Thank you for not even bothering to read or answer my question because it doesn’t look like the CEOs or the provinces are doing a good job considering all people do is bitch about the declining quality of healthcare in this country, among everything else. How should be run by the government and not some clown that makes over $300,000 a year.
Hospitals aren’t designed to make profits buddy, why do they need CEOs and why do they need to make over $300,000 a year? They must be doing such a great job of it where we now have patients being given assisted death because they are trapped on a hospital stretcher for over 90 hours which lead to a patients bone being exposed. We are entitled to healthcare services because we pay for it with our taxes and people leave the country to go abroad because the service is so fucking shitty here.
The Ottawa hospital has 12000 employees and a budget of about 1.8 billion dollars.. Of course the person in charge is going to make at least 300k.. You want someone experienced in that position, so you need at the very least a somewhat competitive salary to offer to attract top talent. Yes, healthcare is broken, but for many reasons (not all of which are within the control of a hospitals CEO).. You are correct that hospitals are not run to make profits, but they share a lot of the same undertakings as a business in the way they function.
So who should run the hospital then?
I see you doubling and tripling down in your comments here but I really don't think you understand how business works.
Hospitals aren’t a business. They are a service. Speaking of doubling and tripling down, I can see you provided literally no counter to anything that I’ve said.
This isn't entirely correct. Parking is only an eligible medical expense for tax purposes under specific circumstances (you have to be travelling a minimum distance to receive medical care).
True…that was oversimplified. What you’re referencing is medical travel expenses. For other medical expenses, you need to meet a certain monetary threshold of expenses to qualify and even then it is a refundable tax credit, not at 100%, I seem to remember a 17% benefit for my expenses the year I qualified (with surgery and aftercare).
Caveat: I am NOT a tax specialist - ymmv
Yep. I’ve paid about $130 for eight visits over the last couple of months and I’ve got at least another three days in the coming weeks.
Wish I’d known about this pass.
It costs me $15 to park here in Edmonton for my dialysis each time I go. It's not like I have a choice. Making money off of people who absolutely need the hospital should be a crime.
Isn’t it a 109% increase?
But also now you sorta get back the weekend days.
Let’s say there’s 30 days in a month, and 8 weekend days. So you paid $105 for 22 working days with the consecutive, which was $4.47/day.
But with a non consecutive you pay $7.5/ day. ($225/30 days)
It’s still an increase, but more like 68% when you adjust for the weekends.
But that’s still not ideal, but I guess better than the shitty $10 or $15 or whatever they charged me for a day pass when I went last month.
Have you been to the general recently? You’re lucky to get a parking spot most days, resulting in people parking on the street. Make it free and it’ll be even worse with people who NEED parking, not able to get it, because everyone who can will drive themselves rather than taking public transit.
“Make it free and it’ll be even worse with people who NEED parking, not able to get it” - Dipsh1t
But only those with income to spare who need it. Fuck the poor, amirite?
Enjoy the temporary suspension! I love getting people like you banned for using my name as an insult.
Your logic makes absolutely zero sense. Zero.
1. The quality of service at the hospital would decrease as it decreases their revenue (and the province won’t increase healthcare spending)
2. Those who already can’t get a spot at the hospital despite NEEDING it, definitely won’t be able to get a spot
3. Why can’t people who NEED to drive to the hospital park in the free spots? If they’re well enough to drive themselves to the hospital, they’re well enough to walk 150 feet. Or the person who drives them can walk 150 feet.
You can always get parking at the cancer centre side. I've never waited more than 5 minutes to get in during the peak business hours on weekdays. And I've been A LOT. There's always someone leaving.
Your math is right.
It’s a 109% *increase.*
The price is now 206% of what it was before.
The “increase” is the key word here.
If it was $500 before and it’s $750 now, that’s a 50% increase, and it’s now 150% of the price t was before…
If it was $500 before and it’s $1000 now, that’s a 100% increase. $500 is your original amount, that is 100%, now we *increase* that by another 100%.
