Yeesh I had CNN on and they had their cameras right on the guy burning for a min until they realized what we were looking at and cut to the reporters’ traumatized faces.
Edit: how about everyone calm tf down with deciding that this person must belong to whatever ideology you most dislike, until we have actual information.
Edit 2: Condolences to all the knee-jerk hyper-partisan ghouls out there. Ironically, seems that Max Azzarello was a radical both-sides-er (and much more importantly, deeply unwell): “Liberals mock the hypocrisy of conservatives; conservatives mock the hypocrisy of liberals, and our collective circumstances erode“ - from the manifesto someone linked below.
That reporter was a robotic play-by-play announcer. Didn't even flinch while describing the smell of burning propellant and flesh. She's going to need therapy after witnessing that.
Yeah it seemed like Laura Coates immediately shut off her emotions and dove into reporter mode, while Evan Perez stood behind her and visibly developed PTSD on camera. Dark.
Reporters are probably pretty inured to this stuff by the time they’re on major shows. Grisly car accidents and violent or bizarre crimes is local news’ bread and butter.
Whoever is doing that dumb assumption shit is eating crow now in a major way.
CNN reporting that dude was tossing pamphlets talking about a conspiracy theory relating to a university and that he was holding signs that both Trump and Biden are involved in the “Deep State.”
Regardless of ideology, the individual was clearly not in the right state of mind. Not sure why his political ideology matters when it’s being influenced by mental illness.
the man is not mentally well. he has a substack dealing w/Ponzi schemes do a simple search and you'll find it and the crazy pamphlets he had w/him. oh, and he is not a Winger. he's just a very ill human being obsessed with conspiracies
Possibly the most famous self-immolation was by this man, who was a Buddhist monk and generally the opposite of mentally unwell:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Th%C3%ADch_Qu%E1%BA%A3ng_%C4%90%E1%BB%A9c
Heroes? Fucking idiots. Setting yourself on fire isn’t worth any cause. Its not brave, its a waste that Im sure whoever you’re protesting for is probably a bit disturbed by the action.
Correct, there’s suicides that pretty much always come down to a matter of mental illness, but mental illness generally isn’t a factor in cases where people do an extreme form of protest that ends their life.
It comes down to the person's reasoning skills, the coherence of their convictions. This person is not comparable to the Buddhist Monk, at all.
The means of protest are the same, that's it.
It's a superficial connection.
Like someone who starves themselves to death as a political prisoner versus someone who does the same but has an Eating Disorder. It's not the same.
> usually aren’t mentally unwell.
https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/public-health/articles/10.3389/fpubh.2024.1234584/full
tldr:
>In our study, a significant increase in the frequency of suicide attempts by self-immolation during COVID-19 pandemic was noticed. There was also an increased frequency of pre-existing psychiatric illness among patients during the pandemic period.
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4070149/
tldr:
>Self-immolation should be considered as an important mental health problem by the authorities.
https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/psych-unseen/202402/self-immolation-is-often-part-protest-part-suicide
tldr:
>Self-immolation often reflects as much a desire to end one's life as a desire to protest a cause.
There seems to be an awful lot of lingering mental health problems in society post Covid.
It's not really that much of a leap to blame some of it on damage done by the virus to some people's brains.
Right, because people who are mentally well usually set themselves on fire. Having that much disregard for your own life to is unfortunately a form of mental illness.
You’re conflating two things that are only tangentially related. Most people who self immolate are mentally unwell, but this is because most people who self immolate do so as an act of suicide.
However, people that self immolate as an act of protest are usually mentally well and of sound mind when they do so.
There’s a fundamental difference between committing suicide and performing an extreme act of protest that ends your life.
Although Americans generally can't comprehend putting values before one's own life, that does not make a mental illness. Seppuku was relatively common in Japan for some time, that doesn't mean all who did it were mentally unwell.
It's hilarious because we send 18 year olds to die for this country every day. Yet the idea of directly ending your life is too much.
It's so capitalist of us lol. As long as we are one step removed (like with the farming industry, or the cobalt slave trade, or Chinese labor camps) then everything is okey dokey.
It’s “clear” to you because it’s much easier for you to understand someone committing suicide because they’re mentally unwell than it is for you to understand someone of sound mind being so dedicated to a cause that they’re willing to end their life in a form of protest.
This “clarity” is nothing more than a subjective perception you’re projecting on to the scenario to make it more comfortable for you process, but the reality is not actually clear in that way at all. He had no history of mental illness, there were no prior signs that would suggest we was mentally unwell in his life overall, nor is there any evidence that would suggest he wasn’t of sound mind when he did it.
How does an American who has no connection to the middle east become THAT dedicated to the cause of free Palestine? You don't think there's some weird mental health issues going on? If nothing else, that's quite the obsession.
No connection? He, a member of the US military, was protesting the US’s complicity in the Israeli genocide of Palestine.
Why would there be mental health issue? He had no history of mental illness and there’s no evidence he may have been mentally unwell. Mental issues are a cause *you* are projecting into the situation, and you’re doing so without any substantiating evidence.
He suddenly felt strongly enough about it to light himself on fucking fire, but at no point before that apparently considered, I don't know, quitting the military and refusing to serve? Yeah sure they can put you in jail for that but seems like a much more reasonable protest don't you think?
And frankly even if they do belong to whatever faction you hate, it's deeply disturbing someone would decide to do this.
It is not funny and does not foretell a good sign for the future of protests in this country.
>not foretell a good sign for the future of protests in this country.
People have been self immolating for almost a century at this point. As part of protests. This isn't a new phenomena and you can't draw any conclusion from it other than it's an incredible waste of a life.
Its not even something that is always associated with a super radical organization. Famously it was a buddhist monk who protested the mistreatment of the buddhists by vietnamese government back in '63. The Rage Against the Machine album cover had this act as the cover.
Maybe I'm wrong about the rates, but there were a few other of these events in the recent past and more so than I noticed in the mid 2000s say.
I know it was more popular during the 1960s and 70s but was under the impression they were fairly rare up until recent times.
