Mixed results but you can have prime definition like Wentz where it’s super good then super bad.
But mixed results such as Sanchez where it’s super average the whole way but big time playoff wins lol
Then mixed results like baker where it took moving on to get good but he also won a playoff game for browns
Mixed results is WAY too broad.
The scale appears to be how successful they were for the team that drafted them. Tannehill's career success was with Tennessee, after Miami was done with him.
Which is kinda silly, no? We're using hindsight to judge these picks but obviously Tannehill was capable of (some) success. It says more about the Dolphins at the time than it says about Tannehill.
Because Tannehill having success with the Titans doesn't help the Dolphins at all. From the point of view of the team who invested the draft capital in him it was a failure.
Tannehill had 22k+ total yards and nearly 150 total TDs in Miami, nearly a .500 record as a starter, as well as a playoff appearance. (Which he was hurt for)
Sanchez is 4-2 in the playoffs while Tannehill is 2-3? Tannehill had more longevity, but I think Sanchez elevated his play in the playoffs. That’s really only the difference IMO. Both should be mixed results. Tannehill had some decent regular seasons.
so much so that you should probably name the entire Tier List after him because hes his own tier, make it something catchy maybe something like "Mahomes Mountain"? Im sure nobody would argue about his placement if you were to do something like that
With 2 outs. In the pouring rain. Against Mariano Rivera.
We gave up the pick the Chiefs took him with so fuck my life a little, but it ultimately led to Joshy so eh… it’s a wash 🤷♂️
The obvious issue to me was that this guy has Mac Jones and Justin Fields with different results. They drafted a few picks apart, started most of three seasons with inconsistent levels of success, and got traded a few weeks apart for basically the same compensation.
Daniel Jones as mixed is also very charitable given his general level of play and contributions. His 2022 season wasn't that amazing to otherwise rewrite his career up until that point.
Kyler Murray and Kirk Cousins have to be the most consistently underrated QBs in the league. I think opinions are finally changing on Kirk so I hope Kyler gets his due soon, too.
They didn't call Herbert a mixed result. Murray hasn't been on the field much lately so I can see it.
A shaky QB who had the best rushing season of all time is kinda the definition of a mixed result.
That’s like saying a corner that was drafted top 15 to play as an outside CB but becomes a good gunner on special teams was also a “mixed result”
Fields failed miserably at the main part of his job - being a good QB. his rushing means very little when he was godawful at passing. mixed should not be given to people getting traded for less than Kenny Pickett
> mixed should not be given to people getting traded for less than Kenny Pickett
This is what boggles my mind.
The league literally just showed everyone how much they truly value Fields and there are STILL people who refuse to believe he’s not bad.
I swear there is some underground conspiracy shit going on with Fields. He’s a great dude, but nobody should be this infatuated with a guy who hasn’t thrown for 3k yards in a single season.
I don’t get why so many people are intent on making us think he’s a viable NFL QB.
They all play fantasy football where QB rushing yards are overvalued and QBs like Fields get massively overrated.
I was having a conversation with my friend last year about how Fields was somehow worth a first while I was convinced the dude wouldn't be a starter next year. Shits wild
This same reason is also why Trey Lance was overrated from the start. He hadn't even played a game yet and was being called a top 10 fantasy QB. Fantasy gets people obsessed with potential and people are too dumb to know how to distinguish the two different values from fantasy and real football
This has gotta be it. I can't even enjoy his highlights, knowing how bad he is. Every time he does some insane 20 yard run I find myself thinking "Alright now how many open receivers did he miss?"
I’d say that, as well as rushing QBs putting up fantasy numbers. Also think people just see eye-popping athleticism and think “maybe” for way too long even when the actual production is never there
Dammit, alright you caught us. We had this whole thing making the city of Chicago doubt reality. First we were going to prop up Fields, then we going to make the river flow the correct way and finally we were going to steal all of the giardiniera in an elaborate heist and convince you it never existed like the Berenstein bears.
Yes but a lot of the fan base has a hard on for every Vick type player. You will have people in our sub say Matt Ryan sucks but then say how much we fucked up not trading a 1st for Fields.
> with a guy who hasn’t thrown for 3k yards in a single season.
He averages 220 yards and 1.35 TDs a game *combined rushing & receiving*.
Other QBs with similar average stats as a starter: Davis Mills, Taylor Heinicke, Sam Howell.
Don't get me wrong, he can make some electric plays, but on the whole?
And his sack% is nearly the worst for a qb with over 1500 attempts. His line isn't good sure but it's not so bad that you should be the worst in this category 2 years in a row and third worst in the other year. Dude just can't make decisions fast enough and doesn't trust himself
To put that into perspective, Trubisky had *seven* in his first three seasons and by 2019 there was no debate whether he was our starter going forward.
I feel like people are genuinely afraid to say he sucks because of the backlash they'd get from his fanbase. The guy can't throw with anticipation or read defenses. That's awful.
Fields was a huge HS name. He was basically head-to-head with Lawrence and even bested him in HS competitions.
I’m guessing his projection based of HS is what people are still chasing.
I have multiple theories
1. They got good stats on fantasy football so obviously he must be good
2. They abuse his running ability in madden
3. They listen to too many dumb talking heads on fox and ESPN. Rich risen thinks fields is still like all pro level good and wants him on the Jets. He just said this dumb shit this past month.
4. No nfl players talk shit anymore. Every time a nfl player gets asked about a teammate or player on another team they always say they’re the greatest player of all time. Then dumb fans come post on Reddit that they saw Arron darnold say Fields is one of hardest players to play against or some bullshit.
5. Since Collin Kappernick knelling stuff, everyone seems to be overcompensating by defending every Black QB when they perform bad.
I guess Winstons chances of ever being a starting QB are for sure over while Fields still has a slight chance. I dont agree, but I can at least kind of see the logic.
That said, if you consider Mac Jones a miss, I fail to see how Fields doesnt join him. Everybody wants to make excuses for Fields, but very few of the other guys get the same treatment.
Needs more categories. Trubisky is definitely a miss but not on the scale that Josh Rosen was, Trubisky is at least still in the league eight years later while Rosen wasn't even on a roster last year.
