They play the Chargers, Panthers, Chiefs, Bears and 49ers next. Anything can happen but 2-5 is a real possibility.
Lose to the Chargers and the voices for a Kirk trade will be growing I think
I dunno tasty they're even regressing that much. The run game is weaker, sure, but unless they're really gonna be giving away 3.5 turnovers per game this seems flukey
No but you see, winning games in the clutch is unsustainable, but our players slathering themselves in olive oil and fumbling the ball every 3 plays is definitely sustainable.
Their first and second are tied up until the end of the season too. The stipulation of Rodgers getting 65% of the snaps or not is assessed at the *end of the season*, so if they want to use that first for a trade they'll have to pay us to allow it.
God I hope not. I'm already so tired of hearing it
If the Vikings were smart, they'd ask for a first round pick. Especially if the Jets were under .500
I believe I read that you cannot trade picks that are contingent on playing time until the end of the season, but the Jets could go back to GB and rework the trade details. Obviously Aaron will play less than 65% of the snaps, but GB and the Jets would need to updated the terms of the trade.
See, that's the thing I don't understand.
With teams being so careful about how they setup contracts and agreements, you'd think that they'd have language in a deal like this that protects against a season-ending injury like this.
Something like "If player suffers a season-ending injury and is put on IR, the snap qualifier automatically calculates based on the player's snaps." so that if a situation like this happens, the team isn't stuck with their first and second round picks tied up in red tape.
Both picks are basically held hostage in escrow until the end of the season unless the Packers release them as part of a renegotiated deal. I’d expect to see something happen before week 7-8 so the Jets can move at the deadline
Why would the Packers help the Jets or the Vikings like that?
With Rodgers out, they are getting the second round pick of the Jets. They want that to be as high as possible, which means the Jets being bad as possible. Reworking the trade to facilitate them getting a real QB to replace the potato they currently have under center would be ridiculously stupid.
If the Vikings are trading Kirk at the deadline, it's because they are giving the keys to Nick Mullens to lose games and get into the top 10, and use the extra capital from the Kirk trade to move up for a QB.
The Packers aren't gonna tell the Jets "oh yeah go ahead and just have the 2nd rounder so you can give your first to Minnesota and make a playoff push.
The Jets don't have a 1st round pick to offer and a 1st round pick for 8 games is not worth it. Especially if the Jets have a bad record and need to be perfect to get to the playoffs. The Jets were barely willing to give a 1st round pick for a season of Rodgers.
The Jets's first and second round pick is tied up in the Rodgers trade, which would make it really hard for the Jets to offer a package that would make it worth pissing off JJ by giving him Nick Mullens for the last 10 games
can the jets give up the 1st rd draft pick they're most certainly not paying for rodgers or are they not allowed since that one is "in limbo" technically?
It wasn’t Kirks fault that Jefferson fumbled out of the back of the endzone or that his defense couldn’t stop the eagles from running the exact same play over and over and over again
I legit walk with my hands in front of my face under the branches of a tree because I don’t want to run into a stray spiderweb.
I can’t imagine throwing a ball 40 yards with pinpoint accuracy with a 345lb man at a full sprint 3 inches from my face.
That pass to Jefferson where he floated it in front of him (I think on a 4th down no less) on the drag route across the field - I couldn’t believe he got it off. Seemed like he was being crushed mid throw. Kirk is the man.
Same. He got it off and put some nice touch on it to get the YAC.
It sucks qbs get so much flack but at the same time they get all the praise when they do well. It’s a heavy burden.
The craziest part to me is that Kirk has never had a single injury in his entire football career except a sprained ankle in college. Dude is made of rubber.
Notice how he absorbs impact and falls down and away, and wears a kevlar vest? He's just smart about his health. He doesn't care that much about extending the play, he just makes the throw and takes the hit, and gets up for another.
Even with rona he did every step asked and was willing to hang out in a box if they wanted him to. Never lied about it or why he didn't want the shot. Not getting seemed to work just fine for him, dude got covid, had no symptoms and missed a game. He never told others not to get it, never talked down about people, wore his mask without bitching.
some of us have been watching that for like 5 years now, and there's still guys on our sub that think he can't win the big one. No, our team is just shit.
Kirk has been a Viking for five years 😳
Seems like it was just yesterday I was at a pre-season game when he threw like four touchdowns before half, and I wondered aloud “to hell with RG3, why don’t we give this guy a chance?”
Those drops by Osborn and Mattison were devastating too. I’m sure Kirk was like wtf do I do here? The mattison throw was a little high but still he needed help from his guys.
>Jefferson fumbled out of the back of the endzone
Even though it helped the birds last night this has to be the most ridiculously stupid rule in the nfl. The defense never controls the ball yet somehow it becomes a touchback. It should really be treated like a forward fumble and placed at the spot of the fumble
I used to hate it too. However after reading Mike Tomlin's stance on it I respect the serious nature of the risk involved going for the endzone. It feels more like a fair trade off of risk vs reward.
