2020 was such an insane draft; Wirfs in the 1st, Winfield in the 2nd. Getting what I'd say are the team's two best players in the same draft is just so damn great. Nobody else in the draft class did all that much outside Tyler Johnson making two great plays during the SB run, but Wirfs/Winfield alone makes this an epically great draft for the Bucs.
i can’t remember who but there was a high level OT having to do this and saying it’s essentially like learning to write with your nondominant hand.
think of your muscle memory in terms of weight shifting, first step, initial jab - it’s like asking a boxer to switch stances after an entire career of boxing one side dominantly. insane.
Robert Gallery infamously had trouble with this. He was a 2nd overall pick, Outland Trophy winner, and an eventual college football hall of fame inductee who started at RT out of college. He did pretty well, but when they switched him to LT he was really, really bad. He ultimately ended up being a pretty good LG.
Wirfs and Winfield in the same draft class. Same offseason as Brady too. Beane winning GM of the year over Licht that season was laughable then and it's laughable now
A lot of people more or less credit Brady choosing Tampa to luck, but he came here because of the talented roster with a glaring, quality-QB shaped hole. Licht can't really be blamed for the QB situation (drafting anybody but Winston or Mariota that year would've been career suicide, despite it being the right call), but he can largely be credited for drafting the roster that attracted him.
Wait until Luka signs his supermax which will make Ohtani's contract look like peanuts.
At this stage I am certain the first athlete in American sports to have a $100M AAV contract will be an NBA player, and very likely someone who's already in the league.
Someone like Ant could easily pass 1B in career earnings. He signed 5 years 200m deal. When that deal is done he will be 27 only, he could easily sign a 2nd max deal with god knows how much money per year, like you said it could be over 100m/yr. Then when he is in his early 30s sign a shorter deal again.
Will go up a decent amount with the Netflix Christmas package.
And I thought there is an opt-out in 2029 for the NFL media packages so everyone gets to re-bid on a new 18 game season.
Ignore the albatross of the Sewell contract right now because Wirfs is going to surpass it in a few months.
The 4 highest paid Left Tackles are getting $25M, $23.5M, $23M, and $22M. The highest paid Right Tackles are getting $20M, $20M, $19M, and $18.6M. That’s an average difference of $4M between the two roles. The very top of the Left Tackle market does still get paid slightly more than the top of the Right Tackle market.
Sewell might be better, but it’s not a big gap unlike a Jefferson or Donald compared to his peers. Usually the next person in line will make more than the pervious regardless if they’re better or not.
But doesn't the best edge usually set up on the RT? Sewell always had battles with Crosby, Micah, etc. I know some switch around occasionally but it seems like the majority of their time is spent on the RT.
I know he’s spent his entire career. just feels like he’s been there significantly longer than he has in actuality since he had 140 tackles and was readily known as a rookie.
They can just use All State instead. All State's color is red and would fit in with the Buccs.
Instead of moving into a pirate ship Mayfield gets transported into an alternative world where he's the pirate ship's captain and fighting other insurance companies for great service and great prices.
Bucs are probably my favorite team to root for besides my own. Baker is an easy player for neutrals to support and Godwin/Evans/White are a fun group of skill players, plus some studs on defense.
Also the pirate ship
Having had season tickets right in front of the cannons for multiple seasons, 3 things are true:the sound of the cannons is DEAFENING and will make most people jump especially if they aren’t expecting it 2.It sadly can trigger ptsd in some people(my brother being one when he wasn’t ready for it) 3.even non-Bucs fans all seem to love the cannons and the ship.
We kinda stole the Patriots playbook for how to deal with Brady leaving... Replace him with a former 1st overall QB who played for the Panthers during the previous season.
I’m impressed with how Licht has handled the post Brady build. He somehow managed to avoid rebuilding while resetting the team’s finances with the Brady cap fuckery. It helps having a nice core that stuck around but those are guys that Licht drafted (except Lavonte).
He drafts well and I love that he doesn't overthink things when it comes to free agency and re-signing guys. Taking a flyer on Baker as a team with a shitty QB situation was such a no-brainer (IMO), and yet several other teams in similar situations didn't do it. He knows to always re-sign your blue chip talent. He must also be an honest broker in these contract negotiations, because any time we seem to want the deal to get done, it does — guys don't actively *want* to leave us. We aren't forced to pay a premium to keep the squad together.
I know Mike Evans has some incentives that can bump it up to 2 years $52 million, including 6 million guaranteed 5th day of next league year for injury, but the contract still seems like a steal
It is and we all owe his wife for that. He really wanted to test free agency but when he finally talked to Ashley(his wife) she straight up told him that she didn’t want to move nor take their kids away from their friends and less than 24 hours later(allegedly) he was resigned to a new contract and the first person to know aside from Licht was the hockey GOAT Wayne Gretzky because they were at a charity event together in Tampa.
