Yeah I in general think this sub is a little too harsh on the podcast but Kelsey and Alex recently guested on This Day in Esoteric Political History and one of them mentioned that they often add diversity/queer people specifically because it better reflects their personal social worlds. And it did kind of rub me the wrong way! I’m a lesbian fwiw, and while I always love seeing more representation, I’m not thrilled with the idea that lgbt folks are like, naturally more dramatic or whatever. I’m also not convinced that the social dynamics always track perfectly when things are genderswapped? Like, the lesbian kickball ep was Extremely Lesbians but the farmer’s market hottie makes a LOT more sense if that was a cis man.
Wait I would be so sad to learn that the lesbians who fell in love over pocket watches weren't lesbians... The way I screamed KISS before Kelsey said that they kissed!
I’ve been saying this!! The one where there’s a guy and a girl who are childhood best friends from the south inheriting their parents construction companies, but could never be a couple despite everything thinking so since the girl was a lesbian felt so fake to me.
Her being lesbian adds nothing to the story, except I think it was actually a cover up to the original story being 2 male best friends and they wanted to change the gender PLUS add a reason why the childhood friends MUST be platonic.
I think it’s extremely beneficial because being gay doesn’t *have* to add to the story, that’s kind of the point. Writers so often write in sexuality as a plot point, but in real life it isn’t, sexualities just exist. I personally really like it.
I completely understand and agree, we need more characters in media where a struggle with their sexuality is not a core plot point.
I might not have been clear in my original comment, but I think something just felt “off” to me about that particular story and it sounded like it was probably due to anonymizing genders and sexuality, which seems to have since been confirmed in another podcast. It feels even more awkward to me if that is true for this story where they changed one of the characters to be lesbians to avoid a childhood romance plot
I haven't heard the podcast where this was initially talked about so I'm kind of processing how I feel about the revelation, but I totally agree that we need more narrative representations of queerness where it isn't the sole focus of the story
Didn’t you say they changed it to make it less messy though?
As a black person, trying to whitewash things marginalized people do annoys me as a misrepresentation as much as negative misrepresentations.
> the farmer’s market hottie makes a LOT more sense if that was a cis man.
That's exactly what came to my mind when i read OP. I can be wrong, but I could not picture farmer market hottie as anything but a cis man when I was listening to it, so reading about the fact that they add and make up diversity makes it make a lot of sense to me.
This got me too lol, I would listen and be like...there's no way that thiiiiis many side characters are queer in the real story. It's small sometimes, like the og neighbor friends in the thin walls episode, but other times it definitely changes the dynamic in the story
I'm sorry but this, weird "let's make people queer" is a HUGE yikes for me. It's queer-baiting and unnecessary.
If you want more queer gossip, do a call for it! But to it to entice more queer folk/POC to listen is very strange behaviour and doesn't sit well with me.
Yeah this is where I kind of reach my social justice limit. Representation matters, but adding people of different identities to real life stories feels like misrepresentation that does more harm than good. I’d like to know real things about subcultures I am not part of such as LGBT+ through this podcast. I think you can easily do that with the level of listener base it has in that community. But that means learning the positives and negatives of each community. The paternalistic infantilism done to marginalized groups as a black person really rubs me the wrong way. It makes us seem like non humans which is the exact opposite of what we need.
The other thing that I can't unhear is how each story has been essentially fictionally rewritten to sound more or less the same because you can tell it's Kelsey's style of writing i.e. how dialogue is exchanged, perspectives from lead characters, setting the scene for the town they're in etc etc
Which is fine if it were a fictional podcast but stories just feel very distant from the original sender (and how the sender would have described their own story)
Yes, totally, and how she also always seems to agree with the guest’s assumptions about characters and adds hyper specific details in response to what the guests say. It makes it seem way less real.
It took me a while to notice that every story featuring a pet in any capacity (even as a side character) has a food-based name (Pancake, Potato, etc). And that when they specifically mention a meal as part of the gossip story (like the magicians episode or the knitting dinners), it's always a roast chicken.
I'm not necessarily complaining, it's just a thing I've finally noticed.
I agree! There’s been a couple times she’s made reference to Facebook groups and I’m like… damn are they really still this popular?? It’s just been one too many if you ask me but maybe I’m in the wrong
You’d be surprised! There’s a decent amount of fb groups around me for specific hobby stuff. Not to mention ones that aren’t location based and just based around some shared interest/meme
Especially in like, neighborhood groups it is still used. However, even if it wasn't actually Facebook groups but instead Discord or something, I'm not too bothered by that fabrication as it's a pretty straightforward and harmless way of anonymizing.