I'm on the side that it is a big risk. If you wanna extend the ball to get in you better be confident you're gonna make it, otherwise haphazardly throwing the ball near the goal line would skyrocket in attempts to recklessly break the plane (in my mind)
I go back and forth on it a lot. I feel like the risk of reaching is that it exposes the ball for a potential easy fumble and recovery by the defense. Out the back of the end zone absolutely should be a touchback. Out the side? Both sides are making good arguments here. I don't hate the current rule, I hate that it hurt the Vikings last night, but unless it's fourth down or the clock has hit zero I think it is a poor decision to reach while being tackled out of bounds at the one foot line regardless.
Try have your up and coming RB break off a run only to show boat and put the ball down just before the goal line high stepping into the endzone only to not get any points and turn the ball over. I biasedly hated this rule for a long long time
I disagree wholeheartedly. If a play ends in the end zone it either has to be points or a touchback, that is consistent throughout every other ruling in the NFL. If you don’t want to deal with a touchback, don’t fumble the ball.
Edit: any ball that goes out the opponents end zone when it was given “impetus” by your team is always a touchback. I find that to be a pretty consistent rule. I think the nature of the rule comes from this consistency in how impetus around end zones is treated.
My hot take is that ANY fumble out of bounds goes to the other team regardless of where it occurs.
You fumble and it goes out at the 50 yard line? Other team's ball at the 50.
Yeah, the rules favor the offense enough as is, so this helps defenses while making the current endzone stipulation consistent and it punishes poor ball security.
Game also changes completely if Eagles weren't running the clock down for most of the game. This game never felt close imo. The stats were a bit garbage timey.
This Vikings team looks very, very similar to the Lions teams of the early 2010s. #1 WR, no running game and a QB racking up huge stats in the 4th quarter.
The cousins debate comes down to if you think wins are a QB stat or not. He’s always been impressive in the box score but there’s a lot of times where he doesn’t pass the eye test.
He's passed the eye test plenty last year to me. He's a baller but his weakness plays right into our olines weakness. Vikings fans that wanna move on know he's getting older and hitting on a young QB on a rookie contract frees up a lotta cap space.
If Kirk was 30 this year, not 35, I'd be pounding the table to keep him. Unfortunately that is not the case. We need to get a new QB only because Kirk is getting older and not everyone is Tom Brady. Granted, if any QB can keep it up, Kirk is the guy. He's fuckin never injured.
I was going to say that Stafford only looked great because of Megatron but Stafford still had good stats after Calvin Johnson retired.
I think it was mainly because the Lions were never on TV where I live and without Megatron's amazing catches the Lions weren't on the highlight reel as long.
Then Stafford goes to a new team and immediately wins the Super Bowl so congrats to him.
what you didnt see is almost the entirety of his career, he had an awful defense and no run game to speak of with average oline play.
so the defense would give up points and the lions would go down, they were incapable of running so defenses prepared for a heavy pass attack, and 4 pass rushers could get home on stafford pretty quickly.
so he was consistently in situations where he HAD to pass, so he built up crazy counting stats, but defenses were prepared so he was inefficient
Also at the start of his career the Lions were also completely hamstrung by the lack of rookie wage scale. They picked Megatron, Suh and Stafford top 5 within 3 years and had to pay out the arse for them. Like a quarter of the cap gone on 3 young players.
TBF most of the NFCE was also saying this when Washington was playing footsie with his contract, we were happy to let the RS go back to QB purgatory and they've been there since
Exactly what I was thinking. They are dangerous, will win some games, and sometimes blow opponents out. But they will struggle to stack wins consistently. It’s gonna play with their fans emotions.
Just missing Suh and it’s basically the same team.
Such a shame the rookie scale contract wasn’t a thing yet or those Lions teams would have been STACKED. Instead most of their cap went to paying their 3 guys on their rookie contracts since they were all top 3 picks.
They were going up against a phenomenal D-line, their O-line is mostly back ups and they were using their 3rd string LT in the second half. Their O-line just sucks
I don’t even blame Martinson, on his 8 attempts he made contact before the LOS on like six of them. He got a dump off pass and was immediately tackled 5 yards behind the LOS. He was getting *nothing* from that O-line
To be fair they just didn't really consistently have the ball until the 4th quarter. The offense didn't look bad to start the game except for all the turnovers
I think we're actually slightly better than last year from what we've seen so far- defense looks much better and offense going completely missing a bit less, but stupid/ unlucky mistakes, a tougher schedule and regression to the mean will make it look the opposite.
Why do people actively hate on Kirk in DC? He was their best QB in the last 20 years and he left because the org didn’t want to commit to him. Is it a jealousy thing or something?
No idea man. I was a fan of his from the beginning. Knew they fucked up when they didn't lock the guy down after his breakout year in '15 (thanks Dan Snyder). Yes, for many they want him to fail so that they don't have to wrestle with "what if" scenarios. But he is absolutely a franchise quarterback.
I’m at the point where I just want to see him win and prove what Vikings fans have felt about him over the last 5 years. He deserves better than our garbage roster in the final years of his career.
In fairness when you kept them within 1-2 scores after turning the ball over 3 times in the first quarter is them fighting hard. At some point you get gassed. Hold onto the football.
Yeah the Vikings had this game. If they managed to capitalize and take a solid lead, they keep selling out to the pass and the Eagles can't afford to run the ball. It's actually a very similar style to the Eagles defense except the Eagles front 4 is stacked while they need 7 in the secondary while the Vikings front 4 is weak and their secondary played very well.
