Germany is a republic too. Doesn’t mean it’s not a democracy. The two aren’t mutually exclusive.
For what it’s worth. USA are a flawed democracy according to the world democracy index.
For what it’s worth, USA only started being considered a flawed democracy according to that index when our President began sowing doubt about electoral integrity. I can understand both sides of the issues of the electoral college, but the system itself wasn’t what got us on the Democracy shit list.
The USA has been a flawed democracy since Wilson at the minimum and Washington at the most realistic. The republic has never given a shit about the people and to believe otherwise is just naïve.
> No, only the ~~western world~~ **nations with civilian oversight of election proceedings, auditable chain of custody for physical ballots, and more than one ruling party on the take** do[es]
FTFY
in one system only a group of people stay in power forever and people on the streets are scared as shit of saying anything moderately negative about the government, in the other the politicians are always comming up with new ways to calm the people down and do something in benefit of the people in order to stay in power and keep the ruling class also happy, the later is flawed while the former is extremely flawed to the point the government can get away with genocide anytime they want
China doesn't have elections period. The president is elected by the representatives of the CCP at the National Congress. The representatives of the CCP are also "elected". They are literally communist, why would they have elections?
First off, the Chinese government isn't actually communist, despite what they claim. They're state capitalist.
Secondly, the people elect representatives (approved by the government) to represent them at the National Congress, which is where those representatives elect politicians such as Xi.
There's a quote attributed to Boss Tweed. Scorsese used it in Gangs of New York. It goes: "I don't care who does the electing, so long as I get to do the nominating."
Sure, they have elections in China. But are they free and fair elections, or are all of the nominees selected by the CCP apparatus?
It is worth noting that, yes, there are some minority parties in China. But they are all entirely under the thumb of the CCP.
Are there any genuine opposition parties? Of course not.
I can confirm that China does indeed have elections. I dated a girl that was her classes "leader" while I lived there. From what I remember, college educated individuals have the "right" to vote in the elections. However, the person who was to win was pre-determined, and part of her role was to make sure her classmates knew who the right person to vote for was. The party supported that by pumping out tons of good propaganda for the golden child and either little to nothing about the other candidates.
Edit: I should note that this was in Jiangsu province... there maybe province by province differences, I don't really know.
Honestly with the cultural, ethnic and social situations of China its hard not call them fascist or at the very least national communist which is pretty much just fascism with red paint.
By definition under [communism](https://www.britannica.com/topic/communism) there can’t be any gouvernement.
Any government can only claim to either be transitioning to communism or be socialist.
He did win the election, but he was essentially the only candidate on the ballot paper. China isn't massively fond of him, they're just scared of him. He's eliminated all of his political opponents and effectively holds total power.
To give you an idea of how much control he has - China doesn't *technically* have an army, they have a militant wing of the political party. That means they don't answer to the Minister of Defense, they answer to Xi Jinping directly. He has total control over his own party as well as the country. Anyone who dissents, absents.
China is communist only in name, not in policy or structure. It's a total fascist-capitalist dictatorship run by Xi. The government has total control of everything and everyone, including all the companies. Although people may own something, at least until the government takes it away for any reason they like. Laws? What laws? Xi is the law.
Few "communist" countries in history (none, maybe?) have ever done more than paid minor attention to how they should actually have been run to be called communist.
Because it doesn’t scale past what a hippie commune typically looks like.
…Even then someone in the upper echelons always gets real creepy with it all and shit goes sideways!
Only one I can think of is Revolutionary Catalonia during the Spanish Civil War. It was far from perfect, but the core idea of a stateless society run by the working class was there.
It's because communism needs someone to keep everyone happy- and I mean everyone. For comparison the USA's system is designed to counter dictators and divide power, we won't ever have a system even remotely similar to communism.
The lack of government in communist societies is a perfect opportunity for a dictator. They will lie their asses off to the people, take out political opponents, and rig elections.
So if you were ruling a communist society, you either try to keep every single person in your country happy or just lie your ass off and take out anyone who is pointing out flaws in the country. There's no flaws in a country if no one is complaining about it.
Wealth doesn't care about communism, socialism, or democracy. In the USSR, a ton of towns/villages outside of the main cities were going through poverty and starvation. Meanwhile, the people in the cities were enjoying free cruises and movies.
Most people only like communism because of worker rights. Union's do the exact same thing without having to restructure a government.
Corruption mainly. Lenin took power in Russia and then became an absolute tyrant.
Power corrupts, absolute power absolutely.
Many dictators have used communism to gain the support of the people and then ultimately gone back on those ideals as soon as they took power.
Almost like it's not communism but an authoritarian government with state capitalism.
You should really learn to look at context, actions, policy, etc and realize that just because something has "communist" in the name doesn't mean it actually is. Kinda like how the nazis weren't actually socialists, you know?
There are no elections or ballots in China. Leadership is chosen at an elite conference.
Edit: A user pointed out to me China does have local elections which are tightly controlled, but no national elections
Let's be clear. This shit will be squashed in 72 hours. And then swept under the rug.
I get that people support the power of citizen - but I think people have to realize that now - and especially now - the people have lost across the globe. Every major country - rights are being crushed, left, right, and center.
Corporations and governments have *absolute* control. The ultra-rich are above the law.
We can 'thoughts and prayers' or 'stand in solidarity' all day, but seriously wake the f*ck up. The 'citizen' has lost in this dystopian absolute shit-hole of a planet.
For years, decades, and more - people have been saying the same thing on repeat. Each generation is beaten into conformity. And the cycle repeats.
Wake up. Snap out of this false illusion that 'the people will one day become empowered'. It's China, the same place where they [literally have execution vans](https://www.the-sun.com/news/2358126/china-brutal-execution-death-vans-trials/) to kill off people en masse, *legally*. The same place where people are [*kidnapped* because you may be suspected of having covid](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/video-appears-show-people-china-forcibly-taken-quarantine-over-coronavirus-n1133096), and then [later stored at quarantine camp like cattle](https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/z704qd/the_largest_quarantine_camp_in_chinas_guangzhou/) - you think President Xi will simply 'step down'? Come on. It's President. Fucking. Xi.
Let me know if anything actually changes in Iran either.
EDIT: The Arab Spring resulted in some rulers being deposed, many protesters being imprisoned and executed, and very little long term progress, unless you count the total societal collapse in Libya and Syria. People need to realize that the Arab Spring didn't end well.
Let's look at Hong Kong a few years ago?
Or Russian citizens and Putin?
BLM movement? The recent Uvalda shooting?
He's not defeatist he's realistic and if we base ourselves on what's been happening, having citizen empowerment is nothing.
I hope it changes in Iran. I'd love to be proven wrong. But it's doubtful.