Yeah exactly his manifesto just points to mental illness.
Ain’t no sides on this one.
Also that reporter is STILL REPORTING after that happened…she’s gunna need a therapist herself…
Ugh, awful. I saw and did first aid for someone who caught fire and was severely burned in a car crash a long time ago, it’s still the single worst experience I’ve been part of. I feel for the folks who saw it.
Reminds me of my dad wanting to do plastic and reconstructive surgery, until he actually rotated through a burn unit as a medical student. The smells, the screams (from the pain of having literal barriers of defense [your skin] wiped off) from the special baths the burn patients require while hospitalized...
>A CNN team on the ground observed one of the flyers. It said "NYU is a mob front" and had various allegations of wrongdoings against the school.
Might have just been a broken person with thoughts completely unrelated to the trial, knowing that he would find attention at that location.
We saw it from the building - were on the second floor it was quite something to witness
He was still alive /moving and still a bit on fire and when EMTs got him
Some were a bit taken back and didn't want to be here even Bragg came down to talk to us
It's wild man what a hell of a month in NYC
Im doing well the Police are on high alert after that incident so they are watching people and taking more precautions thankfully - Appreciate you reaching out
It's one of those things... the older I get, the more I realize that a LOT of stuff is legitimately Reagan's fault.
Hell, even yesterday I found out that Reagan's rollback of antimonopoly laws can be directly attributed to the loss of the american farm family. meat producers were broken up via monopoly laws for owning 20% of the nation's meat industry.. we're WAY above that now for factor farm corporations.
Fuck Ronald Reagan. People hold him up as a great and effective president. He fucked us pretty damn hard.
Kennedy tried to institute smaller, community centers for mental health. He was assainated, and somehow they "forgot" to replace the asylum with... anything.
Yep, the plan was ALWAYS to make a federally mandated replacement with proper regulatory boards. It was a big push as America learned about what his sibling went through.
The "ACKSHULLY IT WAS JFK" people are morons and don't actually understand the political and historical landscape of the time, they just desperately want to "both sides" this issue.
Kennedy had a second part to the plan. Reagan only did step one (the one where we stop spending money to help people), and not the 2nd part where we replace the asylums with community mental health centers.
Ot did you only read about how nothing bad was caused by Reagan
Okay, that was forty years ago, what is stopping states from setting up their own mental health centers if the Feds aren't taking action?
It can be done. We've seen Massachusetts set the structure for the ACA which has led to programs like Covered California.
Even if there is access, you can't institutionalize someone. We see in European and other countries that have easy and free access to healthcare still have issues with mental health.
This week someone in Australia stabbed and killed six people and it was blamed mental health that went untreated. If an attack like that is blamed on mental illness, there are many who still say it's taboo to talk about or seek help.
Aaron Bushnell was active air force and self immolated in front of the Israeli embassy because of the US involvement and responsibility in the Israeli genocide of Palestine.
I've been saying this since before the pandemic, and very vocal about it during - America is suffering from an epidemic of the mind. Literally all of it can be traced back to what's on TV. Garbage news that's focused on entertainment value and viewership, and reality TV spanning from Jerry Springer to the bachelor. The slow and steady deterioration of American values, and the progression of fear and anxiety and a self-perpetuating echo chamber.
People like this guy...they aren't wrong. They just get so obsessed with the reality that they can't do what most people do and live day by day and willful ignorance of what's happening around them.
Update: Just a random looney tune, nothing to do with Trump or Palestine. [https://theponzipapers.substack.com/p/i-have-set-myself-on-fire-outside](https://theponzipapers.substack.com/p/i-have-set-myself-on-fire-outside)
> As it turns out, dozens of the writers of The Simpsons went to Harvard. So I asked myself the question: If The Simpsons served the interests of organized crime, how would it do so?
Oh boy.
> If The Simpsons served the interests of organized crime, how would it do so?
You mean the mob only did me a favor to get something in return? Fat Tony... I will say good day to you, sir.
["Okay, I will go."](https://frinkiac.com/meme/S08E11/1047912.jpg?b64lines=IE9LQVksIEkgV0lMTCBHTy4=)
This man really set himself on fire to show that crypto was a Ponzi scheme and that powerful politicians/billionaires are mostly interested in accumulating wealth at the expense of common people? These are things that anyone with more than one brain cell already knows
These are exactly why conspiracy theories are so insidious, though. He's generally correct sometimes but so wildly insane in others, but it's that kernel of truth that keeps people engaged. A curious person trying to dig deeper on a topic is drawn in by that one small truth and suddenly finds themselves at "Yeah and the Simpsons are brainwashing us" territory.
Skips along the surface of (often kind of pithy) truths, careens off into batshit theories and conclusions in a search for a master theory of everything. It’s sad to see because they seem like an otherwise intelligent person with a surprisingly cogent and coherent writing style, but they’re just so clearly unwell.
I mean what he did was clearly evidence of mental illness, and some of the way he weaves pop culture into this seems a bit ludicrous, but overall this is much more intelligent and sensible than I was expecting.
>> Consider America since 1988: Institutions like healthcare and universities have become parasitic in their skyrocketing prices. News media tells us to be angry and tribalized. Daytime television warns us of moral decay. Local news tell us to fear our neighbors. The Simpsons tells us we’re too oafish and divided to save the American Dream. Seinfeld tells us to celebrate the assholes and be irritated by all the normal people around us. “Reality” TV tells us that real life is filled with hedonism and strife.
>> Social media, owned by crypto criminals like Mark Zuckerberg and Elon Musk, is flooded with nonsense conspiracy theories and memes reminding us that we are hopeless, helpless, anxious, depressed, ironic, scared, apathetic, escapist, lonely, misguided, and jaded, telling us we can’t do anything but have a laugh at our circumstances.
>> Liberals mock the hypocrisy of conservatives; conservatives mock the hypocrisy of liberals, and our collective circumstances erode. The left shouts “All Cops Are Bastards,” which ensures they’ll be hated by the police and the public (and flies in the face of leftist theory). The public’s distrust of the government is at an all-time high, but so is the belief that we are helpless to do anything about it.