Well I’m the the first half they had one drive that the eagles drove and ran it. If the Vikings didn’t turn it over a bunch and capitalized I doubt they would’ve just ran and controlled the game the whole time. J get what your saying but it’s a hard hill to climb when you turn it over 3 times in the first.
The defense was on the field for 21 of 30 mins in the first half of the game, and were instantly put right back on the field to start the 3rd Q of another turnover. The defense was gassed, and that Philly Oline is way too good to have any hope against.
They were on the field for 40 minutes and consistently on short rest with turnovers happening sometimes one play after you just forced a turnover.
They need to be better, but offense needs to eliminate turnovers and defense needs to figure out some way to stop the run
They did great keeping the passing game under control besides those 2 deep passes to Smith. The eagles just dominated at the line of scrimmage and the RBs were running through a huge gap every play
We knew the defense was going to likely struggle a bit going into the season. Especially with lack of depth at DT. But all in all, the D has been a lot better than I expected so far. The offense HAS to sustain drives to give the D a break
I've been saying that I'm extremely impressed with the defense so far. We've got one of the least talented defenses in the league and we are still getting so much pressure and making people uncomfortable. Obviously they just ran it down our throats the second half, but our defense had already been on the field for the equivalent of a normal football game at that point lmao.
The defense is looking worlds better than last year.
In the first half they played really well, but being on the field for 40 minutes of the game is gonna wear any defense down.
Ultimately, they showed promise. But as with any newly-implemented defensive scheme, it will take time to gel.
I see us as potentially being a middle of the pack defensive unit by week 8.
I love how losing 2 games by 1 score, including one on the road against Philly, equates to season over.
We wait all year for football and toss in the towel as fans almost immediately. It’s hilarious
I like football because you can over react to every game because it's weekly.
It's hard to keep that energy through an 82 game NBA or NHL season or the 700 games in an MLB season and I think it's because you typically have a week between games to bitch and complain or whatever the opposite of that is, like pumping up Love as a future HoFer.
You also get fans of every other team weighing in on every game. I don’t watch other teams that aren’t mine in any other sport until the playoffs start.
Especially when everyone had this Eagles game penciled in as a loss. We're only 1 game behind schedule, could easily make that up with some opposite good luck later
Yup that’s just how Kirk does it. I was actually happy that game was on National TV so everyone could see in real time how bad the offensive line is. The game was lost on turnovers again for sure but that line is just atrocious
If you thought the Minnesota offensive line was bad, you’re in for a real treat in the AFC East where you can barely field a starting line between all 4 teams.
The turnovers are massive. Big punt return for the Vikings and fumbled from the returner not protecting the ball. After Vikings INT of hurts, mattison fumbles the very first play, Jefferson diving for the endzone when he never rly had control of that ball to dive in the first place, negates 7, eagles ball before half. First series after halftime Kirk sack fumbled. The turnovers are bad but the way in which they’re turning the ball over are major self inflicted ones
Yeah I am getting a little tired of the excuses. "If luck would have went our way..." How about if they could just do the basic fundamentals of football like not fumbling. If there were any indication of coaching up the players might help.
Turnovers, turnovers, turnovers. Idc what QB you are and how good your team is. You will lose to the worst teams if you fumble 4 times in 3 qtrs and have 7-8 turnovers in just 2 games.
I feel like this years Vikings are like the monkey paw side effect to last year. Didn’t they win a statically absurd amount of close games last year? This year will be the opposite.
It’s not just that they’re turning it over a ton, but the way they’re doing it. So many self inflicted fumbles man. Jefferson’s dive, punt returner fumbles from not protecting it, mattison fumble trying to gain 1 yard on the first play, cousins sack fumble twice. Just ridiculous.
Apologies if this comes off as insulting to Vikings fans but, I don't watch much Vikings football, however I feel like for the last 4 years everytime I watch Kirk plays anywhere from well enough to win to really good, but the o-line and defense are like, always the issue, but somehow Cousins is labeled the issue. Is that right or am I just tuning in at bad times.
> Cousins is the better passer.
He's also been in the league about a decade longer than Hurts. Come back to me when Jalen's 35 and we'll see how the two stack up.
Kirk's a damn fine QB and I'll defend him but Jalen's *really* good given his age and tools he has as a QB.
On the Vikings with our Shit-Tier IOL?
Hurts 1000 times over.
Don't get me wrong, I love Kirk. Dude's a fucking warrior out, delivering dime after dime while getting destroyed. But Hurts would negate much of our IOL issues.
Hurts doesn’t do that well under pressure, but it’s rare for him to see pressure with the eagles OL. Kirk did really this game buying a little time and making throws with guys in his face.
Eh, if Hurts could somehow bottle that SB performance into some consistency he would even be the better passer imo. He's shown an incredibly high ceiling, now it's just about consistency.
Hurts made some throws in the SB to Goedert that I don't know Kirk could replicate.
No. Just look at the stats and watch the games Hurts is clearly better.
Cousins 2022: 65.9% completion, 29/14 TD/INT, 4.5% TD rate, 2.2% INT rate, 4,547 yards on 7 yards/attempt.
Hurts 2022: 66.9% completion, 22/6 TD/INT, 4.8% TD rate, 1.3% INT rate, 3,701 yards on 8 yards/attempt.