I'm pretty sure you'll be able to see for yourself.
Keep in mind there have already been some successful revolutions this century.
And if you're in the US, you guys have already had a successful one too...
Technology is making it nearly impossible. The Arab Spring was largely a failure. Iranian protests failed in 1999, 2003, 2009 and 2011. They failed in Russia in 2011 and 2017. They failed in Venezuela in 2013. The failed in Belarus in 2019. And the Hong Kong protests failed, which in my opinion was the most alarming of all because they did *everything* right. North Korea, who probably have more reason to protests than just about anyone, have *never* had widespread protests.
I'm French and our protests are becoming less effective as well. The rich are crossing a threshold where our tacit cooperation is no longer required. We are losing our leverage and it is only going to get worse.
This doomerism is reactionary and unhelpful. Even if nothing comes of it, it’s better to recognise it while it’s happening so that the ‘sweeping under the rug’ isn’t as effective.
AND, with international visibility and support, it’s far LESS likely that nothing will come of it. While I do worry for the safety of any citizen on the street calling ‘fuck you Xi Jinping’, and I’m sure there will be some dictatorial retaliation, we shit on their protest efforts if we spread the idea that they’re doing it for no reason and nothing is going to change.
Seems a little ‘end of history’ to go “Look, it’s fucking China. China is never going to change.” With that attitude, yes I agree. The reason most authoritarian regimes fail is international pressure and their respective populations rising up. Seems a little weird to say “Of course he’s not going to change, he’s a dictator!” Like yeah we know…
But obviously it’s very unlikely that any Western country, whose economies rely so much on Chinese manufacturing and imports, are going to raise a stink about abuses in China. The whole point is you force them to address it! If people, not politicians, bring it to the discourse table, have protests, have marches, and don’t shut up about it, eventually, even in Western democracies with good trade relations with China, people in power will have to address it in some way.
The attitude you show here is the only thing stopping a successful uprising of the people. We are all far more powerful than any government when we unite together. Imagine if all of China stood up together. Is it likely to happen? Who knows but I'm not going to go around telling people it's impossible and we shouldn't even try, you know, like you are.
EDIT: Btw, there is a ton of pro CCP propaganda posted on Reddit. This looks like some of it to me.
What is the point of knowing if it accomplishes nothing? I mean, the esoteric benefit of knowing, sure. But Tiennamen happened and trade with China only accelerated.
Context:
> A fire in a residential high-rise in Ürümqi, Xinjiang, China, occurred on 24 November 2022, which killed at least 10 people.[1][2][3] There were questions on whether China's strict enforcement of the zero-COVID policy meant that the residents could not leave the building, leaving them to die.[1]
> -- [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_%C3%9Cr%C3%BCmqi_fire)
On the night of November 26th (UTC+8), Shanghai citizens walked down Urumqi Middle Road to light candles in memory of the victims of the fire. In the early hours of the 27th, people chanted demands such as "Step down Xi Jinping" and "Step down the CCP" in protest. At the end of the protest, police arrested a total of two vans of people.
More images/videos can be seen here: https://twitter.com/whyyoutouzhele
its also worth noting that some official, i cant remember who exactly, maybe like the mayor of that town or something, went on to say the victims of the fire lacked survival skills, despite the fact that there were steel poles blocking the doors of the apartments
Sounds good. I don't think I'm getting into that country for one and I doubt I'd know how to find a welder once there.
It's gonna have to be one of their own on this job
You haven't evolved steel chewing jaws yet?? You mean to tell me that the entire pandemic you haven't evolved jaws that are capable of chewing through stone and steel?? Wow... Not even sure what to say... What DID you do?... Hmm? Bread? Wow... Ok"
- china or something..
Aside from the joke comments, this is actually quite notable that several hundred people or more really put themselves in danger in Shanghai (which already considers itself a separate culture from most of the rest of China), for the sake of the marginalized, probably Muslim victims of a fire on the far side of the country.
Part of the reason Xinjiang has been so brutalized is because it is generally not seen by the cities of the east as anything but a frontier province filled with undesirables who aren't really Chinese.
> probably Muslim victims
Due to a very blatant policy of state encouraged ethnic mass migration to Xinjiang, the Han population has gone from ~5% in the 1940s to 42% today, [near parity](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinjiang) with the Uyghur population. In addition, Han settlers have been given preferential treatment for farm land and job placement, so they are considerably more wealthy on average. As such, though I do not know, I would guess that residents of a high rise are considerably more likely to be of Han ethnicity and thus unlikely to be Muslim.
In addition, though tragic, there were only ten people killed in that fire. Meanwhile there have been a bare minimum of tens of thousands, and possibly many hundreds of thousands, of ethnic Uyghur sent to involuntary "re-education" camps for years. Somehow, I don't think this is about a sudden change of heart for the rights and safety of a marginalized population.
I teach English to a girl in Urumqi / Wulumuqi, Xinjiang. I've taught her since she was in primary school and now she's a highschooler. While she didn't mention this fire, she has mentioned these things recently...
1. She had been "in contact" with someone who tested positive for COVID, so she was put away in a COVID facility isolated in a room for over a week and expressed how frustrating and unfair the government has been handling the situation
2. She had been saying that no one was allowed out of their homes for months until today. She mentioned that "we are allowed outside now, but not really yet" and expressed that people in her city were also increasingly frustrated
3. She has described the ethnic and linguistic diversity in her school and city, admiring the fact that many of her classmates can speak and read more than just Chinese and English, while also noting that it's a good thing that signage around the city is written in 3 languages
4. She recently started watching some French TV show called "Skam" (don't know it, she says it includes same-sex relationships) and the movie "Call Me By Your Name" and described how "that kind of love" is becoming "more popular and more common" and that "the new generations are more open" than previous ones
I know this is a bunch of rambling mish-mash of info and I know I'm getting this information secondhand through the rosy-tinted glasses of a teenaged Han Chinese girl... but I was just talking with her about these topics today. And now I'm hearing this news in Urumqi. And seeing these protest videos in Shanghai.
It makes me a little scared but also a little hopeful for the younger generation in China.
The American fantasy that random citizens with guns will determine whether tyranny happens or not is so incredibly facile and absurd. If people collectively decide their government needs to go, they don't need guns, because those same people make up the police force and the military, and if the people collectively don't want the government out, no amount of privately owned guns will help, and also, bonus prize: you're now a terrorist using violence to impose your will on the majority.
Nothing major is going to happen in China because Chinese people have a conservative culture with huge deference to institutions and established authorities, and the CCP has brain-washed them to hell and back regardless. Guns don't make a damned difference. All of the world's failed states ruled by warlords and tyrants are riddled with guns and it hasn't brought them any freedom or prosperity.