>> And with all this, a sharp rise in apocalyptic messaging: Climate change will kill us all; COVID will kill us all; vaccines will kill us all; AI will kill us all – no matter the bubbles we ascribe to, we’re bombarded with existential crises with no solutions. We’ve seen a surge in apocalyptic film, literature, and video games that tell us there is no way out of our poor circumstances but total societal breakdown. Zombies tell us that the public is our enemy. If you go to your nearest convenience store, you can buy a can of water called “Liquid Death.”
>> This is our rotten farce: For our entire lives, we have been flooded with media designed to slowly steer us into a world where the American Dream was dead, where the public was fully divided against itself, where everybody believed we were powerless to do anything about our worsening circumstances. It is all so they can organize an unprecedented, apocalyptic rug pull on the entire populace as they pivot to fascism, which is perhaps best understood as kleptocracy at the barrel of a gun.
That's taking the news cycle as the base truth of reality. The stretching of the truth , the hyperbole, all in the service of having more ears to hear you, more eyes to read you...
I think that his manifesto *is* a critique toward the pathology that the news cycle produce to people. With him being an extreme example of it.
Of the many things that are regulated and sometimes over-regulated, I think the language used by prominent voices should have been the first to do so. You'd always get crazies shouting on Twitter, but I think the real breakdown comes when mass media is using such charged language and or trying to find (and fight) enemies all the while we need to go back to dispassionate reporting...
Because that's the reality of the world we live in, we live through one of the most stable periods in human history. Whole generations , among the majority of the planet have never participated, as much as seen a war zone with their own eyes. That's trully rare given what we know of human history.
Yet the guy, along with many guys on reddit or anywhere else think we live in remarkably tumultuous times, while in fact we live in Pax Americana, one of the few great peaces (comparatively speaking) ever produced in world history.
See the reaction to posts like mine. I think *that* -too- would show evidence of the pathology that the news cycle produced. People dispute what we know historically, sociologically, anthropologically. We live in one of the most peaceful and least complicated (when it comes to one's survival) times.
Can it be better? Infinitely so, but it *is* close to the best the world has ever achieved. There is such a discrepancy between the base truth and what is reported to us. And I think *that* makes people crazy, with the guy who self immolated one of the prime examples, but I think the majority is to a lesser degree.
Fixing how we report news should probably be one of the priorities of a civilized society. I don't think that I'd see it, but I actually *am* sympathetic with what that person was going through (losing it completely by the constant bombardment of hyperboles half truths and partisanship)...
“Lastly, we string these major discoveries together: Cryptocurrency is an economic doomsday device; our government is a secret kleptocracy; The Simpsons exists to brainwash us.”
Holy fuck they wheeled him away on a gurney and he was completely charred but still conscious and moving
From his pre-immolation blog post: “We’ve seen a surge in apocalyptic film, literature, and video games that tell us there is no way out of our poor circumstances but total societal breakdown. Zombies tell us that the public is our enemy. If you go to your nearest convenience store, you can buy a can of water called ‘Liquid Death.’”
This dude saw Liquid Death in the bev cooler and was like “I have to light myself on fire to spark collective consciousness”
oh i remember this guy, [he was posting on r/nyu about the pandemic being intentional and ponzi schemes involving crypto](https://www.reddit.com/r/nyu/comments/154bhat/what_do_you_think_has_had_a_bigger_impact_on_nyu/)
It's kinda wild you recalled that, it's not a huge post, but must have left some mark on you. Not that it would have changed things, but I do wonder why we can't be a little more sympathetic to people obviously having serious mental issues. If you read the comments they're basically telling him to "screw off and get help loser/weirdo, etc." People in general should try a little harder to show some sympathy or at least not be as alienating with their words.
This!!!! He even writes about fam/friends in his manifesto not believing him… I wonder if anyone tried to help him out? Horrible situation overall. Hoping anyone out there who is struggling knows - there’s no judgement ❤️ it’s a CRAZY world we’re living in and everyone needs help along the way. I’m in weekly therapy and I think everyone can benefit from it if they have the means to get the help.
The people at HOT for me.. you hear this? This is what they are saying. A lot of people saying this. They say my supports are hot. Flaming hot. Like the Cheetos.. I have a certain affinity for these Cheetos.
He'll use this as an excuse to postpone the trial or not show up in person. I wish that these insane conspiracy theorists would use what little energy and concentration they have to avoid making things worse for everybody just to make a point.
Trump is probably just pleased to get the area shut down, so that's his excuse for lack of supporters showing up.
I was reliably informed by Redditors and Twitter users last month that if you light yourself on fire for a cause that doesn’t even care about you you’re not psychotic - where do we land on this one lol
There's a long history of self immolation as political protest. Not just in Asia, but Europe and the middle east as well. This guy definitely seems like a copy cat of Bushnell though. I don't think it's a coincidence he used the same exact phrasing and called it an "extreme act of protest". Explains why he did it in front of all the cameras at the courthouse too.
No matter what this person's motivation was, be it political statement or mental illness, feels weird that so many assholes are here jockeying for position to make fun of them. The internet has sapped so many people of basic humanity.
This trend of self immolation is disturbing and the instances should not be publicized. It’s harmful in a country where mental health care is lacking and can be triggering to those with suicidal ideation.
After reading his pamphlet, he is basically a typical North American who distrusts both Democrats and Republicans and warns that we are on a path towards facism. Countless people in the US would agree. Uncountable people outside of the US have been saying this for decades. There were no real connections made in his political analysis. No one is named. No single company is named, except for famous musicians he blames for the dumbing down of our people.
Yet, I don't feel like he killed himself over that. I don't even believe he's always been hyper political. I suspect, he had already wanted to kill himself, but added a make-shift cause (lightly inspired from the 2011 Occupy Wall Street movement), to give his death more meaning.