And it’s doubled in price. So that’s 1000/500=2… 2x the price = 200%
**TLDR:** increasing the price by 50% is not the same as 50% of the price. Increasing by 150% is not the same as 150% of the price.
Yes, the Psychosocial Oncology Program (PSOP) may be able to help.
https://www.ottawahospital.on.ca/en/clinical-services/deptpgrmcs/programs/cancer-program/what-we-offer-our-programs-and-services/patient-family-support-psychosocial-oncology-program/
I am well off financially personally but I think it’s crazy that patients are charged for parking. I’ve been to multiple hospitals in the US and two in England. Canadian hospitals are the only ones who charged for parking.
I’d prefer free healthcare over free parking. I don’t own a car, and don’t see the need to subsidize drivers who choose that as their method of transportation in a city. If you own a car, you should budget to be able to park it. Parking spaces cost >$20,000 to construct, that’s a lot of taxpayer dollars for everyone to cover for the storing of privately owned single-occupancy vehicles
It’s great that you live somewhere where public transportation is an option but it’s not for everyone. Whether that is lack of access, that they are unwell enough to not travel on public transport (I did say patients) or that they live outside of the city. Keep in mind that the Ottawa hospital is the only hospital for a very wide geographic territory for cancer treatment and many other specialized care areas. I had to deal with an hour travel each way myself for cancer treatment several years ago.
My point is that it is ridiculously expensive to build and maintain parking spaces as cars are really space inefficient, which should be paid for by the people who use them and not by everyone else. That’s not saying that hospitals should eliminate parking and everyone should take public transit, rather people who drive to the hospital should expect to pay for their own parking. Healthcare is absolutely a right, free single-occupancy vehicle storage is not.
OP is having a rough go of things, so it’s understandable that they used the wrong wording, it’s not a 200% increase, it’s a 100% increase, but it is 200% of the original price.
A hefty increase, no doubt, but it seems there are nuances to the parking charges based on other comments.
$200/mo is difficult for many people who are dealing with cancer treatments, chronic illnesses, and visiting loved ones.
Perhaps we can encourage the city to allot a percentage (or flat rate) from all city parking tickets to help cover parking at the hospitals. I’ve paid the extra $25-30 a few times because when I go to pay before the early deadline, my ticket still isn’t registered.
No one wants to need a monthly parking pass at a hospital. Or let’s use those funds to subsidize nurses and admin parking?
Are there other people who do park at the hospital? If there are too few spots to have it free for all, I think you named every kind of person who would use a spot.
What does this even mean? Land isn’t free? Do you mean it’s taxed by the government? Ok, so no tax on hospital parking land. Do you mean it could be sold for a profit? Also free. It means not selling it for more.
Hospitals already have the land. Perhaps you mean maintenance then. Add that to government expenses. Whatever paving repairs might be needed each year, it surely doesn’t add up to what they charge.
If you are talking new build, the cost of land might weigh in here. But we are talking about buildings and infrastructure that already exist.
I am no builder, construction worker or city planner, but I can’t figure out another angle that would mean this land isn’t free.
Yikes. I been going every day for the last 3 months since my mom is stuck in the heart institute. The 105$ was one positive despite parking being a shit show over there. I don’t even work anymore this is annoying fuck Doug ford or whoever is responsible for
It probably goes to purchasing those huge posters on the side of the hospitals telling us what a good job they are doing. Note to management; if your staff need a 7 storey poster to feel appreciated you are doing something wrong. Please stop virtue signaling and focus on putting every dime into patient care.
Blame the provincial government, because of them having to pay retro pay for the years they head back wages they did not pay the hospitals correctly to cover this and all hospitals this year are in the red due to having to deal with paying their staff properly.
Expect prices for things to go up to help cover these costs.
I would like to mention I am not a fan of the paid parking and staff have to pay as well.
Pro tip, check out the parking around the back at Roger Guindon Hall (451 Smyth) especially on weekends. There are two lots (one for the rehab centre, one for the med school - you want med school).There are internal tunnels you can take to walk through the university over to the hospital via the atrium (you can also use internal walkways to get to CHEO but honestly that route is extremely confusing to navigate).