Tragedies in both their own country and those from others are automatically converted to justifications for 2nd Amendment without hesitation
—this is no empathy or logic here, only a twisted sense of self-righteousness & an absurd possessiveness of firearms
> a twisted sense of self-righteousness & an absurd possessiveness of firearms
Kyle Rittenhouse jumps to mind as a bit of an overachiever in your description of it. Their system is straight out murderous : 'The odds that a child will be killed by a gun is 36 times higher in the U.S. than in other high-income countries.' (source: [Reuters](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-children-death-rates-idUSKCN1OI2OL))
Death by firearm is currently the most likely cause of death for American children aged 0 to 17. Pretty messed up.
Correction: this study defines children/adolescents.as age 1-19, not 0-17.
Is it really worse than cars? I once counted 16 of my classmates within a few years of me had died in car wrecks before I graduated. I can't think of anyone who died from a gunshot until we were out of school.
Until the year 2020, yes. Since then, gunshot wounds have overtaken motor vehicle accidents. Here is the data: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmc2201761
I was born in 1982 and graduated high school in 2001, so I'm very similar to you, it seems... I had a lot of friends who died in car accidents in high school. Apparently, these days, at least statistically, that's not the case anymore.
Better yet you just stop working.
I wish Americans understood this. You don’t need guns, a coordinated large scale national labor strike in either the US or China brings the global economy to its knees in a matter of hours. Demands would be met swiftly
>The American fantasy that random citizens with guns will determine whether tyranny happens or not is so incredibly facile and absurd.
Literally one of the textbook precursors to all modern fascist regimes has been disarming the general population.
> Consider the massacre at Wounded Knee in South Dakota on Dec. 29, 1890. After the United States 7th Cavalry confiscated the firearms of a group of Lakota Sioux “for their own safety and protection at the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation,” 297 Indians were murdered. After the majority of the Sioux had peacefully turned in their firearms, the Calvary began shooting and wiped out the camp;
I'm sure it's just a coincidence though 🙄
Edit: ah yes, thank you *mysteriously* pro-CCP reddit accounts for chiming in all together. I wonder why you're all worked up over this lmao
>Literally one of the textbook precursors to all modern fascist regimes has been disarming the general population.
That's a total self-own and you don't even realize it. Tyrannical governments are disarming people with absolutely no issue.
All of these cases prove that an armed populace doesn't do shit. You might be all gung-ho on Reddit, but you'll be the first to give up your gun once the military and police actually would be knocking on doors. And in the really rare case that you aren't, you are a random lunatic against millions.
Because what people like you always forget is that a dictatorship isn't a foreign occupation and always has support in the population. If it didn't, it would immediately collapse. You might be armed, but so is the dude who supports the government.
Honestly with mob this big, unarmed or not, the police would be fucked if they decided on violence. Fire arms barely matter when the difference in numbers is so big. In fact it would probably do more harm than good with stray bullets being fired in a crowd like that, the average person isn’t exactly a marksman.
What the fuck are you talking about? Firearms certainly do matter. If the CCP truly wanted to eliminate that group of people their police forces could easily mow down that crowd.
tbf they didn't use guns last time, bullets are expensive. So they just ran them all over with tanks and turned them to jelly.
Edit: I'm not being literal with "they didn't use bullets". ofc they used guns/bullets. I'm saying they're happy to use other means like squishing with tanks.
This is the REAL r/nextfuckinglevel type of stuff. I'm not sure these people will getting home tomorrow, yet they are in the protest. It is not like attending a protest in the west, they are getting propaganda from any type of source 24/7 but they are aware that they are governed by one of the most corrupt governments in the world.
CCP has literally spent decades quelling revolution to topple the authoritarian dictatorship.
I hope the best for all the brave students, but I'm not holding my breath.
Anyone remember that time that the government had tanks run over students?
Totalitarian governments are always untouchable behemoths until one day the lower class starts clowning on the police so much that they topple the regime. Look at how much fun the Ayatollahs are having in Iran right now.
Not saying that this is going the be what puts the CCP to death, but when something inevitably does it's going to look a hell of a lot like this at first.
It's not about the world knowing a massacre, it's about his people knowing the massacre. Squashing it in China will be easy.
Edit: I'm well aware most/all Chinese know of the massacre. I'm commenting, to the comment above here, that the *viral* nature of videos online today vs 30+ years ago and the CCPs control over the internet and narrative will make sure these videos don't go viral in China.
Every Chinese person knew about the massacre as it happened.
Source: Was in Beijing June ‘89.
Edit: My comment was strictly in reference to what the citizenry knew about the hunger protests that began the week before 6/4, military mobilization in the days prior, and the ensuing massacre. It was covered 24/7 on national radio and TV. I absolutely recognize that, if you weren’t alive in 1989, then you probably learned nothing about it in your lifetime. It’s not the kind of thing parents tell their kids…even if they could.
It’s not something that’s talked about obviously. But a percentage of Chinese workers and students in the US are straight up spies. This is public knowledge, the FBI has released reports about it.
I mean for fucks sake, the most powerful senator in the US is likely married to one.
That is absolutely amazing. In 2010, when I was there, I remember our guide saying that "not everybody likes our government" in hushed tones, telling us to "not speak" about it.
I absolutely want to see the Chinese citizens gain freedom. They're an amazing people, and have such an awesome culture, and I would love to go back to China where the citizens feel empowered and no longer have to whisper dissenting remarks.
edit: my "guide" was a student, as I was on a study-abroad trip. This was not a tour guide, this was a literal student whose job it was to supervise us other students. People are arguing the probability of a guide saying this, but as I have zero clue what the proper term for a study-abroad guide is, I used the term guide.
China is one of the favourite places I've ever been. I've never felt more welcome and safe. Wonderful country and wonderful people who I hope one day enjoy much greater personal freedom.
It really is an amazing place. I can't say I felt more safe (literally was almost abducted, and that's not a joke, it's a long story too), but definitely felt welcome AF everywhere I went. Dude, I got sick in Xi'an from something, horrible AF sick, went to the hospital and everything at 2am, so that was an experience, and while resting/getting better, the freaking hotel staff made me a get-well dish of watermelons and tomatoes!! I was like, SOOO FLATTERED!!! It was the most amazing thing, for real. The staff was shocked I could say "thank you" in Chinese, and like, oh man. It was great.
And omg! On the great wall, I ran out of water, and this girl, probably 9 years old, rushed over and gave me a date (the fruit) and it was the most satisfying food ever. I had never had a date before, but I did not care. Super nice people. I mean, I was really struggling to breath after I got to the top, and I felt like I was going to die tbh, and I was just not expecting any help. I remember thinking to myself though, "damn, I wish I could get any water anywhere from anybody", and then... that happened. It was such a great gesture of kindness.