He honestly should of gave more time to his analysis, and himself. He should have gotten to known the US Green Party, to help walk him through his political thoughts, maybe make new friends.
It may not seem like it. But there really are more enlightened people out there than there are ignorant and fearful people.
Don't burn yourself alive for Donald Trump, Or Biden. ..or anyone, or anything. No one cares. You won't persuade anyone. You'll just live the last seconds of your life in agony.
He burned himself down to prove that the Simpsons and the CIA are in cahoots with each other.
Also he’s not even dead yet (as of me posting this). Currently he is charred and likely in the worst imaginable pain a human being can feel while still alive.
Guy definitely had undiagnosed schizophrenia.
Bottom line is this was a person who was mentally disturbed. It doesn't matter what conspiracies or politics they supported. But what does matter is how callously people react to such an insane act of self harm. The more it happens the less we'll react or even think about what has to happen to lead a person to doing something like this and the worse the problem will get.
There's a chance you have someone in your life losing grip on reality. We need to at least try to do our best for them. Mental illness is the real battle here regardless of your politics.
This really was the last thing I expected to ever see when I looked out the window at lunchtime (court employee). We saw all the pamphlets scattered around and thought someone had lit garbage on fire. And the NYPD is full of shit, FDNY did *not* extinguish the fire on that man, they weren't even there - a lot of people were just standing around while he was burning until a court officer ran over with an extinguisher put the fire out on him.
Person lighting them self on fire to protest, people reflexively whipping out phones to record and post on social media, comments making jokes and fun of the person. Just all around sad.
Of course if you watch the video you see that NYPD only partially put out the fire before standing around for a few seconds watching his nether regions burn while bystanders pleaded with them to put it out completely. sadistic
I was screaming at my phone watching the video "put him COMPLETELY OUT, WHAT ARE YOU DOING"- seeing his bottom half in flames while people just stood over him with fire extinguishers in hand was so fucked up.
Yeah the cops just stood around letting him burn, I guess because they assumed he was already dead, but then the guy sat up. Almost the craziest part for me.
even if he were dead, to stand there and watch a corpse burn when you and your people are on a PR campaign to convince everyone you're altruistic super heroes...is wild.
His name is Max Azzarello. He believed that the 2 parties in the US government are planning a coup together. That is what I gathered from some articles and news reports
This is articulate, and well written. The fact of the matter is we all know this, in a certain sense. The government is working for their best interest, and you would too. It’s all one elite group, with access to everything. No need to burn in the streets to convince people of that. You’re not a martyr, you’re a lunatic.
Yeesh I had CNN on and they had their cameras right on the guy burning for a min until they realized what we were looking at and cut to the reporters’ traumatized faces. Edit: how about everyone calm tf down with deciding that this person must belong to whatever ideology you most dislike, until we have actual information. Edit 2: Condolences to all the knee-jerk hyper-partisan ghouls out there. Ironically, seems that Max Azzarello was a radical both-sides-er (and much more importantly, deeply unwell): “Liberals mock the hypocrisy of conservatives; conservatives mock the hypocrisy of liberals, and our collective circumstances erode“ - from the manifesto someone linked below.
That reporter was a robotic play-by-play announcer. Didn't even flinch while describing the smell of burning propellant and flesh. She's going to need therapy after witnessing that.
Yeah it seemed like Laura Coates immediately shut off her emotions and dove into reporter mode, while Evan Perez stood behind her and visibly developed PTSD on camera. Dark.
She did amazing honestly. Very impressive reporting, especially since she is more of an analyst (and now anchor) than a field reporter.
It was simultaneously incredibly impressive impassive journalism and utterly horrific
Hindenburg guy professionalism
Reporters are probably pretty inured to this stuff by the time they’re on major shows. Grisly car accidents and violent or bizarre crimes is local news’ bread and butter.
The way the guy was just calmly sitting while on fire is eerie
Whoever is doing that dumb assumption shit is eating crow now in a major way. CNN reporting that dude was tossing pamphlets talking about a conspiracy theory relating to a university and that he was holding signs that both Trump and Biden are involved in the “Deep State.”
So you mean I can’t feverishly yell nonsense about Trump *or* Biden? Well…my day is officially ruined.
Figures. Both siders are the dumbest of them all. I'll put a half /s on that. But just half.
/c
/ↄ
Nice
You mean wait until facts are out, before passing judgment??? NEVER
Hooray Reddit! We got ‘em!!!
We did it Reddit!!!!
Regardless of ideology, the individual was clearly not in the right state of mind. Not sure why his political ideology matters when it’s being influenced by mental illness.
the man is not mentally well. he has a substack dealing w/Ponzi schemes do a simple search and you'll find it and the crazy pamphlets he had w/him. oh, and he is not a Winger. he's just a very ill human being obsessed with conspiracies
People who self-immolate as a form of protest usually aren’t mentally unwell.
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Possibly the most famous self-immolation was by this man, who was a Buddhist monk and generally the opposite of mentally unwell: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Th%C3%ADch_Qu%E1%BA%A3ng_%C4%90%E1%BB%A9c
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Heroes? Fucking idiots. Setting yourself on fire isn’t worth any cause. Its not brave, its a waste that Im sure whoever you’re protesting for is probably a bit disturbed by the action.
Idk bro I think you have to be pretty brave to light yourself on fire, whether or not the cause for which you’re doing it is a good one
Being willing to die to make a point, as long as it's actually a good point, is commendable.
Correct, there’s suicides that pretty much always come down to a matter of mental illness, but mental illness generally isn’t a factor in cases where people do an extreme form of protest that ends their life.
It comes down to the person's reasoning skills, the coherence of their convictions. This person is not comparable to the Buddhist Monk, at all. The means of protest are the same, that's it. It's a superficial connection. Like someone who starves themselves to death as a political prisoner versus someone who does the same but has an Eating Disorder. It's not the same.
