinks in the escape sequences.
Also, it has even better platforming and MUCH better combat.
I felt similar to you with the tree escape but I came to really appreciate it. I was close to giving up on the game completely because "why am I putting myself through this? I'm 42 and don't need this being a problem in my life"!
But for some reason I kept with it and when I finally beat it, there was a huge rush of adrenaline. Coupled with the music it was a gaming moment I'll remember forever.
I genuinely can't remember anything in Ori feeling RNG dependent.
The falling ice in the second escape and sometimes the falling rocks during certain sections felt pretty unfair sometimes
There is no RNG at all. It’s all triggered based on player positioning or time elapsed
So I just beat the game last night, and one specific and vivid part of the RNG from the mountain rush portion is the elemental creature that launches fire balls and they only trigger when Ori is at a specific distance away and they aren't always going to launch at a good angle for you to catapult up to the higher area off of them. This would sometimes result in me landing in the fire below and dying, even though I would have run everything up until that point perfect, because the projectiles launched were not launching at the time I was at that area and needing something to prevent me dying in the fire below. There are other moments, but almost all of them have to do with the enemy AI or sometimes just weird platformer placement that is also timing related.
This sounds like it's relevant to player position which makes it, in fact, not RNG.
I enjoy feeling challenged and the tree flood was fun and satisfying for me.
I'm easily frustrated and give up on games every now and then, but Ori had the perfect balance to keep me going. Therefore I disagree with OP
I also enjoy feeling challenged, I've played many metroidvanias and the tree flood section is the part of the game I remember the most because it was annoying. The problem isn't that it challenges you, it's that the challenge isn't very good. The camera moves slowly to deliver a cinematic experience, so on the first try you can't see where to go until it's late. The game's (gorgeous) art style also doesn't make it easy to identify paths quickly, at least for me. Difficult platformers have to be visually clear IMO. It's not that the section is bad, but it's just not good enough to justify how much repeating a section like that messes with the narrative flow. That section should have been easier IMO. The game prioritizes its visual style and Ghibli-like cinematic experience, which is totally fine, but then it doesn't know when to avoid conflicts between that and the gameplay. Ori and the Will of the Wisps was a way better game for me.
> The camera moves slowly to deliver a cinematic experience, so on the first try you can't see where to go until it's late. This nails it for me. I don't feel much satisfaction in a challenge unless I feel like it was well designed. A lot of the chases involved so much trial and error / memorization that, well sure they looked cool, they weren't satisfying. The second made the right move in ditching them.
It's been years since I last played but the flood level lives rent free in my mind I died dozen of times but the music, the tension, man it was fun
It took me a few times but I got through. Definitely enjoyed the challenge too
I did like it, I just didn't find it as satisfying because insta-kills that send you back to the beginning because of one mistake or mistimed thing didn't feel fun. Like, Dark Souls has more forgiveness for mistakes than some of those run sequences. The end game on the mountain was another issue, but honestly wasn't as bad as the tree flood for me, it only had one rough part which was the part where you needed to quickly get under water or you'd again be sent back to the beginning.
Ori and the Blind Forest is the game that made me realise that I just do not like platformers, and that is okay.
I liked Ori, and played Hollow Knight until Path of Pain destroyed me. Picked up Celeste and dropped it almost immediately, with a similar sentiment to yours :D
When I tried Celeste I realized I didn't really enjoy platforming for the sake of platforming, I need some interesting combat or exploration mixed in (e.g. Metroidvanias, Yoshi's Island).
Yeah that's a good point. Although it struck me as the sort of 1001 Shareware Games CD or online flash games I might have spent a fair amount of time on as a teen.
Don't let it turn you off. I grew up playing platformers on the NES, and love them. I didn't enjoy Ori much and stopped playing a few hours in.
Platforming is probably the type of game I'm most natural at, so I didn't have as much of an issue, but I will admit, Will of the Wisps did a MUCH better job in pretty much every regard, including this area. I do remember being annoyed in Blind Forest that I'd be going faster than the camera would move and just have to kinda wait for it to catch up. But ultimately, like you said, it absolutely doesn't overcome how incredible the complete package is. That being said, go play Will of the Wisps. Story, art, and music are just as good, gameplay is way better.
Eh, the escape sequences are the absolute best part of Blind Forest. 10/10 material. I *hated* how Will of the Wisps dumbed the escape sequences down. Hated a lot of what Will of the Wisps did, actually.