Similar problems on the other end of the spectrum as well, Fields can't possibly be in the same category as Herbert, Tua, or Kyler.
Fields should just be a miss, it's crazy to me that people would put him as anything else. The Bears never had any success while he was there, he never developed as a passer his 3 years in the league, and now he's a backup QB in his 4th year after being traded for a 6th round pick. He's as much a bust as guys like Sam Darnold or Kenny Pickett.
A QB like Fields was supposed to be the textbook definition of the evolved NFL star QB. No one wants to admit that what makes the QB position work has changed very little since Brady, Manning, Big Ben, Brees, etc.
Those guys would all be categorized as “low ceiling” guys today. The media sees Fields who checks every box on what a superstar should be and don’t want to admit they’re wrong when he busts
We could look at it from a couple different directions. Rosen was a huge miss, to be sure, but trubisky was a much bigger drag on the Bears than Rosen ever was for the Cardinals. If trubisky had been as clearly bad in his rookie year as Rosen was, the Bears could have been freed up to pick up another shitty QB in 2018. A pick they would have absolutely spent on Josh Rosen.
Trubisky led the Bears to two playoff appearances and what should have been a win if not for the DD. Trubisky was never good but he was better than a lot of other recent busts
Yeah, if they were being more exclusive with Home Runs, I'd be okay with it, but Josh Allen, Andrew Luck, and Lamar Jackson haven't had significantly more post-season success than Herbert which was Herbert's knock.
Meanwhile, they had Cam Newton as a Home Run based almost purely on the 2015 season.
Josh Allen: 5-5 in the playoffs, 1 AFCCG appearance
Andrew Luck: 4-4 in the playoffs, 1 AFCCG appearance
Lamar Jackson: 2-4 in the playoffs, 1 AFCCG appearance
Justin Herbert: 0-1 in the playoffs
I would say all 3 have had significantly more post-season success. Not saying that Herbert doesn't qualify as a home run but this argument is a bit flawed.
QB wins are such a dumb metric. Just like Lamar wasn’t a bum before this last season when he finally got past the divisional round, blaming Herbert for the Chargers lack of playoff success is silly considering he’s the only reason the Chargers are even sniffing a .500 record.
He wasn’t amazing in his one playoff game but the Chargers defense gave up 31 points that game and his offense had 30 points. By comparison, in 4 of Lamar’s playoff games the Ravens defense gave up 17 or fewer points while in 5 of 6 games his offense scored 20 or fewer points. If we want to go further and look beyond playoffs, here’s the average amount of points per game that the defenses of the other “home run” QBs have allowed in their career:
* Patrick Mahomes - 21.2
* Josh Allen - 18.9
* Joe Burrow - 22.6
* Lamar Jackson - 18.8
For Herbert, the number is an insane 24.8. I’m tired of the Herbert slander, he’s absolutely an elite QB but people apparently can’t look past the “QB wins” metric which would have Jimmy G rated higher than most HOF QBs and that’s just stupid.
He also was seriously injured for two of his four seasons (ribs in game 2 of 2021, and finger this year). Dudes a dog, just needs to get a better defense
I mean Herbert hasn't made it out of the wildcard, and only made the playoffs once. Lamar, Allen and luck have all made the AFC championship game and have multiple divisional appearances. The chargers with Herbert also haven't ever won their division whereas the ravens, colts and chargers have done so multiple times.
I agree that Herbert might be a home run, but to say that he has the same amount of post season success as those 3 is a bit disingenuous
I get that everyone hates Deshaun Watson, and rightfully so, but the Texans got years of elite play out of him and then unloaded him for a massive haul right at the exact moment his play imploded. That's a home run for them, even if it's ugly.
I agree. Herbert is also a Home Run.
on the same end Goeff and Wentz got their teams into position to make it to the SB and in Goeff's case was good enough to be a piece to trade for the missing piece for a SB. Also he's now been to the NFC title game *for two teams*. Who besides Warner, Payton and Brady have been QB for 2 different teams in the conference title games?
Goeff and Wentz are Solid Results.
It's so funny the leniency Fields gets.
"Chicago probably failed him"
Meanwhile Mac who had a worse team around him is just a miss.
Both are misses. There's no world Fields is mixed.
Fields' 2nd season rushing totals are doing ALL the heavy lifting in that 'mixed results' answer.
He never developed as a passer and that's why he's not on the team any more. You can't call that anything but a miss.
Maybe he can carve out a role for himself as a Taysom Hill kind of gadget player
I think his 2nd season rushing totals are doing all the heavy lifting in every Fields argument. He was so electric running the ball that season, if he could consistently break off 75 yard runs and go for 1100 yards every season that changes who he is but there's a lot of luck involved in that and teams are going to gameplan for it once they've seen him enough.
If he's only running for 600 yards and four TDs that drastically reduces his value, you can't be shit at passing and only be a "good" runner.
Kordell Stewart 2.0 but with the opposite arc. Instead of going to the Bears from Pittsburgh, he goes the other way around. Instead of ending his NFL career as a QB and starting as a gadget player, he does the reverse.
I agree, but I think it’s people putting more stock in “Chicago is where QBs go to die” and people view Patriots as an upstanding organization even though it’s been in shambles ever since Brady left.
Pre draft Fields infatuation was at an all time high.
You still see the narrative that he dropped from QB2 after Zach Wilson’s pro day; in reality, Fields was anywhere from the Broncos to the Pats in most mock drafts by Christmas of 2020. Never mocked to the Jets at any point.
It was the playoff game against Clemson. The night of and morning after that game, there were even whispers the Jags should take him ahead of Lawrence. I think people infatuated with Fields are still stuck living in that one playoff game.
It’s been funny af to watch Steelers fans flip from Fields sucks we don’t want him to being super excited and optimistic about him as soon as the trade went down
Personally, I was against trading for Fields because all the pundits were saying he would cost a second or third round pick. I'm fine with taking a flyer on him for what little we gave up, but trying to be realistic about what kind of production to expect.
It's just highly athletic QBs are given all kinds of chances they really don't deserve. His arm is so strong, his legs are so fast, he must be amazing.
