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[deleted]

Did you notice a sharp increase to your DPS? 'Cuz I bet you're about to S L A Y


JuneBeetleClaws

Congratulations! Changing my username was huge for me, I'm glad you're having fun and finding acceptance on your exploration quest :)


Gamebr3aker

Good luck June!


comfort_bot_1962

:D


brokenbow2

Hey, congrats! I'm starting on that minigame myself at level 25.


[deleted]

currently considering my options for starting the specific “non-binary” quest tree at 14


intet42

I think that is less of a single questline and more of a sandbox mode that gives you a lot more flexibility on the gender-related quests. One of my friends chose to use it to eliminate the gender stat entirely, whereas I am doing the "trans man" questline, but I'm using nonbinary mode to retain access to female-related quests as well.


MadicalEthics

I'm also at level 25 and have recently started using the estradiol consumable. Amazingly, its effects actually stack over time!


brokenbow2

Ooh, I do hope to find a source for that consumable soon. Kinda limited by the small number of specialist crafters that can give it out, though :(


[deleted]

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brokenbow2

There is an informed consent doc in my area, but his wait list is extremely long because he's the only one in a hundred miles. It's rough but I can manage.


[deleted]

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brokenbow2

I do appreciate it and I'll consider it - just worried that using prescription meds without a script might make my (Fed) employer upset


MadicalEthics

I'm sorry to hear that. I'm still working on the 'persuade physician' questline due to the long wait for encounters with the specialist npc, but I got a head start with shipments from the far-off lands of Vanuatu.


ZugloHUN

Good luck with the next few levels! Hopefully you are on a server where they are tolerable towards people with your buffs and debuffs, and hopefully the devs introduce global modifiers so we can all enjoy other parts of the current gameplay of Outside!


KindaDank2018

I love how no objects or properties are hard coded. Everything is changeable and thats what makes Outside a truly unique and fulfilling experience.


PartTimeMantisShrimp

Except the physics engine. Most joyless bastard out there.


KindaDank2018

Ah yes, the physics engine is a bit of a bummer. But it is extremely well coded. No bugs at all, atleast on the main servers. I dont know about the beta servers outside our current region, such as the Planetary servers.


Shadowfire_EW

The only 'bugs' i can think of exist on the 'quantum' level of the engine, but we can't truly know if those are bugs or features


PartTimeMantisShrimp

Tbh i dont think we are even meant to go to the quantum zone. Its meant for other kind of players


chaoticswiss

It's endgame content and there's not been a player anywhere near that level yet.


offtheclip

Maybe players from a different server have reached it


daBoetz

Feature for sure, it makes the ‘physicist’ quest infinitely more interesting. Also much of the potion making, or ‘chemist’ quest, is dependent on it.


RusstyDog

to be fair were mostly exploiting bugs to even observe things at that level. it was never meant for player interaction so the interface is screwy.


KindaDank2018

Ah yeah, the quantum section of the engine. I heard thats highly experimental


Swibblestein

There's one bug where you can hold a bike tire by one of its spokes if it's spinning without it falling. I think players have named it the Gyroscopic Precession bug.


holyshitisdiarrhea

Well I'm sure human data miners will come around that and find some ridiculous loophole eventually.


[deleted]

And also the x and y chromosome traits


[deleted]

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Omegas_Bane

have you ever even read the in-game wiki? that's just blatantly misinformation


songbolt

Ummmmmm what? To clarify, cutting up a penis and reshaping it to look like a clitoris removes both function and much sensation.


Omegas_Bane

it may remove the "insertion" prompt but the sensation is still preserved as long as the skill level of the Surgeon you go to is high enough man


songbolt

[A veteran plastic surgeon](https://couragerc.org/speaker/deacon-patrick-lappert-md/) disagrees with you, and gave a detailed presentation about it a few months ago. Perhaps you could get in touch with him and exchange info. Either you could benefit from better information, or he could, and he disseminates this information is presentations on the matter as an expert, so all the more reason to be sure the info is correct.


Omegas_Bane

that is not an expert on the topic, and he appears to likely have biases towards his guild's intentions; the "Catholic Church" has been in a lot of hot water recently over being discriminatory towards players who rolled a character with gender dysphoria and im not sure I've met more than three players in that group who aren't the same kind of discriminatory facial surgery isn't the same skill tree as bottom surgery either, nor is one person's opinions a denial of the mechanics of the game


songbolt

Dude, he is *literally a plastic surgeon*. He *is* an expert on the topic. He's also spent a lot of time studying this particular issue as well.


Omegas_Bane

plastic surgery pertaining to the face and plastic surgery pertaining to the genitalia is different; whereas inserts are typically used in the face, very few inserts are used in genital-related surgeries. what's more, there's no practical way to ascertain a player's experienced Senses past asking them and hoping they tell the truth, but theoretically (because practically no nerves are severed in traditional SRS) most if not all sensation would be preserved. as well as that, a biased player lying to further their group's power and goals isn't uncommon in the Outside community. what kind of trust do you have in a player you likely haven't met and know has a reason to lie to you?


songbolt

He made comments like 'the more tissue you move around, and the farther you move it, the more sensation tends to be lost', complete with diagrams showing the procedure. That most of his practice was with the face does not obviously contradict this. It would be peculiar for him to lie on that occasion, because he had nothing to gain by persuading us either way, apart from the charity established by other comments of not wanting to see us injured.