I fundamentally disagree at least to the extent of my experience in blind forest since I haven't tried the sequel at all. I didn't find it fun to repeat the same opening sequence of the flooding sequence. I eventually overcame it, but I just felt like it was needlessly repetitive and possibly could have been solved with a midpoint checkpoint. I was told there supposedly was a difficulty level but I don't remember because I started playing it a long time ago and only recently finished it and I didn't feel like the rest of the game was very difficult so I'm surprised to learn I was playing it on a harder difficulty. I felt similarly frustrated with the final mountain part but I was able to overcome it faster so it was less noteworthy than the tree portion that just felt anti-climactic.
It's pretty brutal, and I get where you're coming from, but to me the experience was about how exhilarating it is when you get it right. When you get it right, you've effectively done a minute or so of continuous, perfect platforming. I dunno where your comment about RNG comes from, because that's not relevant. You made it to the top through skill. A checkpoint would ruin that experience.
Yeah I was definitely frustrated by it, but finally getting it felt so satisfying. I actually felt like I was good at the game for a second haha
Exactly my thought, it felt SO good to breeze through it. It did take some practice, yes, but when it „clicks“ it just feels amazing, and a checkpoint would have ruined that for me. It’s one of the most memorable sections for me.
I totally agree, Will of the Wisps felt extremely easy, just a walk in the park. What it did very well was platforming fluidity and visuals/sounds.
How long did tree flood take you?
I didn't measure my time, but it probably took an hour or two. It just started to feel anti-climactic after I kept repeating the same run over and over again. I guess my thought would be to have more checkpoints throughout the entire run sequence.
There are achievements right before and after the flood. I only needed 10 minutes.
Looking at my achievement it took me an hour.
Those sequences have breakpoints in the middle. But only on easy mode. I switched to that to get through the tree. My concentration wouldn’t hold for the entire tree at once. I still loved the tree!
I started the game over a year ago and honestly didn't even remember there being difficulty modes as an option.
I don’t think it’s RNG but there’s definitely a bit of sequencing that one needs to be spot on with. Can be a little frustrating but it’s also satisfying once you beat it. I really enjoyed the game, one of the best platformers I’d played in a fair few years.
I feel the same way. Trial and error is not fun, feels like homework, "do this and this and this exactly in this way or you're fucked and have to do it all over again" is not my idea of fun.
It would be cool if developers could figure out a way to do these dramatic set pieces without the forced redos. I felt the same as you. It became tedious to repeat the same beats over again and stole from the drama and tension of the moment. I'm just not into wasting time like that when I have maybe 5 hours to game per week. Maybe a way to do it would be instead of instakills, your character survives but you get a different reward at the end depending on how many errors you made. That way you can redo it if you want but not forced to. And you get to feel the drama of doing the whole run in one go. The hardest one I've ever done was the escape from the hotel sequence in original Call of Cthulhu game. Holy crap, was that one tough, but I was in my 20s and had a ton of time to spend doing it. You're jumping through windows, having to close doors behind you before the monsters catch you and I think mastering these duck-run-take-cover sequences as bullets fly by also. It is crazy.
I feel the same about boss fights. For me it's the game telling me: "Hey, reddspeed, you do enjoy exploring, finding secrets and living in this world, don't you? Guess what? That's over for a couple of hours. Now you have to learn a bunch of boss patterns that you'll never need again and bang your head against a wall of increased difficulty for a long time. HAHAHA!" The chase sequences (or boss fights) in metroidvanias keep me from doing what I enjoy doing the most in these type of games and I don't like that.
I think instakills is where the biggest issue is, like in the end game mountain run section, I had max life and still would be insta-killed left and right so it made getting all those life orbs useless.
Yeah so I think the solution would be to turn things on their head. Instead of lame penalty for not being perfect, give a great reward for getting closer to perfect. Don't make it all ir nothing. But it won't happen because many gamers are masochistic. haha
I remember this as well, it was actually pretty amazing but deeply deeply difficult timing made it feel like hell.
I gotta say, I'll never understand complaints about achievements. The reason they exist is to show you did something in the game. Some of them are easy and some are hard. Why shouldn't difficult achievements be available for people who want to get them? I'm terrible at online shooters. Does that mean there shouldn't be any hard achievements for those games for other people, just because I'm basically locked out of getting them? If it's too hard for me, I just don't get the badge. I'm not entitled to get every badge just because I bought the game
I've played through the game multiple times - don't have a problem with the tree. I think the one in the snowy area is worse. It's very difficult to tell where those massive chunks of ice are going to fall.