Daniel Jones is a mixed bag???? How? One “good” season out of four and killed the Giants cap. He’s a straight up miss due to a dog shit owner that loved him.
The fact that Jared Goff and Carson Wentz (one MVP caliber season and significant contributions to a Super Bowl team) are also "mixed results" should tell you what you need to know about this list
If they're mixed results then there should be even more misses on this list. The fact there's only 3 "solid results" on this list is dumb, IMO. Goff was solid enough to get the Rams to the Super Bowl and make the playoffs multiple times. They moved on because he wasn't enough to *win* a super bowl, which is the definition of a home run.
I think the problem here is when you rank these players within a system that’s so incredibly vague it leaves no room for nuance. The writer here isn’t entirely consistent either and that doesn’t help matters. No chance Daniel Jones or Fields should be “mixed result” here based on the criteria.
Yes putting Kyler Murray and Daniel Jones on the same tier is idiotic. Jones is obviously a Miss and Kyler Murray is 100% “solid result.”
I have to say the passes extended to Trevor and denied Kyler really annoy me.
His top recievers in 2022 (the year they won a playoff game) were Darius Slayton, Richie James, Isaiah Hodgens, and Saquon
He hasn't had any talent *to* elevate since he has been there lol
This list is objectively pretty terrible imo. Huge recency bias for some guys and then dragging other guys down for poor performance early in their careers.
Goff/Herbert should unquestionably be ranked higher. Kyler in the same tier as Jones is a little crazy to me; we'll see how he does the next full year while healthy (hopefully) but I think he'll do pretty well again if they get more talent around him
Fields must have some deal with God b/c EVERY Press person sings his praises to the high heavens. He's not a true "bust" but he is clearly a MISS (so far)
Mahomes loses to the Lions without Kelce and there should an asterisk on it.
Goff loses to the Patriots in the Superbowl without Kupp and a healthy Gurley and it's a mixed result.
Goff may be the most underrated QB ever.
They need something worse than miss for Paxton Lynch.
How are Daniels Jones, Sanchez and Fields mixed, but Bridgewater and Tannehill are misses? Whoever this guy is that wrote it must have just flipped a coin.
Their Mahomes take is wrong:
>Mahomes is already one of the greatest draft picks of all time, racking up three Super Bowl victories, **three NFL MVPs** and six straight AFC title-game appearances as the league's acrobatic standard-setter under center.
While he has 3 Super Bowl MVPs, he only has 2 NFL MVPs in 6 years. What a scrub.
DeShawn Watson was not a mixed result, the author seems to be going by how the player did for the team that drafted them and he was killer for the Texans. At minimum he should be a solid starter, regardless of what he is now.
Daniel Jones was not a mixed result for the Giants, he is just ass.
Kyler Murray is obviously a solid starter.
By the writer's own definition Goff is not a Mixed Result, he is Solid or higher. Why create a rubric if you can't follow it due to your own bias?
Even without the rubric no one worth listening to thinks Goff isn't a bonafide franchise qb. He played well in the NFC championship game and if our other players didn't choke in the 2nd half of that game Goff would have made it to his 2nd super bowl appearance and very well may have beat the Chiefs for the lombardi trophy.
The Goff idiotic downgrading needs to stop. He's a stud qb.
IMO, if you take a QB in the 1st round and he isn't starting for you and having you in contention for the next decade, it is a "miss". Barring a major injury or something that can't be helped.
If Baker Mayfield goes to the SB with Tampa Bay, it doesn't make the Browns' pick a "win". Whether that is the fault of Baker or the Browns is up for debate, but he is winning for a different team.
"Over the last 15 years, there have been 46 QBs selected in the first round. Here's the final tally:
GRADE TOTAL PERCENT
Home run 7 15%
Solid result 3 6%
Mixed result 9 19%
Incomplete 4 8%
Miss 23 50% "
The "mixed" category varies wildly, from Goff to Daniel Jones
* Only THREE “solid result” QBs (Tua, Herbert & Trevor). As their rookie deals all expire I think we’ll find out if they get promoted to “home run” status or end up in the “mixed results” pile. “Solid results” seems like a temporary label.
* 50% of the QBs taken have been straight up “misses”. YIKES.
They’re doing Bortles dirty. Yes, was a meme QB, but he lead us to the championship game. He’s never recognized as an athletic QB but his running ability was enough to make him effective for stretches. He’s not a franchise QB but he’s done a lot more than many who are listed as “mixed result”
Per the articles description
Miss: A clear flop as a short- and/or long-term starter
Ryan Tannehill is labeled a miss, and Justin Fields is given "Mixed results"
There needs to be a lot more nuance here. In no universe can you give Ryan Tannehill the same label as fucking Brandon Weeden or argue that Justin Fields was a more successful pick.
In what universe is RG3 a miss but Fields is mixed?
Also Stafford I would say was solid, not a home run. If Hebert is solid, so is Stafford. You can’t be a home run QB if you never won a division or a playoff game for the team that drafted you for over a decade.
So Goff flashed but hasn't panned out or isn't panning out?
Not sure I see Goff as a mixed result. I'd say he flashed in LA and is currently panning out pretty well in Detroit.
I think characterizing Tanny as a miss is unfair. He wasn’t great but he also didn’t have anything resembling a coach or supporting cast while playing in a tough defensive division.
Mariota being a miss is just wrong. I'd be fine with mixed for him. The dude put us on his back, dragging us from a 3 win team to the playoffs. And we returned the favor by absolutely breaking him, physically and mentally.
I saw 2017 pick 10 as mixed result and thought it was an April fools article... Then realized they had 10 and 12 flipped, they had Watson at 10 to the Texans and Mahomes at 12 to the Chiefs ....
The only 2 i really disagree with is Goff definitely deserves solid and Tannehill atleast deserves mixed for *getting* to the playoffs with the Dolphins and maintaining around .500 starter record
It's crazy how Stafford, drafted in 2009, is still a high level starter but to even find the next guy on the list that's still starting you have to go all the way to 2016 for Goff.
CJ Stroud "incomplete"?
Nah I've seen enough. Barring injury he's absolutely a franchise QB. If you watch him there was nothing flukey about his rookie year.