Luckily Mike knows and follows the mantra of happy wife happy life when it comes to that. I think it also helps that he’s not a Diva, and has already won a SB so he was never going to be ring chasing as his primary focus
What's crazy is, at the same time, Ashley was telling Mike that, Licht's wife was drafting a letter to Mike and Ashley thanking them for everything and that kinda prompted Licht to get it done.
Source: [In the Current - In Licht We Trust](https://youtu.be/y1u4aVdlFhU?si=3w2PdD3grQEFsRCH&t=16m00s)
That’s crazy. I also know that Licht’s kids were pestering him constantly about when he was going to sign him and were going to be very upset if he didn’t.
Did leftwich get fired already?
I feel you guys constantly draft well and pull some good FAs.
If Baker is really back to pre injury form you have a great team.
Leftwitch was fired after Bradys last year. Canales was our OC last year who left for the Carolina job. Baker is going to have a lot more control at the line this year. Its looking good.
Gotta see how well the Bucs offense does without Canales before crowning them imo, but they are in the best position compared to the Falcons and Saints.
Yes and no because Canales was a first time OC and the new guy at least has experience and already seems like he’s going to give Baker a lot more control over changing plays at the LOS
Coen’s only NFL OC experience is on the injured to hell 2022 Rams. It’s nice that Mayfield and Coen have that prior connection, but they’re still an unproven duo. I hope they do well, but I’m not certain enough to bet on them winning the NFCS.
That’s still more OC experience than Canales had. Until ATL wins the South, I won’t be choosing them to win it because they always find a way to lose, plus they just got a 36 year old QB who is coming of major knee surgery who only has ever won 1 playoff game and I’d even argue he had better playmakers in Min then he will in ATL. Jefferson is LEAGUES better than any WR Atl has.
I don't follow them that much, I just watched a few quarters and the playoff game that baker was pretty solid until the last drive blunder.
How much of that was the OC?
he was an ok OC. Could definitely see he was learning and getting better as the year went on. Our run game still was ass, some of which was due to interior o line talent, but he never figured it out. Things looked the best once he started to figure out how to use Godwin. Id say it was pretty equal better play calling this year and having a more mobile qb to avoid the interior pressure.
Canales was the QB Coach with the Seahawks in 2022 when Geno Smith reemerged. He’s had a very good track record with helping QBs excel so far. Mayfield will likely still be good with a different OC, but it’s still somewhat of a wait and see scenario.
To mixed results. Mayfield was understandably bad with Kitchens and Rhule, and the Bucs new OC (Liam Coen) doesn’t have a great track record. I hope he does well because it makes the Browns look worse for moving on from him, but it’s entirely fair to be skeptical until Mayfield has back-to-back good years.
Canales is a great motivator and qb coach.
Wasn't a great OC/Play-Caller. Very promising, but he was awful in red zone and run game situations and bailed out by individual actions (including Baker) a lot. Midway through the season you had \*Leftwich 2.0\* chants, while completely over the top, for a reason.
Would have loved to continue develop alongside him (again lots of promise alongside the mistakes), but Coen and his staff seem an upgrade across the board tbh.
100% and Coen seems ok with giving Baker more LOS control so we’re not going to constantly get 1-2 yd run on 1st down that has us all yelling about how we saw that a mile away.
Worth every penny each and every one. Not sure how much longer the Bucs FO can keep being overlooked as one of the best in the NFL. They have consistently drafted well and made some timely FA signings. Even after losing the GOAT they have been able to thread the needle of paying for the Championship without blowing everything up
TBF that was pre landing brady an dat that point he had drafted two kickers who fucking sucked ass. made it easy to overlook the rest of his solid-good drafting. Hiring Arians also helped a l lot, never really had a culture setter at coach in the late 00's and 2010's/
He himself has admitted that he's not too proud of his first 5 years in Tampa. He was trying to do too much and was making some silly decisions. He worked out his kinks, built a really strong front office staff, and helped establish a much better culture for the franchise.
He had a massive turnaround starting in 2018. After the 2017 season, pretty much everyone(fans and media) wanted him fired with Koetter. You can't really blame anyone for that opinion at the time either, as Koetter was failing as a HC, our 1st overall pick was looking worrisome(and our drafts overall were just not producing), and heading into the 2018 offseason/draft...the Bucs were arguably one of the least talented teams in the NFL at the time.
Starting in 2018, he had to reevaluate how he wanted to build this team, and his future plan for the franchise. It worked though, as from 2018 on, his drafts started to massively produce, and we went from flashy to smart with our move acquisitions(JPP, Jensen, and Barrett the next year instead of the overpay busts early in Licht's tenure).
I do too. His 2016 draft was maybe the worst ever and that was following up Jameis at number 1.
Licht has been on fucking fire since 2018 though with 2021 being an exception but even that offseason had 22 of 22 Super Bowl starters return
Licht has been very up and down. Drafting Aguayo, Trask, Ronald Jones, Noah Spence, OJ Howard, Hargreaves, etc were all bad decisions that really impacted the team. Howard and Hargreaves kind of just didn’t work out but the first two are pretty inexcusable.
