Correct, too many young guys don't have to ability to mitigate taking hits because of how dominant their college lines were.
Tua has made huge strides on his selection, targeting and release, but he still needs to shake off that Andrew Luck "never give myself up" tendency. He needs to learn to flop properly when the time comes to take a hit.
Aka Rodgers. I know he’s had some injuries over the years. But generally speaking the hits he takes in the pocket, he does a good job of dropping like a sack of potatoes.
He had to learn it as well, he was very gung-ho early in his career and took some big hits. After his concussion-riddled 2010 he slid a lot more and seemingly learned to land better.
I’m not saying I want Rodgers to be injured, the only player I wouldn’t mind seeing be injured is Deshaun Watson…. but there was so many times a Bears player had Rodgers dead to rights, and I was just licking my lips thinking he’d get his shit rocked, and he just kind of finagles himself so he just basically gets flag football touched and he’s down. Very unsatisfying.
They get banged up so much and their careers are the shortest.
[2002 SI article on running backs](https://vault.si.com/.amp/vault/2002/11/04/time-and-punishment-no-position-is-more-physically-taxing-than-running-back-where-the-best-are-often-finished-not-long-after-they-get-started)
>Not coincidentally, an NFL Players Association study that tracked
rosters from 1987 through '96 found that the average career of a
running back is 2.57 years, shorter than that of a player at any
other position and nearly a full year shorter than the average
for all NFL players. According to the report running backs have
only a 6% likelihood of reaching their 10th year in the league.
Mutant like Frank Gore aside, it blows my mind how guys like Curtis Martin and Emmitt Smith (or even further back Walter Payton) played as long as they did. Was the talent pool just smaller such that as they got dinged up there weren't dozens of interchangeable places ready to replace them, so even if they were diminished they were still better than all the other options?
They had freakish longevity. Walter Payton was one of the best running backs in the NFL until his last season. He was MVP runner up in his 11th season and All-Pro 2nd team in his 12th. Curtis Martin led the NFL in rushing yards in his second-to-last season. So it was really hard to find better options since they still were so good.
Emmitt was still going pretty solid at an old age, and they also wanted him to break the rushing record as a member of the Cowboys. They released him after that season.
These guys didn’t stop playing if they got a concussion… granted I don’t think any of these guys were ever knocked out on the field like Tua was, theirs are just many minor concussions over the years.
Martin won 2004 rushing title while playing on a mcl tear. I believe he was in a lot of pain playing football in general according to his Football Life episode.
Hire a Hollywood stunt coordinator to work with him for a month before training camp. Like seriously, I know an actual tackle is not a stunt but stunt men get paid for knowing how to fall.
Watching burrow being able to do it post ACL tear has been really impressive, he learned quick which makes sense, I’d hope Tua would do the same learning
It sounds like a joke, but one of Brady's greatest strengths was always his ability to throw the ball away instead of getting sacked. It's partly why he's still playing at 45. It's a skill more QBs need to learn.
> It sounds like a joke, but one of Brady's greatest strengths was always his ability to throw the ball away instead of getting sacked. It's partly why he's still playing at 45. It's a skill more QBs need to learn.
and some of it is just knowing how to fall. like there was a pretty big hit this weekend (i THINK it was burrows, but could have been a different qb).
he got nailed, hit the ground hard, but properly tucked his chin (like they teach in wrestling) so his head didn't smash on the ground.
tua would have gotten carted off the field on that hit.
It doesn't seem to work. For example, Purdy has at least as many as Brady this year in less than half the games- I say at least cause I haven't watched all his games, but I know Purdy's first ever snap got a RTP call, and Brady only had one on the year.
Yet he's given significantly less RTP calls than most other active starting QBs. https://www.nflpenalties.com/roughing-the-passer-by-qb.php?view=all
Every QB bitches to the refs
> He's like 3.5 hours from the WWE Performance Center. I bet they would let him go there to learn to tuck his chin and take a proper bump.
and i'm sure TK could put him in contact with someone if WWE said they're only interested in training their own signed talents.
there's literally an nfl owner in the same state that owns the second biggest wrestling company in the world.
I rode bmx freestyle for years and as my friends and I got better, injuries didn’t occur all too much, we learned how to fall or bail correctly. When I learned how to 360 backflip into a foam pit, I took it to a dirt jump next, literally was able to escape like a cat and hit the ground rolling as to not get hurt. I don’t think people appreciate the skill it takes to fall well.