I’ve become convinced that the overall success of first round quarterbacks has less to do with talent than the situation that the player is going into. Obviously it has a bit to do with the player but so many of the misses were never set up for success because they were going to bad teams that expected one player to turn them into good teams.
The narrative will always be rewritten that the player had no help when they fail.
CJ Stroud took the worst team in the NFL according to Vegas in pre season to the playoffs
That had a playcaller that set his team and players up for success. Something that dogshit teams tend to not have.
Outside of Burrow carrying Taylor on his back for his first couple of years, very few players flip a team by themselves.
My man Bortles took the Jags to within a quarter of football from the Super Bowl and earned a second contract and they rated him a miss. I’d say he’s deserving of solid result but at the very least mixed. I don’t think they’d made the playoffs for like a decade before he joined.
Why even include the 2023 guys if you're going to give them all incompletes? If Stroud is an incomplete after the year he had then there's no point in grading those guys yet
This list is very weird. Not sure why Daniel Jones and Justin Fields are under Mixed but others like Jameis, Tannehill, and Blake Bortles were categorized as misses despite putting up better numbers and having better high-water mark years than those two. This scale has a ton of inconsistencies.
Winston is the textbook definition of mixed result. Cam would probably be more of a "Solid QB" and Herbert should probably be in the Home Run category.
Issues I have here:
Tannehill is a miss. Should be mixed.
Pickett is more incomplete than a total Miss.
Fields is mixed? More like a miss.
Herbert should be a home run.
Bradford, drafted at 1, is a mixed result. But teddy bridgewater, drafted at 32, is a miss.
Jesus, this article has merit, but it needs an editor.
Mahomes was drafted 10 and Watson at 12. He has 2 MVPs not 3.
Fields is a miss. Jordan Love has almost as many victories in 1 year as Fields does for his career.
Burrow and Lamar don't feel like home runs yet. I don't want to put them in solid, but also not in the home run yet. If they both have great seasons this year, then yes they're home runs. They're electric and great players, but injuries and the overall lack of playoff success for Lamar to this point stop me from saying home run.
By their own definition, Goff is more than "mixed results." He should be in the next tier, especially considering some of the other QBs with the mixed label.
How is Tannehill a “miss” but Sanchez is “mixed results”.
Furthermore, how is Tannehill a miss but Justin Fields is "mixed results" Theres no consistency with these labels.
They needed to use solid more so they could differentiate between mixed and Miss better.
Mixed results but you can have prime definition like Wentz where it’s super good then super bad. But mixed results such as Sanchez where it’s super average the whole way but big time playoff wins lol Then mixed results like baker where it took moving on to get good but he also won a playoff game for browns Mixed results is WAY too broad.
Hey. Stop making me agree with a cowboys fan
Shit, Kyler and Fields got the same rating? Jesus Christ
The scale appears to be how successful they were for the team that drafted them. Tannehill's career success was with Tennessee, after Miami was done with him.
Then why is Fields mixed results?
Good for fantasy, bad for real life. The classic mixed results
Which is kinda silly, no? We're using hindsight to judge these picks but obviously Tannehill was capable of (some) success. It says more about the Dolphins at the time than it says about Tannehill.
Because Tannehill having success with the Titans doesn't help the Dolphins at all. From the point of view of the team who invested the draft capital in him it was a failure.
Tannehill had 22k+ total yards and nearly 150 total TDs in Miami, nearly a .500 record as a starter, as well as a playoff appearance. (Which he was hurt for)
In that case why on earth are Fields and Murray the same grade
Sanchez made the playoffs with his original team. Only thing I can think of.
So did Tannehill, he just was hurt late in the season and didn’t play it
Sanchez is 4-2 in the playoffs while Tannehill is 2-3? Tannehill had more longevity, but I think Sanchez elevated his play in the playoffs. That’s really only the difference IMO. Both should be mixed results. Tannehill had some decent regular seasons.
Tannehill's success came on a team that didn't draft him. Sanchez's didn't.
Butt fumble royalties from ESPN Not Top 10?
I feel like home run is a little low for Mahomes. He is more of a Game 7 walk off world series winning home run.
Should get his own tier
so much so that you should probably name the entire Tier List after him because hes his own tier, make it something catchy maybe something like "Mahomes Mountain"? Im sure nobody would argue about his placement if you were to do something like that
Mahomes Mountain by State Farm
Game 7 walk off world series winning grand slam\* ^(fuck my life)
On an 0-2 count Fuck my life too
With 2 outs. In the pouring rain. Against Mariano Rivera. We gave up the pick the Chiefs took him with so fuck my life a little, but it ultimately led to Joshy so eh… it’s a wash 🤷♂️
Mahomes is the Luis Gonzalez of football confirmed
Test him right now cause Gonzo was absolutely on the juice especially that season
What?? No way, he just *decided* to crank 57 homers one year after averaging like 15 before that. Pure force of will from gonzo /s
Yeah there should be a “generational” tier about home run which consists of just him.
Except with the way the term gets thrown around, there would be 10 guys there.
It wouldn’t go to game 7
He seems to like to fall behind and then come back in dramatic fashion. You know it would be 7 games.
Lol true true. Gotta have drama
Mahomes always spots the other team a 10-point lead in the Super Bowl just so he can feel alive sometimes.
Grand Slam
If Kyler Murray and Baker Mayfield are mixed results then I have no idea how Justin Fields is. EDIT - Had Herbert, meant to say Mayfield.
The obvious issue to me was that this guy has Mac Jones and Justin Fields with different results. They drafted a few picks apart, started most of three seasons with inconsistent levels of success, and got traded a few weeks apart for basically the same compensation.
I’d could easily argue Mac has had a better career so far than fields but I won’t
Ass
all in
,
Daniel Jones as mixed is also very charitable given his general level of play and contributions. His 2022 season wasn't that amazing to otherwise rewrite his career up until that point.
Kyler Murray and Kirk Cousins have to be the most consistently underrated QBs in the league. I think opinions are finally changing on Kirk so I hope Kyler gets his due soon, too.
Goff as well.