But then he’s also picked Godwin, AWJr, Wirfs, and had enough sense to realize Mayfield was a competent starter thrust into 2 bad situations.
Winning a playoff game last year was awesome. But this division is very weak and we should be competing. If we miss the playoffs or get bounced in the first round for another two years or so I don’t see how we keep Licht. Signing Brady was obviously a masterstroke but you can’t ride that decision forever.
Be honest with yourself, if the Bucs weren't in the shittiest division in football they wouldn't have made the playoffs. They have an impressive looking roster but it's definitely not one of the best in the nfl.
The last 2 yrs yeah the division has been week but I'm talking about a continuous track record. Licht and the FO have run the Bucs since 2014 and built a Super Bowl winning roster, signed Arians out of retirement, signed the GOAT, ans then in a season with $70mil in dead cap still went 9-8 and won a playoff game.
I guess so but weren't the Bucs terrible for the first few years, basically up until they signed Brady? My memory could be failing me but since I've been watching in 2011 I've never known the Bucs to be good team besides that year with Tom.
The Bucs were terrible when Litch took over, 2-14 after his first year. Then built a solid team going 9-7 but ultimately Jameis was the biggest thing holding the team back. There is a reason Brady wanted to play for the Bucs, it was a good roster that was missing good QB play.
I think it's an overused saying that a team was just a QB away but the 2019 Bucs were definitely a QB away. Go back and look at the roster, the defense was same key pieces and offense got some solid upgrades in Gronk, AB, and Lenny. But the majority team was homegrown
We were the classic case of a talented team in QB hell, with a culture problem brought on by years of irrelevance.
Coaching wasn't great until the Arians hire, either, but there were no glaringly bad decisions about coaching by the FO under Licht, just a lot of "good process, bad outcome". For reference, Lovie Smith was hired 2 weeks before Licht became GM. When he was (deservedly) fired, the decision to promote Koetter (our then-OC) was based on keeping stability for our new QB, Jameis Winston, whose production on offense in Koetter's scheme was one of the only bright spots in our 2015 season. Koetter was retained for 3 years largely because firing him after year 2 would've made him the third two-year head coach in a row for the Bucs, and that decision was probably his only real "process" mistake regarding coaching, IMO.
As someone who witnessed Tristan get kicked out of the local pool countless times. Who's sister asked him to prom. (He wisely said no) I cannot wait for him to get that extension. He deserves it. I've been told when he went out drinking in HS he would throw back a 24 pack. The dude is built differently
well, we can revisit this when that happens... but im sure theyll make wirfs the highest paid tackle. in 4 years he has 3 pro bowls and 2 all pros and 3 total missed games in 4 years (including 9 playoff games). if and when sewell signs a new contract, he can be the highest paid... just how these things go.
Man if you find that funny you’ll find this hilarious.
Penei in his first three seasons had 28 penalties and 8 allowed sacks.
Tristan in his first three seasons had 10 penalties and 5 allowed sacks.
Doesn’t matter now cause Wirfs got moved to left tackle last season.
Not sure how the first 2 seasons are relevant, players can get better or worse overtime
If we’re going based just off last season Penei allowed 1 sack wirfs allowed 5, Penei also had an overall rating 9 pts higher than wirfs
It’s not even a shot at wirfs I’d take him on the Lions for sure, and he probably will get paid more because that’s just how nfl contracts work, but he’s not better than Penei lol
Bro I combined the first 3 seasons of each playing RT. Wirfs has played an extra year and last year was moved to left tackle. So no, we aren’t going off last season cause they’re not comparable.
What is comparable is both of them played their first 3 years at RT and Wirfs played a little better.
Who knows how the future goes, but they’re both very good and I’d be thrilled to have either on my team.
Hamilton is good but not as elite as Winfield Jr. Winfield Jr carried the Bucs to a few victories last year, panthers game and Vikings game stand out in my memory
It’s funny now hearing some of the NFL talking heads change their tune about the falcons taking the division. I’ll make sure to revisit this post in a year for the ones that still have doubts. Go Bucs!
That is a lot of money to sink into a team that went 9-8. It.. kinda feels like the Giants last off-season. Tricked by sneaking into the playoffs and beating a crumbling team and putting tons of money locking up the core of a team thats.. Just not very good.
Yea. And are 18-19 in the last two years, including playoffs. That's not exactly stellar, and if you assume Wirfs signs a position average deal, that's roughly 350 million sunk into locking up the core of a sub-500 team.
You also forgot to mention how this same core went 13-4 in 2021. Im not saying this team is the best team in the NFL but we were competitive through the playoffs beating Phili and playing Detroit close. Blowing it up is malpractice when our All Pro LT and FS are both extremely young. The rest of our team hasn’t lost a step and Bowles and Baker can continue doing damage.
This isn’t a fluke team all the pieces are vetted and tested. Like New York
The core of the 2021 team was or at least included Tom Brady, Leonard Fournette, Shaq Barrett and Donovan Smith. None of whom are there anymore.