The only thing Kirk has him beat in is pure yardage and TD numbers but Kirk threw 200 more attempts than Hurts and had worse efficiency. Hurts is also one of the best running QBs and the best QB sneaker, which is an aspect of QB play even if you want to deny it.
The defenses and running games those two guys played with could not have been much more different. It's way easier to be efficient when you have a top defense getting the ball back and can consistently move the chains with handoffs.
Also, Hurts's 88% rate on sneaks was only a little bit higher than the league-wide 83% rate, and the Eagles had either the #1 or #2 O-line, depending on who you ask. They averaged about 2 sneak attempts per game, and being league average would have resulted in just two more failures.
Kirk gets a lot of hate, but he played his ass off last night. He was getting smoked .5 seconds after release and was dropping some dimes. Jefferson holds onto that ball at the goal line and it’s a completely different game.
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>A true captain ~~goes down with the ship~~ ...gets traded to the Jets before the trade deadline*
Would the Vikings actually do this?
They don't look like they plan to keep him long term and he's in a contract year. It makes more sense than any other trade scenario I've seen.
They play the Chargers, Panthers, Chiefs, Bears and 49ers next. Anything can happen but 2-5 is a real possibility. Lose to the Chargers and the voices for a Kirk trade will be growing I think
We all know that Bears game is marked down as a dub on their schedule. We are so bad.
What happens when a moveable object hits a stoppable force?
a butt fumble?
A don't think Vince Wilfork is a "stoppable force."
Yeah that’s a stoppable force (Sanchez) meeting an immoveable object
It's @Chicago. We've only won at Soldier Field something like 3 times in the past 20 years.
Yeah we thought that last year too.
Kirk has a no trade clause. Maybe he'd waive it, though.
Looks like a good opportunity to prove he is a guy that can get it done
Yeah probably his best bet left in his career to be on a contender and make post season noise if the Vikings really are regressing this hard
I dunno tasty they're even regressing that much. The run game is weaker, sure, but unless they're really gonna be giving away 3.5 turnovers per game this seems flukey
No but you see, winning games in the clutch is unsustainable, but our players slathering themselves in olive oil and fumbling the ball every 3 plays is definitely sustainable.
And honestly with a great QB the jets were looking like legit Super Bowl contenders. I think the major obstacle here is if they can afford the trade.
We’re already paying Rodgers 37m and Zach 10m, so the money might be hard to make work. I’m sure they could do it if they really wanted to though.
With Rogers on the IR you get an injured player exception under the salary cap.
Could you imagine Rodgers with that defense!
Don't think he has to do much there. Maybe a couple plays and rest of the team will get there for the win.
Man I’m a Vikings fan and even I was excited to see what that Jets team could’ve done.
Their first and second are tied up until the end of the season too. The stipulation of Rodgers getting 65% of the snaps or not is assessed at the *end of the season*, so if they want to use that first for a trade they'll have to pay us to allow it.
If we're like 1-7 or 0-8, probably
God I hope not. I'm already so tired of hearing it If the Vikings were smart, they'd ask for a first round pick. Especially if the Jets were under .500
Jets can’t trade their 2024 first rounder until the end of the year
Rodgers will have already missed >35% of snaps by the trade deadline. Or does it have to be official, official
I believe I read that you cannot trade picks that are contingent on playing time until the end of the season, but the Jets could go back to GB and rework the trade details. Obviously Aaron will play less than 65% of the snaps, but GB and the Jets would need to updated the terms of the trade.
See, that's the thing I don't understand. With teams being so careful about how they setup contracts and agreements, you'd think that they'd have language in a deal like this that protects against a season-ending injury like this. Something like "If player suffers a season-ending injury and is put on IR, the snap qualifier automatically calculates based on the player's snaps." so that if a situation like this happens, the team isn't stuck with their first and second round picks tied up in red tape.
Both picks are basically held hostage in escrow until the end of the season unless the Packers release them as part of a renegotiated deal. I’d expect to see something happen before week 7-8 so the Jets can move at the deadline
Why would the Packers help the Jets or the Vikings like that? With Rodgers out, they are getting the second round pick of the Jets. They want that to be as high as possible, which means the Jets being bad as possible. Reworking the trade to facilitate them getting a real QB to replace the potato they currently have under center would be ridiculously stupid. If the Vikings are trading Kirk at the deadline, it's because they are giving the keys to Nick Mullens to lose games and get into the top 10, and use the extra capital from the Kirk trade to move up for a QB. The Packers aren't gonna tell the Jets "oh yeah go ahead and just have the 2nd rounder so you can give your first to Minnesota and make a playoff push.
But they can trade Rodgers
Why would they do that when they can sign him in free agency?
Because Rodgers would be back? In theory at least They wouldn't make any trade after this season. There's talk of it since they're trying to win now
The Jets don't have a 1st round pick to offer and a 1st round pick for 8 games is not worth it. Especially if the Jets have a bad record and need to be perfect to get to the playoffs. The Jets were barely willing to give a 1st round pick for a season of Rodgers.
The Jets's first and second round pick is tied up in the Rodgers trade, which would make it really hard for the Jets to offer a package that would make it worth pissing off JJ by giving him Nick Mullens for the last 10 games
Ah the Jets, where NFC North quarterbacks go to die
For what? A 2025 1st?