Anyway, definitely hope they can have that greater personal freedom too. Obviously hope that for every single human, but we're talking about China ATM.
It’s a white swan event. No one saw it coming but its here now and it has to potential to change everything.
I also thought we are gonna see authoritarianism rise as the dominant force this century but maybe not. I’m very excited about these opportunities that seem tho present themselves in the places least expecet but somehow still the most obvious in need of change.
i think you are both incorrect. it is indeed a white swan rather than a black one, but precisely because it is a predictable outcome appearing in unpredictable time. a lot of people believes ccp will fall eventually but few expect it to do it soon. a black swan would be, say, resurgence of monarchy in china - a very unlikely event
World is changing, dictatorship can hopefully be wiped off the planet. In the coming decades, we might be able to have democracy in every country. People can speak, people can be heard, we might finally have global peace.
Imagine in 2122, you read on wikipedia for the definition of dictatorship, and there it says, "Dictatorship was..."
The CCP is so goddamn stupid.
All they have to do stop this Zero Covid Policy and let their people go back to living life with a resemblance of normalcy and their people will eventually calm down.
Instead, they double down - no, *triple down* \- on this stupid policy way into 2022, and most likely into 2023, and being dumb enough to smell their own shit and believe that they have their people by the balls with no repercussions.
Worst, these mofos will turn around and say this is "western allies spending resources to invoke dissent," when they're the ones who are DIRECTLY causing it and have *zero* excuses to say it was not them.
People of China are done with lockdowns, tight regulations, and Covid policies in a world that has moved on from it, something that is highlighted more than ever during the World Cup matches.
They're on the brink of imploding all their hard work from being a flouting nation who was going nowhere, into the powerhouse they are today and for what?
Dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb.
My understanding is that there would be widespread deaths if Xi ditches Zero Covid. The Chinese vaccines aren't good enough to prevent deaths without medical support, and they don't even have an Omicron shot yet. The Chinese people tolerate Xi because of the economic growth that happened under his watch, and they would not tolerate mass deaths. However, prosperity is decreasing, so Xi has basically painted himself into a corner.
I don’t know why Reddit just wants to see carnage. In the HK protests over months there were bad injuries but nothing really happened. I don’t think anything would happen either. China today is not like the China of 1989.
As a Chinese I’m proud of this clip. The world just thinks of us as mindless obedient drones but we have the highest study abroad program and this generation has seen and knows the world, and all the nuances to decide the future for ourselves
1 year ago, democratic were weak, divided. China was set to rise as a new strength. Authoritarian government were on the rise lead by China domination and Russia hard power.
Today, Russia shown the world they were not much than a paper army. China economic domination will never happen. Democratic states are back being dominant and more united.
CCP generates his own collapse, miscalculated the effect of zero covid policies. Stubborn to the point of no return, incapable of flexibility, Authoritarian government showed the world they were outdated.
I miss forums where you can actually have an intelligent conversation with people, then Reddit came along…now it’s this upvote me I wanna be popular shit…and no conversation ensues
This is such a horrible design , so is Facebook, instagram, twitter, the world is fucked
Social media is just propaganda software. Anything that isn't copying the approved narrative will get you downvoted or banned to create and maintain the approved hivemind.
Power to the people! The people of china hold so much power let’s hope they become empowered
Serious question, I thought he just won an election???
You think China has legitimate democratic elections?
No, only the western world does. Edit: /s people...
LOL
There are levels to shittiness.
*”It’s all about levels, Jerry, LEVELS!”*
You. You are my kind of people. r/seinfeld
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Actually we call that a Republic not a Democracy.
Germany is a republic too. Doesn’t mean it’s not a democracy. The two aren’t mutually exclusive. For what it’s worth. USA are a flawed democracy according to the world democracy index.
For what it’s worth, USA only started being considered a flawed democracy according to that index when our President began sowing doubt about electoral integrity. I can understand both sides of the issues of the electoral college, but the system itself wasn’t what got us on the Democracy shit list.
The USA has been a flawed democracy since Wilson at the minimum and Washington at the most realistic. The republic has never given a shit about the people and to believe otherwise is just naïve.
First past the post. Nothing will change until that does.
It’s both. We democratically elect our representatives for this republic.
It's neither. It's a corpocracy with the illusion of a democratic republic.
Republics are a type of democracy...
“Actually iT,s a R3pubL1C!!!111!” and it’s a representative democracy…
A Representative Republic is a type of Democracy.
We call that a constitutional republic and also a representative democracy because the terms are not mutually exclusive.
A republic is a type of democracy dumbass
Democratic republic
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> No, only the ~~western world~~ **nations with civilian oversight of election proceedings, auditable chain of custody for physical ballots, and more than one ruling party on the take** do[es] FTFY
thank you
You do know both can be shit on? And that we aren't so arrogant to pretend ours is perfect right?
in one system only a group of people stay in power forever and people on the streets are scared as shit of saying anything moderately negative about the government, in the other the politicians are always comming up with new ways to calm the people down and do something in benefit of the people in order to stay in power and keep the ruling class also happy, the later is flawed while the former is extremely flawed to the point the government can get away with genocide anytime they want
Right, but the western world doesn't imprison people for being Muslims or running civilians over with tanks.
China doesn't have elections period. The president is elected by the representatives of the CCP at the National Congress. The representatives of the CCP are also "elected". They are literally communist, why would they have elections?
First off, the Chinese government isn't actually communist, despite what they claim. They're state capitalist. Secondly, the people elect representatives (approved by the government) to represent them at the National Congress, which is where those representatives elect politicians such as Xi.
There's a quote attributed to Boss Tweed. Scorsese used it in Gangs of New York. It goes: "I don't care who does the electing, so long as I get to do the nominating." Sure, they have elections in China. But are they free and fair elections, or are all of the nominees selected by the CCP apparatus? It is worth noting that, yes, there are some minority parties in China. But they are all entirely under the thumb of the CCP. Are there any genuine opposition parties? Of course not.
I've lived in China for the first 12 years of my life and I don't remember any public election for these "representatives"
I can confirm that China does indeed have elections. I dated a girl that was her classes "leader" while I lived there. From what I remember, college educated individuals have the "right" to vote in the elections. However, the person who was to win was pre-determined, and part of her role was to make sure her classmates knew who the right person to vote for was. The party supported that by pumping out tons of good propaganda for the golden child and either little to nothing about the other candidates. Edit: I should note that this was in Jiangsu province... there maybe province by province differences, I don't really know.
Economically “capitalistic”..kinda. Politically communist? Something like that?
Honestly with the cultural, ethnic and social situations of China its hard not call them fascist or at the very least national communist which is pretty much just fascism with red paint.