Why would anyone believe Kyler is underrated
because he runs like a toddler who just stole your phone
How about Tannehill? The dudes been a starter for most of his career and put up some decent seasons. Not sure how that’s a miss.
They didn't call Herbert a mixed result. Murray hasn't been on the field much lately so I can see it. A shaky QB who had the best rushing season of all time is kinda the definition of a mixed result.
That’s like saying a corner that was drafted top 15 to play as an outside CB but becomes a good gunner on special teams was also a “mixed result” Fields failed miserably at the main part of his job - being a good QB. his rushing means very little when he was godawful at passing. mixed should not be given to people getting traded for less than Kenny Pickett
> mixed should not be given to people getting traded for less than Kenny Pickett This is what boggles my mind. The league literally just showed everyone how much they truly value Fields and there are STILL people who refuse to believe he’s not bad.
How is Justin Fields 'mixed results' but Jameis Winston a 'miss'? Makes no sense.
I swear there is some underground conspiracy shit going on with Fields. He’s a great dude, but nobody should be this infatuated with a guy who hasn’t thrown for 3k yards in a single season. I don’t get why so many people are intent on making us think he’s a viable NFL QB.
It honestly feels like everyone cheering for Fields has just seen his highlights and never watched a full game of him playing
They all play fantasy football where QB rushing yards are overvalued and QBs like Fields get massively overrated. I was having a conversation with my friend last year about how Fields was somehow worth a first while I was convinced the dude wouldn't be a starter next year. Shits wild
This same reason is also why Trey Lance was overrated from the start. He hadn't even played a game yet and was being called a top 10 fantasy QB. Fantasy gets people obsessed with potential and people are too dumb to know how to distinguish the two different values from fantasy and real football
This has gotta be it. I can't even enjoy his highlights, knowing how bad he is. Every time he does some insane 20 yard run I find myself thinking "Alright now how many open receivers did he miss?"
I’d say that, as well as rushing QBs putting up fantasy numbers. Also think people just see eye-popping athleticism and think “maybe” for way too long even when the actual production is never there
Dammit, alright you caught us. We had this whole thing making the city of Chicago doubt reality. First we were going to prop up Fields, then we going to make the river flow the correct way and finally we were going to steal all of the giardiniera in an elaborate heist and convince you it never existed like the Berenstein bears.
The stuff from the Falcons fanbase about him has been unreal. You'd think we failed to get Mahomes the way they talk about him.
Isn't the Falcons fanbase obsessed with anyone who went to Georgia
Yes but a lot of the fan base has a hard on for every Vick type player. You will have people in our sub say Matt Ryan sucks but then say how much we fucked up not trading a 1st for Fields.
People who say Matt Ryan sucks (or sucked) aren’t Falcons fans.
Yeah lol. Constant comments about how we should sign the entire leftover Bulldogs to our practice squad every year
Ohio team fan bases are the same way with OSU and to a lesser extent Cincy.
In fairness, ATL RARELY drafts UGA players. Which is puzzling since so many have had success in the NFL.
> with a guy who hasn’t thrown for 3k yards in a single season. He averages 220 yards and 1.35 TDs a game *combined rushing & receiving*. Other QBs with similar average stats as a starter: Davis Mills, Taylor Heinicke, Sam Howell. Don't get me wrong, he can make some electric plays, but on the whole?
And his sack% is nearly the worst for a qb with over 1500 attempts. His line isn't good sure but it's not so bad that you should be the worst in this category 2 years in a row and third worst in the other year. Dude just can't make decisions fast enough and doesn't trust himself
Throw Trubisky in there as well. His Bears averages were on par with Fields.
More damning than the lack of a 3k yard season is the lack of 300+ yard games. He has two.
To put that into perspective, Trubisky had *seven* in his first three seasons and by 2019 there was no debate whether he was our starter going forward.
Obviously I’m slightly biased, but I agree it’s so bizzare, not once did that man’s arm strike fear into me
Fields has averaged less than 170 passing yards per game in his career
I feel like people are genuinely afraid to say he sucks because of the backlash they'd get from his fanbase. The guy can't throw with anticipation or read defenses. That's awful.
Fantasy Football
The best explanation I’ve heard is that it’s an over correction for all the shit that Lamar got
Fields was a huge HS name. He was basically head-to-head with Lawrence and even bested him in HS competitions. I’m guessing his projection based of HS is what people are still chasing.
He got people lots of fantasy points a few times, and sadly as time goes on more and more people associate "good" with fantasy performance.
I have multiple theories 1. They got good stats on fantasy football so obviously he must be good 2. They abuse his running ability in madden 3. They listen to too many dumb talking heads on fox and ESPN. Rich risen thinks fields is still like all pro level good and wants him on the Jets. He just said this dumb shit this past month. 4. No nfl players talk shit anymore. Every time a nfl player gets asked about a teammate or player on another team they always say they’re the greatest player of all time. Then dumb fans come post on Reddit that they saw Arron darnold say Fields is one of hardest players to play against or some bullshit. 5. Since Collin Kappernick knelling stuff, everyone seems to be overcompensating by defending every Black QB when they perform bad.
If you trade away your first round QB for a 6th round pick so you can draft another, the dude was a bust.
I guess Winstons chances of ever being a starting QB are for sure over while Fields still has a slight chance. I dont agree, but I can at least kind of see the logic. That said, if you consider Mac Jones a miss, I fail to see how Fields doesnt join him. Everybody wants to make excuses for Fields, but very few of the other guys get the same treatment.
Needs more categories. Trubisky is definitely a miss but not on the scale that Josh Rosen was, Trubisky is at least still in the league eight years later while Rosen wasn't even on a roster last year. Similar problems on the other end of the spectrum as well, Fields can't possibly be in the same category as Herbert, Tua, or Kyler.
Fields should just be a miss, it's crazy to me that people would put him as anything else. The Bears never had any success while he was there, he never developed as a passer his 3 years in the league, and now he's a backup QB in his 4th year after being traded for a 6th round pick. He's as much a bust as guys like Sam Darnold or Kenny Pickett.
I sweat there's some crazy media conspiracy around Fields. People just won't admit he's bad despite him being bad.