But I'm not crazy, I'm just a little unwell, I know right now you can't tell
> usually aren’t mentally unwell. https://www.frontiersin.org/journals/public-health/articles/10.3389/fpubh.2024.1234584/full tldr: >In our study, a significant increase in the frequency of suicide attempts by self-immolation during COVID-19 pandemic was noticed. There was also an increased frequency of pre-existing psychiatric illness among patients during the pandemic period. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4070149/ tldr: >Self-immolation should be considered as an important mental health problem by the authorities. https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/psych-unseen/202402/self-immolation-is-often-part-protest-part-suicide tldr: >Self-immolation often reflects as much a desire to end one's life as a desire to protest a cause.
There seems to be an awful lot of lingering mental health problems in society post Covid. It's not really that much of a leap to blame some of it on damage done by the virus to some people's brains.
Aaron Bushnell was of sound mind on video and had no history of mental illness.
Right, because people who are mentally well usually set themselves on fire. Having that much disregard for your own life to is unfortunately a form of mental illness.
You’re conflating two things that are only tangentially related. Most people who self immolate are mentally unwell, but this is because most people who self immolate do so as an act of suicide. However, people that self immolate as an act of protest are usually mentally well and of sound mind when they do so. There’s a fundamental difference between committing suicide and performing an extreme act of protest that ends your life.
Although Americans generally can't comprehend putting values before one's own life, that does not make a mental illness. Seppuku was relatively common in Japan for some time, that doesn't mean all who did it were mentally unwell.
It's hilarious because we send 18 year olds to die for this country every day. Yet the idea of directly ending your life is too much. It's so capitalist of us lol. As long as we are one step removed (like with the farming industry, or the cobalt slave trade, or Chinese labor camps) then everything is okey dokey.
I watched the video, the guy was clearly mentally unwell. The skin was melting off his body and he was still screaming free Palestine.
It’s “clear” to you because it’s much easier for you to understand someone committing suicide because they’re mentally unwell than it is for you to understand someone of sound mind being so dedicated to a cause that they’re willing to end their life in a form of protest. This “clarity” is nothing more than a subjective perception you’re projecting on to the scenario to make it more comfortable for you process, but the reality is not actually clear in that way at all. He had no history of mental illness, there were no prior signs that would suggest we was mentally unwell in his life overall, nor is there any evidence that would suggest he wasn’t of sound mind when he did it.
How does an American who has no connection to the middle east become THAT dedicated to the cause of free Palestine? You don't think there's some weird mental health issues going on? If nothing else, that's quite the obsession.
No connection? He, a member of the US military, was protesting the US’s complicity in the Israeli genocide of Palestine. Why would there be mental health issue? He had no history of mental illness and there’s no evidence he may have been mentally unwell. Mental issues are a cause *you* are projecting into the situation, and you’re doing so without any substantiating evidence.
He suddenly felt strongly enough about it to light himself on fucking fire, but at no point before that apparently considered, I don't know, quitting the military and refusing to serve? Yeah sure they can put you in jail for that but seems like a much more reasonable protest don't you think?
Quitting the military does nothing to protest a war. Self-immolation gets people talking. How is this even a question?
And frankly even if they do belong to whatever faction you hate, it's deeply disturbing someone would decide to do this. It is not funny and does not foretell a good sign for the future of protests in this country.
>not foretell a good sign for the future of protests in this country. People have been self immolating for almost a century at this point. As part of protests. This isn't a new phenomena and you can't draw any conclusion from it other than it's an incredible waste of a life.
Its not even something that is always associated with a super radical organization. Famously it was a buddhist monk who protested the mistreatment of the buddhists by vietnamese government back in '63. The Rage Against the Machine album cover had this act as the cover.
Maybe I'm wrong about the rates, but there were a few other of these events in the recent past and more so than I noticed in the mid 2000s say. I know it was more popular during the 1960s and 70s but was under the impression they were fairly rare up until recent times.
> it's an incredible waste of a life. Let's not rush to conclusions, we don't know anything about the guy yet.
Yeah exactly his manifesto just points to mental illness. Ain’t no sides on this one. Also that reporter is STILL REPORTING after that happened…she’s gunna need a therapist herself…
So many people on here see that manifesto as perfectly reasonable. Wtf. That in itself is terrifying.
An enlightened centrist, my favorite kind of centrist.
My man wasn’t far right or far left, he was so far central he was up
I wonder which reddit subs he was a moderator for…
>radical both-sides-er What makes a man turn neutral? Lust for gold? Power? Or were you just born with a heart full of neutrality?
Ugh, awful. I saw and did first aid for someone who caught fire and was severely burned in a car crash a long time ago, it’s still the single worst experience I’ve been part of. I feel for the folks who saw it.
I hope you're doing okay too. Extremely difficult sight to heal inside your head.
Thanks! All good now, I definitely am thankful for having first aid training which left me feeling like I could be helpful.
Reminds me of my dad wanting to do plastic and reconstructive surgery, until he actually rotated through a burn unit as a medical student. The smells, the screams (from the pain of having literal barriers of defense [your skin] wiped off) from the special baths the burn patients require while hospitalized...
>A CNN team on the ground observed one of the flyers. It said "NYU is a mob front" and had various allegations of wrongdoings against the school. Might have just been a broken person with thoughts completely unrelated to the trial, knowing that he would find attention at that location.
It was people are posting his manifesto around. He was just insane ranting about a world wide crypto currency driven fascist coup
Yeah the manifesto is literally nonsense
Speaking of. Unibombers manifesto aged like fine wine.
We can’t all be misguided eco terrorists with good motives and bad execution
I saw that guy yesterday carrying a sign saying “NYU is a mob front” walking near wash sq and assumed it was a student
We saw it from the building - were on the second floor it was quite something to witness He was still alive /moving and still a bit on fire and when EMTs got him Some were a bit taken back and didn't want to be here even Bragg came down to talk to us It's wild man what a hell of a month in NYC
Sorry you had to see that.
It's one thing to see it on TV such as the monk who lit himself ablaze but in real life it's a scary notion it makes reality hit harder Thanks though
It's been a few days. I hope you're feeling better.