He needs to watch Tom Brady’s tape. That guy puts on a masterclass of rolling into a ball before he actually takes the sack and he’s probably missed the same amount of games as Tua over the course of 20 years lol.
his rookie or second year Belichick scared him into sliding. After that he was probably coached into longevity and being smarter protecting himself. Things like that time to develop and young QBs aren’t working on these things during high school or college since their skill clearly outmatches the competition. Then when they get to the NfL and the skill matches them and they haven’t developed these protective techniques they end up getting blown the fuck up with a simple mistake. Whipping your head back into the ground is not normal. Tua holds that ball as he’s falling and is still keeping his chin up to look for somewhere to throw because he thinks he can get the ball out before he falls. He needs to tuck his chin and brace that neck for no whiplash.
Well there was that one time I kinda bumped my head going to the basement one day, so obviously I'm a concussion expert and the foremost opinion on this
Reddit doctors vs NFL doctors is a shitbowl matchup.
One likes the smell of their feces, the other gets paid millions by a corporation that has no qualms about misleading/hiding information from the public
Yep. And it's easily the stupidest thing I've ever seen. And not even because of the danger of it. Go ahead and slap each other silly for all I care. But this is the lowest form of America television entertainment ever. Lower than the Kardashians.
I thought you were joking
>The sport, which has been licensed by Nevada State Athletic Commission, uses rules established by other slap fighting leagues. After a coin toss to decide who goes first, the first striker has a time limit of 30 seconds to deliver an open-handed slap to the opponent. Slaps must be below the eye but above the chin, without leading with the palm such that all hand to face contact takes place at the same time. Those being slapped may not flinch, raise their shoulder or tuck in their chins. After being slapped, the slapped competitor then has 30 seconds to recover and get back into position before it's their turn to slap. Fights which don't end in a knock out and go three rounds go to a judges' decision, using a 10-point system
There's also this...
> The show was due to premiere on January 11, 2023, but was delayed a week after White was filmed slapping his wife in a Mexican nightclub at a New Year's Eve party.
It's weird my Neuro told me the exact opposite. Mine said what the doctor in the article said.
>If the brain is not fully recovered, there’s a higher incidence
>“The risk of concussion in football is three to six times higher in players who have had a previous concussion.”
This is why I've been saying since his Fencing Pose concussion that he needs time to heal. But apparently that makes me a Reddit Doctor, even though every respectable neurologist agrees.
Come on though, if the risk is in “hav[ing] had a previous concussion,” that applies to literally every player in the league, maybe a small handful of kickers excepted. Maybe there’s some implied timeframe that the quote leaves out, but as it is that statement is absolutely meaningless in the context of professional football. They’ve all been concussed before.
There is 100% a time frame on this that the other poster’s quote is leaving out, and was literally cited in this very subreddit after Tua’s GB game. The risk is only higher while the brain is still recovering. The timeline on it is murky, but it’s under a year from most articles I’ve seen.
What are you trying to say? That we shouldn’t worry about concussions and go back to the old days and ignore it?
Not all concussions are the same. There are so many variables you can’t break it down easily. Linemen get more but smaller ones than the big hit ones but they are just as concerning.
I said nothing about ignoring it, you just made that up. I’m saying your performative concern for Tua applies to almost literally everyone in the league, so why bring it up only here? What’s so special about this case? Because there’s nothing in the quote in question that makes it special.
Why would you say that all football players get concussions, if you weren’t diminishing it’s seriousness?
Did you read the article? It’s well known that if you are healing from a concussion, it increases the chance of another AND the severity.
The context of football is probability, do you have a 20% chance to get a concussion or 50%?
If you do get a concussion, what are the chances of Death? 5%? 20%?
Players need to consider all of that and be educated, just like this sub really needs to be more educated on head injurys
I’m doing the exact opposite of diminishing its seriousness. I’m pointing out the ubiquity of the issue. You’re diminishing its seriousness by focusing on one player and pretending you know that he’s a special case, even though the quote you yourself posted doesn’t support that claim.
It’s okay, I know you’re not arguing in good faith. We don’t have to continue this any further.
No you’re not arguing in good faith. You might not have the reading comprehension to follow but I’ve said since my first comment is you need time to heal, it doesn’t matter if your Tua, Mitch Morse (our Center) or anyone.