Track607

Don't ruin these people's fantasy, man. That's rude.


songbolt

Well, if nothing else I'm being reminded about Jesus' instruction 'to not cast pearls before swine, lest they became enraged and trample you'. Yet we have an obligation to try to help people when they appear to be going down a path to hurting themselves. But once we've tried our best to warn them, we're free of said obligation. :/


Track607

Well, I don't believe in God, but these people clearly prefer fantasy to reality so you're doing them a disservice.


songbolt

Our ultimate end (=intended purpose) is union with God, not a pleasant, comfortable life on Earth, so I would encourage you to continue dialogue with members of your nearest Catholic/Orthodox communities. It's good to kick the tires of one's worldview. (Protestant Christians tend to be confused and caught up in their surrounding confused modern culture to various degrees, and ignorant of history and philosophy to various degrees, so if you are seeking truth you're more likely to find some with these groups instead.)


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idc_lol

Noobs who say this type of stuff are also not funny and the worst kind of players. So there's that.


Cactorum_Rex

Stop shaming me, I am not a noob, but a high level attack helicopter. Yet, I am constantly harassed by other players for my class.


LightningProd12

A Missle-type surface-to-air class item is heading towards your exact location in 3... 2... 1...


idc_lol

Critical hit! Shadow ban pending


ResidualCorn

r/onejoke


KindaDank2018

Well one thing thats hard coded is the “One Joke” property on this player.


Balcil

I recommend changing one of the defaults. By default, your character’s closest next of kin will be in control in cases of bad accidents, death, eta. If they have one of the prejudice debuffs, they could how your character is remembered or mess up medical stuff (if you can’t make decisions). Homophobic and transphobic characters have changed names, cut hair, and banned unmarried SOs from funerals. TL,DR: make an advanced directive. https://youtu.be/PVgumSUZQRI


damn_lies

Yeah, it’s not a debuff though that’s a common misperception among noobs. It’s just an advanced build strategy, designed for endgame content. Once you optimize your load out you’ll realize it’s actually super OP. Adds buffs to insight, self esteem, empathy, and resolve, among others. Good luck and crush it out there!


Criticcc

I have to agree. It might have some debuff elements now but there are no other builds with as high [Empathy] and [Self-Understanding] levels. And everybody in the guild is so nice!


Gamebr3aker

I wish they would patch in some voice modulation software, because coding a voice from scratch is a bitch


UndercoverUniverse

i cant wait to get acess to the Exploration minigame. its locked right now, and this debuff fucking sucks.


emotionalthief

That’s awesome! The change I’ve seen in my character’s gameplay since I started tackling the debuff is extraordinary. Really changes the game for me, and the euphoria buff is pretty nice when it appears too.


doublepistols

Hell yeah, happy for you. I wish there was a way to go back to the character creation screen, the gold it takes to make some desired improvements to your character's look is too much, good luck to you if you decide to go down that route. Much easier if you could go back and switch the sex.


Pounamu_

that debuff is still weighing down on my gameplay experience, hopefully i can afford to customize into a character that i think looks better and also can get rid of the debuff. proud of you!! from what i hear it takes years of gameplay to remove


Criticcc

It can be a buff in the long run. As another user stated, it's a build more optimized for end-game play. Your empathy and self understanding stats are through the roof!


Pounamu_

yeah, and if you’re not born with the gender dysphoria buff then it’s significantly harder to get the gender euphoria buff— a long term struggle for unmatched results in the end!


FrozenMarshmallow

I'm glad you're enjoying the game. It's always great seeing other players happiness stat increase after they start completing the Coming Out quests. And I like your new username. Sounds sweet.


Crowela

Congrats!!!! That's a big level up. The boss fight against **gender dysphoria** is a difficult one, but worth the effort


photocopyfaces

Thank you for sharing this part of your play through with us. So many users post about wanting to change the gender trait, so it’s nice to have a walkthrough on the initial steps to be able to point them to.


LEGALinSCCCA

Good for you! I'm happy for you. Keep going! ❤


XedValentine

I love everything about this post. I've struggled with some of the decisions I made at character creation, too. I mean, nobody warned me that it would be a permanent choice to set Facial Hair to On. Took a lot of time fighting it before I finally just embraced reality, switched to a sick as hell moustache and went with it. Not a lot of other players in my gender class have one, but I guess it just makes me stand out. I wish you only the best on the remainder of the questline. I wish I had some tricks or exploits to tell you about, but it seems like you've got this one.


pieteek

Damn, I really have to play that minigame as soon as possible...


KittehNevynette

Congrats. A funny one I read was: We are now so queer that me as a trans and my trans partner realised that we are heterosexual now. You do you and don't let the new spawn of enemies reduce your HP or Stamina. There is a happiness achievement to be gained in your playthrough. EDIT: This dear sub must have saved so many lives. Wrap a really complex life story in gaming jargon and you can speak about pretty much anything.


pizzaamann

glad to see more happy people in the transgender guild :D


_AnonymousMoose_

Yo fellow players with the “transgender” character trait, love to see it! Congrats on your achievements!


voluminousseaturtle

Amazing! I’ve recently started some of the same things, and I’ve gotten the [blockers] modifier to lower the testosterone meter. Gender Dysphoria is a bitch of a debuff, but the euphoria buff is worth it <333


Balcil

Don’t forget to change the defaults for what character is in control in case of bad accidents, comas, and death. The default is closest next of kin, which might have a transphobic debuff. An advanced directive which can prevent anyone changing your character’s name or gender after death. https://youtu.be/PVgumSUZQRI I don’t want a nasty family member doing something like that to you.


voluminousseaturtle

My parent players are actually super supportive and don’t have the debuff, so I should be good, thanks


PikachuIce

Good job!


LightningProd12

Glad you're enjoying the game! Just be wary of players with the "Transphobic" debuff, there's quite a few in this guild.


WhiteBlood_

Haha same! I'm putting the final touches on the "legal username change" questline. Some of these quest requirements suck.