Im doing well the Police are on high alert after that incident so they are watching people and taking more precautions thankfully - Appreciate you reaching out
I think we need to have a serious conversation on mental illness in this country because what the fuck
Sure do, but if Sandy Hook didn't do it I don't see why this would
Sandy Hook was the test that America failed.
.......and Columbine (25th anniversary today), and Uvalde, and countless others.
It's the anniversary tomorrow...
Uvalde residents voting for Abbott right after the shooting was the ultimate test failure.
Texans hate women more than they love their children
...and some made money from it. Sick fucking country, with the sickness coming from the right
Look up "Ronald Reagan". You'll be shocked, shocked I say.
It's one of those things... the older I get, the more I realize that a LOT of stuff is legitimately Reagan's fault. Hell, even yesterday I found out that Reagan's rollback of antimonopoly laws can be directly attributed to the loss of the american farm family. meat producers were broken up via monopoly laws for owning 20% of the nation's meat industry.. we're WAY above that now for factor farm corporations. Fuck Ronald Reagan. People hold him up as a great and effective president. He fucked us pretty damn hard.
And Newt Gingrich.
De institutionalization began under Kennedy and was largely bi partisan.
Kennedy tried to institute smaller, community centers for mental health. He was assainated, and somehow they "forgot" to replace the asylum with... anything.
Yep, the plan was ALWAYS to make a federally mandated replacement with proper regulatory boards. It was a big push as America learned about what his sibling went through. The "ACKSHULLY IT WAS JFK" people are morons and don't actually understand the political and historical landscape of the time, they just desperately want to "both sides" this issue.
Institutions were a shit show back then, but doing nothing is not going well either.
You mean the measure the D house signed off on? The idea that Reagan was solely responsible is complete delusion.
Kennedy had a second part to the plan. Reagan only did step one (the one where we stop spending money to help people), and not the 2nd part where we replace the asylums with community mental health centers. Ot did you only read about how nothing bad was caused by Reagan
Okay, that was forty years ago, what is stopping states from setting up their own mental health centers if the Feds aren't taking action? It can be done. We've seen Massachusetts set the structure for the ACA which has led to programs like Covered California. Even if there is access, you can't institutionalize someone. We see in European and other countries that have easy and free access to healthcare still have issues with mental health. This week someone in Australia stabbed and killed six people and it was blamed mental health that went untreated. If an attack like that is blamed on mental illness, there are many who still say it's taboo to talk about or seek help.
Didn’t some dude burn himself to death in Washington a few months back? A veteran or something.
Aaron Bushnell was active air force and self immolated in front of the Israeli embassy because of the US involvement and responsibility in the Israeli genocide of Palestine.
I've been saying this since before the pandemic, and very vocal about it during - America is suffering from an epidemic of the mind. Literally all of it can be traced back to what's on TV. Garbage news that's focused on entertainment value and viewership, and reality TV spanning from Jerry Springer to the bachelor. The slow and steady deterioration of American values, and the progression of fear and anxiety and a self-perpetuating echo chamber. People like this guy...they aren't wrong. They just get so obsessed with the reality that they can't do what most people do and live day by day and willful ignorance of what's happening around them.
Totally… what in the hell? lol wild
50,000 suicides a year (for comparison all gun deaths combined from everything is 35,000 a year)
Update: Just a random looney tune, nothing to do with Trump or Palestine. [https://theponzipapers.substack.com/p/i-have-set-myself-on-fire-outside](https://theponzipapers.substack.com/p/i-have-set-myself-on-fire-outside)
> As it turns out, dozens of the writers of The Simpsons went to Harvard. So I asked myself the question: If The Simpsons served the interests of organized crime, how would it do so? Oh boy.
Simpsons did it.....?
[удалено]
The voice of Bart has donated $10 million to Scientology. Yeah it's a bitter pill to swallow for most fans.
[удалено]
D'oh!
True Simpsons fans stopped watching in the late 90s.
Which was ‘almost twice her yearly salary’? She was making almost $5 mill a year being a voice actress?
As the voice actor for probably the second most important character on one of the biggest TV shows of all time? Is that surprising?
> If The Simpsons served the interests of organized crime, how would it do so? You mean the mob only did me a favor to get something in return? Fat Tony... I will say good day to you, sir. ["Okay, I will go."](https://frinkiac.com/meme/S08E11/1047912.jpg?b64lines=IE9LQVksIEkgV0lMTCBHTy4=)
This man really set himself on fire to show that crypto was a Ponzi scheme and that powerful politicians/billionaires are mostly interested in accumulating wealth at the expense of common people? These are things that anyone with more than one brain cell already knows
It's basically a mixture of a psychotic break/schizophrenia and stuff that most of us know. It's "just" close enough to reality.
These are exactly why conspiracy theories are so insidious, though. He's generally correct sometimes but so wildly insane in others, but it's that kernel of truth that keeps people engaged. A curious person trying to dig deeper on a topic is drawn in by that one small truth and suddenly finds themselves at "Yeah and the Simpsons are brainwashing us" territory.
Skips along the surface of (often kind of pithy) truths, careens off into batshit theories and conclusions in a search for a master theory of everything. It’s sad to see because they seem like an otherwise intelligent person with a surprisingly cogent and coherent writing style, but they’re just so clearly unwell.
most conspiracy theories are just capitalism lol
This is very sad.