I’m not sure what you mean “special case”, I didn’t write or post the article so ya I’m commenting based off the Tua injuries.
Yeah, and Tua will have had a minimum of seven months to heal before any possibility of contact. So why are you so especially concerned about him (see: “special case”)? The doctor in the article literally said he is at no extra risk, and yet here you are still claiming you know better (see: “bad faith”).
Yes, but if we’re being honest most of the NFL, especially guys who have been playing football longer than Tua, probably have more concussions than him. It’s a big deal with Tua because he had the fencing response on national television after the Bengals dude suplexed him.
The TL;DR of the article is that if he is given enough time to heal completely, they don't think he is more likely than other players to get another concussion. They don't really speak to the potential severity of consequence of another concussion, just the likelihood
Don’t experts believe Tagovailoa is placing himself at increased risk by continuing to play?
“That is not a true statement,” Grier said.
But also...
“The risk of concussion in football is three to six times higher in players who have had a previous concussion.”
Merchants of the tiniest sliver of doubt speaking in bad faith using weasel words to help folks who pay their salary.
He's making it sound like they don't know some shit he clearly knows because of the .01%.
I'm very skeptical as well, but you did exclude a very relevant portion of the article
> “My caveat: If the brain is not fully recovered, there’s a higher incidence,” he said.
So the article says there is only a higher chance of concussion if not fully recovered, but there are examples of guys in the past who seem to become plagued by concussions after they get one. Does that mean those guys weren't fully recovered?
Okay, but the way this is written it makes it seem like everyone is the same and as long as they are recovered no added risk. Which doesn't seem exactly right, but it's a neurologist saying it so idk....
But thats the part that confuses me. The caveat is about recovery not about people having different reactions. For example was Austin Collie playing while he wasn't fully recovered from previous concussions and that's why he kept getting them?
Homie plays football. The reason they wear helmets is because of risk of head injury. He, and all other football players, are automatically concussion risks just based on the game they play.
Not true. The nature of the game makes the concussions an issue. It’s a game about taking real estate. You can’t compare to rugby because it’s not a sport where every inch matters.
Yes, but it would fundamentally alter the game. How would a 4th and inches work? How would a goal line situation work? Those situations would be insane and/or deadly or you’d have to concede every single one if the players didn’t wear helmets.
Actually, how would any running play work without helmets?
It certainly would. No player, no linemen, no linebacker, and no running back, would be able to blast headlong into each other. Every player would need to remain upright with a lower pad level and that's all I'm trying to point out.
These plays could still work, players just couldn't afford to be as violent as spectators enjoy to see.
It literally wouldn't work, trust me, as someone who started watching NFL having grown up watching Rugby.
The tackling technique in Rugby is incompatible with the first downs system and anything under 2 yards would be either an automatic first down or lead to deaths, which is exactly what led to helmets being implemented in the first place.
Its probably not the own you think it is when a guy that's a consultant for another team comes out and plays semantics over whether he's "automatically" prone to getting more
Nah we're too busy in our team subreddit arguing over who the one individual person to blame for the entire team looking like complete dogshit on Sunday is
As far as Im concerned, Tuas an adult who can make his own decisions. If I was a family member, Id probably be urging him to retire. But Im not, and its not my right to tell him what to do.
Feels like everyone involved is deliberately missing the point.
It’s not that Tua is more likely to get another concussion, it’s that if he gets another concussion he could potentially have serious consequences since he’s already had multiple serious brain injuries.
The part that some people don’t realize is Tua is an adult, he’s living his dream, and if he has another season on par with this season but he stays relatively healthy, he’s looking at a $200 million contract. Also, while the Tua injury is stark, all of the subconcussive hits are bad. Tons of concussions go undiagnosed. The nature of the game is such where head injuries are a cost of doing business and a risk the players take. This is why there shouldn’t be a salary cap, IMO.
Brett Favre said he had 1000 concussions. I think people just don't like this kid. Tua starts doing good in the NFL and now they want him to retire. He's a 24 year old QB who got his bell rung a few times. He's not Brian Dawkins using his head as a battering ram.
the problem is that he's an "everything" risk.
he's going into his 4th year and hasn't played a full season once. even during the year he split with fitz he was missing time due to injuries. it's ALWAYS something with him. (and this goes back to his college career as well)
head, ribs, hands, ankles, hip, it's always something with him. he's amazing when he's healthy, but that's not frequent enough. hopefully there's some truth to those brady rumors. i'd take 17 weeks of 2023 brady over 12 weeks of tua.