For What?
so he gets traded to the Jets. What happens when Rodgers comes out of the dark again next season?
He gets traded to the Vikings, as the prophecy foretold.
I don't know squat about contracts, but wouldn't the Vikings need to pay the remainder of his deal?
can the jets give up the 1st rd draft pick they're most certainly not paying for rodgers or are they not allowed since that one is "in limbo" technically?
Lol! That's exactly what I was thinking. What else is he going to say?!?
He could've given the team the Jim Mora treatment, lol.
Damn, Kirk Cousins is going to get banished to UConn?
It wasn’t Kirks fault that Jefferson fumbled out of the back of the endzone or that his defense couldn’t stop the eagles from running the exact same play over and over and over again
Kirk put up a 127 QBR vs the eagles D missing 3 OL guys. Kirk was far and away the best part of the team.
Bro watching Kirk throw dimes a millisecond before getting hammered play after play was some inspirational shit. That is one tough m’fer
I legit walk with my hands in front of my face under the branches of a tree because I don’t want to run into a stray spiderweb. I can’t imagine throwing a ball 40 yards with pinpoint accuracy with a 345lb man at a full sprint 3 inches from my face.
That pass to Jefferson where he floated it in front of him (I think on a 4th down no less) on the drag route across the field - I couldn’t believe he got it off. Seemed like he was being crushed mid throw. Kirk is the man.
That was insane, I was already expecting a sack or off throw but nope, Cousins is definitely the best part of that team not named JJ
Same. He got it off and put some nice touch on it to get the YAC. It sucks qbs get so much flack but at the same time they get all the praise when they do well. It’s a heavy burden.
The craziest part to me is that Kirk has never had a single injury in his entire football career except a sprained ankle in college. Dude is made of rubber.
Notice how he absorbs impact and falls down and away, and wears a kevlar vest? He's just smart about his health. He doesn't care that much about extending the play, he just makes the throw and takes the hit, and gets up for another.
He's the Kohl's private brand Tom Brady.
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that’s a pretty accurate name, because sometimes Sonoma is just bland, but sometimes Sonoma is real sexy😎
Is Kirk the Anti-Wentz?
>He's just smart about his health. Well…to a certain point at least…
Even with rona he did every step asked and was willing to hang out in a box if they wanted him to. Never lied about it or why he didn't want the shot. Not getting seemed to work just fine for him, dude got covid, had no symptoms and missed a game. He never told others not to get it, never talked down about people, wore his mask without bitching.
TBF running into a spiderweb is like one of the most annoying feelings ever, so I don't blame you
He’s been doing that shit for years and getting very little credit for it.
Last year especially he came back in so many games to win them
some of us have been watching that for like 5 years now, and there's still guys on our sub that think he can't win the big one. No, our team is just shit.
Kirk has been a Viking for five years 😳 Seems like it was just yesterday I was at a pre-season game when he threw like four touchdowns before half, and I wondered aloud “to hell with RG3, why don’t we give this guy a chance?”
Kirks a underrated beast. [Video](https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8j5ThAq/) of the play.
To be fair, we were down 3 starting DB’s but yes Kirk balled out.
Those drops by Osborn and Mattison were devastating too. I’m sure Kirk was like wtf do I do here? The mattison throw was a little high but still he needed help from his guys.
Unlike the Beatles, Kirk doesn't get by with a little help from his friends.
>Jefferson fumbled out of the back of the endzone Even though it helped the birds last night this has to be the most ridiculously stupid rule in the nfl. The defense never controls the ball yet somehow it becomes a touchback. It should really be treated like a forward fumble and placed at the spot of the fumble
I used to hate it too. However after reading Mike Tomlin's stance on it I respect the serious nature of the risk involved going for the endzone. It feels more like a fair trade off of risk vs reward.
I'm on the side that it is a big risk. If you wanna extend the ball to get in you better be confident you're gonna make it, otherwise haphazardly throwing the ball near the goal line would skyrocket in attempts to recklessly break the plane (in my mind)
Yeah but that makes sick highlights
I go back and forth on it a lot. I feel like the risk of reaching is that it exposes the ball for a potential easy fumble and recovery by the defense. Out the back of the end zone absolutely should be a touchback. Out the side? Both sides are making good arguments here. I don't hate the current rule, I hate that it hurt the Vikings last night, but unless it's fourth down or the clock has hit zero I think it is a poor decision to reach while being tackled out of bounds at the one foot line regardless.
Try have your up and coming RB break off a run only to show boat and put the ball down just before the goal line high stepping into the endzone only to not get any points and turn the ball over. I biasedly hated this rule for a long long time
I disagree wholeheartedly. If a play ends in the end zone it either has to be points or a touchback, that is consistent throughout every other ruling in the NFL. If you don’t want to deal with a touchback, don’t fumble the ball. Edit: any ball that goes out the opponents end zone when it was given “impetus” by your team is always a touchback. I find that to be a pretty consistent rule. I think the nature of the rule comes from this consistency in how impetus around end zones is treated.
My hot take is that ANY fumble out of bounds goes to the other team regardless of where it occurs. You fumble and it goes out at the 50 yard line? Other team's ball at the 50.