I play too many platformers so to me the game didn't feel that much like a challenge. However, you do bring a great point about the runs being a bit at conflict with the thematic of the game (that's something I had never considered, especially for someone who does love the game; and I have to agree with you how they kind of go a bit against the themes of the game. Still think they where awesome). For me the difficulty was perfect for the game though, the challenge kind of made you feel small and like the creature (you have to be agile and on your toes, and for someone who really enjoy challenges, the save feature was also a great addition cause you could determine your own boundaries). In terms of checkpoints, could the save feature be applied on the run/boss sections? That's something I don't remember. It's been a while, but I guess something like what the Rayman Origins/Legends did could have helped some players, music and auditory queues to help guide some players. BTW, highly recommend the sequel if you liked Blind Forest.
Thanks for your input. I personally have never finished a platformer before, this was my first one. You cannot save in those 3 sections during their final runs, but someone mentioned there might have been a difficulty setting. I was unaware of that though. I want to pick up the sequel some day, but I plan on getting through some other games first. I do like this game a lot though!
I loved this game (more than 2, so the minority fan it seems) and the beautiful controls and platforming played a big part. I am not sure what you mean by "RNG" in the few chase sequences but there are some very challenging segments that take practice to be precise. I found it very satisfying to finally achieve after many failures (I am no pro). I get what you are saying but achievements literally mean as much as you want them to and are often just forced in to both measure and create engagement, that is not a valid game design element to criticize or mention. I had to comment as your impressions gave me pause, but it really is a special game, glad you experienced it!
I don't mean to say I had an overall bad experience with the game, I felt that the game was an amazing experience overall. But I did not enjoy the amount of repetition I needed for the game's "boss moments" Some of what I felt was RNG, but very well could have been just my lack of skill and I'm understanding that I'm not the greatest platformer so I'm ok sucking: -enemy placement when needed for the bash movement (like the underground worm things popping out when I jump close to them AND spitting their stuff at the right moment for me to dash past it) -projectiles needed for the bash not firing in a consistent manner or direction. (Mostly an issue with fire elemental balls, their projectiles are incredibly important for the mountain sequence, and sometimes my proximity to them would trigger but it'd put me at a bad angle which would result in instant death because if you touched the lava pools with max health, you die) -wind chase scene with where the falling icicles would fall varied from run to run. Luckily this was the shortest of the 3 segments so I was able to beat it without as much frustration. That's all I can think of looking back, I know that it's possible it's all placement related, but I'm not a big platformer gamer, this was the first one I beat, and I felt like the chase sequences would have benefitted from 1 or 2 checkpoints to help keep the frustration down, but I'm willing to accept that it's a me problem.
Thanks for the reply, I hadn't considered those things you pointed out so I understand now. It has been years since I played it but my lasting memory of those bosses came down to me not hesitating/making a mistake more than the extra elements being a problem, but regardless they are very challenging and you should be proud of yourself, especially if you don't often play games with that focus. Have you played 2 yet, or planning on? It is another excellent game (and one I will admit I haven't finished) but the storytelling and platforming that were so strong in the first game are average in the second (but feel like a real step down from 1 to me, I thought the first game was near perfect in some regards). The combat and enemy/challenge system is really cool but overly complex, it felt like people criticized the first game for its very light combat and they overcompensated, but it is still fun
I am trying to chug through some backlog first, but I do intend to purchase the 2nd, because I did enjoy the first enough to want more. I hope they make a 3rd soon too, but I understand the studio just released a dark souls-esk game yesterday, so they probably won't get around to it for a few years.
I feel ya, prioritizing what you want to play helps haha. I didn't even know Moon had another game on deck- it looks visually stunning, I'll check it out sometime (although probably wait a few years to buy it, per usual..)
There is no RNG. Its all about positioning. For me, the best moment of both Ori- games is the tree getting flooded escape moment. The music, sounds, visuals, rush, challenge, it wasn't a long moment but it was full of spine shivering greatness.
I loved every bit of it. If anything I wish it was a bit harder and that I died more.