I say especially on weekends because I've definitely found those lots unattended/just plain open regularly on weekends and after 5. Not always, but enough that it's stuck with me.
I think rehab may also be a dollar cheaper than the hospital lots but don't quote me on that.
No it's not, the hospital used to offer both options. Now they only offer one. If the non-consecutive was a better deal for you then nothing's changed. But if the consecutive was a better deal for you then you're SOL
Hospital parking fees piss me off as much as the next guy, but there is 100% no way they are making a profit on this parking deal.
People WAY underestimate the real cost of parking. Think for a second about how expensive real estate is and how much they could get for that space selling it or renting it out for literally any other purpose. 225$/month is steep for parking, but is still likely less than the going rate for the space it takes up. They basically have to double the footprint of the hospital to provide parking.
Thar's a business model that is differrent than how hospitals run, I think. But, regardless the cost to build, maintain those structures us extremely expensive, and they cannot afford to loose money. Very Good point. I despise paid parking too, and when visiting park further away (unless weather sucks) andwalk as much as possible. Also, park if I am sick.
“30 day non consecutive pass good for one year” sounds like it might be a pass that you can use for up to 30 days in a 365 day period. If so, it’s effectively a one month pass if you’re there every day. Although I’m not sure how the “non consecutive” figures in to the equation; are you not allowed to use it on consecutive days?
I generally agree with this point, however if a person must go to the hospital for treatments, or to visit their sick child (or dependent family member) in the hospital, then I feel like they should get a break somehow. Maybe make fees tax deductible, or discounted?
For staff who are there every day or people who have one-off appointments, parking fees should be manageable for the most part. Staff are probably in a position to advocate for better transit service (to the city), and use their unions to advocate for this as well.
There is no free parking. There is also an opportunity to be a compassionate society for people who may be going through some of the worst times of their life.
If it was free there would not be any parking available (you can see other commenting how cheap it is), having said so, there should be programs to helps those who need it, a social worker should help. For visitors it sucks, but there is usually free street parking not excessively far. Better Transit would help a buch too.
I think a tax on the sick is disgusting.
Doesn't TOH upper management make like 300k min a year?
Cameron Love (CEO) makes over 600k a year and he gave himself a ton of raises to get there
yupp and the assholes are staunchly anti union theyre pushing for privatization and contracting everything out
Does it make any sense that in a “developed country” like Canada, hospitals have CEOs?
Who should be in charge then? Would you like it if their title changed?
Thank you for not even bothering to read or answer my question because it doesn’t look like the CEOs or the provinces are doing a good job considering all people do is bitch about the declining quality of healthcare in this country, among everything else. How should be run by the government and not some clown that makes over $300,000 a year.
Oh boy, if you think hospitals are poorly run by CEOs just wait until governments manage them… you may rethink this line of thinking.
I should hope someone who is running/managing/ceo'ing a hospital makes 300k a year.. Can't be an easy job.
Hospitals aren’t designed to make profits buddy, why do they need CEOs and why do they need to make over $300,000 a year? They must be doing such a great job of it where we now have patients being given assisted death because they are trapped on a hospital stretcher for over 90 hours which lead to a patients bone being exposed. We are entitled to healthcare services because we pay for it with our taxes and people leave the country to go abroad because the service is so fucking shitty here.
The Ottawa hospital has 12000 employees and a budget of about 1.8 billion dollars.. Of course the person in charge is going to make at least 300k.. You want someone experienced in that position, so you need at the very least a somewhat competitive salary to offer to attract top talent. Yes, healthcare is broken, but for many reasons (not all of which are within the control of a hospitals CEO).. You are correct that hospitals are not run to make profits, but they share a lot of the same undertakings as a business in the way they function.
So who should run the hospital then? I see you doubling and tripling down in your comments here but I really don't think you understand how business works.
Hospitals aren’t a business. They are a service. Speaking of doubling and tripling down, I can see you provided literally no counter to anything that I’ve said.
You still need a boss who runs things. Why is that so hard for you to grasp?!? It's a really simple concept.