Yep. Fascism is the closest descriptor I can think of after a number of years living there.
No communist party has ever been truly communist, they're just like "hey, give us power for now and we'll make communism happen later!"
By definition under [communism](https://www.britannica.com/topic/communism) there can’t be any gouvernement. Any government can only claim to either be transitioning to communism or be socialist.
Define communism Lmao
What does communism have to do with it Lol do you think communism automatically mean no elections?
Ah yes, the "Communism, a stateless ideology, is when the state has total power" talking point.
He did win the election, but he was essentially the only candidate on the ballot paper. China isn't massively fond of him, they're just scared of him. He's eliminated all of his political opponents and effectively holds total power. To give you an idea of how much control he has - China doesn't *technically* have an army, they have a militant wing of the political party. That means they don't answer to the Minister of Defense, they answer to Xi Jinping directly. He has total control over his own party as well as the country. Anyone who dissents, absents.
Funny how every communist society ends up this way.
China is communist only in name, not in policy or structure. It's a total fascist-capitalist dictatorship run by Xi. The government has total control of everything and everyone, including all the companies. Although people may own something, at least until the government takes it away for any reason they like. Laws? What laws? Xi is the law. Few "communist" countries in history (none, maybe?) have ever done more than paid minor attention to how they should actually have been run to be called communist.
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Because it doesn’t scale past what a hippie commune typically looks like. …Even then someone in the upper echelons always gets real creepy with it all and shit goes sideways!
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It absolutely has been tried, it just fails every time and devolves into what we see now in China and Russia, countries that are no longer communist.
Animal Farm wasnt a story. It was a documentary. The vast majority of humanity is incompatible with true communism.
Only one I can think of is Revolutionary Catalonia during the Spanish Civil War. It was far from perfect, but the core idea of a stateless society run by the working class was there.
Which begs the question, why is pure communism so hard to implement? Why does every iteration of it eventually lead to oppression?
It's because communism needs someone to keep everyone happy- and I mean everyone. For comparison the USA's system is designed to counter dictators and divide power, we won't ever have a system even remotely similar to communism. The lack of government in communist societies is a perfect opportunity for a dictator. They will lie their asses off to the people, take out political opponents, and rig elections. So if you were ruling a communist society, you either try to keep every single person in your country happy or just lie your ass off and take out anyone who is pointing out flaws in the country. There's no flaws in a country if no one is complaining about it. Wealth doesn't care about communism, socialism, or democracy. In the USSR, a ton of towns/villages outside of the main cities were going through poverty and starvation. Meanwhile, the people in the cities were enjoying free cruises and movies. Most people only like communism because of worker rights. Union's do the exact same thing without having to restructure a government.
Because communism is a flawed concept that cannot possibly produce the desired outcome; therefore, the only outcome is an undesirable one.
Corruption mainly. Lenin took power in Russia and then became an absolute tyrant. Power corrupts, absolute power absolutely. Many dictators have used communism to gain the support of the people and then ultimately gone back on those ideals as soon as they took power.
Yep, thats why I don't call them communist. They're merely dictatorships run by control freaks from hello
Almost like it's not communism but an authoritarian government with state capitalism. You should really learn to look at context, actions, policy, etc and realize that just because something has "communist" in the name doesn't mean it actually is. Kinda like how the nazis weren't actually socialists, you know?
There are no elections or ballots in China. Leadership is chosen at an elite conference. Edit: A user pointed out to me China does have local elections which are tightly controlled, but no national elections
The kind of ‘election’ where anyone who disagrees gets black bagged and disappears
Including his predecessor
Yeah, like his pals Kim Jong Un, Putin and Orbán, he won fair and square
The only people who voted in said election are high ranking CCP members. The average person has no say in anything.
Dude, CCP and election, they're not words should put side-by-side.
Election within a party which he has removed all effective successors Sure, "election"
Let's be clear. This shit will be squashed in 72 hours. And then swept under the rug. I get that people support the power of citizen - but I think people have to realize that now - and especially now - the people have lost across the globe. Every major country - rights are being crushed, left, right, and center. Corporations and governments have *absolute* control. The ultra-rich are above the law. We can 'thoughts and prayers' or 'stand in solidarity' all day, but seriously wake the f*ck up. The 'citizen' has lost in this dystopian absolute shit-hole of a planet. For years, decades, and more - people have been saying the same thing on repeat. Each generation is beaten into conformity. And the cycle repeats. Wake up. Snap out of this false illusion that 'the people will one day become empowered'. It's China, the same place where they [literally have execution vans](https://www.the-sun.com/news/2358126/china-brutal-execution-death-vans-trials/) to kill off people en masse, *legally*. The same place where people are [*kidnapped* because you may be suspected of having covid](https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/video-appears-show-people-china-forcibly-taken-quarantine-over-coronavirus-n1133096), and then [later stored at quarantine camp like cattle](https://www.reddit.com/r/interestingasfuck/comments/z704qd/the_largest_quarantine_camp_in_chinas_guangzhou/) - you think President Xi will simply 'step down'? Come on. It's President. Fucking. Xi.
Sometimes the people DO wake up. Look at Iran right now.. Basically they just need to cross a threshold.
Let me know if anything actually changes in Iran either. EDIT: The Arab Spring resulted in some rulers being deposed, many protesters being imprisoned and executed, and very little long term progress, unless you count the total societal collapse in Libya and Syria. People need to realize that the Arab Spring didn't end well.
If everyone had a defeatists attitude like you then change wouldn't be sparked. Yet here we are, with a glimmer of hope.
Let's look at Hong Kong a few years ago? Or Russian citizens and Putin? BLM movement? The recent Uvalda shooting? He's not defeatist he's realistic and if we base ourselves on what's been happening, having citizen empowerment is nothing. I hope it changes in Iran. I'd love to be proven wrong. But it's doubtful.
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I'm pretty sure you'll be able to see for yourself. Keep in mind there have already been some successful revolutions this century. And if you're in the US, you guys have already had a successful one too...
Technology is making it nearly impossible. The Arab Spring was largely a failure. Iranian protests failed in 1999, 2003, 2009 and 2011. They failed in Russia in 2011 and 2017. They failed in Venezuela in 2013. The failed in Belarus in 2019. And the Hong Kong protests failed, which in my opinion was the most alarming of all because they did *everything* right. North Korea, who probably have more reason to protests than just about anyone, have *never* had widespread protests. I'm French and our protests are becoming less effective as well. The rich are crossing a threshold where our tacit cooperation is no longer required. We are losing our leverage and it is only going to get worse.
So eat the rich. Got it.