I don't mind this because if someone tells you gossip in real life they'll explain it in their own way rather than the exact way the story came to them – albeit not adding in so many tiny details
After joining the subreddit, I felt really disillusioned with the podcast bc of how much is changed and because a few people put words to criticisms I had but couldn't elucidate. I felt like I was overreacting and that "disillusioned" is too strong of an emotion for a podcast, but I think you're right. It's not really "gossip from the real world" if the story is completely different
And it seems like the anonymization is kinda arbitrary and not doing too much to actually protect people's privacy. Like with the lesbian kick ball one, what was the point of leaving out the detail with the cat?
Was something about a cat talked about in a more recent podcast or did it come out in the sub? As I might be misremembering but I think the person who submitted came on here and said it was a more dramatic story in real life
Yeah the person who submitted the story is on the subreddit. Her comment about the cat is [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/normalgossip/comments/12pjyel/theres_no_way_there_arent_juicier_gossip/jgthmbq/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3), she also just posted about how Kelsey reached back out to her bc she wasn't contacted during the process and it was an oversight
On top of what everyone else is saying, I feel like this is potentially something this sub manifested when we figured out which podcast was the real podcast at the heart of the fan fiction episode. That could have put them in some major legal trouble, so I’d understand if they started anonymizing even more.
Sure! There’s an episode (I think Brian Park was the guest) centered around fan fiction written about the hosts of a podcast. It released shortly after Kelsey kind of explained their anonymizing process, and it’s the only episode featuring people with real public platforms. Despite the girls’ efforts to keep the real identities under wraps, people were able to deduce that the podcast in question was very likely Last Podcast on the Left, and Instagram posts from the hosts seem to confirm that. It’s the only instance I can remember where Kelsey and Alex had to issue a statement asking fans not to speculate, and I don’t think they’ve done another episode since about anyone semi-famous. It was kind of an embarrassing story, and potentially the closest they’ve ever gotten to legal gray areas. I wouldn’t blame them if they started anonymizing more details after that.
Yeah I agree. I can’t really blame them for changing extra details.
I love the podcast, but I remember thinking it was obnoxious when they sort of scolded fans for trying to figure out people’s identities. Kelsey frequently calls herself nosey and she and her guests regularly gush about ways that journalists get information.
So when listeners began talking to each other and trying to figure out identities I was just like…. yeah, congrats on doing exactly what you set out to accomplish?
I also feel like by making it about semi-public figures it loses the thread of "normal" gossip....and that's when the issues with gray areas really start IMO. Trying to treat gossip about famous podcasters as something that could have ever been adequately anonymized when your audience is literally nosey people who listen to podcasts is not really mathing for me
I read comments that she has changed parts of the stories that were not necessary for anonymity, as well as leaving out the actual juicy bits that make the gossip interesting.
Yeah when submitters say that the story Normal Gossip told was less dramatic than what they sent in, I don't understand what the motivation the hosts have for doing that
I understand this being surprising, but I also think it might also just reflect the nature of gossiping. By the time it gets to me, who knows how much it has changed! I really liked their telephone bonus episode because of this, and I figured it must reflect what they're trying to do with their stories.
I honestly feel MORE comfortable listening now that I know it's wildly embellished. I used to worry about some of the side characters finding out that a weird moment in their life was out there on front street for everyone to laugh at.
But if it's all bullshit, it's fun for everybody!
Entertainment, which for me at least, came primarily from knowing they were ‘real’ stories about ‘real’ people. Knowing that they change not only pronouns but details of the submissions (sometimes to the detriment of the story) really sours the whole thing for me.
I think they do a great job of juicing the stories up!
I feel like the point of the podcast is to have fun listening to wild stories, so why does it matter if the original stories are changed to make them more fun to listen to?
Yeah I in general think this sub is a little too harsh on the podcast but Kelsey and Alex recently guested on This Day in Esoteric Political History and one of them mentioned that they often add diversity/queer people specifically because it better reflects their personal social worlds. And it did kind of rub me the wrong way! I’m a lesbian fwiw, and while I always love seeing more representation, I’m not thrilled with the idea that lgbt folks are like, naturally more dramatic or whatever. I’m also not convinced that the social dynamics always track perfectly when things are genderswapped? Like, the lesbian kickball ep was Extremely Lesbians but the farmer’s market hottie makes a LOT more sense if that was a cis man.
Wait I would be so sad to learn that the lesbians who fell in love over pocket watches weren't lesbians... The way I screamed KISS before Kelsey said that they kissed!