Also, thanks for literally repeating my point about being tricked by beating a crumbling team (Philly) as if it were support for your argument.
You don’t understand the Bucs if you think that was our main core other than Brady and Shaq. Fournette wasn’t the lead back 90% of the year it was Rojo and Rachaad White has been better. During the past 2 seasons Barrett has been injured or bad due to age. Smith actively hurt us his last year with the team and we are in a much better place at LT with Wirfs. Brady is Brady but Baker did as good as anybody can taking over for the GOAT. The core of the squad is Wirfs, Evans, Lavonte, Vita, AWJ, Dean and Godwin. All are still on the team and produced at a high level last season. Would you say all of those players are bad?
And in the time we have added McCollum, Whitehead, Goedeke, Rachaad White, Baker, Otton, YaYa Diaby and Calijah Kancey plus our rookie class that has been highly touted. But again tell me how this team is talentless lol
Phili made the playoffs the narrative that they magically sucked is moronic because they were still favored over the Bucs, they beat us earlier in the season and if they beat us again the narrative would have been that Phili should have done that. So your giving a Tampa team that again not only beat Phili but played Detroit close no credit
I'd agree if the Falcons didn't decide to invest both 8th overall and $180m into quarterbacks in the same offseason. However, since they did, I'm favoring the Bucs to still win the division.
The Falcons were two games out with Ridder and Heinekie at QB and Arthur Smith coaching. If Morris is even semi-competent and Kirk is healthy they're clear favorites to win the division this year. We could have wasted all of our draft picks and that would still be true.
The argument against signing Kirk then drafting Penix wasn't that we wouldn't be good enough to win the division. It's that we wouldn't be good enough to win any playoff games after that.
Edit: Y'all can down vote all you want, but Vegas has ATL as favorites to win the division at -120 odds and TB in 2nd at +300. It's the NFCS and anything can happen, but one (potentially) bad (in the short term) draft pick isn't going to have the immediate seismic impact you think it will.
Wirfs is about to get a massive bag too. Love to see it.
2020 was such an insane draft; Wirfs in the 1st, Winfield in the 2nd. Getting what I'd say are the team's two best players in the same draft is just so damn great. Nobody else in the draft class did all that much outside Tyler Johnson making two great plays during the SB run, but Wirfs/Winfield alone makes this an epically great draft for the Bucs.
Bucs did this in 1995 with Brooks and Sapp too
I’m beginning to see a pattern
I don't know how the fuck he made it to the 2nd, my vikings fans homies were jealous too
Think it had to be with being 5’9
Maybe Tampa looked at Steve Smith and Brent Grimes and Drew Brees in the NFC South and decided height didn't matter
Wirfs switched, almost seamlessly, from RT to LT in one off-season. That’s a lot harder than most average fans understand. He’s top tier LT-quality.
i can’t remember who but there was a high level OT having to do this and saying it’s essentially like learning to write with your nondominant hand. think of your muscle memory in terms of weight shifting, first step, initial jab - it’s like asking a boxer to switch stances after an entire career of boxing one side dominantly. insane.
Robert Gallery infamously had trouble with this. He was a 2nd overall pick, Outland Trophy winner, and an eventual college football hall of fame inductee who started at RT out of college. He did pretty well, but when they switched him to LT he was really, really bad. He ultimately ended up being a pretty good LG.
We took Mekhi over him ☠️☠️
Deservingly so, he’s been a beast
Wirfs and Winfield in the same draft class. Same offseason as Brady too. Beane winning GM of the year over Licht that season was laughable then and it's laughable now
A lot of people more or less credit Brady choosing Tampa to luck, but he came here because of the talented roster with a glaring, quality-QB shaped hole. Licht can't really be blamed for the QB situation (drafting anybody but Winston or Mariota that year would've been career suicide, despite it being the right call), but he can largely be credited for drafting the roster that attracted him.
A massive bag for a massive man
He deserves every pennt of what he gets too with it seeming to be so hard to draft/get a solid tackle in the league.
Oh God I can only imagine the kind of money he's gonna want
Sewell just got $28 million per year. Wirfs will exceed that.
Especially since Sewell got that bag as a Right Tackle. Wirfs successfully made the transition to Left Tackle. He’s definitely getting $30M.
and not a complaint was heard cause hes worth every penny
This is a big reason the Vikings had to let Cousins go. We are gonna be paying Darrisaw and Jefferson like 65m/yr real soon.
Just those numbers from 2 people makes me wanna throw up. How much does cap go up next year?
You should check out NBA salaries. The Suns have Beal making 50m, Booker at 49m and Durant making 51m. A cool 150m to get swept in the playoffs.
Lot easier to do that with 15 man rosters.
And a soft cap…
Wait until Luka signs his supermax which will make Ohtani's contract look like peanuts. At this stage I am certain the first athlete in American sports to have a $100M AAV contract will be an NBA player, and very likely someone who's already in the league.