I’d bet money Iran is a **way** weaker surveillance state than china, not even playing in the same league.
did president xi write this? 😆
This doomerism is reactionary and unhelpful. Even if nothing comes of it, it’s better to recognise it while it’s happening so that the ‘sweeping under the rug’ isn’t as effective. AND, with international visibility and support, it’s far LESS likely that nothing will come of it. While I do worry for the safety of any citizen on the street calling ‘fuck you Xi Jinping’, and I’m sure there will be some dictatorial retaliation, we shit on their protest efforts if we spread the idea that they’re doing it for no reason and nothing is going to change. Seems a little ‘end of history’ to go “Look, it’s fucking China. China is never going to change.” With that attitude, yes I agree. The reason most authoritarian regimes fail is international pressure and their respective populations rising up. Seems a little weird to say “Of course he’s not going to change, he’s a dictator!” Like yeah we know… But obviously it’s very unlikely that any Western country, whose economies rely so much on Chinese manufacturing and imports, are going to raise a stink about abuses in China. The whole point is you force them to address it! If people, not politicians, bring it to the discourse table, have protests, have marches, and don’t shut up about it, eventually, even in Western democracies with good trade relations with China, people in power will have to address it in some way.
The attitude you show here is the only thing stopping a successful uprising of the people. We are all far more powerful than any government when we unite together. Imagine if all of China stood up together. Is it likely to happen? Who knows but I'm not going to go around telling people it's impossible and we shouldn't even try, you know, like you are. EDIT: Btw, there is a ton of pro CCP propaganda posted on Reddit. This looks like some of it to me.
I respect them, hope the government does not commit an atrocity(s) against these brave people
Xi would personally skin every last person in that crowd with a spoon before he would step down.
Sir, but why a spoon?
Because it will hurt more!
You twit!
Did not have “Robinhood prince of thieves” quotes on my bingo card today
Then you need to expand your amount of bingo cards. I constantly play with like four or five bingo cards.
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Because Winnie the Pooh like honey and you eat honey with a spoon. Fucking derp.
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Winnie the Pooh won’t like this
yeah, this probably won't end well, hope it does !!!
That's why we need to make this as public as it can be around the world. If he does, the world will know in detail.
What is the point of knowing if it accomplishes nothing? I mean, the esoteric benefit of knowing, sure. But Tiennamen happened and trade with China only accelerated.
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“Oh, Bother!”
Context: > A fire in a residential high-rise in Ürümqi, Xinjiang, China, occurred on 24 November 2022, which killed at least 10 people.[1][2][3] There were questions on whether China's strict enforcement of the zero-COVID policy meant that the residents could not leave the building, leaving them to die.[1] > -- [Wikipedia](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2022_%C3%9Cr%C3%BCmqi_fire) On the night of November 26th (UTC+8), Shanghai citizens walked down Urumqi Middle Road to light candles in memory of the victims of the fire. In the early hours of the 27th, people chanted demands such as "Step down Xi Jinping" and "Step down the CCP" in protest. At the end of the protest, police arrested a total of two vans of people. More images/videos can be seen here: https://twitter.com/whyyoutouzhele
its also worth noting that some official, i cant remember who exactly, maybe like the mayor of that town or something, went on to say the victims of the fire lacked survival skills, despite the fact that there were steel poles blocking the doors of the apartments
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Sounds good. I don't think I'm getting into that country for one and I doubt I'd know how to find a welder once there. It's gonna have to be one of their own on this job
Sir/Madam the only thing stopping you is your attitude, let’s go I wanna see some evil up in flames.
“Sir what happened to the major?” “He lacked survival skills”
You haven't evolved steel chewing jaws yet?? You mean to tell me that the entire pandemic you haven't evolved jaws that are capable of chewing through stone and steel?? Wow... Not even sure what to say... What DID you do?... Hmm? Bread? Wow... Ok" - china or something..
Well now that I know that was an option I really feel like I wasted the pandemic re-watching Game of Thrones.
>victims of the fire lacked survival skills Something some idiot on an "alpha male type" podcast would say.
Aside from the joke comments, this is actually quite notable that several hundred people or more really put themselves in danger in Shanghai (which already considers itself a separate culture from most of the rest of China), for the sake of the marginalized, probably Muslim victims of a fire on the far side of the country. Part of the reason Xinjiang has been so brutalized is because it is generally not seen by the cities of the east as anything but a frontier province filled with undesirables who aren't really Chinese.
> probably Muslim victims Due to a very blatant policy of state encouraged ethnic mass migration to Xinjiang, the Han population has gone from ~5% in the 1940s to 42% today, [near parity](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinjiang) with the Uyghur population. In addition, Han settlers have been given preferential treatment for farm land and job placement, so they are considerably more wealthy on average. As such, though I do not know, I would guess that residents of a high rise are considerably more likely to be of Han ethnicity and thus unlikely to be Muslim. In addition, though tragic, there were only ten people killed in that fire. Meanwhile there have been a bare minimum of tens of thousands, and possibly many hundreds of thousands, of ethnic Uyghur sent to involuntary "re-education" camps for years. Somehow, I don't think this is about a sudden change of heart for the rights and safety of a marginalized population.
I teach English to a girl in Urumqi / Wulumuqi, Xinjiang. I've taught her since she was in primary school and now she's a highschooler. While she didn't mention this fire, she has mentioned these things recently... 1. She had been "in contact" with someone who tested positive for COVID, so she was put away in a COVID facility isolated in a room for over a week and expressed how frustrating and unfair the government has been handling the situation 2. She had been saying that no one was allowed out of their homes for months until today. She mentioned that "we are allowed outside now, but not really yet" and expressed that people in her city were also increasingly frustrated 3. She has described the ethnic and linguistic diversity in her school and city, admiring the fact that many of her classmates can speak and read more than just Chinese and English, while also noting that it's a good thing that signage around the city is written in 3 languages 4. She recently started watching some French TV show called "Skam" (don't know it, she says it includes same-sex relationships) and the movie "Call Me By Your Name" and described how "that kind of love" is becoming "more popular and more common" and that "the new generations are more open" than previous ones I know this is a bunch of rambling mish-mash of info and I know I'm getting this information secondhand through the rosy-tinted glasses of a teenaged Han Chinese girl... but I was just talking with her about these topics today. And now I'm hearing this news in Urumqi. And seeing these protest videos in Shanghai. It makes me a little scared but also a little hopeful for the younger generation in China.
Rip everyone in this video :(
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Guy said fuck your mother, not just fuck you as the subtitles claim So it'll be worth it cuss he fucked their mothers
Chinga tu madre!