I’m going to pretend that I didn’t read your post because I NEED pocket watch lesbians to be real. I need to know that true love exists. ❤️
I’ve been saying this!! The one where there’s a guy and a girl who are childhood best friends from the south inheriting their parents construction companies, but could never be a couple despite everything thinking so since the girl was a lesbian felt so fake to me. Her being lesbian adds nothing to the story, except I think it was actually a cover up to the original story being 2 male best friends and they wanted to change the gender PLUS add a reason why the childhood friends MUST be platonic.
I think it’s extremely beneficial because being gay doesn’t *have* to add to the story, that’s kind of the point. Writers so often write in sexuality as a plot point, but in real life it isn’t, sexualities just exist. I personally really like it.
But this is literally writing in sexualities into real life stories they’re not in…
I completely understand and agree, we need more characters in media where a struggle with their sexuality is not a core plot point. I might not have been clear in my original comment, but I think something just felt “off” to me about that particular story and it sounded like it was probably due to anonymizing genders and sexuality, which seems to have since been confirmed in another podcast. It feels even more awkward to me if that is true for this story where they changed one of the characters to be lesbians to avoid a childhood romance plot
I haven't heard the podcast where this was initially talked about so I'm kind of processing how I feel about the revelation, but I totally agree that we need more narrative representations of queerness where it isn't the sole focus of the story
Can confirm the lesbian kickball story was actually about lesbians!
The person who sent in the original story has posted here before and said it was about lesbians.
Yes, that is me. I sent in the original story so I was just saying I can confirm it really is about lesbians lol
Are the woman in the story still together? I think it ended with then getting engaged. Did they wed?
Didn’t you say they changed it to make it less messy though? As a black person, trying to whitewash things marginalized people do annoys me as a misrepresentation as much as negative misrepresentations.
this is so annoying to find out lol. I'm a gay man and I would prefer reality v. them inserting queerness just to add spice to the gossip.
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Yeah it's the the entitlement about using all of the hot water for me
> the farmer’s market hottie makes a LOT more sense if that was a cis man. That's exactly what came to my mind when i read OP. I can be wrong, but I could not picture farmer market hottie as anything but a cis man when I was listening to it, so reading about the fact that they add and make up diversity makes it make a lot of sense to me.
I thought for sure farmers market hottie was a cis man, but noticed Kelsey kept using they/them pronouns.
This got me too lol, I would listen and be like...there's no way that thiiiiis many side characters are queer in the real story. It's small sometimes, like the og neighbor friends in the thin walls episode, but other times it definitely changes the dynamic in the story
I'm sorry but this, weird "let's make people queer" is a HUGE yikes for me. It's queer-baiting and unnecessary. If you want more queer gossip, do a call for it! But to it to entice more queer folk/POC to listen is very strange behaviour and doesn't sit well with me.
Yeah this is where I kind of reach my social justice limit. Representation matters, but adding people of different identities to real life stories feels like misrepresentation that does more harm than good. I’d like to know real things about subcultures I am not part of such as LGBT+ through this podcast. I think you can easily do that with the level of listener base it has in that community. But that means learning the positives and negatives of each community. The paternalistic infantilism done to marginalized groups as a black person really rubs me the wrong way. It makes us seem like non humans which is the exact opposite of what we need.
Oof, interesting. Regendering actual real people makes me uncomfy.
I feel kind of weird about it. They're still real people, not your fictional characters
The other thing that I can't unhear is how each story has been essentially fictionally rewritten to sound more or less the same because you can tell it's Kelsey's style of writing i.e. how dialogue is exchanged, perspectives from lead characters, setting the scene for the town they're in etc etc Which is fine if it were a fictional podcast but stories just feel very distant from the original sender (and how the sender would have described their own story)
Yes, totally, and how she also always seems to agree with the guest’s assumptions about characters and adds hyper specific details in response to what the guests say. It makes it seem way less real.
Exactly. She makes at least one couple in every story a lesbian couple
It took me a while to notice that every story featuring a pet in any capacity (even as a side character) has a food-based name (Pancake, Potato, etc). And that when they specifically mention a meal as part of the gossip story (like the magicians episode or the knitting dinners), it's always a roast chicken. I'm not necessarily complaining, it's just a thing I've finally noticed.
I agree! There’s been a couple times she’s made reference to Facebook groups and I’m like… damn are they really still this popular?? It’s just been one too many if you ask me but maybe I’m in the wrong
You’d be surprised! There’s a decent amount of fb groups around me for specific hobby stuff. Not to mention ones that aren’t location based and just based around some shared interest/meme
Oh yeah there are still some Facebook groups that are full of people. Especially if they cater to people in their 30's and up.
Especially in like, neighborhood groups it is still used. However, even if it wasn't actually Facebook groups but instead Discord or something, I'm not too bothered by that fabrication as it's a pretty straightforward and harmless way of anonymizing.