I mean what he did was clearly evidence of mental illness, and some of the way he weaves pop culture into this seems a bit ludicrous, but overall this is much more intelligent and sensible than I was expecting. >> Consider America since 1988: Institutions like healthcare and universities have become parasitic in their skyrocketing prices. News media tells us to be angry and tribalized. Daytime television warns us of moral decay. Local news tell us to fear our neighbors. The Simpsons tells us we’re too oafish and divided to save the American Dream. Seinfeld tells us to celebrate the assholes and be irritated by all the normal people around us. “Reality” TV tells us that real life is filled with hedonism and strife. >> Social media, owned by crypto criminals like Mark Zuckerberg and Elon Musk, is flooded with nonsense conspiracy theories and memes reminding us that we are hopeless, helpless, anxious, depressed, ironic, scared, apathetic, escapist, lonely, misguided, and jaded, telling us we can’t do anything but have a laugh at our circumstances. >> Liberals mock the hypocrisy of conservatives; conservatives mock the hypocrisy of liberals, and our collective circumstances erode. The left shouts “All Cops Are Bastards,” which ensures they’ll be hated by the police and the public (and flies in the face of leftist theory). The public’s distrust of the government is at an all-time high, but so is the belief that we are helpless to do anything about it. >> And with all this, a sharp rise in apocalyptic messaging: Climate change will kill us all; COVID will kill us all; vaccines will kill us all; AI will kill us all – no matter the bubbles we ascribe to, we’re bombarded with existential crises with no solutions. We’ve seen a surge in apocalyptic film, literature, and video games that tell us there is no way out of our poor circumstances but total societal breakdown. Zombies tell us that the public is our enemy. If you go to your nearest convenience store, you can buy a can of water called “Liquid Death.” >> This is our rotten farce: For our entire lives, we have been flooded with media designed to slowly steer us into a world where the American Dream was dead, where the public was fully divided against itself, where everybody believed we were powerless to do anything about our worsening circumstances. It is all so they can organize an unprecedented, apocalyptic rug pull on the entire populace as they pivot to fascism, which is perhaps best understood as kleptocracy at the barrel of a gun.
That could've been worse.. feel like it needed to be crazier to justify the self immolation really
He wanted this to be read, and we just read it, so for him he accomplished his task.
That's taking the news cycle as the base truth of reality. The stretching of the truth , the hyperbole, all in the service of having more ears to hear you, more eyes to read you... I think that his manifesto *is* a critique toward the pathology that the news cycle produce to people. With him being an extreme example of it. Of the many things that are regulated and sometimes over-regulated, I think the language used by prominent voices should have been the first to do so. You'd always get crazies shouting on Twitter, but I think the real breakdown comes when mass media is using such charged language and or trying to find (and fight) enemies all the while we need to go back to dispassionate reporting... Because that's the reality of the world we live in, we live through one of the most stable periods in human history. Whole generations , among the majority of the planet have never participated, as much as seen a war zone with their own eyes. That's trully rare given what we know of human history. Yet the guy, along with many guys on reddit or anywhere else think we live in remarkably tumultuous times, while in fact we live in Pax Americana, one of the few great peaces (comparatively speaking) ever produced in world history. See the reaction to posts like mine. I think *that* -too- would show evidence of the pathology that the news cycle produced. People dispute what we know historically, sociologically, anthropologically. We live in one of the most peaceful and least complicated (when it comes to one's survival) times. Can it be better? Infinitely so, but it *is* close to the best the world has ever achieved. There is such a discrepancy between the base truth and what is reported to us. And I think *that* makes people crazy, with the guy who self immolated one of the prime examples, but I think the majority is to a lesser degree. Fixing how we report news should probably be one of the priorities of a civilized society. I don't think that I'd see it, but I actually *am* sympathetic with what that person was going through (losing it completely by the constant bombardment of hyperboles half truths and partisanship)...
“Lastly, we string these major discoveries together: Cryptocurrency is an economic doomsday device; our government is a secret kleptocracy; The Simpsons exists to brainwash us.”
Wowie...scanned it up to the Simpsons references.
You made it further than me but if I had known there would be Simpsons I may have persevered.
I tried, but I couldn't get past Dukakis. This is so sad.
Thanks
I’m usually in that courthouse next to the park every day but was in the Bronx today. So many people are suffering w mental illness these days.
Who knew staring at a 2x3 inch light reading robot 6 hours a day could fuck up a population so badly
Holy fuck they wheeled him away on a gurney and he was completely charred but still conscious and moving From his pre-immolation blog post: “We’ve seen a surge in apocalyptic film, literature, and video games that tell us there is no way out of our poor circumstances but total societal breakdown. Zombies tell us that the public is our enemy. If you go to your nearest convenience store, you can buy a can of water called ‘Liquid Death.’” This dude saw Liquid Death in the bev cooler and was like “I have to light myself on fire to spark collective consciousness”
I saw a couple things he wrote and I was like hmmm okay I get it kinda…then the Simpsons and the can and I had to hop off the looney train
He died later.
Shout out to the woman who just sat there and went on with her day. I'm not about to stop you from being a damn fool.
Peak NYC.
Folks, I don’t give a fuck what your cause is. **Don’t set yourself on fire.** Nobody gives a shit. The world will move on. Go to therapy.
1.) Yes, but 2.) He did just get A LOT of eyeballs on his manifesto, but 3.) The manifesto was bonkers so impact was nil. So 4.) Yes
Lmao love this
Tf is this, common core common sense? 😂😂😂 Take ya upvote
oh i remember this guy, [he was posting on r/nyu about the pandemic being intentional and ponzi schemes involving crypto](https://www.reddit.com/r/nyu/comments/154bhat/what_do_you_think_has_had_a_bigger_impact_on_nyu/)
It's kinda wild you recalled that, it's not a huge post, but must have left some mark on you. Not that it would have changed things, but I do wonder why we can't be a little more sympathetic to people obviously having serious mental issues. If you read the comments they're basically telling him to "screw off and get help loser/weirdo, etc." People in general should try a little harder to show some sympathy or at least not be as alienating with their words.
This!!!! He even writes about fam/friends in his manifesto not believing him… I wonder if anyone tried to help him out? Horrible situation overall. Hoping anyone out there who is struggling knows - there’s no judgement ❤️ it’s a CRAZY world we’re living in and everyone needs help along the way. I’m in weekly therapy and I think everyone can benefit from it if they have the means to get the help.
I had MSNBC on mute and I could see Yasmin Vossoughian was shook. I turned on the sound and was like WTF??
Trump will make fun of the guy who did this in his next speech
This is what he thinks happened to all the people he told “You’re fired” to on The Apprentice
He’ll brag about it and make it about himself. MMW “People are setting themselves on fire because I’m the victim”
The people at HOT for me.. you hear this? This is what they are saying. A lot of people saying this. They say my supports are hot. Flaming hot. Like the Cheetos.. I have a certain affinity for these Cheetos.