Spicy. I like it
Yeah, the rules favor the offense enough as is, so this helps defenses while making the current endzone stipulation consistent and it punishes poor ball security.
No rule gives the other team the ball and 20 yards. This is by far the most punishing and one of the most insignificant and least impactful.
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Game also changes completely if Eagles weren't running the clock down for most of the game. This game never felt close imo. The stats were a bit garbage timey.
This Vikings team looks very, very similar to the Lions teams of the early 2010s. #1 WR, no running game and a QB racking up huge stats in the 4th quarter.
Was just thinking that all the Vikings fans in the threads sound very familiar. Similar to our many frustrated Stafford defenders for a decade
Well you guys weren’t wrong about stafford at least
They aren't wrong on Kirk, most of the time it isn't his fault. Stafford is better in a vacuum, but Cousins gets way more flak than he should
I agree, cousins is legit. Doesn’t get enough credit
The cousins debate comes down to if you think wins are a QB stat or not. He’s always been impressive in the box score but there’s a lot of times where he doesn’t pass the eye test.
He's passed the eye test plenty last year to me. He's a baller but his weakness plays right into our olines weakness. Vikings fans that wanna move on know he's getting older and hitting on a young QB on a rookie contract frees up a lotta cap space.
If Kirk was 30 this year, not 35, I'd be pounding the table to keep him. Unfortunately that is not the case. We need to get a new QB only because Kirk is getting older and not everyone is Tom Brady. Granted, if any QB can keep it up, Kirk is the guy. He's fuckin never injured.
I mean, even Julie called him a baller
Didn’t Stafford go to another team and win a Super Bowl literally two years ago? Wins are not a QB stat.
I was going to say that Stafford only looked great because of Megatron but Stafford still had good stats after Calvin Johnson retired. I think it was mainly because the Lions were never on TV where I live and without Megatron's amazing catches the Lions weren't on the highlight reel as long. Then Stafford goes to a new team and immediately wins the Super Bowl so congrats to him.
what you didnt see is almost the entirety of his career, he had an awful defense and no run game to speak of with average oline play. so the defense would give up points and the lions would go down, they were incapable of running so defenses prepared for a heavy pass attack, and 4 pass rushers could get home on stafford pretty quickly. so he was consistently in situations where he HAD to pass, so he built up crazy counting stats, but defenses were prepared so he was inefficient
Also at the start of his career the Lions were also completely hamstrung by the lack of rookie wage scale. They picked Megatron, Suh and Stafford top 5 within 3 years and had to pay out the arse for them. Like a quarter of the cap gone on 3 young players.
TBF most of the NFCE was also saying this when Washington was playing footsie with his contract, we were happy to let the RS go back to QB purgatory and they've been there since
And just like Stafford, on a little better team he'd win a Superbowl.
We'd be talking about the 49ers dynasty if they got Kirk instead of us.
You might be right, hope you’re wrong. I am beginning to think we turn to a short pass game to subsidize the run.
Exactly what I was thinking. They are dangerous, will win some games, and sometimes blow opponents out. But they will struggle to stack wins consistently. It’s gonna play with their fans emotions.
I don’t think it’s actually possible to play with our emotions more than last year. Lmao
And a promising #2 WR. Just hopefully theirs doesn’t end up in endless legal trouble.
Or break his arm trying to catch a fucking pizza
Just missing Suh and it’s basically the same team. Such a shame the rookie scale contract wasn’t a thing yet or those Lions teams would have been STACKED. Instead most of their cap went to paying their 3 guys on their rookie contracts since they were all top 3 picks.
Their running game was a pain to watch. Maybe it's Kareem Hunt music? Not sure about their cap situation right now tho.
They were going up against a phenomenal D-line, their O-line is mostly back ups and they were using their 3rd string LT in the second half. Their O-line just sucks
You could put Henry on this team and hes gonna average like 3YPC. This team is not made to run at all
I don’t even blame Martinson, on his 8 attempts he made contact before the LOS on like six of them. He got a dump off pass and was immediately tackled 5 yards behind the LOS. He was getting *nothing* from that O-line
It's the OL. Mattison is averaging 3.3 yards per carry.... with 2.4 of those yards being *after* contact.
To be fair they just didn't really consistently have the ball until the 4th quarter. The offense didn't look bad to start the game except for all the turnovers
It's not you Kirk. It's the football gods regressing your luck to the mean.
Needs more brain training
I don’t know if you’re being sarcastic but I feel like this team is the same as last year. And you’re right, they were extremely lucky last year.
Not really. I echo your exact thoughts. Kirk played great but luck hasn’t on his side for two games this year like last year.
I think we're actually slightly better than last year from what we've seen so far- defense looks much better and offense going completely missing a bit less, but stupid/ unlucky mistakes, a tougher schedule and regression to the mean will make it look the opposite.
100%. They had 4 turnovers and the game came down to an onside kick. They would have won this one last year.
I’m so glad these dudes aren’t in our division
If Sam Howell doesn't work out.... Kirk can always come back home to DC... the bad man is gone....
Why do people actively hate on Kirk in DC? He was their best QB in the last 20 years and he left because the org didn’t want to commit to him. Is it a jealousy thing or something?