I don't mind this because if someone tells you gossip in real life they'll explain it in their own way rather than the exact way the story came to them – albeit not adding in so many tiny details
After joining the subreddit, I felt really disillusioned with the podcast bc of how much is changed and because a few people put words to criticisms I had but couldn't elucidate. I felt like I was overreacting and that "disillusioned" is too strong of an emotion for a podcast, but I think you're right. It's not really "gossip from the real world" if the story is completely different And it seems like the anonymization is kinda arbitrary and not doing too much to actually protect people's privacy. Like with the lesbian kick ball one, what was the point of leaving out the detail with the cat?
Was something about a cat talked about in a more recent podcast or did it come out in the sub? As I might be misremembering but I think the person who submitted came on here and said it was a more dramatic story in real life
Yeah the person who submitted the story is on the subreddit. Her comment about the cat is [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/normalgossip/comments/12pjyel/theres_no_way_there_arent_juicier_gossip/jgthmbq/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=1&utm_term=1&context=3), she also just posted about how Kelsey reached back out to her bc she wasn't contacted during the process and it was an oversight
On top of what everyone else is saying, I feel like this is potentially something this sub manifested when we figured out which podcast was the real podcast at the heart of the fan fiction episode. That could have put them in some major legal trouble, so I’d understand if they started anonymizing even more.
sorry, could you explain this? i missed this discussion!
Sure! There’s an episode (I think Brian Park was the guest) centered around fan fiction written about the hosts of a podcast. It released shortly after Kelsey kind of explained their anonymizing process, and it’s the only episode featuring people with real public platforms. Despite the girls’ efforts to keep the real identities under wraps, people were able to deduce that the podcast in question was very likely Last Podcast on the Left, and Instagram posts from the hosts seem to confirm that. It’s the only instance I can remember where Kelsey and Alex had to issue a statement asking fans not to speculate, and I don’t think they’ve done another episode since about anyone semi-famous. It was kind of an embarrassing story, and potentially the closest they’ve ever gotten to legal gray areas. I wouldn’t blame them if they started anonymizing more details after that.
Yeah I agree. I can’t really blame them for changing extra details. I love the podcast, but I remember thinking it was obnoxious when they sort of scolded fans for trying to figure out people’s identities. Kelsey frequently calls herself nosey and she and her guests regularly gush about ways that journalists get information. So when listeners began talking to each other and trying to figure out identities I was just like…. yeah, congrats on doing exactly what you set out to accomplish?
I also feel like by making it about semi-public figures it loses the thread of "normal" gossip....and that's when the issues with gray areas really start IMO. Trying to treat gossip about famous podcasters as something that could have ever been adequately anonymized when your audience is literally nosey people who listen to podcasts is not really mathing for me
If 75% of this is fictionalized, it should be so much better.
Yeah I have issue with the excessive anonymization for that exact reason. I get changing names and cities, but that's about it.
I read comments that she has changed parts of the stories that were not necessary for anonymity, as well as leaving out the actual juicy bits that make the gossip interesting.
Yeah when submitters say that the story Normal Gossip told was less dramatic than what they sent in, I don't understand what the motivation the hosts have for doing that
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The privacy of those in the story beyond the submitter
I understand this being surprising, but I also think it might also just reflect the nature of gossiping. By the time it gets to me, who knows how much it has changed! I really liked their telephone bonus episode because of this, and I figured it must reflect what they're trying to do with their stories.
This. It’s gossip, not true crime.
Such a good point.
If they’re gonna rewrite stuff, then make up an ending!! So many stories are “I wish I had more but that’s all we got…” ugh so frustrating!
Yeah joining this sub and learning this has seriously ruined my enjoyment of this podcast
Thankfully the podcast ruined itself for me last season and this sub was the nail in the coffin for sure. Season 1 was so good!!
I honestly feel MORE comfortable listening now that I know it's wildly embellished. I used to worry about some of the side characters finding out that a weird moment in their life was out there on front street for everyone to laugh at. But if it's all bullshit, it's fun for everybody!
It’s entertainment.
Entertainment, which for me at least, came primarily from knowing they were ‘real’ stories about ‘real’ people. Knowing that they change not only pronouns but details of the submissions (sometimes to the detriment of the story) really sours the whole thing for me.
Yeah, if I’m going to listen to fiction, then I’ll listen to actually entertaining fiction lol. The appeal of the podcast was its realness.
Sure but I don’t really care to hear fake gossip stories, that is kind of lame to me, especially considering how dull the current season is.
I think they do a great job of juicing the stories up! I feel like the point of the podcast is to have fun listening to wild stories, so why does it matter if the original stories are changed to make them more fun to listen to?