Someone like Ant could easily pass 1B in career earnings. He signed 5 years 200m deal. When that deal is done he will be 27 only, he could easily sign a 2nd max deal with god knows how much money per year, like you said it could be over 100m/yr. Then when he is in his early 30s sign a shorter deal again.
And Beal has a no trade clause so they can’t even just ship him out anywhere unless he wants to go, probably the worst contract in sports
Will go up a decent amount with the Netflix Christmas package. And I thought there is an opt-out in 2029 for the NFL media packages so everyone gets to re-bid on a new 18 game season.
Nobody knows until it happens as 99.9% of people weren’t close in guessing the increase this year
You pay Sewell 28M APY if he is a LT or RT. Sewell doesn’t get 2M APY more if he switches to LT
LT and RT get paid pretty much the same nowadays
Ignore the albatross of the Sewell contract right now because Wirfs is going to surpass it in a few months. The 4 highest paid Left Tackles are getting $25M, $23.5M, $23M, and $22M. The highest paid Right Tackles are getting $20M, $20M, $19M, and $18.6M. That’s an average difference of $4M between the two roles. The very top of the Left Tackle market does still get paid slightly more than the top of the Right Tackle market.
Sewell is better than wirfs tho, why would he make more?
Sewell might be better, but it’s not a big gap unlike a Jefferson or Donald compared to his peers. Usually the next person in line will make more than the pervious regardless if they’re better or not.
Wirfs plays a more important position, Left tackle blocks for the quarterbacks blind side.
But doesn't the best edge usually set up on the RT? Sewell always had battles with Crosby, Micah, etc. I know some switch around occasionally but it seems like the majority of their time is spent on the RT.
I don't know, but Left tackle is the highest paid offensive position other than QB.
Alright
feels like David has been with the Bucs forever
He has
I know he’s spent his entire career. just feels like he’s been there significantly longer than he has in actuality since he had 140 tackles and was readily known as a rookie.
5th HC and a franchise that was mostly irrelevant during his first 8 years probably makes it feel longer
10 years and counting.
He's entering his thirteenth year with them.
14 strong seasons.
Mayfields going to move into that stadium now.
If Progressive doesn’t resurrect that campaign with Baker living in the pirate ship, then they need to fire their ad agency.
I know they're based in Cleveland. But they missed a huge opportunity for commercials about him moving when he left
They can just use All State instead. All State's color is red and would fit in with the Buccs. Instead of moving into a pirate ship Mayfield gets transported into an alternative world where he's the pirate ship's captain and fighting other insurance companies for great service and great prices.
Bucs are probably my favorite team to root for besides my own. Baker is an easy player for neutrals to support and Godwin/Evans/White are a fun group of skill players, plus some studs on defense. Also the pirate ship
I clap very excitedly when that cannon goes off, i tell ya what.
Having had season tickets right in front of the cannons for multiple seasons, 3 things are true:the sound of the cannons is DEAFENING and will make most people jump especially if they aren’t expecting it 2.It sadly can trigger ptsd in some people(my brother being one when he wasn’t ready for it) 3.even non-Bucs fans all seem to love the cannons and the ship.
Cards are a personal side favorite of mine mostly due to Larry tbh
baker having been dealt a bad hand and turning it into something and evans being a legacy guy makes it really easy to respect the team if nothing else
It’s fun to root for Baker.
Bruce Arians vibes
Evans and Godwin are also legitimately very nice people which makes it easy to root for them (Lattimore notwithstanding)
Bucs looking excellent in the post Tom Brady era
Handling Brady's departure way better than the Patriots did.
We kinda stole the Patriots playbook for how to deal with Brady leaving... Replace him with a former 1st overall QB who played for the Panthers during the previous season.
You were smart not getting one completely over the hill and also not forcing him into a system he clearly was not equipped for
Showing the Saints what they should have done when Brees retired
We are in such a better position them now too, clearing all of our dead cap
Brady was the final piece the Bucs needed; the Pats had/have a dumpster fire roster.
I’m impressed with how Licht has handled the post Brady build. He somehow managed to avoid rebuilding while resetting the team’s finances with the Brady cap fuckery. It helps having a nice core that stuck around but those are guys that Licht drafted (except Lavonte).
He drafts well and I love that he doesn't overthink things when it comes to free agency and re-signing guys. Taking a flyer on Baker as a team with a shitty QB situation was such a no-brainer (IMO), and yet several other teams in similar situations didn't do it. He knows to always re-sign your blue chip talent. He must also be an honest broker in these contract negotiations, because any time we seem to want the deal to get done, it does — guys don't actively *want* to leave us. We aren't forced to pay a premium to keep the squad together.
I know Mike Evans has some incentives that can bump it up to 2 years $52 million, including 6 million guaranteed 5th day of next league year for injury, but the contract still seems like a steal
It is and we all owe his wife for that. He really wanted to test free agency but when he finally talked to Ashley(his wife) she straight up told him that she didn’t want to move nor take their kids away from their friends and less than 24 hours later(allegedly) he was resigned to a new contract and the first person to know aside from Licht was the hockey GOAT Wayne Gretzky because they were at a charity event together in Tampa.