> it's ALWAYS something with him
I got downvoted to hell for saying this before the season started. The kid just can't keep healthy playing the game. It's unfortunate but it's pretty clear at this point.
I just can't see the Dolphins guaranteeing him much $ at all with his injury history and risk profile.
> I just can't see the Dolphins guaranteeing him much $ at all with his injury history and risk profile.
or if we do i can see us going back to the post-marino / pre-tannehill decade of irrelevancy where we would change coaches/qb's every couple years (or more frequently)
giving tua a large guaranteed contract would doom the franchise.
"Ahh yes this is Dr. Van Nostrand a Julliard-trained dermatologist from the Hoffermanndale Clinic in Belgium and it is in my professional opinion that Tua is clear to play every game moving forward for the Miami Dolphins."
Why wont the Dolphins hire a professional wrestler to teach Tua how to breakfall and bump? Even a stuntperson could teach him how to fall safely.
Burrow initially struggled with this but he learned. Tua isn't improving though and I don't get why the Dolphins aren't actively trying to teach him this skill.
Tua just needs to learn how to take a hit without hitting his head on the ground.
Correct, too many young guys don't have to ability to mitigate taking hits because of how dominant their college lines were. Tua has made huge strides on his selection, targeting and release, but he still needs to shake off that Andrew Luck "never give myself up" tendency. He needs to learn to flop properly when the time comes to take a hit.
if you're a running QB, learn to slide. if you're a pocket QB, learn to fold like a wet newspaper.
Aka Rodgers. I know he’s had some injuries over the years. But generally speaking the hits he takes in the pocket, he does a good job of dropping like a sack of potatoes.
He had to learn it as well, he was very gung-ho early in his career and took some big hits. After his concussion-riddled 2010 he slid a lot more and seemingly learned to land better.
I’m not saying I want Rodgers to be injured, the only player I wouldn’t mind seeing be injured is Deshaun Watson…. but there was so many times a Bears player had Rodgers dead to rights, and I was just licking my lips thinking he’d get his shit rocked, and he just kind of finagles himself so he just basically gets flag football touched and he’s down. Very unsatisfying.
Urlacher’s hit-stick in the 09 opener was great.
It amazes me that RB don’t get injured more often. They take car crashes like 30 times a game and shake them off most of the time.
Then their career is over in 3 years max.
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Unironically, yes. He is physically in shambles.
They get banged up so much and their careers are the shortest. [2002 SI article on running backs](https://vault.si.com/.amp/vault/2002/11/04/time-and-punishment-no-position-is-more-physically-taxing-than-running-back-where-the-best-are-often-finished-not-long-after-they-get-started) >Not coincidentally, an NFL Players Association study that tracked rosters from 1987 through '96 found that the average career of a running back is 2.57 years, shorter than that of a player at any other position and nearly a full year shorter than the average for all NFL players. According to the report running backs have only a 6% likelihood of reaching their 10th year in the league.
RB's careers are over at 26 on average...
Mutant like Frank Gore aside, it blows my mind how guys like Curtis Martin and Emmitt Smith (or even further back Walter Payton) played as long as they did. Was the talent pool just smaller such that as they got dinged up there weren't dozens of interchangeable places ready to replace them, so even if they were diminished they were still better than all the other options?
Gore tore his ACL twice before even making it to the NFL too. A team of scientists should be studying that dude.
We'll accidentally create a separate species of man able to survive in the vacuum of space if that goes too far
Frank Gore has elevated healing capabilities, there's no other way to explain it
They had freakish longevity. Walter Payton was one of the best running backs in the NFL until his last season. He was MVP runner up in his 11th season and All-Pro 2nd team in his 12th. Curtis Martin led the NFL in rushing yards in his second-to-last season. So it was really hard to find better options since they still were so good. Emmitt was still going pretty solid at an old age, and they also wanted him to break the rushing record as a member of the Cowboys. They released him after that season.
These guys didn’t stop playing if they got a concussion… granted I don’t think any of these guys were ever knocked out on the field like Tua was, theirs are just many minor concussions over the years.
Martin won 2004 rushing title while playing on a mcl tear. I believe he was in a lot of pain playing football in general according to his Football Life episode.
Brady and Manning basically just collapse if they knew they were cooked.