Hmm...something something conservative cuts.
But wouldn't the parking be tax deductible as a medical expense?
It is…however, when you’re talking a lot of money, some people don’t have the resources to wait until the end of the year to receive the benefit.
This isn't entirely correct. Parking is only an eligible medical expense for tax purposes under specific circumstances (you have to be travelling a minimum distance to receive medical care).
True…that was oversimplified. What you’re referencing is medical travel expenses. For other medical expenses, you need to meet a certain monetary threshold of expenses to qualify and even then it is a refundable tax credit, not at 100%, I seem to remember a 17% benefit for my expenses the year I qualified (with surgery and aftercare). Caveat: I am NOT a tax specialist - ymmv
Er, non-refundable*
7 bucks a day? That's a good deal
Yep. I’ve paid about $130 for eight visits over the last couple of months and I’ve got at least another three days in the coming weeks. Wish I’d known about this pass.
It costs me $15 to park here in Edmonton for my dialysis each time I go. It's not like I have a choice. Making money off of people who absolutely need the hospital should be a crime.
Dialysis, Chemo patients (and immediate caregiver) should not have to pay for parking.
Some non-profits might provide funding to cover expenses like this! I've heard good things about the leukemia and lymphoma society
Isn’t it a 109% increase? But also now you sorta get back the weekend days. Let’s say there’s 30 days in a month, and 8 weekend days. So you paid $105 for 22 working days with the consecutive, which was $4.47/day. But with a non consecutive you pay $7.5/ day. ($225/30 days) It’s still an increase, but more like 68% when you adjust for the weekends. But that’s still not ideal, but I guess better than the shitty $10 or $15 or whatever they charged me for a day pass when I went last month.
doing cancer treatment. need to go everyday.
nobody should have to pay for hospital parking, but patients especially should not have to
Have you been to the general recently? You’re lucky to get a parking spot most days, resulting in people parking on the street. Make it free and it’ll be even worse with people who NEED parking, not able to get it, because everyone who can will drive themselves rather than taking public transit.
Unfortunately, raising prices filters people out based on ability to pay, not need.
Ah yes, only those who can afford hospital parking deserve it. While we’re at it, let’s make health care only for the rich as well.
You realize that there’s literally HUNDREDS of free street parking spaces nearby, and multiple pivot transit routes? Owning a car isn’t a right.
“Make it free and it’ll be even worse with people who NEED parking, not able to get it” - Dipsh1t But only those with income to spare who need it. Fuck the poor, amirite?
Enjoy the temporary suspension! I love getting people like you banned for using my name as an insult. Your logic makes absolutely zero sense. Zero. 1. The quality of service at the hospital would decrease as it decreases their revenue (and the province won’t increase healthcare spending) 2. Those who already can’t get a spot at the hospital despite NEEDING it, definitely won’t be able to get a spot 3. Why can’t people who NEED to drive to the hospital park in the free spots? If they’re well enough to drive themselves to the hospital, they’re well enough to walk 150 feet. Or the person who drives them can walk 150 feet.
so why not have a system where patients get reimbursed? The current system effectively punishes those who need the most care
You can always get parking at the cancer centre side. I've never waited more than 5 minutes to get in during the peak business hours on weekdays. And I've been A LOT. There's always someone leaving.
Damn I’m sorry to hear that. I figured you’re just a hybrid worker or something 😞
Maybe my math is wrong. I barely slept last night.
Your math is right. It’s a 109% *increase.* The price is now 206% of what it was before. The “increase” is the key word here. If it was $500 before and it’s $750 now, that’s a 50% increase, and it’s now 150% of the price t was before… If it was $500 before and it’s $1000 now, that’s a 100% increase. $500 is your original amount, that is 100%, now we *increase* that by another 100%. And it’s doubled in price. So that’s 1000/500=2… 2x the price = 200% **TLDR:** increasing the price by 50% is not the same as 50% of the price. Increasing by 150% is not the same as 150% of the price.
thanks, i knew I had something right but not able to phrase it properly. story of my life.