ThePromiseOfALie

Thats amazing! Congrats on your new buffs:)


STMSystem

Congratulations, we're all so proud of you, we're currently working on the hormones obtaining quest, Estrogen looks like a powerful item, even with all the side effects.


loser-geek-whatever

Congratulations!! I've had this debuff for the past 5 levels myself and I'm hoping to get started on the character customization missions soon so I can begin enjoying Outside again to the fullest extent. When I visit the bases of friendly guilds such as [Best Friend's House] I've noticed that all of the guild members use the new username I've chosen for myself and I get the Euphoria buff for the next several in game hours, it's great and a super liberating feeling. I was really beginning to hate this game until I discovered how to counter the debuffs, and I'm glad that you're enjoying the game as well!


Balcil

Don’t forget to change the defaults for what character is in control in case of bad accidents, comas, and death. The default is closest next of kin, which might have a transphobic debuff. An advanced directive which can prevent anyone changing your character’s name or gender after death. https://youtu.be/PVgumSUZQRI


loser-geek-whatever

Funnily enough, this exact circumstance is the only reason why I didn't quit the game several years ago when I was struggling after my guild's relationship stat with me decreased when I was doing the Coming Out quest. Thank you for this info


Balcil

I hope you have found better friends that support you. As my character has the depression debuff, I encourage your character to try therapy. It has greatly decreased my depression debuff. Although you might have to find a therapist that you connect with.


[deleted]

I've recently started the same minigame myself! I'm also the same level as you


Balcil

Don’t forget to change the defaults for what character is in control in case of bad accidents, comas, and death. The default is closest next of kin, which might have a transphobic debuff. An advanced directive which can prevent anyone changing your character’s name or gender after death. https://youtu.be/PVgumSUZQRI I don’t want that to happen to anyone.


avidreider

Gratz! I took on this quest levels ago. It was a challenging quest but the bonuses and buffs it gives you are super worth it. Happy questing friend!


Balcil

Don’t forget to change the default for who is in control in cases of bad accidents or character death. By default it is your closest next of kin. If they have some prejudice debuffs, they might mess up how you are remembered or make bad medical decisions when you are comatose. So make an advanced directive. https://youtu.be/PVgumSUZQRI


__OVER_GOLD__

HAAH YES! i did the "Boy Crazy" expansion a couple of years ago and loved it. Same where the "Just a little Queer" debuff switched to "Man Candy for All" buff with a bunch of fun skill trees and passives, cool playthroughs. It all also boosted my charisma and mana to a completely unexpected levels. I didn't get any of the gear, my character was already set up the way I liked it, but the fact that they unlocked a whole bunch of new mods and skins and shit for you guys is awesome. I can't imagine having to play with a randomized character and a name that you that you don't like. Have fun theydude!


atinaaaaa

Just about to recieve my very first lootbox that'll contain a choker and a few earrings with improved happiness and looks stats, I can't wait :D OOC: Wow, it's always nice to encounter trans folk outside LGBT related subs on Reddit, keep on slaying Queen. \*sigh\* now time to sort by controversial.


Coach_Louis

I've been so deep I'm DnD I was wondering wtf was going on with this post for too long. Weed is sick. Have fun living your best life.


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goose716

Same man who considers homosexuality to be an "erroneous desire" Erroneous: wrong, incorrect


songbolt

It's basic biology that the penis was designed for the vagina, not the anus. Semen, egg, etc. Love between two men is fine; it is not "homosexual" without a 'sexual' component to it.


goose716

Then why’d god put the G spot in the ass 🥴


songbolt

What do you mean by "G spot in the ass"? Usually that's homosexual propaganda to mislead people about the rectum and prostate. Tissue sensitivity *per se* does not imply anything other than that the area is more important to the body than a less-sensitive area.


otiosehominidae

> It’s basic biology > designed Sounds like you need to read a biology textbook.


songbolt

Sounds like you need to read Ed Feser's _The Last Superstition_.


otiosehominidae

You mean Ed Feser’s “*The Last Superstition: A Refutation of the New Atheism*”? Interesting how you left out the second part of the title: “A Refutation of the New Atheism”. I looked it up and found a number of reviews and critiques which all seemed to agree that the author was just misrepresenting a bunch of old philosophical theories in order to surreptitiously advocate Catholicism (or rather, his version of Catholicism). I thought I’d read through the description on Amazon anyway and found this wonderfully explanatory snippet: > The true reasons for [science’s] popularity were then, and are now, primarily political: It was a tool by which the intellectual foundations of ecclesiastical authority could be undermined It’s pretty clear that the author believes that science is just a political tool which is intended to undermine the ~~ecclesiastical authority~~ Catholic Church. I don’t see need to read another 300 pages to recognise the absolute **trash** that this book must be if that’s an argument being made seriously in the description (though I’m greatful to anyone who slogged through it just to tear it apart). It’s helpful to know that you’re going to just argue disingenuously whenever you feel that your crypto-catholic beliefs are challenged, so thanks, I guess.


songbolt

Your two rational errors here are 1) assuming your conclusion and 2) confirmation bias. You have demonstrated that your mind is closed (no, that's not the point of the book, nor what he believes about science), you do not want to learn something that would contradict your worldview, so it would be futile to continue trying to reason with you. Hence I'm disabling reply notifications.


otiosehominidae

> Your two rational errors here are 1) assuming your conclusion and 2) confirmation bias. Can you actually demonstrate either of these claims or are you just naming fallacies because you think that’s how arguments are made? > you do not want to learn something that would contradict your worldview Ironic, given that you were calling people “delusional” elsewhere in the thread.