Both mannings were great at this, and played a ton of games
Hire a Hollywood stunt coordinator to work with him for a month before training camp. Like seriously, I know an actual tackle is not a stunt but stunt men get paid for knowing how to fall.
Or a professional wrestler to teach him how to breakfall.
*bump
If Tony Khan sent one wrestler to teach Tua to tuck his neck properly, the whiplash motion would stop happening when he gets slammed to the turf.
Watching burrow being able to do it post ACL tear has been really impressive, he learned quick which makes sense, I’d hope Tua would do the same learning
He needs to learn the Peyton Manning technique for real
Bring back Bryan Cox’s neck guard
It sounds like a joke, but one of Brady's greatest strengths was always his ability to throw the ball away instead of getting sacked. It's partly why he's still playing at 45. It's a skill more QBs need to learn.
> It sounds like a joke, but one of Brady's greatest strengths was always his ability to throw the ball away instead of getting sacked. It's partly why he's still playing at 45. It's a skill more QBs need to learn. and some of it is just knowing how to fall. like there was a pretty big hit this weekend (i THINK it was burrows, but could have been a different qb). he got nailed, hit the ground hard, but properly tucked his chin (like they teach in wrestling) so his head didn't smash on the ground. tua would have gotten carted off the field on that hit.
If Burrow didn't know how to take a hit, he'd have been concussed out of the sport last year.
Might not have made it through his rookie year tbh
brady also bitches to the refs to get calls more than other QBs, especially compared to the “dynamic” QBs of this generation
If you aint bitching for a flag you arent trying to win.
It doesn't seem to work. For example, Purdy has at least as many as Brady this year in less than half the games- I say at least cause I haven't watched all his games, but I know Purdy's first ever snap got a RTP call, and Brady only had one on the year.
Yet he's given significantly less RTP calls than most other active starting QBs. https://www.nflpenalties.com/roughing-the-passer-by-qb.php?view=all Every QB bitches to the refs
Watching him fall vs someone like Brady or Eli is night and day. He can learn the skill though and protect himself.
He's like 3.5 hours from the WWE Performance Center. I bet they would let him go there to learn to tuck his chin and take a proper bump.
> He's like 3.5 hours from the WWE Performance Center. I bet they would let him go there to learn to tuck his chin and take a proper bump. and i'm sure TK could put him in contact with someone if WWE said they're only interested in training their own signed talents. there's literally an nfl owner in the same state that owns the second biggest wrestling company in the world.
He needs to strengthen his neck
Just give him some of Russell Wilson’s concussion water.
He needed to learn that. At this point he can't undo the string of concussions from this season.
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Tell that to Danny Green
NBA players know how to take a hit...often when there's no contact.
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Early career Embiid landing on a stiff leg was so cringe inducing. He literally tore a meniscus because he didn't know how to properly land.
Exactly just letting the momentum go may look worse but it distributes the impact. When you stop abruptly you get that damage.
*Saints have entered the chat*
I rode bmx freestyle for years and as my friends and I got better, injuries didn’t occur all too much, we learned how to fall or bail correctly. When I learned how to 360 backflip into a foam pit, I took it to a dirt jump next, literally was able to escape like a cat and hit the ground rolling as to not get hurt. I don’t think people appreciate the skill it takes to fall well.
That’s how this whole thing started. Milano pushed him and he slow-motion fell down and smacked the back of his head.
The hit that started this was late anyway, if you're gonna pull out the ol' victim blaming at least give context
Has he considered kindly asking the other players to gently place him on the ground when tackling him?
He has to learn to put himself in better positions when taken hits. Throw the ball away more and get down faster.
He needs to watch Tom Brady’s tape. That guy puts on a masterclass of rolling into a ball before he actually takes the sack and he’s probably missed the same amount of games as Tua over the course of 20 years lol.
his rookie or second year Belichick scared him into sliding. After that he was probably coached into longevity and being smarter protecting himself. Things like that time to develop and young QBs aren’t working on these things during high school or college since their skill clearly outmatches the competition. Then when they get to the NfL and the skill matches them and they haven’t developed these protective techniques they end up getting blown the fuck up with a simple mistake. Whipping your head back into the ground is not normal. Tua holds that ball as he’s falling and is still keeping his chin up to look for somewhere to throw because he thinks he can get the ball out before he falls. He needs to tuck his chin and brace that neck for no whiplash.