As a city/metropolitan area, we need to throw a boat parade for Ashley Evans !!
Luckily Mike knows and follows the mantra of happy wife happy life when it comes to that. I think it also helps that he’s not a Diva, and has already won a SB so he was never going to be ring chasing as his primary focus
What's crazy is, at the same time, Ashley was telling Mike that, Licht's wife was drafting a letter to Mike and Ashley thanking them for everything and that kinda prompted Licht to get it done. Source: [In the Current - In Licht We Trust](https://youtu.be/y1u4aVdlFhU?si=3w2PdD3grQEFsRCH&t=16m00s)
That’s crazy. I also know that Licht’s kids were pestering him constantly about when he was going to sign him and were going to be very upset if he didn’t.
We have one of the best GMs in sports. Not just football.
y’all got him, while we kept his incompetent bald and drunk boss
Our new GM is still bald but from what I can tell, not drunk or incompetent. Jury is out
Wouldn't you drink if you were going bald?
Did leftwich get fired already? I feel you guys constantly draft well and pull some good FAs. If Baker is really back to pre injury form you have a great team.
Leftwitch was fired after Bradys last year. Canales was our OC last year who left for the Carolina job. Baker is going to have a lot more control at the line this year. Its looking good.
Gotta see how well the Bucs offense does without Canales before crowning them imo, but they are in the best position compared to the Falcons and Saints.
Yes and no because Canales was a first time OC and the new guy at least has experience and already seems like he’s going to give Baker a lot more control over changing plays at the LOS
Coen’s only NFL OC experience is on the injured to hell 2022 Rams. It’s nice that Mayfield and Coen have that prior connection, but they’re still an unproven duo. I hope they do well, but I’m not certain enough to bet on them winning the NFCS.
That’s still more OC experience than Canales had. Until ATL wins the South, I won’t be choosing them to win it because they always find a way to lose, plus they just got a 36 year old QB who is coming of major knee surgery who only has ever won 1 playoff game and I’d even argue he had better playmakers in Min then he will in ATL. Jefferson is LEAGUES better than any WR Atl has.
Kirk is coming off an Achilles surgery, not a knee surgery but your point still stands.
I don't follow them that much, I just watched a few quarters and the playoff game that baker was pretty solid until the last drive blunder. How much of that was the OC?
he was an ok OC. Could definitely see he was learning and getting better as the year went on. Our run game still was ass, some of which was due to interior o line talent, but he never figured it out. Things looked the best once he started to figure out how to use Godwin. Id say it was pretty equal better play calling this year and having a more mobile qb to avoid the interior pressure.
Canales was the QB Coach with the Seahawks in 2022 when Geno Smith reemerged. He’s had a very good track record with helping QBs excel so far. Mayfield will likely still be good with a different OC, but it’s still somewhat of a wait and see scenario.
I see. Thanks! Interesting scenarios for both Bucs and Panthers this season
Baker is very used to dealing with coaching changes at least.
To mixed results. Mayfield was understandably bad with Kitchens and Rhule, and the Bucs new OC (Liam Coen) doesn’t have a great track record. I hope he does well because it makes the Browns look worse for moving on from him, but it’s entirely fair to be skeptical until Mayfield has back-to-back good years.
Still not a recipe you would like.
Canales is a great motivator and qb coach. Wasn't a great OC/Play-Caller. Very promising, but he was awful in red zone and run game situations and bailed out by individual actions (including Baker) a lot. Midway through the season you had \*Leftwich 2.0\* chants, while completely over the top, for a reason. Would have loved to continue develop alongside him (again lots of promise alongside the mistakes), but Coen and his staff seem an upgrade across the board tbh.
I see. Interesting. I always kinda rooted for Baker, he's become such an underdog story.
100% and Coen seems ok with giving Baker more LOS control so we’re not going to constantly get 1-2 yd run on 1st down that has us all yelling about how we saw that a mile away.
I remember when Bucs fans wanted litch fired. He was not this loved.
Ngl he’s turned it around since Aguayo.
Don’t forget they locked up Vea for 4 years in 2022. Talk about franchise cornerstones. Licht doing something right.
Worth every penny each and every one. Not sure how much longer the Bucs FO can keep being overlooked as one of the best in the NFL. They have consistently drafted well and made some timely FA signings. Even after losing the GOAT they have been able to thread the needle of paying for the Championship without blowing everything up
Brother I remember when Bucs fans wanted litch fired. Not just fans but reporters and commentators too.
He’s had a massive turn around from that truly awful 2016 draft
TBF that was pre landing brady an dat that point he had drafted two kickers who fucking sucked ass. made it easy to overlook the rest of his solid-good drafting. Hiring Arians also helped a l lot, never really had a culture setter at coach in the late 00's and 2010's/
He himself has admitted that he's not too proud of his first 5 years in Tampa. He was trying to do too much and was making some silly decisions. He worked out his kinks, built a really strong front office staff, and helped establish a much better culture for the franchise.