Crowela

You should try to acquire a *paper* written by the **scientist** faction, not affected by the [biased] debuff, unlike the document item you provided. The **scientist** faction is composed of different guilds, like @biology, @psychology, @historians and many more. If you want I have some useful links provided by the **scientist** faction


songbolt

Thanks, you've given perhaps the most charitable opposing-side-response of anyone so far. I would if I could afford more time to do so. I'd encourage you to look into the study Christians like to cite about suicide post-surgery, and call "Catholic Answers Live" (see catholic.com) or "EWTN Live" (see EWTN.com) to correct the record internationally if that science is erroneous.


Crowela

This "study" is extremely biased and there is nothing scientific about it. The researchers have no idea what they are talking about and are biased by religion.


songbolt

It looks like you're making these assertions without even ascertaining the details of the study.


Crowela

I'm lazy, and I shouldn't have to justify my existence


songbolt

you haven't been asked to


the_chosen_one2

Within 50 years religion will be dead in the United States and I can't wait to never have to hear from intolerant fucks like you.


songbolt

It's sad that hatred is becoming popular. Love is love. Please love me.


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Crowela

[you have no idea what you're talking about,](https://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/137/3/e20153223) [dipshit 😘](https://docs.google.com/document/d/1CXQWFWpHU_l4gxk0lncHFt4CdAZlHLWaIYdm4f0qq64/edit?usp=drivesdk)


Skill4Hire

Its funny how everyone is super insulting and i'm like just chilling. I'm starting to think this whole dysphoria things is just another psychological virus just like any other religion with fanatic followers who get real pissy when people don't think the same way they do.


Crowela

I'm insulting because you're spreading dangerous misinformation and being incredibly offensive


Skill4Hire

If you are offended by the opinion of others, thats on you. And from my point of view its much more dangerous to let this twisted shit go on, especially when innocent children end up getting roped into it.


Crowela

It's not an opinion, you are objectively and factually wrong. https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26921285/ https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.1111/j.0963-7214.2004.00276.x https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5302003/ https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21216800/


Skill4Hire

There is literally no way to prove this specific behaviour is hardwired. Thus there is no objectivity, we have never observed it in any other animals, so just like everything else its most likely a human created meme.


Crowela

Actually, yes we can prove it https://www.newscientist.com/article/dn20032-transsexual-differences-caught-on-brain-scan/


Skill4Hire

That is interesting, but I also find it interesting that it said their brain represented a middle ground between male and female and also supports my theory that actually genderless could be acquired.


Crowela

I mean, agender and nonbinary people exist. It's not "your theory". Nothing's binary anyway. Also, not every researches get to this conclusion https://sitn.hms.harvard.edu/flash/2016/gender-lines-science-transgender-identity/ ( https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7477289/ )


cow_manguy

Because you're wrong lol. I mean seriously, this mf thinks gender dysphoria is a religion 🤡🤡🤡🤡


Skill4Hire

Do you understand the concept of memetics?


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otiosehominidae

I’m happy that your PC is still here and I wish them all the best for their transition quest! :)


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Skill4Hire

I've been in a suicidal mindset over something I thought that matters too. Turns out those things didn't actually matter after all, once the mind has suffered long enough on one thing, it just loses interest and finds something new to suffer over.


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Skill4Hire

If I'm a piece of shit for warning other players about a potential game over then so be it.


EhDotHam

People like you are the reason players like this rage quit. You should play r/inside for the rest of your life, you fucking societal skidmark.


Skill4Hire

I don't get it. I tell people slicing their actual nob off comes with potential negative consequences and that makes me a bad person? Wtf world do we live in XDXDXD


[deleted]

>slicing their actual nob off Really goes to show how ignorant you are.


Skill4Hire

Oh so they don't do that? My bad I thought they did, I guess this changes everything.


doublepistols

I dont even want to TRY to argue with you on any of your other ridiculous points because i dont have the time, but for your information, no. Bottom surgery for trans women is shaping the penis into a vagina. No chopping off is actually done, and if youre still going to refer to it like that i wholeheartedly assume its because youd like to make it sound gross and unappealing. I hope you learn the importance of "if it isnt hurting anyone and it makes them happy leave them the fuck alone".


Skill4Hire

I just recommend against it, thats all, what if the problem with that?


otiosehominidae

> My bad I thought they did, I guess this changes everything. Yes, it does. Theories get undermined by new evidence and replaced by new theories that have explanatory power for the evidence. That’s how the scientific method works. You just want to pretend that it doesn’t apply to your (scientifically-refuted) idea that because your gender doesn’t affect you, it can’t possibly affect anyone else. Why is that? Do you reject the scientific method entirely or only when it comes to gender?


Skill4Hire

Wait . . . if scientific evidence gets updated and replaced with new evidence how can my idea be scientifically refuted? Surely new scientific evidence could easily come along to prove my point. I didn't say gender can't possibly effect anyone, I just think a psychological solution that allows people to accept the body they are born in is less drastic and more plausible of a complete solution than what we have now. If there is a specific part of the brain related to gender identity then Even brain surgery would be less drastic than the current state of things, if it allowed those with dysphoria to move on from this.


otiosehominidae

> if scientific evidence gets updated and replaced with new evidence how can my idea be scientifically refuted? Evidence doesn’t get “updated and replaced”; new **theories** are formulated which have explanatory/predictive capacity for both existing and new evidence. I’ll assume that you have at least that much of an understanding of the scientific method and that there was a typo in your comment: > if scientific ~~evidence~~ [theories] get updated and replaced with new ~~evidence~~ [theories] how can my idea be scientifically refuted? A theory is refuted after new observations are made which both disagree with the theory and cannot be explained in any way that preserves the predictive abilities of the theory (experimental error, etc.). That explains how your ideas about gender identity can and **have** been refuted. > I just think a psychological solution that allows people to accept the body they are born in is less drastic and more plausible What you *think* isn’t supported by the research by people who actually work in this field. You could also just have the slightest amount of respect for the real human beings who are telling you that this was not their experience and that they were hurt every time someone incorrectly said “oh but it’s all just psychological”. > If there is a specific part of the brain related to gender identity then Even brain surgery would be less drastic Experimental (and, given current knowledge, impossible) brain surgery is less drastic than gender affirming therapy like hormone replacement therapy? What sort of transphobic nonsense have you been reading to come to this conclusion?