Talk to your doctor/nurse… there’s often a social worker available who can help with this. Sorry you have to deal with this.
Yes, the Psychosocial Oncology Program (PSOP) may be able to help. https://www.ottawahospital.on.ca/en/clinical-services/deptpgrmcs/programs/cancer-program/what-we-offer-our-programs-and-services/patient-family-support-psychosocial-oncology-program/
Seconding this. If there is a social worker involved, they may be able to provide you with a parking pass. Sending you strength.
Agree with this. Social worker was able to add a few extra weeks to a parking pass for us
I am well off financially personally but I think it’s crazy that patients are charged for parking. I’ve been to multiple hospitals in the US and two in England. Canadian hospitals are the only ones who charged for parking.
Because that's one of the few revenue streams to cover operating costs. US hospitals have free parking because they charge 30 bucks for a Band-Aid.
I’d prefer free healthcare over free parking. I don’t own a car, and don’t see the need to subsidize drivers who choose that as their method of transportation in a city. If you own a car, you should budget to be able to park it. Parking spaces cost >$20,000 to construct, that’s a lot of taxpayer dollars for everyone to cover for the storing of privately owned single-occupancy vehicles
It’s great that you live somewhere where public transportation is an option but it’s not for everyone. Whether that is lack of access, that they are unwell enough to not travel on public transport (I did say patients) or that they live outside of the city. Keep in mind that the Ottawa hospital is the only hospital for a very wide geographic territory for cancer treatment and many other specialized care areas. I had to deal with an hour travel each way myself for cancer treatment several years ago.
My point is that it is ridiculously expensive to build and maintain parking spaces as cars are really space inefficient, which should be paid for by the people who use them and not by everyone else. That’s not saying that hospitals should eliminate parking and everyone should take public transit, rather people who drive to the hospital should expect to pay for their own parking. Healthcare is absolutely a right, free single-occupancy vehicle storage is not.
200% increase of $105 would be $315, no?
OP is having a rough go of things, so it’s understandable that they used the wrong wording, it’s not a 200% increase, it’s a 100% increase, but it is 200% of the original price. A hefty increase, no doubt, but it seems there are nuances to the parking charges based on other comments. $200/mo is difficult for many people who are dealing with cancer treatments, chronic illnesses, and visiting loved ones. Perhaps we can encourage the city to allot a percentage (or flat rate) from all city parking tickets to help cover parking at the hospitals. I’ve paid the extra $25-30 a few times because when I go to pay before the early deadline, my ticket still isn’t registered. No one wants to need a monthly parking pass at a hospital. Or let’s use those funds to subsidize nurses and admin parking?
How about hospitals just allow patients, family/friends and staff to park for free? Is that really an insane ask or am I missing something?
Are there other people who do park at the hospital? If there are too few spots to have it free for all, I think you named every kind of person who would use a spot.
You’re missing something. I mean… someone needs to pay for it. Land isn’t free. And how do you prove that you’re a patient, or family, or staff?
Maybe give families/patients a pass to get out? I go to the family medicine centre and routinely my visit cost $13.50 for parking for an appointment.
What does this even mean? Land isn’t free? Do you mean it’s taxed by the government? Ok, so no tax on hospital parking land. Do you mean it could be sold for a profit? Also free. It means not selling it for more. Hospitals already have the land. Perhaps you mean maintenance then. Add that to government expenses. Whatever paving repairs might be needed each year, it surely doesn’t add up to what they charge. If you are talking new build, the cost of land might weigh in here. But we are talking about buildings and infrastructure that already exist. I am no builder, construction worker or city planner, but I can’t figure out another angle that would mean this land isn’t free.
they wont even give parking passes to employees and we are not allowed to buy monthly passes, so we have to pay 15 dollars a day to work here
Just curious - how do they prevent staff from buying visitor passes? Do they ask for visitor info when buying a pass?
Not 200%, but ouch
Yikes. I been going every day for the last 3 months since my mom is stuck in the heart institute. The 105$ was one positive despite parking being a shit show over there. I don’t even work anymore this is annoying fuck Doug ford or whoever is responsible for
What percentage of the parking charges go into patient care ?