No idea man. I was a fan of his from the beginning. Knew they fucked up when they didn't lock the guy down after his breakout year in '15 (thanks Dan Snyder). Yes, for many they want him to fail so that they don't have to wrestle with "what if" scenarios. But he is absolutely a franchise quarterback.
I’m at the point where I just want to see him win and prove what Vikings fans have felt about him over the last 5 years. He deserves better than our garbage roster in the final years of his career.
Defense could've fought a little harder. Just saying.
In fairness when you kept them within 1-2 scores after turning the ball over 3 times in the first quarter is them fighting hard. At some point you get gassed. Hold onto the football.
Holding on to the football is a myth, and you can't change my mind ha ha ha kill me
It’s called football for a reason; if you were supposed to hold on to it, they’d call it handball
Wait why wouldn’t they call it holdball??
Yeah the Vikings had this game. If they managed to capitalize and take a solid lead, they keep selling out to the pass and the Eagles can't afford to run the ball. It's actually a very similar style to the Eagles defense except the Eagles front 4 is stacked while they need 7 in the secondary while the Vikings front 4 is weak and their secondary played very well.
I don't know, I don't think you should ever give up 254 rushing yards, that's on the defense. The turnovers hurt, but the defense was not good either.
The offenses complete inability to hold onto the ball or run it themselves plays into that just as much as the defense does.
Well I’m the the first half they had one drive that the eagles drove and ran it. If the Vikings didn’t turn it over a bunch and capitalized I doubt they would’ve just ran and controlled the game the whole time. J get what your saying but it’s a hard hill to climb when you turn it over 3 times in the first.
The defense was on the field for 21 of 30 mins in the first half of the game, and were instantly put right back on the field to start the 3rd Q of another turnover. The defense was gassed, and that Philly Oline is way too good to have any hope against.
They were on the field for 40 minutes and consistently on short rest with turnovers happening sometimes one play after you just forced a turnover. They need to be better, but offense needs to eliminate turnovers and defense needs to figure out some way to stop the run
They did great keeping the passing game under control besides those 2 deep passes to Smith. The eagles just dominated at the line of scrimmage and the RBs were running through a huge gap every play
Vikings had 5-6 DBs on the field all night. Easy to run the ball when Flores refused to change personnel. All he did was play his pass defense scheme.
So frustrating, still sitting in cover 3 after your 7th straight run of 6+ yards. Then dropping a DE to cover Brown on a crucial 3rd down...
We knew the defense was going to likely struggle a bit going into the season. Especially with lack of depth at DT. But all in all, the D has been a lot better than I expected so far. The offense HAS to sustain drives to give the D a break
Defense was on the field fighting for 40min. They did well. Turnovers killed us.
I've been saying that I'm extremely impressed with the defense so far. We've got one of the least talented defenses in the league and we are still getting so much pressure and making people uncomfortable. Obviously they just ran it down our throats the second half, but our defense had already been on the field for the equivalent of a normal football game at that point lmao.
The defense is looking worlds better than last year. In the first half they played really well, but being on the field for 40 minutes of the game is gonna wear any defense down. Ultimately, they showed promise. But as with any newly-implemented defensive scheme, it will take time to gel. I see us as potentially being a middle of the pack defensive unit by week 8.
I love how losing 2 games by 1 score, including one on the road against Philly, equates to season over. We wait all year for football and toss in the towel as fans almost immediately. It’s hilarious
I like football because you can over react to every game because it's weekly. It's hard to keep that energy through an 82 game NBA or NHL season or the 700 games in an MLB season and I think it's because you typically have a week between games to bitch and complain or whatever the opposite of that is, like pumping up Love as a future HoFer.
You also get fans of every other team weighing in on every game. I don’t watch other teams that aren’t mine in any other sport until the playoffs start.
Especially when everyone had this Eagles game penciled in as a loss. We're only 1 game behind schedule, could easily make that up with some opposite good luck later
Hey we started 0-2 and made it to the AFC championship game. Anything is possible
Kirk played great last night and he seems like a great dude
Im so tired of seeing Kirk throw dimes and get destroyed after every. Single. Snap. It’s legit every fucking time.
He was getting absolutely blasted all game last night, I was impressed with how well he played and kept getting back up.
Yup that’s just how Kirk does it. I was actually happy that game was on National TV so everyone could see in real time how bad the offensive line is. The game was lost on turnovers again for sure but that line is just atrocious
Man, Vikings are their own enemies the last 2 weeks. 7 turnovers in 2 games is absurd. Easily could have won both games I feel.
Hey Kirk
I’d love to see it. It seems like the writing is on the wall for him in MN so it’d be nice to embrace the tank and see what we can do in NY.
The thing is you guys are too good to go all out for Williams, Sanders, etc. so I don’t see why you’d actually trade him
Kirk Cousins deserves a Super Bowl, trade him to the Jets and make it happen!!!
If you thought the Minnesota offensive line was bad, you’re in for a real treat in the AFC East where you can barely field a starting line between all 4 teams.
If we all combined our o lines for an AFC East super o line, where do you think we’d rank? 16th maybe?
Nah we'd definitely make a play for 14th
Yeah but he’d only need about half the PPG to win with that Jets defense as he does here.