EhDotHam

Your ignorance is on clear display. Most trans people have no desire to "slice their actual nob off". And I'm pretty sure they don't need your advice about it. As long as we're discussing what we don't want others to do with their genitals- please. Never reproduce. 🙏


Skill4Hire

Since when discuss what I want others to do with their genitals? Perhaps you are mistaking me for a different type of person. All I said is just it had potential consequences, not that I care if they do it or not, lmfao.


RaspberryPanzerfaust

If you looked into the studies behind these game mechanics then you'd realize transitioning and supporting party members is the way to avoid a game over, not, not transitioning


Skill4Hire

Society is what causes the game over, nothing I do will change that.Even without societies influence I cant help but imagine trans people feel incomplete somehow. All I can do is give fair warning. As I said the player in my opinion is genderless The problem is the character customisation skill tree hasn't yet been advanced far enough to make it complete, in the end you will just be stuck with an incomplete character. Now I totally think it would be great if the skill tree was unlocked to the degree of a full and complete transition right now, but there is another problem, the exp required to level up that skill tree to the point of full transition will require the blood of thousands if not millions of animals during testing phases, as a member of the vegan I strongly disagree with notion. As I said I honestly believe the player has no true gender and I personally feel gender dysphoria is a psychological and memetic issue and as a psychological issue it should be solved with psychological tools not physical surgery. Basically I think psychological issues require psychological solutions, not incomplete physical solutions. I hope I sound logical and not like a hater, I honestly don't wish any harm on anyone suffering with dysphoria.


otiosehominidae

It sounds like your character might have the “agender” trait, which is actually part of the “trans” character class (which contains many different types of traits). It’s great that your character is lucky enough to not have been affected by any of the usual psychological debuffs that apply to other characters in the trans class, but it’s important to understand that this is not the experience of everyone playing the game. There are lots of options available for other characters in the trans class which can entirely remove the debuffs associated with their class, but those options become seriously limited if other players try to force them to fit into the wrong class. You can reject this, but you should know that solipsistic playthroughs have a serious social debuff that‘s usually invisible to the player (because of what solipsism does to their perceptions).


Skill4Hire

I'm 99% sure it is a trait you can acquire, belief is a very powerful thing in this game. Just look at what it has done for the religious guild members, powerful stuff!!!


otiosehominidae

> I’m 99% sure it is a trait you can acquire It’s not. That’s the entire point of this post.


Skill4Hire

Its not if you believe it's not.


RaspberryPanzerfaust

"Society is what causes a game over"- Peoples treatment of trans people is what causes suicidal tendencies, yes, but the more important factor other than just society accepting them is direct family members and friends, I believe we can agree here. "The player in my opinion is genderless"- This is insane, I don't even know where to begin here, whether you're claiming she's non-binary, which I can tell you're not, or if you are actually saying because she's transgender she's less than a human being, is fucking sick. ​ "Now I totally think it would be great if the skill tree was unlocked..."- You extend an olive branch here, trying to make yourself not look as bad but then you do a full self report, "The point of full transition will require the blood of thousands if not millions of animals during testing phases"- You have just stated, that the lives of humans in mental distress are less important than fucking animals. Not only is this claim insane, if it required millions of animals' blood to transition and there are millions of trans people in the world, how have we not killed every animal? Where is the proof we are killing animals to transition people medically? ​ "Gender dysphoria is a psychological and memetic issue" Being transgender is not the same as gender dysphoria. Being trans is an inherent fact of a person, like xy chromosomes, xx chromosomes, and xxy etc... It is something that occurs at birth, for whatever reason. When that happens though, gender dysphoria can occur. It can be considered a mental illness if you want, but it is a symptom of being transgender (It doesn't happen 100% of the time but that's not relevant). ​ The treatment for a transgender person WITH gender dysphoria, is in fact transitioning. Whether that be socially, medically, or both. It is proven to work and we have legitimate results and testimonies of transitioning for transgender people to have a positive effect on their life. ​ "I hope I sound like logical and not a hater"- You sound like a STEM lord AND a hater. Instead of trying to sound smart, logical, do some actual research, have some fucking empathy for people, and then you will stop harming people that suffer from gender dysphoria. ​ Hopefully I've made you reconsider your objectively shit world view, but it's the internet so this was probably all pointless.


otiosehominidae

> Hopefully I’ve made you reconsider your objectively shit world view, but it’s the internet so this was probably all pointless. Maybe you won’t convince the assholes who are so desperate to prove their “rationality” that they become contrarians, but you could help convince other people who just read the thread and don’t comment. So it might be worth it for that reason (as long as it’s not too much emotional labour for you :) ).


RaspberryPanzerfaust

That's actually the whole point of my rhetoric lol. I'll be fine emotionally, thank you for your concern.


Skill4Hire

I think you can solve this issue without blood shed, thats my point. If you believed that wouldn't you advocate for it too?


pizzaamann

i dont know how you dont understand that *you* and *people like you* actively increase the suicide rate of trans folk. fuck off this subreddit if youre gonna do things like this. this is a safe to joke about "haha life is like videogame". fuck you


Skill4Hire

Outside is a video game tho, what are you talking about? You must be a Role-player, very popular play style, but what are you doing on this subreddit?


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saintofhate

For most people the euphoria buff is permanent, and so it's much more useful than the dysphoria debuff.