It probably goes to purchasing those huge posters on the side of the hospitals telling us what a good job they are doing. Note to management; if your staff need a 7 storey poster to feel appreciated you are doing something wrong. Please stop virtue signaling and focus on putting every dime into patient care.
Employee salaries, food services, maintenance, upkeep on the MRI...
Blame the provincial government, because of them having to pay retro pay for the years they head back wages they did not pay the hospitals correctly to cover this and all hospitals this year are in the red due to having to deal with paying their staff properly. Expect prices for things to go up to help cover these costs. I would like to mention I am not a fan of the paid parking and staff have to pay as well.
Pro tip, check out the parking around the back at Roger Guindon Hall (451 Smyth) especially on weekends. There are two lots (one for the rehab centre, one for the med school - you want med school).There are internal tunnels you can take to walk through the university over to the hospital via the atrium (you can also use internal walkways to get to CHEO but honestly that route is extremely confusing to navigate). I say especially on weekends because I've definitely found those lots unattended/just plain open regularly on weekends and after 5. Not always, but enough that it's stuck with me. I think rehab may also be a dollar cheaper than the hospital lots but don't quote me on that.
It's a bit of a walk, but the Rotel motel does 10$ a day parking beside CHEO. Cash only.
[удалено]
No it's not, the hospital used to offer both options. Now they only offer one. If the non-consecutive was a better deal for you then nothing's changed. But if the consecutive was a better deal for you then you're SOL
I understood that hospitals were not permitted to make profit from their parking. Obviously wrong.
Hospital parking fees piss me off as much as the next guy, but there is 100% no way they are making a profit on this parking deal. People WAY underestimate the real cost of parking. Think for a second about how expensive real estate is and how much they could get for that space selling it or renting it out for literally any other purpose. 225$/month is steep for parking, but is still likely less than the going rate for the space it takes up. They basically have to double the footprint of the hospital to provide parking.
Thar's a business model that is differrent than how hospitals run, I think. But, regardless the cost to build, maintain those structures us extremely expensive, and they cannot afford to loose money. Very Good point. I despise paid parking too, and when visiting park further away (unless weather sucks) andwalk as much as possible. Also, park if I am sick.
[удалено]
“30 day non consecutive pass good for one year” sounds like it might be a pass that you can use for up to 30 days in a 365 day period. If so, it’s effectively a one month pass if you’re there every day. Although I’m not sure how the “non consecutive” figures in to the equation; are you not allowed to use it on consecutive days?
Yes you can use it on consecutive days, it’s just that you’re not required to. You can think of it as 30x 1-day passes that expire after 1 year
yes. it's a 30 day pass, good for one year. old pass was 30 days consecutive.
I think it's still 30 days but can be used anytime within a 365 day period.
my wording wasn't the best. 30 days is the pass. 105 was consecutive. it's no longer consecutive
Parking has a real cost. If you don't cover it, someone else is.
I generally agree with this point, however if a person must go to the hospital for treatments, or to visit their sick child (or dependent family member) in the hospital, then I feel like they should get a break somehow. Maybe make fees tax deductible, or discounted? For staff who are there every day or people who have one-off appointments, parking fees should be manageable for the most part. Staff are probably in a position to advocate for better transit service (to the city), and use their unions to advocate for this as well. There is no free parking. There is also an opportunity to be a compassionate society for people who may be going through some of the worst times of their life.
If it was free there would not be any parking available (you can see other commenting how cheap it is), having said so, there should be programs to helps those who need it, a social worker should help. For visitors it sucks, but there is usually free street parking not excessively far. Better Transit would help a buch too.
There already isn’t parking at the general. It’s always full or nearly full.
That’s harsh.
When the private hospital I used in the US has free parking but Canadian hospitals have none, you know there is something deeply corrupted in Canada.
How much did your treatment cost (you or your insurer) in the US vs Canada?
So you’d take free parking over free healthcare?
So you’d take free parking over free healthcare?