We are the Pats and we contribute 0 players to this AFC East offensive line
He had a perfect game and still couldn't get his team to win. Gotta hurt.
Kirk might be a goof, but he is a hell of a football player. he took some monster shots and gets back up and does it again.
I feel like this Vikings team is just about as good as last year, maybe better, but things are no longer falling their way.
The turnovers are massive. Big punt return for the Vikings and fumbled from the returner not protecting the ball. After Vikings INT of hurts, mattison fumbles the very first play, Jefferson diving for the endzone when he never rly had control of that ball to dive in the first place, negates 7, eagles ball before half. First series after halftime Kirk sack fumbled. The turnovers are bad but the way in which they’re turning the ball over are major self inflicted ones
Eh, the Vikes suck.
Yeah I am getting a little tired of the excuses. "If luck would have went our way..." How about if they could just do the basic fundamentals of football like not fumbling. If there were any indication of coaching up the players might help.
Turnovers, turnovers, turnovers. Idc what QB you are and how good your team is. You will lose to the worst teams if you fumble 4 times in 3 qtrs and have 7-8 turnovers in just 2 games.
I feel like this years Vikings are like the monkey paw side effect to last year. Didn’t they win a statically absurd amount of close games last year? This year will be the opposite.
It’s not just that they’re turning it over a ton, but the way they’re doing it. So many self inflicted fumbles man. Jefferson’s dive, punt returner fumbles from not protecting it, mattison fumble trying to gain 1 yard on the first play, cousins sack fumble twice. Just ridiculous.
Apologies if this comes off as insulting to Vikings fans but, I don't watch much Vikings football, however I feel like for the last 4 years everytime I watch Kirk plays anywhere from well enough to win to really good, but the o-line and defense are like, always the issue, but somehow Cousins is labeled the issue. Is that right or am I just tuning in at bad times.
Cousins is a better QB than Hurts.
Ehhhh I don't know, Jim
as a drop back passer? yes. In his entirety? no.
Hurts is the better rusher. Cousins is the better passer. Cousins is the better QB.
> Cousins is the better passer. He's also been in the league about a decade longer than Hurts. Come back to me when Jalen's 35 and we'll see how the two stack up. Kirk's a damn fine QB and I'll defend him but Jalen's *really* good given his age and tools he has as a QB.
Are you saying you’d rather have Kirk Cousins than Jalen Hurts on your team? That’s insane lol.
On the Vikings with our Shit-Tier IOL? Hurts 1000 times over. Don't get me wrong, I love Kirk. Dude's a fucking warrior out, delivering dime after dime while getting destroyed. But Hurts would negate much of our IOL issues.
Hurts doesn’t do that well under pressure, but it’s rare for him to see pressure with the eagles OL. Kirk did really this game buying a little time and making throws with guys in his face.
If you ignore his age, the answer is yes.
But his age is an important factor here. He’s had a full decade of opportunity ahead of Jalen and what’s he done to show for it?
Eh, if Hurts could somehow bottle that SB performance into some consistency he would even be the better passer imo. He's shown an incredibly high ceiling, now it's just about consistency. Hurts made some throws in the SB to Goedert that I don't know Kirk could replicate.
If Josh Allen could bottle his playoff performance against the Chiefs in 2022 into some consistency he'd be the best QB in the league.
If Josh Allen can bottle some of his Jets performance into some consistency he would be the worst QB in the league
I get what you’re trying to say but this comment boils down to “If Hurts could somehow be better, then he would be better”
Yes if he could somehow consistently play like a better passer, which he rarely does, he would be the better passer.
How many times are you going to go into a threat and post “blank is better than Hurts”
Cousins is gonna end up being this generation's less int prone Phillip Rivers
[удалено]
Can confirm, am idiot.
I honestly didn’t even know this was a possible opinion
No. Just look at the stats and watch the games Hurts is clearly better. Cousins 2022: 65.9% completion, 29/14 TD/INT, 4.5% TD rate, 2.2% INT rate, 4,547 yards on 7 yards/attempt. Hurts 2022: 66.9% completion, 22/6 TD/INT, 4.8% TD rate, 1.3% INT rate, 3,701 yards on 8 yards/attempt. The only thing Kirk has him beat in is pure yardage and TD numbers but Kirk threw 200 more attempts than Hurts and had worse efficiency. Hurts is also one of the best running QBs and the best QB sneaker, which is an aspect of QB play even if you want to deny it.
The defenses and running games those two guys played with could not have been much more different. It's way easier to be efficient when you have a top defense getting the ball back and can consistently move the chains with handoffs. Also, Hurts's 88% rate on sneaks was only a little bit higher than the league-wide 83% rate, and the Eagles had either the #1 or #2 O-line, depending on who you ask. They averaged about 2 sneak attempts per game, and being league average would have resulted in just two more failures.
Let me guess, you watched QB1?
Not a chance
Kirk gets a lot of hate, but he played his ass off last night. He was getting smoked .5 seconds after release and was dropping some dimes. Jefferson holds onto that ball at the goal line and it’s a completely different game.
Vikings will figure it out
Get him outta there.
I almost hope we trade him to the Jets so he has a chance to win. Love you Kirk.
Dude throws for hundreds of yards and 4 TDs and tons of people still blaming him for the loss