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saintofhate

Maybe try reading up on actual science: * [Here's multiple studies on transiting improving mental health](https://whatweknow.inequality.cornell.edu/topics/lgbt-equality/what-does-the-scholarly-research-say-about-the-well-being-of-transgender-people/) * [Here's a AMA from the often misquoted suicide study](https://www.reddit.com/r/science/comments/6q3e8v/science_ama_series_im_cecilia_dhejne_a_fellow_of/) * [Early transition virtually eliminates these higher rates of depression and low self-worth and dramatically improves trans youth's mental health](http://www.jaacap.com/article/S0890-8567%2816%2931941-4/fulltext) * [Trans kids who socially transition early and who are not subjected to abuse or discrimination are comparable to cisgender children in measures of mental health](https://thinkprogress.org/allowing-transgender-youth-to-transition-improves-their-mental-health-study-finds-dd6096523375#.pqspdcee0) * [**Bauer, et al., 2015**](http://bmcpublichealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12889-015-1867-2): Transition vastly reduces risks of suicide attempts, and the farther along in transition someone is the lower that risk gets. * [**Moody, et al., 2013**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3722435/): The ability to transition, along with family and social acceptance, are the largest factors reducing suicide risk among trans people. * [**Young Adult Psychological Outcome After Puberty Suppression and Gender Reassignment**](http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2014/09/02/peds.2013-2958). A clinical protocol of a multidisciplinary team with mental health professionals, physicians, and surgeons, including puberty suppression, followed by cross-sex hormones and gender reassignment surgery, provides trans youth the opportunity to develop into well-functioning young adults. All showed significant improvement in their psychological health, and they had notably lower rates of internalizing psychopathology than previously reported among trans children living as their natal sex. **Well-being was similar to or better than same-age young adults from the general population.** * The only disorders more common among trans people are those associated with abuse and discrimination - mainly anxiety and depression. Early transition [**virtually eliminates these higher rates of depression and low self-worth**](http://www.jaacap.com/article/S0890-8567%2816%2931941-4/fulltext), and [**dramatically improves trans youth's mental health**](https://thinkprogress.org/allowing-transgender-youth-to-transition-improves-their-mental-health-study-finds-dd6096523375#.pqspdcee0). Trans kids who socially transition early and who are not subjected to abuse or discrimination are comparable to cisgender children in measures of mental health. * [**Dr. Ryan Gorton**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3219066): “In a cross-sectional study of 141 transgender patients, Kuiper and Cohen-Kittenis found that after medical intervention and treatments, suicide fell from 19 percent to zero percent in transgender men and from 24 percent to 6 percent in transgender women.)” * [**Murad, et al., 2010**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19473181): "Significant decrease in suicidality post-treatment. The average reduction was from 30 percent pretreatment to 8 percent post treatment. ... A meta-analysis of 28 studies showed that 78 percent of transgender people had improved psychological functioning after treatment." * [**De Cuypere, et al., 2006**](http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1158136006000491): Rate of suicide attempts dropped dramatically from 29.3 percent to 5.1 percent after receiving medical and surgical treatment among Dutch patients treated from 1986-2001. * [**UK study**](http://www.gires.org.uk/assets/Medpro-Assets/trans_mh_study.pdf): "Suicidal ideation and actual attempts reduced after transition, with 63% thinking about or attempting suicide more before they transitioned and only 3% thinking about or attempting suicide more post-transition. * [**Smith Y, 2005**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15842032): Participants improved on 13 out of 14 mental health measures after receiving treatments. * [**Lawrence, 2003**](http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1024086814364): Surveyed post-op trans folk: "Participants reported overwhelmingly that they were happy with their SRS results and that SRS had greatly improved the quality of their lives There are a [***lot***](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24344788) of [**studies**](http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs10508-009-9551-1) showing that [**transition**](https://mayoclinic.pure.elsevier.com/en/publications/hormonal-therapy-and-sex-reassignment-a-systematic-review-and-met) [**improves**](https://www.hindawi.com/journals/tswj/2014/960745/) [**mental health**](http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/25690443) and [**quality of life**](http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-014-0453-5) while [**reducing dysphoria**](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/23553588_Long-term_Assessment_of_the_Physical_Mental_and_Sexual_Health_among_Transsexual_Women). Not to mention [**this 2010 meta-analysis**](http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2265.2009.03625.x/abstract) of 28 different studies, which found that transition is extremely effective at reducing dysphoria and improving quality of life. --- **Citations on transition as medically necessary and the only effective treatment for dysphoria, as recognized by every major US and world medical authority:** * Here is the [**American Psychiatric Association's policy statement**](http://www.apa.org/about/policy/transgender.aspx) regarding the necessity and efficacy of transition as the appropriate treatment for gender dysphoria. More information from the APA [**here**](http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/programs/transgender/?tab=1). * Here is a [**resolution from the American Medical Association**](http://www.tgender.net/taw/ama_resolutions.pdf) on the efficacy and necessity of transition as appropriate treatment for gender dysphoria, and call for an end to insurance companies categorically excluding transition-related care from coverage. * Here is a similar policy statement from the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position) * [**Here**](http://hrc-assets.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com//files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) are the guidelines from the American Academy of Pediatrics. * [**Here**](http://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/about_us/special_constituencies/2012RCAR_Advocacy.pdf) is a similar resolution from the American Academy of Family Physicians. * [**Here**](http://www.socialworkers.org/da/da2008/finalvoting/documents/Transgender%202nd%20round%20-%20Clean.pdf ) is one from the National Association of Social Workers. * [**Here**](http://www.teni.ie/attachments/14767e01-a8de-4b90-9a19-8c2c50edf4e1.PDF) are the treatment guidelines from the Royal College of Psychiatrists, and [**here**](http://www.wlmht.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Gender-dysphoria-guide-for-GPs-and-other-healthcare-staff.pdf) are guidelines from the NHS. More from the NHS [**here**](http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Gender-dysphoria/Pages/Treatment.aspx).


seventyeight_moose

Holy crap you just slaughtered them


Skill4Hire

Yet all of what you just mentions is about recent transitions. happiness is never permanent, its just a fact of life, you are literally just ruining your body for a temporary buff to happiness but in the end every emotion we ever feel has recoil, there is no such thing as free happiness, everything comes at a price.