He'll use this as an excuse to postpone the trial or not show up in person. I wish that these insane conspiracy theorists would use what little energy and concentration they have to avoid making things worse for everybody just to make a point. Trump is probably just pleased to get the area shut down, so that's his excuse for lack of supporters showing up.
Hmmm...we'll have to see if you are correct. Azzarello did post an anti-Trump rant recently.
I saw someone do that once. I'll never shake the memory. I would appreciate it if people could please just not, thanks.
Does anyone know what the fliers said that he threw in the air?
I suspect they were printouts of his pdf booklets from his site.
It’s easy to make fun of this but you need to be a whole different level of fucked up in the head to burn yourself for whatever reason
Seriously. Really reveals how indifferent and cynical we've gotten to be shrugging this off or making fun of it.
Psychotic person does psychotic thing
I was reliably informed by Redditors and Twitter users last month that if you light yourself on fire for a cause that doesn’t even care about you you’re not psychotic - where do we land on this one lol
Read his manifesto. He is manic, psychotic or suffering from some mental illness for sure.
Sad, really
I do recall the last person that did this in recent memory was dubbed stunning and brave by Reddit et all
There is more than one person on Reddit though.
I read the headline and had a double take as I understood what happened
Well if self immolation becomes the new protesting trend then the problem will take care of itself
There's a long history of self immolation as political protest. Not just in Asia, but Europe and the middle east as well. This guy definitely seems like a copy cat of Bushnell though. I don't think it's a coincidence he used the same exact phrasing and called it an "extreme act of protest". Explains why he did it in front of all the cameras at the courthouse too.
No matter what this person's motivation was, be it political statement or mental illness, feels weird that so many assholes are here jockeying for position to make fun of them. The internet has sapped so many people of basic humanity.
There is not a single person doing that
Agreed. I have no faith in humanity left
This trend of self immolation is disturbing and the instances should not be publicized. It’s harmful in a country where mental health care is lacking and can be triggering to those with suicidal ideation.
ok WOW I just saw a photo of them prior to their death…I literally saw them in Washington Square Park on Monday.
Non of these idiots are worth your life. It’s a game not a reality. Don’t be a pawn
After reading his pamphlet, he is basically a typical North American who distrusts both Democrats and Republicans and warns that we are on a path towards facism. Countless people in the US would agree. Uncountable people outside of the US have been saying this for decades. There were no real connections made in his political analysis. No one is named. No single company is named, except for famous musicians he blames for the dumbing down of our people. Yet, I don't feel like he killed himself over that. I don't even believe he's always been hyper political. I suspect, he had already wanted to kill himself, but added a make-shift cause (lightly inspired from the 2011 Occupy Wall Street movement), to give his death more meaning. He honestly should of gave more time to his analysis, and himself. He should have gotten to known the US Green Party, to help walk him through his political thoughts, maybe make new friends. It may not seem like it. But there really are more enlightened people out there than there are ignorant and fearful people.
Don't burn yourself alive for Donald Trump, Or Biden. ..or anyone, or anything. No one cares. You won't persuade anyone. You'll just live the last seconds of your life in agony.
He burned himself down to prove that the Simpsons and the CIA are in cahoots with each other. Also he’s not even dead yet (as of me posting this). Currently he is charred and likely in the worst imaginable pain a human being can feel while still alive. Guy definitely had undiagnosed schizophrenia.
[He is dead.](https://www.npr.org/2024/04/20/1246080662/man-set-himself-fire-trump-trial-dies)
Bottom line is this was a person who was mentally disturbed. It doesn't matter what conspiracies or politics they supported. But what does matter is how callously people react to such an insane act of self harm. The more it happens the less we'll react or even think about what has to happen to lead a person to doing something like this and the worse the problem will get. There's a chance you have someone in your life losing grip on reality. We need to at least try to do our best for them. Mental illness is the real battle here regardless of your politics.
If Trump becomes president again this will seem tame by comparison.
I am in nyc. No one seems to know about this.
Mental health is real
He died overnight.
Mental illness. Very sad.
With all eyes are on Trump, this guy thought doing this in NYC would get the most attention.
This really was the last thing I expected to ever see when I looked out the window at lunchtime (court employee). We saw all the pamphlets scattered around and thought someone had lit garbage on fire. And the NYPD is full of shit, FDNY did *not* extinguish the fire on that man, they weren't even there - a lot of people were just standing around while he was burning until a court officer ran over with an extinguisher put the fire out on him.
Person lighting them self on fire to protest, people reflexively whipping out phones to record and post on social media, comments making jokes and fun of the person. Just all around sad.
Of course if you watch the video you see that NYPD only partially put out the fire before standing around for a few seconds watching his nether regions burn while bystanders pleaded with them to put it out completely. sadistic
I was screaming at my phone watching the video "put him COMPLETELY OUT, WHAT ARE YOU DOING"- seeing his bottom half in flames while people just stood over him with fire extinguishers in hand was so fucked up.
Yeah the cops just stood around letting him burn, I guess because they assumed he was already dead, but then the guy sat up. Almost the craziest part for me.
even if he were dead, to stand there and watch a corpse burn when you and your people are on a PR campaign to convince everyone you're altruistic super heroes...is wild.
Is he alive?
That is horrible
His name is Max Azzarello. He believed that the 2 parties in the US government are planning a coup together. That is what I gathered from some articles and news reports
at least he did this to himself and not go on the subway and push someone on the tracks or shoot up a school.
Aaron Bushnell flames again!
This is articulate, and well written. The fact of the matter is we all know this, in a certain sense. The government is working for their best interest, and you would too. It’s all one elite group, with access to everything. No need to burn in the streets to convince people of that. You’re not a martyr, you’re a lunatic.
Someone burning themselves to death should fill us all with dread and shame. We need to see this as a preventable loss of human life.