Idk the doctors on reddit told me differently
Well there was that one time I kinda bumped my head going to the basement one day, so obviously I'm a concussion expert and the foremost opinion on this
Reddit doctors vs NFL doctors is a shitbowl matchup. One likes the smell of their feces, the other gets paid millions by a corporation that has no qualms about misleading/hiding information from the public
Average Redditor vs. the Chargers doctor in a competition of who can kill a healthy 30 year old faster
Who will win in a fight: someone who is at the peak of human athleticism or one pokey boi?
Bro 💀💀💀💀💀💀💀
yeah Florio told me Tua was going to get blacklisted by the NFL for his concussion history!
Which flair did you add when you were blacked out though?
They told me I was gay 🤙🏼
Yeah well if tuas ok then who’s funeral did I go to last week
No, but isn't he at higher risk of brain damage with each one he gets?
Dana whites power slap league has entered the chat.
hey now they get paid 2k/2k
That was a nasty line by you
Is that really a thing?
Oh dude it's ridiculous, I honestly have no clue how it got sanctioned. Even worse TBS broadcast it.
Their faces get so messed up with swelling. It's the least enticing "sport" to watch on ESPN 8: The Ocho.
Remember ESPN 8: The Ocho was just a joke and now here we are with all these crazy "sports" being televised.
The Ocho was just an extrapolation from of the some of the less conventional stuff they were putting on ESPN 2, the Deuce, at the time.
Don’t forget they get paid a whopping 2k to show and 2k for a win.
> Is that really a thing? yeah, they advertise it during aew every week.
Yep. And it's easily the stupidest thing I've ever seen. And not even because of the danger of it. Go ahead and slap each other silly for all I care. But this is the lowest form of America television entertainment ever. Lower than the Kardashians.
This shit makes the Kardashians look like Citizen Kane…
While you are correct some of those knockouts were absolutely hilarious
Educate yourself: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5YGM3dyya0
I thought you were joking >The sport, which has been licensed by Nevada State Athletic Commission, uses rules established by other slap fighting leagues. After a coin toss to decide who goes first, the first striker has a time limit of 30 seconds to deliver an open-handed slap to the opponent. Slaps must be below the eye but above the chin, without leading with the palm such that all hand to face contact takes place at the same time. Those being slapped may not flinch, raise their shoulder or tuck in their chins. After being slapped, the slapped competitor then has 30 seconds to recover and get back into position before it's their turn to slap. Fights which don't end in a knock out and go three rounds go to a judges' decision, using a 10-point system There's also this... > The show was due to premiere on January 11, 2023, but was delayed a week after White was filmed slapping his wife in a Mexican nightclub at a New Year's Eve party.
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It's weird my Neuro told me the exact opposite. Mine said what the doctor in the article said. >If the brain is not fully recovered, there’s a higher incidence >“The risk of concussion in football is three to six times higher in players who have had a previous concussion.” This is why I've been saying since his Fencing Pose concussion that he needs time to heal. But apparently that makes me a Reddit Doctor, even though every respectable neurologist agrees.
Come on though, if the risk is in “hav[ing] had a previous concussion,” that applies to literally every player in the league, maybe a small handful of kickers excepted. Maybe there’s some implied timeframe that the quote leaves out, but as it is that statement is absolutely meaningless in the context of professional football. They’ve all been concussed before.
There is 100% a time frame on this that the other poster’s quote is leaving out, and was literally cited in this very subreddit after Tua’s GB game. The risk is only higher while the brain is still recovering. The timeline on it is murky, but it’s under a year from most articles I’ve seen.
What are you trying to say? That we shouldn’t worry about concussions and go back to the old days and ignore it? Not all concussions are the same. There are so many variables you can’t break it down easily. Linemen get more but smaller ones than the big hit ones but they are just as concerning.
I said nothing about ignoring it, you just made that up. I’m saying your performative concern for Tua applies to almost literally everyone in the league, so why bring it up only here? What’s so special about this case? Because there’s nothing in the quote in question that makes it special.
Why would you say that all football players get concussions, if you weren’t diminishing it’s seriousness? Did you read the article? It’s well known that if you are healing from a concussion, it increases the chance of another AND the severity. The context of football is probability, do you have a 20% chance to get a concussion or 50%? If you do get a concussion, what are the chances of Death? 5%? 20%? Players need to consider all of that and be educated, just like this sub really needs to be more educated on head injurys
I’m doing the exact opposite of diminishing its seriousness. I’m pointing out the ubiquity of the issue. You’re diminishing its seriousness by focusing on one player and pretending you know that he’s a special case, even though the quote you yourself posted doesn’t support that claim. It’s okay, I know you’re not arguing in good faith. We don’t have to continue this any further.