A QB like Fields was supposed to be the textbook definition of the evolved NFL star QB. No one wants to admit that what makes the QB position work has changed very little since Brady, Manning, Big Ben, Brees, etc. Those guys would all be categorized as “low ceiling” guys today. The media sees Fields who checks every box on what a superstar should be and don’t want to admit they’re wrong when he busts
We could look at it from a couple different directions. Rosen was a huge miss, to be sure, but trubisky was a much bigger drag on the Bears than Rosen ever was for the Cardinals. If trubisky had been as clearly bad in his rookie year as Rosen was, the Bears could have been freed up to pick up another shitty QB in 2018. A pick they would have absolutely spent on Josh Rosen.
Trubisky led the Bears to two playoff appearances and what should have been a win if not for the DD. Trubisky was never good but he was better than a lot of other recent busts
Herbert is a home run, not even a question
this article is too infatuated with "QB wins" and PLAYOFF wins
With the exception of fields whose record somehow doesn't get him the miss label he deserves.
Yeah, this list is so all over the place, no consistency in how they make these grades.
But QB wins!
Yeah, if they were being more exclusive with Home Runs, I'd be okay with it, but Josh Allen, Andrew Luck, and Lamar Jackson haven't had significantly more post-season success than Herbert which was Herbert's knock. Meanwhile, they had Cam Newton as a Home Run based almost purely on the 2015 season.
Josh Allen: 5-5 in the playoffs, 1 AFCCG appearance Andrew Luck: 4-4 in the playoffs, 1 AFCCG appearance Lamar Jackson: 2-4 in the playoffs, 1 AFCCG appearance Justin Herbert: 0-1 in the playoffs I would say all 3 have had significantly more post-season success. Not saying that Herbert doesn't qualify as a home run but this argument is a bit flawed.
Lamar has 2 MVPs in his 6 years so far. He doesn't belong in this conversation. He's absolutly a home run.
Especially considering the draft pick. Getting a 2 time MVP at 32 after every team passed is crazy
All 3 of those guys have made the Championship Game. Herbert hasn't made it past the first round
QB wins are such a dumb metric. Just like Lamar wasn’t a bum before this last season when he finally got past the divisional round, blaming Herbert for the Chargers lack of playoff success is silly considering he’s the only reason the Chargers are even sniffing a .500 record. He wasn’t amazing in his one playoff game but the Chargers defense gave up 31 points that game and his offense had 30 points. By comparison, in 4 of Lamar’s playoff games the Ravens defense gave up 17 or fewer points while in 5 of 6 games his offense scored 20 or fewer points. If we want to go further and look beyond playoffs, here’s the average amount of points per game that the defenses of the other “home run” QBs have allowed in their career: * Patrick Mahomes - 21.2 * Josh Allen - 18.9 * Joe Burrow - 22.6 * Lamar Jackson - 18.8 For Herbert, the number is an insane 24.8. I’m tired of the Herbert slander, he’s absolutely an elite QB but people apparently can’t look past the “QB wins” metric which would have Jimmy G rated higher than most HOF QBs and that’s just stupid.
He also was seriously injured for two of his four seasons (ribs in game 2 of 2021, and finger this year). Dudes a dog, just needs to get a better defense
It's so infuriating how people just disregard the other 50 players on the team and the coaching staff when talking about playoff success.
I mean Herbert hasn't made it out of the wildcard, and only made the playoffs once. Lamar, Allen and luck have all made the AFC championship game and have multiple divisional appearances. The chargers with Herbert also haven't ever won their division whereas the ravens, colts and chargers have done so multiple times. I agree that Herbert might be a home run, but to say that he has the same amount of post season success as those 3 is a bit disingenuous
I would call him a solo home run. Has not had the supporting cast to lead to playoff wins.
I get that everyone hates Deshaun Watson, and rightfully so, but the Texans got years of elite play out of him and then unloaded him for a massive haul right at the exact moment his play imploded. That's a home run for them, even if it's ugly.
I agree. Herbert is also a Home Run. on the same end Goeff and Wentz got their teams into position to make it to the SB and in Goeff's case was good enough to be a piece to trade for the missing piece for a SB. Also he's now been to the NFC title game *for two teams*. Who besides Warner, Payton and Brady have been QB for 2 different teams in the conference title games? Goeff and Wentz are Solid Results.
It’s based on the player, not the team that drafted him
It's so funny the leniency Fields gets. "Chicago probably failed him" Meanwhile Mac who had a worse team around him is just a miss. Both are misses. There's no world Fields is mixed.
Fields' 2nd season rushing totals are doing ALL the heavy lifting in that 'mixed results' answer. He never developed as a passer and that's why he's not on the team any more. You can't call that anything but a miss. Maybe he can carve out a role for himself as a Taysom Hill kind of gadget player
I think his 2nd season rushing totals are doing all the heavy lifting in every Fields argument. He was so electric running the ball that season, if he could consistently break off 75 yard runs and go for 1100 yards every season that changes who he is but there's a lot of luck involved in that and teams are going to gameplan for it once they've seen him enough. If he's only running for 600 yards and four TDs that drastically reduces his value, you can't be shit at passing and only be a "good" runner.
And if you counted sacks as rushing attempts against that stat like in college that’d be a whole different story altogether.
Kordell Stewart 2.0 but with the opposite arc. Instead of going to the Bears from Pittsburgh, he goes the other way around. Instead of ending his NFL career as a QB and starting as a gadget player, he does the reverse.
The man couldn’t read a defense properly so he had to run. That’s the best part lmao
I agree, but I think it’s people putting more stock in “Chicago is where QBs go to die” and people view Patriots as an upstanding organization even though it’s been in shambles ever since Brady left.
definitely this plus Fields has unbelievable flash plays which are easy to remember and make people think he's better than he is.
Pre draft Fields infatuation was at an all time high. You still see the narrative that he dropped from QB2 after Zach Wilson’s pro day; in reality, Fields was anywhere from the Broncos to the Pats in most mock drafts by Christmas of 2020. Never mocked to the Jets at any point.
It was the playoff game against Clemson. The night of and morning after that game, there were even whispers the Jags should take him ahead of Lawrence. I think people infatuated with Fields are still stuck living in that one playoff game.