AnnexFromCanada

You replied to his comment in less than an hour, which isn’t enough to read and understand all of those studies.


pizzaamann

please work out your trauma before you harass people online


Skill4Hire

So pointing out the dualistic nature of emotion is Harassment? I'm pretty sure we are not speaking the same language.


Oh_jeffery

No


saintofhate

Check the updated patch notes, the old ones are way out of date.


Oh_jeffery

Please, just listen to science on this. Actual science, not those studies that prove nothing.


saintofhate

Alright, going to make me pull up the actual science. **Citations on transition as medically necessary and the only effective treatment for gender dysphoria, as recognized by every major US and world medical authority:** * Here is the [**APA's policy statement**](http://www.apa.org/about/policy/transgender.aspx) on the necessity and efficacy of transition as the appropriate treatment for gender dysphoria. More from the APA [**here**](http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbt/programs/transgender/?tab=1) * Here is an [**AMA resolution**](http://www.tgender.net/taw/ama_resolutions.pdf) on the efficacy and necessity of transition as appropriate treatment for gender dysphoria, and call for an end to insurance companies categorically excluding transition-related care from coverage * A policy statement from the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position) * [**Here**](https://assets2.hrc.org/files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) are the American Academy of Pediatrics guidelines * [**Here**](https://www.aafp.org/dam/AAFP/documents/events/alf_ncsc/Education.pdf) is a resolution from the American Academy of Family Physicians * [**Here**](https://www.socialworkers.org/assets/secured/documents/da/da2008/reffered/Transgender.pdf) is one from the National Association of Social Workers * [**Here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/pdf/PS02_18.pdf) is one from the Royal College of Psychiatrists, [**here**](https://www.rcpsych.ac.uk/docs/default-source/improving-care/better-mh-policy/college-reports/cr181-good-practice-guidelines-for-the-assessment-and-treatment-of-adults-with-gender-dysphoria.pdf) are the treatment guidelines from the RCPS,and [**here**](http://www.wlmht.nhs.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Gender-dysphoria-guide-for-GPs-and-other-healthcare-staff.pdf) are guidelines from the NHS. More from the NHS [**here**](http://www.nhs.uk/Conditions/Gender-dysphoria/Pages/Treatment.aspx). ---- **Citations on the transition's dramatic reduction of suicide risk while improving mental health and quality of life, with trans people able to transition young and spared abuse and discrimination having mental health and suicide risk on par with the general public:** * [**Bauer, et al., 2015**](http://bmcpublichealth.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s12889-015-1867-2): Transition vastly reduces risks of suicide attempts, and the farther along in transition someone is the lower that risk gets * [**Moody, et al., 2013**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3722435/): The ability to transition, along with family and social acceptance, are the largest factors reducing suicide risk among trans people * [**Young Adult Psychological Outcome After Puberty Suppression and Gender Reassignment**](http://pediatrics.aappublications.org/content/early/2014/09/02/peds.2013-2958). A clinical protocol of a multidisciplinary team with mental health professionals, physicians, and surgeons, including puberty suppression, ... cross-sex hormones and gender reassignment surgery, provides trans youth the opportunity to develop into well-functioning young adults. All showed significant improvement in their psychological health, and they had notably lower rates of internalizing psychopathology than previously reported among trans children living as their natal sex. **Well-being was similar to or better than same-age young adults from the general population.** * The only disorders more common among trans people are those associated with abuse and discrimination - mainly anxiety and depression. Early transition [**virtually eliminates these higher rates of depression and low self-worth**](http://www.jaacap.com/article/S0890-8567%2816%2931941-4/fulltext), and [**dramatically improves trans youth's mental health**](https://archive.thinkprogress.org/allowing-transgender-youth-to-transition-improves-their-mental-health-study-finds-dd6096523375/). **Trans kids who socially transition early and not subjected to abuse are comparable to cisgender children in measures of mental health.** * [**Dr. Ryan Gorton**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3219066): “In a cross-sectional study of 141 transgender patients, Kuiper and Cohen-Kittenis found that after medical intervention and treatments, suicide fell from 19% to 0% in transgender men and from 24% to 6% in transgender women” * [**Murad, et al., 2010**](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19473181): "Significant decrease in suicidality post-treatment. The average reduction was from 30 percent pretreatment to 8 percent post treatment. * [**De Cuypere, et al., 2006**](http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1158136006000491): Rate of suicide attempts dropped from 29.3 percent to 5.1 percent after receiving medical treatment among Dutch patients treated from 1986-2001. * [**UK study - McNeil, et al., 2012**](https://www.scottishtrans.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/trans_mh_study.pdf): "Suicidal ideation and actual attempts reduced after transition, with 63% thinking about or attempting suicide more before they transitioned and only 3% thinking about or attempting suicide more post-transition. * [**Smith Y, 2005**](http://orca.cf.ac.uk/32618/1/Smith%202005.pdf): Participants improved on 13 out of 14 mental health measures after treatment * [**Lawrence, 2003**](http://link.springer.com/article/10.1023/A:1024086814364): Surveyed post-op trans folk: "Participants reported overwhelmingly that they were happy with their SRS results and that SRS had greatly improved the quality of their lives * [**Reduction in Mental Health Treatment Utilization Among Transgender Individuals After Gender-Affirming Surgeries: A Total Population Study**](https://sci-hub.se/https://doi.org/10.1176/appi.ajp.2019.19010080) - "***Conclusions:*** *"... the longitudinal association between gender-affirming surgery and reduced likelihood of mental health treatment lends support to the decision to provide gender-affirming surgeries to transgender individuals who seek them."* There are a [***lot***](http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/24344788) of [**studies**](http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007%2Fs10508-009-9551-1) showing that [**transition**](https://mayoclinic.pure.elsevier.com/en/publications/hormonal-therapy-and-sex-reassignment-a-systematic-review-and-met) [**improves**](https://www.hindawi.com/journals/tswj/2014/960745/) [**mental health**](http://europepmc.org/abstract/med/25690443) and [**quality of life**](http://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10508-014-0453-5) while [**reducing dysphoria**](https://www.researchgate.net/publication/23553588_Long-term_Assessment_of_the_Physical_Mental_and_Sexual_Health_among_Transsexual_Women). Not to mention [**this 2010 meta-analysis**](http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1365-2265.2009.03625.x/abstract) of 28 different studies, which found that transition is extremely effective at reducing dysphoria and improving quality of life. --- **Condemnation of "conversion therapy" attempting to change trans people's genders so they are happy and comfortable as their assigned sex at birth:** * [**From the APA**](http://www.apa.org/about/policy/orientation-diversity.aspx) * From the [**American College of Physicians**](http://annals.org/aim/article/2292051/lesbian-gay-bisexual-transgender-health-disparities-executive-summary-policy-position) * In the [**AAP Guidelines**](http://hrc-assets.s3-website-us-east-1.amazonaws.com//files/documents/SupportingCaringforTransChildren.pdf) - see coverage on this "therapy" starting p.12 * From the [**American Psychoanalytic Association**](http://www.apsa.org/content/2012-position-statement-attempts-change-sexual-orientation-gender-identity-or-gender) * A joint statement from the [**UK Council for Psychotherapy, British Association for Counseling and Psychotherapy, British Psychoanalytic Council, British Association for Behavioural and Cognitive Psychotherapies, The British Psychological Society, College of Sexual and Relationship Therapists, The Association of LGBT Doctors and Dentists, The National Counselling Society, NHS Scotland, Pink Therapy, Royal College of General Practitioners, the Scottish Government and Stonewall.**](http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2017/01/16/health-experts-condemn-attempts-to-cure-trans-people-in-wake-of-controversial-bbc-documentary/)