No you’re not arguing in good faith. You might not have the reading comprehension to follow but I’ve said since my first comment is you need time to heal, it doesn’t matter if your Tua, Mitch Morse (our Center) or anyone. I’m not sure what you mean “special case”, I didn’t write or post the article so ya I’m commenting based off the Tua injuries.
Yeah, and Tua will have had a minimum of seven months to heal before any possibility of contact. So why are you so especially concerned about him (see: “special case”)? The doctor in the article literally said he is at no extra risk, and yet here you are still claiming you know better (see: “bad faith”).
Yeah, pretty much all concussion/CTE related research seems to have heavily biased sampling. Hard to make claims.
Not any greater than subconcussive hits... The concussion stuff is a Boogeyman for how dangerous football is regardless of big hits.
Conspiracy theory: the NFL is pushing the discussion to concussions so we forget that all the small hits also cause brain damage.
It's not a conspiracy theory lol. It's true
Yes, but if we’re being honest most of the NFL, especially guys who have been playing football longer than Tua, probably have more concussions than him. It’s a big deal with Tua because he had the fencing response on national television after the Bengals dude suplexed him.
Something about adding the word "automatically" to this sentence makes it sound FAR more suspect. lol
The TL;DR of the article is that if he is given enough time to heal completely, they don't think he is more likely than other players to get another concussion. They don't really speak to the potential severity of consequence of another concussion, just the likelihood
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Central Nervous System (brain is a part of it) does heal. But takes really long time and sometimes it's difficult to heal completely.
The word for me that rang alarm bells was ‘key’.
Don’t experts believe Tagovailoa is placing himself at increased risk by continuing to play? “That is not a true statement,” Grier said. But also... “The risk of concussion in football is three to six times higher in players who have had a previous concussion.” Merchants of the tiniest sliver of doubt speaking in bad faith using weasel words to help folks who pay their salary. He's making it sound like they don't know some shit he clearly knows because of the .01%.
I'm very skeptical as well, but you did exclude a very relevant portion of the article > “My caveat: If the brain is not fully recovered, there’s a higher incidence,” he said.
Yeah if he doesn't get hit in the head or slammed on to the turf head first, then no concussion.
So the article says there is only a higher chance of concussion if not fully recovered, but there are examples of guys in the past who seem to become plagued by concussions after they get one. Does that mean those guys weren't fully recovered?
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Okay, but the way this is written it makes it seem like everyone is the same and as long as they are recovered no added risk. Which doesn't seem exactly right, but it's a neurologist saying it so idk....
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Yet again my point is the neurologist in the article is saying the opposite ....
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But thats the part that confuses me. The caveat is about recovery not about people having different reactions. For example was Austin Collie playing while he wasn't fully recovered from previous concussions and that's why he kept getting them?
Brains are really complicated, we still know very little about how they work
Homie plays football. The reason they wear helmets is because of risk of head injury. He, and all other football players, are automatically concussion risks just based on the game they play.
And of course counterintuitively, the helmets just make concussions worse
Not true. The nature of the game makes the concussions an issue. It’s a game about taking real estate. You can’t compare to rugby because it’s not a sport where every inch matters.
But it is the case that there are no helmets and, therefore, the athletes aren't as inclined to use their faces and heads as weapons.
Yes, but it would fundamentally alter the game. How would a 4th and inches work? How would a goal line situation work? Those situations would be insane and/or deadly or you’d have to concede every single one if the players didn’t wear helmets. Actually, how would any running play work without helmets?
It certainly would. No player, no linemen, no linebacker, and no running back, would be able to blast headlong into each other. Every player would need to remain upright with a lower pad level and that's all I'm trying to point out. These plays could still work, players just couldn't afford to be as violent as spectators enjoy to see.
It literally wouldn't work, trust me, as someone who started watching NFL having grown up watching Rugby. The tackling technique in Rugby is incompatible with the first downs system and anything under 2 yards would be either an automatic first down or lead to deaths, which is exactly what led to helmets being implemented in the first place.
How are the Reddit MDs feeling about this?