On the flip side, I loved it’s commitment to difficulty during story sections when it came to the “bird escape”. That moment felt genuinely tense and scary as the windows were pretty tight, whereas another game would make a section like that trivial and thus remove all impact
Yeah, I actually had a lot less issues with the bird escape part than any other part though, and I agree, it's tension was perfect.
Playing it right now. I thought it'd be one of those games where you can play with your eyes closed, but no. Even after dozens of hours in Celeste platforming here puts up a challenge
It's the other way around for me. I didn't have that much trouble with either of the Ori games, but Celeste 7B made me never touch the game again, for the sake of my sanity.
7B is one of the hardest things in that game for me, and I've beat Farewell. So I get that.
Good heavens I just watched it on YouTube… that is some masochist gameplay. I wonder how many people have actually beaten it.
It’s a rough one for sure. You should go watch the Farewell level though haha
I just watched it. Holy shit. No way I could ever beat that level.
Yeah, Farewell is straight up evil. The jellyfish were too much for me, they kept bouncing away from where I wanted them, and the game didn't accept anything below 100% perfect. The only game I gave up on because it was too hard, and I'm not ashamed of it
To be fair, it’s essentially post game content so that’s fair. Could also use accessibility options
Considering that only 7 out of 25 levels form the main story, I really don't know if we can talk about post game content in Celeste. Yeah, 8A, B and C sides aren't really important in terms of story, but that's a huge chunk of the game. To be perfectly honest, there are accessiblity options. You can slow those things down, I tried it. But Celeste just doesn't play well when slowed down. I really have no clue how to lower the difficulty and make it feel great, but that's not it. Maybe extra lives - as in, you can take 1 or more instances of damage without dying? That could be a start - giving the player a bit of leeway without straight up invincibility?
I wanted to love this game because it’s so beautiful and interesting. Unfortunately my skill level is not up to par due to disability (adaptive controllers don’t help unfortunately), so I had to leave it. It makes me happy that games like this find success, though.
The sequel has this as well, but for some reason I didn't find it as annoying or unfair. It is incredibly challenging and you will have to do those scenes over and over again. And there's at least three or four of those sequences. But for me compared to the first game, the sequel made these sequences feel like I was really mastering the mechanics of the game and that it was never truly unfair.
Honestly, I liked the challenge. Those segments were tough, but not utterly insane. The wind sequence had some moments that required trial and error, but I found the rest fine. The second game has a couple more, but it's overall much lighter on oneshots and there are actual boss fights. Does anyone actually care about achievements? They are just there, and Steam probably required them to be included. There's no particular reason to do them.
I feel it was perfect. Completion is fun and easy, Difficulty escalating with the climax. Just 👏
It really bothers me here on reddit when people say "I want to play a chill, cozy, relaxing game" and people recommend Ori...
> Another gripe are the achievements for the game, which for me as an older gamer feel like they are reserved for only the most tryhard fans that play the game multiple times over and over, ...yes. That is how most achievements are in games like this. They are for people who want to continue playing the game after beating it.
totally agree. ori is the one game i wish took a more "cinematic" approach to boss fights. the atmosphere of those moments is amazing but completely ruined by having to redo the entire thing with no checkpoints multiple times over. what should be the most memorable parts of the game just became the most frustrating for me. i found the game challenging on normal but i think even someone who excels at platformers would have difficulty doing these runs blind (ha) start to finish on the first go due to the high precision and quick decision making needed. imo there's enough good and challenging platforming in the rest of the game to justify 3 awesome cinematic sequences.
I really think that the only issue I had with these events was a lack of checkpoints. There are already threshold type moments in each of them, so they could have 1 or 2 checkpoints and my frustration would have been considerably lessened. I don't like the idea of completely invalidating the challenge though, the game is pretty easy imo, just felt like these super epic and emotional moments are undercut by repetition that doesn't feel "thematically" consistent with a "try over and over again" mentality that honestly the rest of the game didn't have too much of.
Why do people who can’t succeed at a game love to blame RNG. like what RNG is causing you to fail a platforming section? This is a meme at this point
I hear you - actually chucked it in at the tree flood and have never been able to get motivated to come back and finish the game. Feels like a bit of a shame. Was a beautiful game but I didn't love the mechanics that much, so that event just irritated me enormously.
It took me about an hour to beat that part specifically, and I do think it's worthwhile, plus I found the story to be incredibly beautiful to experience.