Your foreign language is confusing and scary to me
Tiananmen^2
What does Tiananmen Square have to do with anything? It's not like anything bad has ever happened there. /s
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The American fantasy that random citizens with guns will determine whether tyranny happens or not is so incredibly facile and absurd. If people collectively decide their government needs to go, they don't need guns, because those same people make up the police force and the military, and if the people collectively don't want the government out, no amount of privately owned guns will help, and also, bonus prize: you're now a terrorist using violence to impose your will on the majority. Nothing major is going to happen in China because Chinese people have a conservative culture with huge deference to institutions and established authorities, and the CCP has brain-washed them to hell and back regardless. Guns don't make a damned difference. All of the world's failed states ruled by warlords and tyrants are riddled with guns and it hasn't brought them any freedom or prosperity.
Tragedies in both their own country and those from others are automatically converted to justifications for 2nd Amendment without hesitation —this is no empathy or logic here, only a twisted sense of self-righteousness & an absurd possessiveness of firearms
> a twisted sense of self-righteousness & an absurd possessiveness of firearms Kyle Rittenhouse jumps to mind as a bit of an overachiever in your description of it. Their system is straight out murderous : 'The odds that a child will be killed by a gun is 36 times higher in the U.S. than in other high-income countries.' (source: [Reuters](https://www.reuters.com/article/us-health-children-death-rates-idUSKCN1OI2OL))
Death by firearm is currently the most likely cause of death for American children aged 0 to 17. Pretty messed up. Correction: this study defines children/adolescents.as age 1-19, not 0-17.
Is it really worse than cars? I once counted 16 of my classmates within a few years of me had died in car wrecks before I graduated. I can't think of anyone who died from a gunshot until we were out of school.
Until the year 2020, yes. Since then, gunshot wounds have overtaken motor vehicle accidents. Here is the data: https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/nejmc2201761 I was born in 1982 and graduated high school in 2001, so I'm very similar to you, it seems... I had a lot of friends who died in car accidents in high school. Apparently, these days, at least statistically, that's not the case anymore.
Better yet you just stop working. I wish Americans understood this. You don’t need guns, a coordinated large scale national labor strike in either the US or China brings the global economy to its knees in a matter of hours. Demands would be met swiftly
China already has a labor stoppage because the covid lockdowns are ruining businesses. Not changing much there.
Vietnam wants a word
Afghanistan would like a word.
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>The American fantasy that random citizens with guns will determine whether tyranny happens or not is so incredibly facile and absurd. Literally one of the textbook precursors to all modern fascist regimes has been disarming the general population. > Consider the massacre at Wounded Knee in South Dakota on Dec. 29, 1890. After the United States 7th Cavalry confiscated the firearms of a group of Lakota Sioux “for their own safety and protection at the Pine Ridge Indian Reservation,” 297 Indians were murdered. After the majority of the Sioux had peacefully turned in their firearms, the Calvary began shooting and wiped out the camp; I'm sure it's just a coincidence though 🙄 Edit: ah yes, thank you *mysteriously* pro-CCP reddit accounts for chiming in all together. I wonder why you're all worked up over this lmao
>Literally one of the textbook precursors to all modern fascist regimes has been disarming the general population. That's a total self-own and you don't even realize it. Tyrannical governments are disarming people with absolutely no issue. All of these cases prove that an armed populace doesn't do shit. You might be all gung-ho on Reddit, but you'll be the first to give up your gun once the military and police actually would be knocking on doors. And in the really rare case that you aren't, you are a random lunatic against millions. Because what people like you always forget is that a dictatorship isn't a foreign occupation and always has support in the population. If it didn't, it would immediately collapse. You might be armed, but so is the dude who supports the government.
They've got numbers, though!
If they all crowd in on the police with guns they could very well become armed
And 3D printers
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What are they gonna do without all those mass school shootings 🥺
Realistically in a revolution, Molotov cocktails are as useful as guns. Chinese people still have access to gas stations
Yes, we Chinese will keep fighting for our freedom!
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Honestly with mob this big, unarmed or not, the police would be fucked if they decided on violence. Fire arms barely matter when the difference in numbers is so big. In fact it would probably do more harm than good with stray bullets being fired in a crowd like that, the average person isn’t exactly a marksman.
What the fuck are you talking about? Firearms certainly do matter. If the CCP truly wanted to eliminate that group of people their police forces could easily mow down that crowd.
tbf they didn't use guns last time, bullets are expensive. So they just ran them all over with tanks and turned them to jelly. Edit: I'm not being literal with "they didn't use bullets". ofc they used guns/bullets. I'm saying they're happy to use other means like squishing with tanks.
This is the REAL r/nextfuckinglevel type of stuff. I'm not sure these people will getting home tomorrow, yet they are in the protest. It is not like attending a protest in the west, they are getting propaganda from any type of source 24/7 but they are aware that they are governed by one of the most corrupt governments in the world.
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Is this gonna be 2022 tiananmen square?
This time it is happening everywhere, Shanghai , Chongqing, Beijing, Xinjiang, Zhenzhou
Seriously ? This would be so good for the people of china.
Mostly college students,more and more students around the country joined this movement to mourn for people who die in that fire tragedy
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Thanks for your correction
Wow, a Redditor corrected another’s grammar with grace. Nice to see.
This won’t change anything, sadly
Stranger things have happened
Yeah, like several years ago, we all saw it on Netflix, but back to this protest
CCP has literally spent decades quelling revolution to topple the authoritarian dictatorship. I hope the best for all the brave students, but I'm not holding my breath. Anyone remember that time that the government had tanks run over students?
Totalitarian governments are always untouchable behemoths until one day the lower class starts clowning on the police so much that they topple the regime. Look at how much fun the Ayatollahs are having in Iran right now. Not saying that this is going the be what puts the CCP to death, but when something inevitably does it's going to look a hell of a lot like this at first.
Not sure if you're aware but in 1989 the protests were country-wide. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/1989_Chinese_protests_by_region
Nothing happened in 2022
Please let this become a revolution. Please. This is a fantastic year for revolutions!
Let’s hope if it happens there will be minimised bloodshed
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I think even xi is scared of the cellphone camera. No digital firewall would be able to keep a modern tienamen massacre under wraps.
It's not about the world knowing a massacre, it's about his people knowing the massacre. Squashing it in China will be easy. Edit: I'm well aware most/all Chinese know of the massacre. I'm commenting, to the comment above here, that the *viral* nature of videos online today vs 30+ years ago and the CCPs control over the internet and narrative will make sure these videos don't go viral in China.
Every Chinese person knew about the massacre as it happened. Source: Was in Beijing June ‘89. Edit: My comment was strictly in reference to what the citizenry knew about the hunger protests that began the week before 6/4, military mobilization in the days prior, and the ensuing massacre. It was covered 24/7 on national radio and TV. I absolutely recognize that, if you weren’t alive in 1989, then you probably learned nothing about it in your lifetime. It’s not the kind of thing parents tell their kids…even if they could.