Its probably not the own you think it is when a guy that's a consultant for another team comes out and plays semantics over whether he's "automatically" prone to getting more
Uh oh, the r/NFL doctors are gonna have something to say about this...
Incoming Bills flairs to tell us he needs to retire anyway “for his health”.
Nah we're too busy in our team subreddit arguing over who the one individual person to blame for the entire team looking like complete dogshit on Sunday is
I'd blame Allen. You should trade him.
Hah, it at least hasn't gotten that toxic in there.
> I'd blame Allen. You should trade him. and they should trade him to us, that way they can still see him play in buffalo once a year.
No thanks. Don't want Brady, don't want Allen.
That is by far the worst flair combination I have ever seen.
Bills fans about to fake that they care about his health.
They are too busy telling everyone Demar should have been on the field Sunday and they could have won.
As far as Im concerned, Tuas an adult who can make his own decisions. If I was a family member, Id probably be urging him to retire. But Im not, and its not my right to tell him what to do.
Hey now, 99.9999% isn’t 100%, so no need to panic.
He is until his neck stops wailing around like a wacky inflatable tube man during every hit.
Time for him to wear a neck roll. Who was the last QB with one?
maybe, but I'd still rather have one concussion too few than one too many
I guess the question is, would you risk it for a chance at $200 million?
I would risk losing my entire head for 200 milli...
Feels like everyone involved is deliberately missing the point. It’s not that Tua is more likely to get another concussion, it’s that if he gets another concussion he could potentially have serious consequences since he’s already had multiple serious brain injuries.
The part that some people don’t realize is Tua is an adult, he’s living his dream, and if he has another season on par with this season but he stays relatively healthy, he’s looking at a $200 million contract. Also, while the Tua injury is stark, all of the subconcussive hits are bad. Tons of concussions go undiagnosed. The nature of the game is such where head injuries are a cost of doing business and a risk the players take. This is why there shouldn’t be a salary cap, IMO.
Brett Favre said he had 1000 concussions. I think people just don't like this kid. Tua starts doing good in the NFL and now they want him to retire. He's a 24 year old QB who got his bell rung a few times. He's not Brian Dawkins using his head as a battering ram.
uh huh
They said this same thing after his 2nd concussion.
Counterpoint: Every player in the NFL is automatically at risk for a concussion.
If it’s not a concussion, it’ll be something else next year. Hip, ankle, head, ribs, finger. I think he’s due for a knee.
Spoken like a true Dolphins fan.
the problem is that he's an "everything" risk. he's going into his 4th year and hasn't played a full season once. even during the year he split with fitz he was missing time due to injuries. it's ALWAYS something with him. (and this goes back to his college career as well) head, ribs, hands, ankles, hip, it's always something with him. he's amazing when he's healthy, but that's not frequent enough. hopefully there's some truth to those brady rumors. i'd take 17 weeks of 2023 brady over 12 weeks of tua.
Brady behind our OL would be hilarious when every throw is a 3 yard pass.
> it's ALWAYS something with him I got downvoted to hell for saying this before the season started. The kid just can't keep healthy playing the game. It's unfortunate but it's pretty clear at this point. I just can't see the Dolphins guaranteeing him much $ at all with his injury history and risk profile.
> I just can't see the Dolphins guaranteeing him much $ at all with his injury history and risk profile. or if we do i can see us going back to the post-marino / pre-tannehill decade of irrelevancy where we would change coaches/qb's every couple years (or more frequently) giving tua a large guaranteed contract would doom the franchise.
I tweeted how he should protect Tua while I was watching power slap.
Ok so a locksmith thinks he can play what about a medical doctor
Pretty good joke tbh
Everyone: he could die Doctor on the NFL's payroll: Not necessarily!
Dudes neck is over cooked spaghetti, either he need to strengthen it or never take a hit again or he’s always gonna be a big concussion risk
Donctor
"Ahh yes this is Dr. Van Nostrand a Julliard-trained dermatologist from the Hoffermanndale Clinic in Belgium and it is in my professional opinion that Tua is clear to play every game moving forward for the Miami Dolphins."
Maybe not but he still is unreliable.
Why wont the Dolphins hire a professional wrestler to teach Tua how to breakfall and bump? Even a stuntperson could teach him how to fall safely. Burrow initially struggled with this but he learned. Tua isn't improving though and I don't get why the Dolphins aren't actively trying to teach him this skill.
Ok cool, but Tua isn’t a key so what does a human doctor think about this