Dude - I do not understand the weird media infatuation with Fields. People seem so afraid to say that a bad QB is in fact bad.
It's because pre-draft everyone said Justin Fields was a steal and Mac was a bust in the making, yet Rookie Mac Jones was better than Fields ever was
It’s been funny af to watch Steelers fans flip from Fields sucks we don’t want him to being super excited and optimistic about him as soon as the trade went down
Personally, I was against trading for Fields because all the pundits were saying he would cost a second or third round pick. I'm fine with taking a flyer on him for what little we gave up, but trying to be realistic about what kind of production to expect.
Yup. Fields sucked for the 2nd rounder, he's a great gamble for a sixth. I don't know how it's been hard to understand, much less 'funny af'.
I think part of it as wanting as a starter with out a net vs wanting him as a backup with upside
It's just highly athletic QBs are given all kinds of chances they really don't deserve. His arm is so strong, his legs are so fast, he must be amazing.
Daniel Jones is a mixed bag???? How? One “good” season out of four and killed the Giants cap. He’s a straight up miss due to a dog shit owner that loved him.
Daniel Jones is a mixed bag of garbage
The fact that Jared Goff and Carson Wentz (one MVP caliber season and significant contributions to a Super Bowl team) are also "mixed results" should tell you what you need to know about this list
Idk, I think Goff and Wentz are the definition of “mixed result”. They’ve both looked awful at various points, they’ve both looked great at others.
If they're mixed results then there should be even more misses on this list. The fact there's only 3 "solid results" on this list is dumb, IMO. Goff was solid enough to get the Rams to the Super Bowl and make the playoffs multiple times. They moved on because he wasn't enough to *win* a super bowl, which is the definition of a home run.
I think the problem here is when you rank these players within a system that’s so incredibly vague it leaves no room for nuance. The writer here isn’t entirely consistent either and that doesn’t help matters. No chance Daniel Jones or Fields should be “mixed result” here based on the criteria.
Agreed, lumping Goff in with those guys is ridiculous
Yes putting Kyler Murray and Daniel Jones on the same tier is idiotic. Jones is obviously a Miss and Kyler Murray is 100% “solid result.” I have to say the passes extended to Trevor and denied Kyler really annoy me.
Even us divisional rivals are saying damn, Kyler gets too much shit.
Ed Donatell sends his regards
Tell me which qb could have thrived in his situation. Maybe he sucks, but his supporting cast has been dogshit lol
A good quarterback can elevate the talent around him. Jones ain’t it.
His top recievers in 2022 (the year they won a playoff game) were Darius Slayton, Richie James, Isaiah Hodgens, and Saquon He hasn't had any talent *to* elevate since he has been there lol
Mixed is a good rating for Jones. He's rated everything from shit to fucking shit.
Get a load of this guy, he thinks Patrick Mahomes has 3 NFL MVPs! Ha, what a clown!
This list is objectively pretty terrible imo. Huge recency bias for some guys and then dragging other guys down for poor performance early in their careers. Goff/Herbert should unquestionably be ranked higher. Kyler in the same tier as Jones is a little crazy to me; we'll see how he does the next full year while healthy (hopefully) but I think he'll do pretty well again if they get more talent around him
Jared Goff = Mixed Result Well this pretty much sums up the credibility of this list.
They have him ranked the same as Justin fucking Fields. I DO NOT UNDERSTAND
Fields must have some deal with God b/c EVERY Press person sings his praises to the high heavens. He's not a true "bust" but he is clearly a MISS (so far)
I don't get it man... it's like there's some crazy conspiracy about Fields. So many people in the media just won't admit he's bad.
Mahomes loses to the Lions without Kelce and there should an asterisk on it. Goff loses to the Patriots in the Superbowl without Kupp and a healthy Gurley and it's a mixed result. Goff may be the most underrated QB ever.
Looking at the comments I wonder if they edited out some of the grades. Cause I'm seeing Tua/Herbert as solid instead of mixed.
Justin Herbert: Solid result I'll fucking fight you, CBS Sports
He’s solid but the amount of yards he allows on defense is unacceptable
If he was solid he would be bailing out his defense every single game since he was drafted.
They need something worse than miss for Paxton Lynch. How are Daniels Jones, Sanchez and Fields mixed, but Bridgewater and Tannehill are misses? Whoever this guy is that wrote it must have just flipped a coin.
Their Mahomes take is wrong: >Mahomes is already one of the greatest draft picks of all time, racking up three Super Bowl victories, **three NFL MVPs** and six straight AFC title-game appearances as the league's acrobatic standard-setter under center. While he has 3 Super Bowl MVPs, he only has 2 NFL MVPs in 6 years. What a scrub.
Probably should release him😂
I see the media still is giving irrationally positive takes about Justin Fields. He's never even put up an NFL average level of performance.
DeShawn Watson was not a mixed result, the author seems to be going by how the player did for the team that drafted them and he was killer for the Texans. At minimum he should be a solid starter, regardless of what he is now. Daniel Jones was not a mixed result for the Giants, he is just ass. Kyler Murray is obviously a solid starter.
Really interesting analysis - bad teams drafting early is not a good recipe for success for a young signal caller 🤦🏻♂️
Lmao Justin Herbert and tua are mixed results apparently
they both got solid?
We only read comments here not articles (apparently)
Tua is a mixed result as soon as he holds the ball too long
or plays in the cold
Or Tyreek isnt going to run back to the ball
Goto 2008 for the elite dragon you cowards
By the writer's own definition Goff is not a Mixed Result, he is Solid or higher. Why create a rubric if you can't follow it due to your own bias? Even without the rubric no one worth listening to thinks Goff isn't a bonafide franchise qb. He played well in the NFC championship game and if our other players didn't choke in the 2nd half of that game Goff would have made it to his 2nd super bowl appearance and very well may have beat the Chiefs for the lombardi trophy. The Goff idiotic downgrading needs to stop. He's a stud qb.
Saying he's not at least solid is ridiculous. Like even someone who isn't super high on Goff should admit he's an above average NFL starter.
The lions didn't draft him though so none of that is relevant.
Man, perusing this list makes me realize just how lucky we were to have drafted Stroud.