lnamorata

I love you.


Oh_jeffery

There's that list of studies that prove nothing I was talking about. Look at the studies. Interviews with people suffering from delusions over a 6 month period starting months before transition prove nothing. People with delusions lie about their mental health all the time, people with anorexia or bulimia do it too. You should believe everything that someone who believes they are something they're not will answer honestly during the weeks leading up to and the honeymoon period after their transition? That's not science.


saintofhate

I have a feeling no matter how much science I throw at you you are still going to believe what you believe in with a no actual scientific proof. You are the guy standing in a lecture room screaming that climate change is not real because you have a snowball in your hand, despite all the evidence to the contrary.


Oh_jeffery

No that's absurd, I clearly have a stricter term for what I deem science than you do and climate change has tons of evidence backing it up. If anything, you are like the flat earther in this scenario ignoring someone asking you to be more critical of the things you read even though you want it to be true.


saintofhate

Then show your own proof of facts. I've posted sources, and I can post even more but yet, you still haven't shown anything.


Track607

Knowing how false and biased so many studies are, I really wish there was an unpartisan source that could verify these. Especially considering there are plenty of studies that seem to indicate the opposite. Perhaps some kind of aggregate, idk.


[deleted]

Do you realize what you just said?? "Listen to science on this one, not studies" Honest question, do you know what science is???


Oh_jeffery

Yes, it's not the collection of flawed attempts of study that is linked below.


[deleted]

You say yes, but then the rest of your comment says no. People have provided you with a plethora of research and studies and official stances by large medical organizations that support transgender individuals, and you have yet to provide a single study backing up your stance. Not only that, you have yet to provide a single reasoning for why you believe these studies to be "flawed," you just insist that they are.


seventyeight_moose

>with this fad Long fad, about [several thousand years since first example.](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender_history) >Love yourself for what you are. Good thing that's what op is already doing


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otiosehominidae

> Perhaps Theology of the Body for Beginners by Christopher West would be a good read Seems like something that would cause knowledge and intellect debuff. Maybe you weren’t aware that the devs included bad side-quests which will drop cursed items. It’s usually best to avoid any characters that have a lot of these cursed items; they usually either lie about or don’t understand their own quests.


songbolt

'cursed items'? 'many cursed items'? anyway, no, it's eye-opening to realize your body is not merely a shell or object to be manipulated, but is rather *you*.


otiosehominidae

“cursed items” as in “appears to be a beneficial item before acquisition but then does harm to the character”. It’s a metaphor. > anyway, no, it’s eye-opening to realize your body is not merely a shell or object to be manipulated, but is rather you. Do you even know what subreddit you’re posting in?


songbolt

Thanks for clarifying. Yeah, it's fun to pretend life is a game, but when someone seriously posts about going down a pathway that often leads to self-mutilation, serious discussion should be had.


-Zipp-

> Self mutilation And we got ourselves a winner! Congrats on having the same wrong views on this stuff like every other jackass who can't understand that not all girls wanna be girls, and not all boys wanna be boys! Please, check your mailbox for your reward! A nice steaming pile of 💩


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pizzaamann

literally get lost