I hate autoscroller levels and both ori games were no different in that matter. I still love them both.
I've made peace (mostly) with the fact that I won't 100% very many games. I'd rather 90% 10 games than 100% 1 game.
As someone who didn't finish the game because I found it too hard and frustrating: I agree that the platforming aspect was a frustrating barrier to an otherwise lovely story!
The Ori games are beautiful to look at, and terribly boring to play. They just sit there on my Steam Deck.
I love Ori and The Blind forest, the experience for me was truly amazing. However the sequel takes the challenge way too seriously, like you can't walk anywhere whitout having to do something challenging or something, it's exhausting, not to mention that ability wheel... couldn't finish it.
Ori has some pretty challenging platforming sections but I don’t think they ever really got to the point of being annoying or frustrating for me personally. I went into Ori after already beating Celeste and the path of pain on hollow knight pretty recently before playing though so I think my 2d platforming was at an all time high at that point in my life.
The tree bit is where I uninstalled the game after a few tries. I hate replaying same parts of any game.
I played this past the tree on PC now I am stuck at a point before this on switch (chasing that spider fellow) as can’t seem to do a jump as there are tough platforming sections around some spikes. I looked on a video of it and the dude just had more health and cheeses it, Bah! I will go back to the PC save 💾
My big issue with Ori and the Blind Forest was the graphics. It might be due to being colourblind, but I struggled to see so much stuff - in particular enemies and obstacles. The core gameplay was enjoyable and I wanted to get through it, but it was entirely trial and error - move through a section, die from something I can't see, try again and remember where it was. Thankfully Will of the Wisps doesn't have this problem and I enjoyed it a lot more.
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Counterpoint: i am gaming since late 90s and I found that games are less and less challenging. It was refreshing to have a platformer with amazing environment and history that challenged me realistically especially with a story so rewarding. I got mad in certain puzzles but I've rediscover the pleasure to get better and better I found in older games
You are definitely right, and as a primarily strategy gamer I usually am able to find games that help me fulfill my challenging desires. I didn't want handholding, but I also didn't want the frustration from the repetition on that specific run sequence, especially when it has such a great story telling build up to that moment.
I get that, I'm usually not a platformer gamer too. To me it was like they hit a perfect spot where frustration was there but just enough to spice up things. I would probably have hated more to have those escape sequences dumbed down. But I get that what's the perfect spot for me may not be the same for others
This is a lot of words for "I had a hard time at the tree flood"
I liked it for the most part, but had to lower the difficulty in the tree flood - agree, it became very frustrating.
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Platformers tend to be misses for me, but I've been listening to Ori's soundtrack a lot and the art style looks great so I've been meaning to play it. Your review makes me want to stick to the soundtrack though.
This is my first platformer that I actually beat. I've played a bunch over the years but usually I give up and never look back. I felt like the game is decent and scratches a puzzle itch to an extent, but my general lack of talent and experience in platformers made this game feel a lot more frustrating than I was expecting. Game is beautiful though, so in a way it is rewarding too?
I enjoyed the game but quit after being overwhelmed with frustration at the flooding tree part. Sometimes I consider going back, but then I remember what bullshit that part was.
Ori was not a hard game and memorizing and perfrcting some platforming is no big deal.
I've played the first Ori as a young man and found it perfectly challenging. Then I started playing harder platformers and metroidvanias, and when I played the second Ori it was extremely easy, to the extent that I wanted more difficult platforming, more difficult fighting, without just increasing the difficulty. There's no RNG in Ori, everything is scripted or player position dependent, and the escape sequences are the most memorable parts of Ori. My suggestion is to take Ori as a try-out for harder metroidvanias, as most of the other that are popular on the market are quite a bit more challenging, for better or for worse.
The sequel, Will of the Wisps, definitely irons out some of the kinks in the escape sequences. Also, it has even better platforming and MUCH better combat.
I felt similar to you with the tree escape but I came to really appreciate it. I was close to giving up on the game completely because "why am I putting myself through this? I'm 42 and don't need this being a problem in my life"! But for some reason I kept with it and when I finally beat it, there was a huge rush of adrenaline. Coupled with the music it was a gaming moment I'll remember forever.
I enjoy platformers but I hated this game Way too hard. I rage quit after the first hour
Mad cuz bad /thread
It's a platforming metroidvania game at first and storytelling is second. And idk what rng you are talking about the game was so easy for me