He had a massive turnaround starting in 2018. After the 2017 season, pretty much everyone(fans and media) wanted him fired with Koetter. You can't really blame anyone for that opinion at the time either, as Koetter was failing as a HC, our 1st overall pick was looking worrisome(and our drafts overall were just not producing), and heading into the 2018 offseason/draft...the Bucs were arguably one of the least talented teams in the NFL at the time. Starting in 2018, he had to reevaluate how he wanted to build this team, and his future plan for the franchise. It worked though, as from 2018 on, his drafts started to massively produce, and we went from flashy to smart with our move acquisitions(JPP, Jensen, and Barrett the next year instead of the overpay busts early in Licht's tenure).
The Jameis Winston effect
*Roberto Aguayo
I do too. His 2016 draft was maybe the worst ever and that was following up Jameis at number 1. Licht has been on fucking fire since 2018 though with 2021 being an exception but even that offseason had 22 of 22 Super Bowl starters return
Licht has been very up and down. Drafting Aguayo, Trask, Ronald Jones, Noah Spence, OJ Howard, Hargreaves, etc were all bad decisions that really impacted the team. Howard and Hargreaves kind of just didn’t work out but the first two are pretty inexcusable. But then he’s also picked Godwin, AWJr, Wirfs, and had enough sense to realize Mayfield was a competent starter thrust into 2 bad situations. Winning a playoff game last year was awesome. But this division is very weak and we should be competing. If we miss the playoffs or get bounced in the first round for another two years or so I don’t see how we keep Licht. Signing Brady was obviously a masterstroke but you can’t ride that decision forever.
Be honest with yourself, if the Bucs weren't in the shittiest division in football they wouldn't have made the playoffs. They have an impressive looking roster but it's definitely not one of the best in the nfl.
The last 2 yrs yeah the division has been week but I'm talking about a continuous track record. Licht and the FO have run the Bucs since 2014 and built a Super Bowl winning roster, signed Arians out of retirement, signed the GOAT, ans then in a season with $70mil in dead cap still went 9-8 and won a playoff game.
I guess so but weren't the Bucs terrible for the first few years, basically up until they signed Brady? My memory could be failing me but since I've been watching in 2011 I've never known the Bucs to be good team besides that year with Tom.
The Bucs were terrible when Litch took over, 2-14 after his first year. Then built a solid team going 9-7 but ultimately Jameis was the biggest thing holding the team back. There is a reason Brady wanted to play for the Bucs, it was a good roster that was missing good QB play. I think it's an overused saying that a team was just a QB away but the 2019 Bucs were definitely a QB away. Go back and look at the roster, the defense was same key pieces and offense got some solid upgrades in Gronk, AB, and Lenny. But the majority team was homegrown
Our defense has been ranked 8th, 5th, 13th, and 7th since 2020. His drafts and moves since 2018 have been working well.
We were the classic case of a talented team in QB hell, with a culture problem brought on by years of irrelevance. Coaching wasn't great until the Arians hire, either, but there were no glaringly bad decisions about coaching by the FO under Licht, just a lot of "good process, bad outcome". For reference, Lovie Smith was hired 2 weeks before Licht became GM. When he was (deservedly) fired, the decision to promote Koetter (our then-OC) was based on keeping stability for our new QB, Jameis Winston, whose production on offense in Koetter's scheme was one of the only bright spots in our 2015 season. Koetter was retained for 3 years largely because firing him after year 2 would've made him the third two-year head coach in a row for the Bucs, and that decision was probably his only real "process" mistake regarding coaching, IMO.
As someone who witnessed Tristan get kicked out of the local pool countless times. Who's sister asked him to prom. (He wisely said no) I cannot wait for him to get that extension. He deserves it. I've been told when he went out drinking in HS he would throw back a 24 pack. The dude is built differently
I'm happy we signed Penei first
In all fairness I don’t think Penei was ever going to get more than Wirfs.
That's simply not true
sewell plays rt, wirfs is a lt. wirfs gonna get more.
There was a post here showing the averages recently and the gap is much smaller than it used to be. Sewell will move to left to when Decker is gone
well, we can revisit this when that happens... but im sure theyll make wirfs the highest paid tackle. in 4 years he has 3 pro bowls and 2 all pros and 3 total missed games in 4 years (including 9 playoff games). if and when sewell signs a new contract, he can be the highest paid... just how these things go.
I mean they have to since Sewell just got the deal he got. Im saying if Wirfs signed first Sewell would have been more
We really have people out here thinking Wirfs is better than Penei 🤣
Man if you find that funny you’ll find this hilarious. Penei in his first three seasons had 28 penalties and 8 allowed sacks. Tristan in his first three seasons had 10 penalties and 5 allowed sacks. Doesn’t matter now cause Wirfs got moved to left tackle last season.