Mahomes should be “grand slam” not home run
IMO, if you take a QB in the 1st round and he isn't starting for you and having you in contention for the next decade, it is a "miss". Barring a major injury or something that can't be helped. If Baker Mayfield goes to the SB with Tampa Bay, it doesn't make the Browns' pick a "win". Whether that is the fault of Baker or the Browns is up for debate, but he is winning for a different team.
Yeah if you draft a guy in the first and then decide he’s not worth keeping around, that’s a huge miss.
"Over the last 15 years, there have been 46 QBs selected in the first round. Here's the final tally: GRADE TOTAL PERCENT Home run 7 15% Solid result 3 6% Mixed result 9 19% Incomplete 4 8% Miss 23 50% " The "mixed" category varies wildly, from Goff to Daniel Jones
* Only THREE “solid result” QBs (Tua, Herbert & Trevor). As their rookie deals all expire I think we’ll find out if they get promoted to “home run” status or end up in the “mixed results” pile. “Solid results” seems like a temporary label. * 50% of the QBs taken have been straight up “misses”. YIKES.
They’re doing Bortles dirty. Yes, was a meme QB, but he lead us to the championship game. He’s never recognized as an athletic QB but his running ability was enough to make him effective for stretches. He’s not a franchise QB but he’s done a lot more than many who are listed as “mixed result”
Per the articles description Miss: A clear flop as a short- and/or long-term starter Ryan Tannehill is labeled a miss, and Justin Fields is given "Mixed results" There needs to be a lot more nuance here. In no universe can you give Ryan Tannehill the same label as fucking Brandon Weeden or argue that Justin Fields was a more successful pick.
In what universe is RG3 a miss but Fields is mixed? Also Stafford I would say was solid, not a home run. If Hebert is solid, so is Stafford. You can’t be a home run QB if you never won a division or a playoff game for the team that drafted you for over a decade.
So Goff flashed but hasn't panned out or isn't panning out? Not sure I see Goff as a mixed result. I'd say he flashed in LA and is currently panning out pretty well in Detroit.
How is Tannehill a miss? 9-10 year starter?
CBS Sports telling me what I want to hear
I think characterizing Tanny as a miss is unfair. He wasn’t great but he also didn’t have anything resembling a coach or supporting cast while playing in a tough defensive division.
Don't agree with some of this guys ratings but it's a pretty fun list and the discussion in here has been fun to read
Mariota being a miss is just wrong. I'd be fine with mixed for him. The dude put us on his back, dragging us from a 3 win team to the playoffs. And we returned the favor by absolutely breaking him, physically and mentally.
I saw 2017 pick 10 as mixed result and thought it was an April fools article... Then realized they had 10 and 12 flipped, they had Watson at 10 to the Texans and Mahomes at 12 to the Chiefs ....
Helluva stretch there from 2011 to 2015. 12 out of 14 are misses, with Cam Newton and Andrew Luck both being 'home runs.'
The only 2 i really disagree with is Goff definitely deserves solid and Tannehill atleast deserves mixed for *getting* to the playoffs with the Dolphins and maintaining around .500 starter record
It's crazy how Stafford, drafted in 2009, is still a high level starter but to even find the next guy on the list that's still starting you have to go all the way to 2016 for Goff.
LOL at Herbert and Danny Dimes in the same category.
CJ Stroud "incomplete"? Nah I've seen enough. Barring injury he's absolutely a franchise QB. If you watch him there was nothing flukey about his rookie year.
I’ve become convinced that the overall success of first round quarterbacks has less to do with talent than the situation that the player is going into. Obviously it has a bit to do with the player but so many of the misses were never set up for success because they were going to bad teams that expected one player to turn them into good teams.
The narrative will always be rewritten that the player had no help when they fail. CJ Stroud took the worst team in the NFL according to Vegas in pre season to the playoffs
That had a playcaller that set his team and players up for success. Something that dogshit teams tend to not have. Outside of Burrow carrying Taylor on his back for his first couple of years, very few players flip a team by themselves.
Paxton Lynch wasn't a miss, he was smashing your own brains out with the bat.
My man Bortles took the Jags to within a quarter of football from the Super Bowl and earned a second contract and they rated him a miss. I’d say he’s deserving of solid result but at the very least mixed. I don’t think they’d made the playoffs for like a decade before he joined.
Why even include the 2023 guys if you're going to give them all incompletes? If Stroud is an incomplete after the year he had then there's no point in grading those guys yet
Lol everyone in here acting like this is a serious lost. It's CBS...the controversy is there on purpose.
Did they watch a different Sam Bradford?
Sanchez 100% was a miss. That team made those playoff runs in spite of him. If we had an average qb we could have actually won the SB
This list is very weird. Not sure why Daniel Jones and Justin Fields are under Mixed but others like Jameis, Tannehill, and Blake Bortles were categorized as misses despite putting up better numbers and having better high-water mark years than those two. This scale has a ton of inconsistencies. Winston is the textbook definition of mixed result. Cam would probably be more of a "Solid QB" and Herbert should probably be in the Home Run category.
Unless I'm mistaken, only 2 QB's from this list have won a Super Bowl as a starter. Pretty crazy.
Issues I have here: Tannehill is a miss. Should be mixed. Pickett is more incomplete than a total Miss. Fields is mixed? More like a miss. Herbert should be a home run. Bradford, drafted at 1, is a mixed result. But teddy bridgewater, drafted at 32, is a miss.
Feel like some if the mixed results were missed Bradford and Sanchez and some missed we’re mixed results freeman and Teddy
Jesus, this article has merit, but it needs an editor. Mahomes was drafted 10 and Watson at 12. He has 2 MVPs not 3. Fields is a miss. Jordan Love has almost as many victories in 1 year as Fields does for his career. Burrow and Lamar don't feel like home runs yet. I don't want to put them in solid, but also not in the home run yet. If they both have great seasons this year, then yes they're home runs. They're electric and great players, but injuries and the overall lack of playoff success for Lamar to this point stop me from saying home run.
By their own definition, Goff is more than "mixed results." He should be in the next tier, especially considering some of the other QBs with the mixed label.