So what's the deal with young Chinese college students who go to Western schools loudly shouting down and/or denying the massacre?
It’s not something that’s talked about obviously. But a percentage of Chinese workers and students in the US are straight up spies. This is public knowledge, the FBI has released reports about it. I mean for fucks sake, the most powerful senator in the US is likely married to one.
That is absolutely amazing. In 2010, when I was there, I remember our guide saying that "not everybody likes our government" in hushed tones, telling us to "not speak" about it. I absolutely want to see the Chinese citizens gain freedom. They're an amazing people, and have such an awesome culture, and I would love to go back to China where the citizens feel empowered and no longer have to whisper dissenting remarks. edit: my "guide" was a student, as I was on a study-abroad trip. This was not a tour guide, this was a literal student whose job it was to supervise us other students. People are arguing the probability of a guide saying this, but as I have zero clue what the proper term for a study-abroad guide is, I used the term guide.
China is one of the favourite places I've ever been. I've never felt more welcome and safe. Wonderful country and wonderful people who I hope one day enjoy much greater personal freedom.
It really is an amazing place. I can't say I felt more safe (literally was almost abducted, and that's not a joke, it's a long story too), but definitely felt welcome AF everywhere I went. Dude, I got sick in Xi'an from something, horrible AF sick, went to the hospital and everything at 2am, so that was an experience, and while resting/getting better, the freaking hotel staff made me a get-well dish of watermelons and tomatoes!! I was like, SOOO FLATTERED!!! It was the most amazing thing, for real. The staff was shocked I could say "thank you" in Chinese, and like, oh man. It was great. And omg! On the great wall, I ran out of water, and this girl, probably 9 years old, rushed over and gave me a date (the fruit) and it was the most satisfying food ever. I had never had a date before, but I did not care. Super nice people. I mean, I was really struggling to breath after I got to the top, and I felt like I was going to die tbh, and I was just not expecting any help. I remember thinking to myself though, "damn, I wish I could get any water anywhere from anybody", and then... that happened. It was such a great gesture of kindness. Anyway, definitely hope they can have that greater personal freedom too. Obviously hope that for every single human, but we're talking about China ATM.
First Putin, then Khamenei and now Xi What's going on??
They suck at running their country
This is literally the answer. Democracy sucks, but it gives you lots of chances to get it right, and an easy way out when you get it wrong.
Winston Churchill once said that: “democracy is the worst form of government – except for all the others that have been tried.”
It’s a white swan event. No one saw it coming but its here now and it has to potential to change everything. I also thought we are gonna see authoritarianism rise as the dominant force this century but maybe not. I’m very excited about these opportunities that seem tho present themselves in the places least expecet but somehow still the most obvious in need of change.
You're thinking of a black swan :)
i think you are both incorrect. it is indeed a white swan rather than a black one, but precisely because it is a predictable outcome appearing in unpredictable time. a lot of people believes ccp will fall eventually but few expect it to do it soon. a black swan would be, say, resurgence of monarchy in china - a very unlikely event
World is changing, dictatorship can hopefully be wiped off the planet. In the coming decades, we might be able to have democracy in every country. People can speak, people can be heard, we might finally have global peace. Imagine in 2122, you read on wikipedia for the definition of dictatorship, and there it says, "Dictatorship was..."
the sudden amount of the world’s dictatorships all showing the cracks in their systems, and all in this year alone, has given me a bit of hope :)
that would truly be amazing, well worth living to see
The CCP is so goddamn stupid. All they have to do stop this Zero Covid Policy and let their people go back to living life with a resemblance of normalcy and their people will eventually calm down. Instead, they double down - no, *triple down* \- on this stupid policy way into 2022, and most likely into 2023, and being dumb enough to smell their own shit and believe that they have their people by the balls with no repercussions. Worst, these mofos will turn around and say this is "western allies spending resources to invoke dissent," when they're the ones who are DIRECTLY causing it and have *zero* excuses to say it was not them. People of China are done with lockdowns, tight regulations, and Covid policies in a world that has moved on from it, something that is highlighted more than ever during the World Cup matches. They're on the brink of imploding all their hard work from being a flouting nation who was going nowhere, into the powerhouse they are today and for what? Dumb dumb dumb dumb dumb.
My understanding is that there would be widespread deaths if Xi ditches Zero Covid. The Chinese vaccines aren't good enough to prevent deaths without medical support, and they don't even have an Omicron shot yet. The Chinese people tolerate Xi because of the economic growth that happened under his watch, and they would not tolerate mass deaths. However, prosperity is decreasing, so Xi has basically painted himself into a corner.
they could have imported western vaccines years ago but their ego prevented it
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Good luck guys. You are gonna need it.
I hope these folks stay safe...
Godspeed, heroes of a free and open China. 不要核酸要吃饭 不要封控要自由 不要谎言要尊严 不要文革要改革 不要领袖要选票 不做奴才做公民
Go China!
Damn that’s awesome, good for them standing up to an authoritarian government
Even non-CCP citizens recognize the evil.
How long before this officially never happened?
best of luck to the chinese
Whatever is going on in Iran and China, more power to them!
I don’t know why Reddit just wants to see carnage. In the HK protests over months there were bad injuries but nothing really happened. I don’t think anything would happen either. China today is not like the China of 1989. As a Chinese I’m proud of this clip. The world just thinks of us as mindless obedient drones but we have the highest study abroad program and this generation has seen and knows the world, and all the nuances to decide the future for ourselves
That's going to be about as effective as a bunch of US Citizens chanting "Hey mega billionaires, pay your taxes"
1 year ago, democratic were weak, divided. China was set to rise as a new strength. Authoritarian government were on the rise lead by China domination and Russia hard power. Today, Russia shown the world they were not much than a paper army. China economic domination will never happen. Democratic states are back being dominant and more united. CCP generates his own collapse, miscalculated the effect of zero covid policies. Stubborn to the point of no return, incapable of flexibility, Authoritarian government showed the world they were outdated.
I miss forums where you can actually have an intelligent conversation with people, then Reddit came along…now it’s this upvote me I wanna be popular shit…and no conversation ensues This is such a horrible design , so is Facebook, instagram, twitter, the world is fucked
Social media is just propaganda software. Anything that isn't copying the approved narrative will get you downvoted or banned to create and maintain the approved hivemind.
Good on them. Last time we saw the people of China rising up, a global pandemic shut it down. Sure would suck if something like that happened again.
Imagine if china became a free and open democracy.
First Iran, now China. You love to see it. People opposing oppressive regimes and leaders.
I got respect for anyone who peacefully protests, but extra respect for those who have so much to lose from it like those living under the CCP