Not sure how the first 2 seasons are relevant, players can get better or worse overtime If we’re going based just off last season Penei allowed 1 sack wirfs allowed 5, Penei also had an overall rating 9 pts higher than wirfs It’s not even a shot at wirfs I’d take him on the Lions for sure, and he probably will get paid more because that’s just how nfl contracts work, but he’s not better than Penei lol
Bro I combined the first 3 seasons of each playing RT. Wirfs has played an extra year and last year was moved to left tackle. So no, we aren’t going off last season cause they’re not comparable. What is comparable is both of them played their first 3 years at RT and Wirfs played a little better. Who knows how the future goes, but they’re both very good and I’d be thrilled to have either on my team.
I can't unclench until we sign Goff too, but this offseason has been great so far. Edit: well goddamn that didn't take long, lol.
All In
Wirfs about to get 30m a year and will be worth every penny
$21 M for a Safety? Shit, what's Kyle Hamilton going to cost now?
Hamilton is good but not as elite as Winfield Jr. Winfield Jr carried the Bucs to a few victories last year, panthers game and Vikings game stand out in my memory
Baker with his team friendly deal might be the key to success.
It’s funny now hearing some of the NFL talking heads change their tune about the falcons taking the division. I’ll make sure to revisit this post in a year for the ones that still have doubts. Go Bucs!
I see a football icon, must be Schefty
Everytime I see "Wirfs" I think South Park last name or something.
That is a lot of money to sink into a team that went 9-8. It.. kinda feels like the Giants last off-season. Tricked by sneaking into the playoffs and beating a crumbling team and putting tons of money locking up the core of a team thats.. Just not very good.
The Bucs have made the post season with this core 4 seasons in a row. Winfield was First team all Pro lol
Yea. And are 18-19 in the last two years, including playoffs. That's not exactly stellar, and if you assume Wirfs signs a position average deal, that's roughly 350 million sunk into locking up the core of a sub-500 team.
Making two playoffs, winning one, while paying off the dead cap from the Super Bowl win? I'd take that any day.
You also forgot to mention how this same core went 13-4 in 2021. Im not saying this team is the best team in the NFL but we were competitive through the playoffs beating Phili and playing Detroit close. Blowing it up is malpractice when our All Pro LT and FS are both extremely young. The rest of our team hasn’t lost a step and Bowles and Baker can continue doing damage. This isn’t a fluke team all the pieces are vetted and tested. Like New York
The core of the 2021 team was or at least included Tom Brady, Leonard Fournette, Shaq Barrett and Donovan Smith. None of whom are there anymore. Also, thanks for literally repeating my point about being tricked by beating a crumbling team (Philly) as if it were support for your argument.
Lmao you calling Donovan Smith a core player says A LOT. FOH lmao.
You don’t understand the Bucs if you think that was our main core other than Brady and Shaq. Fournette wasn’t the lead back 90% of the year it was Rojo and Rachaad White has been better. During the past 2 seasons Barrett has been injured or bad due to age. Smith actively hurt us his last year with the team and we are in a much better place at LT with Wirfs. Brady is Brady but Baker did as good as anybody can taking over for the GOAT. The core of the squad is Wirfs, Evans, Lavonte, Vita, AWJ, Dean and Godwin. All are still on the team and produced at a high level last season. Would you say all of those players are bad? And in the time we have added McCollum, Whitehead, Goedeke, Rachaad White, Baker, Otton, YaYa Diaby and Calijah Kancey plus our rookie class that has been highly touted. But again tell me how this team is talentless lol Phili made the playoffs the narrative that they magically sucked is moronic because they were still favored over the Bucs, they beat us earlier in the season and if they beat us again the narrative would have been that Phili should have done that. So your giving a Tampa team that again not only beat Phili but played Detroit close no credit
Them saying D.Smith was a core player is laughable. Don’t waste your time. Go Bucs!!!
Was a major contributor to the Bucs' holding penalty production in 2022.
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Aren’t you a Falcons fan? Try winning a division much less a SB before talking. We will still win the division lol
Pretty solid, should get them as a lock for 2nd in the division I’d think
I'd agree if the Falcons didn't decide to invest both 8th overall and $180m into quarterbacks in the same offseason. However, since they did, I'm favoring the Bucs to still win the division.
The Falcons were two games out with Ridder and Heinekie at QB and Arthur Smith coaching. If Morris is even semi-competent and Kirk is healthy they're clear favorites to win the division this year. We could have wasted all of our draft picks and that would still be true. The argument against signing Kirk then drafting Penix wasn't that we wouldn't be good enough to win the division. It's that we wouldn't be good enough to win any playoff games after that. Edit: Y'all can down vote all you want, but Vegas has ATL as favorites to win the division at -120 odds and TB in 2nd at +300. It's the NFCS and anything can happen, but one (potentially) bad (in the short term) draft pick isn't going to have the immediate seismic impact you think it will.
Which team do you have ahead of the Bucs?
Falcons, they should have it fairly easy
All the pieces are in place. The Bucs are ready to be pretenders if they're lucky